Hard Light Productions Forums
General FreeSpace => FreeSpace Discussion => Topic started by: karajorma on October 13, 2005, 06:59:26 pm
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Figured my arsing about was worth it's own topic now that I'd spent more than a few minutes on it. Due to a error with the ship-create SEXP although I meant to create a single Herc I ended up accidentally creating over 250 of them :D
So I decided to play about with the mission a little and see what would happen :)
Here's the first two from the first and second time I ran the original mission.
(http://homepage.ntlworld.com/karajorma/Misc-Pics/HercSwarm3.jpg)
(http://homepage.ntlworld.com/karajorma/Misc-Pics/HercSwarm4.jpg)
Then I tried the high poly Herc. Not as good cause the FPS went down so it didn't generate as many (I got 50-70 hercs and about 0.3 FPS for a good 3-4 minutes!)
(http://homepage.ntlworld.com/karajorma/Misc-Pics/HercSwarm5.jpg)
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So I swapped to the Loki cause it's low poly.
(http://homepage.ntlworld.com/karajorma/Misc-Pics/LokiSwarm01.jpg)
(http://homepage.ntlworld.com/karajorma/Misc-Pics/LokiSwarm02.jpg)
I decided to randomise the starting location using the rand-multiple SEXP and I got a much nicer shoal
(http://homepage.ntlworld.com/karajorma/Misc-Pics/LokiSwarm03.jpg)
(http://homepage.ntlworld.com/karajorma/Misc-Pics/LokiSwarm04.jpg)
(http://homepage.ntlworld.com/karajorma/Misc-Pics/LokiSwarm05.jpg)
Then on Goobers suggestion I tried something bigger and created the Super Mentu.
(http://homepage.ntlworld.com/karajorma/Misc-Pics/MentuSwarm.jpg)
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And then finally I tried the Ursa and Ares
(http://homepage.ntlworld.com/karajorma/Misc-Pics/UrsaSwarm01.jpg)
(http://homepage.ntlworld.com/karajorma/Misc-Pics/AresSwarm01.jpg)
And this is what I got when I told them all to form on my wing!
(http://homepage.ntlworld.com/karajorma/Misc-Pics/AresSwarm02.jpg)
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Now you may be able to recreate that .ani from FS1 where the ships flood out of the lucy.
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Whoa...
...is anyone else reminded of the E3 Mario demos for the Gamecube?
And Kara... try Dragons. ;7 Make yourself invulnerable, and throw in an invulnerable Aeolus too.
Or pit two fighter swarms against each other. :eek:
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I wonder if they'll replenish once some of them die.
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From the bug, it looks like they will more than likely continue to create until the game crashes.
However, there might be a way to control the number that is spawned. By attaching the creation process to a variable and using the bug, you could probably spawn Hercs for around 50 seconds, and then change the variable with a chained event. Then you have 50 or more hercs, exactly like you wanted :D
:drevil:
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Try a bunch of Colossuses. ;7
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Actually the problem was with the way Kara used the SEXP (he used it as a conditional rather than an action, so it's always "evaluated"). That aspect of create ship actually does work properly. And the game actually doesn't crash, it caps out when somewhere between 250 and 300 ships get into the mission.
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Originally posted by Goober5000
Try a bunch of Colossuses. ;7
In the country of England, a large explosion was detected...
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i agree try the colossuses and tell us your fps =P
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Actually I fixed the 'bug'.
But no worries, shoals will still be possible with the every-time SEXP.
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Originally posted by Retrosynthetic
i agree try the colossuses and tell us your fps =P
Yes please!!!
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Wow..... Just wow..... :jaw:
How did you do that??? Lol. I want to try it out myself.
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Actually the big C would have less of a FPS impact than the high-poly Herc does, since you'd have many fewer of them in the mission. The HTL Perseus would be the other point of potential interest, since it's got a similar complexity to the Hercules.
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well what happens if 50 colossuses do beam cannons at the sametime
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What happened when all these ships explode in the same time? :D
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Um.......
CTD?
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lol true that to
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Man.. if that ursa pic was rotated so the ursas were "up-down" in respect to the camera and the hud removed (and using high poly ursas) it would look epic... definitley would be my new wallpaper
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That Ursa pic needs Ride of the Valkyries as its soundtrack. For that matter, a pic with actual Valkyries would work even better. :p
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i wanna play the mission!
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Originally posted by karajorma
(http://homepage.ntlworld.com/karajorma/Misc-Pics/UrsaSwarm01.jpg)
Terrans: We have an invincible FSNA-ish Ursa armada! No one can stop us now!
HoL: Oh crap, it's an invincible FSNA-ish Ursa armada! We're doomed!
Shivans: S***.
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Can anyone record an in game video of this?
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Just as soon as I download the build, I'm going to :drevil:
And i'm putting flight of the walkyries as well :drevil:
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kekekeke ursa rush!!!!11111
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I'll post the mission later today. I don't actually have the mission on the PC I'm typing from at the moment. (Although it's only one event and the code is in the SCP forum if anyone wants to play with it)
The current version of FRED won't work so you need to open the mission in notepad to change things :) I used the 12th October CVS build I think the bug has been fixed in the 13th October so you need a build from sometime between 9th and the 12th to make it work.
The problem with capships though is that they don't move much so they look kinda boring in comparison to the shoals of fighters. That's why I gave up on them after the Mentu.
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*Imagines all those Ursas launching helios at a Sathanas =D~
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One very fried McSath burger coming right up!
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Surprisingly no. The problem is that the game is running out of collision pairs and once you include the fact that there are 250+ helios bombs in the mission as well as all the laser bolts and the ships themselves the game decides it's had enough and the bombs fly straight through the sath.
I did manage to blow up a ravana by warping it in so that only 50 or so Ursas were close enough to target it and go after it simply by a fluke. The ravana lasted less than 30 seconds (The bomb flight time)
Anyway here's some more pics and the mission itself.
(http://homepage.ntlworld.com/karajorma/Misc-Pics/MoreShoals01.jpg)
(http://homepage.ntlworld.com/karajorma/Misc-Pics/MoreShoals02.jpg)
(http://homepage.ntlworld.com/karajorma/Misc-Pics/MoreShoals03.jpg)
(http://homepage.ntlworld.com/karajorma/Misc-Pics/MoreShoals04.jpg)
(http://homepage.ntlworld.com/karajorma/Misc-Pics/MoreShoals05.jpg)
(http://homepage.ntlworld.com/karajorma/Misc-Pics/MoreShoals06.jpg)
(http://homepage.ntlworld.com/karajorma/Misc-Pics/MoreShoals07.jpg)
------------------------------------------------
$Formula: ( when
( and
( has-time-elapsed 3 )
( = 2 ( ship-create
"Ship 2"
"GTB Ursa" <----------------Change this line to have a different ship
(rand-multiple 0 100)
(rand-multiple 0 100)
(rand-multiple 0 100) )
)
)
( do-nothing )
)
+Name: Create Ship
+Repeat Count: 1
+Interval: 1
+Team: 0
--------------------------------------------------
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Wow, that fourth one looks almost epic. :)
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I agree the fourth one is the best-looking. Not to say that any of them aren't good-looking.
I also particularly like the fifth. Kinda always wanted to do something like that in a mission...
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Let's admit it, that's how we all envision the FS2 story in our heads.
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:lol:
I especially like this one. It looks like the Moloch has a birthday balloon of Ursas: http://homepage.ntlworld.com/karajorma/Misc-Pics/MoreShoals02.jpg
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Tried the Colossus but the game just crashed on me. Probably to do with me exceeding the limit for the maximum number of subsystems. The Fenris also crashed the game unless I rigged it so that I was looking at the ships as they were created (in which case I got 17-18 of them).
My best result was with the Mentu I got ~43 of them which I promptly sent up against the Shivans :D
(http://homepage.ntlworld.com/karajorma/Misc-Pics/MoreShoals08.jpg)
Thing is that beams don't seem to work. Any chance of getting that string concatenate SEXP Goob? I really want to see a fleet of cruisers open up on the Sathanas :D
EDIT : Nevermind. Just realised that I may be able to do it using when-argument :)
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Can you set them to kamikaze?
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WOW! Its like looking at a school of fish.
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Originally posted by aldo_14
Can you set them to kamikaze?
Hadn't thought of that :) I'll try that next. For the meanwhile Here they are using beams!
(http://homepage.ntlworld.com/karajorma/Misc-Pics/Beamzzzzzzzzzzzzz01.jpg)
(http://homepage.ntlworld.com/karajorma/Misc-Pics/Beamzzzzzzzzzzzzz02.jpg)
(http://homepage.ntlworld.com/karajorma/Misc-Pics/Beamzzzzzzzzzzzzz03.jpg)
(http://homepage.ntlworld.com/karajorma/Misc-Pics/Beamzzzzzzzzzzzzz04.jpg)
(http://homepage.ntlworld.com/karajorma/Misc-Pics/Beamzzzzzzzzzzzzz05.jpg)
(http://homepage.ntlworld.com/karajorma/Misc-Pics/Beamzzzzzzzzzzzzz06.jpg)
(http://homepage.ntlworld.com/karajorma/Misc-Pics/Beamzzzzzzzzzzzzz07.jpg)
They managed to kill the Sathanas in about 8 minutes :) Not bad for a ship armed with the SGreen! :D
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lol wow
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Awesome...
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:lol:
http://homepage.ntlworld.com/karajorma/Misc-Pics/MoreShoals06.jpg
This one almost looks like one out of those comics that Dark_4ce made a while back...
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Okay last one for today :) Here's what happens when you get about 30 Aeoluses to kamikazi a Sathanas :)
Click me (http://homepage.ntlworld.com/karajorma/Misc-Pics/Aeolus02.gif)
And while I'm at it here's what Bearbaiting should have looked like perhaps.
(http://homepage.ntlworld.com/karajorma/Misc-Pics/MoreShoals10.jpg)
And a picture of a lot of ships shooting at something :)
(http://homepage.ntlworld.com/karajorma/Misc-Pics/MoreShoals09.jpg)
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That's awesome. I could never get kamikazi to work right...
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odd....I tried using the 10-14 build on this, but recieved an error about the sexp. Do you have the 10/9 build on hand, Karajorma? :/
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This ***t should be highlighted. This is sweet ***t.
Try a few colossus vs a sathy.
Also, have like 5 shivan corvetts in defence formation, vs like 500 loki or Ares. I think pics would look better with more enemy contact shooting back.
Can u do multiple friendly\hostile fighters in same mission vs eachother?
Get some good Ares shots. Ares is da bomb. And Diemos.
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Originally posted by Singh
odd....I tried using the 10-14 build on this, but recieved an error about the sexp. Do you have the 10/9 build on hand, Karajorma? :/
Like I said (rather abiguously when I look back on it) you need to use a build from between 9th October and 12th of October. WMC has changed the SEXP into an action operator and fixed the bug so the way the mission is set up will give you an error and even if it did work all you'd get was one ship.
The 12th of October Build is available from here (http://fs2source.warpcore.org/exes/latest/October2005/20051012-redmenace.rar).
Originally posted by Charismatic
Try a few colossus vs a sathy.
The Colossus crashed the game every time I tried it. That might be different if I make sure I'm looking at it when it gets created.
Originally posted by Charismatic
Also, have like 5 shivan corvetts in defence formation, vs like 500 loki or Ares. I think pics would look better with more enemy contact shooting back.
The mission is there if you want to play with it :)
Originally posted by Charismatic
Can u do multiple friendly\hostile fighters in same mission vs eachother?
Now there's an idea...... :D
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This is really cool!
I thought I could take on those bombers, but I was wrong...
... just the right time for the Shivan Super Laser. :drevil:
(http://img301.imageshack.us/img301/554/screen54896be.jpg)
(http://img301.imageshack.us/img301/6119/screen54592za.jpg)
They are using their turrets only!
I'm convinced. I think BoE style missions might be cool.
And this also reminds me of a benchmark test. I've just learned my CPU is the limiting factor in my system.
Turning on AA and AF doesn't change the fps...
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I take it back. THIS is what Bearbaiting should have looked like :)
(http://homepage.ntlworld.com/karajorma/Misc-Pics/GrizzlyBearBaiting01.jpg)
(http://homepage.ntlworld.com/karajorma/Misc-Pics/GrizzlyBearBaiting02.jpg)
(http://homepage.ntlworld.com/karajorma/Misc-Pics/GrizzlyBearBaiting04.jpg)
(http://homepage.ntlworld.com/karajorma/Misc-Pics/GrizzlyBearBaiting05.jpg)
Incidentally I accidentally called in an Orion by mistake and got this shot :)
(http://homepage.ntlworld.com/karajorma/Misc-Pics/GrizzlyBearBaiting03.jpg)
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Originally posted by karajorma
Like I said (rather abiguously when I look back on it) you need to use a build from between 9th October and 12th of October. WMC has changed the SEXP into an action operator and fixed the bug so the way the mission is set up will give you an error and even if it did work all you'd get was one ship.
Bah. Go look at my warp drive mission... it shows you exactly how to achieve the same effect in any newer build using every-time.
But your Bearbaiting version looks awesome. :D
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Pity that can't be done ingame and still be really playable. 'Cuz it would be awesome to do Bearbaiting like that.
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Originally posted by Goober5000
Bah. Go look at my warp drive mission... it shows you exactly how to achieve the same effect in any newer build using every-time.
Not quite. The advantage of using the builds with the bug in them is that I don't need to supply the name of the ship. Without that bug I'm going to have to supply the name for 200+ ships (Which without the string concatenate and Int > String SEXPs means a very big every-time argument SEXP with a list of over 200+ names (BTW When-argument seems to break down when the list of arguments is over 200-300 arguments. Not that anyone else is likely to be doing anything crazy enough to justify a bump but I thought I'd mention it :D )
The other disadvantage is that the bugged version of the SEXP seems to hit a limit and stop when you're looking at the spawning point. When I was spawning ships and looking away I ran the risk of spawning too many and crashing the game.
Using a method of determining how many ships I'm going to get other than letting the game determine it at runtime is likely to cause me more crashes if I set the number too high and get me less ships than I could otherwise if I set the number too low.
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Originally posted by karajorma
Not quite. The advantage of using the builds with the bug in them is that I don't need to supply the name of the ship.
Whoops, I forgot about that. Fixed: you can now specify "<none>" for the ship name and it will auto-generate them. :)The other disadvantage is that the bugged version of the SEXP seems to hit a limit and stop when you're looking at the spawning point. When I was spawning ships and looking away I ran the risk of spawning too many and crashing the game.
Using a method of determining how many ships I'm going to get other than letting the game determine it at runtime is likely to cause me more crashes if I set the number too high and get me less ships than I could otherwise if I set the number too low.
I'm not sure why that is, but whichever way you use the sexp shouldn't matter to if the game caps the limit or not.
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Why did I get an email about this being nominated as newsorthy? :wtf:
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Maybe 'cause you're a moderator for this forum?
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In response to the guy that thought they couldn't be done very well:
http://homepage.ntlworld.com/karajorma/Misc-Pics/GrizzlyBearBaiting04.jpg
His FPS is up at 20. That's somewhat playable. Just use lower poly models with lower res textures(not too low though :D ).
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Nice Deployment BUG LOLOL!
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Originally posted by Ghost
In response to the guy that thought they couldn't be done very well:
http://homepage.ntlworld.com/karajorma/Misc-Pics/GrizzlyBearBaiting04.jpg
His FPS is up at 20. That's somewhat playable. Just use lower poly models with lower res textures(not too low though :D ).
The FPS is 20 because I'm taking a screenshot. It was actually smoother than that before I pressed the PrtScrn button :)
The problem is that once you get too many ships the game stops registering impacts so none of your shots actually hit anything.
That said spawning ships appears to have a lower overhead than putting them in manually so I may see if it's possible to push up the number of ships in a mission like bearbaiting. :)
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I just played around with the mission - pretty neat stuff, to say the least!
Some pictures, followed by a video (and yes, it does have Wagner's Flight Of the Valkyries! But it only covers 80% of the video, as opposed to all of it)
Apologies for the sucky compression artifacts. Xvid codec required to play it.
www.game-warden.com/singh/Flight1.avi
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Screenshots:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v107/anandraj/Flight1.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v107/anandraj/Flight2.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v107/anandraj/Flight3.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v107/anandraj/Flight4.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v107/anandraj/Flight5.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v107/anandraj/Flight6.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v107/anandraj/Flight7.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v107/anandraj/Flight8.jpg)
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Great screenshots Singh :) I'm downloading the video as we speak :) I've already seen the effect in action in the game of course but I'm interested in seeing what you've done with it :)
(BTW for those who didn't notice I have posted the mission on one of my posts with a load of pictures in it. :) I'm guessing that most people were too busy looking at the pics to spot that :D )
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I've actually done nothing special with it, with exception of changing the background. But I did manage to get a few worthy angle shots of the Ursas as they attacked the Ravana :drevil:
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Wow, the video clip is awesome! :)
I love this thread. :yes:
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Then you'll love this even more.
Bearbaiting!
There's a bug in the current version of CVS so I've included two versions. The should-work version is for when the bug is fixed. The does-work version is playable now though you will need to use the 14th or 16th October CVS builds. The mission is certain to crash with anything earlier.
There are bound to be collision detection problems but what the hell it's Bearbaiting with more than 120 extra ships in it :D
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holy sweetness!!
Time to take more Fraps videos!! This is soooo gonna be cool! :D
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BTW I should mention that due to the bug there are about 5-10 friendly shivan mara's in the mission.
ummmmm......... They're SOC operatives on a secret mission that went horribly wrong. That will explain it :D
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Or bi-curious Shivans.
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Originally posted by karajorma
Bearbaiting!
Hmm, not as bad as I thought performance wise. It never dipped below 23 FPS on me and was pretty playable. We might have to see about making the collision pairs dynamically allocate though, in sanely sized batches, to get around that particular problem.
For performance during that mission:
compute_num_homing_objects():
calls: 4,962,496
CPU time spent: 108.27 seconds
percent of mission time: 21.63%
time per execution: ~0.0000218176 seconds
ship_name_lookup():
calls: 3,299,491
CPU time spent: 25.9 seconds
percent of mission time: 5.18%
time per execution: ~0.000007849696 seconds
collide_remove_weapons();
calls: 24,999
CPU time spent: 14.05 seconds
percent of mission time: 2.81%
time per execution: ~0.00056202
vm_vec_mag() was 16.80 seconds, but with 313,809,411 calls. Everything else was less than 10 seconds.
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This would be great for SoL. I'd like to see a lot of enemies at the same time. Low-poly+low-res of course. ;)
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The only problem with ship-create is that not all the sexps are guaranteed to work properly. The reason is that none of the ship-create ships are on the arrival list for that mission, and some sexps check the arrival list to determine whether a condition is true, false, known true, or known false. So these sexps could possibly have weird behavior.
The good news is that if you run into this sort of sexp problem, chaining it to the sexp that created the ship should solve it. :)
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Originally posted by karajorma
The FPS is 20 because I'm taking a screenshot. It was actually smoother than that before I pressed the PrtScrn button :)
The problem is that once you get too many ships the game stops registering impacts so none of your shots actually hit anything.
That said spawning ships appears to have a lower overhead than putting them in manually so I may see if it's possible to push up the number of ships in a mission like bearbaiting. :)
'xactly. I'm fairly sure that there's shots visibly passing through a ship in that screenie.
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And thus, despite all claims to the contrary, it is proven that we all really like BoE style battles deep inside =)
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So...freaking...awesome.
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Well, dynamically allocated collision pairs (on the plus side of 99,000 of them) later and the good guys get their butts whooped. Actually they get utterly stomped, very quickly. About 2 minutes into the mission and I was alone. Around 14 kills later and it was deathroll time for me too.
But it was still cool. :D
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I'm definitely playing this tomorrow. Those screenies look effing sweet.
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How big is hte normal ship limit (ships in mision at once - not counting waves)?
I recall making a few highly intense missions myself with TONS of ships and fighters, but I don't recall hitting the limit...yet
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Well I've bounced off the hard limit of 400 ships in the game a few times while making these missions. However I doubt FRED will let you place anywhere near that many ships. I only got away with it cause I'm spawning them.
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Bearbaiting? Fa. This should be High Noon. ;7
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You don't need that many..in theory, with waves, you could put thousands of shps in the mission - the thing is, only 100 or so of them would be in the area at once.
Which is still significant.
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Originally posted by Galemp
Bearbaiting? Fa. This should be High Noon. ;7
I said I'd be doing that one next :) I've heard about the same number of complaints over the years about both missions :)
With luck I should be able to control the number of ships I'm spawning now that the SEXP is (hopefully) working properly which means I can balance the mission so that it's playable. :D
I should even be able to split the ships up between the two capital ships so that each one has a swarm of fighters over it :D
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Why did I get an email about this being nominated as newsorthy?
That probably was me. I think this has great potential. Amazing eyecandy.
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Thats pretty orgasmic if you ask me, oooh the potential.
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Originally posted by Charismatic
That probably was me. I think this has great potential. Amazing eyecandy.
why would an SCP error be considered as news? :wtf:
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Originally posted by Cobra
why would an SCP error be considered as news? :wtf:
*smacks Cobra*
It's a feature. Haven't you read the thread?
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Not to mention that since things like the Horribly Wrong Idea pic make the news, therefore anything can. :nervous:
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Originally posted by Cobra
why would an SCP error be considered as news? :wtf:
It's not an error. I first discovered what the SEXP could do due to a bug but the fact is that now the bug has been fixed I should still be able to do the same thing with it via proper SEXPing.
Besides bug or not the reason why people were suggesting the highlight is cause it allowed for some nice pictures :)
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Bugs can be features too.
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Originally posted by WMCoolmon
Bugs can be features too.
Definitely :nod: For example, the trichording speed boost was originally a bug in the original Descent installment, but it became an essential element of gameplay and was included deliberately in the other two games. There are a lot of other cases where bugs in games have become legitimatized by frequent use.
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Then there's wavedashing in SSBM. Its discovery transformed the way the game can be played. And countless other examples like you said.
And that edited Bearbaiting mission is a blast! Sure, there's so much on screen that half the time your lasers don't even show up and having bombs actually hit anything is out of the question, but who cares? The eye candy rules.
But one thing I am wondering: is the collision detection going to be (or even capable of being) revised to allow missions of this sort?
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Originally posted by Fenrir
But one thing I am wondering: is the collision detection going to be (or even capable of being) revised to allow missions of this sort?
Yes and it has, courtesy of taylor. :)
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Funny thing is that I tried out the should-work (i.e bug free) version today and the Shivans got their arse's kicked but the Taurets. Maybe the collision errors were in their favour but I had been expecting it to go the other way :)
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Originally posted by karajorma
Okay last one for today :) Here's what happens when you get about 30 Aeoluses to kamikazi a Sathanas :)
Click me (http://homepage.ntlworld.com/karajorma/Misc-Pics/Aeolus02.gif)
Dude. That's freaking awesome. :jaw:
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preeeeeeetttttty
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@ Karajorma and his .gif: is that the sort of framerate you got, or is that just as fast as you could take good screenies?
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It was the taking screenshots that caused the slowdowns. The game is perfectly playable normally :)
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Three words:
Battle of Endor.
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Hey Kara, make another big pile of Aeoluses and put them in front of a Sath, and have the Sath jump out.
Roadkill.:drevil: :lol:
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Need more pics! :D
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Originally posted by Ulala
Three words:
Battle of Endor.
the battle of endor with nothing but fighters. :p
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i see fleets of aeoluses and deimoses flying into each other, beams and flak and little plasma bubbly thingys flying everywhere
it'd be sweet
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Originally posted by Turambar
i see fleets of aeoluses and deimoses flying into each other, beams and flak and little plasma bubbly thingys flying everywhere
it'd be sweet
And stick the player right in the middle, could he survive?:drevil:
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Originally posted by Cobra
the battle of endor with nothing but fighters. :p
jiggawha?
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Originally posted by WeatherOp
And stick the player right in the middle, could he survive?:drevil:
Of course, he's Alpha 1...
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What if we make him...
Beta 2!
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nah, lets make him Hook 4 ;7
Or Red 3!
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Battle. Of. Deneb.
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What about deneb? The GTA lost half their fleest, but alpha1 survived...
Or are you suggesting soeone make a battle of deneb mission? As i interpret it it was sevral isolated engagements (The galetea, the eva, the minnow, the leigon... none were near eachother...)
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You've seen the intro sequence to FS2, right?
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Big ships were far apart, but fighters were _everywhere_...
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Oh... yeah... it apears i'd totaly lost the context of the thread....
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Funny thing is that I'm usually against BoE missions :)
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Originally posted by karajorma
Funny thing is that I'm usually against BoE missions :)
Oh, just admit it: as much as many people say they hate BoE missions, at heart everyone would give anything to fly in that scene from the movie. :p
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Originally posted by Mongoose
Oh, just admit it: as much as many people say they hate BoE missions, at heart everyone would give anything to fly in that scene from the movie. :p
And those who bought Rogue Leader or X-Wing Alliance can :p
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Originally posted by Mongoose
Oh, just admit it: as much as many people say they hate BoE missions, at heart everyone would give anything to fly in that scene from the movie. :p
Depends. My objections to BoE are that they can make fairly boring missions unless done well.
Adding the extra fighters to Bearbaiting for instance looks very cool but it didn't actually add that much to the gameplay.