Hard Light Productions Forums
Off-Topic Discussion => General Discussion => Topic started by: Kosh on March 02, 2008, 12:20:11 am
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http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/23408757/
Coolness.
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That thing is an insane piece of work. It'll be interesting to see what new science will come out of it :)
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This:
(http://pcmedia.gamespy.com/pc/image/article/566/566979/hls01_1100725391.jpg)
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A fancy light show? Oh come on, you can do better. The energy stored in just one of the magnets in the ATLAS detector is enough to melt a couple of tons of solid gold outright. Its beam dump will have to dissipate over 700 Megajoules in less than a millisecond whenever they want to turn it off - That's probably enough to reduce an M1 Abrams tank to molten slag. Many universities involved with the project have had to have special high-speed data connections built just to cope with the amount of data that needs to be moved for analysis. As I said, the LHC is insane... it deserves at least a modern game with more impressive special effects ;)
Plus given that the world wide web was invented at CERN, Half-Life already owes much of its popularity to it even without the LHC :p
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Hello Mr. Blackhole! Do you believe in Hawking Radiation? No? OH SH--[transmission prematurely ended].
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Can it divide by zero?
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Can it divide by zero?
only if you use an egg and cress sandwich but it is a tricky and sometimes messy operations
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So when things go wrong, how big a chunk do you think it will blow off from mother earth?
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More likely it will just wreck the facility.
And I wonder how many people are going to try and tie the LHC experinments with that 2012 doomsday prophecy....
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Finally! :yes:
Now them eggheads will get to business regarding the Higgs' boson and whether or not it actually exists.
Or alternatively...
(http://thxforthe.info/blog/wp-content/uploads/2007/12/divided_by_zero.jpg)
:lol:
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I can't wait to read something about the results... ;7
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I can't wait to read something about the results... ;7
Budget cut. ;7
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if were luckey then they accidently created a warp drive and warp the earth right into the sun
muahahaha
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That would be a problem... :blah:
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No, not a fancy light show. It will open a portal to an alien dimension and we all know the rest.
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so when is the testfiring and blackholedness ?
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This:
(http://pcmedia.gamespy.com/pc/image/article/566/566979/hls01_1100725391.jpg)
Bah. Real over fake.
http://www.riemurasia.net/jylppy/media.php?id=44890&c=5
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:ha:
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so when is the testfiring and blackholedness ?
It's been testfired and there's no smoking hole in the ground and the Earth hasn't been destroyed.
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I think everyone is being altogether too reasonable about this!
Clearly the Large Hadron Collider (more like the Large Hardon Collider am i rite) is a device built by atheist 'scientists' who intend to tear a rift through the Van Allen Belt and bring about the Apocalypse! Can't you see that? Are you all so blind?
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Ransom you mad fool, you inspired them to build a SYNC device.....
Now we're all doomed and it's your fault...........
:warp:
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it hasent been testfired at full power ......
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Ransom you mad fool, you inspired them to build a SYNC device.....
Now we're all doomed and it's your fault...........
:warp:
I nominate myslef as Trancendant :nod:
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Hardon Collider
Cannot unsee. :warp:
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Particle physics gives me a hadron
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:lol:
I read about this in Demons and Angels.
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I wouldn't be the least bit surprised to find it had already been tested before it opens officially. Most Nuclear power plants were started that way, the official pulling the lever, cutting the rope or whatever was actually 'opening' something that had been started at least 24 hours beforehand.
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That's nderstandable, the last thing you want is for all your investors to be standing around for the pig lever pulkl. Only for a puff of smoke and a weak whimper to be the sole result.. Testing before public revelation = good practice :nod:
Also it gives time to warm it up so they can pull "another world" trick on the people they owe money to.
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Ransom, why would Atheists want to bring about the Apocalypse? The Christians get a better deal out of that whole matter... /oversimplification
Anyway. We were talking about Mass Spectrometers in Chem class yesterday. I was INCREDIBLY tempted to ask about a Resonance Cascade.
Lol in that link Fury posted, there's a guy in the back left that looks kinda like Breen.
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More like anti-mass spectrometers amirite?
/me played Half-Life SO MUCH as a kid.
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Urrite. I played it to death. It got to the point where i modelled my school, my house my pub and my barracks in worldcraft. Complete with toxic waste filled-radiation zoned toilets.
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Should I bother to write? I'm seriously considering this you know.
There has been recorded more energetic particles incoming on the Earth than the LHC is able to produce.
Better thing to ask is where are the applications of the basic research of this line. It tends to stir some emotions. And is pretty funny too, if you aren't working there.
Mika
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I think trying to harness ambient radiation would be like trying to move a desert one grain of sand at a time. Not cost effective and too much effort.
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Oh, I meant the DOOM prophecies of small black holes, that were supposed to DOOM Earth. There has been more energetic DOOM particles coming from above.
Mika
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Oh, I meant the DOOM prophecies of small black holes, that were supposed to DOOM Earth. There has been more energetic DOOM particles coming from above.
Mika
You mean we're (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/c/c9/Doom-boxart.jpg/300px-Doom-boxart.jpg)'ed?
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I always loved how those demons were never in any of the games and how they had that one lone space marine off in the distance coming to help you when the game was all about how you were alone in a monster infested space colony.
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well there are alot of dead space marine corpses around in the game... :nervous:
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It's been awhile but wasn't 4 player LAN available?
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And a lot of demons.
I believe it was 8 players via IPX socket connections... Wow that was old school.
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Scientists at the LHC have been getting death threats (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/earth/main.jhtml?xml=/earth/2008/09/05/scilhc105.xml) and pleas to shut the machine down:
Scientists working on the world's biggest machine are being besieged by phone calls and emails from people who fear the world will end next Wednesday, when the gigantic atom smasher starts up.
The Large Hadron Collider near Geneva, where particles will begin to circulate around its 17 mile circumference tunnel next week, will recreate energies not seen since the universe was very young, when particles smash together at near the speed of light.
Such is the angst that the American Nobel prize winning physicist Frank Wilczek of the Massachusetts Institute of Technology has even had death threats, said Prof Brian Cox of Manchester University, adding: "Anyone who thinks the LHC will destroy the world is a t---."
The head of public relations, James Gillies, says he gets tearful phone calls, pleading for the £4.5 billion machine to stop.
"They phone me and say: "I am seriously worried. Please tell me that my children are safe," said Gillies.
Emails also arrive every day that beg for reassurance that the world will not end, he explained.
Others are more aggressive. "There are a number who say: "You are evil and dangerous and you are going to destroy the world."
"I find myself getting slightly angry, not because people are getting in touch but the fact they have been driven to do that by what is nonsense. What we are doing is enriching humanity, not putting it at risk."
There have also been legal attempts to halt the start up.
For ****s sake....... :rolleyes:
EDIT: I forgot the date on the article is in the European system.
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http://www.telegraph.co.uk/earth/main.jhtml?xml=/earth/2008/02/06/scitime106.xml
Prof Irina Aref'eva and Dr Igor Volovich, mathematical physicists at the Steklov Mathematical Institute in Moscow believe that the vast experiment at CERN, the European particle physics centre near Geneva in Switzerland, may turn out to be the world's first time machine, reports New Scientist.
:D
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:wtf:
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:wtf:
Seconded.
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http://www.telegraph.co.uk/earth/main.jhtml?xml=/earth/2008/02/06/scitime106.xml
Prof Irina Aref'eva and Dr Igor Volovich, mathematical physicists at the Steklov Mathematical Institute in Moscow believe that the vast experiment at CERN, the European particle physics centre near Geneva in Switzerland, may turn out to be the world's first time machine, reports New Scientist.
:D
Let's just kill these Time-o-nauts and watch the time paradoxon fireworks afterwards.
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"the fabric of the universe, which is a blend of space and time that scientists called spacetime."
:wtf:
I really want to bring harm to the writer of this article and his friends and family.
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The actual article they wrote can be found from (written 2007):
http://arxiv.org/pdf/0710.2696v2
They simply show that theoretically, assuming certain conditions for the LHC, it is possible to obtain a closed time curve, which would imply that time travel is possible in the subatomic scale. There are several maybes and assumings, hence: could be possible. Good luck putting it up in the macroscale, though.
I reckon at this point some people are asking what have they been smoking. That's basic research in CERN for you, funded by your tax money. (Not that I would envy them, or anything)
Mika
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I don't get why everybody's so scared that the thing will make a black hole. Even if it did make one and Hawking radiation didn't apply, we're talking about subatomic particles here. *sarcasm* Oh I'm so scared of a black hole with the mass of a PROTON!
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until it absorbs another proton, then it has the mass of two, the four then eight, the more it absorbs the bigger it gets and the faster it eats.
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While it has the SIZE of a proton, black holes are notorious for packing a HUGE mass into a very small SIZE.
Hence, a black hole the SIZE of a proton could have the MASS of a thousand suns.
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Not if it only was created with the energy equivalent of a few protons or whatever. The LHC isn't smashing thousands of suns together (we'll have to wait a few centuries or millennium for one that big), so it can't make a black hole with that much mass.
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Black Holes tend to have a chain-reaction nature about them...
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Black Holes tend to have a chain-reaction nature about them...
Only if the event horizon exists long enough to be able to start accumulating mass. Of course the high velocity any potential black hole would gain from the momentum of the particles that formed the event horizon would mean that time dilatation would slightly lengthen the apparent lifetime of such a black hole, but even so any black hole with mass equivalent of energies released in LHC experiments would dissipate rather fast, or so the theory says.
Mind you, most of the energy in these experiments is kinetic energy. It causes interesting stuff to happen but it's still a relative form of energy and according to my understanding it wouldn't just "morph" into rest mass just like that. Any black hole would only have as much mass as the particles had; rest of the energy would be either released as radiation or become the black hole's (or other particles') kinetic energy. This velocity would be well over the escape velocity from solar system... or the galaxy even. Couple this with the fact that the diameter of the event horizon that would be borne would be really really tiny, so tiny in fact that the probability of the hole actually hitting a particle would be minuscule - even if it were to travel through the Earth.
So sayeth the wise Alaundo.
Repeating the best argument on why LHC will not cause end of world in any shape or form - it hasn't happened yet, and LHC is not going to be doing anything that wouldn't be happening all the time naturally anyways except making high energy particle collisions repeatable and thus a lot easier to research. Very high energy particles hit you all the time. Looking at an open, unprotected bubble chamber it keeps flashing all the time from all kinds of particles hitting it - you might want to check if there's one near you at an observatory or science center or whatever, it's kinda like traceroute...
Anyhows - LHC will instigate proton-proton-collisions of 7+7 TeV, which means 14 TeV total collision energy, or 14*10^12 electronvolts.
Cosmic rays can have energies of over 10^20 electronvolts. Or, if you will, 10 million TeV. The highest observed occurrence of a cosmic ray was a particle with energy of 50 joules which is about the same as the kinetic energy of a tennis ball flying at 42 m/s, which is pretty fast. If it was a proton, it was traveling so close to light speed that it would travel one light year minus 46 nanometers in a year... :nervous:
Since these particles haven't caused the destruction of Earth, It's very safe to say that LHC will not do it either.
Here's something of interest by the way... a simulation about what happens when 1 TeV proton hits the atmosphere: http://astro.uchicago.edu/cosmus/projects/aires/ (http://astro.uchicago.edu/cosmus/projects/aires/)
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So sayeth the wise Alaundo.
And the Lord of Uninformed shall perish....
and in his death he shall spawn a host of mortal progeny
and chaos will be sown in their footsteps
for they will talk s*** about the LHC and other stuff.
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I want them to install some sort of chair/merry-go-round system so that joe public like me can have a nice ride while the particles are sleeping.
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Yes, using a black hole in the middle to rotate it... and.. eat it
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* Looks at page 2 *
Woo, that's the second thread derail I have achieved in my internet history so far!
I want them to install some sort of chair/merry-go-round system so that joe public like me can have a nice ride while the particles are sleeping.
This actually reminded me of a certain legend I heard when I was in a party in the University (party people being Physicists if someone wondered). I recall someone told me there was some buzz when no particles came through the accelerator (not the LHC, can't recall what accelerator it was). Lots of megawatts to start the system and nothing come out of it. Of course, situation being this, they immediately shut down the accelerator (yeah, it takes some time) and started troubleshooting. The end result was someone had forgot a beer bottle inside the tube... That bottle became pretty expensive when you think about it. I suppose the needed energy is several megawatthours to keep the system for some time + the pay for the people who had to check through everything in the accelerator tube.
Inspired by this, my imagination already draw a quick flash of a beer bottle travelling at relativistic speeds, smirking at the physicists and thinking something like:
[drunken red neck accent]
"Hey guys, lookie 'ere, you never gonna guess who's gonna collide with that particle!"
[/drunken red neck accent]
And this ain't no ****. But don't quote me for that one.
Mika
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* Looks at page 2 *
Woo, that's the second thread derail I have achieved in my internet history so far!
I want them to install some sort of chair/merry-go-round system so that joe public like me can have a nice ride while the particles are sleeping.
This actually reminded me of a certain legend I heard when I was in a party in the University (party people being Physicists if someone wondered). I recall someone told me there was some buzz when no particles came through the accelerator (not the LHC, can't recall what accelerator it was). Lots of megawatts to start the system and nothing come out of it. Of course, situation being this, they immediately shut down the accelerator (yeah, it takes some time) and started troubleshooting. The end result was someone had forgot a beer bottle inside the tube... That bottle became pretty expensive when you think about it. I suppose the needed energy is several megawatthours to keep the system for some time + the pay for the people who had to check through everything in the accelerator tube.
Inspired by this, my imagination already draw a quick flash of a beer bottle travelling at relativistic speeds, smirking at the physicists and thinking something like:
[drunken red neck accent]
"Hey guys, lookie 'ere, you never gonna guess who's gonna collide with that particle!"
[/drunken red neck accent]
And this ain't no ****. But don't quote me for that one.
Mika
Looky at my signature.
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Scientists at the LHC have been getting death threats (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/earth/main.jhtml?xml=/earth/2008/09/05/scilhc105.xml) and pleas to shut the machine down:
You know what? As long as no one actually gets hurt I say good. In fact I want more hysteria. I want all the worlds media running stories day and night about how it's the end of the world.
And then on Wednesday they turn it on....and nothing much happens.
For too long the media have scared the public about science. We need a big fake story we can point at and say "They were wrong about the LHC, They wrong about this too." The public won't distrust the media when it comes to science until they see the media getting the science spectacularly wrong in a way that even a Fox News viewer can understand. The LHC could very well be that mistake. You can't get a much bigger prophecy wrong than predicting the end of the world erroneously after all. ;)
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I wouldn't be the least bit surprised to find it had already been tested before it opens officially. Most Nuclear power plants were started that way, the official pulling the lever, cutting the rope or whatever was actually 'opening' something that had been started at least 24 hours beforehand.
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3218/2291013416_66549c1fd3.jpg)
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Now to fully Test the power of this fully armed and operational Battle Station.
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Scientists at the LHC have been getting death threats (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/earth/main.jhtml?xml=/earth/2008/09/05/scilhc105.xml) and pleas to shut the machine down:
You know what? As long as no one actually gets hurt I say good. In fact I want more hysteria. I want all the worlds media running stories day and night about how it's the end of the world.
And then on Wednesday they turn it on....and nothing much happens.
For too long the media have scared the public about science. We need a big fake story we can point at and say "They were wrong about the LHC, They wrong about this too." The public won't distrust the media when it comes to science until they see the media getting the science spectacularly wrong in a way that even a Fox News viewer can understand. The LHC could very well be that mistake. You can't get a much bigger prophecy wrong than predicting the end of the world erroneously after all. ;)
you haven't been paying attention, they are way too good to get caught in a situation like that. they have this situation rigged so no matter what scientists look like idiots. when the LHC doesn't end man, they will just point and say, look at all the stupid scientists who told us this was going to be the end of the world, see people never trust scientists all they do is make insane predictions that don't come true. the media has been honing this skill for many many years, you are not going to be able to turn this around on them so easily.
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I don't think people are going to blame the scientists for this one. You don't have to be a genius to figure out that no sane scientist is going to switch on a machine that will end the world and call it an experiment. :p
Yes you have idiots who'll believe everything they read but the more the press shout out about how the LHC will end the world the less people are going to find them credible when it doesn't.
Of course this only works if the press do take this story and run with it. The current level of nonsense isn't enough.
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This:
(http://pcmedia.gamespy.com/pc/image/article/566/566979/hls01_1100725391.jpg)
That is actually becoming far more plausible:
(http://www.shacknews.com/images/image-o-matic.x?/images/sshots/Screenshot/10698/10698_48c7161254f4d.jpg)
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:shaking:
That's pretty freaky.
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Oh ****..... i think something went wrong
i was watching the videostream from CERN today and then suddenly bright flash and stream went dead ..... OMFG.
http://webcast.cern.ch/index.html
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Nicre try, but a bit premature. So far, the first proton stream is successfully circulating, but they haven't started with the second stream yet, so no particle collisions yet.
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Well we're still here and it's past 10am GMT
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Nicre try, but a bit premature. So far, the first proton stream is successfully circulating, but they haven't started with the second stream yet, so no particle collisions yet.
:P
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Nicre try, but a bit premature. So far, the first proton stream is successfully circulating, but they haven't started with the second stream yet, so no particle collisions yet.
I hadn't heard that until today. I'm somewhat disappointed that we're not getting any collisions today.
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Yup, that was widerly overlooked by the media. Today's testing plan is to get singular beams circulating, first in one direction and then the other, so no collisions there. The original plan calls for first real collision experiments sometime in October.
But from what I'm reading on the blag, preliminary tests were completed faster that planned, so they might speed up a schedule a bit.
You have to keep in mind that today is indeed the big day for most involved engineers, because getting the protons up to speed and keeping them on track is a rather delicate process. If there is a failure in one of the guidance systems, the beam will burn a hole into the cryostatic tube through which it is travelling. This would most likely cause leakage of liquid helium, which in turn would require repairs, for which the coolant would have to be removed. All this would cause huge delays and additional costs.
The media only read so far as "big LHC inauguration today" and started writing away, interviewing self-proclaimed experts with unwarranted-self-importance-syndrome and other doomsday prophets.
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Heard an interview of Stephen Hawking on the radio today where he got asked a few questions about it.
I never knew an artificial voice could sound so pissed off.
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(http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/turn-on.png)
I am so tempted to use this line now.
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I am so tempted to use this line now.
When I go to my university bar tomorrow, I will be using this.
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Well, it seems that CERN is trying to end the world through other means (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j50ZssEojtM).
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http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/turn-on.png
I am so tempted to use this line now.
"Supercollider? I 'ardly know 'er!"
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There does seem to be a problem with Switzerland today. I was trying to use netmeeting at work this afternoon, but the internet was so clogged up that is was taking about 10 minutes to send one powerpoint slide. I think people may be testing the CERN telemetry... all at once.
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Well, it seems that CERN is trying to end the world through other means (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j50ZssEojtM).
Why the **** couldn't it be metal instead :(
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Well, it seems that CERN is trying to end the world through other means (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j50ZssEojtM).
That was... very educational.
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Well, it seems that CERN is trying to end the world through other means (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j50ZssEojtM).
Why the **** couldn't it be metal instead :(
Cause you can't have metal around a superconducting magnet fool. :p
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Superconducting magnet fool.... why does everything stick to you?
Superconducting magnet fool.... it's not your faaaaaault!
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Someone pointed this (http://hasthelargehadroncolliderdestroyedtheworldyet.com/) out to me the other day. It makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside.
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Someone pointed this (http://hasthelargehadroncolliderdestroyedtheworldyet.com/) out to me the other day. It makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside.
This site is faulty! The LHC won't just destroy the world - it already has (http://gist.github.com/9810).
Tachyons, man! Tachyons.
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lol @ last 2 posts :D
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Hey guys, I found a 24/7 live feed site!
http://www.cyriak.co.uk/lhc/lhc-webcams.html
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ROFL!
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Hey guys, I found a 24/7 live feed site!
http://www.cyriak.co.uk/lhc/lhc-webcams.html
A black hole isn't this size, also, it's event horizon would prevent you to actually see anything. I guess.
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hence, the black.
It would only prevent you from seeing anything beyond the event horizon. Before that, however, it's game.
But yeah, that's not what an event horizon looks like, but it's still funny.
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Hey guys, I found a 24/7 live feed site!
http://www.cyriak.co.uk/lhc/lhc-webcams.html
Epic success. :lol:
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They broke it already http://www.cnn.com/2008/TECH/science/09/18/hadron.collider.transformer.breaks.ap/index.html
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LOL I was just reading up on that.
It broke on the first day.