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Hosted Projects - FS2 Required => Blue Planet => Topic started by: ViolentAJ on September 27, 2009, 08:29:01 pm

Title: Knossos Mission
Post by: ViolentAJ on September 27, 2009, 08:29:01 pm
I just can't get to the cruiser in time before it destroys the Sanctuary. It's beam fires WAY too fast, and none of the other ships turn to even try and bring their beams to bare against the target. What is the solution?
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Droid803 on September 27, 2009, 08:46:57 pm
Trebuchets/Stilettos, I would believe. Assuming this is Forced Entry you're talking about.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: General Battuta on September 27, 2009, 08:49:32 pm
Trebuchets, for now, and we'll be rebalancing it a bit in the re-release since that's the only truly unfair part of the mission.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: ViolentAJ on September 27, 2009, 09:12:46 pm
Alright. I'll give them a try. I'm using the default fighter (the one with one bank of 4 guns). I guess that I really don't need missiles for dogfighting.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Scotty on September 27, 2009, 09:19:41 pm
Use the Myrm with three banks of Trebs.  Balors for bomber hunting, Trebs for beam-removal.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: The E on September 27, 2009, 09:31:25 pm
Yeah, that's the best loadout for the mission. Remember not to fire trebs on fighters.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on September 27, 2009, 10:52:50 pm
Alternatively, use the Herc II and load it out with 20 Trebuchets if you're good at using the Energy Transfer System. I pass all the time with this loadout (not that it says much since I always play legally on Very Easy). :nervous:
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: ViolentAJ on September 28, 2009, 12:06:46 am
Thanks for the tips. I'm going to use trebs, but try to beat it with the regular fighter (I like that fighter lol).
For some reason, the Balor is nice with that Recon fighter int he earlier missions, but sucks on the other fighters IMO. The Prometheus is the best weapon it seems (in my opinion).
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Darius on September 28, 2009, 12:12:34 am
The Balor is mainly useful as a tracer weapon for taking down light, fast fighters, which is what you're mostly facing in earlier missions. Once you get to bomber intercept and capital ship engagement, something harder hitting like the prometheus (which is my favourite cannon to use in Forced Entry due to its range) or the kayser would be better used.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on September 28, 2009, 12:48:10 am
Does the Prometheus have a longer range in BP?
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: General Battuta on September 28, 2009, 01:09:09 am
The Prometheus has always had a really long range.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: ViolentAJ on September 28, 2009, 05:42:34 am
Yeah, the prometheus rocks. I would argue that it is superior to the Keyser (at least int his mod).
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Akalabeth Angel on September 28, 2009, 07:15:03 am
Yeah, the prometheus rocks. I would argue that it is superior to the Keyser (at least int his mod).

I almost always pick teh prometheus over the Kayser. The Kayser seems to drain power reserves more quickly as well. Might do more damage but with half the range is it really worth it?
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Droid803 on September 28, 2009, 08:53:52 pm
It is when something (like a wing of Basilisks) jumps in real close and you want them dead fast (you're protecting Escape Pods).

Definitely not for Forced Entry though.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Pred the Penguin on September 29, 2009, 04:52:54 am
Try the Herc II if you're really having problems.

I tend to stick with a Kayser-Balor loadout....
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Aardwolf on September 29, 2009, 07:06:47 pm
I just can't get to the cruiser in time before it destroys the Sanctuary. It's beam fires WAY too fast, and none of the other ships turn to even try and bring their beams to bare against the target. What is the solution?

Did you actually mean the cruiser (i.e. the Lilith), or the [other thing that jumps in after the Lilith]?
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: The E on September 29, 2009, 07:18:10 pm
That's usually what the Lilith attack looks like. Unless you know what you are doing (that is, by having played the mission before), it is really easy to be out of Treb range when the Lilith shows up, with no chance of getting there before it fires.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Droid803 on September 29, 2009, 08:13:19 pm
Generally what it's firing at will survive one or two hits.
Just get there. FAST.

The Temeraire won't though. You have to have foresight skillz...well, they do say that they're being followed.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: General Battuta on September 29, 2009, 08:13:44 pm
That Lilith attack is just unfair.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on September 30, 2009, 12:27:12 am
Since when did the Shivans play fair? :p
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Flaser on October 11, 2009, 02:14:57 pm
Spoiler:
...and then you get a Ravana.

...and it keeps beaming me out of existance!
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: General Battuta on October 11, 2009, 02:36:22 pm
Trebuchet it!

The Abel is actually a piece of cake...if you're ready for it.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Madcat on October 11, 2009, 04:07:41 pm
I think the really mean part about the Lilith is that, despite that beam cannon being REALLY ****ING HUGE, it is somehow blocked by the ships structure when you face that cruiser from the front. I always have to dive under it in a very certain angle to get a clear shot and take out the cannon. This problem is not present on the Cain...

I have now beat the mission twice on Easy, both times with the Myrmidon, 2xKayser and full Trebuchet loadout.
1 Treb for the Cain beam cannon, 4 for the Lilith (because the first salvo never hits right), the rest for the Ravana.

I will wait for the voice acted version of the campaign to be released and then play it on Medium. :)

BTW, I finished the campaign yesterday for the first time (in one playthrough because I started again with the 3.6.10 version) and was totally blown away. Nice job on all fronts... the ending really hit me hard.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Scotty on October 11, 2009, 05:13:23 pm
With Kaysers?  Balors are the way to go for that mission.  Or Proms for range.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Madcat on October 11, 2009, 05:29:45 pm
If I read that correctly in another thread, after the last rebalance the Balor has the same damage per second as the Subach, just a much higher rate of fire.
Prometheus would work too and is usually my other weapon of choice if I can't have Kaysers.

As for the energy consumption, I only press the button if I'm likely to score a hit, but I like that hit to be as devastating as possible. I'm not likely to score a hit at 1500 meters on a  moving target, and have a hard time keeping my aim perfectly directed on the target for a few seconds to apply full damage with a rapid fire weapon. Maybe it's easier for people playing with a mouse, I never tried that. Love my joystick way too much! :D

Also, as said so far I played on Easy. I might reconsider on higher difficulties... I went up to medium as of today.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Aardwolf on October 11, 2009, 06:16:23 pm
The Abel is actually a piece of cake...if you're ready for it.

Which one? You had an Abel in one of the "Journey of a Thousand Miles" missions too... it was a Rakshasa IIRC.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on October 12, 2009, 11:42:46 am
:wtf:

Spoiler:
...and then you get a Ravana.

...and it keeps beaming me out of existance!
Trebuchet it!

The Abel is actually a piece of cake...if you're ready for it.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: NathanP on November 05, 2009, 04:18:22 pm
Diving under the lilith to get the front turret is not just restricted to BP, i've had to do it in SGWP2, retail, warzone and most other campaigns using the lilith.  2 salvo's of trebs usually does the job especially if you go for a fighter that can carry maxims.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Droid803 on November 05, 2009, 08:10:53 pm
I think the magic number is 3 Trebuchets per Lilith LRED, if you really need to conserve.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: PeterX on November 08, 2009, 06:15:07 am
I´d use a HercII armed with a pair UD8Kayser with a pair of GTW66Maxim as primary and all secondary banks with Trebuchets.
So i am able to destroy the beams on both Lilith,Cain and last but not least take off to destroy the beams of the Ravana in a long distance.
Peter
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Scotty on November 08, 2009, 02:49:33 pm
3 Secondary banks on a Myrm will still carry enough to do it with no re-arm.  WIll also take off the two SReds on the top of the Ravana.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Thaeris on November 08, 2009, 03:29:07 pm
I've heard that suggested several times. I just normally don't want to fly the Myrm.

Thus, I tend to use the good 'ole Herc 2 with the Maxim, Kayser, a bank of 10 Trebs, and a bank of 400 Tempests. That definately is not the easiest way to win the mission, but it certainly will do it. Taking the Herc means you don't need to worry about the minor beams of the Cain; you can just blast them with the Maxim. The Kayser/Tempest combo will knock down fighters. The Maxim and the Tempests also work wonders against hostile cruisers. The Myrmidon just can't do those tasks at the level of competance the Herc can do them at. Making yourself fly the Kulas would be very cruel to yourself indeed...

The biggest problem with the Herc is the speed. Though that's glaringly obvious, it's really amplified by the ranges involved in the mission. Though distance is a thing of beauty in FS... a thing which most missions tend not to have... those glorious distances tend to work against you in this mission because of the range of the Lilith's beams. Getting into a firing position with your Trebs is not easy on the Lilith; even after you fire, it will still hose down the Sanctuary with a few more blasts from the main gun. I hate those things...

This mission is the perfect example for a mission that needs controls to automatically dump all power into engines/restore balanced power configurations.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: General Battuta on November 08, 2009, 03:32:05 pm
If it weren't for the vulnerable weapons subsystem, I'd be all over the Kulas on this mission.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Thaeris on November 08, 2009, 03:35:32 pm
I never actually got around to flying the Kulas during AoA. Which reminds me... I need to start up a new thread...
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on November 09, 2009, 02:31:59 am
I've never even bothered to use the Kulas. Ever. Simply because the Herc II can carry more stuff, and because I love shunting power in my ETS.

I would proclaim that I can make any Herc II I fly behave like a space superiority fighter, but that's wishful thinking. :)
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Thaeris on November 09, 2009, 09:19:45 pm
I've never even bothered to use the Kulas. Ever. Simply because the Herc II can carry more stuff, and because I love shunting power in my ETS.

I would proclaim that I can make any Herc II I fly behave like a space superiority fighter, but that's wishful thinking. :)

<Thaeris awards Androgeos Exeunt not only mad props, but MASSIVE PROPS!!!  :yes: :yes: :yes: :yes: :yes:>

You sir, can be my wingman any time... or I'll be yours. I assume you've played FS more thoroughly, after all...  ;)
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on November 10, 2009, 06:23:57 am
Before you get carried away, you should also know that I've never played singleplayer beyond Very Easy difficulty, hence the "wishful thinking" bit.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Fury on November 10, 2009, 06:44:49 am
I would proclaim that I can make any Herc II I fly behave like a space superiority fighter, but that's wishful thinking. :)
I've never played singleplayer beyond Very Easy difficulty, hence the "wishful thinking" bit.
(http://ui08.gamespot.com/2119/doublefacepalm_2.jpg)
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Herra Tohtori on November 10, 2009, 06:48:57 am
Before you get carried away, you should also know that I've never played singleplayer beyond Very Easy difficulty, hence the "wishful thinking" bit.

I couldn't resist...

(http://cdn1.knowyourmeme.com/i/4856/original/Touhou_easy_mode_how_lame.png)


Srsly though, I usually play on whatever difficulty level lets me have fun. Usually it's either Medium or Hard. Very Easy makes the AI ships move like they were piloted by a specifically retarded Derp Dog... and that includes your wingmen. But I don't especially enjoy having to run missions over and over and over again, so I rather move the difficulty one notch down and retry rather than pass the mission after five fails or keep running it with taste of blood in my mouth until I can complete it on the same difficulty as the rest of the campaign. :nervous:
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Thaeris on November 10, 2009, 02:01:09 pm
 :doubt:

I feel let down now. I felt Androgeos was a true member of the Brotherhood of the Hercules [Mk II]...

Now, I relegate thee to the position of Gamma 4!

Really, it's not personal.  :P

As far as difficulty goes, I try to keep it constant throughout the given campaign I'm playing. Currently I play at Medium; this doesn't bode well for one playing Transcend though, as no matter how awesome the Mk. II is, an 8-on-1 dogfight with a crappy loadout for that situation is a real killer...  :shaking:

As far as BP goes, anything is better than the Aurora, though.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Firartix on December 08, 2009, 02:07:49 pm
Guys. I went through the Lilith, but uh ?
What about the ravana ? i can't beat it in time.

I was using Myrmidon with 2 Bolars, 2*3 Trebs & 5 Silletos.
Note: the Silletos works fine to remove the liliths beam cannon under 2000 meters... boo, single shot !

Well then, i'm flying a Myrmidon, and that crappy Ravana somehow spawn 12,5k meters away.
What the hell ? I switched all power to engines, used afterburners all the time, but just had time to fire my 2 remaining trebs when it fired it's beam and destroyed Ter..Tri... well, whatever. How could you ever be faster ?!

Btw, that Myrmidon - Boler loadout is pretty good.
Well, i got killed the 2 first times i used it (i use most of power on engines and tends to get caught in bombs explosions :s), and ended up against the ravana with 25% the third time. I survived all the times with the Interceptor (love that one :o)... but could never destroy  beams in time ><
And well... i must say, bolers are really bad for bombs killing.

Well then, i just can't go through the mission even in Very Easy mode.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: General Battuta on December 08, 2009, 02:29:30 pm
As soon as the Temeraire jumps in, rush to get in position behind her stern with Trebuchets ready.

You can do it! We believe in you!
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Rodo on December 08, 2009, 02:32:48 pm
Yes, It can be done, besides you get a new excuse to listen to the music  ;)
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Droid803 on December 08, 2009, 02:34:39 pm
Just get there before it jumps in.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: General Battuta on December 08, 2009, 02:36:51 pm
You'll have to make use of Sam's curse of prescience.  :p

(Actually, that might be a funny thing to add to the mission for the director's cut...a sudden urge to get to the Temeraire's stern...)
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Vip on December 08, 2009, 02:41:27 pm
My tactic - Herc II, Maxims + Kaysers + 2x10 Trebuchets. First thing - destroy all main beam cannons (except the bottom AAA one) on both Rakshasas (3 beams on each, 1 Trebuchet per cannon). Then do some dogfighting with your Kaysers, and when the Cain jumps in, destroy the main beam cannon with a single Trebuchet. Immediately after the Sanctuary jumps in, rush to its rear and use 3 Trebuchets to destroy the lilith's LRed. Don't leave this position just yet, but engage any nearby bombers. As soon as the Temeraire jumps in, go full speed to its rear. When the Ravana appears, use double Trebuchets per each of the main cannons and fire your Maxims at it ASAP. When the LReds are destroyed, go for the SReds on the top spikes, they won't last long against the Maxims and Trebuchets.

During the entire mission, you have to assign wings to protect ships that jump in. Especially the Duke and the Bretonia. When the Temeraire jumps in, tell all your fighters to protect it. Also, shift all power to engines whenever to move from one ship to the other, especially when going for the Lilith and Ravana.

You need excellent timing. I managed to pass this mission on my 10th-15th pass :P

Hope this helps.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: General Battuta on December 08, 2009, 02:43:52 pm
We're making the mission a little more fair in the upcoming rerelease, but I don't think it would pay to make it too easy. Part of the thrill is how intensely difficult it is, and part of the fun of the campaign is sharing stories from Forced Entry.

Now Keepers of Hell, that was a hard mission.

Also, I'd advise not using any Trebuchets disarming the two Rakshasas. Just take them out the old-fashioned way.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Thaeris on December 08, 2009, 02:51:25 pm
I feel the Myrm would be acceptable in that mission, though I would strongly suggest using the Herc 2:

Load up on a pair of Kaysers and a pair of Maxims - The Kaysers will eat the enemy fighters while the Maxims will make smoking hostile turrets a breeze. Note that the Myrm just can't pack that kind of firepower: Myrm + Kayser = NO ENERGY! Furthermore, you can't place the Maxim on the fighter, so you'll be limited to either your finite missile supply or getting in close with low-power guns. Bad idea against capital ships...

Then, pack 10 Trebs in the first bank and 400 Tempests in the second. USE YOUR TREBS WISELY! I typically would use a few on the initial pair of Rakshasas, just to blast out a few of the forward beams (I'd rather not let the Duke get too basted in the first run...), and then save the rest for knocking out beams on the Lilith and maybe have one left over to hit the Ravana upon its arrival. The Tempests are the Herc 2's best friend, and the secondary firing ports are placed in the perfect spot as well for them: despite the slower speed of the Tempest in comparison to a cannon shot, the vertical placement of the bank gives an "artificial" lead when firing on a target you're turning into. Thus, they offset the Herc's smaller grouped primaries (in comparison to the Myrm's, which are best suited to low-power, fast-firing primaries like the Balor) with a fantastic puch. They'll also let you eat cruisers alive.  ;7

Here's the kicker: speed. Be familiar with adjusting your power settings when taking the Herc. She's lovely to fly and will lay the beat-down on anything, but she's pretty slow. Fortunately, her great reactor will keep a healthy charge on the afterburner when engines are at full - fly smart and the Shivans will "nevah know what hit 'em."  :yes:

...I realize that I've probably said that before, and many other people are in agreement, but hey...
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Vip on December 08, 2009, 03:32:42 pm
I feel the Myrm would be acceptable in that mission, though I would strongly suggest using the Herc 2:

Load up on a pair of Kaysers and a pair of Maxims - The Kaysers will eat the enemy fighters while the Maxims will make smoking hostile turrets a breeze. Note that the Myrm just can't pack that kind of firepower: Myrm + Kayser = NO ENERGY! Furthermore, you can't place the Maxim on the fighter, so you'll be limited to either your finite missile supply or getting in close with low-power guns. Bad idea against capital ships...

Then, pack 10 Trebs in the first bank and 400 Tempests in the second. USE YOUR TREBS WISELY! I typically would use a few on the initial pair of Rakshasas, just to blast out a few of the forward beams (I'd rather not let the Duke get too basted in the first run...), and then save the rest for knocking out beams on the Lilith and maybe have one left over to hit the Ravana upon its arrival. The Tempests are the Herc 2's best friend, and the secondary firing ports are placed in the perfect spot as well for them: despite the slower speed of the Tempest in comparison to a cannon shot, the vertical placement of the bank gives an "artificial" lead when firing on a target you're turning into. Thus, they offset the Herc's smaller grouped primaries (in comparison to the Myrm's, which are best suited to low-power, fast-firing primaries like the Balor) with a fantastic puch. They'll also let you eat cruisers alive.  ;7

Here's the kicker: speed. Be familiar with adjusting your power settings when taking the Herc. She's lovely to fly and will lay the beat-down on anything, but she's pretty slow. Fortunately, her great reactor will keep a healthy charge on the afterburner when engines are at full - fly smart and the Shivans will "nevah know what hit 'em."  :yes:

...I realize that I've probably said that before, and many other people are in agreement, but hey...

And, most important of all, patience. Don't get discouraged and feel no shame in decreasing your difficulty level. It's one of the hardest missions I've seen, requiring excellent timing, knowledge of your and your enemies' crafts' weaknesses and lots of micromanagements (both ETS and assigning escorts).
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Scotty on December 08, 2009, 03:38:56 pm
Myrm with twin Balors and full Treb banks works almost as well or better than the Herc II, simply becase it can get places a third again faster than the Herc.  With a twin Balor load-out (on Very Easy, at least) you can hunt all bombs and bombers fast, and pump your shields and engines up another notch each without a noticable change in weapon recharge.

Order all fighters to destroy one Rakshasa, then the next, in sequence.  Destroy the fighters your self, and quickly, you REALLY want those friendlies for escort duty later.  When the Lilith jumps in, roast the gun with three Trebs (or is it two?  I can't remember right now).  Then tell EVERYONE to ignore it.  It isn't going anywhere.  When the Temeraire jumps in, if you go full burners toward the sterns, you can usually get two sets of Trebs off at the Ravana before it actually fires the first time.  The first beam salvo WILL hit.  Nothing you can do there (except hope one misses to give you a few seconds extra).  Disarm both main beams with a volley of Trebs each, then hit the little stinger SReds on the top to keep the Ravana from small-beaming the Temeraire to death.  Debeamed, the Ravana will be easy pickings (If you want, you can go kill that Lilith now).

Have fun on the next mission. :P
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Sushi on December 08, 2009, 03:45:02 pm
I got through this mission before I knew it was supposed to be hard, so I'm still not entirely sure what I did. But I don't remember having much trouble at all (aside from the Ravana at the end the first time I got to it).

Pretty sure it involved me mostly avoiding dogfights, and focusing on shooting out turrets with Maxims (and the occasional treb) and shooting down bombs (also with maxims) while wingmen mop up. Disarmed capships are no threat, so as long as you stay on top of that you can just focus on the bombs/bombers... a strategy I've abused to death in many, many FS2 missions. :)
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: MatthTheGeek on December 09, 2009, 10:30:47 am
Using standard tactics, on medium, with a Perseus, Balor + Promy S and full banks of trebs, I never had problem successfully running this mission.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Mongoose on December 09, 2009, 04:43:09 pm
I had my problems on Easy (can't remember my loadout, though I don't think I changed it from the default) until I recognized that it all depends on dishing out the right orders.  Other than a few critical disarmings and the usual kill-anything-that's-red, your most important role is that of squadron commander, and keeping at least one wing protecting each of the capital ships that jumps in makes the entire mission substantially more doable.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Vip on December 09, 2009, 04:53:48 pm
I had my problems on Easy (can't remember my loadout, though I don't think I changed it from the default) until I recognized that it all depends on dishing out the right orders.  Other than a few critical disarmings and the usual kill-anything-that's-red, your most important role is that of squadron commander, and keeping at least one wing protecting each of the capital ships that jumps in makes the entire mission substantially more doable.

This is one of the rare missions when you have to order your wingmen around AND actually modify their orders every now and then as the situation on the battlefield changes. I think the only thing that could be changed is at the very end  - either increase the Temeraire's integrity from 34% to something like 50-60, or disable one LRed on the Ravana. It's frustrating to fail at the very end, tbh.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Thaeris on December 09, 2009, 07:07:32 pm
I found the Lilith much worse than the Ravana. As soon as that raging douche jumps in, she starts drilling the Sanctuary with that over-powered, overly-armored main beam. And, if she's in position, she'll use her second beam as well. Even worse, if you're in the wrong spot, you can't even shoot at the said beam because the rest of the hull shields it from view, and thus shields it from your Trebs/Maxims...  :mad:

Furthermore, because FS2/FSO is sometimes strange, cycling through turrets after firing secondaries often seems to reset the "targeting schedule," thus leaving you in a situation where, due to the angle at which you need to approach the Lilith, you can't tell if you're aiming at the front beam or the rear beam. If you choose wrong, you're going to be shooting at a beam which no longer exists because you just launched a salvo of Trebuchets at one turret... where you'll have to wait for those weapons to hit. The real kicker regardless of if you've made this mistake or not is that the Lilith will keep blasting the Sanctuary until the turret(s) are destroyed...

So yeah, the Ravana is a pussycat in comparison to the Lilith in this mission...
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: General Battuta on December 09, 2009, 08:39:01 pm
The Lilith is the worst part and it's been tamed a bit.

However, you can solve your turret targeting woes with the V key.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on December 10, 2009, 07:20:00 am
I'd advise not using any Trebuchets disarming the two Rakshasas. Just take them out the old-fashioned way.

The last time I played this mission, I flew a Herc 2 on Very Easy and had enough Trebs to distribute to all the Shivan warships in Forced Entry, including the Rakshasa cruisers.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: General Battuta on December 10, 2009, 09:25:24 am
Yeah, but then you're spending Trebs for no good reason, so you lose some redundancy. You can take down at least one Rakshasa before the Duke arrives guaranteed. Probably both.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: NGTM-1R on December 10, 2009, 10:10:07 am
Y'know I never had any trouble with this mission until I went to somebody's "recommended" Kulas and loadout.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on December 10, 2009, 11:18:53 am
Ah yes, but you see, we all fly different ways. :drevil:

I will always prefer using the Herc 2, even though I can probably understand why other people would use the Myrmidon and Kulas.

I have never seen anyone use a bomber in that mission, though. When I first did Forced Entry, I thought it was a great idea. :ick:
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Dilmah G on December 10, 2009, 11:27:56 am
Heh. :)

The good thing about Forced Entry is that after the first time you pass it, it's quite easy afterwards (at least that's how I found it, I can almost do it with my eyes closed these days. :P)
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Firartix on December 11, 2009, 12:51:39 pm
I FINALLY DID IT !

And well, all what i can say is : Screw Myrmidon and Trebuchets.
Although they seem to work fine first, i couldn't make the mission with them.

Here's the Loadout i used : (well it was in very easy mode ><)
Alpha Wing with Perseus, Kayser & Prometheus, 5 Trebs 5 Silettos
Beta Wing Hercules MkII with huh.... anti-fighter things. I didn't think about em much.
Gamma Wing using.... i don't remember at all oO'

Actually, the Trebs are not usefull at all.
Just one thing to say:
GET SILLETOES !

Whereas the Treb takes 5 Shots to hit 3 times, and 3 shots to kill a cannon, the Silletos are much more effective
Instead of firing Trebs at 5000 range, just go near 1500 range and fire silletos to one shot the beam cannons.
And since the Trebs are really slow and uneffective, it'll be even faster this way.
Just remember to aim carefully, Silletoes guiding isn't as good as the Treb one..

You may think i'm stupid but uh, here's what happened to me for now :
 - First, i couldn't make the mission without dieing (most of times) using Myrmidon & Hercules. With the Perseus everything is just fine, i ended the mission with 92% integrity (without rellying on shields much)
 - I went to attack the Ravana with 3 trebs and 3 Silletos. I fired my Trebs at one beam cannon. Only 2 hit the target, and the beam was at ~10%. Then well... i just took my 3 Silletos, and one shot all the 3 beams.

Anyway, good luck to other people doing that mission :o
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Dragon on December 11, 2009, 01:38:50 pm
One more thing, don't try giving Trebs to AI, as they never use them unless special condintions are met. (good-secondary-time SEXP)
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: MatthTheGeek on December 11, 2009, 01:51:50 pm
I don't understand how people can have difficulties to pass this mission. I usually pass it on the first or second try on Medium and Hard. It might come from flying styles, but it still seems a too large difference to only be due to that.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on December 11, 2009, 01:54:36 pm
I think it boils down towards ship, ship loadout and not knowing where the Shivans will appear next. When I first played Forced Entry, I did not expect the Abel to appear behind the Temeraire, so I panicked and failed the mission.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: General Battuta on December 11, 2009, 02:54:32 pm
Firartix, which MediaVPs are you using? The Trebuchet is not nearly as ineffective as you make it out to be. Something sounds wrong.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: The E on December 11, 2009, 03:09:03 pm
Agreed, Trebs are the way to go. Stilettoes, as good as they are, get intercepted too easily in my experience. It all comes down to targeting; Especially that beam on the Lilith can be very hard to hit if the Geometry is even slightly wrong.

Double-linked Trebs have a very good hit/kill rate in my experience, and, unlike Stilettoes, they don't get intercepted by Flak or fighters.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Firartix on December 12, 2009, 04:50:23 am
well i use FSPort 3.1.1, FSPort mediavps, and the standard MediaVP pack.
Maybe i shouldn't use the standard FS2 ones huh ?
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: The E on December 12, 2009, 05:03:37 am
Whaaaat.

To play BP correctly you need:
*Retail FS2
*FS2 MediaVPs (Preferably the patched 3.6.10 ones)
*Blue Planet 3.6.10

Please run a debug build, load up BP, and then post the fs2_open.log file from <FS2 dir>\data\ here.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Firartix on December 12, 2009, 08:47:34 am
Wait, i'm completely wrong.
I just made a mistake....
I'm actually not using FSPort ><
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: MatthTheGeek on December 12, 2009, 04:11:12 pm
Allright I've run a little playthrough of this level : [deleted] (I know, bad quality and no sound, but anyway)
First attempt for a long time, Hard difficulty, Perseus loaded with Promy+Balor and full Trebuchet banks. All went without a flaw. And the video capture process stole me quite a lot of CPU or GPU power i.e. drop in FPS, so I wasn't flying as good as I'm used to.

Now tell me where it's even possible to experiment difficulties in this mission, because I really don't see 0.0

EDIT : Much better quality for this one. http://fr.xfire.com/video/1b545d/ (http://fr.xfire.com/video/1b545d/)

Now please tell me were you're having difficulties, because I really don't understand.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: ShihiZu on January 12, 2010, 04:32:27 pm
I can't finish this mission. When Temeraire jumps in, it go about 13min to the portal. After ~8min it suddenly stops driving and stands still, never reaches the portal. No way to finish it..
When I run a debugger-build, it crashes (log attached). Also, i can't skip this mission.

Is there a solution?

[attachment deleted by admin]
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: The E on January 12, 2010, 04:37:25 pm
Is it always the same crash?

There's a known issue with this mission that may cause intermittent crashes at the end of it.
However, your log shows an issue somewhere in the sound handling code, I can't say I have ever seen that before.

Please try to redownload the BP 3.6.10 pack, see if it fixes the issue.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: General Battuta on January 12, 2010, 04:40:53 pm
Yeah, redownload the campaign, see if it fixes itself. You can pick up right where you left off assuming you don't make a new pilot.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: The E on January 12, 2010, 05:37:41 pm
Yeah, I'd recommend making a new pilot as well. Could be pilot file corruption.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: General Battuta on January 12, 2010, 05:51:48 pm
Well then you'll lose your campaign progress and have to do it all over, so leave that as a last resort.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: ShihiZu on January 12, 2010, 06:31:33 pm
The bug itself which I'm getting when running in debug-mode is not fixed itself, but I could finish the mission. Thanks!
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: General Battuta on January 12, 2010, 06:42:36 pm
Okay, awesome. Glad to hear you beat it, it's a tough mission!

Are you enjoying the campaign?
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: ShihiZu on January 13, 2010, 06:53:01 am
I started yesterday afternoon and played the whole campaign. I'm enjoying it very much. I look forward to WiH.  :)
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Aardwolf on January 14, 2010, 08:14:26 pm
Damn beam haze...

I was all the way to the end, and got killed by the beam haze of the Ravana's mains, while sitting BEHIND them.

Edit: Woot! I beat it, taking a myrmidon for myself and my wing... Prom+Balor/Hornet+Trebuchet+Trebuchet for myself. And I enabled Fury's custom AI tables so that my wingmen would actually be able to keep up with me using ETS/Afterburners to rush up and take out the Abel's beams, so they could defend me from Kali wing's inevitable retaliation...
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Scotty on January 17, 2010, 05:21:28 pm
I swear, the Myrmidon could have been tailor made for Blue Planet.  The Balor is just teh awesomez with it.  Trebs help too.

(Does the Myrm ever get to mount trebs in retail?)
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: eliex on January 17, 2010, 06:08:25 pm
(Does the Myrm ever get to mount trebs in retail?)

Yep, but not in the spammable amounts required in the last couple of missions in FS2 retail.  :P
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on January 18, 2010, 06:08:13 am
I wouldn't consider 26 Trebuchets (on a Mara) as being "spammable", you know. Even on an Ares, I run out of Trebs all the time. :p
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Dilmah G on January 18, 2010, 06:11:35 am
You have yet to learn the art of discipline.
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: PeterX on April 26, 2010, 10:23:17 am
H(a)i
My ship was a kulas carriing maxims and 6 Trebs,Alpha took down the cruisers and Beta the fighters.
Search the cruiser´s beams and order destroy this subsystem and they´ll destroy all beams on it.
Specially my work is it to take down bombers and the Beams of the Ravana. I can shoot as i see the Ravana  :nod:
Peter
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: Firartix on April 26, 2010, 11:33:08 am
Here's a nice tip to skip all sort of missions without using cheating and stuff, by the way:
 - Switch difficulty to insane
 - Set time compression to 64x
 - Click 4 times on "Restart the mission"
 - Click on "Advance to the next mission" :°

It's really handy on buggued missions too (i recall one in Sync, one in StL...)


... And, was the problems with trebuchet from the .10 version ?
I hope it's solved... Because like i said before, i couldn't hit the turrets properly without coming close enough :( (or they would get to half HP because of the Treb's shockwave)
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: -Norbert- on April 26, 2010, 12:04:48 pm
The last two times I played it, my Trebs didn't have any problems (that is in the 3.6.12 version with all enabled mods, in case it matters).
Title: Re: Knossos Mission
Post by: General Battuta on April 26, 2010, 12:07:21 pm
It's fixed in 3.6.12.