Hard Light Productions Forums
General FreeSpace => FreeSpace Discussion => Topic started by: Narwhal on May 14, 2010, 09:46:05 am
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... the game never existed, you had this great idea in dream of a Space Shooter in which a mysterious race intervenes in a conflict between the Terrans and another race... you get the idea.
What would you make different ? In term both of background / history and campaign/battle design.
My opinion :
In term of background / history
- I would make nodepoints tougher nuts to crack, but with lighter ships able to jump in or out further away from jump points to justify "skirmishes" in systems.
- I would make the Taranis a Destroyer
- Actually, I would call cruiser "cruiser", but "destroyer" carriers, and war capships smaller than cruisers "destroyers".
In term of campaign design
- More point defense for capships. The level of anti-fighter defenses we see in PI - this I like. It feels more realistic.
- No "waves" of ships, even Shivans. Maybe one first wave to scout, but then brute forces immediately. I really resent the "wave" systems (although I understand it was necessarily due to hardware capacities in 1999)
- Shivans ships more specialised : for instance the Scorpion is supposedly a scout IIRC, but really we only see it used just as a fighter. I would have liked to see it used more as a scout - only a couple of them patrolling, and jumping out when they see something. As it is now, when I play, there is only three types of Shivans "fighters" : Dragons (shoot with missile or send wingmen), Manticores (engage) and "Targets" (everything else, supposedly they are "assault" or "heavy" fighter", I don't really make the difference anyway).
What are the other ideas flying around ?
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You know you can do almost all of those right now, with the FSO mod¡fications anything can be done ;7
My response would be much like yours, but I would add a freedom of movement in an universe, not in a preset scenary. (mission boundaries)
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Put it on a better engine, of course. ;)
As far as gameplay changes go... well, as Rodo pointed out, those can already be done. And the ones that I want but can't be done, I code in. ;7
Frankly, I'm surprised there haven't been more "FS1/2 re-imagined" campaigns than there are.
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Probably because there are a lot of people that would immediately jump in against everything that remotely look non-canonical.
What if was interesting, but Shivans with beams in the GW ? Meh.
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Or maybe because making your own version of an universe is pretty damn difficult.
Particularly because if you want to go against FS main story you'll have to at least reach as much content and length (in regards of the campaign) as the originals did.
I bet everyone round here has thought of a side story to the main FS one... at least one, I know I did... and still do.
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I'd add a bit more realistic physics, which would allow ships to 'slide' while turning without having them accelerate to ludicrous speed (a side effect of high damp values in the .tbl). Thrusters on all 3 axis for all factions would also be nice.
I'd also double the velocities reached by ships, as well as weapon ranges.
I'd make sure that when 2 capships duke it out, they'd kill each other faster in FS 1 to give the feel of them actually having firepower, and slightly slower in FS 2 to allow players to watch 3-4 minute shootouts rather than nearly instant pwnage.
And meeting only 2 alien species just isn't enough, especially for FS 2.
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I'd add a bit more realistic physics, which would allow ships to 'slide' while turning without having them accelerate to ludicrous speed (a side effect of high damp values in the .tbl).
$Use Newtonian Dampening: YES
Solved.
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I say we use the iNovae engine when it's released...
;7
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I'd also double the velocities reached by ships, as well as weapon ranges.
There's a mod that does just that, along with optimized main campaign.
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And meeting only 2 alien species just isn't enough, especially for FS 2.[/color]
This I can't agree with. More is not better. I'd prefer to see more time taken to explore the existing species.
We haven't run out of things to say about humanity yet. Vasudans and Shivans should get the same depth.
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I aways thought that in FS1 we should have started out with weaker 'prototype' shields, then had them become full power later in the campaign. I kind of figured that was part of the justification for the Valkyrie's flimsy shields, seeing as most people, by default, would probably want to pick the brand-new Valkyrie to fly in the beginning, over the Apollo(and then assuming everyone would want to transition to the Ulysses and/or Herc by the end).
Of course, I'm sure we'd all replace ST with ST:R.
Were this topic here a month or so ago, I'd probably had things a little more fresh on my mind.
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I wouldn't change anything.
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I would add more cowbell.
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At the very least, some of the logical, hinted-at stuff from the FSRef Bible could be made more prominent/included. Really, just giving Volition all the time they needed, instead of having to hurry up and meet x deadline, could work. :D
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FS2 was released ahead of schedule and deadlines, IIRC.
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FS2 was released ahead of schedule and deadlines, IIRC.
Given certain things, like the unused path for the Colossus in High Noon, I don't think everything was done yet, per se. The tech room description for the Horus, and a Command Brief introducing the Perseus both claim each are the fastest fighters in the GTVA. Again, my memory fails at the moment, but I'm sure there were some more nits that could stand to have been run by a fact checker.
Also, if :v: knew there would be no FS3 soon following, perhaps there would have been a tiny bit more info given regarding everyone's motives(YMMV as to whether that would necessarily be a good thing, of course).
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At the very least, some of the logical, hinted-at stuff from the FSRef Bible could be made more prominent/included. Really, just giving Volition all the time they needed, instead of having to hurry up and meet x deadline, could work. :D
Well, the deadline was set by them, and they decided to meet it by any means necessary. There's nothing we could do.
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i think the sense of scale is entirely screwy in the FS verse. i really don't know how you'd go about fixing it though. smaller craft perhaps. and it always bugged me that everything putzes along at no more than 100 m/s through SPACE.
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i think the sense of scale is entirely screwy in the FS verse. i really don't know how you'd go about fixing it though. smaller craft perhaps. and it always bugged me that everything putzes along at no more than 100 m/s through SPACE.
True, I've always hated the fact that capital ships are either too small or fighters are too big, there's no way an Orion can fit as much fighters inside as it should.
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I would make it an MMORPG.
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I would make it an MMORPG.
Burn the heretic!
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LOL? You don't like MMORPGs? I'm thinking making it EvE in twitch based.
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What, a twitch-based accountancy game?
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:wtf:
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Think Freelancer. Which I'm actually posting in both boards at the moment now actually. Here and on discovery.
Anyway, think freelancer. Throw in the zods and shivians (why are vasudians called zods?) and conquerable bases. Eve's manufacturing system. Viola.
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Strategy-based game.
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geomod!
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Strategy-based game.
There's an RTS in the works, but it looks like it'll end up like that pile of unfinished projects HLP has...
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FS1:
- Make the Lucifer 5,000 meters instead of 2,777
- Of course, make the Lucy flux cannon more realistic-looking
- Be able to fly capital ships (can be done with FSO though)
- Add a Shivan campaign! MWAHAHAHAHA! :drevil:
FS2:
- Since the Lucy is now 5 clicks, make the Colly 8 clicks
- Enough "all details concerning this is highly classified" for goodness' sakes, LET US NOW MORE OF YOUR F***ING UNIVERSE!" :P
- Add a Shivan campaign! (again)
- Capital ship flying (again)
Actually, this thread can also be called "what improvements would you suggest to make FreeSpace more your choice" I thought this thread meant "how are you going to create FreeSpace singlehandedly" type.
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FS1;
Fix multi problems.
Slightly decrease light-blob turret accuracy or projectile speed but increase rate of fire substantially,
Make missiles more accurate.
Change URSA primary banks slightly so that the side bank is a little more tucked in.
FS2;
Remove the massive damage tag from the entire game.
Make EMPs have a more significant effect on the player, and the AI.
Make Lamprey more effective on AI.
Make the Circe not redundant(lower energy usage slightly, increase shield damage slightly).
Make Piranha less useless.
Make Infyrno less useless.
Normalise all fighter missile alignments and change the gunports on the Seraphim to be less useless.
Make the colossus not **** (probably, give it beam strength roughly equal to the Sath's at all times, and significantly reinforce both the Colly and Sath's hulls).
Make the SoC arcs a little more substantial (more missions, more action).
Lengthen the entire game by another arc of stories leading up to the Knossos "closure."
Have an additional ending video showing the start of exploration of the stellar exhaust of the super nova at capella and the beginning of construction of the GTVA Knossos at Delta Serpentis.
Bump up the robustness of the network code (not that, I personally find it that bad).
Expand the multiplayer to incorporate more players.
And certainly I wouldn't allow anyone to touch the physics, not ever, crazy 'realism(rofl@realism of what people are expecting pilots to be capable of with their 'realistic physics')' people can burn in hell :<
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FS1
All of the Above
Restore the missing mission and Anti-Zod sentiments from the Alpha
Fix some bugged ship arrival cues- that Cruiser from Clash of the Titans for instance
Fix the slight plot error regarding A-1's "investigation of Lucifer in Antares" that never happened - It was the Eva you went after
More of the Lucifer dishing out death - With those missing cutscenes, it doesnt come across big a threat as its supposed to for me - To the Allies It's meant to be what the Master Chief is to the Covanent. ... that give me PLOT BUNNY! whole new theory on the shivans/Ancients
Completly Overhaul the Battle of Deneb - I once posted my vision of it
Bad ending cutscene - If Vasudan Admiral ever finishes his one we'll get this
Ribos Cutscene - wish Icey Brian would finish this
More about Lt MacCarthy
FS2
All of the above things
restore the collosus's final battle
Fix slight errors - Like briefing says a ship is one class, in mission it's a different one and ship arrival Cues
Make Clash of the Titans II even more epic by having a Shivan
Lvl Omega classified info given when you reach Rank Admiral - ie you get details on what the comms nodes are
Give the storyline dates like FS1 did
Give the Shivans their FSO weapons
Restore the cut weapons
You know, I think i once posted something like this a while back
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Terran_emperor did you actually play FS1 originally (before SCP started up)?
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Yes i actually own the original game+Slient Threat. The Pre-SCP Lucy didn't scare me...The SCP one actually has teeth but there isnt enough of it to trully be terrifying. Hell I saw more of the Shark from Jaws than the Lucy. We need the Ribos Cutscene, the Bad-Ending and a massively expanded Battle of Deneb.
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Write more believable fluff. Most of it is frankly embarassing.
Make the missions less painfully scripted.
Modify weapons so they are balanced without abandoning common sense (as it is: imagine if someone built Maxim-toting gunships or dumbfire bombs)
Add some variety where needed. Why are GTVA and Shivans using the same warheads?
Slightly improve most FS2 special-purpose weaponry... they generally do to little/take up too much power compared to pure damage dealers
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For both FS1 and FS2 and in order of importance!
1. Balance weapon load-outs better. Some of the special weapons are just useless and others are borderline useless.
2. Make FS2 ships tougher, stronger, and/or faster to establish an actual 20 years gap in technology. Ie. The Hecate should actually fit its tech room description.
3. Fix the Ancient's lore so they're more believable.
4. Give the Shivans FS2 weaponry in FS1. Yes, it might be ridiculous but that can be compensated for by having the GTA/PVN develop similar technologies. It's better than the Shivans suddenly showing up with the new stuff.
5. I want to see some old Apollo fighters, Athena fighter-bombers, and Valkyrie fighters during the early stages of FS2. I find it odd that there are no Valkyries flying in the fleet when the Perseus was just recently developed during the NTF campaign to replace the Valkyrie.
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Apollos and Athenas probably couldn't mount the Alliance's newer weaponry, though.
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but the herc and uly can?
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I'd introduce more realism and newtonian flight model.
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I'd introduce more realism and newtonian flight model.
uuuuuuuuurgh :(
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I'd introduce more realism and newtonian flight model.
It's a good thing you are not remaking freespace from scratch :p
2. Make FS2 ships tougher, stronger, and/or faster to establish an actual 20 years gap in technology. Ie. The Hecate should actually fit its tech room description
I agree with this one. Look at the Seth and the Herc II for example. The Seth is how many years old by the time of FS2? The Herc II only outperforms it slightely
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I'd introduce more realism and newtonian flight model.
uuuuuuuuurgh :(
I don't object to realism if it means ships are slightly faster, but TBH, I think :v: got the balance quite well with what they've got at the moment. They wanted it to play a bit like a WWII dogfight with all the good bits, and I can't say they missed the mark. :)
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I would like to be able to change weapons and / or fighter during a mission. For example in carriers.
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2. Make FS2 ships tougher, stronger, and/or faster to establish an actual 20 years gap in technology. Ie. The Hecate should actually fit its tech room description
I agree with this one. Look at the Seth and the Herc II for example. The Seth is how many years old by the time of FS2? The Herc II only outperforms it slightely
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Well, I would claim there is a very low marginal utility of R&D on spacecraft quality. Most "big improvements" might have been found out and implemented in the craft. What is left might be only very marginal improvements, and you need to do a lots of research to find them.
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Fix the ugly line progression during explosions and have a more powerful explosion, but with more ships pieces left over.
Change the weapon effects so it actually looks like they are doing some damage and aren't just a blob of colour (like some of the new flak effects). Faster speeds of weapons may help with this.
Perhaps a FS2 intro style beam effect for the large ships, so it makes the beam look difficult to control. An increasing size of "fireball" as beam burns through ships.
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Reduce debris damage, goddamnit! :mod:
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Perhaps a FS2 intro style beam effect for the large ships, so it makes the beam look difficult to control. An increasing size of "fireball" as beam burns through ships.
That can be done.
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It would be an open world MMORPG working exactly like EvE, but with less caps and twitch based combat.
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It would be an open world MMORPG working exactly like EvE, but with less caps and twitch based combat.
Wouldn't that be a totally new game, and not really FreeSpace at all?
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And also not really good, either?
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It would be an open world MMORPG working exactly like EvE, but with less caps and twitch based combat.
Wouldn't that be a totally new game, and not really FreeSpace at all?
And also not really good, either?
Amen to all of that.
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Haven't we discussed this somewhere else already? :nervous:
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Hmm......... FS MMO..... screw eve though.
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Squadwar!
let's see... if I could remake FS... reasonable, organized and documented code so the SCP could spend less time fixing inane [v] bugs!
Also more dakka... This may have a lot to do with limitations of the time, but faster weapons and faster (not necessarily more maneuverable) ships (especially capships) can make FS incredibly fun. I've been fiddling with some tables- not necessarily a complete mod per se- and faster ships certainly make for better gameplay. The play area seems much smaller, and the range of weapons such as beams and trebuchets becomes very relevant to gameplay and mission timing.
Also, much more variance in weapons. Autoaim defined on a per-weapon basis- more interesting secondaries- more interesting flak! Flak at the moment is really pure dakka- rapid-fire weapons in general present some really interesting potential that is really not explored in FS.
Although it seems like BP is going to be improving on some of this, from what I've seen of the WiH videos. :drevil:
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Squadwar seconded!
Eh, I would have liked drifting myself. And faster movement.
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I forgot about SquadWar... :nervous:
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Also, I would make it so collision actually kills you if you have no shield (at a normal speed), or fairly damage you otherwise. Of course, I would ALSO improve the IA so that it does not collide every single time.
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Damage modeling on ships. That would be fun, but hard to do right...
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Damage modelling? Isn't that what Esarai was trying to do two months ago?
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Damage modelling? Isn't that what Esarai was trying to do two months ago?
yeah, and he made something that crashes FSO.