Hard Light Productions Forums
Off-Topic Discussion => General Discussion => Topic started by: Nemesis6 on December 15, 2010, 02:11:54 pm
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MANEZH PLAZA, under the walls of the Kremlin, is a symbolic place in Russian politics. In the late 1980s, thousands demonstrated there against the injustices of the crumbling communist system. But this past weekend, the square saw an ugly scene (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zeUlMYxNMlQ) of rioting nationalist thugs played out. The tacky fountains and underground shopping malls that epitomise the oil-fuelled consumption of today's Russia can no longer disguise an inherent instability and a growing sense of injustice among different social groups.
The pogroms were sparked by the killing (http://en.rian.ru/russia/20101207/161675541.html) of Yegor Sviridov, a football fan, on December 6th, by a man from Russia's north Caucasus. Several of the men initially detained for the murder—although not the prime suspect—were inexplicably (some say for a bribe) later released by the police, infuriating Mr Sviridov's friends. Inevitably their protest turned racist, and the mob turned on people from the north Caucausus, who are formally Russian citizens but have long ceased to be treated as such.
Several thousand football fans and right-wing radicals shouting “Russia for the Russians” clashed with riot police, pelting them with heavy objects. A few brave policemen tried to shelter several swarthy-looking men from the wrath of the neo-fascists. After an appeal from the head of the Moscow police, the rioters were pushed underground into metro stations, where they proceeded to attack anyone who did not look ethnically Russian.
The riots exposed the fragility of the Russian political system, as well as the Kremlin’s impotence. The riot police may be able to disperse peaceful demonstrations (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UpE0x50ddIA&feature=player_embedded), but they appear to be less effective when confronted by an aggressive nationalist crowd, whose views many of them share.
For the Kremlin, it is business as usual. A day before the rioting Vladimir Putin, the prime minister and "alpha dog (http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE6AS4BZ20101129)" of Russian politics, was in St Petersburg, crooning (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t2LxpNJ6jck) "Blueberry Hill" and performing a Soviet-era homage to the motherland.
But after ten years of consolidating political power and installing “stability”, the Kremlin is struggling to keep a lid on violence. Corruption is undermining the foundation of the state (http://www.economist.com/node/17674075?story_id=17674075). The day after the pogroms, several migrant workers in Moscow were attacked and a Kyrgyz man murdered (http://www.expatica.ru/news/russian-news/youths-kill-kyrgyz-man-in-moscow_116940.html) by a group of 15 people.
http://www5.economist.com/blogs/easternapproaches/2010/12/moscows_riots (http://www5.economist.com/blogs/easternapproaches/2010/12/moscows_riots)
At this point I really don't think the government cares. They do not allow opposition rallies, and pre-emptively do everything in their power to thwart political opposition, and yet they allow these football hooligans to gather for riots.
Russia is kind of like America now that I think about it -- They've both got the "dey took jur jeerrrrbbs" thing going, except the Russian versions of these typical American hillbillies seem to be otherwise normal suburban people, who instead of doing protests and ranting on the internet, just go around beating and killing people. The Russians even have their own version of Fox News, called Russia Today(RT), who are already trying to thoroughly whitewash these riots, calling reports "exaggerated", and portraying the riots as football fans versus Caucasian gangs. Man, I sure am glad I live in a civilized, non-gangster-run country.
To quote the heavy: "OHHHHH, IT IS SAD DAY!". And right he is.
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Why come in here and post flamebait **** like this? There isn't really any constructive conversation we could have over this.
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Actually, I think this was an interesting read. I don't know much about current life in Russia except that it's getting a bit tense. It's good to get some kind of window.
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Actually, I think this was an interesting read. I don't know much about current life in Russia except that it's getting a bit tense. It's good to get some kind of window.
It's been like this for at least eight years. There have been numerous articles, documentaries(Ross Kemp's for example), and lots of general research done on this field. St. Petersburg, for example, has been called the "skinhead capital of the world". So it's not just a problem like, say, ethnic tension in America, no, this seems to permeate their society. For example: On Adolf Hitler's birthday, universities in St. Petersburg don't let their students leave because nazi gangs prowl the streets, looking for any non-slavic-looking minority to beat up or kill. So, this latest thing isn't actually news, it's just more of the same; just another day in Russia, I guess... :-/
By the way, BBC article from the today, with some arrest numbers and stuff: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-12003358
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damned Caucasians! had it coming!
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So it's not just a problem like, say, ethnic tension in America, no, this seems to permeate their society.
Wat no. That's like saying that the conditions in the shady places of Detroit seem to permeate our (American) society. It's a singular example, and I highly doubt it's indicative of a societal bias toward one group or another.
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Russia is a peaceful, non-racist country. Except not.
Why this thread title?
The recent incidents should really not come as a surprise to anyone. I'm slightly worried if the unrest spreads to St. Petersburg. That's already too close then. I just hope this isn't the beginning of the next "new start" in Russia.
"Russia for Russians" is a rather funny slogan considering the circumstances, now that I come to think of it.
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Why come in here and post flamebait **** like this? There isn't really any constructive conversation we could have over this.
Some of us do actually care about politics beyond the continual American left-right slanging match, you know. :P
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So it's not just a problem like, say, ethnic tension in America, no, this seems to permeate their society.
Wat no. That's like saying that the conditions in the shady places of Detroit seem to permeate our (American) society. It's a singular example, and I highly doubt it's indicative of a societal bias toward one group or another.
The thing is, though -- These Neo-Nazi gangs are organized and active in all of the major cities. Unlike America where it's really bad in certain places because of poverty and lack of integration, in Russia it seems to be the case that the bigger the city, the more influence the far-right thugs have. That's the way it seems to me, anyway.
Journeyman Pictures had a nice documentary specifically dealing with how Chechens living in Moscow were treated specifically bad by police, I'll try to dig it up.
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"Russia for Russians" is a rather funny slogan considering the circumstances, now that I come to think of it.
There is a funny thinɡ behind that, actually. In Russian, that phrase is "Россия для русских". There are two ways of saying "Russian" -- Русский, meaning being ethnically Slav and legally a citizen. Then there's "россиян", an ethnic Russian. So what they're saying is actually "Russia for Slavs", or non-Caucasian white people, put another way.
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Yeah
I mean that they have never been that eager to gather all the non-slavic people inside their borders. Not at least for the last 500 years.
So are the rioters supporting the separation of those countries from Russia?
In the hindsight, the above is a rhetoric question. I think I already know the answer for it.
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I still associate Russia with nukes and the Heavy from TF2, so this was enlightening.
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The fact I come from a country that was torn apart by this stupid violence between people of different ethnicities in the same country, who really are just as 'Russian' as you are made this all the more angering to read.
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The fact I come from a country that was torn apart by this stupid violence between people of different ethnicities in the same country, who really are just as 'Russian' as you are made this all the more angering to read.
Well when I take over the world this is one of the first things I'll attend to.