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Off-Topic Discussion => General Discussion => Topic started by: aldo_14 on May 04, 2006, 09:04:47 am

Title: women having 4th kid.......... at 63
Post by: aldo_14 on May 04, 2006, 09:04:47 am
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/4971930.stm

She's a psychiatrist, which'll come in handy.
Title: Re: women having 4th kid.......... at 63
Post by: vyper on May 04, 2006, 09:17:56 am
Thats going to be one screwed up kid.
Title: Re: women having 4th kid.......... at 63
Post by: Rictor on May 04, 2006, 09:19:41 am
The more disturbing thing for me is to imagine that a 63 year old women even has a sex drive. Eugh!
Title: Re: women having 4th kid.......... at 63
Post by: aldo_14 on May 04, 2006, 09:19:57 am
The more disturbing thing for me is to imagine that a 63 year old women even has a sex drive. Eugh!

she doesn't; she's having IVF
Title: Re: women having 4th kid.......... at 63
Post by: Carl on May 04, 2006, 09:55:12 am
The more disturbing thing for me is to imagine that a 63 year old women even has a sex drive. Eugh!

The female sex drive doesn't deminish with age like the male one.
Title: Re: women having 4th kid.......... at 63
Post by: aldo_14 on May 04, 2006, 09:56:04 am
The more disturbing thing for me is to imagine that a 63 year old women even has a sex drive. Eugh!

The female sex drive doesn't deminish with age like the male one.

Never heard of the menopause?
Title: Re: women having 4th kid.......... at 63
Post by: Triple Ace on May 04, 2006, 02:25:11 pm
That is just disturbing. I think I'm gonna be sick.
Title: Re: women having 4th kid.......... at 63
Post by: Polpolion on May 04, 2006, 03:56:35 pm
*throws up entrails
Title: Re: women having 4th kid.......... at 63
Post by: karajorma on May 04, 2006, 07:32:06 pm
Quote
The reports of Dr Rashbrook's pregnancy have sparked an outcry from pro-life groups.

"We're pro-lifers against married couples having children!" :lol:


Personally I'm finding all this argument quite interesting. The arguments seem to revolve around two main points with the only one I actually care about pretty marginalised.

1) The parents are likely to die before the kids have grown up
2) Older parents won't have the energy to deal with a toddler

The questions I'd like to ask anyone citing those two as an argument are. So health reasons like those should prevent you from having kids? What if she was in a wheelchair instead of being 63? What if she had cancer and would be dead in 5 years? Blind? Deaf-mute?

Personally I reckon the biggest issues are that she's probably hugely increasing the risk of Down's Syndrome (unless that's due to the age of the egg not the mother) and that her body is unlikely to be able to cope with the stresses and strains of pregnancy. Beyond that it's pretty out of order to start complaining that she shouldn't have kids cause she's too old to bring them up properly when we aren't sterilising chavs on sight.
Title: Re: women having 4th kid.......... at 63
Post by: Mefustae on May 04, 2006, 08:08:43 pm
"In other news, in light of recent developments, breast feeding is now illegal in public areas."
Title: Re: women having 4th kid.......... at 63
Post by: BlackDove on May 04, 2006, 08:19:01 pm
And so is having children when you're past the age of 30.
Title: Re: women having 4th kid.......... at 63
Post by: Mars on May 04, 2006, 08:23:34 pm
My mom is 49 and has a three year old, you do the math.
Title: Re: women having 4th kid.......... at 63
Post by: BlackDove on May 04, 2006, 09:11:56 pm
My math tells me that when the kid is 18 years of age, she will be old enough to be its grandmother?

As much as biology is a wonderous work of nature, there is a reason why in China, they sanction one child per household.
Title: Re: women having 4th kid.......... at 63
Post by: Taristin on May 04, 2006, 11:47:55 pm
Old people have more sex than young people.  Ask BW, IIRC he made a post about the most common diseases at nursning homes being STDs.
Title: Re: women having 4th kid.......... at 63
Post by: Grug on May 05, 2006, 12:40:50 am
It's been done before, why cry out now?
Title: Re: women having 4th kid.......... at 63
Post by: Mefustae on May 05, 2006, 12:43:17 am
Old people have more sex than young people.  Ask BW, IIRC he made a post about the most common diseases at nursning homes being STDs.

Aww! C'mon man, we did not need to know that!!
Title: Re: women having 4th kid.......... at 63
Post by: Grug on May 05, 2006, 12:49:40 am
Old people have more sex than young people.  Ask BW, IIRC he made a post about the most common diseases at nursning homes being STDs.

Aww! C'mon man, we did not need to know that!!

Do you really think all you'll do is watch Wheel of Fortune 24/7 when you get older? :p
Title: Re: women having 4th kid.......... at 63
Post by: Turambar on May 05, 2006, 12:50:09 am
gaah they got it all wrong

we need LESS babies, not MORE babies

Making More babies is the exact opposite of making Less babies
dammit, the world is just going straight downhill
Title: Re: women having 4th kid.......... at 63
Post by: aldo_14 on May 05, 2006, 03:13:09 am
gaah they got it all wrong

we need LESS babies, not MORE babies

Making More babies is the exact opposite of making Less babies
dammit, the world is just going straight downhill

We need less babies in some places and more babies in some other places.
Title: Re: women having 4th kid.......... at 63
Post by: WMCoolmon on May 05, 2006, 03:31:50 am
She looks pretty good for 63
Title: Re: women having 4th kid.......... at 63
Post by: aldo_14 on May 05, 2006, 03:41:14 am
She looks pretty good for 63

Only from a distance in a small pic.  Close-up (on the news), she's every inch of 63.
Title: Re: women having 4th kid.......... at 63
Post by: Wild Fragaria on May 05, 2006, 09:32:02 am
She looks pretty good for 63

Is that why a lot of young men get hitched with older women these day?   ;7
Title: Re: women having 4th kid.......... at 63
Post by: karajorma on May 05, 2006, 09:35:40 am
Well he's 61 so she's hardly cradle snatching :p
Title: Re: women having 4th kid.......... at 63
Post by: Ferret on May 05, 2006, 09:49:27 am
People can still have a lot of energy at an old age, my grandfather is nearing 72 and is the fittest person I know. Age doesn't mean crap, it's how you live.
Title: Re: women having 4th kid.......... at 63
Post by: aldo_14 on May 05, 2006, 11:04:19 am
1) The parents are likely to die before the kids have grown up
2) Older parents won't have the energy to deal with a toddler

The questions I'd like to ask anyone citing those two as an argument are. So health reasons like those should prevent you from having kids? What if she was in a wheelchair instead of being 63? What if she had cancer and would be dead in 5 years? Blind? Deaf-mute?

Not health reasons, mortality reasons, but you do have a point.

The cancer concept IMO is closest to that, but with the caveat that a) there would quite possibly be a young health parent and b) there would be other issues RE: sideeffects of cancer treatment to consider.  What my concern is, that having aging parents who are statistically likely to be dead before you finish university, is something that could be developmentally harmful to the child by transferring the burden of care to them far earlier than they're mentally capable.  If you're mum and dad were in nursing homes before you were, say, 14, then I think you'd have some big problems.  Also it's kind of inconsiderate to the other 3 kids, who must be wondering what's so wrong with them (and may need to take up care of a 10 year old if their parents die a few years younger than average).
Title: Re: women having 4th kid.......... at 63
Post by: karajorma on May 05, 2006, 11:24:13 am
I'm not saying that the parents made the correct choice in the situation by a long shot. The fact that they had to go to that self-publicising bastard Severino Antinori in order to get this done pretty much shows why it wasn't a good idea. That man cares nothing about the welfare of either mother or child. The fact that he wanted to help a couple give birth to a cloned child even though the technology simply isn't there yet and the most likely result would be a stillbirth or heavily deformed baby pretty much proves that to me.

My point was simply that the reasons people are giving are very poor. Psychological issues are another thing but to claim that physical incapasity should prevent you from having children is something I find pretty repugnant.
Title: Re: women having 4th kid.......... at 63
Post by: Grug on May 05, 2006, 11:32:04 am
Well adoption or having someone else being the birth mother may have been a better choice in this situation. But one has to assume someone considers all options before continuing forward with such a decision. Perhaps they were ill advised somewhere down the line or something.
Yet I'd still say best of luck to them.
Title: Re: women having 4th kid.......... at 63
Post by: aldo_14 on May 05, 2006, 01:28:07 pm
My point was simply that the reasons people are giving are very poor. Psychological issues are another thing but to claim that physical incapasity should prevent you from having children is something I find pretty repugnant.

I'm not sure it's that repugnant, to be honest.  We're not talking about preventing natural procreation for one thing, but the question as to whether you should allow IVF treatment for someone - someones, given the age of the parents - who has a high chance of being unable to care for that child for various reasons.  It is an incredibly hard thing when you think about it, and get past the knee-jerk 'unnatural' aspect of it (which I'll admit to having), although on the other side you wouldn't give a 14-year old IVF, and it is different to suggestion restrictions on IVF treatment to suggesting a ban on natural procreation.  To me IVf has to have the same considerations as, say, adoption, and I'm not sure this couple would be selected for that because of their age.  Possibly in that context, I have an incling that doctor implements precisely ****-all controls in that manner, which makes any 'selection' by him highly disturbing by association.
Title: Re: women having 4th kid.......... at 63
Post by: karajorma on May 05, 2006, 03:54:15 pm
I think you've misunderstood me. I was saying that I find it repugnant to say that you can't have kids because you are physically unable to run around after a toddler. There are plenty of reasons why this particular case may be a bad idea but that particular one needs to be put to bed right now or else it would rule out people who are blind or suffer from other disabilites too.
Title: Re: women having 4th kid.......... at 63
Post by: Wild Fragaria on May 06, 2006, 10:56:31 am
1) The parents are likely to die before the kids have grown up
2) Older parents won't have the energy to deal with a toddler

The questions I'd like to ask anyone citing those two as an argument are. So health reasons like those should prevent you from having kids? What if she was in a wheelchair instead of being 63? What if she had cancer and would be dead in 5 years? Blind? Deaf-mute?

Not health reasons, mortality reasons, but you do have a point.

The cancer concept IMO is closest to that, but with the caveat that a) there would quite possibly be a young health parent and b) there would be other issues RE: sideeffects of cancer treatment to consider.  What my concern is, that having aging parents who are statistically likely to be dead before you finish university, is something that could be developmentally harmful to the child by transferring the burden of care to them far earlier than they're mentally capable.  If you're mum and dad were in nursing homes before you were, say, 14, then I think you'd have some big problems.  Also it's kind of inconsiderate to the other 3 kids, who must be wondering what's so wrong with them (and may need to take up care of a 10 year old if their parents die a few years younger than average).

It is true that againg parent are more likely to die when the children are still very young.  As for the parents to see them graduate college is one thing but old enough to take care of themselves is another.  It's highly possible that an individual can finish college around the age of 19 in the States. On top of that, the avarage human life span has tremendously increased since 50 years ago.  So the mother is this case might actually stand a chance to live to see her youngest child graduated from college.  To be realistic, she really shouldn't want to have babies at her age, consider there are more risks and disadvantages than benefits.
Title: Re: women having 4th kid.......... at 63
Post by: IceFire on May 06, 2006, 02:13:37 pm
gaah they got it all wrong

we need LESS babies, not MORE babies

Making More babies is the exact opposite of making Less babies
dammit, the world is just going straight downhill
Thats a misnomer.  Plenty of people think that the world is overpopulated.  They are generally right but specifically wrong.  The birth to death rates in most European countries and in North America are falling drastically.  Most families here can afford and plan to have two kids but given that not all couples have kids and so forth...basically we're declining.  In China I think we will see the population drop drastically in the next 30 or 40 years as long as the 1 child policy continues.  Its Africa and India that we then have to worry about.  The population levels are soaring in those places...and what it does is strain natural resources beyond their limits.

My biggest conundrum in Africa is that so many people die, so many are destitute, so few are educated, and so forth that they have tons of children, not many survive but they end up with far more people than around here.  The land cannot support them and the cycle continues.  Maybe if we stopped selling them guns....I digress.

I don't see a huge problem with the 63 year old mother.  Its a little unusual but if the kid grows up in a strong family it doesn't matter too much.