Hard Light Productions Forums
Off-Topic Discussion => General Discussion => Topic started by: portej05 on March 09, 2009, 10:30:05 am
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http://www.sundayherald.com/news/heraldnews/display.var.2494129.0.0.php (http://www.sundayherald.com/news/heraldnews/display.var.2494129.0.0.php)
PLANS TO refurbish Trident nuclear weapons had to be put on hold because US scientists forgot how to manufacture a component of the warhead, a US congressional investigation has revealed.
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:lol:
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They should ask the Russians. They probably have the plans somewhere. :D
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No one thought to write that down... :nervous:
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Hoh! Let's just hope they don't start guessing.
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I THINK THIS STYROFOAM I HAVE IN THE BACK OF MY CAR WILL WORK =D
*KABOOM*
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Where's Nuke when they need him? :nervous:
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Working for the Chinesee.
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Will build thermonuclear devices for food.
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Somebody call MacGyver!
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Apparently it was so top secret, the hid the only plans, then couldn't find them again.
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Have they tried looking under the pillow?
"This weapon is so secret no one knows how it works!"
"Sir, what do you mean no one? Surely the people that put it together must know."
"What? And what if they are to be captured or tortured by the enemy! You are insane private!"
"But..."
"Do you want this weapon to fall into enemy hands?"
"But..how did we build it in the first place then?"
"It's a secret!"
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This kind of thing isn't new. NASA forgot how to make a particular material, if memory serves.
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.... What if.... What if we all forget how to build nukes, and then... then we forget how to maintain them, and they break down to the point that they're useless, so we dispose of them, and then no one has nukes and no one know how to make any more.... it'll never happen. :blah:
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I can just imagine it.
General: We need 2 dozen Trident missiles. and We need them by next tuesday.
Scientist: We could have them ready by thursday...but there is one little tiny baby problem...
General: and what is that
Scientist: We forgot how to make them and no-one has the plans.
General: That's two problems...WHAAAAAT?!
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this is why plans to nuclear devices should be open source
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Should I be amused? :confused:
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Didn't the same thing (kinda) happen with F-14 Tomcat part molds? IIRC they were destroyed, making manufacture of large spare parts of the airframe prohibitively expensive, hence the decision to scrap F-14 and replace it with F/A-18 Super Hornets and F-35 Lightning II's (for the better or the worse). Can't remember what the details of this occurrence were specifically, though.
I can't help but feel that this kind of things don't happen by chance or accident, but politics.
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:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
How the hell does this **** even happen
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And I always thought dystopian fiction that had people forgetting all of our old technology was improbable.
But this, coupled with ruins suggesting flush toilets and plumbing in the Ancient Indus Valley is enough to prove how fragile technological knowledge is.
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So THAT'S how the Atlantis city vanished!
"Um, sir, mr. Ruler-of-the-Atlantis, we forgot how to remain floating on water"
"What the <gulp>"
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how do i built nukes?
i dunno lol
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I see your Trident missile problem and raise you the question - how many of you know how to smelt iron ore into steel and then bang it into a shape you need it to be? :p
If all CNC machines and other magical devices that produce parts for other machines suddenly ceased working, what would humanity do?
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Ask the Society for Creative Anachronism for help? :D
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Revenge of the Renaissance Fair
Remember to stock up on your Ballistae and Trebuchets http://siegethedayinc.com/default.aspx (http://siegethedayinc.com/default.aspx)
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.... What if.... What if we all forget how to build nukes, and then... then we forget how to maintain them, and they break down to the point that they're useless, so we dispose of them, and then no one has nukes and no one know how to make any more....
...We'd have some 4 or more world wars in our history by now.
If all CNC machines and other magical devices that produce parts for other machines suddenly ceased working, what would humanity do?
They'd call the repair guys to get them back online, duh...
And if that didn't work, our next cars would be Ford T's, available in any color as long as it's black.
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If you don't know how to make Trident Missiles, reverse engineer them and learn to rebuild them.
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Didn't the same thing (kinda) happen with F-14 Tomcat part molds? IIRC they were destroyed, making manufacture of large spare parts of the airframe prohibitively expensive, hence the decision to scrap F-14 and replace it with F/A-18 Super Hornets and F-35 Lightning II's (for the better or the worse). Can't remember what the details of this occurrence were specifically, though.
Yes it did happen. AND I WILL NEVER FORGIVE!!!!!!! Scrapping the F-14 was SACRILIGE!
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F-14s were getting to the point like the F-15s of having airframe cracks and it was a matter of time before one of them broke up during a training exercise. I loved the good ole Tomcat but its time has passed and so has the time for many of the old F-15 and F-16 airframes. Soon the early F-18 airframes will be on the block too....these things only last so long.
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I see your Trident missile problem and raise you the question - how many of you know how to smelt iron ore into steel and then bang it into a shape you need it to be? :p
If all CNC machines and other magical devices that produce parts for other machines suddenly ceased working, what would humanity do?
as too the first part of your question i can do that as for the cnc machines we did have the direct human operated versions for a long time before (not as fast i know ) but they have less down time due to crashes, and having worked in a engineering construction (steelwork) job , most of the difficulties come from ppl designs that are brilliant but absolute nightmares to make and could be way more simple
but for the trident issue im glad they arent being built atm
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Someone really needs to start a knowledge preserve, somewhere. Like that Seed preserve in Northern Europe. We need to start engraving information into thick glass tablets that'll last through everything up to and including a nuclear holocaust. Housed within a fortified, hermetically sealed bunker in some remote but accessible and ultimately obvious region, like the top of Mount Kosciusko in Australia.
Or we could just print out every wiki article and keep them under our beds for warmth, safe in the knowledge that we're prepared.
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F-14s were getting to the point like the F-15s of having airframe cracks and it was a matter of time before one of them broke up during a training exercise. I loved the good ole Tomcat but its time has passed and so has the time for many of the old F-15 and F-16 airframes. Soon the early F-18 airframes will be on the block too....these things only last so long.
I was refering more to the Super Tomcat project being canceled.
F'course if a fighter has been around long enough it will show stress of usage. That why you can build new units of the same type or more modern type.
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glass ... last through everything
:doubt:
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Somebody call MacGyver!
Seconded.
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F-14s were getting to the point like the F-15s of having airframe cracks and it was a matter of time before one of them broke up during a training exercise.
So you do what the Marines did with the AH-1Z and build a fleet of new airframes.
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F-14s were getting to the point like the F-15s of having airframe cracks and it was a matter of time before one of them broke up during a training exercise.
So you do what the Marines did with the AH-1Z and build a fleet of new airframes.
Are the Tomcats really that great? This sounds like Windows re-selling Windows 95SE...
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They have swing-wings!
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F-14s were getting to the point like the F-15s of having airframe cracks and it was a matter of time before one of them broke up during a training exercise. I loved the good ole Tomcat but its time has passed and so has the time for many of the old F-15 and F-16 airframes. Soon the early F-18 airframes will be on the block too....these things only last so long.
I was refering more to the Super Tomcat project being canceled.
F'course if a fighter has been around long enough it will show stress of usage. That why you can build new units of the same type or more modern type.
Hate to say it but the Soviet Union is gone man.......
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Yeah! Who needs a Super Tomcat?
*sweeps F35 and F22 under the rug*
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Hate to say it but the Soviet Union is gone man.......
The Backfires and the Badgers ain't.
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It's a shame about the F-14. It had a lot of potential. For the cost of the new Raptor, you could have built something like a dozen new, modern, up-to-date Super Tomcats 21's or other variations. I'd say that would be a better use for the money--especially as a new generation could stay in development until it was ready and offered a major upgrade.
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Don't forget the Phoenix missile - like a FS2 Trebuchet, except even longer ranged and even more powerful! Way it is supposed to work is it ignites its engine, climbs, levels out, keeps going, targets the top of the enemy plane, and then slams down on it at several times the speed of sound. And lets not forget it has a proximity warhead, so it almost never misses.
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...and it weighed so much, that no Tomcat ever lifted off of a carrier deck carrying the full loadout of six, because if they weren't fired during a mission, the F-14 was too heavy for the arrestor cable.
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Long range missiles would be a lot better if it weren't for the fact that usually rules of engagement preclude attacking an aircraft before it is in visual range anyway.
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Not if you're in a shooting war, which is the exact arena that weapons are designed for. The RoE are different during war than peace. By war, I mean all-out war with a modern nation-state, like the (now non-existent) Soviet Union or China. And it is quite possible to identify enemy aircraft from BVR either by their emissions (all active radars have different signatures) or because they don't respond to challenges. If they aren't emitting, don't respond to challenges, and are on a direct course for the carrier group, its safe to assume hostile intent. Which is when you want your CAP of Tomcats to light off their Phoenix missiles before they blow up that multi-billion fleet of yours.
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Not if you're in a shooting war, which is the exact arena that weapons are designed for. The RoE are different during war than peace. By war, I mean all-out war with a modern nation-state, like the (now non-existent) Soviet Union or China. And it is quite possible to identify enemy aircraft from BVR either by their emissions (all active radars have different signatures) or because they don't respond to challenges. If they aren't emitting, don't respond to challenges, and are on a direct course for the carrier group, its safe to assume hostile intent. Which is when you want your CAP of Tomcats to light off their Phoenix missiles before they blow up that multi-billion fleet of yours.
That's how an Aegis cruiser managed to shoot down an Iranian airliner. And it wasn't even in time of war!
Solatar's got a great point. Even not accounting for ROEs, most fights end up at visual range (and have been doing so for a very long time, in spite of predictions to the contrary.)
The Phoenix was, unfortunately, a big waste of money and space. And the Tomcat never handled well in ACM.
I really recommend playing Falcon 4.0. It demolished a lot of my myths about air combat -- especially when I had to fly allied operations alongside Eastern Bloc fighters in the hands of now-NATO countries.
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Solatar's got a great point. Even not accounting for ROEs, most fights end up at visual range (and have been doing so for a very long time, in spite of predictions to the contrary.)
The Phoenix was, unfortunately, a big waste of money and space. And the Tomcat never handled well in ACM.
For the scenario and the threat it was designed for, the Tomcat/Phoenix combination was very capable. There's not going to much commercial air traffic flying around out there in the North Atlantic with the multiregiment Backfire raid.
The Tomcat-21 project would have produced a fighter on a par or better than the F-15E in every fashion. It would also have sidestepped the really crippling problem that the modern USN carrier air wing has: the Hornet's lack of range. By all reports the JSF when it gets around isn't going to be vastly better in this fashion. That was the real problem with sending the F-14s and A-6s to the boneyard, it shortened a carrier's reach dramatically.
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There's only so far you can push the Tomcat, I think in this case just starting a fresh was a good idea.
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Fail :blah:
I seriously doubt the article though, but if it's real, then it's Epic Fail...
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Solatar's got a great point. Even not accounting for ROEs, most fights end up at visual range (and have been doing so for a very long time, in spite of predictions to the contrary.)
The Phoenix was, unfortunately, a big waste of money and space. And the Tomcat never handled well in ACM.
For the scenario and the threat it was designed for, the Tomcat/Phoenix combination was very capable. There's not going to much commercial air traffic flying around out there in the North Atlantic with the multiregiment Backfire raid.
The Tomcat-21 project would have produced a fighter on a par or better than the F-15E in every fashion. It would also have sidestepped the really crippling problem that the modern USN carrier air wing has: the Hornet's lack of range. By all reports the JSF when it gets around isn't going to be vastly better in this fashion. That was the real problem with sending the F-14s and A-6s to the boneyard, it shortened a carrier's reach dramatically.
I remember Tomcat CAPs in Harpoon were great because you could get your missiles off and RTB from quite a distance. Fuel was a big consideration in that game.