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General FreeSpace => FreeSpace Discussion => Topic started by: tinfoil on June 10, 2008, 02:23:25 pm

Title: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: tinfoil on June 10, 2008, 02:23:25 pm
I can't seem to complete the mission in fs2 where you have to take out 2 of the sath's main beams. i just end up failing 5 times and moving on
Title: Re: Sounds like you do...
Post by: Jeff Vader on June 10, 2008, 02:31:54 pm
Well, just take out the beam cannons. Or at least two of them. A dual Helios can do remarkable things, when fired from an appropriate distance. And do call in the support ship.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: tinfoil on June 10, 2008, 02:36:03 pm
haven't tried dual fire might make it easiar (or faster which is more the problem)
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Art Kelson on June 10, 2008, 02:39:06 pm
Basically what I did was...

1. order all Ships to attack one of the Beams (obviously the one that´s closer)
2. give your Engine full power for more acceleration
3. hit the Afterburners
4. if your within Range of Rockets (not Torpedos), set your Shields to full power and fire all Rockets
5. After all Rockets are fired switch to Torpedo, log in, fire within very close Range (not so close that it hits you)
6. the same for second Beam

...theres a alternative. You could simply fire anything you have at the Beams, then reload your Weapons and make another run. But it took me much to much time, with second Variant...never made it this way.

Just make sure all Fighters/Bombers concentrate on one Beam. Fire your Torpedos as close as possible...i even got so close they hit me, but on the other Hand, if I was to far away, the Torps never reached their Targets.

Suit your Fighter with Torpedos and normal or swarm Rockets. They will do 20-40% Damage on Beam and can be fired long before the Torpedos got in Range.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: haloboy100 on June 10, 2008, 02:40:05 pm
I always cheated at this mission :rolleyes:

Actually, the second half of the Freespace campaign I cheated through on my first playthrough those years ago...

Basically what I did was...

1. order all Ships to attack one of the Beams (obviously the one that´s closer)
2. give your Engine full power for more acceleration
3. hit the Afterburners
4. if your within Range of Rockets (not Torpedos), set your Shields to full power and fire all Rockets
5. After all Rockets are fired switch to Torpedo, log in, fire within very close Range (not so close that it hits you)
6. the same for second Beam

...theres a alternative. You could simply fire anything you have at the Beams, then reload your Weapons and make another run. But it took me much to much time, with second Variant...never made it this way.

Just make sure all Fighters/Bombers concentrate on one Beam. Fire your Torpedos as close as possible...i even got so close they hit me, but on the other Hand, if y I was to far away, the Trops never reached theyr Targets.

Suit your Fighter with Torpedos and normal or swarm Rockets. They will do 20-40% Damage on Beam and can be fired long before the Torpedos got in Range.

You mean the trebuchet? ;)
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Jeff Vader on June 10, 2008, 02:41:07 pm
Dual fire is quite handy. When the mission starts, summon a support ship and fly at the best possible speed towards one of the beam cannons. Fire a dual Helios at it, evade and go for the next one. Repeat. Then, stop so that the support ship can reach you. Again, assault a beam cannon, and then the last one. Then, take some distance to the Sath before it jumps away and order more torpedoes if you feel you need them for the Beleth.

if your within Range of Rockets (not Torpedos), ... Suit your Fighter with Torpedos and normal or swarm Rockets.
1. There is only one fighter capable of carrying torpedoes.
2. This is a scramble mission.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Art Kelson on June 10, 2008, 02:43:01 pm
Quote
You mean the trebuchet?

Yeah, the one with extended Range. It deals a pretty good blow to that Beams.

Quote
1. There is only one fighter capable of carrying torpedoes.
2. This is a scramble mission.

Don´t remember the exact Loadout of my Wingmans, I usually let them like normal. But I know i made it, by using Torpedos and Trebuchets. Hit the Afterburners to get to the Beam as fast as possible and then hit them combined with my Wingmens. Took me about 2 Minutes to take one down. But it takes a whole lot of Time to get to the other one and make another run.

You can´t just fly to the second Beam and fire the Torps, they will get destroyed 99%. But if you make a straight ahead attack, they always hit.

Oh wait. I remember. The first Beam got down pretty fast. And it wasn´t my Torpedo...so something else probably hit it.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Jeff Vader on June 10, 2008, 02:57:17 pm
But I know i made it, by using Torpedos and Trebuchets.
Indeed. Because that is the assigned loadout for this scramble mission. You cannot change it without editing the mission file.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Akalabeth Angel on June 10, 2008, 03:15:12 pm
haven't tried dual fire might make it easiar (or faster which is more the problem)

      Dude, I always fire dual fire. The only time when I don't is when: 1 will be enough to the damage I want to do, or I want to conserve ammo. Against the Sathanas, neither one holds true. Get closer to the beam and launch your bombs, so close that the Sathanas doesn't have time to shoot them down. Then switch launchers and fire the other bombs.
 
      Also when you need to reload, you can call the ship before you'reactually out of ammo. Call it so that after you do launch your last pair, you're really close to reload again right away.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Titan on June 10, 2008, 03:36:29 pm
i cheated through the second part of that campaign too... 'cept for the last 3... i just wanted to find out how it ended... SSL FTW!

the only time i dont use dual fire is if it's a really weak enemy (like an astaroth) or if i'm trying to conserve my torps.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: foolfromhell on June 10, 2008, 04:38:21 pm
I actually managed to take down all 4.

The Sath just sat there in the fight with the Collosus and the Collosus ended with 100% armor.

Unfortunately, the Collossus "suffered moderate damage" and had 85 armor at the next battle.

It sucks.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Rodo on June 10, 2008, 05:08:35 pm
yeah my colossus did not get beamed at all, but it got very injured as the debreafing guy said..... internal problems with the generators i can believe but extenced hull damage hoho ^^

For me, probably the most difficult mission was the one where you had to bring down the ravana on the nebula, that was a tough one to beat...

Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: WMCoolmon on June 10, 2008, 05:09:46 pm
yeah my colossus did not get beamed at all, but it got very injured as the debreafing guy said..... internal problems with the generators i can believe but extenced hull damage hoho ^^

Somebody spilled coke on the weapons console...
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: foolfromhell on June 10, 2008, 05:21:13 pm
Yeah. The Collossus overcharges its beams when it doesnt even have it.

It could just have sat there and taken down the Collosus with its BGreens...
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Kie99 on June 10, 2008, 05:31:29 pm
Quote
You mean the trebuchet?

Yeah, the one with extended Range. It deals a pretty good blow to that Beams.

Does about 2% damage in my experience.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: tinfoil on June 10, 2008, 05:34:22 pm
I tried your suggestions and for some stupid reason the sath actually blew up (this is the mission before it is supposed to) WHY???
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Rodo on June 10, 2008, 05:38:06 pm
I tried your suggestions and for some stupid reason the sath actually blew up (this is the mission before it is supposed to) WHY???

Noooo that's impossible, check again... 

did you used cheat codes?
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: tinfoil on June 10, 2008, 05:39:40 pm
quite possible. i banged away at that thing for ages and it finally went down. for some reason it never warped out.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: haloboy100 on June 10, 2008, 05:40:55 pm
Obviously a glitch.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: foolfromhell on June 10, 2008, 05:43:00 pm
I tried your suggestions and for some stupid reason the sath actually blew up (this is the mission before it is supposed to) WHY???

The ONLY way I see how to do this.

You cant target the Sath when inside the "square" formed by the 2 beams. The angle is too small.

You target the first beam that is in your sights.

Then you ask teammates to attack the next main beams. Then go bakc to the original beams and APPROACH FROM AHEAD. Not parallel. Target with Helios. If you are Medium difficulty or less, this works. You go within 100 meters or so of the beams then launch Dual Fired Helioses. Turn around and BOOST AWAY. If you do it from anywhere more than 200 meters, the Long Range Flak WILL take the Helioses out.

The first one will do 62% and then the second one will do the rest. As soon as its destroyed, go like 1000m ahead of the Sath then do the same to the second.

It is virtually impossible to target the beams and get a clear firing solution when targeting from inside the box created by the beams. By this, I mean the entire area caused by the box and the little "pit" inside. Target from ahead of the Sath and fire when REALLY REALLY CLOSE BY.


After you take out two, you shouldnt have any Helios bombs left after taking out two. Task the teamates to take out the third one while waiting for rearming. Rearm outside the Sathanas's path or he will crush you. After rearming, boost 500-1000m ahead and repeat.

As long as you have 2 beams left, you are pretty safe for the next mission. Take out 3 for more safety. If you manage all 4, the next mission is the easiest in the whole game.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: colecampbell666 on June 10, 2008, 06:08:12 pm
What I do:

Start right away by pressing C-3-8 and then C-5.

Max power to engines and full burn to the beams.

Fire 1 Treb each at 2 fighters, chances are you'll take them down.

Lock onto the beam, make sure that you have dual fire on, and fire the Helioses when you are less than 300 metres away.

Repeat with Beam 2.

Let the Support Ship catch you, and once you're reloaded, take out the other two in the same manner. Use dual Trebs if the beam only has a small amount of health left after being hit.

Reload, and take on the Beleth. Make sure to disable it first.

Wait for 30 seconds after you destroy Gemini, because a new wave jumps in, usually as you are jumping out.

Make sure to press C-3-9 after the Sath leaves.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Polpolion on June 10, 2008, 07:50:57 pm
I remember the very first time I played this mission. I destroyed all the beam canons.

That is a feat I have not been able to reproduce since.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: tinfoil on June 10, 2008, 07:55:43 pm
i can only ever get 1 on very easy :(
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Droid803 on June 10, 2008, 09:14:07 pm
I got the last beam cannon using my Mehku-HL7 as the Sath was jumping out :lol:
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: terran_emperor on June 10, 2008, 10:00:55 pm
I've managed to get all 4 and the Flak turrets on easy - no cheats. Though the Sathanas jumping out hurled me well away from the mission area the first couple of times. So i wasnt able to stop the Beleth...Eventually managed - took tons of restarts
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Droid803 on June 10, 2008, 10:15:26 pm
Has anyone completed the bonus objective (Tail Beam) as well as getting the flak and four forward beams?
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: terran_emperor on June 11, 2008, 12:02:12 am
I never knew that was an objective bonus or otherwise
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Akalabeth Angel on June 11, 2008, 12:03:03 am
I never knew that was an objective bonus or otherwise

         There's no way in hell the player could get over there anyway, would have to rely on the wingmen whose talents are dubious at best.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Mars on June 11, 2008, 01:15:56 am
Heh, I used to suck at it, then I watch a video of Goober playing this mission.

Use your wingmen on the flak and rear beam cannon.

Two Heleii are all it takes to take out a beam cannon, you just need to come at the right velocity (speed and angle).

I can usually get every single objective, all four main beams, the flak cannons, the rear cannon (bonus), all the beam cannons on the demon, and the demon itself.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Art Kelson on June 11, 2008, 05:24:17 am
Quote
I remember the very first time I played this mission. I destroyed all the beam canons

Yeah, the same here. It was probably because i used a lower difficult setting, way back there.

All I can say is, thoose Beams get destroyed if booth Torpedos (dual) hit the Beam. But to make sure they hit, you have to get very close to it...that´s why i said to build up the Shields.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Snail on June 11, 2008, 05:06:31 pm
IIRC I killed all 4 beam cannons, nuked the Beleth, but jumped out before the second Gemini wave arrived and got a court martial and then executed by that idiot called command. In that continuity, I hope the Colossus was destroyed and the subsequent Saths walked all over the GTVA. Serves them right for killing me.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Droid803 on June 11, 2008, 05:21:43 pm
I found executing a bomber pilot for not clearing the fighter screen is just a little retarded. Bomber pilots should be able to the get hell out of there as soon as there is no more stuff to bomb...
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: haloboy100 on June 11, 2008, 05:23:13 pm
I hate this mission for that very reason :doubt:
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: foolfromhell on June 11, 2008, 05:27:43 pm
IIRC I killed all 4 beam cannons, nuked the Beleth, but jumped out before the second Gemini wave arrived and got a court martial and then executed by that idiot called command. In that continuity, I hope the Colossus was destroyed and the subsequent Saths walked all over the GTVA. Serves them right for killing me.

Wait, executed?

They only say that desertion carries the Death Penalty...

I cant wait for 50yrs from now when games will have truly branching stories.

No matter how badly you fail, you can continue. Like, if you get an arm chopped off in an RPG, you dont die but you fight without an arm.

Or your friend dies and you have to make do without her.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: haloboy100 on June 11, 2008, 05:32:28 pm
Or your friend dies and you have to make do without her.
Fire Emblem FTW
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Droid803 on June 11, 2008, 05:44:39 pm
Well, you could technically do that already with some fancy campaign work in FS2.  Further add to the frustration by making the campaign end when the player dies, so they have to start over from the beginning. :lol:

Heh, I used to suck at it, then I watch a video of Goober playing this mission.

Use your wingmen on the flak and rear beam cannon.

Two Heleii are all it takes to take out a beam cannon, you just need to come at the right velocity (speed and angle).

I can usually get every single objective, all four main beams, the flak cannons, the rear cannon (bonus), all the beam cannons on the demon, and the demon itself.

Ah, so that's how you do it. Do you get the kill for the Demon though? (Its important, being the only SD Demon kill in FS2 campaign :P, just like how the SC Hela is important to get the kill for because its the only SC Lilith.)
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: colecampbell666 on June 11, 2008, 06:09:26 pm
SC Hela?
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Snail on June 11, 2008, 06:12:57 pm
Yes, from Their Finest Hour.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Droid803 on June 11, 2008, 06:15:13 pm
Yeah. Comes in after the SC Baal (a Cain) gets killed.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Snail on June 11, 2008, 06:19:22 pm
Which was preceded by the Demogorgon. The Hela was then followed by the Orcus, then by the Beast, and finally by the Sathanas.

Funnily enough, Their Finest Hour was my favorite FS2 mission because I could fly an Ares and blow up cruisers.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: tinfoil on June 11, 2008, 06:20:31 pm
i've always liked Love The Treason...
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Snail on June 11, 2008, 06:27:29 pm
I don't know if I loved Love the Treason or hated it. It was fun blowing up waves and waves and waves of Herc IIs, but it was pretty damn frustrating getting blown out of the sky by Aeolus cruisers.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: tinfoil on June 11, 2008, 06:44:10 pm
i like the part where snipes goes an about how he even followed the instructions. that guy is the best wingman in the game
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Droid803 on June 11, 2008, 06:45:29 pm
The two Aeolus cruisers in Love The Treason are wimpy. The Erinyes will rape them in like, 5 seconds.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Goober5000 on June 11, 2008, 07:10:28 pm
http://staff.hard-light.net/goober5000/downloads/bearbaiting-small.avi
http://staff.hard-light.net/goober5000/downloads/bearbaiting-large.avi

:D

No sound, unfortunately.  I may have to re-record it sometime.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Droid803 on June 11, 2008, 07:17:48 pm
These should be linked on the walkthrough :P "Additional Help: See these videos"

EDIT: What difficulty was that? (and why did the Thebes just...stop giving fire support?)
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: foolfromhell on June 11, 2008, 07:39:31 pm
Goober!

You changed your profile avatar!
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Droid803 on June 11, 2008, 07:41:09 pm
lolwhut? Hasn't it been like that for a little while now?
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: tinfoil on June 11, 2008, 07:42:05 pm
a couple days i think. it's from when he monkeyed BlackDove.
10 Ah ha ha ha ha ha
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: colecampbell666 on June 11, 2008, 08:30:17 pm
And I had sound.

And it's mainly from TrashMan's monkeying.

That should be 287 titles, kara gave me mine.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: haloboy100 on June 11, 2008, 08:32:46 pm
how does he remember all of them anyway?
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: tinfoil on June 11, 2008, 08:47:16 pm
kara gave it to him because of Blackdove's thread though
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Hades on June 11, 2008, 09:03:36 pm
And I had sound.

And it's mainly from TrashMan's monkeying.

That should be 287 titles, kara gave me mine.
How do you that is one of the titles they are talking about? :rolleyes:
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Droid803 on June 11, 2008, 09:19:20 pm
You know the Ravana that jumps in in "Into the Lion's Den"? What was it called again? (And did anyone ever manage to kill it there?)

Whenever I play that mission, I never manage to take down even a single cruiser...maybe I just suck at using the Mara, but killing the three nodes seems to be the only thing I have time for (aside from flying from the node to device 1 to device 2 to device 3 then back to the node on full burn and a few sporadic dogfights).
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: foolfromhell on June 11, 2008, 09:24:51 pm
You know the Ravana that jumps in in "Into the Lion's Den"? What was it called again? (And did anyone ever manage to kill it there?)

Whenever I play that mission, I never manage to take down even a single cruiser...maybe I just suck at using the Mara, but killing the three nodes seems to be the only thing I have time for (aside from flying from the node to device 1 to device 2 to device 3 then back to the node on full burn and a few sporadic dogfights).

I believe it is the SD Nebiros and it is physically impossible to destroy that Ravana short of cheats.

You dont have enough time and trebbies dont do the trick.

And, the Nebiros makes an appearance later in the game too, so you really shouldnt kill it there.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Droid803 on June 11, 2008, 09:32:06 pm
I've heard that the Nebiros shows up if you screw up (?) Dunkerque or something, but I've never seen the Nebiros myself in my one playthrough of the mission.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: tinfoil on June 11, 2008, 09:34:16 pm
i saw it - it killed me. it literally jumped in on top of me and blasted me to kingdom come with the impact
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: foolfromhell on June 11, 2008, 09:34:46 pm
The Nebiros shows up towards the end of the mission. I just remember hearing that word and was like "Sounds familiar! OH wait, it is from Into The Lion's Den!" but I didnt have the opportunity to destroy it.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Droid803 on June 11, 2008, 10:19:04 pm
i saw it - it killed me. it literally jumped in on top of me and blasted me to kingdom come with the impact
Ouch. I've been smacked by a Sath jumping out more than once (actually, basically once every mission there is a Sath, lol), but I've never been smacked by something jumping in.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Retsof on June 11, 2008, 10:36:50 pm
Quote
Whenever I play that mission, I never manage to take down even a single cruiser...maybe I just suck at using the Mara, but killing the three nodes seems to be the only thing I have time for (aside from flying from the node to device 1 to device 2 to device 3 then back to the node on full burn and a few sporadic dogfights).
You don't actually need to warp out in time, you can hang out at the node and have fun vaporising the waves of dragons that keep warping in right next to you.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Grizzly on June 12, 2008, 04:44:48 am
On my second retry of the mission, I took out 2 (I was on Easy difficulty at that time). I found it most difficult to take down the ship that came AFTER the Sathanas, as I was bingo on any arnament and had 11% hull left...

On my second re-run of the campaign (at medium) I took out all 4 (The hint was: Keep a support ship near!). On my third re-run of the campaign, I gunned down all 4 (There are actually 5 as Goober has demostrated with his video's somewhere around here... The one at the back of the Sathanas can be taken out for bonus points), and then proceded to the next mission, where I reloaded on bombs and used a Dual-Helios on a wing of Manticore fighters, which to my suprise actually hit...

Fireworks!
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: colecampbell666 on June 12, 2008, 01:18:52 pm
And I had sound.

And it's mainly from TrashMan's monkeying.

That should be 287 titles, kara gave me mine.
How do you that is one of the titles they are talking about? :rolleyes:
I asked him. :rolleyes:
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Goober5000 on June 12, 2008, 01:26:16 pm
That's total number of members with a custom title.  Not the number of members I've given titles to.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Snail on June 12, 2008, 01:59:21 pm
Do admins give themselves their custom titles?
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: colecampbell666 on June 12, 2008, 02:54:05 pm
Yup. Goob gave himself one as a mod a few years ago, IIRC. He was advertising DEM.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Droid803 on June 12, 2008, 05:24:36 pm
You don't actually need to warp out in time, you can hang out at the node and have fun vaporising the waves of dragons that keep warping in right next to you.
That's news to me. Then theoretically, can't you take down the Nebiros there then with just trebs? :P (oh wait...no support. darn.)
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: colecampbell666 on June 12, 2008, 05:43:44 pm
You can take it out with Kaysers, if you want to stay for a while.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Snail on June 12, 2008, 05:44:35 pm
You can take it out with Kaysers, if you want to stay for a while.
I never knew Kaysers can bypass the big damage flag... Hmm...
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: colecampbell666 on June 12, 2008, 05:45:26 pm
No, once you get past 15%, the damage done decreases exponentially. The ship isn't actually immune to small weapons.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Snail on June 12, 2008, 05:46:45 pm
I always thought it was 10%... Are you sure?

And IMO the big damage flag should be changed, so that the amount of damage decrease is more subtle, so that it starts decreasing the damage at 99%, so that you don't have 5 Orions sitting around with 10% hull.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: colecampbell666 on June 12, 2008, 05:49:39 pm
Since when do you ever get to have the time to blast at Orions/whatever for that long without getting pwnt?
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Droid803 on June 12, 2008, 05:50:16 pm
And IMO the big damage flag should be changed, so that the amount of damage decrease is more subtle, so that it starts decreasing the damage at 99%, so that you don't have 5 Orions sitting around with 10% hull.

That would probably alter balance, but it'd be much prettier.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Snail on June 12, 2008, 05:52:14 pm
Since when do you ever get to have the time to blast at Orions/whatever for that long without getting pwnt?
With super Maxims.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Jake2447 on June 12, 2008, 08:19:39 pm
Since when do you ever get to have the time to blast at Orions/whatever for that long without getting pwnt?
With super Maxims.

And while using time compression
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: colecampbell666 on June 12, 2008, 08:47:57 pm
But when?
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Jake2447 on June 12, 2008, 10:03:17 pm
But when?

you could take out the first ravana in the neb after everything else has warped
although the next mission would be screwed plot-wise
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: WMCoolmon on June 13, 2008, 01:20:03 am
I always thought it was 10%... Are you sure?

And IMO the big damage flag should be changed, so that the amount of damage decrease is more subtle, so that it starts decreasing the damage at 99%, so that you don't have 5 Orions sitting around with 10% hull.

So then you have 5 Orions sitting around with 1% hull, rather than 5 Orions sitting around with hull values distributed somewhere between 10% and 1%?

Exponentially decreasing the damage like it's done now is a much more subtle solution (at least to most players).
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Mars on June 13, 2008, 01:53:10 am
Forgive me if I'm wrong but by "decreases exponentially" doesn't that mean asymptote, meaning that the hull will never reach 0, so the large ships really are immune from small arms.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Goober5000 on June 13, 2008, 07:36:45 am
I already did that, and then I reverted it.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: S-99 on June 14, 2008, 04:32:41 am
One thing i learned from that mission is that take a dive bomber approach goes a long way. Picking a good vector, locking on, afterburners and launch on a good vector to make sure your bombs are on their way and  pull up. I've noticed without this approach and just sitting there and lobbing bombs at the turrets that most of the time the bombs just detonate slightly below the beam turret and doesn't do full damage to the tip of the beam (i remember doing only 20% damage with dual helioses once just sitting there lobbing bombs). The dive bomber approach is good because it's fun, it gets your bombs more on target more and more damage done. Usually you want your bomb to hit the midsection of the turret tip and then you'll know you're good.

The other reason the dive bomb approach is a must do, is because helioses and cyclops bombs are slow as hell. What's even worse is their maneuverability. Oh man, i sat back once years ago on this mission, lobbed a helios at the top left sath turret, and the ****ing bomb took forever circling the turret before prematurely exploding and doing only 10% damage, i was like wtf?!?!

The other reason for doing the dive bomber approach. You'll probably beat the mission without needing to skip or cheat on it. That mission really does require precise bombing to destroy turrets faster and sometimes people get all 4. I've only ever gotten 3 turrets on my best try.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: colecampbell666 on June 14, 2008, 08:28:30 am
I always get four+flak. Now that I know about the last one I'll have to get that too.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on June 18, 2008, 02:45:49 am
I usually cheat on this mission, just like haloboy. :drevil:

But I did try to do it properly just once...and I did...on Very Easy difficulty. :nervous:

What I did was this:

1. Order all wingmen to cover me.
2. Divert all energy to engines.
3. Afterburn all the way to the nearest beam while watching the Phoenicia get shredded.
4. Switch to dual Helios 3km in.
5. When I fly within range of the Helios' aspect lock, I lock but do not fire and continue afterburning myself closer to the beam.
6. At about 500m away, I afterburn one last time, fire, divert energy to shields and fly away.

During the mission, I kept worrying that I wouldn't have enough time to do all four beam cannons, but I did have enough time...just.

The more difficult part, I think, is getting the GVCv Thebes to survive. In that same run of the mission I did, the corvette blew up. At least Command didn't care.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Jeff Vader on June 18, 2008, 02:47:57 am
In that same run of the mission I did, the corvette blew up. At least Command didn't care.
But I suppose that's why Command advises you to take out the Beleth's beam cannons, or at least the one(s) facing the Thebes.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: ssmit132 on June 18, 2008, 04:25:03 am
Not all of them are facing the Thebes, at least to start with, the one on the left-front (IIRC) (right-front if you're facing the Beleth) is facing the other way.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on June 18, 2008, 05:02:19 am
It was really sad, actually, to see a corvette's hull drop from 100% to 50% in three shots. I hope the Vasudans in there enjoyed enough HEADZ... :headz:
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Mars on June 18, 2008, 08:42:13 am
Just use your Trebuchets to take out the beam cannons the instant the Beleth arrives.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on June 18, 2008, 08:44:55 am
Does that kill the beams instantly?
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: foolfromhell on June 18, 2008, 10:44:40 am
Does that kill the beams instantly?

It does. Dual Trebbies takes out beams. But watch out, they might hit something else by mistake...
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: haloboy100 on June 18, 2008, 11:35:03 am
Like what?
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: colecampbell666 on June 18, 2008, 12:49:13 pm
Does that kill the beams instantly?

It does. Dual Trebbies takes out beams. But watch out, they might hit something else by mistake...
It takes 6 to take out a beam. Five actually, but you'll probably be dual-firing.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: foolfromhell on June 18, 2008, 12:55:08 pm
Does that kill the beams instantly?

It does. Dual Trebbies takes out beams. But watch out, they might hit something else by mistake...
It takes 6 to take out a beam. Five actually, but you'll probably be dual-firing.

Really? On that mission, on medium, it only takes me one shot of dual trebbies to take each out.

Maybe I was actually using Helioses.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: colecampbell666 on June 18, 2008, 01:00:40 pm
On medium, 5 Trebs for me.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Hyper Ion on June 18, 2008, 01:05:51 pm
On medium, 5 Trebs for me.
Maybe for the Sathanas beams, but not for the Beleth.... I too only need two trebuchets to take out the Beleth's beams.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: colecampbell666 on June 18, 2008, 01:06:51 pm
I swear it took 5. Three at the least.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Hyper Ion on June 18, 2008, 01:11:38 pm
Hmm, I just took a look at Youtube, and this may be the case.

EDIT: Yup, 5-6 Trebs are needed to take out the Beleth's beam cannons.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: S-99 on June 18, 2008, 09:57:55 pm
I always remembered it took one treb to take out a beam. I could be wrong though, i wouldn't be surprised, haven't played the game in a while.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on June 18, 2008, 10:03:51 pm
I always remembered it took one treb to take out a beam. I could be wrong though, i wouldn't be surprised, haven't played the game in a while.

Did you do it on Very Easy difficulty? Or have you been sniping at Shivans five clicks away? :drevil:

By the way, what happens when the Beleth reaches the jump node?
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: S-99 on June 18, 2008, 10:22:00 pm
I snipe shivan cruisers, corvettes, and destroyers from 4 clicks away. Great way to run into a fight and have no AAA's or other beams or turrets. And i play on medium. Maybe i was double shooting and didn't remember correctly.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: colecampbell666 on June 19, 2008, 09:46:19 am
It leaves. What happens in the next mission if it isn't killed?
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Jeff Vader on June 19, 2008, 09:51:43 am
I seem to remember hearing that the mission fails if you let the Beleth escape. Could be wrong, hmm.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on June 19, 2008, 10:03:16 am
To destroy it isn't too much of a problem; to disarm it before the Thebes is destroyed is a problem.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: ShadowGorrath on June 19, 2008, 10:07:17 am
Well, loosing the Thebes isn't too bad, right? At least not like loosing the Aquitaine in Agronautica. If you loose the Aquitaine in that mission, then you're off to fly support ships in Wolf 359 :P
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Droid803 on June 19, 2008, 12:05:38 pm
I lost uh...myself more than once trying to save the Thebes. Took a LRED in the face for it. :lol:
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: colecampbell666 on June 19, 2008, 12:08:47 pm
Man, saving the Thebes is easy.

Just kill the turret facing you on the side of the Beleth, and forget about the others until you disable it.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: WMCoolmon on June 20, 2008, 01:54:44 am
It leaves. What happens in the next mission if it isn't killed?

Their Finest Eight and a Half Minutes. :p

Or at least it would, if Freespace 2 had more of a branching campaign.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on June 20, 2008, 08:46:34 am
Well, loosing the Thebes isn't too bad, right? At least not like loosing the Aquitaine in Agronautica. If you loose the Aquitaine in that mission, then you're off to fly support ships in Wolf 359 :P

Don't remind me. That was the first time I died flying a Horus because I came too close to a Piranha explosion's shockwave on Very Easy difficulty. It's even worse than getting incinerated by an SRed while flying a Seth, or an SGreen while flying an Ursa. :mad:

I lost uh...myself more than once trying to save the Thebes. Took a LRED in the face for it. :lol:

I bet everyone here has gotten beamed before. As per above, I've been beamed twice. You can make that three if you count an instance where I got hit by the TSJ Icanus' USilv in INFR1 because I SEXPed the events wrongly and didn't triple-check.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: colecampbell666 on June 20, 2008, 09:50:41 am
It leaves. What happens in the next mission if it isn't killed?

Their Finest Eight and a Half Minutes. :p

Or at least it would, if Freespace 2 had more of a branching campaign.
So you lose? It continues on?
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Snail on June 20, 2008, 01:22:06 pm
No. Read the last sentence again.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: nagachief on December 01, 2008, 08:43:17 pm
I think I know why I have such a hard time on the mission...

The GameTap version that works flawlessly...isn't working flawlessly.

Commanding Alpha to attack the subsystem does nothing.

I cannot use the afterburners in any mission.

And I cannot get in front of the ship, since I don't have afterburners.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: tinfoil on December 01, 2008, 09:21:16 pm
:necro:

(don't worry i did that once too)
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: General Battuta on December 02, 2008, 08:33:49 am
I think I know why I have such a hard time on the mission...

The GameTap version that works flawlessly...isn't working flawlessly.

Commanding Alpha to attack the subsystem does nothing.

I cannot use the afterburners in any mission.

And I cannot get in front of the ship, since I don't have afterburners.

Are you playing on XP? Try running the game in compatibility mode.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Wobble73 on December 02, 2008, 10:53:38 am
I think you are right General, if he is using retail. As per Karajorma's FAQ

Quote
The afterburner/energy transfer system has stopped working. I hear the sound but don't go any faster. What can I do?
This had many people perplexed for a while but turned out to be due to a bug in the FS2 code. All the cases I've seen of it so far have occurred on Windows XP or Windows 2000. The problem can be solved for XP users by running FS2 in compatibility mode. Open up your FreeSpace folder and look for FS2.exe. Make a short cut for this file and position it wherever you like (Desktop or Start menu). Right click on icon and choose properties. Click on the Compatibility tab and choose which ever mode you like (I've heard that Windows 95 works best but you might find otherwise). Use the icon to run FS2 from now on.
Since Windows 2000 lacks compatibility mode I'm not certain how to solve the problem there. But running FS2_Open will also fix this problem as the bug has been corrected.

Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: terran_emperor on December 02, 2008, 11:16:10 am
Ive never had this bug. Both my computer and my dad's laptop, which i had FS2 installed on previously, are Windows XP. And i never got this bug
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: TrashMan on December 02, 2008, 02:34:08 pm
To destroy it isn't too much of a problem; to disarm it before the Thebes is destroyed is a problem.

Pfft..easy.
Charge in all the while letting trebs loose on the front side turret, then pull up and Helios it's top turret, followed by another helios into its engines.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: terran_emperor on December 02, 2008, 03:23:32 pm
Out of curiousity, has anyone else been launched off the field by the departing Sathanas?

I have and ended up 6-8 km out
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: tinfoil on December 02, 2008, 04:01:45 pm
thta's fun :D
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: terran_emperor on December 02, 2008, 04:45:04 pm
so how far out did you end up?

And it wasn't fun. I had finally managed to destroy all 4 primary beams and the foward flak guns. Ten the bastard jumps out and throws me off the pitch, i wasnt able to get back intime to de-beam the Beleth. Ruining an otherwise perfect mission (This was before i found out about the rear beam bonus objective
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on December 02, 2008, 09:18:22 pm
Well, at Command gave some useful advice for once. :p

Whenever I hear him say, "The Sathanas is engaging its subspace drives! All units, get out of the way now!" I immediately fly away. Hence, I never get launched.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: tinfoil on December 03, 2008, 10:28:20 am
so how far out did you end up?

far enough that i ended up behind the sathanas. Wheeeee
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Droid803 on December 03, 2008, 05:53:02 pm
so how far out did you end up?

far enough that i ended up behind the sathanas. Wheeeee

Wait...so you went...through it?
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: tinfoil on December 03, 2008, 05:56:37 pm
nope. at least i don't think so. i'm pretty sure if you go far enough you wrap back around. i seem to remember trying it once. or yeah i went through and ended up about 5 km back of the thing.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Droid803 on December 03, 2008, 06:05:50 pm
You got knocked out to infinity then back...like an asymptote? O_o
Doesn't that mean that you're basically in the perfect position to intercept the Beleth, then?
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: tinfoil on December 03, 2008, 06:06:20 pm
Yep :D
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: terran_emperor on December 03, 2008, 07:39:16 pm
Well, i cant beat infinity and and byond. I only got knocked ~8km away from the node.

 The annoying thing is that its pretty much the same thing with the infamous "DIVE! DIVE! DIVE!" incident, yet i never manage to survive that collision when it happens....Probably because the Mara doesnt have the as strong a hull as the Bomber you pilot againt the Sath does
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Droid803 on December 03, 2008, 07:45:42 pm
Actually, the Terran Mara has 475 hull points and 700 shields while the GVB Baka only has 440 hull points and 620 shields.
Might have to do with the angle.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Goober5000 on December 04, 2008, 09:02:34 pm
On Easy and Very Easy, the game makes you invulnerable when the Sathanas warps out.
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: terran_emperor on December 05, 2008, 01:31:52 am
It doesnt during the "DIVE! DIVE! DIVE!" incedent for me
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on December 05, 2008, 01:41:07 am
Goober probably meant Bearbaiting.

No wonder ~ + I always wore off when the Thebes jumped in. :nervous:
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: terran_emperor on December 05, 2008, 01:51:18 am
 :eek2: I've never noticed that
Title: Re: Maybe i just suck but...
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on December 11, 2008, 08:53:33 pm
Initially, I didn't either. It was only because I overused that mission to train myself on dive-bombing did I realise that, when I hit ~ + I at the beginning of the mission, I have to do the same thing again when the Beleth comes in, or else I'll get raped by an SAAA.