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Hosted Projects - Standalone => Fate of the Galaxy => Topic started by: Akalabeth Angel on July 02, 2008, 06:28:46 pm

Title: Hyperspace
Post by: Akalabeth Angel on July 02, 2008, 06:28:46 pm
Out of curiosity, do you guys have hyperspace working? Ie, when a ship enters the battlefield it comes in super fast from far away and then dramatically slows to a crawl.

And if so, was that easy to do? I've seen a few different people change the warp in effects and I'm wondering how the hell to do 'em.
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: chief1983 on July 02, 2008, 06:50:55 pm
WMC made us a nice effect, we may continue tweaking it to our needs or attempt to import the effect from the Imperial Alliance codebase, since it already has more features.
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: varsaigen on July 15, 2008, 10:11:15 pm
coming in from far away? XD Sounds like star trek!  *sssttttttrrrrrrrrrrrreeeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaaatttttttttccccccccccccchhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!!* XD
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 15, 2008, 10:28:07 pm
Pssst. Varsaigen. Its "capital ships", not "capitol ships".
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: varsaigen on July 15, 2008, 11:34:52 pm
what are talking about? I never mentioned any capital ships...

Edit: Ah. the sig. yeah. I'll change that. XD thx
Edit2: LIES!!! It's spelled correctly. XD
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 16, 2008, 05:57:06 am
Quote from: Varsaigen's signature
...has destroyed rogue Lucifers and has captured many GTVA capitolships
No, its not.
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: varsaigen on July 16, 2008, 09:36:20 am
why are you talking about my sig? this thread is for hyperspace. not my sig! >:O
Besides, I did a spellcheck on it many times now. >.>
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: Jeff Vader on July 16, 2008, 09:57:13 am
Now that we're talking about it, capitolship is spelled separately and with an a, "capital ship". (dunno why the spell checker accepts capitolship)

Now, then let's jump back to hyperspace. And next time, if someone has inconsistencies in his signature, PM him.
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: colecampbell666 on July 16, 2008, 11:16:21 am
What's the best form of HS travel IYO? Stargate? FS? SW? B5?

I personally think the Stargate option, there are no boundaries, you can't be attacked unless the other ship jumped with you, and it's fast.
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 16, 2008, 12:51:30 pm
I have a scene from Dark Reign vividly impressed in my mind...

A ship fleeing through a stargate, the pursuer accidentally damages the stargate, and then tries to enter it only to get ripped to shreds by energy flunctuation. Dangerous imo, stargates. Look at BP. :lol:

I think Homeworld's one is best. And its mechanics are pretty well explained.
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: varsaigen on July 16, 2008, 01:27:22 pm
Lobo, thank you for clearing it up. I'll make that change now.

I think the startrek *STREETTTCCCCHHHHH!* optiion looks pathetic. I haven't seen a stargate warp i for ages. I take it ou mean not coming through the gate? (Although it would make a great replacement for the Knossos Gate...)
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: brandx0 on July 16, 2008, 02:36:03 pm
Guys, this isn't a forum for discussing this universe vs. that one, etc.

Take that stuff to another forum.  This one is for discussion of the Star Wars Conversion.  Keep it on topic
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: varsaigen on July 16, 2008, 02:55:52 pm
I thought it was for the Hyperdrive stuff. Just like what the title says...
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: brandx0 on July 16, 2008, 03:58:34 pm
Quote
Hard Light Productions Forums > Hosted Projects - Work In Progress > Star Wars Conversion


Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: varsaigen on July 16, 2008, 05:33:40 pm
*sigh* I know it;s for star wars. I don't know why it went off topic.
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: Scourge of Ages on July 16, 2008, 07:56:10 pm
Well, just look at the Battle of Endor in the movie. When the rebel fleet enters hyperspace, they're moving slowly, then all of a sudden BAM they're gone in a little streak. Sort of like a Star Trek (sry, won''t mention again) warp-out, except a lot faster and no flash at the end.
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 16, 2008, 11:47:18 pm
I know in Star Wars Republic Commando, there's a mission you have to fight off a Seperatist battleship, you can actually glimpse it at the edge of the system as a tiny little dot, then it *bam* it appears in front of you. It moved like uber fast, but I didn't notice any stretching effect.

Also, sorry for going off topic.
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: Flipside on July 17, 2008, 12:37:25 am
I also don't recall any real stretching being used, they just went from moving very very quickly to normal speed (with the star blur reverting to a normal scene). I think people get confused because of motion blur, particularly in the newer movies where it's all rendered.

I think they also do a trick with the lens angle in the Star Wars movies, but I can't remember for certain.
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: brandx0 on July 17, 2008, 04:57:16 am
In the original movies the ships simply moved very quickly away, but there was a very very slight star distortion effect around them.  This could either have been due to the way they shot it against a blue screen with a lot of time distortion and post processing, but they didn't stretch.
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 17, 2008, 04:59:10 am
The scene I remember the most is the stars stretching as the Millenium Falcon jumped. :D
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: TopAce on July 17, 2008, 05:33:52 am
In the current state of affairs, your view will change to external in the moment your ship begins to jump out - like in FS. So if it remains that way, we won't have to deal will the stretching effect that you see when the Falcon escapes Tatooine in ANH. Of course it would be great to see a similar effect in FotG - we have the subspace.pof anyway at our service; some modifications and tricks might make a decent impression of a hyperspace jump -, but I'd advise caution against being overambitious.
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 17, 2008, 05:38:50 am
There's no way to lock the camera in place when jumping out? Or would that require a code change?
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: TomShak on July 20, 2008, 07:31:30 am
Out of interest what is the current thinking on how ships will go into hyperspace. Will they only be able to jump at preconfigured hyperspace buoys (e.g. XWA) or can they jump from anywhere to anywhere? (e.g. XW and TF).

Canon tends to support the "from any place" concept, given that the Millennium Falcon seemed to make it's hyperspace jump without any concern for a "buoy". However, this means ships could always escape by just jumping into hyperspace. This could make writing certain kinds of missions difficult, for example a mission to ambush a convoy, As soon as you arrive the convoy would start calculating the jump coordinates (if they haven't done so already) and within about 30 seconds they will have jumped away.
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: chief1983 on July 20, 2008, 11:01:11 am
Well we will just have to disable them quickly then.  I'm sure we'll find ways to take those things into account.
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: Nohg on July 20, 2008, 11:12:57 am
If I were planning an ambush in SW I'd wait until the convoy was in a gravity well and thus unable to flee. Remember, Hyperspace is affected by "mass shadows". If these fights are in deep space, then yes they could run. Inside a system they will be stuck with the gravity wells' power. Or an interdictor craft would make it hard to flee, unless the gravity wells could be knocked out.
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 21, 2008, 03:33:22 am
I know the Imps would just bring in an Interdictor cruiser and use it to cast mass shadows all over the dang place.
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: varsaigen on July 21, 2008, 09:45:14 am
best ship evah! :)
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 21, 2008, 08:48:20 pm
I was just playing KotOR and was wondering if the Sith Interdictor vessels operated on the same technology as the Imperial Interdictor vessels. And the Interdictor ship will appear in FotG, right?
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: varsaigen on July 21, 2008, 08:55:06 pm
Hmmm... I haven't read any starwars books in a while and they only mentioned htem in the ones I read. D: Although, you could probably find it on wookieepedia.org
Here's the link to the interdictor ship page: http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Interdictor (http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Interdictor)
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 21, 2008, 09:00:02 pm
Meh.  Why didn't EAW have the Interdictor Star Destroyer. It'd save me the trouble of leaving Victorys and my designated flagship to guard my Interdictors.
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: LordMelvin on July 22, 2008, 12:31:09 am
Two words: game balance. The Interdictor Star Destroyer is as much a game breaker as an accurately-statted Tie Defender would be in a fighter-oriented game. If the Intradictor can be boomied, then there's much better potential for interesting strategic manouvering.

Also, interesting strategic spelling.
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: Scourge of Ages on July 22, 2008, 01:05:59 am
Out of interest what is the current thinking on how ships will go into hyperspace. Will they only be able to jump at preconfigured hyperspace buoys (e.g. XWA) or can they jump from anywhere to anywhere? (e.g. XW and TF).

Canon tends to support the "from any place" concept, given that the Millennium Falcon seemed to make it's hyperspace jump without any concern for a "buoy". However, this means ships could always escape by just jumping into hyperspace. This could make writing certain kinds of missions difficult, for example a mission to ambush a convoy, As soon as you arrive the convoy would start calculating the jump coordinates (if they haven't done so already) and within about 30 seconds they will have jumped away.

Why would a convoy/fleet come out of hyperspace if it weren't passing through a gravity well anyway? Maybe they're resupplying? Changing course? Taking on/dropping off ships or supplies? In any case they would be tied down for a while anyway.
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: varsaigen on July 22, 2008, 01:07:19 am
yes they would. But most likely, they would also be defended until they could escape.
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 22, 2008, 03:49:22 am
Why would a convoy/fleet come out of hyperspace if it weren't passing through a gravity well anyway? Maybe they're resupplying? Changing course? Taking on/dropping off ships or supplies? In any case they would be tied down for a while anyway.
Recharging their hyperspace drives, maybe ? Do they even need recharging?
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: chief1983 on July 22, 2008, 10:47:26 am
An Interdictor would be usable in a campaign, you'd just have to either take out its subsystems or wait for help to arrive, either way the goal wouldn't have to be 'blow it up'.
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: Zelvik on July 22, 2008, 02:19:03 pm
Quote
Out of interest what is the current thinking on how ships will go into hyperspace. Will they only be able to jump at preconfigured hyperspace buoys (e.g. XWA) or can they jump from anywhere to anywhere? (e.g. XW and TF).

Canon tends to support the "from any place" concept, given that the Millennium Falcon seemed to make it's hyperspace jump without any concern for a "buoy". However, this means ships could always escape by just jumping into hyperspace. This could make writing certain kinds of missions difficult, for example a mission to ambush a convoy, As soon as you arrive the convoy would start calculating the jump coordinates (if they haven't done so already) and within about 30 seconds they will have jumped away.

Actually XWA buoys arent in conflict with canon. They are a workaround within the engine of the X-Wing series representing nothing more than a visual representation of the course that your computer plotted. Its not 100% done within SW realism but the buoy isnt actually present but only visible to your ships sensor systems.
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: TopAce on July 22, 2008, 04:37:16 pm
Those aren't the buoys that contradict canon. It is the fact that you can always jump out if you're within x meters to it, no matter which direction you are facing. As far as I remember XWA, even if you had an SSD straight ahead, you could jump out.

Of course, we can regard this as pure game mechanism.
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: brandx0 on July 22, 2008, 04:42:45 pm
Well, I'm no coder, but perhaps when you go to jump one could script a check, a straight line along the ship's axis headed to infinity, and it if intersects with another ship, then it cancels the jump?

As I said, I'm no coder, so it's just a thought.  If it works out though it might be possible to go off that basis and then add in such checks as stars and background objects too.  I'd say one could use it to check for gravity wells also, but I think that'd be better handled in FRED manually.
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: varsaigen on July 22, 2008, 05:15:08 pm
lol. the warp out could be interesting. just imagine, a fighter warpis out and a star destroyer is in the way. if the jump is successful, then either the fighter is obliterated, or the star destroyer has a hole in it. XD
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: chief1983 on July 22, 2008, 05:29:17 pm
FS already has a collision detection on warpout, I'm just not sure what range it checks, it may be hardcoded based on FS warpout distances, or it may actually check based on how much space it knows the warpout will need.  I'm betting on the former though.
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: aRaven on July 22, 2008, 07:04:15 pm
Those aren't the buoys that contradict canon. It is the fact that you can always jump out if you're within x meters to it, no matter which direction you are facing. As far as I remember XWA, even if you had an SSD straight ahead, you could jump out.

Of course, we can regard this as pure game mechanism.

Wrong, your craft doesn't jump when some object is before it.
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: Nohg on July 22, 2008, 07:50:28 pm
An Interdictor would be usable in a campaign, you'd just have to either take out its subsystems or wait for help to arrive, either way the goal wouldn't have to be 'blow it up'.

Additionally, an Interdictor is lightly protected comparatively, it is not inconceivable that they'd jump out if endangered.


Plus any sort of Thrawn mention would need a few Interdictor-as-precision-navigation-tool scenarios.
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: Turambar on July 22, 2008, 09:01:36 pm
they almost never deployed Interdictor cruisers without a Star Destroyer escort. 

when they did, rogue squad killed one with coordinated torpedo salvos.

edit: they may have just caused it to withdraw.  My rogue squad books are packed up cause of (maybe) moving soon.

I know that when they did deploy an interdictor with a victory II escort, rogue squad took out the vic II
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: varsaigen on July 22, 2008, 09:24:02 pm
which is why they don't do taht anymore. XD
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: TopAce on July 23, 2008, 04:02:30 am
Wrong, your craft doesn't jump when some object is before it.

Only if something is just in front of you.

Anyway, I don't know of any way to circumvent this in FRED, but I'll experiment.
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: EtherShock on January 07, 2009, 11:47:12 pm
I know this is an old thread, but I noticed no one mentioned nodes. In FS2, sometimes the ships had to be in range of the node (represented by the giant green sphere) to jump to subspace. Maybe you guys could implement that regarding jumping to hyperspace.
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: Narvi on January 08, 2009, 01:14:25 am
How are you going to prevent collisions when things jump in? In FS, they come out of portals, so they're avoidable, but SW is 'go really fast then slow down' FTL. Are you going to script things so only clear vectors are allowed?
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: chief1983 on January 08, 2009, 09:48:05 am
I think the warp code itself can handle finding a clear vector, and then bigger ships will probably just need to be FREDed carefully too.
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: TopAce on January 08, 2009, 12:12:39 pm
That's not a problem. You need one "escape" waypoint assigned to each capship that will jump out in the mission. These waypoints are scattered randomly very far away from each other. Capships will need some time to jump out as soon as they start following their respective "escape" waypoints, just to make sure that they won't collide if they are close to each other.

I've done that before for FS, and it works, though I admit we'll probably need more complex missions and some unexpected errors may occur.
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: Galemp on January 08, 2009, 12:23:45 pm
Consistent effects like hyperspace jumps really need to be scripted or coded into the engine and not into individual missions; if it's going to be used for every ship in every mission it has to be something reliable.
Imagine the chaos if the game required an event to disable movement for each individual ship if their Engines subsystem was destroyed. You're basically doing the same thing here, writing an in-mission event for every ship's warp. There must be a better way to apply that globally.
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: varsaigen on January 08, 2009, 02:21:34 pm
I noticed that when the player is in space, while playing Star Wars: Galexies, if they jump to another system, they go through the station, or whatever would block their way. That means, planets, stations, other ships, or asteroids. :/

Just thought I'd point that out. :P
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: aRaven on January 08, 2009, 03:32:04 pm
that is because SWG is a piece of s**t
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: chief1983 on January 08, 2009, 08:20:01 pm
Yeah you collide with planets etc in EVE Online too, it's just an MMO.  This isn't an MMO though, you shouldn't fly through stuff.
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: FUBAR-BDHR on January 08, 2009, 09:03:27 pm
Jumping into something should be a possibility though.  Not for the player but for caps.  If a fighter is in the wrong place when a cap jumps too bad for that fighter.  Now caps running into each other is a problem.  Caps hitting debris can even be a problem.  Take the FS2 mission RI.  Once in awhile the Hecate will run into a chunk of the Orion when it jumps in.  So much of the Hecate. 
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: varsaigen on January 09, 2009, 02:13:59 pm
Jumping into something should be a possibility though.  Not for the player but for caps.  If a fighter is in the wrong place when a cap jumps too bad for that fighter.  Now caps running into each other is a problem.  Caps hitting debris can even be a problem.  Take the FS2 mission RI.  Once in awhile the Hecate will run into a chunk of the Orion when it jumps in.  So much of the Hecate. 

lol true. XD I noticed many problems with SW: Galaxies as well, but I didn't know what LucasArts had in mind when they had ships jumping out. Although... the collision thing would be true, since Han Solo had the Millennium Falcon exit the asteroid field when he was being persued by Boba Fett, before jumping. :/

So... what ever makes you happy. :P Although perhaps a clear distance for the jump would be better instead of having it for every single collision. Because, if they have a cruiser 900,000 meters away (don't know why one would be that far out :/ ), it could pose as an obsticle for the jump. So, a certain distance would be better, perhaps. My opinion.
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: TopAce on January 09, 2009, 02:37:35 pm
...Because, if they have a cruiser 900,000 meters away (don't know why one would be that far out :/ ), it could pose as an obsticle for the jump.

If it's that far away, the threat it poses is nonexistent. It would require a very weird and unusual set of coincidences.

I think planets are more problematic.
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: varsaigen on January 09, 2009, 02:57:43 pm
:/ true. XD just saying, it could be a distance requirement. =3
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: FUBAR-BDHR on January 09, 2009, 03:19:19 pm
It's like the odds of successfully navigating an asteroid filed thing.  It's a bad idea but even Han wasn't crazy enough to attempt a jump in one. 
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: brandx0 on January 09, 2009, 04:06:03 pm
Also remember though at this point, the Millennium Falcon's hyperdrive wasn't working.  Just food for thought.
Title: Re: Hyperspace
Post by: EtherShock on January 10, 2009, 03:54:06 am
In the current state of affairs, your view will change to external in the moment your ship begins to jump out - like in FS. So if it remains that way, we won't have to deal will the stretching effect that you see when the Falcon escapes Tatooine in ANH. Of course it would be great to see a similar effect in FotG - we have the subspace.pof anyway at our service; some modifications and tricks might make a decent impression of a hyperspace jump -, but I'd advise caution against being overambitious.
It would be cool if you could get the camera to spin too, just like they did in the movies for most of the jumps. Most of the games switched to external camera when jumping out. The only thing they showed inside were the stars stretching, then the camera would switch. Only XWA didn't do this. You stayed in the cockpit the whole time.

Are there going to be different zones you can jump to in a mission like in XWA as well...if it's even possible to code in.