Hard Light Productions Forums
Modding, Mission Design, and Coding => The Modding Workshop => Topic started by: Setekh on January 25, 2001, 02:19:00 am
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This mod idea was inspired by a Stargate episode. (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/smile.gif)
A model, with 3 or 4 separate fighters: they are all subsystems of one 'ship'. All the fighters receive the same commands, so they fly in a fixed wing formation. So the player, or an AI pilot, can control effectively four figthers at once - one can be destroyed and the others will continue to fly, as they are subsystems of the ship.
It would be effective story-wise as a resort used by the NTF when pilots were rare, or something along those lines. (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/smile.gif)
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Could we do that for the FS engine?
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Yes we can (I'm 90% sure) - if we can get separate models within the one ship model, everything else will work - we can simply have shield meshes over each individual 'fighter', each fighter will have gunpoints and thrusters etc. and each will be a subsystem of the drone fighter wing.
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MAKE IT OUT OF ONE SUBOBJECT or else
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They can be handled the same way that turrets are - as individual subsystems.
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In that case: Wicked!
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- ICQ: 57179504
Webmaster: Hard Light Productions ("http://www.3dap.com/hlp/")
Staffer and P1mp: Ross128 ("http://ross128.telefragged.com") Sounds of Thunder ("http://ross128.telefragged.com/sot/index.shtml")
Fight the future!
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I catch you online once and you're not on ICQ! Can you say D'oh? (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/wink.gif)
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I dunno.....sounds cool, but I don't know how well it will work in practice, to tell you the truth.
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It might look terrible- but this site is for pioneering things... so lets give it a go! (anyone know modelling?)
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- ICQ: 57179504
Webmaster: Hard Light Productions ("http://www.3dap.com/hlp/")
Staffer and P1mp: Ross128 ("http://ross128.telefragged.com") Sounds of Thunder ("http://ross128.telefragged.com/sot/index.shtml")
Fight the future!
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I'm busy with other models at the moment.
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At least we'll know what doesn't work (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/wink.gif)
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Interesting idea Setekh.
How would they stay together, would it be some invisible 'thread' connecting the ships or can you actually have them part of the same 'ship' but not connected.
If they were connected then they couldn't really change formation, so when they turned it might look a bit funny and if one or two got destroyed it might look like the flying is unsyncronised.
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"All empires Fall. You just have to know where to push."
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Well, the Knossos model is not all connected. (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/smile.gif)
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There we go then.
I still can't shake the idea that it would look artificial though since the fighters wouldn't really stay in formation while dogfighting, they'd lose their advantage.
Maybe it would work better for something else, such as a brace or torpedoes or a drone ship with little ships stationed around it (aka Homeworld). If you did that it would look pretty cool and as it was a capship it wouldn't need to manouvere.
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"All empires Fall. You just have to know where to push."
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that sounds difficult. i always have problems with multible objects so i know i can't do it.
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"I like tomatoes because they are so red"-Daveb
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Well, we know it can be done - now we just have to figure out how. (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/smile.gif)
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hey Setekh, did you ever figure this out?
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I thought about that too, but it was for asteroids, to have more dense asteroid fields. By making them rotate, and move the subobject axis out of the submodel itself, they would move around.
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venom2506
Member of the Robotech mod for FS2 ("http://robotechlan.com/freespace2/")
and of Hidden Terror, the Shivan campaign ("http://shivancampaign.homestead.com/index.html")
and My own page ("http://www.geocities.com/venom250681/Venom2506.html")
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Now I don't know s**t from modelling in FS yet, but there is this special texture that says hidden...isn't there?
so, if you have each 'fighter' stuck on the end of a pole, all poles connecting at the other end, and texture the poles with the 'hidden' texture, wouldn't it make it appear as separate objects?
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Give me a few.
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Warlock
(http://deathangelsquadron.net/da.jpg)
DeathAngel Squadron ("http://deathangelsquadron.net")
CO
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To Fly Exotic Ships, Meet Exotic People, and Kill Them.
We may rise and fall, but in the end
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Ya mean like this?
(http://deathangelsquadron.net/hercwing.jpg)
Polycount= 2000
In MV32 textures look freaked out from most angles.
If someone REALLY wants this concept though it WILL work. Just need lower poly fighters.
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Warlock
(http://deathangelsquadron.net/da.jpg)
DeathAngel Squadron ("http://deathangelsquadron.net")
CO
Do or Do Not,..There Is No Spoon
Ghosts of the Past Forum ("http://pub10.ezboard.com/bdeathangelsquadronforum.html")
Ghosts of the Past WebSite ("http://deathangelsquadron.net/GhostsofthePast/ghostsofthepast.html")
To Fly Exotic Ships, Meet Exotic People, and Kill Them.
We may rise and fall, but in the end
We meet our fate together
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couldn't you avoid the poly count problem by making the other fighters subobjects of the first one? You wouldnt need a 'pole' to connect them and other ships could actually fly through the space between them. It would seem to me that the most realistic use of this would be a single fighter with three 'support drone' weapons platforms, much like you see in a lot of those top-down or sidescrolling shooters. You could put turrets and supplementary secondary banks on them so that they could shoot semi-autonomously while you were flying around.
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1: They are subobjects of the same fighter.
2: hiegharcy (I never could spell it) has nothing to do with polycount. Poly or faces are what makes up the model itself.
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Warlock
(http://deathangelsquadron.net/da.jpg)
DeathAngel Squadron ("http://deathangelsquadron.net")
CO
Do or Do Not,..There Is No Spoon
Ghosts of the Past Forum ("http://pub10.ezboard.com/bdeathangelsquadronforum.html")
Ghosts of the Past WebSite ("http://deathangelsquadron.net/GhostsofthePast/ghostsofthepast.html")
To Fly Exotic Ships, Meet Exotic People, and Kill Them.
We may rise and fall, but in the end
We meet our fate together
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Intriguing idea...but what would be the hull? Isn't that a required subsystem?
The problem is by destroying the hull, you could kill all four fighters at once, but where do you put the hull?
As for the fixed-wing thing, that could be overcome- just have the subsystem/ships move around in a few simple patterns. The solar panels on the Faustus, for example, rotate, and if you put the axis of rotation below the bottom HerII, it would rotate around it. If the whole object was moving forward, it would look like a spiral motion.
Also, how do you decide how the system aims? The gunpoints would all be at radically different positions and possibly moving, so which ship or what point does the AI use as it's boresight crosshair?
This could be fun. (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/biggrin.gif)
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Sushi- the OTHER white meat!
Accelerate your game-Velocity Mod ("http://sushicw.homestead.com/files/freespace/velocity.htm")
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OK, some things to point out: You don't need the models to touch each others, no need to link them in any way. Make the hercs rotate would be weird, and gunpoints can't rotate. If you want gunpoints that follow the rotating subobjects, you will have to make them as turrets , and give them no ROT. That definitively can't work with regular fighters, it would look too weird. But the shooter weapon platforms (like in Xenon) should be great and work perfectly (you'll have top make them as turrets anyway).
Warlock, hem... could you make what you did for those hercs2 with the asteroid models? That would be great (the pb is that with this big poly increment, you should make the LODs, that's a lot of work I'm afraid...). I would definitively use it.
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You guys have a nack formaking something WAY the hell more trouble than it should be (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/tongue.gif)
1: If all objects are vaped then the wing is dead.
2: If this were for a player,..and the player section is killed,...who cares if the other three "should" live? You're dead mission over (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/tongue.gif)
3: Those hercs were not connected by any object. It's called glue (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/tongue.gif)
4: Rocks...np,..low poly count.
5: Why would the guns points be so different? Set the damn things up where the hercs (or whatevers) guns are ;p
6: Pull the trigger and BANG all guns point selected fire for ALL fighters in the wing.
Remember Set got this from watching Stargate,..think about how those wings flew guys,..as if they were linked. Imagine the Blue Angels,..if they spin as a whole they spin as a whole.
The point of making this? I've got NO idea. It's not a good tactic to maintain a tight formation when there are other enemy fighters/bombers engaging you,..opening scenw of FS2,..they missed two medusas and nailed the third. A tight formation draws alot of fire but increases the change that ONE of them might be hit. Break and attack baby.
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Warlock
(http://deathangelsquadron.net/da.jpg)
DeathAngel Squadron ("http://deathangelsquadron.net")
CO
Do or Do Not,..There Is No Spoon
Ghosts of the Past Forum ("http://pub10.ezboard.com/bdeathangelsquadronforum.html")
Ghosts of the Past WebSite ("http://deathangelsquadron.net/GhostsofthePast/ghostsofthepast.html")
To Fly Exotic Ships, Meet Exotic People, and Kill Them.
We may rise and fall, but in the end
We meet our fate together
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It's not a good tactic to maintain a tight formation when there are other enemy fighters/bombers engaging you,..opening scenw of FS2,..they missed two medusas and nailed the third. A tight formation draws alot of fire but increases the change that ONE of them might be hit. Break and attack baby.
It's standard tactic for bomber wings to stay in close formation for their attack runs, because this way all rear guns/ gun turrets can open fire on attacking fighters. Of course you are right, the chance of one being hit is higher, but also the chance of the attacker being hit before it can come back for the next attack run.
I used this tactic once in 1942-Pacific Air War, and the first Zero to show up shot down my entire bomber wing. Since then I always did a break out maneuver when the interceptors showed up, and left formation for a lonely low altitude bombing and strafing run that did ten times more damage then all other bombers at their dive-bombing run.
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You guys are strange...