Hard Light Productions Forums
Off-Topic Discussion => General Discussion => Topic started by: phatosealpha on October 28, 2005, 06:43:39 am
-
Well, I know there are some people with Athlon 64s around here, and where those go, overclocking usually isn't far behind. Heck, with the 3000+ and 3200+ it's practically a sin not too. So, are you guys O/C? Hows it going for you?
I just made a rather strange discovery myself. Well, strange to me anyway. Samsung TCCD ram is wacky. I was running my dimms with a divider since it wouldn't hit 250 stable at any timings - kind of annoying since I bought this ram specifically for it's overclockability, and paid extra cause it was a very well reviewed brand.
Well, this morning I decided to do some more testing, partly because I'd run out of things to do having beaten TRON 2.0 again, not feeling like FEAR and still quite angry at nexus, partly because I had to do my running and the CPU had some idle time for testing.
Anyway, in the course of this, I decided to see if the mem controller was the suspect. Put a divider on the CPU, and turned the voltage on the RAM down from 2.75 to 2.6 (probably more like from 2.7 to 2.55, since my Neo 2 is a notable undervolter). Figured if it was the mem controller, the voltage shouldn't make too big a difference.
Strangely, not only did it pass with the cpu at 1250 at 250-2.5-3-3, it passed it when I turned the multiplier back up. Apparently, my memory doesn't like voltage at all.
Figures. I was just starting to think about selling the cpu/mobo and maybe the RAM since I've got the itch to upgrade and that $400 Asrock dual Sata/x2 3800 is looking tempting, and this boy gives me more.
So, how about you guys? Overclocking now? anything to share?
Edit: As an aside, anybody know of a decent free windows memory benchmark? would like to test settings to see if this 250-2.5-3-3 is really better then 200-2-2-2
-
well my 3000+ is at 2.5 GHz and memory running at 180 Mhz the HTT multy is at 3 afaik and FSB is at 280 runs smooth as silk
-
Back in the day (of AMD K6-2s) I overclocked by about 45%. She lasted all of a two weeks, and I still can't quite get the smell of burning silicone out my mind. It's like some vitenam vet memory...
-
Owning two A64 computers, my opinion of overclocking is that it's nothing more than a way to gain a bigger virtual penis.
-
Never tried it, and I'm not that bothered about it to be honest. I don't have the cash to go around blowing my computer up. My 3500+ is plenty fast enough as it is...
-
I am currently using a 2ghz stock 90nm A64 running at 2.2ghz. I can't get it any higher regardless of how much voltage I put into it. It's some unnamed engineering sample that predates the winchesters. Hopefully I will have better luck with the X2 I'm planning to get at the end of the year. In any case, additional game performance generally tops off around 2.2ghz anyway; video card overclocks are really where the extra performance is to be gained.
200mhz at 2-2-2 is better than 250mhz 2.5-3-3 across the board on an A64. Apparently low latency pretty much always makes a bigger difference than bandwidth on an A64, although neither is exactly significant. I actually use my Corsair value memory at 180mhz 2-3-2 instead of the stock 200mhz 2.5-3-3 and it's slightly faster. Check out Zebo's memory thread in the Anandtech CPU forum.
-
Ive owned about 7 different CPUs in my life and as far as overclocking goes AMD does the best.
AMD XP 3200+ Stock 2.2ghz stable overclock 2.5 ghz, record overclock 2.67 ghz
AMD XP 2500+ Stock 1.85ghz stable overclock 2.3 ghz, record overclock 2.5 ghz
AMD X2 4400+ Stock 2.2ghz stable overclock 2.7 ghz, record
overclock 2.853ghz
This has all been done with cheap, regular samsung RAM. IMO expensive fancy ram isnt worth the price, its more of a gimmick to get your $$$ than anything.
And now my vid card overclocks:
MSI GeForce 5700LE 256mb, stock 225 mhz, overclock 322mhz
BFG Geforce 7800GT 256mb, stock 425 mhz, overclock 580 mhz
I do overclocking for the fun/thrill mainly and to get the highest benchmark scores possible. For the most part of its use I leave my comp running at stock frequencies.
-
Well, spoke too soon. Crashed at those timings after 2 hours of gaming. Back to the divider. Looked over the recommended thread at anandtech, and from the look of it, it matters very little. Doubt I'd ever really notice. Barely even notice the big CPU overclock except when DVD shrinking.
-
I try to overclock my 2800+ from time to time, and every time I get the same problem... windows will not load :p
Memory issues I think was the problem... :(
-
Unfortunately, if I overclock, and adjust my FSB, it raises the SATA voltage too and goes completely bonkers. My 3k+ is fast enough. I dunno, but I find it silly to build a system based on high benchmark scores alone. I hear this from my friends all the time, about going and building a system to just get the highest futuremark score possible. Unless you have lots of cash or dont value your purchase very much, overclock to your heart's delight, I say.
-
You lack a PCI lock, and it's not the SATA voltage, but frequency.
I've given up on overclocking for the moment. When my 3500+ doesn't cut it, then I'll overclock. Until then, you're just shortening the lifetime of your CPU.
-
Originally posted by Grey Wolf
You lack a PCI lock, and it's not the SATA voltage, but frequency.
Right, that's what it is. The whole PCI bus gets jacked whenever I try to increase the FSB at all, which doesnt play nice with the SATA controller. Seriously, I think OC'ing, unless you have a rock solid board that's built for it (ovbiously non-PCI Lockable boards arent) is unnecessary. It does shorten the lifespan of your components, and it can damage MUCH more than just what you're going to oc. The only thing I've OC'd is my Videocard, my Ati Radeon 9800 Pro. I guess you cant consider it overclocking though as it uses the same exact core as the XT with a BIOS that had looser memory timings and a lower clock speeds. The XT BIOS clock for the card though topped out at 398 Mhz, and I'm running it at 412, a reportedly "true" speed for XT cards.
-
I don't worry too much about the lifespan. If it lasts for a year and a half, it's enough for me. By the time you really have to start worrying about lifespan the thing will have become ancient anyway.
A video card overclock, in contrast to a CPU one, can make a big difference in actual gameplay. It basically allows me to push the resolution one level up at the same minimum framerate.
-
My only 'real' overclocking experience was running my old PII 400 at 496 (124Mhz FSB). 533Mhz also seemed feasible but since the BSLive didn't like a 44Mhz PCI bus and since this was before 1Mhz FSB increments 496 was the highest I ever got. I haven't bothered overclocking any of my Athlons since it just hasn't seemed worth it. They're plenty fast enough at their stock speeds and faster CPUs are so cheap these days that it makes much more sense to just buy a replacement that spend money/time overclocking slower ones.
-
Originally posted by CP5670
I don't worry too much about the lifespan. If it lasts for a year and a half, it's enough for me. By the time you really have to start worrying about lifespan the thing will have become ancient anyway.
A video card overclock, in contrast to a CPU one, can make a big difference in actual gameplay. It basically allows me to push the resolution one level up at the same minimum framerate.
With a short-term future likely including many academic loans, any extra time is a good thing.
-
i wouldnt overclock unless 1 the machine was ancient and in dire need of a speed boost, and 2 the machine wasnt my main/only computer and is otherwise expendable.
-
I OC when I have a good PSU, and a good board that supports a wide range of voltages. After all, it isn't the fact that the memory is unstable at higher frequencies, because that isn't true at all. To put it another way, good luck getting past 200MHz if you're limited to 2.7v. With appropriate voltages, and sufficient cooling, OC'ing problems are a non-issue.
EDIT: Yeah, my post looks like someone who is half asleep wrote it... I suppose that's a good sign to go to bed.
-
Meh, my CPU is generally underclocked by about 50%, long live Cool'n'Quiet. (AMD64 3000+, 1 GB brandless RAM, Radeon9800Pro)
-
There're two types of RAM chips. One loves low voltages and will clock very high without increasing the voltage. The other will clock up in approximately direct proportion to the voltage, until such time as the silicon breaks down.
I forget the names of these two types of memory, but I think TCCD falls into the first category.
My current CPU is a Newcastle core A64 3500+. Overclocking it would take the running temperature above the 55°C boundary. This might not seem like a very high temperature, but consider that it's cooled by an XP-90 heatsink with a 140CFM Delta fan on it and uses AS5 thermal paste...
Overclocking Newcastle cores is baaaaaaaad.
In a box, on the pile of computer junk that covers my Playstation, is an X2 4200. It's going in my new watercooled system. To be honest I'm going for watercooling for silence and low temperatures rather than overclocking, but I estimate I'll probably get at least a 10% speed boost out of it before I need to turn the radiator fan voltage up above 5V. I would've bought the 4400 but the only advantage is the larger cache, and that makes very little positive difference in most cases. For overclocking it's a bad thing, since larger cache means more active die space, meaning a lower maximum clock due to propagation time.
Overclocking doesn't just affect the CPU. Ensure that all your hardware can endure higher frequencies and voltages.
I bought some RAM rated for 2.5-3-3-6 at 275MHz for this new system. I doubt it'll be pushed anything like that far, but bear in mind that the timings can be made more aggressive at low clock speeds. At 200MHz, that RAM is running rock stable at 2-2-2-5.
Overclockable memory is good even if you don't intend to overclock it. It's very robust at stock speeds and will probably outlast every other component in the machine.
Anyone know how well Gigabyte Ultra-9 boards overclock? I couldn't get a non-SLI Abit Fatal1ty board so I went for a GA-K8N instead.
-
Overclocking doesn't just affect the CPU. Ensure that all your hardware can endure higher frequencies and voltages.
I bought some RAM rated for 2.5-3-3-6 at 275MHz for this new system. I doubt it'll be pushed anything like that far, but bear in mind that the timings can be made more aggressive at low clock speeds. At 200MHz, that RAM is running rock stable at 2-2-2-5.
Overclockable memory is good even if you don't intend to overclock it. It's very robust at stock speeds and will probably outlast every other component in the machine.
I'm not sure about that. 2-2-2 memory is about 5% faster on average than the standard 2.5-3-3 value memory while costing nearly three times as much, which is definitely not worth it when you could instead use the money to upgrade to the next level of video card and gain a much bigger performance boost. Brand name value memory can in many cases be pulled below 200mhz to attain comparable timings, as bandwidth is almost irrelevant at these levels on an A64 anyway.
These days, it's also hard to recycle old memory in a newer setup because of the dual channel requirements and the impending switch to M2 and DDR2 next year, so longevity shouldn't be a big concern at this point. For example, I have two 512MB sticks right now but 2GB has since become the standard, so I will have to replace them with two 1GB sticks in a new setup and can't simply add another 1GB or 2x512MB without performance drops and reduced overclock capacity.
Since dividers on an A64 have no performance impact, overclocker memory is of little use for actual CPU overclocking. The only thing you need to worry about is the motherboard's max HT speed and voltage options.
-
Only significant overclocking I've done was the classic Celeron 300A @ 450Mhz setup. Solid as a rock.
Currently running an Athlon XP 2500+ at the stock rate. It's been fast enough so far that I haven't thought much about overclocking it. Not being a graphics whore helps.
-
Originally posted by CP5670
I'm not sure about that. 2-2-2 memory is about 5% faster on average than the standard 2.5-3-3 value memory while costing nearly three times as much, which is definitely not worth it when you could instead use the money to upgrade to the next level of video card and gain a much bigger performance boost. Brand name value memory can in many cases be pulled below 200mhz to attain comparable timings, as bandwidth is almost irrelevant at these levels on an A64 anyway.
Don't underclock the system bus on an A64. It's pointless.
As for CAS2 vs. CAS2.5, your prices are off by about a year. For an example, we'll use Corsair RAM.
256MB PC3200 CL2.5 $24.17
256MB PC3200 CL2.0 $34.00
-
You don't need to underclock the HT bus. Just use the memory on a divider. I have my HT at 220mhz and the memory on a 5:6 divider to get 183mhz, which allows for 2-3-2 timings.
The 256MB prices are irrelevant, as nobody will buy 256MB LL sticks these days at their normally inflated prices, so obviously the prices have come down. Look at 1GB sticks instead to see what I am talking about. Also, "CL2.0" is ambiguous; it could be 2-3-3, 2-3-2 or 2-2-2.
-
True. I had only written CL2.0 as the CL2.5 stick lacked timings.
As for cost, you're still off. Across the line, it's about a 50% premium at most for the lower latency sticks, not 200%.
-
I have this (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16820145440) stuff, which is 2.5-3-3, while this (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16820145522) the vanilla (no LEDs) 2-2-2 memory from the same brand. About 2.5 times the price. You can sometimes find good deals on 2-3-3 memory, but 2-2-2 stuff is very expensive. 2-2-2 1GB sticks are even worse since they are fairly rare and hard to come by. I think only OCZ makes those at the moment, actually.
-
I got mine from Overclockers.co.uk. I think it's Corsair XMS4400C25PT.
The price seems to have gone up, though. It was only £140 inc. VAT two months ago.
-
I payed $120 for 1GB of 2-3-3-6 Mushkin a few months back, though I'm actually running it at CL2.5, though for an unrelated reason.
-
Well, you guys seem pretty well informed,so I'll ask.
I'm really considering an upgrade to an X2 3800+ on an Asrock Uli board. Not sure about the RAM though. May also upgrade to 2 GB. Question is do I buy two new 1 GB sticks of cas 3, and plug the old ram into my girlfriends rig to give her 4x512, or just buy 2 more 512 and run 4x512 myself. Does 2T really hurt or what?
-
Yes and no. Depends on the timings on your 512s.
-
My 512s are 3200 2-2-2-5. Girlfriends got 2-3-2-5 in her rig.
-
Get another 2 512s with decent latency (at least 2-3-3-6) rather than getting two 1GB sticks.
-
The RAM in my desktop is 2-3-2-5-T1..... is that good? Because OCing ends up with my windows boot sequence failing every time.
-
Turn it down to T2 and you should see a stability increase.
Early Athlon 64s (such as mine) had real problems driving doublesided DIMMs at T1. I don't know how well the later Athlon XPs cope with it.