Hard Light Productions Forums
Off-Topic Discussion => General Discussion => Topic started by: MachManX on July 17, 2011, 02:51:47 am
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My niece and nephew have a computer at their house that breaks down like every month due to software. Their parents call me to go over there and fix it, and most of the time it's due to some stupid program that they installed that messes up the computer. The only option I have is to reinstall Windows. You can imagine how annoying this is for me to have to go to their house and fix their computer all the time! :mad: I'm sick and tired of having to do this for them, but end up fixing it anyway because their family or my family begs me to fix it. So last month I decided to change certain settings so that they could no longer install anything:-
1. Disabled Windows Installer in Group Policy Editor (gpedit.msc)
2. Added "msiexec.exe" to the List of Disallowed Applications in Group Policy Editor
3. Hid the "Programs" section in Control Panel in Group Policy Editor
4. I've also tried limiting the user to Standard, but then some programs have issues running and require admin username and password to run. Can't even download something from Internet Explorer without the prompt <--Small problem which I can work around.
Now the above has been working fine, but it also prevents any program updaters from running like Java Update, Adobe Flash Update, and so on. I guess I could allow these installers to run by allowing them in the Group Policy Editor. But I'm wondering if you guys know any better methods or even a program that can simply prevent the installation of new programs yet allow updates to existing programs? Maybe a program that uses a password system to allow/deny installs?
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i have a similar situation when my sister decides to use one of my computers. she likes to install crap trojanware and browser plugins that we dont want. my soplution has been this.
1: block facebook at the router
2: yell at her, call her names, and tell her not to download crap or install anything.
this has worked thus far.
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You could install a program like Deep Freeze (http://www.faronics.com/standard/deep-freeze/)
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i have a similar situation when my sister decides to use one of my computers. she likes to install crap trojanware and browser plugins that we dont want. my soplution has been this.
1: block facebook at the router
2: yell at her, call her names, and tell her not to download crap or install anything.
this has worked thus far.
oh nuke
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corporal punishment
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Educate the kids on recognizing crapware and to not install it. This is PEBKAC, so fix the root of the problem.
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You can't win. Just find a way to make the reinstalls as quick and automatic as possible.
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what do they use it for, just internet stuff ?
how about a linux live cd
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You could try installing COMODO Internet Security, then setting it not to prompt when installing a program, automatically rejecting the request instead. It can be set to be quite paranoid, so there's a chance it'd work (provided they won't find an easy way to turn it off, even if you hide the icon, you could still kill it with a task manager). Alternatively, you could also try setting it to automatically remove any malware it finds, thus killing most of it on install. Again, if you set it to be paranoid enough, it should catch everything.
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They know what they're doing is wrong. Problem is every time it's a different program that causes the problem. :mad: I've tried the old "Do It Again And You're Dead" staredown, but it doesn't work. :nono:
The COMODO program, well, they're kids...they'll figure out how to bypass it :no2:
The "Deep Freeze" program is very interesting, Sololop. Though I don't like the fact that it's a yearly subscription. :no: Well I'll look into this program, but I'd appreciate more suggestions for my situation.
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Image your computer with an equivalent to Norton Ghost, and restore from that (restore takes what, 20 mins max? I forget now).
Every month, restore from the image, update the computer, and create a new image (so your image is a clean install + updates, never more than a month old).
Problem is user data (docs, pics, music, etc).... external hard disk?
Or, switch to Linux Mint 11 (http://www.linuxmint.com/), set a nice admin password, and create a limited account?
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My niece and nephew have a computer at their house that breaks down like every month due to software. Their parents call me to go over there and fix it, and most of the time it's due to some stupid program that they installed that messes up the computer. The only option I have is to reinstall Windows. You can imagine how annoying this is for me to have to go to their house and fix their computer all the time! :mad: I'm sick and tired of having to do this for them, but end up fixing it anyway because their family or my family begs me to fix it. So last month I decided to change certain settings so that they could no longer install anything:-
This is why i like user rights management. Any program you don't want installed doesn't get installed unless someone has the admin password. Don't let them know the password, and refuse to work on their dumbass computer.
And something the likes of norton ghost to make a backup of a clean install.
Definitely find out if they're too dumb to use a computer. I'm also not joking.
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So I went to my uncle's house today to install a new game for them. But when I got there, the computer was already messed up. There was a virus infection (due to certain kids visiting unsafe websites probably) and they followed the instructions of the "Fake Antivirus Popup" and now the computer has multiple issues, like the ones that can only be solved with a reinstall. I don't even know how they were able to install some programs like PC Tune Up and 3 other programs unless of course those programs don't have a setup.exe . God, even with all those restrictions I put in place, it wasn't enough to prevent these issues :mad:
Right now I'm thinking about installing Kubuntu or Edubuntu on their machine, but is it really better for my situation? Do I still need an antivirus for this OS? There are some old 3D games from 1998-2002 that I'd like to install but would Wine be enough? Also, does Handbrake run on it? I still don't know if I should keep Windows or move to these Linux alternatives. Could use some more insight from you guys.
This is why i like user rights management. Any program you don't want installed doesn't get installed unless someone has the admin password. Don't let them know the password, and refuse to work on their dumbass computer.
And something the likes of norton ghost to make a backup of a clean install.
Definitely find out if they're too dumb to use a computer. I'm also not joking.
How do I configure user rights management to block every software install? Maybe I should even block my uncle from having an admin account and only let myself have it. While I'm at it, I could not install any games for them. Yeah, punishment for them! :mad2:
I've used Norton Ghost in the early 2000's and it's never worked for me. Has it improved since then?
I would love to deny the repair, but my uncle needs the computer himself for video conversion and for the kids to do their online homework...so you see how I'm in a bind here. :banghead:
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For Linux:
No, you don't need an antivirus--they're only good on Linux to prevent the accidental spread of Windows viruses to other Windows computers.
WINE might work for your games, though WINE is typically targeted toward newer, more popular games. Check http://appdb.winehq.org for the specific games.
Yes, HandBrake has a Linux version (see http://handbrake.fr/downloads.php)
Also, http://www.ubuntuforums.org is the best place for Ubuntu/Kubuntu/Edubuntu help.
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Most viruses now change the association of "exefile" and sometimes ".exe" in HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT ... normally, .exe should be:
Name Type Data
(Default) REG_SZ exefile
Content REG_SZ application/x-msdownload
exefile\shell\open\command should be:
Name Type Data
(Default) REG_SZ "%1" %*
IsolatedCommand REG_SZ "%1" %*
They change it from "%1" %* to the path to their fake AV soft so that whenever you try to open a program, it opens the fake AV and runs a fake scan.
EDIT: PS, the exefile is listed after the .zip or whatever extensions (the . makes all extension entries higher).... so scroll past the .z whatever file extensions and the alphabet begins again.
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I've been hit by a few of those drive-by irritants myself. It's nothing a quick system restore hasn't solved, but it's still annoying as hell.
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I've used Norton Ghost in the early 2000's and it's never worked for me. Has it improved since then?
I use Nortan Ghost quite often, works well.* I normally use Drive to Drive mirroring (It copies by file, not bit to bit, so full defrag, woo!) but it should be fully capable of both making an image of a 'new' drive and putting it back later.
*your experiance may vary
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Start charging money for your services. That's what I started doing. Tell them that fixing computers has become a business for you and you've set rates. I usually charge $25 to scrub viruses, $50 for a full Windows reinstall. If your parents take issue with that, tell them you feel your skills are being unfairly taken advantage of and you want to be compensated for your time, which is only fair because you have a marketable skill set. Most importantly, don't budge on it. If that family won't pay, that's their problem. You're not their personal computer slave.
Bottom line, if they're not going to treat you right (and they aren't -- in my book, they're looking at you like a servant), don't work for them.
Another option is that, since you're rendering services on a monthly basis, charge a retainer fee. With either option, make sure that you make it clear this family has a choice: Either get educated or start paying.
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The Linux solution is probably the best. I installed Ubuntu on my Dad's computer, changed the theme to look like Windows XP so he doesn't get confused and left the SSH server open so I can admin remotely in case he needs anything. He only uses the browser though so it doesn't matter what the desktop and program menus look like.
I wouldn't know if it would work in your case, but if you're considering it I think you should give it a try.
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Most viruses now change the association of "exefile" and sometimes ".exe" in HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT ... normally, .exe should be:
Name Type Data
(Default) REG_SZ exefile
Content REG_SZ application/x-msdownload
exefile\shell\open\command should be:
Name Type Data
(Default) REG_SZ "%1" %*
IsolatedCommand REG_SZ "%1" %*
They change it from "%1" %* to the path to their fake AV soft so that whenever you try to open a program, it opens the fake AV and runs a fake scan.
Holy Crap! That's one of the issues the computer has. Any exe I click on and the intended program doesn't run. Well, I get no fake antivirus popup, so I assume it got deleted somehow. But there's still other problems like internet explorer constant redirects, task manager & antivirus won't work, virus somehow locked a standard user account but cannot remove or change it with the admin account, huge font size on startup, etc etc.
I've been hit by a few of those drive-by irritants myself. It's nothing a quick system restore hasn't solved, but it's still annoying as hell.
System restore doesn't delete certain files like those left behind by viruses. So I doubt it'll work with all the problems I have. Besides, I stopped believing in System Restore for a long time and just turn it off. If it had more of a "ghost image" feature, then it would be hella lot better.
I use Nortan Ghost quite often, works well.* I normally use Drive to Drive mirroring (It copies by file, not bit to bit, so full defrag, woo!) but it should be fully capable of both making an image of a 'new' drive and putting it back later.
*your experiance may vary
If the virus infects the ghost partition, then it will be useless, right? Or I'll have to burn to DVDs, I guess. I'm gonna play with Norton Ghost on my own time to get familiar with the software...see if it has improved since.
Start charging money for your services....I usually charge $25 to scrub viruses, $50 for a full Windows reinstall.
I'm more evil: I charge $75 for virus removal and $125 for reinstall with other people :pimp: But still, he has helped me out a few times around the house, like a handyman and never charged me. So you see how I can't charge him back. I'm just annoyed I have to do this like every month or so.
Yeah, I'm gonna try going the Kubuntu route. Some ppl just don't deserve Windows, plain and simple. Since I don't have to install antivirus, that's a plus. We'll see what happens. Thanks for your help, everyone :)
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If the virus infects the ghost partition, then it will be useless, right? Or I'll have to burn to DVDs, I guess. I'm gonna play with Norton Ghost on my own time to get familiar with the software...see if it has improved since.
Burning to DVD is just a waste of time, and very slow when you want it back. Which is why I use drive to drive. Make them pay for a drive atleast close in size to the one they use (yes, ghost can resize the partitions to fit a smaller drive assuming the 'removed' area is blank and up to fill a whole drive) and keep it in your desk drawer so you can copy it back when they break it. For a 500gb drive it is going to take a couble hours (a fresh win install should be perhaps 30-60 mins, possibly 90 after updates and drivers, etc), so be sure to charge for time spent and/or say they have to bring the computer to you where you can just have it running on the side.
I perfer to boot an OS with ghost from a usb drive though so I can get the full IO of both hdds, windows doesnt get in the way of the copy, and better any viruses hit the usb OS then the clean drive.
And having a working harddrive means that should you decided it is necessary, you can update the ghosted drive whenever you want to, not just when they mess up theirs.
(This all obviously works best if they keep pictures, music, videos, etc on another drive or an external one)
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Most viruses now change the association of "exefile" and sometimes ".exe" in HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT ... normally, .exe should be:
Name Type Data
(Default) REG_SZ exefile
Content REG_SZ application/x-msdownload
exefile\shell\open\command should be:
Name Type Data
(Default) REG_SZ "%1" %*
IsolatedCommand REG_SZ "%1" %*
They change it from "%1" %* to the path to their fake AV soft so that whenever you try to open a program, it opens the fake AV and runs a fake scan.
EDIT: PS, the exefile is listed after the .zip or whatever extensions (the . makes all extension entries higher).... so scroll past the .z whatever file extensions and the alphabet begins again.
BTW, since regedit.exe is an .exe file, copy it (use Windows + E to get windows explorer, it's in \windows\system32 ), then rename the extension from .exe to .com .. it works. Same goes for any other program you want to run, change the extension... until you fix that registry key back to it's default value. FYI, you will have to set explorer to view system folders, hidden files, and also to display extensions of common file types. (so you can see and change the .exe extension)
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Display known file type extensions i wish was default :hopping:
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heres the reg file
save it as anyname.reg
Windows Registry Editor Version 5.00
[-HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Classes\.exe\shell\open\command]
[-HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Classes\secfile\shell\open\command]
[-HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT\.exe\shell\open\command]
[HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT\.exe]
@="exefile"
"Content Type"="application/x-msdownload"
[-HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT\secfile]
then merge it
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Display known file type extensions i wish was default :hopping:
By far one of the biggest mistakes introduced in an OS. I understand wanting to hide some stuff from the illiterate users, but showing the extension and making it difficult to change would have worked so much better!
PS: Sorry for going off topic!
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It sort of does that anyways... when you display the extensions and try to change them, it says that it might cause things to stop working.
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Well, I tried Davros' reg file but it changed nothing. Also, I tried renaming the .exe to .com as jr2 suggested and open the file, but it would simply give me the administration prompt, which I click yes, and then nothing. So not even regedit.com would run. This must be some nasty virus or viruses, lol. I'm just gonna reformat and install Kubuntu. Ideally, I would like to run an antivirus program on the data drive before installing Kubuntu. Gonna run Kubuntu LiveCD and see if I can find an antivirus program there.
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Problem is UAC (the prompt for the OK) is itself a program IIRC... so yeah, you're FUBAR...
Except, try tapping F8 on boot, go to repair your computer, open System Restore (NOT system recovery, that wipes your drive) and go back to before the infection.
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Why specifically Kubuntu? Not that I have any problem with KDE, just curious as to why you are so particular?
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Hmmm, kubuntu...well, not a bad choice if you don't like unity :yes:
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Well, the KDE interface is the one most similar to Windows. So the "OS shock" (kinda like culture shock from going to one country to another) of transitioning to a linux OS would be least felt with the KDE GUI. I am dealing with a family of novices here, after all ;) Besides, from what I read, Unity is more designed for touch screens and netbooks. I dunno the reason but the kids prefer their 15" LCD over a larger unit. If I start to even think about why, my brain would probably have a reactor meltdown (kids....) .
I've used Kubuntu and Ubuntu in the past, so I am somewhat familiar with them. Otherwise I've never used any other linux OSes besides Telnet (is Telnet an OS?) . Also there's so much Ubuntu support out there and I know I NEED support as I would consider my knowledge level a 3 on a scale of 1-10 for Ubuntu.
BTW, I've already installed Kubuntu for them and so far they've adjusted to it just fine. Handbrake works for their dad. Internet browsing is the same and most required software comes preinstalled. I installed Edubuntu software package for KDE so that the kids can use the educational software. The only small downfall I'd say is the Wine support for windows games. They can't play Sonic Adventure because the sound doesn't work, so I gave up on it. The internet usage can be controlled by parents now + game usage, so parents actually like this OS. Had to get a printer that supported Linux, but they're happy with the new printer. Oh, NO VIRUSES YET!! :D So I'm happy! ;)