Hard Light Productions Forums
Off-Topic Discussion => General Discussion => Topic started by: JoeLo on February 24, 2006, 08:51:59 am
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Would I see a benefit using a socket 754 athlon 64 mobile +3700, over a athlon 64 +3400 desktop?
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Look, dude; get the right parts for the right frickin machine.
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Is there any particular reason why you want to use unorthodox hardware?
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Because its a +3700 which isn't made for desktop computers.
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Because its a +3700 which isn't made for desktop computers.
Did you ever consider that maybe there's a reason?
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It works fine on most 754 boards with an appropriate BIOS, but only some heatsinks will fit on it correctly. But why do you want a mobile 3700? It's rather expensive for what it is, doesn't overclock well and there is little point in getting a higher end processor on the outdated 754 anyway. The only difference over a 3400 is the cache, which counts for about 3% extra performance unless you use Mathematica a lot.
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Yeah I just changed my mind lol. Getting a 939 system, now I gotta deicide if I go dual core or single any suggestions?
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Depends on how much you have to spend, how long you want to keep using the processor and whether you're willing to overclock.
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Overclock yeah, and I'm looking for something that is about on par with an x800GTO or a 6800GS, I don't wont something holding me back, or with massive wasted potential, i.e. not an FX-60.
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Well, if you want to buy something cheap that has great OC'ing potential, the A64 3000 with a venice core is a must buy. Sure, that 1.8Ghz default clock looks bad, but they sure do like to overclock. Take for example, mine runs stable at 2.52Ghz with a small increase to the Vcore.
The review below got theirs to 2.79Ghz stable.
http://www.hexus.net/content/item.php?item=1255&page=4
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On par with a video card? I'm not sure what you mean. :confused:
The single cores are cheaper and overclock better than the dual cores, but will become slower over time as more programs are designed to be multithreaded.
For single cores, the Opteron 144 or 146 are no brainers. Both are outstanding overclockers with the right motherboard and good air cooling. I have my 146 at a stable 3ghz. The 146 typically overclocks higher (2.7-2.8ghz is common) and is around $210 while the 144 doesn't go as high (around 2.5-2.6ghz) but is only $170.
If you want a dual core, the 3800 and Opteron 165 are the best options, but the choice between those is less clear. The 165 overclocks a little better (but its advantage over X2s is not quite like that of the single core Opterons over normal A64s) and comes with a nice stock heatsink and extra cache, but costs about $30 more.
The review below got theirs to 2.79Ghz stable.
http://www.hexus.net/content/item.php?item=1255&page=4
That looks like an older review. The early venice A64s could go very high, but after the initial batches the rest apparently haven't been quite as good.
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That looks like an older review. The early venice A64s could go very high, but after the initial batches the rest apparently haven't been quite as good.
Glad I got a venice early on then. :D
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Assuming A64-Ms are just as fast as their normal counterparts but produce less heat/use less power, they'd be excellent for microATX or other SFF cases.
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I dont think you'll be able to pull some of the crap that people got away with by putting in the Athlon XP Mobile chips into thier desktop systems. If that's what you're looking for, best stay away. Stick with the correct hardware.
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By graphics card on par with a Video card, I mean I want a midrange CPU, same as a midrange graphics card. Basically, a cpu that won't create bottlenecks for my graphics card, but won't be so powerful the rest of my computer will hold it back a lot.
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The X2 3800+ is an excellent buy, and the bundled cooler for the X2s is actually surprisingly good. I thought about buying a nifty cooler for my new system but decided to see how the stock cooler performed first and, well, still using the stock cooler as I simply can't seem to get my 4600+ (I wanted the 3800+ actually, but they were so in demand ther was a 2 month wait to get one... and I didn't feel like waiting) to go above 40C even at sustained max load. It's even relatively quiet too.
An Opteron is definitely better if you want to OC though. They're simply better made. But frankly, 2GHz on an Athlon is sufficient for 90% of all applications as they get a lot more done per clock cycle than a P4. So I guess your choice is really up to whether you favour your wallet or your bragging ability the most ;)
Either way, I'd definitely go for a dual-core these days. It's amazing for multi tasking. No more annoying wait every time I switch tasks, and no slowdowns from running anti-virus programs or other things in the background while gaming. Just one thing: If you do go dual-core, and also get an Nvidia video card, use the 77.77 drivers and not the newest ones if you like running older games that aren't made with a consideration for dual core systems, as otyherwise you'll run into trouble with the likes of KOTOR.
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By graphics card on par with a Video card, I mean I want a midrange CPU, same as a midrange graphics card. Basically, a cpu that won't create bottlenecks for my graphics card, but won't be so powerful the rest of my computer will hold it back a lot.
Any 1.8ghz or higher A64 will fit that requirement, even without any overclocking (which pretty much includes all of them) in most games. The only exceptions to this that I've seen are UT2004 and the original Deus Ex, and that's with much more powerful cards.
Assuming A64-Ms are just as fast as their normal counterparts but produce less heat/use less power, they'd be excellent for microATX or other SFF cases.
Most of them are still the old 130nm clawhammer cores, so they are actually quite a bit more power hungry and heat producing than the newer 939 90nm desktop chips.
I dont think you'll be able to pull some of the crap that people got away with by putting in the Athlon XP Mobile chips into thier desktop systems. If that's what you're looking for, best stay away. Stick with the correct hardware.
They will generally work fine. It's just that there is no advantage in using them. The Opterons have taken the place of the old mobile XPs as the overclocking champs. It would have been even better if the HE versions were on 939 too.
The X2 3800+ is an excellent buy, and the bundled cooler for the X2s is actually surprisingly good.
The 3800 actually doesn't come with the good cooler. It's the only dual core that has the vanilla single core cooler; the rest all have the heatpipe/80mm cooler.
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Bleh, they nixed the good cooler for the 3800+? Bastards. I take that back then. All the others have a good one though, same one that comes with the FX series in fact if I remember right.
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Yeah, that's one advantage of the 165 over the 3800. You don't have to buy a separate cooler for decent overclocks and may end up saving a bit in the end.
There are actually two types of the heatpipe coolers, the original one with a 70mm fan and a new one with a 80mm fan and more fins. The first one is pretty good, but it's the other one that really shines for a stock cooler. Until last month they were using the old one on everything, but all the FXs and dual cores these days (aside from the 3800) are including the new one.
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Dual Core vs. Single core:
I went from a Single core winnie [email protected] to a dual core opty [email protected]. In gaming, I noticed no performance difference, so if gaming is your only concern, there is no huge advantage just now. Might be down the road, might not, depends on how a lot of things pans out. Have been some minor compatibility nuiscances, but nothing that couldn't get sorted out.
Encoding, however, is a different beast altogether. There it made a huge difference, so if you do any DVD shrinking or similiar tasks, dual core is seriously worth considering.
Can't comment on the stock cooler though. I just slapped my XP-90 back on. Figure I'll send the opty heatsink with the winchester if I ever get around to selling that thing.
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If your going the 939 Athlon64 single core then if your tossup is between the 3700+ and the 3800+ go for the 3700+ its cheapter but it has a larger cache size and therefore its speed difference is minimal and infact its nearly identical with the 3700+ pulling out infront in a few tests.
If you can wait...the Socket AM2 Athlon64's are due out in June according to several news sites and an AMD rep I was speaking to. Its got a new core and the memory controller has been upgraded to DDR2-800.
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One thing to keep in mind is that the cheapest dual core is $300 while the single core Opteron 144 can be had for as little as $135 (the price seems to have fallen a lot recently). For a gaming oriented computer, I would only buy a dual core once the graphics hardware has been more or less maxed out. That saved money could be put into the video card, which would yield a much larger boost over any processor you could buy.
Can't comment on the stock cooler though. I just slapped my XP-90 back on. Figure I'll send the opty heatsink with the winchester if I ever get around to selling that thing.
That's exactly what I did. :D Although my 146 just came with the crappy basic cooler.