Hard Light Productions Forums
Modding, Mission Design, and Coding => The Modding Workshop => Topic started by: Nico on April 10, 2001, 04:56:00 pm
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Does the $Power Output tag doesn't work? I want my weapon power to come back quickly on a ship I'm doing, but tweaking this tag does nothing... Can someone tell me how to increase that?
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venom2506
Member of the Robotech mod for FS2 (//"http://robotechlan.com/freespace2/")
and of Hidden Terror, the Shivan campaign (//"http://shivancampaign.homestead.com/index.html")
and My own page (//"http://www.geocities.com/venom250681/Venom2506.html")
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Well, it works for me... at least i think it does (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/confused.gif)
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"Supernova, ya supernova, supernova goes pop
supernova, ya think it's over but the supernova don't stop" PM5K
Death:"Arnold Judas Rimmer... your life is over. You will travel with me to the-"
#knees death in the groin#
Rimmer:"Remember matey, it's only the good that die young"
Kudoth, god of pointless educational programs.
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power output is for the ships.tbl
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Bobboau, bringing you products that work.............. in theory
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Yes, thanx, I knows that, but I tried 0, 0.1, ,0.6, 1, 2, 5, 10, 1000, and the power income speed stays the same, so how the hell do I make it faster, please?
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venom2506
Member of the Robotech mod for FS2 ("http://robotechlan.com/freespace2/")
and of Hidden Terror, the Shivan campaign ("http://shivancampaign.homestead.com/index.html")
and My own page ("http://www.geocities.com/venom250681/Venom2506.html")
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you mean the fir rate or the recharge time (recharge time varys per ship)
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Bobboau, bringing you products that work.............. in theory
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I mean recharge time: the speed at which the power gauge for weapons replenishes itself.
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venom2506
Member of the Robotech mod for FS2 ("http://robotechlan.com/freespace2/")
and of Hidden Terror, the Shivan campaign ("http://shivancampaign.homestead.com/index.html")
and My own page ("http://www.geocities.com/venom250681/Venom2506.html")
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that is something that you put in the ship section, it isn't part of the weapons, its part of the ship.
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Bobboau, bringing you products that work.............. in theory
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He IS using the Ships TBL. He just wants the weapon banks to recharge faster.
Have you tried changing the energy to weapons in-game? Maybe it stays the same until you shunt power to it.
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Sushi- the OTHER white meat!
Accelerate your game-Velocity Mod ("http://sushicw.homestead.com/files/freespace/index.htm")
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Bobboau: Thanx (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/smile.gif) Can you tell it to me a third time? I'm sure I didn't understand.
Sushi: Nope, but I'll try (anyway, if that's that, its wrong (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/frown.gif) )
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venom2506
Member of the Robotech mod for FS2 ("http://robotechlan.com/freespace2/")
and of Hidden Terror, the Shivan campaign ("http://shivancampaign.homestead.com/index.html")
and My own page ("http://www.geocities.com/venom250681/Venom2506.html")
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I'm resurrecting this thread from the dead because I'm having this exact same problem now.
I'm changing the power output value in the ships.tbl for the Volron Fighter.
I have the power output set to 100. It takes about a minute for the ship to recharge. I set it to 1000. Still takes a minute. I set it to 10000. Still takes a minute. Is this value being capped at 100? Some other value? Give me a clue guys. This is most annoying ;)
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[color=66ff00]Sweet Neptune's Trident!
You revived a 4 year old thread. :D
[/color]
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Wouldn't it be easier to lower the power consumption rate (rather then recharge) ?
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Originally posted by Maeglamor
[color=66ff00]Sweet Neptune's Trident!
You revived a 4 year old thread. :D
[/color]
God god, I didn't know we still had 4-year-old threads :p
I'm pretty sure that there's something else in the table that controls this. What I can't remember and I can't look it up from here, but look at the specs and see if there isn't something else concerning weapon recharge rates.
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AFAIK avgr_1 (sry if I mispelled) worked on this one.
Yes, there was (is) a problem with the fact that the poweroutput didn't do anything - though I don't know if his changes made it to the CVS.
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i think it takes the weapon energy into account in the calculations. if you lower the bank capacity and increase the power output you will notice a much faster charge rate. if you have a high value set to weapon erergy it will take a long time to charge regaurdless of power output.
id like to see a spreadsheet that shows how table variables get calculated by the engine as a reference for modders when facing this kinda problem.
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Taken from Herc MK1 table:
$Power Output: 3.0
$Max Oclk Speed: 64.0
$Max Weapon Eng: 150.0
I believe that the 2nd & 3rd of those entries are crucial for you. I'm guessing that the Max Oclk Speed is how quickly your weapon power recharges, and Max Weapon Eng is what the weapon energy cappacity is. I'm also guessing that the power output affacts how much the other 2 (plus engines and shields) change when more or less power is transferred to them VIA ETS. I'm just guessing here, but maybe it'll put you in the right direction.
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damn I was darn dense, wasn't I?
:lol:
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and looking into the code, wow, it actualy doesn't do anything!!!
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Was I correct in any aspects of my guessing?
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you mean the fir rate or the recharge time (recharge time varys per ship)
Some things never change... :D
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you know I do seem to have gotten better.
and no TP, oclk speed is how fast your ship goes when all energy is diverted to the engines
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Originally posted by Trivial Psychic
Was I correct in any aspects of my guessing?
actually no, $Max Oclk Speed: is how fast you can go when engine power is maxed.
Originally posted by Bobboau
and looking into the code, wow, it actualy doesn't do anything!!!
so i imagined it workign, oh well, it wouldnt be the first think i hallucinated. so this means weapon and shield recharge rate are hard coded. so what are there hard-coded recharge rates?
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however fast it needs to be to get them recharged in the same time for all ships regardless of how big there primary banks are
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Oh. Really? Wow. That sucks. It might be useful if some smarty pants programmer fixes this so that it does do something. How difficult can it be?
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Originally posted by Bobboau
and no TP, oclk speed is how fast your ship goes when all energy is diverted to the engines
What about Max Weapon Eng then?
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Originally posted by Trivial Psychic
What about Max Weapon Eng then?
That's how much energy is stored when your banks are fully charged. Max weapon eng 100 & weapon energy consumption of 20 = 5 ahots before empty.
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er... 100/20 = 5 I think.
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Sigh. Yes what he said.
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IPAndrews fails at division.
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My brain was swiss cheesed from working on TBP tables at the time. That's my excuse and I'm damn well sticking to it.
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Also whilst I'm here. If power takes the same time to recharge for any ship regardless of the size of it's bank. Effectively that means ships with bigger banks get faster recharge (in terms of energy points per second). Interesting...
So you can achive your faster recharge by giving a ship a super large energy bank. Although on the downside... your ship ends up with a super large energy bank :)
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Originally posted by IPAndrews
Oh. Really? Wow. That sucks. It might be useful if some smarty pants programmer fixes this so that it does do something. How difficult can it be?
I second that! Power output should increase the rate at which shields and weapon energy re-charge.
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I smell a new launcher flag a la -smart_shields.
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The only reason this needs a launcher flag is to prevent it from breaking existing missions so instead of fixing $Power Output I'd suggest adding a new table entry called $Reactor Output.
That way we can add the feature to new campaigns without having to worry about needing a new flag or breaking existing campaigns.
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Or have it default to the old system if a value isn't present. That way you can have both behaviors side-by-side.
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Problem is that the ships on the standard ships table do have a value and it changes depending on the ship. The second you fix $Power Output you'd break the main campaign.
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I was thinking (since $power Output has no effect) that you could taylor the recharge rates with a couple of extra variables. Not "fix" the old power output though, because you're right about it causing massive breakage.
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of just ad an "enable_power_output" flag. ships with the flag will read the $power output: field, else it defaults to normal.
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Would it break the original campaign?
has anyone tested it?
and one strange this - I do belive power output works.. I set it to 10 on my Phoenix fighter and it's shields recharge far faster than on any other fighter... Strange...
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well not if the absence of the flag results in it using the game default. id have to look at the way the variable would have been used to tell you that. my assuption was that it was coded as a variable, and v simply replaced the variable with a hard coded number. my solution would simply precede that line with an if statment
if(flag)
use variable
else
use hard coded value
so no, it wouldnt.
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useless waist of a flag, we only get 32 of them before we have to do major recodeing to get more.
just get a slightly diferent version of the table entry.
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Originally posted by Bobboau
damn I was darn dense, wasn't I?
:lol:
Bob, you're looking in the wrong place. Density is stored in the ships.tbl.
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I was thinking that perhaps reactor cores could eventually be installed as tertiary subsystems. That way, newer reactor technology could be installed into existing fighters partway through a campaign. Note, that this feature may not necessarily be compatible with the existing cannon for Freespace, but some non-freespace campaigns could benefit from this ability. This would unfortunately mean waiting for the implimentation of Tertiaries. Of course, the other way to do this would be to introduce a completely new category... upgradable subsystems. Things like Reactors and Shield generators, or pretty much any citical part of a fighter that could be upgraded during a campaign, could be incorporated in this.
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Originally posted by Bobboau
useless waist of a flag, we only get 32 of them before we have to do major recodeing to get more.
just get a slightly diferent version of the table entry.
$Power Output That Actually Does Something:
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Originally posted by TrashMan
Would it break the original campaign?
It's pretty bloody obvious it would. At the moment all ships use the same hardcoded number. Look at the ships table and you'll quickly see that the numbers for pow output vary by quite a large amount. IIRC the value for the Eyrinies is 5 times higher than that of the ulysses.
We're not dealing with minor differences here. You make a ship 5 times better at recharging it's shields when previously it was the same then you're going to make some ships weaker than before and other ships stronger.
Just go with $Reactor Output and avoid all the hassle. That way if you decide you want to try using it in the main camapign a simple search and replace will have the feature working in a matter of a few seconds.
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i wasnt really aware there was a flag limit. in that case im for $Reactor Output:
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Meh..simply set all fighter to have the same output then...tehre..problem fixed.
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Originally posted by TrashMan
Meh..simply set all fighter to have the same output then...tehre..problem fixed.
What a f**king stupid idea. You'd have to edit all the tables given out with every single campaign since FS2 came out to make that work or you'd risk breaking the lot of them.
Even then you'd still have problems every time someone extracted the table from root_fs2.vp instead of using the new one.
I fail to see why you insist on doing something in such a stupid and problematic fashion when there is a simpler and easier way to do things.
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Duh....changing the power output for fighters is a easy thing...and putting the fixed tables for download is allso a easy thing...
I've seen MOD's out there that come with two sets of tables for you to choose which one to use..why not do it here?
Really, you make it sound like I'm asking you to climb mt. Everest...
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Cause what you're asking for is stupid and counterproductive. If it's easy to edit the tables to give them all the same value then it's far easier to do absolutely nothing and still have the same effect.
It also breaks the SCPs cardinal rule that the media.vps are optional and that a standard exe will play existing campaigns without breaking them.
Furthermore the multiplayer tables would have to be distributed to all the people who play multiplayer (even those on Tom's Old Build who wouldn't even be affected by the change) and the ships.tbl would have to be re-validated
On top of all that who's going to edit all the table entries for every single campaign and re-upload them? You? What about all the people who have already downloaded campaigns. Are you planning to make an archive of edited table files available for them or are you planning to force them to download the entire mod again just because of this table change?
Last of all I'd be stuck answering the question of all the newbies who come onto the board and get messages claiming that they are using hacked tables when they just have the standard [V] ones. And it would be me, not you who would be the one answering those queries so I resent the fact that your ill thought out idea would probably result in more work for me for absolutely no good reason.
Or we could avoid being f**king idiots and use a new table entry that doesn't cause anyone any problems beyond the bother of updating a few entries in the wiki to say that one entry does nothing and the name of the entry that does.
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This would explain 4 hours of frustration I experienced ending in a bruised forehead and a dinted wall.
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Originally posted by IPAndrews
$Power Output That Actually Does Something:
or
$Power_Output:
and Kara, calm yourself, he's got about as much authority over the situation as I have over Iraq. don't wory we won't do that.
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Didn't think you would. It just annoys me when someone continually contradicts me just for the sake of it.
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*Contradicts kara for the sake of it*
:p
It would be nice just to have extra flags that do specific things, like a recharge rate per second for weapons and maybe some other things buried in my mind.
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reactor output gets divied up by the ets gauge. no need for seprate vlues.