Hard Light Productions Forums
General FreeSpace => FreeSpace Discussion => Topic started by: Colonol Dekker on September 04, 2002, 08:39:53 pm
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I know theres one somewhere, A reg Key, but i cant find it, reason i need it is that i have it installed but my CD's got stored away in my attic/loft, and i cant get at em for a while... any links pls ppl ?
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I think I speak upon the behalf of the entire FreeSpace community when I say, that we do not support this kind of activity towards :v: olition's FreeSpace.
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Link? lets see...
Open up attic door, walk up stairs... go to box containing FreeSpace CD Key... take it out, put code in.
easy :D
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Well Mr.Lets-rip-off-volition-by-trying-this-lame-ass-attempt-to-obtain-a-key-and-not-buy-fs2
This certainly will not help your hosting requests IMO.
Pherhaps this is more the place (http://dir.yahoo.com/Entertainment/Humor/Tasteless/Ate_My_Balls/) you should be at.
edit: by = buy
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DAMMIT, i bought entire FS1/FS2 compiliation and Red Faction fair and square !!!!! Seeing as my upstaris landing is 9 foot tall and 40 miles away, i dont see as how i can get at them right now......
And what CODE are you talking about, on a full install it only needs CD verification.... and rip :v: off for a gAME THAT ONLY COSTS £10 FOR fs1 AND fs2 , I ANT HOMELESS, I bought the game once, why should i buy it again for a CD ??
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Do you mean a no-disk patch?
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Yeah, thats exactly what i meant
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We're not saying we don't trust you, we just... um... don't trust you... :p
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Originally posted by Pegasus V
We're not saying we don't trust you, we just... um... don't trust you... :p
Whats with you people and your admin-instilled fear of gamespy\thq?
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Originally posted by demon442
Whats with you people and your admin-instilled fear of gamespy\thq?
Huh? The more sales and money that FS makes, the more chances of a sequel. No matter how remote.
I think I know what the real reason why FS2 didn't do well in sales... :blah:
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Just do yourself a favor and search for a free CD-ROM emulator. You see, they're actually legal. :)
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They even legalized DVD zone remover on the PS2. :p
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Would a No-CD patch be viewed in the same light as downloading a rip of the game? To use a No-CD patch you have to have the original CD's to install....though I guess someone could borrow the game from elsewhere, install, patch, and give the CD's back.
The question is, is it actually illegal to use No-CD patches (in general)? They could be seen as circumventing some sort of protection, though it would probably be up to :v: to determine whether patching in this manner is legal or not.
One thing to add - if the source code is freely available, then it's entirely possible to remove CD checks from the code, compile, and release. Is this sort of action expressly prohibited when modifying the source?
To get to the question at hand, yes I know where you can get a No-CD fix from. But I'm not telling you in an open channel until the admins determine the legality of such a discussion.
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...:nervous:
Whilst anyone could well claim to have bought the CD, that could be rubbish and it could well be an illegal copy as well. As such HLP has traditionally looked down on posting cracks and so on for games and fought against it quite strongly (well, I have if nobody else).
As such, wether the game is bought and legit or not doesn't matter - we have to assume that it's not. As such I don't think you should post links to cracks up here (yes, I know they exist as well).
If anyone does have a link to a crack and wants to help this person then PM or email him - don't discuss it publicly. Thats all :)
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Originally posted by Thunder
As such HLP has traditionally looked down on posting cracks and so on for games and fought against it quite strongly (well, I have if nobody else).
yeah, you've got it...
not HLP... you...
:D yeah, just search on google or astalavista or something
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The idea is reasonable, however the objections made are also reasonable. Such is the dangers of game piracy. :blah:
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Originally posted by Stealth
yeah, you've got it...
not HLP... you...
You know, I included that for people just like you. Traditionally it was me - and nobody disagreed strongly, we all found that allowing that kind of thing to happen was more trouble than it was worth.
But if it's one more thing you can poke at me for - who cares right?
Wanders off, wondering if he can be bothered to have fun with certain peoples profiles and post counts or not...
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It is more trouble than it's worth. When they released the no cd patch for the mech3 community, suddenly our numbers swelled in there, and the new people were all friends in real life with some of the veteran players. you don't have to be a rocket scientist to figure out that 2 + 2 equals horse ****. You can play mods without the CD, i almost never have mine in anymore.
They put down a combat move with mech4. it has a nocd patch, but that patch isn't compatible with the 2.5 patch that you need to play it on the zone. so you have a choice. Play without cd, or play against live oponents. Can't have both with mech4.
and if you are wanting to play fs2 over the wire, well only one in 4 needs to have a cd in anyway.
the only thing you can't do is play the campaign. or the movies. and once you have beaten the campaign 12 times...it gets old.
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Originally posted by ShadowWolf_IH
the only thing you can't do is play the campaign. or the movies. and once you have beaten the campaign 12 times...it gets old.
yeah, i beat the campaign dozens of times...
(FS1 that is)
but FS2 i haven't even beaten once. I'm on the last mission, (i think) where you have to escort the bastion or something like that :D
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That's not the last mission, close to it. I won't spill any more.
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Originally posted by Kazashi
Would a No-CD patch be viewed in the same light as downloading a rip of the game? To use a No-CD patch you have to have the original CD's to install....though I guess someone could borrow the game from elsewhere, install, patch, and give the CD's back.
You don't need the original CDs to run a no-CD patch. Lets say this all together now friends. ISO. This is how linux is distributed online. Download the ISO, burn the image to CD, install. Its as simple as that.
Forget no-CD patches. They're useless anyways since you can't use any update patches on the game once you apply the no-cd "patch". Just get a CD-ROM emulator and rip the CD to your hard drive. That way legalities are thrown out the window, and you can still play to your hearts content without scratching your precious CDs. This is perfectly legal as long as you own the game. (just like ROMs)
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Originally posted by MD-2389
You don't need the original CDs to run a no-CD patch. Lets say this all together now friends. ISO. This is how linux is distributed online. Download the ISO, burn the image to CD, install. Its as simple as that.
Forget no-CD patches. They're useless anyways since you can't use any update patches on the game once you apply the no-cd "patch". Just get a CD-ROM emulator and rip the CD to your hard drive. That way legalities are thrown out the window, and you can still play to your hearts content without scratching your precious CDs. This is perfectly legal as long as you own the game. (just like ROMs)
Making CD images of CD's you own can be a good idea, however there is still the dubiousness concerning the ownership of the game - as you mentioned ISO's can be downloaded (though it is an impediment to those lacking in bandwidth), and games can still be borrowed. And when you live in an IT-demented country like ours, copying CD's in this manner is actually illegal without the express written permission of the original artists :nervous:
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Its only illegal if you tamper with it (ala change the formats, etc....) or try to distribute it.
If it were illegal, then you wouldn't be able to buy Virtual CD off of the shelf.
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I personally have legally bought all of the games I own but get CD cracks anyway simply because I think it is just too much of a hassle to change the CDs every time. (especially since I play games in the night and it is difficult to see CD labels in a dark drawer after staring at a monitor) FS2 is one game I have never found such a patch for, but the CD checker in that is somewhat strange; missions sometimes load without any CD and sometimes do not. As for productivity (non-game) application cracks, that is entirely a different matter, but I won't get into that now.
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Originally posted by CP5670
I personally have legally bought all of the games I own but get CD cracks anyway simply because I think it is just too much of a hassle to change the CDs every time.
That's why I will sometimes use such devices, it isn't exactly easy for me to change CD after CD when I am using multiple programs in one sitting.
If anyone's interested in the Australian handling of copyright law concerning CD's and computer software, then check out the guides on http://www.copyright.org.au/page3.htm, specifically the files on Computer Software, Games, and Music: Copying CD's. Basically, we can make a backup copy of software, provided that we don't have to crack any anti-copying measurements in the process. However, this does not apply to computer games and CD's - it is illegal to make a copy of a CD without written permission or the expiration of copyright (applies for both data and music CD's).
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Legally we are entitled to (1) back up of our existing media, but if we sell or give it away we must destroy the backup...
This is posted all over at the store down the street from me that sells games for all formats (pc/consoles)...:nod:
Funny but I also think there is a caveat about is you had an acident you have to keep the disk to prove ownership (if you throw it out you gotta throw away your back up too).. Pardon me but isn't that why you have a back up? And why would you keep a messed up disk? Don't you have enough drink coasters from AOL??? :lol:
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:thepimp:
Might I suggest fs2_open (http://fs2source.warpcore.org/releases/fs2_open-3.2.zip)?
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well everything iw as goin gto say, you guys covered heh....
stealth, you haven't finished FS2 campaign? Well be carefull , on the last level when the two sathanas's close in on the aquitane make sure u gaurd the vasudan destroyers while they fire the shivan defectors' enhanced beam cannons at the them.
It's a spectacualr fire fight
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1. FreeSpace 2 is open-source. That means freeware. They don't sell FS2 much of anywhere any more, only FS1. Any copies you see of FS2 for sale, Volition likely isn't getting the money, and it doesn't change the fact that the game has been declared open-source. In fact, not only is it freeware, but you can't get much freer than it- any derivatives, imitations, clones, reverse-compilations, or programming rips are the creator's, with Volition's blessing. Get it? There's only one illegal thing you CAN do with FreeSpace, and that's rip off the corporate logos from the opening animation. Hardly a capital crime, at that.
2. There isn't going to be an FS3. One would think all of you would have figured it out when the Volition dudes said something like "Well, we work for this other company now, and they don't care about FreeSpace, so there's not going to be a FreeSpace 3, and since we can't make much more money off of FS2 we're gonna open-source it to make it up to you."
3. FS2 is freeware. It's FREEWARE. That means you can legally distribute whatever you like of it. FS1 still seems to be getting sold quite a lot, tho, and the source hasn't been released, so THAT'S not freeware.
Learn some copyright law before preaching it, you hosers.:rolleyes:
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I was bored, so I read the copyright agreement (Before the source release). It says that you can distribute it to firneds or aquantainces, free of charge. If somebody gave him a FREE copy of fs2. It wouldn't be warez.
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Bravo!
nice to see some thinking flying around here
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Originally posted by Stryke 9
1. FreeSpace 2 is open-source. That means freeware. They don't sell FS2 much of anywhere any more, only FS1. Any copies you see of FS2 for sale, Volition likely isn't getting the money, and it doesn't change the fact that the game has been declared open-source. In fact, not only is it freeware, but you can't get much freer than it- any derivatives, imitations, clones, reverse-compilations, or programming rips are the creator's, with Volition's blessing. Get it? There's only one illegal thing you CAN do with FreeSpace, and that's rip off the corporate logos from the opening animation. Hardly a capital crime, at that.
2. There isn't going to be an FS3. One would think all of you would have figured it out when the Volition dudes said something like "Well, we work for this other company now, and they don't care about FreeSpace, so there's not going to be a FreeSpace 3, and since we can't make much more money off of FS2 we're gonna open-source it to make it up to you."
3. FS2 is freeware. It's FREEWARE. That means you can legally distribute whatever you like of it. FS1 still seems to be getting sold quite a lot, tho, and the source hasn't been released, so THAT'S not freeware.
Learn some copyright law before preaching it, you hosers.:rolleyes:
Given your abuse directed at those "preaching" copyright law, I assume that I am most likely included as one of these hosers (whatever this word happens to mean this decade). In an earlier post I did make the mention that the FS2 engine was freely available in the fact that it could be modified in such a way as to remove CD checks.
I then later posted the broader copyright legislation for my country, not specifically for FS2, but for copyrighted CD's in general, since the topic had moved to making CD images. Had I added something at the end of that spiel such as "Sorry boys and girls, that means you can't copy FS", then you'd have every right to go off your rocker.
Ok, now to make another assumption that since you are able to tell off others for entering the copyright debate you must be very familiar with copyright law, and since I must not be familiar with it at all since I'm a hoser, would you like to confirm that the FS2 copyright agreement stating that you can distribute it to others is the express written permission of the developers, saying that it can be copied in the methods mentioned previously?
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From the FS2 Readme
General Product License. This copy of FreeSpace 2 (the "Software") is
intended solely for your personal non-commercial home entertainment use.
You may not decompile, reverse engineer, or disassemble the Software,
except as permitted by law. Interplay Entertainment Corp. and its
licensors retain all right, title and interest in the Software including
all intellectual property rights embodied therein and derivatives thereof.
The Software, including, without limitation, all code, data structures,
characters, images, sounds, text, screens, game play, derivative works and
all other elements of the Software may not be copied, resold, rented,
leased, distributed (electronically or otherwise), used on a pay-per-play,
coin-op or other for-charge basis, or for any commercial purpose. Any
permissions granted herein are provided on a temporary basis and can be
withdrawn by Interplay Productions at any time. All rights not expressly
granted are reserved.
Doesn`t say anywhere that you can copy it and give it to your friends. In fact it says quite the reverse.
Furthermore although the source code has been released as freeware that doesn`t mean that the rest of the game automatically becomes freeware too.
Not being a programmer I haven`t looked at any readme's included with the source but unless there is one that explicitly states that everything is freeware only the source code itself is freeware.
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I certainly do remember seeing that thing about giving copies to friends, but I cannot recall where exactly; perhaps it is in the installation...
Thing is, someone could just say that everyone in the world is his friend and use it as an excuse to put it on a warez site. :D
Although I have some sympathy with Stryke's post; this extreme anti-warez fervor is just silly.
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It says in the copyrights. in the installation. read on. I t says that you may distribute it to friends or aquantiances, free of charge.
And that part about saying everybody is your friend. If you don't know the person, how can they be your friend? Who cares? ANyway, give the guy a copy. He's you "Unnofficial" aquantaince. You know, him, just not personally. I think that :v: knew it wasn't going to sell well (Because of interplay's lack of enthusiasim), so they planned to release the source. Making the game ALMOST freeware would give more people some fun.
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1. I said "hosers" because "hosers" is a cool word. I haven't the ****ingest what it means, but I know it's an insult of some sort (a Canadian sort, I think), so this was a good excuse to use it.
2. The original copyright is now defunct. It was the minute Volition released the source. Just because something once was copyrighted, doesn't mean that it always will be so long as a copy of the legalese remains. Think, dude, they couldn't very well hack your computer and change the wording, could they?
3. Open-source means that the source code, whole or in part, is free for distribution to anyone, and that the company relinquishes all rights to it. The texes and model files CAN remain proprietary (and the movies DID), but they didn't really in this case and the prog itself is free. HLP has been using the models and texes unauthorized for a very long time, I imagine since it came into being. Are you gonna have moral qualms about it now? If so, just delete the VP files and send everything else. The recipient can download one of many user campaigns, all of which are freeware, and get the VP files from someone with a less... blinkered view of copyright law.
That is all.
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Originally posted by Hades
It says in the copyrights. in the installation. read on. I t says that you may distribute it to friends or aquantiances, free of charge.
Quote that part and give us an exact location, because to be honest, I don't believe it.
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I don't believe that, either. But it makes little difference.
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Okay, I'll reinstall tomorrow, I was going to do so anyway. I'll send you the whole copyright.
EDIT: Anyway, Freespace2 is freeware now. its open source. But I'll still post it for you.
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The CODE is free. You still need all the data files to run it.
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Yes, but you can't buy Freespace2 any more. Oh well, let's all just pause for a moment of silence to be thankful we have Freespace2.......Okay, minute's up.
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Originally posted by GalacticEmperor
The CODE is free. You still need all the data files to run it.
Exactly. The source code and the game are two seperate entities and definitely different in terms of legality. Just because the source code is out doesn't mean the game is free. It just gives the users the ability to make utilities and such for the game or mod it even further. Even then, its only enough to compile a single exe. As the poster I'm quoting said, you still need the other data files to run the game. The original copyright still applies until otherwise stated by Interplay or Volition.
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MD: No. That's not what open-source means. Read up or look at other open-source games and apps or something.
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Originally posted by Stryke 9
MD: No. That's not what open-source means. Read up or look at other open-source games and apps or something.
No it's you who is confused. Freespace is not open source. The code has been released as open source. The rest of the game was not.
ID was the first company I can think of who did this. You release the code. People port the code to other platforms and improve the game code. More people buy the game and you increase sales. ID did it with Doom. The result was ports to AmigaDOS and Linux which resulted in more sales. It worked so well they did it again with Quake.
It's a way of extending the shelf life of a game that is reaching the end of it's viable life.
Considering what wankers Interplay have been do you really believe they would give the game way for free? Or do you find it easier to believe that they would use this method to try to squeeze every last penny they can out of the Freespace series at no extra cost to them?
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The FS2 code (the engine) has been released under a fairly non-restrictive license. However, I would hesitate to call it "open-source," as that term has specific licensing requirements which the Volition source code license does not meet. Most open-source licenses allow you to sell a product based on that code, provided you make the source available; the Volition source code license prohibits that.
And the game itself -- the campaigns, models, graphics, etc. -- have not been released at all under the source code license, so the only license that applies to them is the one that comes with the game.
In other words:- you may distribute the source code, for free
- you may distribute executables, libraries, etc. for for free; AFAIK you are not required to redistribute the source along with it (a major distinction between the Volition source code license and the GPL)
- you may not charge for the source code, nor for anything built with the released source code
- you may not redistribute the original game -- executables, models, movies, etc. -- it is not covered under the source code license, and the applicable Freespace/Freespace2 license prohibits it.
Obviously, this last rule is bent a little: people release mods that contain TBLs (with original Volition data), and/or modified/re-skinned Volition models; this seems a little questionable from a strict IP perspective, but it is done all the time...
IANAL, but that's my interpretation of it. Do whatever you feel is right ;)
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Cut and paste DIRECTLY from the copyright you are shown when installing fs2
You may make copies of the Software
for your personal noncommercial home entertainment use and to give to
friends and acquaintances on a no cost noncommercial basis.
Here it is.
It is still controversal whether we can give it to people SAYING that their CDs are scratched up.
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Originally posted by Hades
You may make copies of the Software
for your personal noncommercial home entertainment use and to give to
friends and acquaintances on a no cost noncommercial basis.
Here it is.
It is still controversal whether we can give it to people SAYING that their CDs are scratched up.
Whoa.
I had no idea... I'd better go re-install (and actually read the license agreement this time)... That's very interesting.
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I thought you guys would think so. Anyway, read about to the middile, or end of the first paragraph.
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Originally posted by Hades
Here it is.
It is still controversal whether we can give it to people SAYING that their CDs are scratched up.
Oh my gosh. My apologies; you were right. I saw it with my own eyes. *shakes head* I can't believe that has been completely missed for the past 3 years! Shows how often people actually read those liscense agreements. :doubt:
But anyway, what does this mean for us? It sounds like we can freely copy the discs and give, not sell, those copies to friends and aquaintances. So what does it matter if someone's disc is scratched or if he's just claiming to have a scratched disc; essentially, there's no such thing as a warez copy of FS2, so long as it's the full 3 discs? Where's DaveB? I wanna hear his views on this!
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You DO realize that he probably had to okay it before it bot released, yeah? Might say something there. :D
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Originally posted by Stryke 9
You DO realize that he probably had to okay it before it bot released, yeah? Might say something there. :D
No duh! I wanted to hear what were the reasons behind the decision to release it with this clause in the Agreement.
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Because Volition is secretly a front for the Communist Party. Vive el Revolucion!
It's a lot less effective without the little funny accent marks.
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With a game with a title like Red Faction you honestly wonder.
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So who wants to post it in the downloads section?
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Originally posted by Hades
So who wants to post it in the downloads section?
:lol: In all actuality, I prefer to hear from DaveB about this regardless of what the liscense agreement says, just to be sure.
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I have no idea what the wording of the agreement intends. And I'm not a lawyer.
However, common sense dictates it would be a very very stupid thing to do to post the game data or executables (that is, those that come with the game).
As for the source code being "open source" - I don't even know what open source means. What you can do :
- pass the source code and any utilities or other goodies generated from this around on a hobbyist basis. You need to make sure any source code needs to contain the license agreement/notice in all the files.
What you cannot do :
- profit in any way shape or form from the source code or parts thereof. That includes derived executables, sections of code brought into other codebases etc.
Basically, you can't make any money from it, or use it in any commercial form. Its for fun only.
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I wonder....if you recompiled the code, and created new versions of every data, interface, etc file, you could distribute it as a freeware game, then, surely?
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I suppose so, but that would take a lot of work... :p
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To be honest, this is what I would like to see as a result of the source code project -- a complete game. I've posted this in the FSSCP forum, and I still maintain that it wouldn't be that tough...
The graphics (UI and HUD) -- all 2D. We'd need sounds, including persona voices, etc. (a lot of the :v: ones are getting old already, anyhow -- I cringe whenever I hear "get this bandit off of me" ;)) Wrap it up w/ a campaign or two and you have a nice TC complete w/ engine.
I'm surprised no one has jumped on the "custom HUD" thing yet at least...
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Hmmmm, they don't have to be DETAILED, just functional. You don't need the skin to be pretty to use the model, you just need a skin. Someone with a lot of time could make a very basic interface.
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Originally posted by daveb
I have no idea what the wording of the agreement intends. And I'm not a lawyer.
Bah - I'm not a lawyer either, but that sentence is the most un-legalese sentence in any liscense agreement I've ever seen. I mean, seriously:
[q]You may make copies of the Software for your personal noncommercial home entertainment use and to give to friends and acquaintances on a no cost noncommercial basis.[/q]
It says right there: freely distribute copies of the game ot friends and aquaintances, as long as you're not making money off it.
Originally posted by daveb
However, common sense dictates it would be a very very stupid thing to do to post the game data or executables (that is, those that come with the game).
And Liscense Agreements are there for the explicit purpose of taking into account every possible use of the Software purchased that could be "blamed" on this thing called "common sense".
DaveB, I'd really appreciate it if you could email someone on the Volition or Interplay team who would be able to explain and/or clarify this... if you don't mind. :)
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So no chance then? (btw i actually own 2 copies of FS2 now) i bought the original shortly after release and now i own the FS1 / FS2 twinpack (£9.99p inc P+P white label Virgin interactive from generic website) And silent threat doesn't work on my new copy of FS1 (my old FS1 is in the same loft at my house) Any info on why silent threat dont work? any links to any FS1 PATCHES, (no not hacks)
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If you read the copyright at install, it says you can freely distribute it as long as you don't get any money from it. But I think of you read the copyright in the fs2 directory, after install, it says you can't distribute it. Isn't that weird?
In the copyright it says that you can't reverse engineer it, or MOD it. The VBB supported MODing. Think about that.
Also think about this. Your brain has two sides, so does your a$$.
Think about that. :D
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Originally posted by Vertigo1
Forget no-CD patches. They're useless anyways since you can't use any update patches on the game once you apply the no-cd "patch".
That's why you usually keep a backup copy of the replaced EXE. When you need to update, you bring the EXE back, patch, then download a new CD crack.
As to whether or not Colonol Dekker actually owns the game, well there's a simple way to find out. What do the pictures on the CDs show?
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*sniff, sniff*
Wow, this topic's a tad ripe! Why'd you have to go and dig it up, Executor?
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I only visit HLP every few months. It's not like this board is overflowing with new posts anyway.
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Originally posted by Kazashi
That's why I will sometimes use such devices, it isn't exactly easy for me to change CD after CD when I am using multiple programs in one sitting.
If anyone's interested in the Australian handling of copyright law concerning CD's and computer software, then check out the guides on http://www.copyright.org.au/page3.htm, specifically the files on Computer Software, Games, and Music: Copying CD's. Basically, we can make a backup copy of software, provided that we don't have to crack any anti-copying measurements in the process. However, this does not apply to computer games and CD's - it is illegal to make a copy of a CD without written permission or the expiration of copyright (applies for both data and music CD's).
In Denmark, you can make a backup of everything, just as long as you own the CD whatever there is on it.
analog to digital:not allowed(and why should one).
analog to analog:allowed for backing up
digital to analog; not allowed(and why should one).
digital to digital; allowed for backing-up
The freespace Cd-roms even comes with no counter measering copy format.