Hard Light Productions Forums
Off-Topic Discussion => General Discussion => Topic started by: est1895 on January 19, 2012, 06:50:40 pm
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When I took my system in, I got a new Western Digital hard drive. I thought the store was giving me a Velocoraptor (pardon my spelling). Years later I found out that it was a Western Digital Scorpio hard drive? :hopping: So whats a Scorpio? A very slow Notebook drive about 5400rpm. I have been getting errors ever since. So I use CCleaner and yes it is all thats holding the system together. I get errors everyday and use CCleaner everyday. But I would like more advice about which hard drive I should buy next. Just a reminder, I have a desktop Windows XP SP3 home 32 bit.
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What kind of errors do you get?
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Western Digital:
Velociraptor: 10k/15k drives. Generaly low storage. 3.5" only.
Caviar: 5400/7200 drives. Normal drives from 320 to 3000gb. 3.5" only.
(Green = power efficient, Blue = normal, Black = performance)
Scorpio: 5400/7200 drives. Laptop drives. 120 to 1000gb. 2.5" only.
Note: It is extremely rare for any prebuilt desktop to come with a Caviar Black HDD, let alone a Velociraptor. In fact, 90% of the time, they come with Caviar Green drives. Same applied to laptops, only substitute Caviar with Scorpio.
If you're going to get an HDD, get it from bestbuy. They're much cheaper 'cause they have HDDs in storage because who the hell goes to bestbuy to buy an HDD, right?
And no, using CCleaner does not hold a HDD together... CCleaner wipes data off an HDD, which is causing the HDD to do work. If there is a hardware problem, nothing can help it besides getting a new HDD or possibly a new controler board for the existing one, which requires that you buy an exact match of your existing drive.
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What kind of errors do you get?
Well I would get Blue Screens and lockups. But when I use the CCleaner, it tells me what the errors are. There is a good possiblity that Windows was not installed properly. How do you check for improper installation of Windows?
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What kind of errors do you get?
Well I would get Blue Screens and lockups. But when I use the CCleaner, it tells me what the errors are. There is a good possiblity that Windows was not installed properly. How do you check for improper installation of Windows?
That would be Registry errors wouldn't it... That is not a sign of a bad install, that's a sign that things have changed on your system at some point in time and references don't exist (a shortcut to a program you uninstalled for instance), they are natural.
Cleaning your registry is a dangerous game, even with the praise CCleaner gets for it. I hope you at minimum make backups before each clean.
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:lol:
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Well when I went to that place that installed Windows onto my new hard drive, the tech had said that he mistakingly put the OS on drive D and not on drive C. So he wipped the hard drive. Then, the drives were mapped in a different order than I have seen after going to this place. And then I couldn't defragment to 0%.
Is there a program to see if Windows was improperly installed?
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Okay. You are completely wrong on all counts. CCleaner will NOT save your hard drive. You are looking at the initial signs hard drive failure. Trust me, I've had enough off themselves to know what the symptoms are. Him installing Windows on a different drive isn't going to do anything. The different order just means a different hard drive is your primary.
Get a non-****ty hard drive now and back your stuff up before it outright crashes and you get blue screens spouting general hardware failure errors. Scratch that, you're already getting them. Just get a new one.
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id suggest running whatever diagnostic tools are available from the drive manufacturer and give the hard drive a scan (iirc western digital had pretty good ones). avoid doing any destructive tests or procedures (for example, a low level format), just run the diagnostics. many things could be wrong, the tech could have dropped the drive before installing it, it could have been a refurb model, the tech might have zapped the cache memory chip on the drive with esd (frankly from what you said he sounds rather incompetent).
another thing you may want to consider is run a memory scan, like memtest 86. if it reports any errors, then the tech may have screwed up your memory timings (they may have reset your bios and lost the manufacturer's timing settings). if your getting crashes and not filesystem errors, it is far more likely to be a memory issue.
tldr: find a better computer tech, the one you had sounds like a real noob.
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^And from the sounds of it, the tech sounds like he's also taking advantage of people and sucking money out of them.
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that is also a distinct possibility. computer techs are under paid and will exploit you in any way they can.
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Well I already have a hard drive waiting for this one to fail. Then who do you go to have you system reinstalled? I've been to about every computer shop in town and always gotten burned. One shop stole $700 of my stuff and left in the middle on the night with it. I have all my stuff already backed up; so that when my hard drive fails, I will be ready. I just have to find a good and honest place.
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...or, you can get a copy of windows yourself and install it. It's really damn easy. And much less expensive than paying some sleazy tech.
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I don't go to anybody. I spent a few hours learning how to do it myself, 6 or 7 years ago Most hardware replacements are trivial to do, and in 90% of cases so are OS reinstalls. Usually, its a case of putting in the replacement hard drive, putting in the OS disc, booting the system from it, and hitting next a whole pile of times.
The only thing I can think of is that especially with XP, you should really grab drivers for your hardware and put them on a flash drive before you reinstall, so you have the drivers available if, for example, your network adapter doesn't have drivers built into XP.
Seriously, once you work through your first reinstall, you'll wonder why you paid to have it done.
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Can Windows be installed only so many times, then the key is dead? I've had xp since it first came out and had it installed over and over again.
I have one example. Years ago when Fujitsu made desktop hard drives, I had a place put one in for me. He put it in and fried it, I had to wait for a replacement. When the replacement arrived, he fried that one too. And this guy was a trained tech too. :shaking:
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the keys are usually valid unless you change your hardware drastically. like a mobo or cpu change. is ms even supporting xp anymore?
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Can Windows be installed only so many times, then the key is dead? I've had xp since it first came out and had it installed over and over again.
XP can be installed 2 times every 6 months, Vista can be installed once per year, and Win 7 can be installed once every 6 months using the same key. The key never permanently dies.
And if that doesn't work, call them and say you had to reinstall. They really dont care why.
the keys are usually valid unless you change your hardware drastically. like a mobo or cpu change. is ms even supporting xp anymore?
MS doesn't care about CPUs as long as its the same family (or else overclocking would trip the key), they register the OS with some form of motherboard UUID or something. And yes, they will support (but not make new patches) for XP sp3 till 2014.
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im curious what they are gonna do about xp after 2014. they should do the right thing and release an official patch to activation. of course im sure they will just unplug and reallocate the activation servers to some other job. its been a concern to be for some time what will happen to software that has drm that requires a call home to activate it, after the developers decide to no longer support it.
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I have one example. Years ago when Fujitsu made desktop hard drives, I had a place put one in for me. He put it in and fried it, I had to wait for a replacement. When the replacement arrived, he fried that one too. And this guy was a trained tech too. :shaking:
You're an idiot. Fujitsu just made bad drives.
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i have a 5 year old drive who's model was famous for self destructing, and it still works. even a ****ty hard drive should still be functional for a few years. the fact that this "trained tech" ****ed up 2 hard drives should have been a big red indicator light to go somewhere else for tech services. a ****ty hard drive in the hands of some one who knows what they are doing will still work.
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Well I already have a hard drive waiting for this one to fail.
If you have a new hard drive to replace your current problematic one, you can do one of the following;
- keep it collecting dust while waiting for the current one to fail, during which time your computer will be an unreliable piece of crap that has to be serviced on a daily basis, and since you pay techs to do it rather than doing it yourself, it will also be a money sink. Your data, if not backed up, is also at risk. Added bonus: while your new hard drive is not being used, it's warranty period is slowly expiring. Fun, eh?
- just replace the damn thing, make a fresh windows install, copy all the relevant data off the old one then put it where it belongs - in the trash. And enjoy smooth seamless operation.
Right now it seems you're going for option #1. I'd kinda reconsider if I were you :)
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Seriously, if I can replace my own hard drive, then anyone can. :p
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Seriously, if I can replace my own hard drive, then anyone can. :p
If I can unbend pins from my CPU, anyone can.
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some people are not cut out for this kind of geekery. no shame in that. but when you pay for an expert, you should get an expert, not some inept ****tard who managed to pass a cert test, but lacks the mental discipline necessary to work a problem. my brother is a good example of this. he has his a+ cert, but he cant do basic stuff like backup files and install operating systems. certs are too easy to get. and it doesnt account for that spidee sense that comes with a highly skilled technician.
Seriously, if I can replace my own hard drive, then anyone can. :p
If I can unbend pins from my CPU, anyone can.
you put it in backwards! HEADDESKS :P
but seriously i saw a lot of this kinda derpage happen when i was a system builder. id always have to fix their rejects. an empty mechanical pencil was always the way to go.
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some people are not cut out for this kind of geekery. no shame in that. but when you pay for an expert, you should get an expert, not some inept ****tard who managed to pass a cert test, but lacks the mental discipline necessary to work a problem. my brother is a good example of this. he has his a+ cert, but he cant do basic stuff like backup files and install operating systems. certs are too easy to get. and it doesnt account for that spidee sense that comes with a highly skilled technician.
That spidee sense is worth more then any piece of paper in the world (at least to the tech anyway :P ). Such a shame it comes with actual practice and knowledge.
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Seriously, if I can replace my own hard drive, then anyone can. :p
If I can unbend pins from my CPU, anyone can.
you put it in backwards! HEADDESKS :P
No! A few pins got bent when I accidentally tore the CPU from the socket while trying to remove the cooler because AMD's stock thermal paste crap had petrified. Nothing that couldn't be fixed with a tiny screwdriver, a magnifying glass and a decent amount of time.
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Seriously, if I can replace my own hard drive, then anyone can. :p
If I can unbend pins from my CPU, anyone can.
you put it in backwards! HEADDESKS :P
No! A few pins got bent when I accidentally tore the CPU from the socket while trying to remove the cooler because AMD's stock thermal paste crap had petrified. Nothing that couldn't be fixed with a tiny screwdriver, a magnifying glass and a decent amount of time.
Pft, be a real geek, do it with your finger nails.
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Shame on you all for running with the hard disk theory and not doing a little digging. est1895 said he's gotten BSODs and lockups, and CCCleaner is displaying the errors. None of those things necessarily indicate hard disk failure. Two things that DO indicate hard disk failure are SMART failure warnings on boot, or clicking when the disk spins up. Registry errors (which is what CCleaner would be detecting) can be a sign of many other problems that do not indicate a hardware fault. And yes, I've also had a half-dozen disks fail over the years - the symptoms are quite predictable.
The first step, as Nuke said, is to run diagnostics. Yes, WD has an excellent set of tools on their website for non-destructive diagnostics. Start with the SMART testing, and run through the others. Memtest is also a good idea to make sure the RAM is fine.
What a BSOD says is also important - it will at minimum give you a memory address, and often some indication of what threw the error in the first place. More information is also available in the Event Viewer (Control Panel - Administrative Tools - Event Viewer). More often than note, BSODs are first and foremost a result of software errors or driver incompatibility (and no disrespect to est1895, but judging from his level of knowledge it is quite plausible that he has installed something he shouldn't have and the hardware itself is just fine). XP is notorious for strange BSODs due to software/driver issues if it isn't set up properly. While it's pretty difficult to "improperly install Windows," it's not at all difficult to do something silly and install an incorrect driver. It's also not at all difficult to **** up your Windows installation by mucking about in the registry, which if you've been running CCleaner, you may have done without meaning to. There's also the issue of "file cleanup," which if you've ever been enterprising and done manually you may have well deleted something important.
Drive letter assignment isn't that relevant to these types of problems, but a good question is how many drives are in your computer? I'm assuming C and D are different disks in your PC, but they may actually be partitions - in which case Windows is still on the same physical hard disk, just a different partition. Yes, an installation of Windows can be corrupted over time (which is possible in your case, given the registry errors CCleaner is throwing at you), and that's your next step after checking the integrity of the hard disks - if the disk(s) and memory check out fine, it's time to wipe your hard disk entirely and start from scratch - which isn't difficult and you definitely should not be paying anyone to do for you (unless the payment is a case of beer to a friend).
So:
*****BACK UP YOUR DATA*****
1. Go to Western Digital's site, download their hard disk tools, and run the diagnostics.
2. Run memtest (from a USB key)
3. If no errors come back from either of those, pop your Windows CD in, reboot the computer to the CD (you may have to enter the BIOS to set boot priority), and follow the prompts to reinstall Windows. Wipe the drive completely in the process, you'll thank yourself later.
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Shame on you all for running with the hard disk theory and not doing a little digging. est1895 said he's gotten BSODs and lockups, and CCCleaner is displaying the errors. None of those things necessarily indicate hard disk failure. Two things that DO indicate hard disk failure are SMART failure warnings on boot, or clicking when the disk spins up. Registry errors (which is what CCleaner would be detecting) can be a sign of many other problems that do not indicate a hardware fault. And yes, I've also had a half-dozen disks fail over the years - the symptoms are quite predictable.
The first step, as Nuke said, is to run diagnostics. Yes, WD has an excellent set of tools on their website for non-destructive diagnostics. Start with the SMART testing, and run through the others. Memtest is also a good idea to make sure the RAM is fine.
What a BSOD says is also important - it will at minimum give you a memory address, and often some indication of what threw the error in the first place. More information is also available in the Event Viewer (Control Panel - Administrative Tools - Event Viewer). More often than note, BSODs are first and foremost a result of software errors or driver incompatibility (and no disrespect to est1895, but judging from his level of knowledge it is quite plausible that he has installed something he shouldn't have and the hardware itself is just fine). XP is notorious for strange BSODs due to software/driver issues if it isn't set up properly. While it's pretty difficult to "improperly install Windows," it's not at all difficult to do something silly and install an incorrect driver. It's also not at all difficult to **** up your Windows installation by mucking about in the registry, which if you've been running CCleaner, you may have done without meaning to. There's also the issue of "file cleanup," which if you've ever been enterprising and done manually you may have well deleted something important.
Drive letter assignment isn't that relevant to these types of problems, but a good question is how many drives are in your computer? I'm assuming C and D are different disks in your PC, but they may actually be partitions - in which case Windows is still on the same physical hard disk, just a different partition. Yes, an installation of Windows can be corrupted over time (which is possible in your case, given the registry errors CCleaner is throwing at you), and that's your next step after checking the integrity of the hard disks - if the disk(s) and memory check out fine, it's time to wipe your hard disk entirely and start from scratch - which isn't difficult and you definitely should not be paying anyone to do for you (unless the payment is a case of beer to a friend).
So:
*****BACK UP YOUR DATA*****
1. Go to Western Digital's site, download their hard disk tools, and run the diagnostics.
2. Run memtest (from a USB key)
3. If no errors come back from either of those, pop your Windows CD in, reboot the computer to the CD (you may have to enter the BIOS to set boot priority), and follow the prompts to reinstall Windows. Wipe the drive completely in the process, you'll thank yourself later.
For the record, CCleaner -only- deals with the HDD. The only 'errors' CCleaner can provide are registry issues, which someone who doesn't know computers shouldn't really be touching anyway.
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No! A few pins got bent when I accidentally tore the CPU from the socket while trying to remove the cooler because AMD's stock thermal paste crap had petrified. Nothing that couldn't be fixed with a tiny screwdriver, a magnifying glass and a decent amount of time.
Pft, be a real geek, do it with your finger nails.
I tried that, ended up bending more pins. I'm just a semi-geek or something.
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For the record, CCleaner -only- deals with the HDD. The only 'errors' CCleaner can provide are registry issues, which someone who doesn't know computers shouldn't really be touching anyway.
Agreed, it's just that errors displayed by CCleaner don't necessarily indicate a failing hard disk - registry errors can be caused by all kinds of other things too.
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i stopped using registry tools a log time ago. i just set a restore point every time i change something, and i like to format my system partition every 6-12 months anyway. even then it usually doesnt need it.
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Shame on you all for running with the hard disk theory and not doing a little digging. est1895 said he's gotten BSODs and lockups, and CCCleaner is displaying the errors. None of those things necessarily indicate hard disk failure. Two things that DO indicate hard disk failure are SMART failure warnings on boot, or clicking when the disk spins up. Registry errors (which is what CCleaner would be detecting) can be a sign of many other problems that do not indicate a hardware fault. And yes, I've also had a half-dozen disks fail over the years - the symptoms are quite predictable.
The first step, as Nuke said, is to run diagnostics. Yes, WD has an excellent set of tools on their website for non-destructive diagnostics. Start with the SMART testing, and run through the others. Memtest is also a good idea to make sure the RAM is fine.
What a BSOD says is also important - it will at minimum give you a memory address, and often some indication of what threw the error in the first place. More information is also available in the Event Viewer (Control Panel - Administrative Tools - Event Viewer). More often than note, BSODs are first and foremost a result of software errors or driver incompatibility (and no disrespect to est1895, but judging from his level of knowledge it is quite plausible that he has installed something he shouldn't have and the hardware itself is just fine). XP is notorious for strange BSODs due to software/driver issues if it isn't set up properly. While it's pretty difficult to "improperly install Windows," it's not at all difficult to do something silly and install an incorrect driver. It's also not at all difficult to **** up your Windows installation by mucking about in the registry, which if you've been running CCleaner, you may have done without meaning to. There's also the issue of "file cleanup," which if you've ever been enterprising and done manually you may have well deleted something important.
Drive letter assignment isn't that relevant to these types of problems, but a good question is how many drives are in your computer? I'm assuming C and D are different disks in your PC, but they may actually be partitions - in which case Windows is still on the same physical hard disk, just a different partition. Yes, an installation of Windows can be corrupted over time (which is possible in your case, given the registry errors CCleaner is throwing at you), and that's your next step after checking the integrity of the hard disks - if the disk(s) and memory check out fine, it's time to wipe your hard disk entirely and start from scratch - which isn't difficult and you definitely should not be paying anyone to do for you (unless the payment is a case of beer to a friend).
So:
*****BACK UP YOUR DATA*****
1. Go to Western Digital's site, download their hard disk tools, and run the diagnostics.
2. Run memtest (from a USB key)
3. If no errors come back from either of those, pop your Windows CD in, reboot the computer to the CD (you may have to enter the BIOS to set boot priority), and follow the prompts to reinstall Windows. Wipe the drive completely in the process, you'll thank yourself later.
How do you determine exactly which Scorpio drive I have?
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No! A few pins got bent when I accidentally tore the CPU from the socket while trying to remove the cooler because AMD's stock thermal paste crap had petrified. Nothing that couldn't be fixed with a tiny screwdriver, a magnifying glass and a decent amount of time.
Pft, be a real geek, do it with your finger nails.
I tried that, ended up bending more pins. I'm just a semi-geek or something.
credit card
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XP is notorious for strange BSODs due to software/driver issues if it isn't set up properly. While it's pretty difficult to "improperly install Windows," it's not at all difficult to do something silly and install an incorrect driver.
Unfortunately, even if you *do* install the correct drivers, sometimes said drivers may *still* have bugs in them... which is why I have a handful of lockups (6-8) on my system every year. (Either that, or the gremlins of not using ECC-memory).
It's a sad truth, but modern software can't be tested for all possible cases of interaction and developers don't always take this to heart. It's time programmers started to take this issue as seriously as the academics make it. It's actually a question of insecurity, for in a way, the failure of drivers is a failure to anticipate input that can put the system in an unstable state:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3kEfedtQVOY
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I have one example. Years ago when Fujitsu made desktop hard drives, I had a place put one in for me. He put it in and fried it, I had to wait for a replacement. When the replacement arrived, he fried that one too. And this guy was a trained tech too. :shaking:
You're an *****. Fujitsu just made bad drives.
Come on people, no need for name calling. :nono:
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How do you determine exactly which Scorpio drive I have?
Your invoice, or pop open the hard disk bay and have a look at the drive sticker - being the simplest ways. My home system is Win7 and is setup in RAID, and I can't recall if the Windows XP disk management software displays hardware IDs or not. The POST information as your PC boots should display the HDD models, provided the manuacturer doesn't obscure that information with some obnoxious boot loading screen (if so, F11 or another key usually gets rid of it).
That said, it appears that WD's data Lifeguard for Windows has identical downloads for all the Scorpio drives - just grab it here: http://support.wdc.com/product/download.asp?groupid=702&sid=3&lang=en
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First: Be happy that you dont have any of those 10000RPM Raptors, saw way to many of these dying (thats why they got such a fast support)
Second: MP-Ryan is right. XP can be easily messed up by doing a few things. Backup all stuff, run diagnostics and then reinstall the windows. If you still get errors after this, you might need to check if your drivers are correct or compatible with SP3 (no joke, there can be a Problem with that).
Oh and one last word: Windows tune up stuff and CCCleaner tend to mess up windows as often as icq does.