Hard Light Productions Forums
Off-Topic Discussion => General Discussion => Topic started by: Vertigo1 on September 05, 2002, 11:30:19 pm
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http://www.cnn.com/2002/WORLD/europe/09/05/germany.osama/index.html
If you ask me, those two should be forcibly neutered with the dullest rusty blade there is, and then immediately dunked in the dead sea. Then take away the child for its own good.
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Yeah, let's kill those bastards! How DARE they express their political beliefs! They should force them to change the baby's name to, I dunno, George Washington!
Geez, it's people expressing beliefs like this which screws up the whole concept of freedom to express beliefs! If only they'd start worshiping those local heroes we happen to like at the moment!
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Originally posted by Stryke 9
Yeah, let's kill those bastards! How DARE they express their political beliefs! They should force them to change the baby's name to, I dunno, George Washington!
Geez, it's people expressing beliefs like this which screws up the whole concept of freedom to express beliefs! If only they'd start worshiping those local heroes we happen to like at the moment!
Thats not the point and you know it. They're trying to name their child after a frelling MURDERER! Do you realize what that child would go through if that were to happen? Do you have any IDEA what the poor kid would put up with, if he even survives, later in life?
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Originally posted by MD-2389
Thats not the point and you know it. They're trying to name their child after a frelling MURDERER! Do you realize what that child would go through if that were to happen? Do you have any IDEA what the poor kid would put up with, if he even survives, later in life?
:nod: The kid would be dead before his 10th... I don't mind them expressing their political beliefs (Although I REALLY don't agree with them) but the shouldn't force it on someone else. Especially their own children....
But I guess its their way of life... :( Its sad to see that ppl on this world still force their beliefes on someone else...
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Originally posted by MD-2389
Thats not the point and you know it. They're trying to name their child after a frelling MURDERER! Do you realize what that child would go through if that were to happen? Do you have any IDEA what the poor kid would put up with, if he even survives, later in life?
unfortunately children do not have much freedom (i.e. much of the child's self is decided by adults, at least in early age) anyway so in this case I think the parents have the right to name the baby that.
And on a different note, if I named my child "Adolf" or even "William" is that a problem to you? I'm sure there's been a murderer named william before. How about YOU, is your name the name of some murderer? Who cares anyway, any mature twit would know that names are hardly worth any value as far as mental/emotional obligation/mindset goes...
I commend theese people for being bold about their erm... beliefs... but just use a dog or something instead of their children, gawd
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What makes you think the child won't share his parents' views? It's a rare kid who doesn't, PARTICULARLY when the parents are fringers.
Kid might get some **** from other kids. So? Some kid always ends up being the one who gets to get the **** kicked out of him. You might as well say it's inhuman cruelty for a parent to name a kid something like "Gustavus", or (particularly) to teach the kid to like to read more than to play some stupid sport.
Anyway. It's the parents' business how they wanna raise their kid, and theirs alone, until the kid's old enough to get a say in the matter. So sometimes people raise children in odd ways. So? What are you gonna do about it? Government regulation of the family is an infinitely greater evil than ANYTHING that a parent can do if they can do anything they want.
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I was named after "William" the conquerer, got a problem with dat?;7
Know what's worse? Having the same first name as a Shivan... I mean really, what were my parents thinking?
Carl "William" Crocker...???
:lol:
No offense Carl...
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The big point of complaint with this case looks to be that they want to call the child "Osama bin Laden", rather than just sticking with something like Osama, or Adolf, or William. Millions of people aside from the notorious centers of attention have also used these names - however, it would be comparatively rare to find more than one "Osama bin Laden" combination, and the fact that it isn't a common name like James Smith leads to the overwhelming recognition between the afforementioned name and the terrorist himself. The same would be said if Mr. and Mrs. Hitler named their son Adolf, or if Mr. and Mrs. Conquerer named their son William ;)
Enough babble from me tonight....
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*points out the name Lucy*
I think calling your kid 'Osama Bin Laden Supreme Leader Of The World Most Infamous Terrorist Group Smith' is relative tame compared to naming your child after Satan.
They're trying to name their child after a frelling MURDERER
I take it that you've seen him actually kill someone then?
And also, it's times like these when the bible can enlighten us on such issues:
Judge lest ye be judged.
Or in plain, modern English: Not your job to tell people what's right and wrong. If you do, expect God to **** you up.
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Assuming there is a God of course...
I'm against them doing this, but not because of the name - it's only a name. However the child will have to live with that name for the rest of its life, unless it changes it of course.
Thus the parents should be allowed to call the kid what they like - but if it affects the kid (which this will) that's different.
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Pfft, names. Just give the damn kid a number, tattoo it as a barcode on his neck for reference, and you're done.
:D
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:doubt: I dunno Styxx...I wouldn't be too keen on going through life being called "THX-1138" or "TK-421" or something...
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Didn't we track some of his supporters to germany a year ago? While i think this is deplorable, they have different views. They are obviously supporters of osama. Whether that support is direct, or simply beleifs. If that support is direct, it will be uncovered and they will be dealt with. If it is a matter of them beleiving in what he is doing.....you have to remember that the world of islam sees us as their great devil. We stand with israel. This isn't a war over borders, it's a holy war. While i am thoroughly disgusted and as enraged as any other who saw the towers collapse, if we think about it logically, he attacked us in a manner that was nearly military. He was meaning to cripple the US.
1. Throw us into economic turmoil. (WTC)
2. take out our military leaders (Pentagon)
3. Take out our upper levels of government (capitol building)
The fourth plane was more than likely heading to the capitol building, congress, both houses, were in session that morning.
Once again i can think of worse fates for him than the CIA can, but i have a hard time seeing this as an act of terror. It wasn't meant to scare the United States or her people, it was meant to cripple us as a nation. That makes it an act of war. We call it terrorism because it wasn't purpetrated by a government. Has anyone thought that maybe our own people who threw tea into Boston harbor were considered terrorists by King George III?
Some people will view him as a revolutionary. Some will see him as a hero. That's thier perogative. I see him as an enemy. Yes he is a terrorist. 99% of his targets are civilians. Outside of a few other ops, he doesn't normally pull anything that can be remotely considered Military in nature, as far as war goes.
As far as naming the child goes. They think they are naming him after a hero. And reguardless what we feel, Osama is a hero to those people. Much as it pains me to admit it.
If i have offended anyone i will apologize now. But this country was founded on freedom. That tolerance has bitten us a few times, but we cannot foresake our foundations or our beliefs because of what one small group has done. While i may disagree with them naming the child Osama bin Laden, i can be glad that they don't live in America, where they would be able to just do it.
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And yet they choose to ignore the fact that the Quran specifically bans violence against civilians... horrible, just horrible...
I could understand if they wanted to name him Osama, for whatever reason, but the Bin Laden part is overkill, even for extremists.
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At the rate the western world is ramming its own head up its arse I'm starting to think a few bombs going off here and there is a good thing.
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Oh it was in Germany...
well, you know how totally paranoid they are about violence over there anyway.
Cant display a game with blood on the counter....bah.
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Originally posted by Styxx
Pfft, names. Just give the damn kid a number, tattoo it as a barcode on his neck for reference, and you're done.
:D
Mmmmmm. Alba. They should actually tattoo data regarding the childs genetic make-up and any incurable virii onto it's back and update throughout it's life.
I wouldn't be too keen on going through life being called "THX-1138" or "TK-421" or something
THX-1138 kicks ass. And just think, there'd be one kid called AK-47 and another called B-52. That would be soooooo cool.
And yet they choose to ignore the fact that the Quran specifically bans violence against civilians... horrible, just horrible...
So. The bible bans homosexuality.
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Originally posted by an0n
So. The bible bans homosexuality.
:nervous:
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Originally posted by wEvil
At the rate the western world is ramming its own head up its arse I'm starting to think a few bombs going off here and there is a good thing.
:blah: :wtf:
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Originally posted by Zeronet
:blah: :wtf:
:blah: :wtf: to you too :doubt:
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It's.....a name, it's not your name. Were we all suddenly appointed name accepters of the world? Are we to collectively tell people what to name their children? Go back to what you were doing and let these people name their kid whatever.
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and by dropping a few bombs we accomplish......more loss of life? I'm sorry, but i don't see where killing some western world people will help the situation. Perhaps if we weren't so smug and secure in ourselves 9-11 could have been avoided. Perhaps if it weren't for the false sense of security we had, we could have stopped them before they got to airplanes. Perhaps, perhaps, perhaps. The fact is, no matter how lax our security was, no matter how false our sense of security was, we were attacked. They brought it into our backyard. when you decide to say that maybe we should drop a few more bombs over here, you say that everything that has happened to the US is a good thing. You negate the very freedoms which i personally fought for. And you belittle the lives that have been lost throughout the last 200 years defending the blanket of freedom that you sleep under. Am i a combat veteran? Yes i am. So take your bleeding heart garbage elsewhere. When you advocate the taking of american lives simply because you don't happen to agree with a few things that are going on, you are dead wrong. These are my personnal feelings on the matter, and as such not subject to a fact finding committee. If this missive offends you in any way...i don't really give a ****, but don't expect us to sit here idly while you discuss the taking of more american lives.
and that's the last i'll say on the subject.
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I don't agree with the taking of any life as such. But **** happens, and if it's gotta come down to one nationality, it might as well be Americans.
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Originally posted by an0n
And also, it's times like these when the bible can enlighten us on such issues:
Judge lest ye be judged.
Or in plain, modern English: Not your job to tell people what's right and wrong. If you do, expect God to **** you up.
Good thing I'm an athiest. :D
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Originally posted by MD-2389
Good thing I'm an athiest. :D
Ditto. Woo! ^^;;
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So far everything in this article an0n has said checks out ;)
Osama would be fine, Bin Laden, blatent support, but like other's have said, that's their perogitive. It's a good thing they live in germany, cause if that kid gets anywhere near the U.S. , particularly NYC , you're gonna have a shooting. With how confused some of those kids must be, i diffintitly wouldn't be surprised if a teenager went to school in NYC (or any other city)and had a name like Bin Laden and was brutally mammed/killed. Yes it's sad but it's true.
I also don't see how you can be a dedicated Christen, yet non homophobic.
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...Because Christ didn't say **** about hating people?
...Because, despite common interpretation, "love" in the Bible is not defined as ostracize, meddle in he life of, or kill?
...Because, if you're a Christian, Christ's doctrines of universal tolerance take precedence over the monstrous, obscene, and downright silly laws of the Old Testament?
I find it disturbing that I'm an agnostic and I know more about Christianity than most Christians.:rolleyes:
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I'm going to go against public opinion here and say flat out that homosexuals should be stoned to death, as set forth in the Old Testament.
I find it quite irritating that religions would over-rule founding principles of their belief system.
No, actually, infact, **** God. Go forth and sodomize.
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And
ShadowWolf: When, exactly, was America a bastiuon of freedom in any more than name? As I recall, we were pretty much the last nation in the world to abolish slavery- and while de jure segregation is no longer legal nor in existence here, de facto most certainly is, and America is world-famous for its racial discrimination. Nowhere else do people have such problems getting along, short of nations engaging in outright civil war and genocide. America is the last Western nation to maintain an imperialistic policy of interfering in other nations' local difficulties, which are none of our business, and few other industrialized Western nations retain such puritanical and draconian policies against victimless crimes- 200,000 people in America are jailed for marijuana violations alone, for smoking a plant no more harmful than tobacco, and considerably less than alcohol. America is also famous for overthrowing local governments to install despotic tyrants who will serve our interests- in fact, as has been much publicized, a few of those murderous despots we put in power have come back to bite us in the ass, which is the reason we dislike them. We're possibly the least free industrialized Western nation in the world, and yet we never tire of harping on how great we are.
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[rides an0n like a stallion]
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Copy-pasted?
*runs*
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*neighs and gallops*
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We're simply the-best! duh- duhn- duhn- duh, better than every-one!" sing along guys!:D
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Originally posted by Knight Templar
We're simply the-best! duh- duhn- duhn- duh, better than every-one!" sing along guys!:D
*puts fish-hooks through KT's eyes and pulls sharply on the attatched wire*
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hey there, i'll be needing those back soon enough, i'm not tall enough yet to be a cool looking blind man = :cool:
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If you continue to sing Tina Turner songs, your eyes won't be the only spherical body parts you'll be losing.
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If you continue to sing Tina Turner songs, your eyes won't be the only spherical body parts you'll be losing.
ooo you'd like that, wouldn't you? :wink:
i don't want to fight, really, i just want to be everyone's friend. Especially er-fun people like you man! ;)
I actually had no idea that was a tina turner bit.. it so is now that i think bout' it tho..:nervous:
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i see
the name is a name like any other
in islamic culture names sometimes consist of 2 part, like Ahmed al Rashid or something]
therefore Osama Bin Laden might be a legitamte name, how do you know the parents inteded it to be wrong
ok please dont refer to people as a religous group. saying "islam" is against us and with bin laden is like saying the jews control the banks and the christians are evil. some muslims condone it. most dont. some christians condone neo-nazism, mopst dont.
"When you advocate the taking of american lives simply because you don't happen to agree with a few things that are going on, you are dead wrong."
ok how about this, when you condone the taking of "foreign (serb, muslim, etc etc)" life, simply because you can, simply because you need to get you military in that specific place so it can stay there and look after americ interests, you are wrong.
whats the difference between a child walking down the street in bagdad and in chicago. well nothing, except that the one in bagdad is about to get bombed.
do you know how many civilian casualties the us wracks up. combs dont discriminate and even if they did, the us wouldnot
so from now on if you wish to argue, say that the us is bombing civilians instead of otherwise. then, if you live with that and still argue, i'm right here.
statistically speaking the us has more than payed back for 9-11. say about 5000-10000 people died. just as many died in afganiostan and other places the us saw fit to bomb.
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Originally posted by Rictor
is like saying the jews control the banks and the christians are evil.
But they do, and they are.
And on a related note: Britain and the US have bombed some Iraqi installations.
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but surely the media would inform us of such US inflicted casualties.... they did when american pilots "accidently" hit that Canadian troop convoy or whatever.
that is a huge screw up to make
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But they do, and they are.
memories of my 8th grade history/english teacher (jewish) flashing by.... i had no idea Jews were that into money until he informed me.. heh
sufficed to say, it was his first year teaching
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Templar: Actually, about that many Afghan deaths WERE reported... the articles just never exactly got headline coverage, and only were reported once, unlike stories about US citizen deaths. I think that story about the entire town being wiped out by American carpet-bombers was the only one that came close to a big story over here, and even that didn't last long.
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sorry, forgot to attach the sarcsm tags.
We would never self knowingly publicise our own stupidity and sheer evilness... perhaps one reason is we are always "the good guys"
well at least to ourselves....
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Like I said, we did publicize. It's less a conspiracy than the convienient fact that, 90% of the time, the American public as a mass doesn't give half a moldy rat **** about what happens to the rest of the world. News ain't news unless you can provoke people to care, and atrocities committed by US troops overseas only fits the bill 20 years after it happened.
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[sarcasm]Yea, but I still blame forgieners. [/sarcasm]
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i distinctly remember being finished with this. Stryke you sound fairly educated. It all boils down to a matter of heart, don't you think? i know where mine is. I fought for something i beleive in. You do the same, in your own way.
Maybe i just think about things wrong when i decide that all of this is my backyard. When i decide that even people i don't like are my neighbors, even at 1000 miles away. Maybe i was wrong about doing everything i can to protect something. Maybe i was wrong to try and stop the flow of cocaine into my home town. maybe i was wrong trying to make things a little better for when my kids go to school. Maybe i didn't make a difference. Then again, i didn't sit there and ***** about what was wrong, i got up and did something. Even if i failed.
i never said it was perfect. but on the other hand, if i am going to ***** about something, then i am going to do one of two things, remove myself from the item that i ***** about, or try to change it. You choose to see only the bad, i choose to see the good as well.
no one says anyone has to live here that doesn't want to be here. you can always go elsewhere if it isn't good enough for you here.
And you are right about marijuanna, and alcohol, and cigarettes. Fortunately, i grew up, and away from them. They should all be illegal as far as i am concerned. We are also far too lax on crime. Japan has a very low crime rate, because of how stiff the penalites are. Start cutting hands off of theives and see how quickly burglary drops. Start castrating people (which on the issue of rape is highly warranted as far as i am concerned) and see how fast rape drops.
now, this is the last i will say on the subject. You get a rebuttle. Then we close it. agreed?
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...Or just don't attempt to force people into masses of a hundred million, and see how few crimes happen in small, localized communities. The microstate theory has held out excellently so far- more than you can say for most government systems. But that's beside the point. It's inhuman to castrate people, it's twisted to lock them in cages, and it's even more so to do all this when it's unnecessary. You know, if you stick a hot iron in a kid's eyeballs every time he sucks his thumb, he'll learn to stop pretty fast. That doesn't mean that's how you teach him to stop sucking his thumb.
Who says I'm not doing anything about it? One thing to do about it is to teach people where the country can (at the very least) be improved (or, in this case, explore whether or not we should just toss the damn thing out and start from scratch). For one thing, what you're talking about is completely irrelevant- stopping rapacious drug dealers from using Machiavellian tricks to make themselves rich, and ruining lives in the process, is completely different from blowing up some Afghan farmhand for some politics he knows nothing about, is completely different from siccing racist, brutal cops on the people to gun down blacks, dissenters, and anyone else in the way, is completely different from using our global influence to rape small nations of their resources, as we once did of their manpower, and foist our ideas of government on them. And it's completely different from having a soulless, materialistic society where human contact is something to avoid, where everyone has to cover their ass to keep from getting sued for someone else's idiocy, and where the one goal in life is the aimless, endless accumulation of money. THESE are the things I'm fighting, these are the things thousands are, separated and unable to join forces due to the disarray modern political bull**** has left the revolutionary movement in. There is no "U.S" and "Non- U.S." There are some things worth preserving. THEY are not of interest here, and they can be dealt with far better, when the time comes. But now, it's time to destroy the greater evils of society, to attempt to really make things better for everyone, instead of nitpicking at what are, relatively speaking, little civic projects.
Legalize the so-called victimless "crimes", and such things as the drug industry become a buyer's market. If some cartel or dealer is screwing the people, selling dangerous poisons as drugs, or messing up little kids, it won't be in operation for very long, for the same reason that any company shipping products not worth their cost will fail. Get rid of the money fetish, and suddenly decent teachers will work in the ghetto, or wherever they're needed, because they are looking for fulfillment in their work itself, not in how much imaginary green paper they can hoard.
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Originally posted by ShadowWolf_IH
Didn't we track some of his supporters to germany a year ago? While i think this is deplorable, they have different views. They are obviously supporters of osama. Whether that support is direct, or simply beleifs. If that support is direct, it will be uncovered and they will be dealt with. If it is a matter of them beleiving in what he is doing.....you have to remember that the world of islam sees us as their great devil. We stand with israel. This isn't a war over borders, it's a holy war.
So you want another crusade? "An eye for an eye until the whole world goes blind?" This will just stir up more hatred, which leads to more hatred. The cycle goes on until we destroy each other. Give them love and forgiveness, and eventually, they will return the love and forgiveness.
While i am thoroughly disgusted and as enraged as any other who saw the towers collapse, if we think about it logically, he attacked us in a manner that was nearly military. He was meaning to cripple the US.
Bull****. The WTC, as big as important as it is, constitutes a meer fraction of a fraction of our economy. But because of his huge sybolic presence, far more damage was done because it simply frightend us, which also drained our economy. Think of bin Laden's mentality. He grew up and lives where money has almost no meaning. Hell, he views our economy and concern over money as another reason for us to be Satan. He wanted to frighten us, make us pay. And he did. When you sing God Bless America every day and put your flag up because of 9/11, honestly, you aren't doing it because you love America suddenly when you feel threatened. Your message is: Don't screw with me, I'm American. Mess with me and I whoop you ass. We're freaking ignorant, and the rest of the world pays because of it.
Once again i can think of worse fates for him than the CIA can, but i have a hard time seeing this as an act of terror. It wasn't meant to scare the United States or her people, it was meant to cripple us as a nation. That makes it an act of war. We call it terrorism because it wasn't purpetrated by a government. Has anyone thought that maybe our own people who threw tea into Boston harbor were considered terrorists by King George III?
Point of view, my friend, something that my fellow Americans have completly forgotten. We don't always know best. Get over it.
As far as naming the child goes. They think they are naming him after a hero. And reguardless what we feel, Osama is a hero to those people. Much as it pains me to admit it.
Again, point of view. I don't support giving him that name, for the child's sake, but that's something you don't have a right to decide over.
If i have offended anyone i will apologize now. But this country was founded on freedom. That tolerance has bitten us a few times, but we cannot foresake our foundations or our beliefs because of what one small group has done. While I may disagree with them naming the child Osama bin Laden, i can be glad that they don't live in America, where they would be able to just do it.
Funny about that. We seem to do thing exactly opposite what we stand for. "Of course, our country is based on freedom and equality. One's trying to get away. Nail that nigger!" Of course, I never heard of anyone say that, but you get my point (and yes, I probably offended someone). Bottom line: Our true principles and values reveal themselves in our actions, not our statements.
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Originally posted by Stryke 9
You might as well say it's inhuman cruelty for a parent to name a kid something like "Gustavus", or (particularly) to teach the kid to like to read more than to play some stupid sport.
ehh.... Gustavus? wtf's wrong with Gustavus?
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There is nothing inherently wrong with doing what these people want to do, but it would probably be detrimental for both the parents and the child, since the parents would be likely put under constant surveillance and the child would probably be killed by a mob at an early age.
Pfft, names. Just give the damn kid a number, tattoo it as a barcode on his neck for reference, and you're done.
Ah, now this is the right idea; I was hoping someone would bring this up when I saw the first few posts.
THX-1138 kicks ass. And just think, there'd be one kid called AK-47 and another called B-52. That would be soooooo cool.
Yes, indeed! Actually, I would like a number such as 142857 or 52631578947368421... ;7
Government regulation of the family is an infinitely greater evil than ANYTHING that a parent can do if they can do anything they want.
This has to be one of the stupidest things I have heard here. Who are you to decide what is "evil" and what is not? :rolleyes:
So you want another crusade? "An eye for an eye until the whole world goes blind?" This will just stir up more hatred, which leads to more hatred. The cycle goes on until we destroy each other. Give them love and forgiveness, and eventually, they will return the love and forgiveness.
Actually, there will likely still be someone left; it is difficult to completely get rid of both sides in a conflict. As for the last statement, this is what that fool Gandhi tried to do 50 years ago, and look where it got his nation. :p
message is: Don't screw with me, I'm American. Mess with me and I whoop you ass.
Exactly, that's the way the world works. You don't like it, too bad. :p
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Reading through this thread I can't help but share wEvil's, Rictor's, and stryke9's views. And I have been giving serious thought to what wevil said about the many of us out there without any means of getting arround the US...that was really profound.
The only solution to all the hate, killing, corruption, and for all you brainwashed americans: terrorism is one final world war that wipes out mankind completely.
PS: If I offended you: Good. I am me, you have no right to judge me to yourself or any others, your just like me: human.
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ShadowWolf if you still bother to read here:
look i know that you fought for America and that you must feel very proud, but isnt it better to keep your mind open to the possibility of you being wrong, just as i try to keep mine
you fought for your country cause you love it and want to defend the people in it. most people do it for that reason. mopst iraqis. most afgans. just as you see bin laden as a murdered so do other see bush.
no wonder the world is pissed. you set the rules and not the majority. *not sure* did you know that the us has troops in all sorts of foreign countries, even allied ones, like germany*not sure*. how would you feel if say germany wanted to put its troops in america. i'm pretty sure that you werent invited there either either.
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If you fail to try and undertand the opposite sides' viewpoint, and fail to try and change it through changing yourself and realising your mistakes, then you give the other side justification for their feelings.
Terrorism is wrong, of course.... but ignoring the reasons for it justifies their actions to the terrorist. Unfortunately, an eye for an eye approach to attacks doesn't seem to work in Israel, and it's not really worked for the US in their war against terrorism either.
I'd think it's more effective to remove the root causes of terrorism, and which make people become terrorists, than to try and kill an enemy that sees death as martyrdom. Because otherwise you'd just strengthen them by giving them more martyrs to attract support.
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Originally posted by demon442
Reading through this thread I can't help but share wEvil's, Rictor's, and stryke9's views. And I have been giving serious thought to what wevil said about the many of us out there without any means of getting arround the US...that was really profound.
The only solution to all the hate, killing, corruption, and for all you brainwashed americans: terrorism is one final world war that wipes out mankind completely.
PS: If I offended you: Good. I am me, you have no right to judge me to yourself or any others, your just like me: human.
This is an instance where propaganda works. Where the often state controlled muslim media portrays the evil America war against Islam.
I say let them call their kid that and when nobody speaks to him and he is ridiculed, he will hate his parents.
Also on this very misinformed statement about troops in foreign countries. The US spends most of the time outside US PEACEKEEPING, its a NATO member, it keeps troops in Kuwait to defend against Iraq. The fact their are troops in allied countires is very logical and they were invited, helps move em to places where they are needed. Britian has bases in Germany, it all stems back to the cold war when we had Bases in West Germany to protect against attack from the Warsaw Pact. Its sheer lunacy to suggest they arent allowed their and arent welcome. I could write reams upon reams about this.
The Reasons we are RIGHT, is because we use war only when we have to. Saddamn has had since 1992 to comply with the Resolutions, technically we are still at war with Iraq, because only a ceasefire was signed, which he has broken. Also we havent even made a decision to attack him, no decision has been made.
The coalition so far, has only attacked during the war on terrorism, Afganistan really and removed the Taliban(much to the delight of the Afganis).
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This is an instance where propaganda works. Where the often state controlled muslim media portrays the evil America war against Islam.
Another good example is every news report, news paper and Imperialist Kingdom pamphlet you've ever read.
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Thank you Rictor. And now that i've had my day to settle down, (and trust me on this, it usually takes that long when i get riled up). Let me try to explain this calmly.
I fought. I'm not at all proud of what i did. I think that there has got to be another way to get our point across. The wanton taking of human life has got to stop somewhere. There is no pride in what i've had to do. The big lesson i discovered along the way, is that i was wonrg going in. I thought of the glory of combat. Now when i look back i find that the only real glory of combat is surviving it. Do i agree that the world as we know it is pretty screwed? You're damned right i do. Some things are worth fighting for. Most things aren't. I didn't fight so thati could keep my car from being stolen, that's replaceable. Somewhere, across a line in dirt, a man was doing his job, and had to die. He probably had a wife and kids, and he wouldn't be going home that night, simply because he had seen us. He wasn't a military target. He died to preserve operational security. There is no honor in that. When it comes down to the wire, i probably hate my own actions every bit as much as those of our terrorists. And because i hate what i've done, but done what i had to, i get downright angry when i (probably mistakenly) see someone trodding all over that, as if the actions of people who did it created a welcome mat to wipe our feet on.
Stryke. I know that castration is inhuman. no more so than rape. To be perfectly honest, i abhor violence. I hate it. I hate what it does to both the victim and the perp. I hope that you never have cause to study rape. I hope that you never scrounge all of the books that you can so that you can help someone go from victim to survivor. I hope that you never quit a job as a bouncer, just because you are her sense of security and 60 dollars for 5 hours work just isn't enough money when you see what it does to her to see that sense of security being threatened, even inadvertently.
now we are all fairly intelligent people, i don't think that (at the risk of sounding rude) people of lesser intelligence can create some of the things we create here. As such, maybe if we all pay a little more attention (me included) to the spirit of a post, and not to whether or not every i is crossed and every t is dotted we would be better off. At least in this little corner of our existence.
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Originally posted by Zeronet
This is an instance where propaganda works. Where the often state controlled muslim media portrays the evil America war against Islam.
I say let them call their kid that and when nobody speaks to him and he is ridiculed, he will hate his parents.
Also on this very misinformed statement about troops in foreign countries. The US spends most of the time outside US PEACEKEEPING, its a NATO member, it keeps troops in Kuwait to defend against Iraq. The fact their are troops in allied countires is very logical and they were invited, helps move em to places where they are needed. Britian has bases in Germany, it all stems back to the cold war when we had Bases in West Germany to protect against attack from the Warsaw Pact. Its sheer lunacy to suggest they arent allowed their and arent welcome. I could write reams upon reams about this.
The Reasons we are RIGHT, is because we use war only when we have to. Saddamn has had since 1992 to comply with the Resolutions, technically we are still at war with Iraq, because only a ceasefire was signed, which he has broken. Also we havent even made a decision to attack him, no decision has been made.
The coalition so far, has only attacked during the war on terrorism, Afganistan really and removed the Taliban(much to the delight of the Afganis).
Yeah, and we don't have to go to war right now. Saddamn is a chicken. He wouldn't use chemical weapons during the Gulf War because he was afraid we would use nukes. He won't use them directly, and he knows if he gives them to a terrorist who does it for him, he'll be the first person on the the US's kill/damn to hell/who cares if will kill civillians list.
PROPHECY: If we invade Iraq, we'll get a rude shock like no other. Now lets see how good my ESP was working.
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Originally posted by Mr. Vega
PROPHECY: If we invade Iraq, we'll get a rude shock like no other. Now lets see how good my ESP was working.
*waits 4 months*
*turns on ESPN*
*sees reports of a flourine gas attack at a Lakers game*
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I don't think Sdaam Hussein would pose a credible threat to any ground forces, because he has relatively few trained loyal troops, and little by way of air defences.
The problem is the fallout within the Muslim world, who will see this as an attack on their religion. Take, for example, Zimbabwe or North Korea, who could both be designated as legitmate targets - but have never been targeted or even threatened. Or Communist Cuba.
The truth is, this whole Iraq thing has simply established a nice smokescreen for Osama Bin Laden - it's caused, I think, the redeployment of US troops to Qatar, et al, and that will rpobably give him leeway.
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Originally posted by Rictor
how would you feel if say germany wanted to put its troops in america.
Ummm....Germany has some of it's airforce stationed in Nevada.
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Ummm....Germany has some of it's airforce stationed in Nevada.
seriously? why?
:shaking: :nervous: :shaking:
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This is an instance where propaganda works. Where the often state controlled muslim media portrays the evil America war against Islam.
You've seen the Communist Conspiracy in Hollywood.
You've seen the Liberal News Conspiracy.
And now, Tinfoil Hat Productions (the creators of The Jews are Trying to Take Over the World) presents...
THE ISLAMIC MEDIA CONSPIRACY!
Coming soon to a fallout bunker near you.
Really. Cos, you know, nobody could possibly think these things through themselves. They have to hear it from someone with an evil ulterior motive. :rolleyes:
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Originally posted by Knight Templar
seriously? why?
:shaking: :nervous: :shaking:
Um....
Red Flag anyone?
http://www.nellis.af.mil/redflag/
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lol You saved me a search there Blue. :)
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Originally posted by Styxx
Pfft, names. Just give the damn kid a number, tattoo it as a barcode on his neck for reference, and you're done.
:D
heh, the Germans already have experience with that too :p