Hard Light Productions Forums
Off-Topic Discussion => General Discussion => Topic started by: Goober5000 on May 11, 2009, 08:46:26 pm
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We need a break from all the political threads.
Launch Day Article (http://www.spaceflightnow.com/shuttle/sts125/090511launch/) (informal)
Launch Day Article (http://www.nasaspaceflight.com/2009/05/live-sts-125-launch-updates/) (technical)
NASA Animation (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vw7gFJxr-vw)
Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/STS-125)
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Maybe someone can update me, I thought they had planned to dis-mantle the Hubble. Hopefully, they changed their minds. :)
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One of the things I've really been annoyed with NASA about is their continual desire to do nothing but go up to the International Space Station and send out probes. If we really want to get anywhere in space, people should actually start heading beyond Earth's orbit. Even going back to the moon would be all right, but enough with the satellites and space stations orbiting our own little rock.
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One of the things I've really been annoyed with NASA about is their continual desire to do nothing but go up to the International Space Station and send out probes. If we really want to get anywhere in space, people should actually start heading beyond Earth's orbit. Even going back to the moon would be all right, but enough with the satellites and space stations orbiting our own little rock.
Have you heard of Project Constellation?
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Yeah, but how long is it going to be before that seriously gets anywhere we haven't already gone? I mean, yeah it's something, but it's mostly going to be moonwalks again, whenever it gets finished. Last time I checked, we were at the moonwalk stage in 1969. We should be a little farther than that by now. Problem is we're not, and that's what bugs me.
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Thing is that despite the improvements in technology in other fields...space flight and travel is an area that hasn't progressed very far. Some of the problems that were around in the 60s are still problems now. I had thought when I was young that we'd be much further along as well....but I'm growing to realize how difficult space is to us despite decades of experience. If anything...it shows you how truly ahead of its time the Apollo program really was.
Space travel needs to become cheaper....its not yet and may not be for a while yet.
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One of the astronauts on there is from the seattle area, so our newspaper had a big huge article about it :P
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I keep finding myself wishing that there was still some way for NASA to retrieve Hubble when its operational lifespan is finally completed, as I believe was originally the plan before the shuttles started to be phased out, instead of just sending it to a fiery/watery grave. But I'm consoled somewhat by the fact that, if this mission goes right, we'll still manage to get several years of incredible images from the old girl. I did learn from a video on NASA's site that they'll be bringing back the corrective Wide Field Planetary Camera 2 that was installed during the original 1993 servicing mission, so at least there will be something from it to see in the Smithsonian someday.
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I think the progress in the 1960's was more a result of the desperation of the Space Race than anything else. Losing to the Soviets would have been a political disaster, so NASA was pretty much given a blank check. Plus, that fear of losing provided motivation, and that's what pushed them to develop the Moon program in such a short amount of time. But it's like IceFire said, the costs associated with space exploration are absurdly high. We made the exception for Apollo, but now with so many problems here on Earth it's hard to draw support for major funding for space programs anymore. The private sector looks really promising, though...
With Project Constellation... I'm not a huge fan, since it doesn't seem all that exciting on the surface. But I've heard that the ultimate goal, at least for the Moon stage of Constellation, is to set up a permanent base on the Moon. That seems like a pretty neat goal, and more importantly it's something that has a good chance of drawing major public interest. But given the amount of interest it would draw, the fact that NASA hasn't made those intentions public makes me wonder if it's really in their plans. (Or maybe they're just keeping the bigger plans quiet until something finally goes right with Constellation; based on what I've heard, the early stages haven't been smooth at all...)
Anyway, sorry, went way off topic. Yeah, it's too bad we'll be losing Hubble... there's no way they'll be able to squeeze in another Shuttle mission to even try to recover it. I guess that's the thing about space exploration--sadly, recovering our most important vehicles isn't always an option. It's the same way for all the Mars rovers. But aren't they planning to launch a new space telescope in a few years?
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If we really want to get anywhere in space, people should actually start heading beyond Earth's orbit.
What would be achieved by that, at this point? You put N$ in (N being a figure of astronomical proportions), and what do you get out?
Those $ must come (be taken) from somewhere.. personally I think they are better spent in basic research at this point.
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I guess that's the thing about space exploration--sadly, recovering our most important vehicles isn't always an option. It's the same way for all the Mars rovers. But aren't they planning to launch a new space telescope in a few years?
There are actually a few different telescopes up there now covering various parts of the EM spectrum, and I think the planned James Webb telescope (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Webb_Space_Telescope) is expected to be Hubble's primary successor in terms of mission parameters. And as far as recovering things like Spirit and Opportunity goes, at least there's always the potential in 2050+ for explorers on a permanent Mars base to walk over to them and pick them up. :p
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I'd like to add that all the plans for the crafts used in the '60s moon landing were destroyed as a precaution against espionage.
:wtf:
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Uh... no?
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...what?
In any case, space travel is still far too expensive. It takes too much power to get out of Earth and too much power to get back in safely. Nuclear fission might solve the energy consumption problem, but even then, we don't have that kind of technology that can propel something as huge as a space shuttle to 300 m/s and slow it down in a few seconds.
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One of the things I've really been annoyed with NASA about is their continual desire to do nothing but go up to the International Space Station and send out probes. If we really want to get anywhere in space, people should actually start heading beyond Earth's orbit. Even going back to the moon would be all right, but enough with the satellites and space stations orbiting our own little rock.
This is a repost of mine I made on another forum about this topic.
"I was reading this (http://www.independent.co.uk/opinion/commentators/johann-hari/johann-hari-are-there-just-too-many-people-in-the-world-828254.html) and started thinking. If there is any reason to make a serious push into space, this is it. Maybe it won't make the population start declining, but it would help to slow down its rate of growth by moving as many people as possible to off-world colonies.
Also we can use the resources from other worlds to help support the rest of the population on Earth. Running low on platinum for your fuel cells/catalytic converters/whatever? No problem, I was reading somewhere there was more platinum on just one asteroid (in the asteroid belt) than has ever been mined in the history of the world. Running low on natural gas? No problem, there are whole oceans of it on Triton. We as a people could accomplish many great things with the resources of an entire solar system at our disposal.
It is really something we should have done decades ago, but we didn't. We didn't because of an apathetic public who just didn't care. We never would have gone to the moon (or maybe even space) to begin with if it wasn't for the Soviets expressing interest in going there. Then after the first few moon landings no one cared about it anymore. After the collapse of the Soviet Union, the US had an amazing opportunity to focus on scientific discovery and developing the infrastructure for a permanent human presence in space (the ISS is peanuts compared to what we could have achieved if we tried). But unfortunately, it didn't do this and squandered its resources persueing global dominance. The US is now spending about $1 trillion (http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Middle_East/JA24Ak04.html) on it's military establishment (counting all military related spending that are not on the "official" pentagon budget). But now with record budget deficits and an enormous debt, I think that window of opportunity has closed. It's a shame we did not expend such resources more wisely. This is not completely NASA's fault since it is chained to an electorate that cares more about driving their monstrous SUV's and which celebrities are sleeping together than the future of humanity (after all, if it did then why drive SUV's around the city?) We could have done better than we did."
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...what?
In any case, space travel is still far too expensive. It takes too much power to get out of Earth and too much power to get back in safely. Nuclear fission might solve the energy consumption problem, but even then, we don't have that kind of technology that can propel something as huge as a space shuttle to 300 m/s and slow it down in a few seconds.
space travel is cheap, its launch thats costly :D
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One spacewalk down, and the Wide Field Camera III and replacement Science Instrument Command and Data Handling Unit have been successfully installed. I'm watching the live stream of the second spacewalk right now; they've already swapped out the three Rate Sensing Units (gyroscopes), and they're moving on to battery replacement. I have no idea how the two spacewalkers managed to coordinate swinging shut two of the larger doors on the telescope; it's hard enough to do something like that down on Earth. :p
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Excellent news. When I checked earlier today, one of the gyroscopes simply did not want to go into its socket, and they were trying to manhandle it into position or swap its socket with another.
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From what I understand, they swapped out another one of the gyroscope arrays for that one that wouldn't fit, and then had to use the spare they brought up in lieu of that one when it wouldn't fit into the final slot, either. Thank goodness for spare parts. The astronauts who were out on the first spacewalk had their own share of troubles, too; they had to fight against a stubborn bolt when removing the WFPC 2 which, had it broken, would have completely scuttled the installation of the WFC III and essentially crippled Hubble's main function. Let it never be said that those guys don't have nerves of steel. :p
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Pic of Atlantis and Hubble, taken from Earth (http://antwrp.gsfc.nasa.gov/apod/ap090516.html)
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Pic of Atlantis and Hubble, taken from Earth (http://antwrp.gsfc.nasa.gov/apod/ap090516.html)
That's utterly fantastic.
Looks like the third day went almost completely without a hitch, for once. In fact, the spacewalk went ahead of schedule and managed to get more accomplished than was originally planned. The Cosmic Origins Spectrograph is installed and operational, and it seems as though the repairs to the Advanced Camera for Surveys went according to plan. Next up: an even more involved repair of the Space Telescope Imaging Spectrograph, including the removal of 111 itty-bitty screws from an access panel. That'd be a ***** even down here.
(I swear, NASA has to have a few English majors on-staff to come up with proper-sounding acronyms for all of this stuff. :p)
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In the middle of the fifth and final spacewalk right now. The repair of the STIS yesterday was successful, but because of a handle bolt issue earlier, the spacewalkers didn't have time to replace some of Hubble's thermal covering as planned, so that had to be tacked onto the end of today's spacewalk. It seems like they've already successfully replaced the final battery assembly and the broken Fine Guidance Sensor, so they're now working on some of that thermal covering.
All things considered, this mission seems like a resounding success so far. The only setback I can think of is the fact that the High Resolution Channel on the ACS didn't come back online, but that was considered a long shot at best, and the Wide Field Channel that was specifically targeted by the repair seems to be working just fine now. This mission will definitely wind up breaking just about every boundary or what sort of repairs can be pulled off in-situ.
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Good, now we just have to hope that the re-entry and landing go as planned.
*crosses fingers*
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Re-entering frpm the Hubble orbit isn't any different from re-entering from the ISS orbit. They inspected the heat shield and found nothing to worry about.
The only difference between the Hubble mission and any ISS mission, from a safety standpoint, is the time crunch. At the ISS, they can afford to take refuge on the ISS for up to two months, long enough for the next shuttle to make its way through its normal processing flow and launch at the same time as it normally would have launched for its next mission. With the Hubble, they can only wait on the shuttle itself for up to two weeks, so the next shuttle has to have finished its processing and already be on the launch pad.