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General FreeSpace => FreeSpace Discussion => Topic started by: mosshadow on January 31, 2015, 04:55:18 pm

Title: What kind of advanced AI is available for FSO?
Post by: mosshadow on January 31, 2015, 04:55:18 pm
I know that the campaigns Bluespace WIH and Shadow Genesis have a better AI because the BP fighters dodge better and the SG fighters can use long range missiles. Are these built into what ever software is used to make missions or did each programming team make something on their own?
Title: Re: What kind of advanced AI is available for FSO?
Post by: Boomer20 on January 31, 2015, 05:01:46 pm
They use Fury AI

http://www.mediafire.com/download/d6mdtf767a979x1/FuryAI_v9.7z

Title: Re: What kind of advanced AI is available for FSO?
Post by: mosshadow on January 31, 2015, 05:15:13 pm
Is there an easy way to tell which campaigns use it. Its pretty awesome and I would like to find more campaigns.
Title: Re: What kind of advanced AI is available for FSO?
Post by: Cyborg17 on January 31, 2015, 06:53:11 pm
Easiest way is to load up the mod in the launcher and then open FRED to see what AI profiles are available.
Title: Re: What kind of advanced AI is available for FSO?
Post by: AdmiralRalwood on January 31, 2015, 07:59:05 pm
Or take a look inside the mod's VP files to see if it has an ai_profiles.tbl file or *-aip.tbm file. If it does, there's a pretty good chance it's using Fury AI.
Title: Re: What kind of advanced AI is available for FSO?
Post by: mosshadow on January 31, 2015, 08:15:06 pm
Was fury the AI used for the Sync/Transcend end battle?
Title: Re: What kind of advanced AI is available for FSO?
Post by: Lorric on January 31, 2015, 11:32:52 pm
I think Bem Cavalgar uses Fury AI.

Wings of Dawn uses stronger AI as well.
Title: Re: What kind of advanced AI is available for FSO?
Post by: X3N0-Life-Form on February 01, 2015, 03:03:03 am
I think pretty much any mod that's been made past 2010 is gonna use the new AI features.

Was fury the AI used for the Sync/Transcend end battle?
Given the age of the mods, no.
Title: Re: What kind of advanced AI is available for FSO?
Post by: Fury on February 01, 2015, 03:10:34 am
Look guys, while I appreciate your calling it "Fury AI", I feel it is discrediting hard work of SCP coders (particularly Sushi) without whom the better AI would never have been possible. I simply made the tables while being as lazy as to delegate gameplay testing to QuantumDelta, who by the way also deserves bigger credit than I do.

This could be said to be equivalent of Esarai/Aesaar/whoever making another really cool ship, someone else making table entry for it and the ship gaining name of whoever made the table entry. Not fair at all.
Title: Re: What kind of advanced AI is available for FSO?
Post by: mosshadow on February 01, 2015, 09:53:08 am
I think pretty much any mod that's been made past 2010 is gonna use the new AI features.

Was fury the AI used for the Sync/Transcend end battle?
Given the age of the mods, no.

I thought Transcend was pretty recent but I guess I didn't check the label. I recall though that at the end there was a Perseus fighter as the boss and I am sure it moved in strange ways since It took ten minutes of going in circles to kill.
Look guys, while I appreciate your calling it "Fury AI", I feel it is discrediting hard work of SCP coders (particularly Sushi) without whom the better AI would never have been possible. I simply made the tables while being as lazy as to delegate gameplay testing to QuantumDelta, who by the way also deserves bigger credit than I do.

This could be said to be equivalent of Esarai/Aesaar/whoever making another really cool ship, someone else making table entry for it and the ship gaining name of whoever made the table entry. Not fair at all.

Oh sorry about that. Can we call it something like "SCP Advanced AI"?
Title: Re: What kind of advanced AI is available for FSO?
Post by: mjn.mixael on February 01, 2015, 09:59:07 am
People have known it as Fury AI for several years. It's far too late to change it's name....
Title: Re: What kind of advanced AI is available for FSO?
Post by: Lorric on February 01, 2015, 10:11:41 am
I thought Transcend was pretty recent but I guess I didn't check the label. I recall though that at the end there was a Perseus fighter as the boss and I am sure it moved in strange ways since It took ten minutes of going in circles to kill.
While I haven't played Transcend, Fury AI isn't the only non-retail AI out there.

As for the name, I knew the name Fury AI for a long time before I knew Fury had had a hand in it. I think it fits as a name on its own, if you disassociate Fury the member and instead associate the meaning of the word fury, I think it fits very well. I thought it was named for that before I found out about Fury.
Title: Re: What kind of advanced AI is available for FSO?
Post by: X3N0-Life-Form on February 01, 2015, 02:12:11 pm
People have known it as Fury AI for several years. It's far too late to change it's name....
As far as I'm concerned, I make a point of never calling these enhanced AI features Fury AI, due Fury's past comments on the matter. However, as Lorric pointed out, it's a pretty cool name :)
Title: Re: What kind of advanced AI is available for FSO?
Post by: SypheDMar on February 13, 2015, 09:35:22 pm
Look guys, while I appreciate your calling it "Fury AI", I feel it is discrediting hard work of SCP coders (particularly Sushi) without whom the better AI would never have been possible. I simply made the tables while being as lazy as to delegate gameplay testing to QuantumDelta, who by the way also deserves bigger credit than I do.

This could be said to be equivalent of Esarai/Aesaar/whoever making another really cool ship, someone else making table entry for it and the ship gaining name of whoever made the table entry. Not fair at all.
It's a lot easier to change your name than to tell everyone else to adopt a different name. :p

If it makes you feel better, I stopped associating the AI with you since you mentioned your issue with the name. Fury in this case becomes a modifier for AI that so happens to be your username.

That said, thanks to SCP, modders, and the community for continued awesomeness.
Title: Re: What kind of advanced AI is available for FSO?
Post by: jr2 on February 15, 2015, 09:06:39 pm
Fury AI sounds cool, though...  :(
Title: Re: What kind of advanced AI is available for FSO?
Post by: deathspeed on February 15, 2015, 09:50:41 pm
I had not associated it with the user Fury before this thread; just thought it was a cool descriptive name.  :)
Title: Re: What kind of advanced AI is available for FSO?
Post by: BirdofPrey on February 16, 2015, 01:40:14 am
Same here.  I've been a lurker mostly till the end of last year, and hadn't made a connection between what I thought was a cool name for a feature and someone's online handle.
Title: Re: What kind of advanced AI is available for FSO?
Post by: headdie on February 16, 2015, 02:27:08 am
Fury AI came about because Fury was the first to release a set of AI tables, though I only associated his files and not AI mods in general
Title: Re: What kind of advanced AI is available for FSO?
Post by: Sushi on February 16, 2015, 10:58:48 am
Look guys, while I appreciate your calling it "Fury AI", I feel it is discrediting hard work of SCP coders (particularly Sushi) without whom the better AI would never have been possible. I simply made the tables while being as lazy as to delegate gameplay testing to QuantumDelta, who by the way also deserves bigger credit than I do.

This could be said to be equivalent of Esarai/Aesaar/whoever making another really cool ship, someone else making table entry for it and the ship gaining name of whoever made the table entry. Not fair at all.

For my part, at least, I don't mind the name. All of us are building on each others' shoulders, and I think we're all very aware of that. :)
Title: Re: What kind of advanced AI is available for FSO?
Post by: Spoon on February 16, 2015, 12:26:47 pm
WoD's AI profile is named 'Strike Angels', I was just about to start making a AI table myself but then Fury released his tables, which I then used as a template. (Took a lot of work off my hands there) So while I'm not using 'Fury AI', I must admit it is a cool name. (despite Fury's objections to it  :p)

I remember back in the day, I had this super potent Cyrvan AI, which utilized glide and strafing really well, but then Sushi changed some hardcoded behavior regarding that for Diaspora, which pretty much turned the AI into a bumbling mess, where it couldn't decide to glide, turn or strafe. When I brought that up, he fiddled around with it to bring it back up to a somewhat competent degree again. But the AI just never really displayed the same ferocity after that again... (On closer inspection I am saying dumb **** here, based on old fault memory)
Namely when its turning its nose in a glide, it will rotate much slower than it should be able to, and then when the player has closed enough distance, it half way through decides that the maneuver can't be completed in time and it breaks off.

I also seem to remember that back in the 3.6.12 days, the ai behaved different from what it does now. Namely I seem to recall that the Fura'ngle would break off a joust pretty much instantly due to it having a really low courage value. (I remember talking with Quantumdelta about this too) Something that it definitely doesn't seem to do nowadays. But when I checked back using a 3.6.12 executable, the behavior I remembered it doing wasn't really happening there either. So maybe I'm just misremembering, or I should have tried checking with an even older .11 build.
Title: Re: What kind of advanced AI is available for FSO?
Post by: Gee1337 on February 16, 2015, 12:36:26 pm
I move to call it "Furious Quantum Sushi AI"  :nervous:
Title: Re: What kind of advanced AI is available for FSO?
Post by: Lorric on February 16, 2015, 12:47:48 pm
Strike Angels, eh? I'm glad I've got a name for that now.

Are there any other AI profiles out there?
Title: Re: What kind of advanced AI is available for FSO?
Post by: Fury on February 16, 2015, 12:56:24 pm
I also seem to remember that back in the 3.6.12 days, the ai behaved different from what it does now. Namely I seem to recall that the Fura'ngle would break off a joust pretty much instantly due to it having a really low courage value. (I remember talking with Quantumdelta about this too) Something that it definitely doesn't seem to do nowadays. But when I checked back using a 3.6.12 executable, the behavior I remembered it doing wasn't really happening there either. So maybe I'm just misremembering, or I should have tried checking with an even older .11 build.

And here I thought I was imagining things when I thought AI went worse after a while. I assumed it was because of tabling and I tried various alterations but nothing worked. Could there really be a regression that completely eluded Sushi? I think this is worth investigating, but alas I do not have FSO installed.

I move to call it "Furious Quantum Sushi AI"  :nervous:

:lol:

Are there any other AI profiles out there?

Eh, both AI tables contain keys and values like any other table. I believe there are in fact countless AI profiles out there.
Title: Re: What kind of advanced AI is available for FSO?
Post by: Spoon on February 16, 2015, 01:45:15 pm
And here I thought I was imagining things when I thought AI went worse after a while. I assumed it was because of tabling and I tried various alterations but nothing worked. Could there really be a regression that completely eluded Sushi? I think this is worth investigating, but alas I do not have FSO installed.
I agree, I'm going to do some testing on this.
Title: Re: What kind of advanced AI is available for FSO?
Post by: AdmiralRalwood on February 16, 2015, 01:57:07 pm
There are also occasional observations that the AI behaves differently from retail, resulting in a change in default behavior and the addition of a new table entry; for mods made before that revision, the change can feel like a regression even though it's actually restoring retail behavior to the default.
Title: Re: What kind of advanced AI is available for FSO?
Post by: Spoon on February 16, 2015, 03:11:26 pm
Testing stuff with .11 .12 .14 and 3.7.0 I couldn't actually really find real significant changes. The courage setting doesn't seem to do much at all (I dont know why I seem to remember so vividly that it did) regardless of what version its run with. No matter what ai profile or version though, the ai is hilariously incompetent at dealing with a stationary target. As long as you face in its direction it will do all sorts of dumb stuff instead of just shooting you.