Hard Light Productions Forums
Community Projects => The FreeSpace Upgrade Project => Topic started by: General Battuta on May 12, 2011, 09:05:12 pm
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For now I've just noticed this issue in Capella, so we'll use that as the test case to see if this problem is any more widespread.
I recently set up a cool event in FRED that would create a Capella background using add-background-bitmap SEXPs. After setting up all 25 add-background-bitmaps, based precisely on the nebula backdrop in the MVPs version of 'Apocalypse', the final FS2 mission, I booted up my test mission to admire my work.
To my shock, it seemed like the event had bugged out. There were only two patches of nebulae in the sky, unimpressive and fairly distant. It was mostly just blank starfield. Weirdly enough, these two patches consisted of a total of 25 bitmaps, layered on top of each other.
Then I realized the problem wasn't my SEXP - it was the MVPs!
At some point the nebula backdrop on Apocalypse was cut down enormously from retail. For comparison, here's a retail screenshot in FRED2.
(http://i1233.photobucket.com/albums/ff390/GeneralBattuta/retailcapella1.jpg)
Notice the fairly diffuse nebulae backdrops. These continue for about half of the sky - you can see more of them to the right of the planet:
(http://i1233.photobucket.com/albums/ff390/GeneralBattuta/retailcapella2.jpg)
By comparison, the same two space areas in the MVPs. The first shows one of only two nebula areas in the background - notice how much less area it covers.
(http://i1233.photobucket.com/albums/ff390/GeneralBattuta/mvpscapella1.jpg)
The other side of the planet - nothing there at all. Same true with above and below.
(http://i1233.photobucket.com/albums/ff390/GeneralBattuta/mvpscapella2.jpg)
The last weird thing is the star itself. Retail doesn't have any nebulae near it, perhaps to focus attention on the Saths.
(http://i1233.photobucket.com/albums/ff390/GeneralBattuta/retailcapella3.jpg)
But the only other patch of nebula in the MVPs aside from the tiny one to the left of the planet is a big orange splotch to the right of the star:
(http://i1233.photobucket.com/albums/ff390/GeneralBattuta/mvpscapella3.jpg)
Perhaps this was introduced in some kind of strange jab at REALISM. D: I would like to express my strong preference for the more cinematic, diffuse nebulae in retail.
Axem and I checked out other system backgrounds and Capella seems to be the only one with this issue.
ed: If I have made any huge factual errors in creating this, please make fun of me forever. It is a distinct possibility.
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As I understand it, the person who designed the Capella background wanted to keep it consistent with the FS2 endgame cutscene, so that's probably why Capella doesn't have a lot of background nebulae.
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Poor reason now, as I'm remaking that cutscene! ;)
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I'm cool with anybody deciding to remake this background as some sort of intermix or something. Axem did a different Capella in Vassago's Dirge, the only complaint from battuta (aside from it being 90 bitmaps) was the tan/grey. I don't think we need to replicate the retail coloration to any extent but some variation of color that is similar in application would be nice.
Anybody that does decide to take the challenge should be aware of a few things though:- It's not necessary to change the nebula structure that is to the right of the sun, only that which is surrounding the planet (Though you can if you must)
- Do not change the position of the Sun(s) or Planets, as this will require additionally moving the SunSath elements as well
- Any submissions may be altered slightly or combined with other submissions, but credit's will be given to all submissions where any elements are used
That's about all I can think of. I'm not adverse to even restoring (behind the planet) the Retail settings, but I'd rather utilize the newer nebula graphics that we have. The Judges for the entries (aside from the FSU Staff in general) will be General Battuta and Axem (for Blue Planet, possibly also including Herra Tohtori)), with Primary FSU Judges being myself and Mjn.Mixael
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I made a custom Capella background for "Workings Of The Warp" ... but at that time I wanted the background more to reflect the final conflict of FS2 in Capella (that's why it's made form dark blue and red)...
Just posted some screens of it over at "A celebration of Freespace" (http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php?topic=25406.msg1509505#msg1509505)
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I have the exact same complaint about Deneb from the first couple missions. It went from being a lush spattering of colour to like two streaks of purple (presumably to match the intro cutscene).
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0rph3u5: ( New direct link to the post: http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php?topic=25406.msg1509505#msg1509505 )
I rather like the look of that. I'd like to see more of it. Would you be willing to pastebin the "Background" section of the mission in question (just a notepad open and copy of the Background elements specifically) and either link that here or in a PM to me? (If you're willing and have no objection to it possibly being used, that is!)
Snail: That's likely the right of it. Those missions as well saw (I believe) a reduction in the background elements. If not in total count of bg elements used, then in their concentration into being less spread out.
All: So, let's open this up a bit more, rather than just concentrating on a few missions here and there, let's go for broke. The rules are:
- No alteration of the position of the Suns or the Suns used (unless a good argument can be made for their replacement)
- No alteration of the Planets or their placement.
If the suns are altered in any way, then the Planet(s) may be rotated to example as close to realistic lighting from the new position as possible
So, be creative and share some results.
And while this isn't necessarily germane to the original topic, here's another creative opening for people as well: A new Splash image for the next edition of the MediaVPs.
Granted, we have a few new assets that are not yet released as completed (Typhon and Colossus) but the existing models can be used for "stand in". Make a mini-mission environment to set the ships and camera to where you would like to see and explain any post-effects or editing you would do to it to achieve the final product.
Provide some form of a "Proof of Concept" shot or Final work and what incomplete assets as-of-yet un-released that you would like to have in it.
We'll then hold a poll on the submissions as we near Release (still quite a ways off, so take your time) and the winner get's their work put in to the next Release.
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I made those backgrounds ages ago. As Talon 1024 implies, the "reduction" was to make the background more consistent with the cutscenes. In all of the Capella cutscenes there is not a single trace of nebulae anywhere to be seen -- merely a starfield. I thought it looked odd to be looking at some lush background one minute, then none at all the next -- were the cutscenes in the same system? So I made a small streak of color far away from the suns. Of course, back then no one ever imagined that someone would be along to recreate the cutscenes themselves... :)
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:D
muahahahahaha
More seriously. I like how this thread is going and I look forward to seeing what everyone can bring to the table.
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0rph3u5: ( New direct link to the post: http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php?topic=25406.msg1509505#msg1509505 )
I rather like the look of that. I'd like to see more of it. Would you be willing to pastebin the "Background" section of the mission in question (just a notepad open and copy of the Background elements specifically) and either link that here or in a PM to me? (If you're willing and have no objection to it possibly being used, that is!)
/color]
Link fixed - PM send