Hard Light Productions Forums
Off-Topic Discussion => General Discussion => Topic started by: Bobboau on July 21, 2010, 04:04:40 am
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oh, he abbreviated Japanese, this topic is doomed.
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Oh whatever. I certainly won't lock it if people don't get their panties in a wad. That being said, wtf Japan? Neat but wtf? Lol
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No racial epithets please, I'm in a household with internment camp veterans and if they see it on mah screen they'll flip out.
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Thank you, kind sir.
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Huh? Did somebody say 'japs' or something?
People offend too easily.
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Huh? Did somebody say 'japs' or something?
People offend too easily.
Tru dat, that's like getting offended for being called a "Brit" or a "Scot". Same thing, just a shortening of my nationality.
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Huh? Did somebody say 'japs' or something?
People offend too easily.
Tru dat, that's like getting offended for being called a "Brit" or a "Scot". Same thing, just a shortening of my nationality.
Seriously?
No racial epithets please, I'm in a household with internment camp veterans and if they see it on mah screen they'll flip out.
That is serious **** right there. Jap is a racial epithet with a bad history.
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Huh? Did somebody say 'japs' or something?
People offend too easily.
Tru dat, that's like getting offended for being called a "Brit" or a "Scot". Same thing, just a shortening of my nationality.
Seriously?
No racial epithets please, I'm in a household with internment camp veterans and if they see it on mah screen they'll flip out.
That is serious **** right there. Jap is a racial epithet with a bad history.
So has Scot, you know, started out as a racial epithet used by the English and all. You dirty scot bastard, etc etc.
It's also not offensive, it is literally just a shortening of the name. I'm sorry if for those people it has bad connotations, but they're not intended or even really present.
Edit:
Oh, and I am avoiding saying it, out of respect for your veterans, do the same, please. I just think that it's possibly the most stupid thing I've heard all day.
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Lets not get distracted people.
Lets focus on the fact the video's not up so........................
playnicenao :nod:
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Lets not get distracted people.
Lets focus on the fact the video's not up so........................
playnicenao :nod:
Alright, Alright, I'm done anyway, this can only spiral downwards into the depths of the internet hate machine.
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Huh? Did somebody say 'japs' or something?
People offend too easily.
Tru dat, that's like getting offended for being called a "Brit" or a "Scot". Same thing, just a shortening of my nationality.
Seriously?
No racial epithets please, I'm in a household with internment camp veterans and if they see it on mah screen they'll flip out.
That is serious **** right there. Jap is a racial epithet with a bad history.
So has Scot, you know, started out as a racial epithet used by the English and all. You dirty scot bastard, etc etc.
It's also not offensive, it is literally just a shortening of the name. I'm sorry if for those people it has bad connotations, but they're not intended or even really present.
Edit:
Oh, and I am avoiding saying it, out of respect for your veterans, do the same, please. I just think that it's possibly the most stupid thing I've heard all day.
I understand what you're saying, and I know it makes sense if taken outside of the cultural context, but, well...
...'negro' just means 'black'. I mean, it's only a color, right? It can't be offensive, can it?
Words are given meaning by their history and 'Jap' is a raw wound for people betrayed by their own country in a way that 'Scot' or 'Yank' isn't.
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Come on GB, lets drop teh subject. :yes:
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Come on GB, lets drop teh subject. :yes:
Feel free to split. It's an interesting topic and I don't think emotions are particularly high.
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Nah they aren't, can't help to compartmentalise though.
Zim Zalah Bim. It is done!
the origin topics pretty empty now though :nervous:
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Huh? Did somebody say 'japs' or something?
People offend too easily.
Tru dat, that's like getting offended for being called a "Brit" or a "Scot". Same thing, just a shortening of my nationality.
Seriously?
No racial epithets please, I'm in a household with internment camp veterans and if they see it on mah screen they'll flip out.
That is serious **** right there. Jap is a racial epithet with a bad history.
So has Scot, you know, started out as a racial epithet used by the English and all. You dirty scot bastard, etc etc.
It's also not offensive, it is literally just a shortening of the name. I'm sorry if for those people it has bad connotations, but they're not intended or even really present.
Edit:
Oh, and I am avoiding saying it, out of respect for your veterans, do the same, please. I just think that it's possibly the most stupid thing I've heard all day.
I understand what you're saying, and I know it makes sense if taken outside of the cultural context, but, well...
...'negro' just means 'black'. I mean, it's only a color, right? It can't be offensive, can it?
Words are given meaning by their history and 'Jap' is a raw wound for people betrayed by their own country in a way that 'Scot' or 'Yank' isn't.
It was also longer than 22.3 years ago. That means we can joke about it. :P
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it seems silly that something a child would come up with on his own can be considered hugely offensive.
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It was also longer than 22.3 years ago. That means we can joke about it. :P
yes but they might launch a sneak attack on my naval assets while i'm asleep
(But seriously, these people were alive through it, at least wait for them to die.)
it seems silly that something a child would come up with on his own can be considered hugely offensive.
Once as a four-year-old I was attempting to cling to my mother's leg in a pool and I stumbled upon the nonsense word 'nggr!'
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If all it takes to make your naval assets vulnerable is sleep, I have no sympathy for you.
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Hmmm, I wonder if there is some kind of cultural difference there. I know guys (am related to, in fact) who were at Dunkirk and whom were Nazi POWs, none of them get the blind shivers when someone says 'Jerries' or 'Nazis'
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Hmmm, I wonder if there is some kind of cultural difference there. I know guys (am related to, in fact) who were at Dunkirk and whom were Nazi POWs, none of them get the blind shivers when someone says 'Jerries' or 'Nazis'
I'm not talking about people who were in Japanese internment camps.
I'm talking about Japanese-American citizens who were dragged from their homes and herded into American concentration camps.
They don't take kindly to 'jap'.
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You were rather ambiguous on that point Battuta, actually gave the impression that I gleaned.
Well, your history, not mine.
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You were rather ambiguous on that point Battuta, actually gave the impression that I gleaned.
Well, your history, not mine.
It's not mine either. I have no blood relation to these people. But I do respect that my beliefs about what's offensive or frightening aren't the only beliefs in the world, and that I need to be considerate of that.
I'd hesitate before telling an internment camp survivor that their feelings are 'the stupidest thing I've heard all day', is all. I'm happy to make Holocaust jokes (for better or worse) but I probably wouldn't do it to an Auschwitz survivor's face. And hell maybe I should reconsider that general freedom too.
I don't know, I can see both sides but I just feel like my authority to determine what's cool and what's not is much less than the authority of people who were actually part of the events that defined the words.
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it seems silly that something a child would come up with on his own can be considered hugely offensive.
Once as a four-year-old I was attempting to cling to my mother's leg in a pool and I stumbled upon the nonsense word 'nggr!'
But you didn't attach it to a black person, did you? We have Brit and Scot, so Jap seems like a logical term for a person from Japan. Kind of like Paki for Pakistani, when we call people from Afghanistan Afghanis instead of Afghanistanis.
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it seems silly that something a child would come up with on his own can be considered hugely offensive.
Once as a four-year-old I was attempting to cling to my mother's leg in a pool and I stumbled upon the nonsense word 'nggr!'
But you didn't attach it to a black person, did you? We have Brit and Scot, so Jap seems like a logical term for a person from Japan. Kind of like Paki for Pakistani, when we call people from Afghanistan Afghanis instead of Afghanistanis.
Didn't you get banned over this? :p Playing with fire if Kara stumbles in here.
See, I agree, they are reasonable contractions...until at some point they're weaponized and turned against the group in question. That's happened to 'Jap'. It was used in propaganda posters, broadcasts, military slang and common parlance to designate a slant-eyed, rice-eating hive of interchangeable and fanatical yellow-skinned supermen who wanted to conquer the world and sexually violate American women. That's what the term means, especially for people who lived through that era.
Whether you are a Japanese national today, or - worse - an American citizen who was treated as a traitor and a 'Jap' just because of your ancestry, you don't want to be that any more. You want to be a human being, not a monster.
Jap isn't just a contraction any longer. It was repurposed. You can't pretend that it's short for Japanese any more than you can claim that 'negro' or 'colored' are acceptable terms no matter how factually accurate they might be.
(And I'm gonna guess the same goes for Paki.)
The same thing could happen to Yank one day, and when that day comes it'll no longer be an acceptable term for Americans.
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Wasn't Yank originally a slur and then people got over it?
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Wasn't Yank originally a slur and then people got over it?
Probably so. For some people I imagine it's still a slur. The same process might happen to 'Jap' some day. You never know.
But I imagine that the people who 'get offended over it' do so because they believe it's used in ignorance, without full understanding of what the term still means to many.
Arthur C. Clarke once suggested that in the feature we'd all call black people niggers because the term would have been stripped of any derogatory meaning. But it hasn't happened yet.
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Wasn't Yank originally a slur and then people got over it?
Probably so. For some people I imagine it's still a slur. The same process might happen to 'Jap' some day. You never know.
But I imagine that the people who 'get offended over it' do so because they believe it's used in ignorance, without full understanding of what the term still means to many.
Arthur C. Clarke once suggested that in the feature we'd all call black people niggers because the term would have been stripped of any derogatory meaning. But it hasn't happened yet.
The funny thing is that it started out with no derogatory meaning - and then slavery got involved. It was a bit of an imprecise contraction, as not all black people came from Nigeria, but tell that to an ignorant public back in Europe/NA
I also hate to point out that the propaganda, whilst being a broad generalisation, did have a lot going for it terms of what would happen if they did conquer you. Just look at what happened to Japanese occupied China, and all the horror stories out of there.
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Wasn't Yank originally a slur and then people got over it?
Probably so. For some people I imagine it's still a slur. The same process might happen to 'Jap' some day. You never know.
But I imagine that the people who 'get offended over it' do so because they believe it's used in ignorance, without full understanding of what the term still means to many.
Arthur C. Clarke once suggested that in the feature we'd all call black people niggers because the term would have been stripped of any derogatory meaning. But it hasn't happened yet.
The funny thing is that it started out with no derogatory meaning - and then slavery got involved. It was a bit of an imprecise contraction, as not all black people came from Nigeria, but tell that to an ignorant public back in Europe/NA
Quite so. Analogous to 'jap' in that respect.
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You know, I've actually never heard the word Paki used except by people who legitimately thought it was the word for Pakistani. :P
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You know, I've actually never heard the word Paki used except by people who legitimately thought it was the word for Pakistani. :P
Well, in Britain it was a widely-used term of abuse for people of Asian/Middle Eastern descent, though it seems to have generally fallen out of use just now.
Well, I reckon so, but an Indonesian friend of mine was apparently racially abused at her work (she's a waitress) by some ***** whom I remember from school, apparently got her really angry. Don't know what language was being hurled at her though, might have to ask.
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You know, I've actually never heard the word Paki used except by people who legitimately thought it was the word for Pakistani. :P
But you are not the world!
And look this thread is perfectly civil. It is a good day on HLP. (Now if spardason would just unblock me so he'd get my PM apology for that tiff earlier.)
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But I cant possibly be the only one. How can something be a serious slur if any random person who hasn't heard it would use it? It just makes no sense.
Does the tone make the slur? What if I say "French" all nasty and meanlike? Will French people have to come up with a new word for their nationality if too many people say "French" with a sneer?
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But I cant possibly be the only one. How can something be a serious slur if any random person who hasn't heard it would use it? It just makes no sense.
Read this post. (http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php?topic=70503.msg1393976#msg1393976)
Something becomes a serious slur when it starts being used as a slur. It can be recreated innocently, but a word does not exist in a vacuum, transmitting information directly from the speaker to the listener(s). It's simply a signifier for a set of social information. And in the case of 'jap' or 'paki' the social information that history has attached to the word is terrible.
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So what are gay people supposed to call themselves? I've never heard a word for "homosexual" that wasn't a slur, including the word homosexual itself. Are there any?
What about women? Every feminine word is used as a slur pretty frequently, so what're we supposed to call ourselves?
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So what are gay people supposed to call themselves? I've never heard a word for "homosexual" that wasn't a slur, including the word homosexual itself. Are there any?
Quite so. That's why people try to reclaim terms. If a 'trusted' individual uses a slur it can be taken as a sign of affection or ironic commentary on hostility towards the ingroup. This is why it's socially acceptable for black people to say 'nigger' and gay people to refer to each other as 'fags' - if used by members of the ingroup the term can be redefined as one of affection or solidarity.
These are not easily answered questions - they're the kind of dilemmas that are still being tackled today.
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These are really retarded dilemmas. Do we not have better things to do than determine which abbreviations are mean and which are nice?
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These are really retarded dilemmas. Do we not have better things to do than determine which abbreviations are mean and which are nice?
These meanings are not defined from the top down by any individual or group decision, they're built from the bottom up from usage. They are prototypical, not algorithmic.
The meaning contained in language is defined by the speaker, the listener, the environment, the history behind them and a great deal more. We can't change that by fiat.
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Let's just make every label for everything a slur, like it is for gays and women Then there will be no labels left and we'll *have* to use them all neutrally.
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You're spinning a fairly tangled web Battuta. It's certainly acceptable that members of a society should be aware of, and if sufficiently educated in tolerance actively avoid using the racial slurs associated with their society. For example members of the United States should be aware of the connotations and history involved in calling someone of African descent the "n" word. Expecting people to be cognizant of other societies' slurs on the other hand is a bit ungainly. For many in the US using "Paki" as a method of referring to Pakistanis doesn't have the context it does in Britain, to be honest if it weren't for the fact that it started a furball on HLP earlier this year I would still be ignorant of its slur component. The world is to damn big to expect everyone to be pan societally politically correct. Plus I tend to think forcing one society to accept another's beliefs/history/whatever is a bit of a loaded issue.
I'm not saying people should have carte blanche to throw around slurs like party favors, just that trying to force some massive politically correct infrastructure on the world isn't really realistic not to mention boring.
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You're spinning a fairly tangled web Battuta. It's certainly acceptable that members of a society should be aware of, and if sufficiently educated in tolerance actively avoid using the racial slurs associated with their society. For example members of the United States should be aware of the connotations and history involved in calling someone of African descent the "n" word. Expecting people to be cognizant of other societies' slurs on the other hand is a bit ungainly. For many in the US using "Paki" as a method of referring to Pakistanis doesn't have the context it does in Britain, to be honest if it weren't for the fact that it started a furball on HLP earlier this year I would still be ignorant of its slur component
Indeed, but it did start a furball on HLP earlier this year.
The world is to damn big to expect everyone to be pan societally politically correct. Plus I tend to think forcing one society to accept another's beliefs/history/whatever is a bit of a loaded issue.
I'm not saying people should have carte blanche to throw around slurs like party favors, just that trying to force some massive politically correct infrastructure on the world isn't really realisti
I wouldn't advocate anything like that. These issues are incredibly complicated and I don't have an easy answers. But I don't believe people lose anything by being considerate of the requests of others and mindful of different cultures and contexts.
Also I've never figured out what 'politically correct' is but I'm pretty sure it's not me.
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You're pretty much the definition of politically correct, Battsy.
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It seems pretty simple actually. If you think someone might get offended by a term, don't use it. If you find out that a term that you previously used is offensive, stop using it. If you unknowingly say something that someone finds offensive, apologize, acknowledge your mistake, and stop using it.
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Are there any inoffensive terms for a gay person or a woman?
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Are there any inoffensive terms for a gay person or a woman?
Not sure about a gay person, it really seems to depend on the person in question. But most women I know are fine with woman and girl (That first depending on context, really. With the only negative context being an innapropriate usage in a commanding way [Unless she's into that kinda thing]). Female works as well.
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Are there any inoffensive terms for a gay person or a woman?
Is "woman" offensive?
Also, at least where I am from, it is acceptable to just say "gay," as long as you phrase it so that the listener knows you mean "homosexual" and not anything else.
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Are there any inoffensive terms for a gay person or a woman?
Is "woman" offensive?
Also, at least where I am from, it is acceptable to just say "gay," as long as you phrase it so that the listener knows you mean "homosexual" and not anything else.
I didn't think it was, myself. And yea, generally seems to be the case here as well
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Usually with woman and girl and that kind of thing, it's in the context of "______ like a woman/girl/whatever." Therefore, the words carry the connotations. That's apparently how it works for Paki and Jap, right?
As for "gay" it's used as a catch-all insult where I live, by everyone, constantly.
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Usually with woman and girl and that kind of thing, it's in the context of "______ like a woman/girl/whatever." Therefore, the words carry the connotations. That's apparently how it works for Paki and Jap, right?
As for "gay" it's used as a catch-all insult where I live, by everyone, constantly.
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I... I ... I don't even know how to reply to that.
I hate to see whoever the hell it is you hang around with, Iaz. Whenever I hear Woman/Girl, it's usually in the context of "I met this girl saturday night, she was really nice, we exchanged numbers, I think it could go somewhere." that kinda thing, ya?
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Yeah, the word can reasonably be used totally innocently, kinda like Jap and Paki.
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You're pretty much the definition of politically correct, Battsy.
If you had an inkling of the things I've written or the experiments I've run I'd doubt you'd say that.
I pride myself on having data-driven opinions.
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Yeah, the word can reasonably be used totally innocently, kinda like Jap and Paki.
I dunno, my general feeling is that when you're referring to someone's race/ethnicity, you usually use the full name because it sounds like a slur otherwise, even if it wasn't previously. That may just be where I am from though.
Also note though, you have to be much more sensitive to international connotations when you're on the internet.
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The silliest things turn out to be slurs. Eventually it stops being sensitive and starts being a waste of time.
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The silliest things turn out to be slurs. Eventually it stops being sensitive and starts being a waste of time.
Silly to you. But you have a responsibility to empathize with those who have different histories. (Since it's obvious by now that we're debating what got you banned last time :p )
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I really don't care that I got banned last time. Anyway, I've decided to replace every insult I use with "American." This thread is ****ing American as hell.
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I really don't care that I got banned last time. Anyway, I've decided to replace every insult I use with "American." This thread is ****ing American as hell.
Ow, that IS insulting :C
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(Now if spardason would just unblock me so he'd get my PM apology for that tiff earlier.)
You aren't blocked, at least not intentionally. I've just been trying to figure out the best way to apologize to you while saving face.
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(Now if spardason would just unblock me so he'd get my PM apology for that tiff earlier.)
You aren't blocked, at least not intentionally. I've just been trying to figure out the best way to apologize to you while saving face.
Oh. Well don't worry about it, I don't think you're dumb or anything. I just figured you were still super pissed at me or something. :/
I've been plenty angry at certain HLP members before and then felt remarkably sheepish about it later.
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Usually with woman and girl and that kind of thing, it's in the context of "______ like a woman/girl/whatever." Therefore, the words carry the connotations. That's apparently how it works for Paki and Jap, right?
As for "gay" it's used as a catch-all insult where I live, by everyone, constantly.
Ah, I think I know what you mean. "Oi, you catch like a chick!" kind of thing? (a quote from the bloke who plays forward pocket in the school football team).
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Here's Sushi's take in short:
1. Try to be respectful of other people and not say things that you know will offend them. Come to grips with the fact that this is impossible and you will inevitably gaffe. If people are smart enough to tell you when you screw up, listen to them.
2. When people say something offensive, give them the benefit of the doubt. They probably weren't trying to offend you. If you're still offended, politely inform them, since they probably didn't do it on purpose. If the word is something acceptable only within the "in" group, be prepared to defend the double standard. :)
Are we all happy yet?
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Yeah, that satisfies me, and looks mostly like what I'd do. Except there aren't many words that I have to be careful using around certain people, but that's the great thing about being a kid, barely anyone gives a ****.
But the second point is something I've had to do on several occasions. There are only about two dozen people in the entire world who're allowed to joke about my ethnicity in a manner many would see as offensive. :P
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Okay, okay, back the hell up here people. You're making it more complicated than it should be.
There's a simple reason why it's different.
Jap is not a national term. It is a racial one. If you don't believe me look at Japanese population statistics; the country remains nearly 99% ethnic Japanese even today. I know we're all Western Hemisphere folks and the concept of single-race countries is utterly foreign to us but that's the way it works. Japan has been one race much longer than it's been one country, and the basis of the country is wrapped up in a racial identity, the Yamato people, rather than a political or geographical one.
Scot or Yank are not racial. They are political terms, and indeed have more or less always been. In the modern world attempting to use them racially is a joke.
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Uhm, so what?
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Okay, okay, back the hell up here people. You're making it more complicated than it should be.
There's a simple reason why it's different.
Jap is not a national term. It is a racial one. If you don't believe me look at Japanese population statistics; the country remains nearly 99% ethnic Japanese even today. I know we're all Western Hemisphere folks and the concept of single-race countries is utterly foreign to us but that's the way it works. Japan has been one race much longer than it's been one country, and the basis of the country is wrapped up in a racial identity, the Yamato people, rather than a political or geographical one.
Scot or Yank are not racial. They are political terms, and indeed have more or less always been. In the modern world attempting to use them racially is a joke.
I really hope you're ****ing joking. Scot is a racial term. Saying it isn't, THAT is ****ing insulting. Because that's what we, the natives, are. Mixture of Celt and Pict, natives of Scotland, the fecking Scots. Yeah we share the nation with others, who may not have been of caucasian descent, and they're generally known as Brits. British because they are part of the UK conglomerate, not descended from one of it's constituent nations' natives (Though they have just as much right to be British as any of us, imo)
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See! Different things can be slurs to different people! ;7
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See! Different things can be slurs to different people! ;7
I don't see that as a slur, I see it as insultingly ignorant. Not because there are any racial connotations involved, but because he's just gone and written off a distinct group of people as a "political" contrivance.
(Which amounts to the same thing, but hush Batts, it is all in the semantics)
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I really hope you're ****ing joking. Scot is a racial term. Saying it isn't, THAT is ****ing insulting.
Because you're so racially different from your neighbors the average person can be expected to tell you from Brits (Saxon or Norman ancestory!) or Welsh or Irish at glance!
Oh wait.
Yeah, I'm not buying that. One can typically make an educated guess at the race of someone vis a vis Japanese/Korean/Chinese from a picture. This is not true of the inhabitants of the United Kingdom.
I would also point out that the long association with the rest of the UK and the population statistics are on my side as well.
Uhm, so what?
Hush now child, you're not expected to understand.
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I really hope you're ****ing joking. Scot is a racial term. Saying it isn't, THAT is ****ing insulting.
Because you're so racially different from your neighbors the average person can be expected to tell you from Brits (Saxon or Norman ancestory!) or Welsh or Irish at glance!
Oh wait.
Yeah, I'm not buying that. One can typically make an educated guess at the race of someone vis a vis Japanese/Korean/Chinese from a picture. This is not true of the inhabitants of the United Kingdom.
I would also point out that the long association with the rest of the UK and the population statistics are on my side as well.
Uhm, so what?
Hush now child, you're not expected to understand.
NGTM-1R. Look up the picts. The natives of Scotland, the first people in Britain, before the celts. Then tell me that the Scots aren't distinct. We are. We even have a different 'look' to the more celtic parts of the nation (Which everyone thinks is all of Scotland, and is really just Glasgow/the central belt. Those are the ones who are NEARLY interchangeable with the Irish and Welsh).
Learn your facts before you start making sweeping generalisations.
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This is not going to go anywhere happy.
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Look up the picts. The natives of Scotland, the first people in Britain, before the celts. Then tell me that the Scots aren't distinct. We are.
I'm quite aware of my English history thanks. You retain a distinct governance (if one squints a bit), but a truly distinct culture and population? Don't make me giggle. You've been fully integrated into the United Kingdom for hundreds of years.
We even have a different 'look' to the more celtic parts of the nation (Which everyone thinks is all of Scotland, and is really just Glasgow/the central belt. Those are the ones who are NEARLY interchangeable with the Irish and Welsh).
Okay. Prove it in pictures.
Oh wait, that's not relevant is it again? Since even you admit that calling someone a Scotsman covers more than one racial type! Unless now you're saying people from Glasgow aren't really Scottish and nobody would ever refer to them as Scottish?
More to the point, it doesn't matter what you think. It matters what other people think qualifies, and you're saying they agree with me.
Learn your facts before you start making sweeping generalisations.
I evidently know them better than you do. You didn't even think about what you were writing for chrissakes, you proved my point for me.
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This is not going to go anywhere happy.
No, you're right. I'll fold.
If it makes life easier for NGTM, think of us as a political generalisation.
What makes this interesting and I wasn't offended at the term (As I said, I call myself a Scot), I was offended by attributing it a frankly wrong meaning.
Woah, wait... WHAT.
I'm sorry... get out. You clearly know **** all, laddie, if you think that we don't have a seperate culture. And I suggest you actually go learn some before you start throwing things around like that. (Seriously, say that on a street in Glasgow, I'll carry a hat for your teeth.) English History isn't being discussed here, we're discussing Scottish history. The two groups are distinct, culturally and ethnically (for the most part, of course there is inter-breeding, but maybe not quite as much as you assume)
Oh, and they are Scottish, they share a good percentage of the same blood, but it's an Ethnic group for god's sake man. Of course there are variations in there, there are variations in EVERY racial group. It doesn't make it any less a racial/ethnic group. That's like saying 80% of Germans are not Germans because they aren't blonde, 6 foot tall, and have blue eyes.
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(Seriously, say that on a street in Glasgow, I'll carry a hat for your teeth.)
You're proving my point about it covering more than one race again. I'm beginning to think you can't help yourself. :P
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(Seriously, say that on a street in Glasgow, I'll carry a hat for your teeth.)
You're proving my point about it covering more than one race again. I'm beginning to think you can't help yourself. :P
Read my edits. I'm not quite sure your definition of race/ethnicity is accurate. A 'Genetic' one doesn't really work all that well, as there are variations with any population, isolated or not.
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Great, here we go again.
Mods?
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Great, here we go again.
Mods?
Again, I apologise, but this is like trying to douse a fire with oil. (NGTM's comments, I mean)
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Great, here we go again.
Mods?
I like Blue Planet.
Oh, wait, that wasn't the question, was it?
Thread locked due to escalating asshattery.