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Off-Topic Discussion => General Discussion => Topic started by: Galemp on March 18, 2002, 10:17:36 am

Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: Galemp on March 18, 2002, 10:17:36 am
WAKKA! I'm getting full tuition to the Honors college of Architecture in the New Jersey Institute of Technology!
(http://216.40.201.240/s/otn/realhappy/jump.gif)
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: Styxx on March 18, 2002, 10:31:07 am
And what exactly does that mean? Is it any good? :p
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: Shrike on March 18, 2002, 10:32:16 am
It means he's gonna flunk out of being an architech and end up working at mcdonalds. ;)
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: wEvil on March 18, 2002, 10:33:11 am
Heh..no such thing as anyone paying our tuition fees here.

pay 40% income tax and you still have to pay £1k to go to university.

bastards - i hope they choke on whatever they bought with my money.
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: Styxx on March 18, 2002, 10:36:36 am
Heh, I didn't pay a single cent for University. :p
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: wEvil on March 18, 2002, 10:38:46 am
:mad: :mad: :mad:


GRAAAAAAAAAAA!!!


:mad: :mad: :mad:
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: aldo_14 on March 18, 2002, 10:40:54 am
Quote
Originally posted by wEvil
Heh..no such thing as anyone paying our tuition fees here.

pay 40% income tax and you still have to pay £1k to go to university.

bastards - i hope they choke on whatever they bought with my money.


Buying gold toilet seats and silk wallpaper, probably.  The dirty thieving, robbing, greedy, selfish, scummy, utter bastards..... don't get me started on tuition fees.:mad:

In fact, I need money.  anyone want to buy a model in 3ds or cob format?

...........thought not
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: Styxx on March 18, 2002, 10:44:15 am
Quote
Originally posted by wEvil
:mad: :mad: :mad:


GRAAAAAAAAAAA!!!


:mad: :mad: :mad:



And that's because... :confused:
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: wEvil on March 18, 2002, 10:45:09 am
www.payuptony.com

just read all about it.
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: Styxx on March 18, 2002, 10:52:12 am
I'll check it...
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: Zeronet on March 18, 2002, 01:53:59 pm
Its free in scotland aint it?
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: mikhael on March 18, 2002, 08:43:32 pm
Quote
Originally posted by Shrike
It means he's gonna flunk out of being an architech and end up working at mcdonalds. ;)


I'm an architecture dropout but I don't work at McDonalds. :D
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: Ace on March 18, 2002, 09:46:10 pm
mikhael works at BurgerKing(tm) j/k ;)
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: Styxx on March 19, 2002, 06:41:21 am
Quote
Originally posted by Ace
mikhael works at BurgerKing(tm) j/k ;)



Nah, he went the easier way - he joined the army. :D

(okay, let's stop the bad jokes... :p )
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: Galemp on March 19, 2002, 03:08:52 pm
Seriously, though. I get a free ride to college! And honors, too! I'm...so...happy... *sniff* It would be about $16000 a year (US) otherwise.
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: mikhael on March 19, 2002, 08:47:22 pm
Quote
Originally posted by Styxx



Nah, he went the easier way - he joined the army. :D

(okay, let's stop the bad jokes... :p )


Right idea, wrong branch. I dropped out of university, became homeless and gave being homeless up for something easier AND harder: the US Navy. Easier because being homeless is hard work when you're not mental unstable and harder because the military is no place for someone with no self discipline or self respect.

I will kindly, ask you not to disrespect the military of any nationality. They serve.
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: Styxx on March 20, 2002, 06:48:26 am
Quote
Originally posted by mikhael
I will kindly, ask you not to disrespect the military of any nationality. They serve.



Sorry man - as I had said in the post, it was a bad joke. I really didn't mean any offence. :)
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: mikhael on March 20, 2002, 08:34:48 am
You didn't. I was heading it off before it began. ;)
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: Zazicle on March 20, 2002, 03:46:45 pm
Quote
Originally posted by wEvil
www.payuptony.com

just read all about it.
I think many people are overly harsh on the English University funding scheme. I know that the average student leaves with an enormous debt, but that's because they spend all their money on alcohol. It's not like the government force them too. I'm going to University this october, so don't start saying I'm being hypocritical.
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: an0n on March 20, 2002, 03:57:59 pm
In the UK you pay nothing if you earn under about £16k(I think) and you pay a higher percentage of the tuition fees, the more money you earn. Therefore the poor pay less tuition and the rich pay more.

The debt comes from living expenses. You need money for:
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: Zeronet on March 20, 2002, 04:38:50 pm
Quote
Originally posted by Styxx



Nah, he went the easier way - he joined the army. :D

(okay, let's stop the bad jokes... :p )


Im getting my A levels and then joining the AAC as an Officer, dont diss the army :)

Also students in the uk find it very difficult to pay off debt or even live during their uni years, unless grants or something comes out i doubt i'd be able to live with 1k debt.
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: wEvil on March 21, 2002, 06:31:34 am
the point is students having to PYA their own tuition fees is utterly LUDICROUS.

we pay 17.5% Sales tax on everything we buy, between 20 and 40% income tax plus 80% petrol tax.

Our govornment is just squeezing everything way too hard.  Thats why tuition fees piss me off something chronic - because with the amount of tax my parents and myself have already paid, i should have free reign of the system.

But I dont, because they are incompetent and waste my money because they think they can spend it better than i can.

Utter, total, steaming, hairy bollocks.

In the UK you can get UP TO a £3,750 loan, and skip paying £1075 tuition fees.

I had £3,478 and had to pay the whole £1075 myself because my parents, even though they earn £30k+ each, can't afford to fund me.

The banks' been my best friend, to be honest (thank god for interest free overdrafts, and I've even maxxed that out)

I'm not irresponsible with money at all, its just as soon as you pay £1k tuition and then have to find cash for rent and food it doesnt leave you with very much at all.

The student loan is not an adequate system.  It does not work.  The amount of money you get is insufficient, the fact you have to pay it back is unacceptable considering the amount of tax the average briton pays and the system of applying for one is totuous to say the least.

There is nothing that can be said in defense of this system or this govornment - they're no better than criminals.
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: Styxx on March 21, 2002, 07:14:31 am
Well, here in Brazil we have private universities (you have to pay for it) and public ones (better than the private ones, you don't have to pay, but it's hard to get in). If you get into a private one, you can still get government help to pay up to 70% of the costs, with very low interest rates and several years to pay, starting at one year after you've completed your course.

I got into a public one myself, Federal University of Rio Grande do Sul...
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: aldo_14 on March 21, 2002, 07:44:59 am
( I agree 100% with wEvil)

Quote
Originally posted by Zeronet
Its free in scotland aint it?


Nope.  We have to pay them back once we earn >10k a year (point of reference - the average wage in the UK is 16k).

seeing as graduates are most likely to get the best jobs, and thus pay most income tax, this is plainly discriminatory and unfair (intended to get the votes of people too dumb to go to Uni, who resent student smore intelligent than they are).

At present (2nd year), I owe 2x £2000 for fees, plus £1800 + £2500 in loans, at an absurdly high rate of interest.  (that's almost £7k kiddies ;) )

I have exactly £220 in the bank.  I've spent at least £300 on books since I started, and at least £500-800 (minimum) on train fares.  Plus food and other expenses (notably computer software and stuff - I'm doing comp Science).

I do have a few grand in a high interest account from my loan, but I've recently discovered that the interest on the 2 are just about even (my intention being to have interest leftover from paying back the loan).

Bear in mind, this is the highest interest rate of any ISA account in the UK.

I haven't bought any new clothes for over a year, nor went out, and I have to bring my own lunch to Uni to try and save money.  Had I been living in the student halls, I'd have mostly likely went broke.

Now you tell me it's not unfair?
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: Styxx on March 21, 2002, 07:49:21 am
Ouch! :(

And I thought we had a crappy education system...
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: aldo_14 on March 21, 2002, 08:00:55 am
Quote
Originally posted by Styxx
Ouch! :(

And I thought we had a crappy education system...


We do have a good education system...it's just the way it's funded that's crap.   Unfortunately, my course is so time-consuming I don't have the time to get a job (literally - I'm in 8 till 5 with no breaks atall most days, sometimes longer), so I need to rely almost totally on the government.

Who are, of course, money grabbing bastards.  

interesting point - we have £1+ billion in unused taxes, etc, sitting in the treasury.  Presumably, to buy off voters if anyone is ever capable of challenging Labour at the polls.
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: Styxx on March 21, 2002, 08:13:42 am
Politicians are politicians, everywhere... :sigh:
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: diamondgeezer on March 21, 2002, 08:24:31 am
I've found a workable solution: spend your nights in the pub/FREDding, and sleep through your lectures! Bonus!
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: CP5670 on March 21, 2002, 09:34:13 am
The taxation is not too bad in the US but the better universities are very expensive. (MIT for example is $25000/year :p)
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: Zeronet on March 21, 2002, 04:31:19 pm
The Army(AAC, im not joining inf) will pay my tuition fees.
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: wEvil on March 22, 2002, 05:46:55 am
Heh.

I've earned almost £1,500 on contract work, had a £500 hardship loan and im up to the eyeballs in overdraft (£1,250) at the moment.

On average, therefore, you need an UTTER MINIMUM of £7000 loan per year.

we get barely £4k.

£3,000 short of what you need unless you want to live like a hermit and eat beans on toast all year.
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: Styxx on March 22, 2002, 06:22:12 am
You don't have any kind of public universities there? :confused:
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: wEvil on March 22, 2002, 07:32:31 am
If you're super-intelligent or have a rich daddy you're fine, you can get scholarships and stuff.

If you're just a normal, tax-paying british citizen, they screw you over.

Its as simple as that.

Which is why i dont intend on being a British citizen for much longer.  I dont really want to be associated with such a rediculous sysytem.
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: Setekh on March 22, 2002, 07:51:27 am
Man, that sounds so backwards. What is happening to the world these days, I don't know...
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: wEvil on March 22, 2002, 07:54:26 am
I dont have a clue why everyone thinks the UK is so great - its just about as totally crap as you can get, honestly.
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: aldo_14 on March 22, 2002, 07:57:04 am
Quote
Originally posted by Styxx
You don't have any kind of public universities there? :confused:


We did have free Unis, with grants, but when a suppossedly socialist labour government came in, on of the first thing they did was introduce fees and scrap grants.

Presumably to win votes by screwing over students to cut taxes.
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: wEvil on March 22, 2002, 08:01:02 am
Quote
Originally posted by aldo_14

Presumably to win votes by screwing over students to cut taxes.


Which they then put up by another 20%, speaking hollistically.
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: aldo_14 on March 22, 2002, 08:09:27 am
Quote
Originally posted by wEvil


Which they then put up by another 20%, speaking hollistically.


LEts be fair.

all that money does go to a useful, and valuable cause.








(aye, that'll be ****ing likely)

like a new office for MPs to spend 1 day a week, in with plants rented for several thousand pounds a year..... rented - what the hell!?!. Or a presidential (cough) jet for Tony Blair costing several million (veto-ed by the Royal family, who were s'possed to share it - at least someone there has a vague bit of common sense).  Plus flights to African countries so El Presidente Tony can have a holiday.  not to mention the Millenium Dome, the worlds tackiest tourist attraction.  Or the money given to bail out Railtrack before it collapsed.... need I go on?

The problem with Britain, is that it's run by politicians......
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: Styxx on March 22, 2002, 08:28:38 am
That's sounding an awful lot loke Brazil, you know?

(There was a scandal some time ago when a news agency found out that the government spent several millions to build a place to grow frogs... Frogs, for God's sake!)
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: Zeronet on March 22, 2002, 12:57:19 pm
I think they are brining back grants for those from poorer families but with intelligence. Still the Uk is a consitutional democracy, labour can do whatever they want because the tories will never get in because they'd make it even worse and are totally useless as an opposition.
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: Galemp on March 22, 2002, 02:34:46 pm
Quote
Originally posted by aldo_14
The problem with Britain, is that it's run by politicians......


So is the rest of the world, sadly. :sigh:

Anyway, back on topic, anyone else going to university next year?
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: an0n on March 22, 2002, 02:38:09 pm
Quote
Originally posted by GalacticEmperor
So is the rest of the world, sadly. :sigh:
 


Not for long.

*strokes United Anarchic Front standard issue rifle*
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: Skippy on March 22, 2002, 02:50:02 pm
We have to pay to be more intelligent... :sigh:
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: mikhael on March 22, 2002, 03:35:21 pm
Quote
Originally posted by Skippy
We have to pay to be more intelligent... :sigh:

No, you have to pay to be more educated. Intelligence is mostly set by the time you start school.
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: Setekh on March 22, 2002, 08:12:42 pm
Quote
Originally posted by Styxx
the government spent several millions to build a place to grow frogs... Frogs, for God's sake!)


:eek2:
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: Blue Lion on March 22, 2002, 08:14:35 pm
I like frogs though, it might be worth it
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: Kazan on March 22, 2002, 09:53:41 pm
Quote
Originally posted by Styxx
Heh, I didn't pay a single cent for University. :p


b*@$$*stard!

college is going to cost me somewhere between $60K and $70K - and that's if they don't raise tutition and room&board again - and im sure they will
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: wEvil on March 23, 2002, 07:49:10 am
This govornment was a total disaster in every sense of the word!

The reason we pay so much for rent is there's always a bunch of w*nkers every year who think its funny to set off the fire alarms for a joke.

Never mind it costs the uni £400/fire engine, and on average we have one a DAY

They dont care, they just pass the cost on to next years' student residents.
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: Setekh on March 23, 2002, 07:57:21 am
Quote
Originally posted by Kazan
b*@$$*stard!

college is going to cost me somewhere between $60K and $70K - and that's if they don't raise tutition and room&board again - and im sure they will


$60K-$70KUS?!!![/b]
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: Nico on March 23, 2002, 07:57:57 am
lol, you can complain: we just found out that France telecom (by far the most used phone company in France, it was the only one till a couple of years ago) have several billions (yeah! billions my god!!!) of euros (yeah, coz francs, that would not be enough isn't it?) of debt!
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: Kazan on March 23, 2002, 08:02:41 am
Quote
Originally posted by Setekh


$60K-$70KUS?!!!
[/B]


yeah.. and that's for a public uni!

the place i really wanted to go would have cost me around $150K

[those numbers are for all 4 years, and school associated costs only]
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: wEvil on March 23, 2002, 08:32:26 am
Quote
Originally posted by venom2506
lol, you can complain: we just found out that France telecom (by far the most used phone company in France, it was the only one till a couple of years ago) have several billions (yeah! billions my god!!!) of euros (yeah, coz francs, that would not be enough isn't it?) of debt!


British Telecom - £32 billion.

Well...they sold most of those stupid Transit vans and most of those japanese ventures and someone finally realised that concert (BT/AT&T) was just a massive cash drain (well done, lads!)

so they might be down to a mere £16bln by now.

morons.
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: Martinus on March 24, 2002, 01:22:56 am
wEvil, just be glad the conservatives aren't still in power. You'd be paying for your college, uni etc. and hospital care, water, air, right to live, right to die and anything else they can squeeze money out of to help the rich get richer and the poor get poorer. I'm sure they would've imposed a death tax if they'd been re-elected. Labour is the lesser of two evils and lesser by far!

Not to say I'm happy about paying £1050 in tuiton fees every year though...
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: wEvil on March 24, 2002, 07:11:18 am
I'm terribly sorry, but thats not what the conservatives stand for.

Labour is kind of the ultimate hypocrite.

They're worse than the tories would ever be.

OK, so taxes were high, but they've always been in this country. Its just under a new labour govornment they've skyrocketed to totally ludicrous proportions.

also, the tories SUPPORT the GRANTS system, not the LOANS system.

You are misinformed.

*EDIT*
Death tax?
yea..if you leave anyone over £10k you pay 40% in death duties, its been that way since the 18th century, i beleive.
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: Kazan on March 24, 2002, 07:24:10 am
Quote
Originally posted by Maeglamor
wEvil, just be glad the conservatives aren't still in power. You'd be paying for your college, uni etc. and hospital care, water, air, right to live, right to die and anything else they can squeeze money out of to help the rich get richer and the poor get poorer. I'm sure they would've imposed a death tax if they'd been re-elected. Labour is the lesser of two evils and lesser by far!

Not to say I'm happy about paying £1050 in tuiton fees every year though...


that sounds like the biggest bull**** rant i've ever heard - no matter what country you're in

especially the bull**** about the 'rich richer, and the poor poorer' - it's true some of the conversatives do this - in my country and yours, look at asshole bush

not all do it - and you also make being rich sound evil - it's not
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: Zeronet on March 24, 2002, 08:15:41 am
Quote
Originally posted by Kazan


that sounds like the biggest bull**** rant i've ever heard - no matter what country you're in

especially the bull**** about the 'rich richer, and the poor poorer' - it's true some of the conversatives do this - in my country and yours, look at asshole bush

not all do it - and you also make being rich sound evil - it's not


Actually its perfectly true. Conservatives are useless and stupid, and the lib dems would ban cars, so they wont get in power. If the tories got in power, they'd reconsider, saying a load of lies so they can stick with the loans system.
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: wEvil on March 24, 2002, 09:02:07 am
Quote
Originally posted by Zeronet


Actually its perfectly true. Conservatives are useless and stupid, and the lib dems would ban cars, so they wont get in power. If the tories got in power, they'd reconsider, saying a load of lies so they can stick with the loans system.


Oh, so they'd just be following Labours' lead then?

they've welshed on almost every fecking promise in their shabby manifesto.

Anyone who voted labour is a total idiot.
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: aldo_14 on March 24, 2002, 10:08:34 am
Quote
Originally posted by Kazan


that sounds like the biggest bull**** rant i've ever heard - no matter what country you're in

especially the bull**** about the 'rich richer, and the poor poorer' - it's true some of the conversatives do this - in my country and yours, look at asshole bush

not all do it - and you also make being rich sound evil - it's not


Unfortunately, there's a balance of power that still rests with the rich.  It's possibly more immediately apparent in the US (Bush makes  money from oil wells, then prepares to start wars with majors oil producers*), but also in the UK.  In many cases, the truly rich - landed gentry, etc - do **** all to help those less powerful.  If you have a few million in the bank, then why not give out at least some of the interest to charity, or to help others?

Personally, I'm not voting in the UK elections, because I don't believe any of the parties will help.  i may vote in the Scottish elections, simply to show support for devolution and the aim of Independence (SNP).
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: Styxx on March 24, 2002, 09:07:05 pm
Quote
Originally posted by Kazan
b*@$$*stard!

college is going to cost me somewhere between $60K and $70K - and that's if they don't raise tutition and room&board again - and im sure they will



Well, I had to go through a one-week-straight exam to get in, against 30 to 1 odds or something like that. There are only a few public universities, and they're very disputed - thankfully, they're the best ones too. The CS institute at my university got all A grades on the Ministry of Education yearly evaluation. :nod:

Ah, and I got into two other public universities and three other private ones, I just chose that one because it was the best one and closest to home. ;)
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: Styxx on March 24, 2002, 09:10:50 pm
On a sidenote, this is turning into too much of a political debate for my taste. These things tend to turn into The Song That Never Ends™ pretty soon... ;)
Title: OT- Higher education
Post by: Setekh on March 26, 2002, 04:31:22 am
Quote
Originally posted by Styxx
On a sidenote, this is turning into too much of a political debate for my taste. These things tend to turn into The Song That Never Ends™ pretty soon... ;)


They all do! The ones that get to 80+ replies... it happens, every time...