Hard Light Productions Forums

Hosted Projects - Standalone => Fate of the Galaxy => Topic started by: rsaxvc on April 04, 2010, 03:45:30 pm

Title: Steam?
Post by: rsaxvc on April 04, 2010, 03:45:30 pm
Has anyone looked at SteamWorks (http://"http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steam_(content_delivery)#Steamworks")? Apparently, you can set up free games in steam.

There's also a neat tool called Steam Cloud, that lets you store savegames/screenshots and other user-related things online. This way, just log into steam and you get your profile.

Here's the API (http://"https://partner.steamgames.com/documentation/api")
Title: Re: Steam?
Post by: The E on April 04, 2010, 04:35:26 pm
Actually, no.

For one, SteamWorks licenses are only granted at Valve's discretion, or with an Unreal Engine 3 license.
Second, I do have my doubts if a potentially copyright-infringing mod like this one is considered eligible for this.
Title: Re: Steam?
Post by: TopAce on April 04, 2010, 05:29:53 pm
Not if I were authoritative on the subject matter, but people complain a lot about Steam, so I don't expect we'll be using it.
Title: Re: Steam?
Post by: chief1983 on April 04, 2010, 05:39:11 pm
I complain about it less than I used to.  I get what they had to do, and in certain situations I'll use it.  But I still would prefer an DRM-free hard copy of a game.  Just can't seem to get that any more.
Title: Re: Steam?
Post by: Titan on April 04, 2010, 06:01:26 pm
I'd prefer not to have to get into steam to play this. This mod is the whole reason I got into this community, though I'm less of a SW nut now.
Title: Re: Steam?
Post by: rsaxvc on April 04, 2010, 11:47:30 pm
We could have a standalone kit too.

I recently got a new desktop and had space to install windows. I, for one, like Steam. I understand they may not take our game, but the idea of a system that manages gamefiles is great for the average user. Kinda stinks for developers / people making mods, but it makes it much easier to push out update, new maps, and make sure everyone has the same files. Also, free advertising.

You can still register discs with it too, if you like.
Title: Re: Steam?
Post by: Angelus on April 05, 2010, 11:13:30 am
Steam??? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. No. Seriously.

In all seriousness, i'm not sure what the team would do, even if there wasn't this copyright thing.
But i never ever gonna touch anything Steam related, not even with a ten foot pole.
What would be the benefits? The only thing i can think of is - NONE. AT. ALL.
Title: Re: Steam?
Post by: LordMelvin on April 05, 2010, 11:25:44 am
I think this website says it best. (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/NoJustNo)
Title: Re: Steam?
Post by: chief1983 on April 05, 2010, 02:23:27 pm
You gotta admit, it has a lot of benefits, and it doesn't have to include DRM if we don't want it to.  But the system we're currently moving towards is likely going to resemble Steam's functionality.
Title: Re: Steam?
Post by: Angelus on April 05, 2010, 03:08:44 pm
You gotta admit, it has a lot of benefits, and it doesn't have to include DRM if we don't want it to.  But the system we're currently moving towards is likely going to resemble Steam's functionality.

Wait. This sounds like:

No place where the files are hosted ( you know, like any Mod team does it ), where everyone can download them.
And if the team decides to make updates, i can't choose if i want them or not.
Just because the game forces me to download updates everytime, regardless if i want them or not.  [/oh yeah, sounds like fun]


Seriously though, what is Steams functionality, what are the benefits of having it??
Does this apply only to the FotG team ( a team internal decision ) or is it a SCP thing in General?

Title: Re: Steam?
Post by: headdie on April 05, 2010, 03:18:07 pm
it is a marketing and retail tool for valve, ohh and if you run single or early dual core processors current incarnations max out your processor at random intervals untill you exit out the processor and in the case of my single core athlon 64 makes the the system stutter even windows works iffy
Title: Re: Steam?
Post by: Angelus on April 05, 2010, 03:37:59 pm
My questions have partially answered on IRC.

I still have mixed feelings about the new System. 
Title: Re: Steam?
Post by: Snail on April 05, 2010, 04:59:17 pm
wat
Title: Re: Steam?
Post by: Thaeris on April 05, 2010, 05:45:42 pm
I say no to Steam as it blows large chunks out of you-know-where.

You should say no as well.  :yes:
Title: Re: Steam?
Post by: chief1983 on April 05, 2010, 06:01:04 pm
Yeah I doubt we'd actually use Steam.  It'd be more like Impulse, which is sort of like Steam done right.  But no one knows what that is.  It's still going to be proprietary though.
Title: Re: Steam?
Post by: SpardaSon21 on April 05, 2010, 08:50:37 pm
more like Impulse, which is sort of like Steam done right
Win.  Go Impulse!
Title: Re: Steam?
Post by: Iss Mneur on April 05, 2010, 09:22:11 pm
more like Impulse, which is sort of like Steam done right
Win.  Go Impulse!

Don't all of these platforms require that you charge for whatever you are offering on them?
Title: Re: Steam?
Post by: SpardaSon21 on April 06, 2010, 12:55:07 am
No.
Title: Re: Steam?
Post by: chief1983 on April 06, 2010, 09:38:59 am
Why on earth would they require that?  And like I said, we're not going to actually use one of those, but we're getting some ideas from them, and tweaking it to work best for the community and with the way things are already set up where necessary.
Title: Re: Steam?
Post by: Iss Mneur on April 06, 2010, 11:51:30 am
Why on earth would they require that?  And like I said, we're not going to actually use one of those, but we're getting some ideas from them, and tweaking it to work best for the community and with the way things are already set up where necessary.

Because they are a for profit enterprise?

Anyway, it seems I missed where the topic shifted to "the getting some ideas from them".

That being said, a project to bring a Steam or Impulse like system to FreeSpace is already in the works in the form of wxLauncher 2.0.  I should be posting the initial request for input within a week.
Title: Re: Steam?
Post by: Angelus on April 06, 2010, 12:13:56 pm
While it is possible to refer to that new Installer/ Launcher/ Updater as "something like Steam", i'd like suggest to not do that.
Whenever i hear or read Steam, i get cold shivers running down my spine and automatically engage RAGE mode.
And since it seems i'm not the only one, i suggest we refer to it as N.I.L.S. or FSNils ( New Installer and Launcher System ).
Much less confusing and no need to mention Steam ever again.  :P
Title: Re: Steam?
Post by: LordMelvin on April 06, 2010, 01:00:48 pm
... i suggest we refer to it as N.I.L.S. or FSNils ( New Installer and Launcher System ).

how about f-soil - F ree S pace O pen I nstaller & L auncher 
Title: Re: Steam?
Post by: TopAce on April 06, 2010, 01:32:43 pm
That's a very creative name, given that S-foil is a Star Wars term. :yes:
Title: Re: Steam?
Post by: Angelus on April 06, 2010, 01:40:05 pm
Too Late, NILS it is. :P
Title: Re: Steam?
Post by: The E on April 06, 2010, 01:42:12 pm
Too soon, no firm decision has been made yet  :p
Title: Re: Steam?
Post by: Angelus on April 06, 2010, 01:46:06 pm
Damn, you blew it. :P
Title: Re: Steam?
Post by: LordMelvin on April 06, 2010, 02:04:02 pm
That's a very creative name, given that S-foil is a Star Wars term. :yes:

Hey, you're right! I probably should have thought of that for myself before I suggested it so as to get my capitalization right.

Edit to add: Not being sarcastic here, I actually didn't realize that.
Title: Re: Steam?
Post by: chief1983 on April 06, 2010, 02:04:56 pm
To be honest, I'm sorry you hate Steam so much, but I find that anyone who just automatically shoots it down hasn't taken the time to fully understand the benefits of the system.  I'm not going to filter myself just for those people.  Hate it or not, it's the most recognized example of anything close to what we're doing.
Title: Re: Steam?
Post by: General Battuta on April 06, 2010, 04:30:55 pm
Steam is awesome. It's one of the best things to happen to PC gaming in a while and one of the reasons that PCs haven't lost even more ground to consoles.

I can't count how many games, new and classic alike, that I've been able to grab due to awesome Steam sales. And you can get stuff on there, like X-COM, that you'd never be able to find at retail.

A winner in my book, and not a bad thing to be associated with.

Please don't give this system some god-awful acronym like NILS or F-SOIL. That's horrifying.
Title: Re: Steam?
Post by: The E on April 06, 2010, 04:33:14 pm
Yep. Let's just call it the Launcher and be done with it (as this whole installer is planned to be part of the new, completely redone and multiplatformized Launcher by IssMneur and kkmic).
Title: Re: Steam?
Post by: rsaxvc on April 07, 2010, 10:11:21 pm
This new launcher sounds awesome. I'd be willing to help out.

I'm just not a fan of stand-alone games, with:
un-synchronized updates,
having to run a game just to find out there's nobody up for a match,
giant updates ( pk3 files are a good example )

and Steam takes care of those for me, but I bet we can do better, or at least not use 40 threads while running in the background.
Title: Re: Steam?
Post by: brandx0 on April 08, 2010, 07:53:08 pm
I figured I'd chime in on the idea of putting us up on Steam:

(http://www.imglols.com/wp-content/main/2009_04/picard-points-you-to-the-door.jpg)
Title: Re: Steam?
Post by: Angelus on April 08, 2010, 07:59:07 pm
I figured I'd chime in on the idea of putting us up on Steam:

(http://www.imglols.com/wp-content/main/2009_04/picard-points-you-to-the-door.jpg)

 :lol: :yes:
Title: Re: Steam?
Post by: Thaeris on April 08, 2010, 08:45:55 pm
Brand again demonstrates why he is my hero!

 :nod: :yes:
Title: Re: Steam?
Post by: Getter Robo G on April 27, 2010, 02:20:45 am
I would like to comment...

I resisted any steam game for years. But then I wanted to play Supcom2...

Wanted to to try Demo first, But you need steam to DL it, WTF?

Had some extra cash and had to decide C&C4 or Supcom2... Gave C&C4 the finger and blew $50.00 on Supcom2.

Got home and went to install it, first thing it does is install STEAM...

Look, I get that fact that you should get online at least once to REGISTER a game, but for someone like me who occasionally loses access to the internet cause of finances (I won't get into it but for example I once went without cable TV for 7 years cause Dail up internet was MORE IMPORTANT).

So now you have basically a control program demanding to be run before the game launches that forces you to be online.

I just turned off the net for a sec to run Supcom2, first thing it does is update steam and unless you're online that's where the process stops.


Following blacked out for the "sensitive" types.

Spoiler:

If your game has a single-player mode and is not categorized as an MMO or a hybrid of one you have no right to force customers who paid you damn money to connect to anyone or anything just to play your game after they registered their legal copy.

All bull**** aside, yes I know I only own the physical disk and you developers "Own" the content on it.  That's fine and should be like that.

But no one has the right to explicitly determine where or when an individual can access said content.

IF you buy MMO cards for time access that's ONE thing. That is an additional fee that some people save up for to treat themselves or others choose not to participate at all.

I used to be an EverQuest I player, but that $5.00 extra jump killed my finances back then so I had to give it up.

There are a few reasons I play AO occasionally. IT's FREE, It's fun, and as long as the servers are up it's game time. The paid functionality is optional for more content, not basic content, which is much more vast than any other "MMO" out there with a similar arraignment.

According to Funcom's C.E.O., the "Froob" marketing campaign is a success and has kept Funcom in the black as far as AO section is concerned. Good for them.

Now back to Steam.

I paid my money and entered my DRM code, that disk only works for me if you have one time registration on installation (same info even if I use another comp after an upgrade or visiting long term somewhere).

Having a user needlessly jump through an EXTRA hoop just to enjoy the software they bothered to pay for is just another feather in the pirate camp.

If some guy on the street had a steam cracked game for $25.00, (you know like the guy who comes around your workplace and has speakers or DVD's and what not, for sale every other month), I would seriously consider it for a moment.


Pros: No steam

Cons: No, or limited-lan, multiplay. If disk is damaged or causes some physical error can't return it to "store". You're hurting the developer.

Addition new Pro: You're hurting the developers.  :drevil:
[let's just say a Pirate Emoticon for conversations here would be an interesting option...]

Rant ended.


Oh I just supported Atari and Bioware by buying the Witcher and DragonAge.


And BTW I just looked on the back of my Supcom2 box, VALVE is not listed on it! Unless you KNEW GPG is Valve's (censored), a customer would unknowing get saddled with steam and would be forced to keep it in this day and age of software. They could only return it for another disk of the same game if it were damaged.

"Cause of Pirates". So now every customer is a pirate the moment you buy a game, nice...

Thus the importance of trying demos before you buy any software. A costly lesson to learn each and every time you fail to do so. Grilling your local games merchant is mandatory now "Do I need steam to play this f-ing game? yes? Bye..."

I broke my boycott of Valve/steam this one time, never again...
Title: Re: Steam?
Post by: chief1983 on April 27, 2010, 10:03:02 am
I believe Steam still has a functioning offline mode, you register the game through steam, set it up for offline play, and you shouldn't need to be online to play single player again.  Trust me, it's orders of magnitude less offensive than Ubisoft's new DRM that requires you to be online the ENTIRE TIME you're playing, and if you disconnect for more than 30 seconds THE GAME QUITS.
Title: Re: Steam?
Post by: General Battuta on April 27, 2010, 10:05:59 am
Steam is awesome, and I wish every PC game used it.

yeah bring it mofos
Title: Re: Steam?
Post by: Angelus on April 27, 2010, 11:46:42 am
Steam is awesome, and I wish every PC game used it.

yeah bring it mofos

The judgement of this youngling, clouded by the darkside it is.
Confused by the teachings of the mighty gaming industry he has become, a threat he is, yes.
Obrand-X Kenobi, to deal with him he has. :P
Title: Re: Steam?
Post by: The E on April 27, 2010, 11:54:43 am
Oh, do shut up.

Also, can this thread please be closed? It started at a low level and has only gone further down the drain already.
Title: Re: Steam?
Post by: Jeff Vader on April 27, 2010, 11:59:27 am
(http://images.cheezburger.com/completestore/2010/4/19/129161956729992540.gif)
Title: Re: Steam?
Post by: chief1983 on April 27, 2010, 02:45:35 pm
In after lock

Yeah that's right I'm the mod around these parts.  Really was global mod intervention necessary here?  No one's feelings are getting hurt.  No FotG staff have complained about this thread, and it's our board.  The_E isn't on FotG.