Hard Light Productions Forums
Off-Topic Discussion => General Discussion => Topic started by: jg18 on February 06, 2013, 12:13:44 am
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After finding that the latest iMacs have GeForce 600 series cards with only 512 MB of video RAM (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intel_iMac#2012_iMac) :wtf: I decided it's time to leave Apple and learn to build my own machine. Thus I turn to you guys for advice. :)
For the key question of what are you going to use it for?, it'd be mainly programming (meaning lots of compiling) and gaming. At a minimum, it'd be nice to be able to pick up just about any game in the next few years or so and get decent performance with good graphics settings.
I was thinking of spending $800 - $1,000, although a bit more would be OK.
I'm not planning on overclocking. I guess that could change at some point, but it's not a priority.
I don't need Windows 7, since I have a copy.
Recommendations for a magnetic screwdriver? Those look pretty useful. Are there any other tools worth getting?
I even have a 3M disposable anti-static wrist strap (http://solutions.3m.com/wps/portal/3M/en_US/Telecom/Home/Products/ProductCatalog/?PC_7_RJH9U5230OVAE0I4IEIUQH38G7000000_nid=GSTJQVNVKVgsC7904ZWCMBglZDL4MVQMBFbl) that I could wear for maximum dorkiness. :D Reminds me of this xkcd (http://xkcd.com/649/).
I've watched the three Newegg how-to videos and a couple similar videos, so I know what to expect. I also have a general understanding of hardware but zero hands-on skills -- seriously, upgrading the RAM in my iMac was a harrowing experience. :shaking:
Just for comparison, current rig (mid-2010 15" MacBook Pro):
* Intel Core i5 2.4 GHz (520M)
* 8 GB DDR3 1067 MHz RAM
* nVidia GeForce GT 330M 256 MB
* 320 GB 5400 RPM HDD
As for specific parts:
- Monitor will be 1920x1080.
- No idea what to get for a case or PSU, although paying a bit extra for a nicer case that makes building/maintaining/upgrading easier would be worth it to me.
- I was thinking of getting 8 GB RAM and using an SSD (128 GB?) and HDD (~2 TB?) but I don't know what to get for any of those.
- For mobo, I was thinking Gigabyte GA-Z77X-D3H (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128546) ($134.99, $119.99 w/rebate), which got good marks in Tom's Hardware (http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/z77-express-ivy-bridge-benchmark,3254-35.html).
- For CPU and graphics card, I was first thinking Intel Core i5-3570K Quad-core 3.4 GHz (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819116504) ($229.99, $214.99 w/promo) and Gigabyte GeForce GTX 660 2 GB (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814125443) ($229.99, $209.99 w/rebate), but maybe those are too expensive and should be taken down a notch or two, not sure.
- I'll also need a DVD burner and a b/g/n wireless card.
- Do I need an aftermarket CPU cooler? If so, which one?
Looking forward to whatever suggestions you guys might have. :) Thanks!
EDIT: Final build specs (although my total was around $1175, including shipping/taxes):
PCPartPicker part list (http://pcpartpicker.com/p/CbkQ) / Price breakdown by merchant (http://pcpartpicker.com/p/CbkQ/by_merchant/) / Benchmarks (http://pcpartpicker.com/p/CbkQ/benchmarks/)
CPU: Intel Core i5-3570K 3.4GHz Quad-Core Processor (http://pcpartpicker.com/part/intel-cpu-bx80637i53570k) ($229.99 @ Newegg)
CPU Cooler: Cooler Master Hyper 212 EVO 82.9 CFM Sleeve Bearing CPU Cooler (http://pcpartpicker.com/part/cooler-master-cpu-cooler-rr212e20pkr2) ($29.99 @ Newegg)
Motherboard: Gigabyte GA-Z77X-UD5H ATX LGA1155 Motherboard (http://pcpartpicker.com/part/gigabyte-motherboard-gaz77xud5h) ($189.99 @ Newegg)
Memory: G.Skill Ares Series 16GB (2 x 8GB) DDR3-1600 Memory (http://pcpartpicker.com/part/gskill-memory-f31600c10d16gao) ($89.99 @ Newegg)
Storage: Western Digital Caviar Black 1TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive (http://pcpartpicker.com/part/western-digital-internal-hard-drive-wd1002faex) ($99.99 @ Newegg)
Storage: Intel 330 Series 120GB 2.5" Solid State Disk (http://pcpartpicker.com/part/intel-internal-hard-drive-ssdsc2ct120a3k5) ($139.99 @ Newegg)
Video Card: Gigabyte GeForce GTX 660 2GB Video Card (http://pcpartpicker.com/part/gigabyte-video-card-gvn660oc2gd) ($213.98 @ Newegg)
Case: Corsair Carbide 400R ATX Mid Tower Case (http://pcpartpicker.com/part/corsair-case-400r) ($109.98 @ Newegg)
Power Supply: SeaSonic G 550W 80 PLUS Gold Certified ATX12V / EPS12V Power Supply (http://pcpartpicker.com/part/seasonic-power-supply-ssr550rm) ($89.99 @ Newegg)
Optical Drive: Asus DRW-24B3ST/BLK/G/AS DVD/CD Writer (http://pcpartpicker.com/part/asus-optical-drive-drw24b3stblkgas) ($28.98 @ Newegg)
Other: TP-LINK TL-WDN4800 b/g/n PCIe Wireless Adapter ($37.99)
Total: $1260.86
(Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available.)
(Generated by PCPartPicker 2013-02-13 20:16 EST-0500)
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Well, I am currently building a new rig for myself, one that, at ~600 Euros, would come in at the lower range of your price bracket.
I chose the following hardware:
CPU: AMD FX 6300
GPU: SAPPHIRE Radeon HD 7770 GHz Edition OC Vapor-X
MB: MSI 970A-G46 Motherboard
RAM: Mushkin DDR3-1600 Kit (8 GB, 8-8-8-24)
HDD: 1 TB Western Digital
PSU: Seasonic M12II-520
Case: Aerocool VS-3
Plus a DVD-burner and a PCI WLAN card.
Obvious upgrades here would be substituting the FX 6300 for an FX 8320 or an i5; With the budget I have available, and my usage patterns, the multithreading performance I get from the FX is likely to be more important than the single-thread performance one of the recent Intel chips would get me (and at the price, the only Intel chips I could have gotten would have been i3s, the FX 6300 looked like a better deal in that regard).
The next planned upgrade however would be a Bluray drive; I have some BRs left over from when I owned a PS3, and I would very much like to see them again.
As for monitors, I was lucky to get a Samsung Syncmaster P2770 (http://www.samsung.com/ca/consumer/office/monitors/lcd/LS27EMNKUY/ZC) used for cheap; I can offer no help there.
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- No idea what to get for a case or PSU, although paying a bit extra for a nicer case that makes building/maintaining/upgrading easier would be worth it to me.
i use a cooler master HAF 912, couldn't be happier. well, i could. i'd rather it not have a gaping hole in the top to let dust fall in, but that's nitpicky. PLENTY of space for whatever gargantuan components you might use. fits CM hyper 212+/evo heatsinks if you so desire such cooling (see below). tool-less quick instert optical drive bay and 3.5" hdd rail system. no annoying LEDs (except the power/hdd ones).
i splurged on my PSU, which is never a bad thing to do, but i went a little overkill and got a 80+ gold rated 850 watt unit that was highly rated on hardware secrets. those guys do fantastic in-depth reviews on the actual build quality of PSUs. normal price for something like that is upwards of $200, but i lucked into a couple of stacked discounts and got mine for $130 out the door, $99 after rebate.
- I was thinking of getting 8 GB RAM and using an SSD (128 GB?) and HDD (~2 TB?) but I don't know what to get for any of those.
these days it's pretty safe to get just about any non- "value" brand/series of ram. if it has a heat spreader on it and you've heard the brand name before, it's probably alright. i currently use gskill. quality stuff, no gimmicks, and low price. watch out for tall heat spreaders if you think you'll ever put an aftermarket heatsink in. fortunately the ram manufacturers seem to finally be catching on to this. the gskill ares series for example. i like to look to see if i can find sticks with lower latency or the next bump up in speed that are only a few bucks more than the average going price for the standard stuff. but that won't make a noticeable performance difference.
my personal opinion on SSDs is they aren't worth the cost, but i'm about the only one on the forum who thinks so. my system already loads very quickly with just a mechanical hard drive, and you won't be writing enormous files to it so there isn't really anything to be gained for transfer time. if you're set on one though, the samsung 830/840 series are pretty much accepted as the best out there. conventional HDD- I recommend western digital black.
- For mobo, I was thinking Gigabyte GA-Z77X-D3H (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128546) ($134.99, $119.99 w/rebate), which got good marks in Tom's Hardware (http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/z77-express-ivy-bridge-benchmark,3254-35.html).
that looks fine. just for info, i have an ASrock that works quite well (and looks very slick), and i can vouch for their customer service.
- For CPU and graphics card, I was first thinking Intel Core i5-3570K Quad-core 3.4 GHz (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819116504) ($229.99, $214.99 w/promo) and Gigabyte GeForce GTX 660 2 GB (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814125443) ($229.99, $209.99 w/rebate), but maybe those are too expensive and should be taken down a notch or two, not sure.
also seem like good choices to me, but i haven't done any real comparisons since i built mine right before ivy bridge was released. i have a GTX 670, which is a bit pricey, but IT OWNS. i can max every game i have, including crysis/crysis 2. the 660ti seems to be the most popular mainstream gamer card. i don't know how a 650 stacks up.
- I'll also need a DVD burner and a b/g/n wireless card.
honestly i'd just go with the cheapest ones you can find for these
- Do I need an aftermarket CPU cooler? If so, which one?
if you aren't going to overclock, no. if you think you might want to make that leap later on, it can't hurt to go ahead and get one for the initial build. best bang for your buck is going to be the cooler master hyper 212+ or 212evo. the evo is newer and a couple bucks more expensive, but i'm not sure it actually cools any different than the +. i have the +. do note, these things are HUGE and will not fit in a small case (the one i mentioned above is the smallest i'd be comfortable with), it might overhang a ram slot and prevent you from installing a stick with a raised heat spreader in it, and they are a little bit more tricky to install than the stock heatsink (which is why i say if you're going to get one to overclock eventually, do it now to save yourself some extra trouble later).
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http://www.extreme.outervision.com/psucalculatorlite.jsp
That may help a bit, however it recommended me a PSU that's a bit less powerful than what the graphics card specs recommended (IIRC I got about 480-500 W from the calculator, while nVidia recommends 550 W for a PC with the GeForce 680).
Just got a 550 W PSU installed yesterday that I'll be reusing when I'll be building up my next PC (Core i7, GeForce 680, 8 GB of RAM, an SSD and an HDD, estimated cost would be about 1200-1300 USD if built today).
My old 450 W PSU gave up last week, after some 4 years of service.
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Stick with brands that you know, or can trust. This includes brands recommended by other members.
I'm running a PSU by Corsair. Quality is top of the market in my opinion. It came in it's own carry case and everything, which honestly, is way over the top. But that perfect little niche I was looking for
Most of all, have fun building. Go at your own pace.
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I had a cheapo Corsair TX 650W die on me shortly after installing a GTX 480 almost two years ago. Replaced it with an AX 850W, so from Corsair's upper quality lineup - that's been fine ever since. Just listing this as an example - it can be cheaper to get a more expensive PSU right at the start. Though I was lucky and was able to get a replacement TX 650W since it was under warranty. The store wouldn't give me a better PSU and just slice off the price of the TX, so I picked up the brand new replacement TX in an unopened box and just sold it right off on the used market, covering a part of the price of the AX gold series one.
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Yeah, going cheap on the PSU is not something you should do.
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We are buying one more pc for our office this week. It will have an i7 3770, a Radeon HD 7850, (2x8) 16GB of memory. The rest is commentary. And I still feel that Moore's Law is crawling at the moment: I wished for a lot more horsepower to be available for this price point nowadays.
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I think the problem is that there is no real pressure on Intel to improve further for the time being. They currently have the top spot, and they know it; Even AMD's current best model is nowhere near an i7 in terms of performance (Except for situations where it can play to its strengths, most of which are not found in use cases commonly encountered by most people).
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By the beauty of crowd sourcing I want to recommend this thread (http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3525843) as the collective wisdom of the Internet's best on PC building. There's a big FAQ and a 'quick picks' list to help you avoid choice paralysis and focus on the very best!
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Also if you're getting a modern Core i5/i7 it is probably really easy and really safe to overclock, and I'd recommend an aftermarket cooler. The stock Intel coolers are a huge pain in the ass to mount.
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honestly i'd just go with the cheapest ones you can find for these
Depends. Even for parts like DVD burners or WLAN cards it is advisable to be at least somewhat picky.
A flaky/shoddy wireless card that occasionally drops the connection can really ruin your day if you want to play online. I d at least recommend to go with a reputable brand; Intel for example. None of those cards, no matter the brand, are overly expensive anyways.
If the DVD Burner sucks it won't ruin your day... but it's still worthwhile to be somewhat picky and, for example, at least avoid those obnoxiously loud models. (If you want to watch movies or play games from DVD at all.)
With any part... if you buy the very cheapest, you often end up buying twice ;)
(I ended up buying 3 full sets of case fans and 2 fan controllers until I was satisfied with my first attempt at building a "silent" PC heh. :) - now, years later, I finally realized buying a new case would have made it all much easier.)
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Recommendations for a magnetic screwdriver? Those look pretty useful. Are there any other tools worth getting?
- Do I need an aftermarket CPU cooler? If so, which one?
Looking forward to whatever suggestions you guys might have. :) Thanks!
Not worth buying a screwdriver just for a one-time use, unless you have bad eyesight or shaky hands. Just save one of those sample credit cards that everyone seems to get in the mail or a (clean) playing card to use to spread the thermal paste for the cpu and you have all the tools you need.
Definitely get an aftermarket cooler even if you don't want to overclock now, the stock fans that come with current intel/amd chips are garbage. A hyper212+ will fit on any new intel or amd chips, and it shouldn't cost you more than 20-30$ minus whatever rebate is offered. Its huge, but it works, and with a second fan (like 5$) it'll handle a decent overclock too. Should fit in any case 9" or wider without any problems. And the motherboard you listed fits it just fine without any contact issues.
for a PSU, just grab a gold-certified PSU that can do 550 or 600W. No reason to go higher for the use you stated unless a gold-cert higher W PSU is on sale for the same price :p
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oops
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Also if you're getting a modern Core i5/i7 it is probably really easy and really safe to overclock, and I'd recommend an aftermarket cooler. The stock Intel coolers are a huge pain in the ass to mount.
This. Cooler Master Hyper 212+ is an awesome and inexpensive aftermarket cooler. Noctua coolers are great and extremely quiet, but also expensive, about the same as a closed-loop water cooling system like a Corsair H60 (I have one, it's awesome).
Also, when you get a power supply, make sure you look not only at the wattage but also at the amps it can push through the 12v rail especially.
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Also if you're getting a modern Core i5/i7 it is probably really easy and really safe to overclock, and I'd recommend an aftermarket cooler. The stock Intel coolers are a huge pain in the ass to mount.
This. Cooler Master Hyper 212+ is an awesome and inexpensive aftermarket cooler. Noctua coolers are great and extremely quiet, but also expensive, about the same as a closed-loop water cooling system like a Corsair H60 (I have one, it's awesome).
Also, when you get a power supply, make sure you look not only at the wattage but also at the amps it can push through the 12v rail especially.
I'd second the Noctua. Extremely good build quality and performance.
Prolimatech may also be worth a look though.
Kinda wary about closed loop water cooling systems after reading some of the horror stories. Not something I would want for longterm use due to the potential risk.
Not only can a leak turn you computer into disgusting garbage - I was especially disgusted to learn that the cooling fluid used in those things is highly toxic.
The final nail in the coffin is the fact that none of those premade water cooling solutions is as good as highend air cooling. (Worst part: They can't even match the quietness of highend air cooling.)
The only time I would consider a closed loop water cooling setup at all, would be if cooler weight was an issue.
(I.e. If I planned to ship the computer somewhere - Which probably is why those solutions are so popular with online PC retailers.)
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Personal recommendation would be to go AMD for the extra cores for reasonable prices, 6 or 8 core on a 990FX or 970 chipset.
Yet another recommendation for the Cooler Master 212+ here. Wonderful, inexpensive.
Don't skimp on the PSU, it's probably the most important part of your system.
I have a 650, and it's only really good for medium-high details at 1080p in current games. Not exactly useless, but won't make you happy. Get something higher up; a 660 is probably enough as it's a significant jump up from the 650.
I have the Antec Three Hundred Two - very good case for under 100 (Mine was 73 after taxes), holds ATX boards and the 212+, has plenty of airflow. Definitely recommended.
Also - If you're doing a lot of compiling, you'll want lots of RAM. 16GB is cheap enough that it almost doesn't make sense to buy less if you'll be able to make use of it - which you likely will when compiling.
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Side note, if you get a gigabyte board, you will have a better chance of being able to turn the machine into a hackintosh. :P
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Side note, if you get a gigabyte board, you will have a better chance of being able to turn the machine into a hackintosh. :P
I'm still stumped at why anyone would actually want to do that.
/cue flamewar :)
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Personal recommendation would be to go AMD for the extra cores for reasonable prices, 6 or 8 core on a 990FX or 970 chipset.
They don't do anything yet though! There's no advantage to having them unless you're in very specific fields.
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Like, for example, software development, where big compiles go much faster with more cores.
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Side note, if you get a gigabyte board, you will have a better chance of being able to turn the machine into a hackintosh. :P
I'm still stumped at why anyone would actually want to do that.
/cue flamewar :)
:P
In my case, I've almost always found Mac OS to not get in my way nearly as much as Windows. For the most part, it Just Works(tm) for me and what I do on my machines.
I like Mac OS 10 and it's UNIX underpinnings. I don't like where Apple is taking it with the iOS looking stuff in 10.7 and later, nor do I like their hardware designs for the midrange. iMacs are nice looking and all, but I don't like all-in-one designs.
Anyway, I mentioned it as jg18 is looking at building a machine because the current Apple designs are underwhelming in their hardware. :)
EDIT: I suppose I should mention as well that this idea really needs to be an Intel-based system. Some people have made patches to get it to run on an AMD system, but since Apple uses Intel chips, it seems to be less painful to perform the procedure w/ an Intel vs and AMD.
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Side note, if you get a gigabyte board, you will have a better chance of being able to turn the machine into a hackintosh. :P
I'm still stumped at why anyone would actually want to do that.
/cue flamewar :)
My next machine will almost certainly be a hackintosh as I have a huge catalog of logic sessions that I would lose access to if I could only run Windows/Linux. OSX also costs $20, which is a $20 more than Linux but significantly cheaper than Windows IIRC. Generally I agree with you though; hackintosh stuff probably only makes sense for very specific sets of users.
jg18: you've probably already seen this sight if you have any interest in a hackintosh, but here's a rather neatly laid out set of builds that are confirmed to work with 10.8:
http://www.tonymacx86.com/325-building-customac-buyer-s-guide-january-2013.html (http://www.tonymacx86.com/325-building-customac-buyer-s-guide-january-2013.html)
edit: ninja'd
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Your initial thoughts, and the advice you've been getting is all very good so far. I'd just like to say definitely don't skimp on the wireless card; get a recognizable, non-generic brand. I cheaped out on it when I build my computer, and it's a huge headache to install and not even very good.
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Thanks for the feedback, guys! OP updated with current tentative selection. Let me know what you think.
A few remaining things:
- Based on the discussion, I take it that the CM Hyper 212 EVO isn't worth it over the 212+?
- I doubt I'll do enough compiling to make the AMD 6- or 8- core worth it.
- I was gonna pick the Samsung 840 120 GB non-Pro SSD, but apparently it uses low-endurance NAND memory and thus isn't recommended (http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3454120). :blah: Any other ideas? The 840 Pro 128 GB is ~$40 more.
Recommendations for a magnetic screwdriver? Those look pretty useful. Are there any other tools worth getting?
Not worth buying a screwdriver just for a one-time use, unless you have bad eyesight or shaky hands. Just save one of those sample credit cards that everyone seems to get in the mail or a (clean) playing card to use to spread the thermal paste for the cpu and you have all the tools you need.
Well, my hands are a bit unsteady, so a magnetic screwdriver could well be worth it if it's not that expensive.
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you can just go to a hardware store to get that. few bucks probably. i do really like them for computer work. those screws are small and fall down onto the motherboard easy.
the answer to the EVO vs. + is... unknown. last time i did research on it, the benchmarks i found on it didn't seem to be statistically different. but then again, neither did pretty much anything in the top 10, with prices ranging from $20 to $100+. if memory serves, the evo is $5 more, so it seems to be a question of do you want to have the latest model. maybe it has a better machined surface one extra fin or something.
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you can just go to a hardware store to get that. few bucks probably. i do really like them for computer work. those screws are small and fall down onto the motherboard easy.
the answer to the EVO vs. + is... unknown. last time i did research on it, the benchmarks i found on it didn't seem to be statistically different. but then again, neither did pretty much anything in the top 10, with prices ranging from $20 to $100+. if memory serves, the evo is $5 more, so it seems to be a question of do you want to have the latest model. maybe it has a better machined surface one extra fin or something.
I think there's a difference in how the heat pipes are laid out, but I don't remember ever seeing any reviews that said it was worth the extra money. Making sure the thermal compound is applied properly is probably gonna have a bigger effect on temperatures.
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So as to your current build list: My only real issues (other than my AMD fanboy heart whimpering in protest) are that I would drop the Storage drive to a Blue or Green, and use the extra few dollars to move up to a 600 or 650 watt PSU just to have a bit of extra headroom. That said, the Seasonic units have a great reputation and the one you have picked will definitely be sufficient.
I don't know enough about SSDs to make an informed suggestion there, unfortunately.
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Thanks again for your feedback, everyone! OP updated with final list of parts. Rest assured that even if I chose not to follow your advice, I thought about it seriously and greatly appreciate it nonetheless. :) EDIT: For example, the Corsair HX650 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139012) was on sale for a good price, but the widespread complaints of chirping noises made me decide to keep the Seasonic G 550.
The last few parts just arrived, so I'll build it in the next few days. I'll try to take some pictures while I'm building it.
I made a couple last-minute changes for various reasons; for example, I ended up picking the EVO over the + because I heard it's easier to install, and the build process is gonna be challenging as it is, even after getting my YouTube degree in computer building. :eek2:
The optical drive box arrived with a dent in it. Newegg customer service wants me to test the drive before I can get it exchanged, meaning it'll take even longer before I have a proper optical drive in place, all because Newegg did a ****ty job of packing the box! :hopping: It was just in a bag without any cushioning.
Yes, I know this qualifies as a First World problem.
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i was just about to post that the kickass power supply i got was back on the same insane sale today, but i guess it doesn't matter now
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I take it you're referring to the OCZ Z Series 850W (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817341026) ($120, $90 w/rebate)? It might be worth returning the Seasonic for it, although I'd pay a 15% restocking fee (~$14). I'm in no great rush to build this thing, though, so I could wait... hmm.
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that's the one.
and don't forget about return shipping when deciding.
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Thanks for the reminder. It looks like there's no way to determine the shipping cost without actually submitting the RMA request, but based on an estimate from UPS, I doubt it's worth it, even if Newegg gets a discounted shipping rate. Thanks for mentioning it, though.
Which reminds me, I'll be :mad2: if I have to pay return shipping for the optical drive to get exchanged, given that it's their fault for not packing it properly.
Newegg does not pay for return shipping on defective merchandise, as we do not manufacture the products we carry. However, when you return an item to us for replacement, we will ship the replacement item to you at no charge.
What kind of bizarre lame excuse is that? :wtf: Amazon has always paid return shipping when I've had to return a defective item.
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That is definitely odd. Perhaps it's a difference between "defective" and damaged due to "incompetence". If it was damaged, they can probably file insurance and cover it themselves.
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it's standard industry policy that the user pays shipping for returns/rmas. my motherboard rma (that it turns out wasn't needed) cost me $22.
HOWEVER, if you hop on to newegg's support chat and ask nicely or give a semi-valid reason (like the not packaged properly thing), they will probably give you a shipping label. worked for me twice. the first time i even talked them down on the restocking fee for a return. in that case, i had a video card go bad within the return period, but decided i'd rather get a different card instead of a replacement.
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And the machine is built!
The process went smoothly for the most part, although it took most of a day.
For the thermal paste, I followed the spreading method shown in the Newegg TV video, which seemed to work OK. Installing the cooler backplate wasn't bad, but the cooler itself was kind of a pain. Took a bit to figure out how to adjust the screws to the right position and then get everything lined up while trying not to get thermal paste on my fingers or on the CPU socket holder.
The cable with the two ATX 4-pin 12V power connectors was just barely long enough to reach, so it required a small blood sacrifice to get those connectors in, followed by cleaning said sacrifice off the CPU cooler. (The aluminum fins are apparently sharper than they look.) It was worth it in the end, but now I understand the G-550 customer reviews complaining about the length of the power cables.
As for the optical drive, the drive itself looks okay and seems to work (installed Windows just fine). I'm reluctant to exchange it for another one, since there's no reason to believe that the next one they send would be any better packed than the first. I guess I could return it and get the same drive from a brick-and-mortar store. :doubt:
One issue is that the computer is a bit loud from the fans, probably because there's no fan control for the case fans, so they're always on. The exhaust fan is 3-pin and the two front fans have some proprietary connection into a single 4-pin Molex power connector. I've heard that Gigabyte boards don't have good fan control support, besides. I'd rather have it so case fan speeds get automatically controlled by system needs if possible. I'm also concerned that having the case fans always on could shorten their lifespan. Maybe I'll have to get a separate fan controller. :blah: Opinions?
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The biggest issue is that your motherboard, regardless of the quality of it's fan control, only has two additional connectors for fans - one on the top left, and one on the top right. You might be stuck picking up a fan controller. That said, the exhaust fan could likely be connected to the top left spot - unless that connector only allows for controlling fans with 4-pin PWM connections, which it may.
I haven't seen any reviews that mention the front fans only being controlled via a single molex, so that's odd. Are you sure the connections aren't just simple 4-pin PWM fan connectors into a 4-pin molex adapter? Because if they are, you can most likely disconnect the adapter and get at least one of them connected to the top right 4-pin on the board. Otherwise, you likely will need a separate fan controller to be able to adjust them.
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The board I'm using (GA-Z77X-UD5H rev. 1.1) actually has 4 fan headers: one on the top left near the back panel ports (which is where the exhaust fan is plugged in), one on the top right next to the RAM slots, one on the bottom center between various front panel headers, and one on the lower right.
The front fans might have 4-pin connectors connected into the Molex, although I don't know if the cables are long enough to reach the board. I'll have to look into it.
If I end up having to get a separate fan controller, any recommendations? I took a quick look at Hardware Secrets and Newegg and there seem to be controllers that cost around $25 and others that cost more like $50-60. Not surprisingly, I'd prefer the $25 variety. ;) Would a fan controller be able to control the exhaust fan, given that it has a 3-pin connector?
Thanks for your help.
EDIT: According to the manual (http://www.gigabyte.us/products/product-page.aspx?pid=4440#manual), the 4th fan header (bottom center one) doesn't seem to have a pin for speed control. Its pin 4 is marked "Reserve" rather than "Speed Control". Does that mean I should avoid using that header if possible?
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Oh. Information I found online about your board only shows the 3 total connectors - possibly the rev 1.1 added the additional headers.
The difference between 4-pin and 3-pin fans are that 3-pin fans can only be controlled by changing the voltage applied to the fan, while 4-pin fans are controlled using Pulse Wave Modulation. Basically they turn on and off really fast, and the distance between the intervals controls the speed. Whether the motherboard can handle both, or just PWM fans is a question the manual *should* be able to answer, though from what it looks like the motherboard can only do PWM, if the exhaust fan running full-tilt is any indication. There *might* be an adjustment in the BIOS somewhere, again, couldn't hurt to look.
Most separate fan controllers, at least ones I've seen, use voltage adjustment to control the fans, and as such it would be able to control the exhaust fan. As for brands, I've been using single-channel internal controllers on my system, so I'm not as up to date on current front panel controllers.
EDIT: After taking a look through the manual, from the pin layout on the headers, SYSFAN_1 has the ability to control by Voltage, and 2/3 only can control by PWM control (4-pin fans with speed control). 4 is only for full speed, no speed control.
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honestly, you in all likelihood don't need all those case fans. i have two running: a front intake and a rear exhaust. the exhaust is barely above room temp. the only way i get any hot air out of my rig is from the video card after a while of gaming. i'm even considering turning off the front fan. it makes an ugly round ring of dust on the case cover. :/
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I've been doing more research on the Corsair Carbide 400R's fans.
The exhaust fan has just a normal 3-pin connector, but the two front fans have a strange 3-pin connector shaped like a buckle insert that plugs into something that leads into the 4-pin molex connector, which powers the front fans and their LEDs. Details from The Tech Report (http://techreport.com/review/21759/corsair-carbide-400r-mid-tower-chassis/4) (bottom of the page, emphasis added to make a TLDR version):
Under load, the Carbide is the loudest of the bunch, but not by a huge margin. At idle, however, the difference in noise levels is more prominent. Whereas the other cases use fan controllers or have system fans that plug directly into the motherboard, which can regulate fan speeds to some degree, the 400R's front fans are tied to four-pin Molex connectors that have to be plugged directly into the PSU. This connection provides the juice necessary to spin the fans and light the LEDs, but it also restricts the fans to a constant speed, regardless of the system load.
The front fans can be separated from their Molex wiring harness, but each one has a non-standard three-pin plug. This plug can be jammed into a motherboard connector, but it doesn't play nicely with the vertical tab that extends upward from a standard fan header. You'll probably want to shave off that tab to avoid stressing the header. Also, the wire that would typically report the fan's rotational speed has been repurposed as the LED on/off circuit. When plugged into a motherboard, the LEDs glow at about 10% of their normal brightness and can't be turned off--without snipping wires.
Replacing the front fans entirely or connecting them to a fan speed controller would be the best way to reduce the Carbide's noise output. Doing so will leave the case's LED switch hanging, but I'm sure modders and tinkerers will find creative ways to use it.
Guess I'm not the only one who finds the 400R a bit noisy.
A related Corsair support thread here (http://forum.corsair.com/v3/showthread.php?t=100763). Someone had to cut off the front fan connectors' extra tabs to plug them into a fan controller.
So time to look into a fan controller. :blah: I was thinking of the NZXT Sentry Mesh (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811992007), which got good reviews (https://www.google.com/search?q=nzxt+sentry+mesh+review), is compatible enough with the black mesh of the 400R (http://forum.corsair.com/forums/showthread.php?t=99758), and is $25. The guy who had to break off the connector tabs had a 400R, though.
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And we're up and running!
NZXT Sentry Mesh is installed, although I did have to trim the front fan connectors with an X-Acto Knife like the other guy did (there goes the warranty on the case?) but now the computer is much quieter. And my Anker mouse (http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00AAQRNQ8/) just arrived, so now I should be good to go!
Thanks for your help, everyone! :)