Hard Light Productions Forums
Modding, Mission Design, and Coding => The Modding Workshop => Topic started by: Topgun on March 26, 2007, 12:41:55 pm
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It takes forever for me to model, what am I doing wrong? it takes me about 8-12hrs just to do a simple med-poly model, and you can forget about textures...
And then I see everybody else making awesome models in 1-4hrs?!?!
What am I doing wrong?!?!
ps: i use Blender.
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Would help if you could specify how you model, in order to answer your question :P
From the top of my head:
1. I ALWAYS have a clear idea of what I want (either mentaly or previously sketched). That means that I spend less time experimenting with the model itself in Blender, only doing it in the few cases where in 3d doesnt look as good as I thought, OR if I had another small idea in the meanwhile.
2. I know my modelling software, that means I know exactly what to do in order to achieve my ends... this one is only solvable by practice, trial and error, screwing up alot, and reading info on the program
If that doesnt help, be more specific please :)
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Um, I mesh model. I make a simple mesh, move the points, extrude, move the points again, rinse lather and repeat. but what I mean is how can I make a smooth model? and then it is one heck of a pain to keep textures
in the COB. how the h--- do I make a texture in less then 80hrs. I make a simple metal color, add a layer, change the color of the layer, and merge, rinse lather ripeat.
oh and thanks for posting.
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Your way of modelling is the same as mine. I dont know if you have tried it, but sometimes I make some parts just by extruding vertices, linking them, and making faces from them. Too smooth the model, its either a) move the vertices in a way that you have a smooth syrface, or b) apply smooth shading
As far as the textures go, you only worry about that AFTER the model is done... at that point you have to UV map the model (that is, define where each face is in a 2d image), and then draw the texture in photoshop... using the brush, a plethora of effects\filters\ blendin modes etc
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well, so how you keep the materials when you export to .cob?
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create, fine tune, export to 3ds, open in wings3d, apply auto-smoothing, smooth, fix up minor errors, uvmap, texture. save, export, open in truespace, save, convert.
http://www.wings3d.com/
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well, so how you keep the materials when you export to .cob?
Thats something I have no idea, I just use blender for the modelling part, the UV maps I make them on 3dMax. But thats a question Vasudan Admiral can answer, because he mentioned before that he does it all on blender, except the conversion of course
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Doh! I don't have 3dsMAX, and they stopped giving out GMAX!
now imagine Little Richard screaming "Somebody Help me!!!"
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I never said you HAD to do it in 2dsMax now did I? :P I only said that im clueless at how to UVmap in blender because I never needed it ;)
It IS possible to do everything for a freespace in Blender, except for hierarchy stuff and ofc conversion... that means you can UVmap\texure your models in blender np... I just dont know how :P
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GMAX I have the free version of... want me to upload it somewheres?
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blender has no hiearchy. they dont expect you to be using it for space sim games.
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GMAX I have the free version of... want me to upload it somewheres?
Is that legal?
and what is OFC?
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ofc= of course :P changed the original
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ofc= of course :P changed the original
oh! ::)
I use Truspace for that. now for the other thin
Calling Vasudan Admiral!
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blender has no hiearchy. they dont expect you to be using it for space sim games.
....mate, if your threads on GW are anything to go by, you've used Blender for a couple of weeks. As such there is no shame in admiting you haven't found the heirarchy system (outliner view) yet, but saying it's not there is just plain wrong. :p
And what on earth do you mean by 'they don't expect you to be using it for space sim games'? Blender is a full 3d modeling and animation package - it wasn't built for making ships as it's goal. It's just very good at it.
Anyways, just explained the process to Topgun via PM, and since I guess others may find it helpful, here:
Hey, the name's Topgun. I have a question for ya. How do you keep the materials in Blender when you export to COB?
Hey, well, the simple answer is that you can't. :(
The various file format exporters and importers were all written by different Blender users, and as such they have different levels of stability, capability and completion. The truespace COB exporter is unfortunately one of the less capable ones.
It will be able to export all your objects and have TS recognise them as separate objects, it will keep the UV data of your textures and sometimes keep the objects positions relative to each other correctly. It won't however export the heirarchy, textures (it gives everything a default texture) and usually not object centres.
However, there is a way to get your Blender models into TS ready for heirarchy conversion. It will require that you set up your parts so they look something like this in Blenders outliner view:
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y184/VA--Twisted_Infinities/BlenderTutorialStuff/OutlinerView.jpg
Notice that there's no heirarchy there. I did a lot of exporting experimentation and found that none of the formats will preserve that, so there's no point in assembling it in Blender. :( TS is actually better for that bit anyway.
So, once I'm at that stage, I export it as a DirectX .X file (just press the export all button). From there, open it up in 3d exploration (D/L it here: http://homepage.ntlworld.com/karajorma/FAQ/Downloads/3DExplorer_v181.rar) and re-save it as a COB.
Because of Truespace' crappy importing, that's the only way you can get it to keep the objects separate. You'll still lose the object names and centres, but it's not too hard to figure them out again and they will retain their textures, positions relative to each other, and you'd have to redo their centres anyway.
Opening it up in TS, you'll see something like this in the scene editor: http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y184/VA--Twisted_Infinities/BlenderTutorialStuff/TS_ImportedHeirarchy.jpg
From there just figure out what is what, set it up in TS as you would any other ships heirarchy, save to COB or SCN and convert using TS. Have a look at Karajorma's turreting tutorial for more help there. :)
Also, I'm currently working on a tutorial that will build, texture, convert and complete a ship starting in Blender, so that should help with this sorta thing. :)
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GMAX I have the free version of... want me to upload it somewheres?
Is that legal?
Should be. It's free, and you'd still have to register with them to get the code to allow it to work. If they don't want you to use it, then they won't allow you to get the code. Now, if I gave you the program and my code, that might be a bit dicey. Want me to try?
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GMAX I have the free version of... want me to upload it somewheres?
Is that legal?
Should be. It's free, and you'd still have to register with them to get the code to allow it to work. If they don't want you to use it, then they won't allow you to get the code. Now, if I gave you the program and my code, that might be a bit dicey. Want me to try?
Please!
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K, I will, but it might be tomorrow morning (12-16 hrs from now) before I finish, as I have to leave now. (Currently uploading)
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Thanks everyone. you guys helped allot (even Taka gave me good advice! :lol:).
I am still a newbie so post any helpful info please.
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http://hosted.filefront.com/jr2/
You're lucky; I'm done now, go there and browse around, pick up the stuff you want. Don't ask me what the progs do; I haven't done more than open them up... D'l the file gmax_and_truespace_registration_links (or whatever it's called), this has the links (I hope they still work) for you to register GMAX and TS3.2.
EDIT: Under the folder for 3d Modeling programs. G2g now. Enjoy! :D
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I consiter 9 hours start-finish _complete_ for geometry allone to be a good time, it can take me weeks some times to get a model done, though my better models tend to be less than 12 hours.
UV mapping is something I still hate to do, it tends to be my big bottle neck, textures can take a month, though a week is more common, and there is always a settleing time were minor details are buffed, that can take years.
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In sum, the time you spend on it, depends on the model itself, and of course, the time you are willing to take to refine and fine tune your model
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good models take time. the htl ragnarok in nukemod took me 6 weeks straight. and i was really into it. of course that went from nothing to fully textured. then the htl phoenix probibly took no more than 3 days, including textures. i admit learning max has shaved alot off my modeling time, even so im not really that fast. i think the pros are expected to model 2 or 3 complete models a day textured. master the technique first then worry about speed later.
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I dont think the pros are expected to be THAT fast... in fact I think about 3\4 days per model (on a professional) is a rather average speed... otherwise think of it like this:
IF they were expected to pump 2\3 models a day, and that more often than not are multiple modelers working on the same project, those modelers would find themselves unemployed in a week :P
Also, dont forget that in most situations youll have the tasks more divided: modelers, texturers, concept artists, etc... everyone of those knows the trade of the other 2, but he isnt as fast\good as the other 2 in their respective areas
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Also, I'm currently working on a tutorial that will build, texture, convert and complete a ship starting in Blender, so that should help with this sorta thing. :)
VA that is probably the best news I have read on here since I found a handy guide for getting the SCP working without an installer!! :)
I tried Blender and gave up as I was punching outside of my weight. Now I have started my first model in TS3.2 I can see how much better (but harder to crack) Blender is.
How about a Blender based sticky where you can pimp the program and save us cluttering the forums with continuous cries for help?
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Also, I'm currently working on a tutorial that will build, texture, convert and complete a ship starting in Blender, so that should help with this sorta thing. :)
VA that is probably the best news I have read on here since I found a handy guide for getting the SCP working without an installer!! :)
I tried Blender and gave up as I was punching outside of my weight. Now I have started my first model in TS3.2 I can see how much better (but harder to crack) Blender is.
How about a Blender based sticky where you can pimp the program and save us cluttering the forums with continuous cries for help?
you should ask one of the mods.
that is a great idea since blender is the most powerful, free model app (in my opinion).
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That sort of stuff should go into the wikki perhaps? Sounds more logical, since HLP is not about pimping software other than FS :P
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I found gmax here http://www.turbosquid.com/gmax with direct links to the files so download managers like GetRight will work.
Learning how to model takes time and just doing stuff in a 3D program. I've seen some amazing stuff done with trueSpace 3.2 on many sites. See the forums at http://www.scifi-meshes.com for some examples, as well as models done in many other 3D apps.
With trueSpace 7.x out, It'd be nice if Caligari would release 4.3 for free as it's much more powerful and has more tools that make modeling much easier. IIRC, 4.2 or 4.3 had the Lightworks rendering engine, which may be what's preventing a free release. T'was cool when trueSpace had Lightworks included, for LESS than what the engine cost as an add-on for Lightwave. :) The only real problem with tS 4.x is it makes a total mess of any procedural textures created with older versions.
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Learning how to model takes time and just doing stuff in a 3D program. I've seen some amazing stuff done with trueSpace 3.2 on many sites. See the forums at http://www.scifi-meshes.com for some examples, as well as models done in many other 3D apps.
You know, this TS challenge thing (http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php/topic,42815.msg880302.html#msg880302) I issued ages ago is still open. :p
As for the tut, the wiki-way is the plan currently, though there will be a thread in modding and hopefully a news post, since I want as many of the almost-modelers we seem to have quite a few of now to at least give it a go to see where it needs improving or re-writing etc. :)
Another advantage is that if more experienced blender users do eventually come along and spot something that I'm making unnessecarily difficult, they can fix it.
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You can't get GMAX codes anymore (via activation link, but if I am wrong please correct me, and send me the REAL link so I can activate mine!). Websites should take it down cause it's misleading to DL a program you can't activate without "questionable help", ie someone else's code.
I got mine off Turbo Squid 6 months ago.
I waited too long and now Free Version is pulled by autodesk.
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http://hosted.filefront.com/jr2/1927020
Look at the text file there for registration links; I also have the programs there.
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You know, the best thing to speed things up is to keep practising.
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And also be informed :P
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Getter, did the link I posted work for you?