Hard Light Productions Forums
Off-Topic Discussion => General Discussion => Topic started by: Pegasus V on September 10, 2002, 11:47:47 pm
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Do you think this would be a bad thing? What problems do you think would arise if the world accepted the US to be the supreme authority of Earth? I would like to know your opinions.
Thanks.
-PS. What about Australia? :nervous: Crikey! :eek2:
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lol grea topic, i'll make a "smart" post tommarow. As for auzzieland...
every aeroplane with a roo' on the side! Crikey, Good Blimey!
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What do you mean, what if? The USA runs world politics, the UN, culture, and language already. :sigh:
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Hopefully the supremacy would only be governmental... now if it was food/culture etc. I'd run away to Mars.... actually I'd run to mars anyway.
Now that we have our supreme idiot and evil dude ruler (Bush, in case you didn't know) I would feel very uncomfortable with him ruling the world. For 9-11 and the anthrax threats and whatnot...
Additionally I don't think a lot of the islamic states would take to it nicely...
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Personally, I think it would be a good idea that the US was to have supreme authority over Earth, on the condition that individual culture was not eliminated. Culture variety is a great part of humanity.
I say all this despite living in Australia. I would never wish to move to the US (perhaps visit San Fransisco, but that's all). But I do believe that the US has the best morals of any Earth nation in any epoche (timeframe). I understand that it has made mistakes, but they're nothing compared to other nations.
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Originally posted by Pegasus V
the best morals of any Earth nation in any epoche (timeframe). I understand that it has made mistakes, but they're nothing compared to other nations.
note that america is one of the youngest nations and has had plenty of base to develop their moral system.... (not that I think america has good morals) that also means a lot less time to make mistakes.
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United States of Earth. I like it.
Just think half of congress wouldn't talk to the other half. Oh, its already that way.:shaking:
The US is an example of what can happen if people have the personal freedom to dream and to reach for said dream.
The "third-world" countries that hate the USA need to spend more effort on building an infrastructure to support a modern economy. You know simple stuff:
- Paved roads
- plumbing
- reliable power
If they build the things we have that they want, instead of shooting at us because we have them, they would have the freedom to do as they wish.
The largest part of what makes America work is that we don't let the Church as an entity make policy, at least not directly.
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Originally posted by Liberator
If [third world countries] build the things we have that they want, instead of shooting at us because we have them, they would have the freedom to do as they wish.
Agreed!!
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That would work out quite nicely in my opinion, but at that point it wouldn't really matter whether it was the US or any of the other first-world nations controlling the world since they all operate pretty much the same way. (although I do like the US for its combination of science and immorality, but then again, the corporations are way too powerful)
The cultural systems will merge regardless of the governmental divisions; heck, we can even see it happening today. (everyone tries to imitate the US and the western world in general) In the end, instead of a hundred crappy cultures we will have one crappy culture; not much of an improvement, but inevitable. :p
Although I agree that Bush is quite an idiot, I really doubt he actually makes all the big decisions directly considering his intelligence. It is quite likely that he is simply a figurehead while it is the others in his administration who actually make the decisions by influencing him, since he is too stupid to think for the whole nation alone. :D
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assuming it was a non violent take over, I don't think I'd be tarably upset living under any major wesurn democrocy, but I like haveing a buch so if one goes bad you can always jump ship
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I'm curious - if culture isn't affected then what does the US really have control over in this idea?
Suffice to say I think that it's a bad idea. I'm sorry but the level of resentment and so on would be to high - each country would have to join this thing voluntarily and those that don't join will immediatly see this growing order as the biggest threat to their own security out there - perhaps something similar to what happened with Russia and eastern Europe.
Also, you can't have cultures remain intact whilst imposing other peoples morals on a people. It just won't work, and the idea of the US running everything frightens the life out of me since (and I know I've said this before) Bush - whilst perhaps acting in the best interest of the loudest voices in America - is an idiot. Though I won't go into that here..
As an aside a friend and I were talking about the state of the planet yesterday and we were both worried that there might not be a planet in the next five years. That tension is a direct result of Bush and Blairs actions in bids for the "war on terrorism" amongst other things, she in particular reconed that we've not got much of a chance at this rate. I'm inclined to agree.
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Originally posted by Liberator
h for said dream.
The "third-world" countries that hate the USA need to spend more effort on building an infrastructure to support a modern economy. You know simple stuff:
- Paved roads
- plumbing
- reliable power
If they build the things we have that they want, instead of shooting at us because we have them, they would have the freedom to do as they wish.[/B]
I force myself to stay calm when I read that...
Maybe you don't know about that, but they have no money? maybe you don't know why they have no money, either? Lots of words come into my mind when reading your post, but I don't want to be banned.
About earth being ruled by the US: I look at french corses. I look at southern ireland. I look at spanish basques. I look at all those independentist or revolutionary groups everywhere in the world. Hell, I even look at Stryke9!
I laugh :D yeah right, global gvt :lol:
Half the planet would nuke the USA rather than accepting that.
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Originally posted by venom2506
Lots of words come into my mind when reading your post, but I don't want to be banned.
Part of having an opinion is a part of what makes us human. Everyone should respect and consider someone else's opinion even if they don't agree with it. That way we can consider all of the possibilities.
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Eliminate Bush, then all will be well... :nod:
(Woohoo! In 2004, I'll be 18 and can vote in the 2004 elections!! :yes: Here's one vote Bush won't be getting for reelection :nod: )
Anyway, the whole situation would depend on how the US took over and what rights would be gained by the people. I personally would love a single world government run by the US, but that's a dead dream from the start. People would simply not live or work together. You'd have far too many disagreements in the society that nothing will ever get accomplished. People would riot or worse. Militant terrorist groups and rebellions would grow with people who refuse to live under the supreme authority (sounds like Bosch eh?). The list of chaos goes on...
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Originally posted by Pegasus V
Part of having an opinion is a part of what makes us human. Everyone should respect and consider someone else's opinion even if they don't agree with it. That way we can consider all of the possibilities.
yeah, that's like telling ethiopians to buy more food coz that way they won't be hungry anymore. I don't call that an opinion man.
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if you can't raise suply lower demand
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edited, don't wanna start a flamewar, so I'll ignore this thread from now on.
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why not, it's 9-11 and there's about five other political topics that are doomed to degrade in such a manner anyway
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Originally posted by Bobboau
why not, it's 9-11 and there's about five other political topics that are doomed to degrade in such a manner anyway
it was about comparing ethiopians to american trees and national starving to fires, if you know what I mean...
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did I make that analagy?
my coment was more that there should be some sort of population controle,
conraception, education, ect...
if these arn't implemented the people will never get out of poverty, and will continue to die in suffering squaler,
wich I would rather they didn't
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Originally posted by Bobboau
did I make that analagy?
my coment was more that there should be some sort of population controle,
conraception, education, ect...
if these arn't implemented the people will never get out of poverty, and will continue to die in suffering squaler,
wich I would rather they didn't
problem is that they don't have the means to do that. that's the whole deal in fact.
bah, I prefer the hot chicks thread, I have too many pbs in real life to discuss others further more on HLP. Go on w/o me.
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If the US had world supremicy, I want to migrate to another planet.
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*sigh*
I love reading teenagers slamming the US.
As far as ANY world Govn. goes .... no way it'll work ...peroid. Too many whiney bastards out there that would prefer to bomb innocent ppl because they're too chicken **** to take up a true fight with a govn.
And Venom ... I think what was ment with the "We'll give them roads power and plumbing and they'll stop hating us" was simply LOOK at the countries that are mostly "The US is the Satan from our Bible!" don't have. The guy was just making his comment saying perhaps if the US helped and gave them what they don't have perhaps the hate would fade. Not "well since their staring they can just get a damned job and go buy food."
Not like the US doesn't have 1000+ "Feed the Children" and such programs going on RIGHT NOW as it is while OUR poor and starving are having it basically said "Oh you're hungry ... get a job"
Don't read a flame until one's been typed ;)
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Originally posted by Warlock
*sigh*
I love reading teenagers slamming the US.
Probably because we TEENAGERS can see what lousy foreign policies the US government has.
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And for the most part the members of the new generation are also the ones who have been taken in by the ethical disease and who label things as "good" and "bad." :rolleyes: US foreign policy is perfectly fine; could be better, but in the other direction. :D
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hey warlock, I know what I've read, and what was written means what I understood, and not what you said.
:lol: just read that sentence again and can't stop laughing ( I'm in class damnit!!! ), it just makes no sense :lol:
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Originally posted by CP5670
And for the most part the members of the new generation are also the ones who have been taken in by the ethical disease and who label things as "good" and "bad." :rolleyes:
:wtf: we are? I thought we were the more objective ones :p
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Originally posted by NeoHunter
Probably because we TEENAGERS can see what lousy foreign policies the US government has.
You're right.... we should disolve all the finacial aid and good will assistance that goes over seas. Everytime we set up a new Disater Relief fund for another country .... we could use that money here at home.
My point was there is ALOT that the folks here *****ing about the US this and the US that just simply do NOT seem to recall or have ever known.
NO country is perfect. None ever will be. But if things here suck so much,... wtf do we have thousands of ppl immigrating into the country ...both legally and Illegally...daily ? ?
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Originally posted by venom2506
hey warlock, I know what I've read, and what was written means what I understood, and not what you said.
:lol: just read that sentence again and can't stop laughing ( I'm in class damnit!!! ), it just makes no sense :lol:
Ummmmm ,.... is that anything like who's on second but someone's on third and noone's on first yet anyone is at bat?
Damnit man I've only had two cups of coffee! Don't do that to me this early :D LMAO
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lol, sorry, it's almost 5pm here, I'm a bit tired too, for the opposite reason :D
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lol understood :D
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I actually kinda agree with CP on this one. I wouldn't really mind having a world govermnet, since patriotism and the like is just... well, stupid, in most cases. The problem is, with the current situation of the world's politics and economy, it would never work. The new government would be fighting bloody guerrilla wars everywhere, and terrorism would be even more widespread than it is today.
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World Government = good
World supremicy = BAD!
What I'm saying is that a world government is good as long as not 1 country from the current world would have control. I know it will get messy when other countries also involve itself in this government but its the only fair way for countries with different policies, beliefs etc to actually thrive within this government and not rebel.
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:wtf: we are? I thought we were the more objective ones :p
well, I think we are just as objective (and as biased) as the last few generations, but our thinking is influenced in a slightly different way than theirs is; they go by nationalism, while we go by common ethics. (in the generality, of course)
I actually kinda agree with CP on this one.
someone mark down the date and time; this is quite a momentous occasion. :D
The problem is, with the current situation of the world's politics and economy, it would never work. The new government would be fighting bloody guerrilla wars everywhere, and terrorism would be even more widespread than it is today.
That's true, which is why I think it must gradually come about to work correctly so that the cultural systems have time to adjust themselves accordingly. There will still be force involved, but it will go on over long periods.
What I'm saying is that a world government is good as long as not 1 country from the current world would have control. I know it will get messy when other countries also involve itself in this government but its the only fair way for countries with different policies, beliefs etc to actually thrive within this government and not rebel.
What's probably going to happen though is that the powerful countries of today will have more of a say in the new government; this is quite inevitable as long as there is an imbalance of power in today's world. (i.e. all countries are not economically, etc. equal) The others can and will get involved, but they won't have control over as much as the big nations would. (and if they rebel you can always apply force :D)
Although I'm not sure that the policies/beliefs/etc. throughout the world will be all that different by the time this type of thing becomes practical, since as I said before, everyone tries to imitate the more prosperous nations even today. (in this case, the US)
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Originally posted by CP5670
That's true, which is why I think it must gradually come about to work correctly so that the cultural systems have time to adjust themselves accordingly. There will still be force involved, but it will go on over long periods.
that's what we're doing with the european union, and w/o using force. Many little pbs, but hey, the system is still young.
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*moves to Cuba*
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that's what we're doing with the european union, and w/o using force. Many little pbs, but hey, the system is still young.
Still, there have been many centuries of conflict and resentment between the involved parties, and the cultural systems retain these feelings for some time after. (they do fade away, but it take a while) I think that the main reason the European nations are teaming up at the moment is to be able to economically compete with the US, since they have a much better chance when working together. Note that there is little power imbalance in there though, i.e. the involved countries are all more or less equally powerful; this needs to be there for a peaceful cohesion to work out, and it doesn't really exist elsewhere in the world.
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Originally posted by an0n
*moves to Cuba*
* points at an0n and laughs *
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I'd rather live under the sea.
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Double Post.
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Originally posted by Styxx
* points at an0n and laughs *
"Haha, that's a comically amusing idea."
Or
"Haha, you're going to die of typhoid or be shot for inciting a rebellion."
???
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World Goverment? I suppose the current countries would become more like states are today in america. I suppose its a good idea... although would you really be willing to give up your taxes (living a a richer part of the world i assume) to help poorer 'areas'? You already do to an extent, through foreign aid, but think, if say 500 million people these days are 'rich enough', then they still have to pay for the other 5,500million on the planet. Budgets for schools, healthcare, roads, etc would be reduced by about 83% to maintain equal levels of funding around the world, since most poorer areas couldnt afford to pay for such things.
I cant see how the poor and the rich could live under one goverment. Look at the difference between the richest and the poorest in a developed country, its huge, rich earning, what? 100 times more than the poor? And current goverments have trouble reducing that gap. What is that gap like going to be like on a global scale? Whats the average wage in america theses days, $33000?... compaired to your average tribes member in africa who earns pennys.
Wont work.
...although, if it did i wouldnt like America to govern it. A democracy, fair enough. Just not america. Some one with experience in dealling with lots of collonies and a large empire.. say, oh, Britain? ;7
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Originally posted by an0n
"Haha, that's a comically amusing idea."
Or
"Haha, you're going to die of typhoid or be shot for inciting a rebellion."
???
Erm... both. :D
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The USA is a land of opportunity and freedom if you happen to be a white, christian, male with money, aged between 21 and 70.
Reasons I can't stand Bush:
- Abstinence only education (read: propaganda) in schools.
- Puritencial stance with all social issues.
- War on drugs (which is kind of hypocritical for a reformed drunk, which is probably what happened to his brain cells).
- War on terror (read: freedom)
- The Appointment of John Ashcroft as Attourney General: A racist fanatical bigot who makes Osama Bin Laden look rational.
- Banging on about a lack of fair elections in Cuba (and using that as justification for a blockade against them) whilst his own election was controversial.
- The only reason he's there is because of daddy's money (who was influencial because of daddy's money and so on)
- A complete and utter contempt for the common man and the public services which are essential for us that aren't multi millionaires.
- Kyoto.
- Exploitive foregn policy.
P.S. CP: I'm not an American, christian male, aged between 21 and 70 with money, born into an influencial so it's in my interest to hate that retard along with most of the rest of the worls's population.
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Originally posted by Top Gun
The USA is a land of opportunity and freedom if you happen to be a white, christian, male with money, aged between 21 and 70.
Ummmm this pretty much proves you're not an american.
I know many successful ppl that are different ethnic, religious and finacial backgrounds. I know just as many of us White Christian Males that don't have $800 in a bank account at the same time.
What should success and a higher lifestyle be handed to everyone?
Not against you personally ,... but I see ALOT of folks that whine about that same thing yet they will NOT get off their asses and work towards a goal in life.
Hell lol Caucasion, Christian males are the LEAST "free" ,... look at the 101 "freedom" groups .... Every ethnic background BUT Caucasion has it's own college fund and rights activists ... Then you have all the Gay and Lesbian groups for those lifestyles ,... then all the non-christian religious groups have their things. ....
So basically you're *****ing about the ONE grouping of ppl in this country that DON'T get a damned thing for free.
Sorry .... but that is something that's bugged the **** out of me ...seeing crap like this :p
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wow everyone save for the idiots are making sense in this thread ;)
i have to say though
I'd rather live under the sea.
that's your solution to everytihng these days isn't it.. "let's live under the sea" :D
well i can't even vote and my life is too busy with school and stuff to really pay attention to politics... so it would just be ignorant of me to try t gorm any one sided opinion at this point.
just remember, every hi has it's lows...even the tallest mountain has a base just as low as everytihng else.
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In my opinion America is way too powerful already. What does it do with this power? Does it help save the environment? Does it help reduce poverty in 3rd world countries? Not last time I checked anyway.
Perhaps if America / the west was actually controlled by governments and not companies then the people would have a chance to keep them in check. But to be honest probably not.
Power corrupts, Absolute Power corrupts absolutely.
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Originally posted by Warlock
You're right.... we should disolve all the finacial aid and good will assistance that goes over seas. Everytime we set up a new Disater Relief fund for another country .... we could use that money here at home.
Any benfits of handouts to poor countries are greatly outweighed by the fact that the west (ie American corperations) do not allow fair trade where under-developed countries have a chance of actually getting themselves out of poverty. All the rules are stacked against these countries making products in their countries and selling them, instead they are forced to sell the raw materials for pitifully low prices. The west then makes the product and takes all the money.
Good business sence, morally bankrupt however.
NO country is perfect. None ever will be. But if things here suck so much,... wtf do we have thousands of ppl immigrating into the country ...both legally and Illegally...daily ? ?
Everywhere else is so unstable because America and its enemies fight their battles through other countries.
ie
Israel (backed by USA) vs Palestine (backed by Arab states and orginisations)
And once apon a time
Taliban (backed by America) vs Northern Alliance (backed by Russia)
Im not saying that America is repsonsable for starting the above problems (I believe if you go back far enough the UK has some things to answer for as far as Afganistan goes). I dont think Americans are bad people, I just think that most of them never see the awful things corperations do in America's name because they are done so quietly.
For one example check out my sig, then do some research and realise thats just one of hundreds of grievences against the US and its corperations.
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Let's see, my 3 plans for world government:
1. Become rich and buy out all the rulers of the world.
2. Have the UN become a United Earth thing.
3. Move to Mars and nuke earth, and the one survivor will rule.
BTW, Creative's mixer is 1337. I transformed 2 stereo speaker systems into a surround sound system :cool:
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Originally posted by beatspete
I cant see how the poor and the rich could live under one goverment. Look at the difference between the richest and the poorest in a developed country, its huge, rich earning, what? 100 times more than the poor? And current goverments have trouble reducing that gap. What is that gap like going to be like on a global scale? Whats the average wage in america theses days, $33000?... compaired to your average tribes member in africa who earns pennys.
If we had a GOOD world government, this wouldn't be a problem. After years of fixing up the world, we could all live in peace. Sure, we might not like it that much, but isn't our job to provide a BETTER world for the rest of the human race? If we sacrifice a little of our money, we can save millions of lives. If the world were under one government, within 50-100 years of hard work, the world would be equal, and technologically advanced. We would be a race that was destined for destruction, but saved ourselves just in time.
I would like to live in a world like that, but, sadly, we may never be able to. I would like my children, and their children, and their great great grandchildren, to live in a worl like that. I would gladly sacrifice some of my money to make a better world for my children.
This doesn't have to be accomplished by a world government, but if it isn't, people will fight over ways of doing things, and a war will ensue. This would destroy any chance of world peace for a long time.
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Originally posted by Top Gun
The USA is a land of opportunity and freedom if you happen to be a white, christian, male with money, aged between 21 and 70.
Let's see here..
Nobody considers Spike Lee a racists when he clearly is.
Scholarships CAN'T be given to whites only, because it is racist, BUT they ARE given to blacks, hispanics, and Native Americans based on grades AND race.
People are demanding the Federal Government impose more taxes so they can pay for the slave labor that was used to build the capital 200 years ago, and these people believe that just because they are black they should be given a cookie because their ancestors suffered.
Conservative Minorities are considered Uncle Tom's and are mocked.
The Confederate Flag is considered offensive to most, which would be the ignorant.
I have less rights than convicted and accused crimminals according to state and federal laws.
I am not aloud in a women's abuse shelter, even though I am there to give donations.
I can be sued for not hiring a female over a male just because she may have better qualifications, but he may have done a better job at the interview.
I am automatically considered a suspected rapist and serial killer just because I fit the white, single, and between the ages of 21 and 45.
And I can be fined in some states for calling somebody a "Queer."
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Originally posted by CODEDOG ND
And I can be fined in some states for calling somebody a "Queer."
What's a queer?
And I know all americans will disagree with me, but here in Brazil I have a lot more freedom than any american can hope to have... :p
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And I can be fined in some states for calling somebody a "Queer."
i didn't know that
queer = f***t = flamer = gay
all the same
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"Taliban (backed by America) vs Northern Alliance (backed by Russia)"
You've got that pretty bass acwards,
What is now known as the Northern Alliance and the Taliban (though they were largely on the same side at the time and the names didn't change until well after this period of time) were both backed by America when Russia invaded Afghanistan and imposed a communistic puppet government. After the forces we supported pushed out Russia, we soon cut our support(biggest mistake we ever made), because they had won the war and we decided (with help from other people) that we shouldn't impose our horrid democratic values on them. You know things like, equality for women, freedom, a central government, and roads, indoor plumbing... so the place was left to fester with fighting warlords and clashes between ethnic groups. Until the Taliban came into power a few years later
The Taliban came from refugee camps in the southern regions and in Pakistan were the deplorable conditions led to a general feeling of disparity and hopelessness (which nether neither the US nor any European country seemed eager to help in). In this squalor the Taliban (or students as I believe the word means in pashtu, a reference to there strict studies of the Qaran) started to take over. They brought the promise of peace and stability, what they failed to inform there fellow countrymen was that they also brought a hard line fundamentalist Islam that subjugating the entire population. After the Taliban started to take ground the feuding warlords formed the Northern Alliance and tried to fight them back, but the Taliban were being funded by the Pakistani intelligence service (ISI) which was largely in favor of the wahabi sect of Islam, and without support of there own the Northern Alliance lost much ground and the people of Afghanistan suffered under the strict laws of the Taliban. Because the Northern Alliance had failed to bring a government other than warlordism and the Taliban had succeeded, not to mention the fact that they controlled roughly 90% of the country, many nations began to deal with them. Such as the US, which had interest in shutting down opium, production and stopping the terrorist camps that were running in the country. The Taliban never had any intentions of dealing with the US but the US bought some cooperation from them on the Opium side, by 2001 opium production was nearly halted in Afghanistan thanks to the Taliban and aid from the US
However the fact that the Talaban's human rights violations especially towards women kept them from being recognized by any governments other than Iran and Pakistan, the NA was still fighting for freedom while the Taliban convinced the US that they could be a potential partner. The darkest hour of the Northern Alliance was on September 9th when two AlQuada assassins killed general Ahmed Shah Massoud in what was believed to be a preparation for the 9-11 attacks. Shortly thereafter however the NA got the supplies and support it needed from the US and pushed the Taliban from power across all of Afghanistan, there are however small pockets still loyal to the Taliban in the south/southeast.
Currently an interim government formed from the NA is being held together by the coalition forces lead by the US that supported the NA in it's victory over the Taliban. The goal is to have a fair democratic representative government that will insure peace stability and freedom for the people of Afghanistan,
This time were not going to pull the plug and let the Taliban back in
Now I think I was fairly accurate and fair with that, would anyone like to point out any inaccuracies. Note my mention of US support of all islamic fighters during the 1980's including Usama and the Taliban later on
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Originally posted by Styxx
What's a queer?
And I know all americans will disagree with me, but here in Brazil I have a lot more freedom than any american can hope to have... :p
firstly a queer is a gay person... (I believe...)
and secondly how so? (maybe I'll just move to brazil :p)
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Originally posted by Bobboau
Note my mention of US support of all islamic fighters during the 1980's including Usama and the Taliban later on
Thats my point. The Taliban were just one of many groups but after a while they were singled out despite their extreme beliefs because they were "beter fighters"
Its Russia that we have to thank for the government in Afganistan, their influence stopped the whole thing falling apart.
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My responce:
Awefull, horrible, disaster. I wouldn't like to live in that kind of world. Besides, noone on the planet would agree that one country would have a supreme authority. That kind of regime wouldn't be a democratic one. It would rather be an imperialistic regime if you ask me.
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Originally posted by Kamikaze
and secondly how so? (maybe I'll just move to brazil :p)
There's a far smaller risk of you being sued for anything you say;
The chance of being sued for hitting on a girl on any environment is close to nil;
You can buy and drink alcoholic beverages anywhere, providing that you're legally allowed (well, in most places you don't even need that);
There are very good public universities (the best universities in the country, most of the time), where you don't have to pay a cent - meaning that even if you're from a "poor" family you can still go to a great university if you're dedicated;
Racial blending is far smoother than on the US - in fact, I'd say that only the most extremist minority groups claim that there's significant racism around here;
The chance of you being monitored by the government due to religious or ideological beliefs is close to nil;
I could go on, but I think that this will suffice for now. Of course Brazil has many more problems, but I like it here. ;)
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Originally posted by Styxx
There's a far smaller risk of you being sued for anything you say;
The chance of being sued for hitting on a girl on any environment is close to nil;
You can buy and drink alcoholic beverages anywhere, providing that you're legally allowed (well, in most places you don't even need that);
There are very good public universities (the best universities in the country, most of the time), where you don't have to pay a cent - meaning that even if you're from a "poor" family you can still go to a great university if you're dedicated;
Racial blending is far smoother than on the US - in fact, I'd say that only the most extremist minority groups claim that there's significant racism around here;
The chance of you being monitored by the government due to religious or ideological beliefs is close to nil;
Sounds like Holland! :D
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Originally posted by Tiara
Sounds like Holland! :D
or France ( tho even if it's not too expensive, you have to pay for uni ).
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Actually, if one just wants maximum freedom the best place to go would be something like Antarctica. You can do whatever you please there; nobody is going to care. :D
I like the US, but not because of the "freedom" so much as the fact that it is leading scientific advancement. who needs freedom when you have that. :D
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Originally posted by CP5670
Actually, if one just wants maximum freedom the best place to go would be something like Antarctica. You can do whatever you please there; nobody is going to care. :D
I like the US, but not because of the "freedom" so much as the fact that it is leading scientific advancement. who needs freedom when you have that. :D
People who enjoy living their lives ?
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for the society as a whole though it is pretty useless by itself. :p
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Originally posted by CP5670
Actually, if one just wants maximum freedom the best place to go would be something like Antarctica. You can do whatever you please there; nobody is going to care. :D
mmh, you can do nothing there, mostly coz there's nothing to do or use. snowballs maybe? Or dying from a cold, that would be neat! yeah!
"this stupid idea was brought to you by CP incorporated"
:p
btw, what's useless? not sure what you're talking about
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Originally posted by CP5670
so much as the fact that it is leading scientific advancement...
Oooh, now is that some arrogant statement. Industrial development is one thing, scientific advancement is another. What is your proof that the US leads scientific advancement?
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I think you'll find that if you remove Americas sheer scale, they get f00kin whooped at everything by the British and Japanese.
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Oooh, now is that some arrogant statement. Industrial development is one thing, scientific advancement is another. What is your proof that the US leads scientific advancement?
Well, consider that most of the major univerisities and academic institutions in the world today are located in the US, and that's where all of this stuff goes on. (some other nations are indeed technologically superior, but that is a matter of engineering and not theory) At least in the last 20 or so years, the cutting edge of math and physics research has gradually shifted towards the US, at least as far as theoretical stuff goes. (and I'm sure you can find specific examples to the contrary; this is in the generality)
mmh, you can do nothing there, mostly coz there's nothing to do or use. snowballs maybe? Or dying from a cold, that would be neat! yeah!
do math all day, of course! you don't need anything for that but your brain. :D
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Originally posted by CP5670
do math all day, of course! you don't need anything for that but your brain. :D
how? no pen to buy ( ink would freeze anyway ), no battery for your calculator. man, you'd end up writing with your finger in the snow :p ( and your finger would fall after a day ).
try again :p
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what if it didn't
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how? no pen to buy ( ink would freeze anyway ), no battery for your calculator. man, you'd end up writing with your finger in the snow :p ( and your finger would fall after a day ).
try again :p
ah come on, you can just do everything in your head and get a solar power calculator. :D If you want to stay warm, just put on a spacesuit.
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Originally posted by CODEDOG ND
Scholarships CAN'T be given to whites only, because it is racist, BUT they ARE given to blacks, hispanics, and Native Americans based on grades AND race.
..and seems as there's a direct correlation between grades and wealth, who does better.
Originally posted by CODEDOG ND
People are demanding the Federal Government impose more taxes so they can pay for the slave labor that was used to build the capital 200 years ago, and these people believe that just because they are black they should be given a cookie because their ancestors suffered.
Good, try hiking the taxes on big business to provide health care as well while you're at it.
Originally posted by CODEDOG ND
Conservative Minorities are considered Uncle Tom's and are mocked.
Which is verry odd because they're the ones running the government, schoolboards and all the other lucrative positions of power. It's all relative. Compared to Europeans (although I'm not sure for how much longer), American politics is Laughably unrepresentitive of the vast majority of the people.
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Guys stop already....I'm laughing myself to death here!
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Originally posted by Top Gun
The USA is a land of opportunity and freedom if you happen to be a white, christian, male with money, aged between 21 and 70.
Reasons I can't stand Bush:
- Abstinence only education (read: propaganda) in schools.
- Puritencial stance with all social issues.
- War on drugs (which is kind of hypocritical for a reformed drunk, which is probably what happened to his brain cells).
- War on terror (read: freedom)
- The Appointment of John Ashcroft as Attourney General: A racist fanatical bigot who makes Osama Bin Laden look rational.
- Banging on about a lack of fair elections in Cuba (and using that as justification for a blockade against them) whilst his own election was controversial.
- The only reason he's there is because of daddy's money (who was influencial because of daddy's money and so on)
- A complete and utter contempt for the common man and the public services which are essential for us that aren't multi millionaires.
- Kyoto.
- Exploitive foregn policy.
P.S. CP: I'm not an American, christian male, aged between 21 and 70 with money, born into an influencial so it's in my interest to hate that retard along with most of the rest of the worls's population.
I absolutely agree with Top Gun. Bush was never supposed to be elected as president in US. Just tell me what did he ever do right during his mandate. He just fights wars, brainstorms about attacking Iraq and other countries just because he thinks that they are involved in the events of 11.9. I mean, anyone with an electron size brain could have thought of that.
I also heard one more thing about him. Wasn't he some kind of "executioner" in texas? ( Since texas is known for giving people death sentences)
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an0n's views on world politics (read: the truth)
Bush = Chimp who cheated his way into office
Iraq = Just like every other country. Try to build bigger and better weapons and use them against their enemies. Can anyone say Hiroshima?
Kyoto = Nullified by America not signing
Ashcroft = "Slaves! Get your black slaves here! Work them heathens ta death."
Blair = Bush: I call him.....Mini-me :drevil:
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Originally posted by CP5670
ah come on, you can just do everything in your head and get a solar power calculator. :D If you want to stay warm, just put on a spacesuit.
you can buy that at your local store? man youre lucky :p
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Originally posted by CP5670
Well, consider that most of the major univerisities and academic institutions in the world today are located in the US, and that's where all of this stuff goes on. (some other nations are indeed technologically superior, but that is a matter of engineering and not theory) At least in the last 20 or so years, the cutting edge of math and physics research has gradually shifted towards the US, at least as far as theoretical stuff goes. (and I'm sure you can find specific examples to the contrary; this is in the generality)
Engineering is a vital part of scientific advancement and your views are really opinion, because you have no proof. I could list a number of British advances, a recent Military one is the shielding we're putting on our tanks.
Still i find all this anti-US stuff foolish.
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**Plays his MP3 of "Things Yoda Would Say in Bed" and rushes back out**
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you can buy that at your local store? man youre lucky
Okay fine, but you can certainly buy a really thick coat. :p
Or how about this: just get a boat and go into some international waters where it is not as cold. Since you are not on any nation's territory, you are free to do what you want there, and you can even write down your math. :D
Engineering is a vital part of scientific advancement and your views are really opinion, because you have no proof. I could list a number of British advances, a recent Military one is the shielding we're putting on our tanks.
Not really; engineering is the application of science to practical issues. It can and does lead to scientific advancement but in experimentation only, and at least so far it has not gotten to the point where it can assist in the search for theories as well. The British could well be putting some kind of shields on their armor divisions, but the important part is the theory behind its operation. (although in this particular example the appropriate equations have probably been around for many decades) This stuff had been coming out Europe for centuries and for a while the USSR was doing very well, but they have all since stagnated. (since the US has gotten a reputation for being a center of research, all the good minds from around the world are coming here, and so that reputation starts to become a reality; once the wheel starts spinning it keeps doing so :D)
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Japan Tech > USA Tech
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Of course, but there are not a whole lot of equations and formulas coming from there. :D
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Originally posted by Razor
I absolutely agree with Top Gun. Bush was never supposed to be elected as president in US. Just tell me what did he ever do right during his mandate. He just fights wars, brainstorms about attacking Iraq and other countries just because he thinks that they are involved in the events of 11.9. I mean, anyone with an electron size brain could have thought of that.
I also heard one more thing about him. Wasn't he some kind of "executioner" in texas? ( Since texas is known for giving people death sentences)
Actually speaking he deserves credit in the intelligence department for realizing that unless he keeps the US at war, the public will remember that he's a moron (although he probably doesn't make his own policy any more than his own speeches).
As for the executioner bit: You really should do some research before commenting, it adds a whole lot more weight to your argument.
He was Governor of Texas (the state that executes the most people). While governor he notoriously rejected appeals from numerous people on death row. Including those with mental ages of less than ten. Not even the Arabs of Chinese do that!
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Originally posted by Top Gun
Actually speaking he deserves credit in the intelligence department for realizing that unless he keeps the US at war, the public will remember that he's a moron (although he probably doesn't make his own policy any more than his own speeches).
As for the executioner bit: You really should do some research before commenting, it adds a whole lot more weight to your argument.
He was Governor of Texas (the state that executes the most people). While governor he notoriously rejected appeals from numerous people on death row. Including those with mental ages of less than ten. Not even the Arabs of Chinese do that!
Works for me ...I'd rather a killer get what they should than be supportted by MY tax money.
Do some counter reseach ... MOST prisons are better living conditions than alot of hotels for christ's sake.
I don't recall the figures and I'm too busy to look them up ...but when Tim Mcfay got juiced ,... I heard a report state that it was like **estimated guess here not exact** a thousand or so for everything needed for the lethal injection,.....yet at his age in the mid twenties...average lifespan being set at 75 ...they estimated 1-2 million to pay for his life sentence in prison.
I have NO problem with killing a killer.
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Regarding the racism, I agree that there is some of that around here, but it doesn't seem to be all that much more than in most other countries. I personally have not experienced any discrimination in my life due to that (my parents are from India and I am of hindu ethnicity), but I have heard about such incidents elsewhere. These various types of affirmative action are indeed quite stupid though; it is just another kind of racism. (e.g. universities should not admit x males, y whites, etc. but rather x people, based on intellectual merit)
The main thing I don't like about the US is the corporations; these stupid conglomerates are simply way too powerful and are able to easily bribe government officials due to their large sums of money. I stand by my contention that lobbying through money should be completely banned.
I don't really know what Bush did as governor, but it is good if he was brutal on these criminals; if anything, we need to be more ruthless. I think that the main reason the US has the highest crime rates in the world (in addition to the rubbish culture) is the very lax punishments; as Warlock said, the prison facilities are quite luxurious and sometimes poor people actually get in trouble on purpose just to be able to live in there. :p
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Originally posted by CP5670
I don't really know what Bush did as governor, but it is good if he was brutal on these criminals; if anything, we need to be more ruthless. I think that the main reason the US has the highest crime rates in the world (in addition to the rubbish culture) is the very lax punishments; as Warlock said, the prison facilities are quite luxurious and sometimes poor people actually get in trouble on purpose just to be able to live in there. :p
Hell buddy .... I'm all for cheap and effective means of criminal prevention.....
Ditch the needles and electric chairs ....bring back the noose and public beheadings .... bet after a few times seeing what a murder charge gets .... ppl will think twice . And if not ...well hell ... you only buy a rope once ever so many ppl ...= $50
New blade ever year or two $300 perhaps ?
Then take the savings and but it into more schools and such :D
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Originally posted by CP5670
Of course, but there are not a whole lot of equations and formulas coming from there. :D
how do you know that? :p
btw, how'd you live in the middle of internatilan sea? no shop around to get food :p You'd have to do fishing!!! hargh!!! exposing yourself to sunlight!!!!
bzw, razor:
Just tell me what did he ever do right during his mandate. He just fights wars, brainstorms about attacking Iraq and other countries just because he thinks that they are involved in the events of 11.9. I mean, anyone with an electron size brain could have thought of that.
youy're not fair, he also planed his antimissile shield :lol:
her... :nervous:
"slowly hides himself in a dark corner"
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Originally posted by CP5670
Of course, but there are not a whole lot of equations and formulas coming from there. :D
Actually, apparently Seoul (S.Korea) has the highest ratio of PHD's per capita in the world. I wouldn't imagine you subscribe much to non-english language journals.
Em.... capital punishment is regarded as wrong because justice is no infallible, thus making it state-sponsored murder. Which is illegal. Besides which, I think i'd prefer a quick death to the rest of my life in a prison being gang raped and beaten up.... It's also not massively effective based on the US's crime rate
To be honest, the US is far from perfect. It's not exactly the 'Great Satan', either. It's just like every country - flawed... and I think the main bugbear I have is the levels of pollution and waste from the US.
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Ditch the needles and electric chairs ....bring back the noose and public beheadings .... bet after a few times seeing what a murder charge gets .... ppl will think twice . And if not ...well hell ... you only buy a rope once ever so many ppl ...= $50
New blade ever year or two $300 perhaps ?
That's the way to go. :D If this type of thing is implemented I bet the crime rate will drop like a brick. :D
how do you know that? :p
btw, how'd you live in the middle of internatilan sea? no shop around to get food You'd have to do fishing!!! hargh!!! exposing yourself to sunlight!!!! :p
I have not really been following recent physics discoveries that closely but at least in math, the main thing I can think of is the important Taniyama-Shimura conjecture on elliptic curves. (all the theories seem to be named after people, and one can tell where the guy is from by the name) Although one of the two men who discovered that shot himself and the other one has been in the US for over 30 years now. :D
As for the sunlight and fishing, that of course would very bad, but hey, I'm fine right here living with only some freedom. :D This is for others who want maximum freedom; you can get it there. (don't ask me what to do with your waste though... :nervous: )
Actually, apparently Seoul (S.Korea) has the highest ratio of PHD's per capita in the world. I wouldn't imagine you subscribe much to non-english language journals.
Yeah, but after getting their degree (or in many cases, in order to) many of them come over here. :D (seeing as there are a significant number of Japanese-Americans, among other immigrants, on university faculties here; the system keeps running on immigration) Besides, these days anything important is immediately translated to all the other major languages; that wouldn't really be an issue.
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Originally posted by CP5670
Yeah, but after getting their degree (or in many cases, in order to) many of them come over here. :D (seeing as there are a significant number of Japanese-Americans, among other immigrants, on university faculty here)
What happens when the foreign graduates decide to leave to work back in Asia, possibly because of a recession in the US?
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They occassionally do, but not really for economic reasons, since that is why they came here in the first place. Still, out of all the immigrants who come to the US either to learn or to work, maybe a half percent of them end up returning to their homeland permanently (and that is almost always for personal reasons), so that's not really a big issue. :D
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Tsk, tsk. All I see is personal opinions and vague claims... Where's the proof I asked?
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If you want the exact stastistics, there are professors who specialize in the history of science/math at universities; ask them what has been going on lately. :D
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Originally posted by Warlock
Works for me ...I'd rather a killer get what they should than be supportted by MY tax money.
Do some counter reseach ... MOST prisons are better living conditions than alot of hotels for christ's sake.
I don't recall the figures and I'm too busy to look them up ...but when Tim Mcfay got juiced ,... I heard a report state that it was like **estimated guess here not exact** a thousand or so for everything needed for the lethal injection,.....yet at his age in the mid twenties...average lifespan being set at 75 ...they estimated 1-2 million to pay for his life sentence in prison.
If getting beaten up and gang raped is your idea of a good hotel I feel really sorry for you.
Eropeans got rid of the death penalty over fifty years ago and we have less murders per year put together than you do in the US. Almost every Sociological report on the subject says that the harshness of the punishment has no bearing on the murder rate. People should be locked up according to their danger to the public.
Is killing the murderer going to bring the murderee back to life? No. So why do we get so hysterical about ensuring criminals get brutalized? Most of it is down to our emotions, you know CP, the things you try to supress.
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Almost every Sociological report on the subject says that the harshness of the punishment has no bearing on the murder rate.
Really...look at some of the reasonably developed nations in Asia, for example. Many still have the "lashing in public" thing, but their crime rates are also far lower. Besides, it's quite obvious that people commit crimes because they think it is very easy (and it usually is, in today's system) to get away with them.
Is killing the murderer going to bring the murderee back to life? No. So why do we get so hysterical about ensuring criminals get brutalized? Most of it is down to our emotions, you know CP, the things you try to supress.
Of course not, but it will discourage further such incidents; that is all we want.
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Originally posted by CP5670
Of course not, but it will discourage further such incidents; that is all we want.
That is indeed so true. I myself would have them hideously tortured before putting them to death, it would be even better to suppress further crime...
(and you claimed the US was the leader in research, the burden of proof is upon you) :p
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Originally posted by Warlock
Works for me ...I'd rather a killer get what they should than be supportted by MY tax money.
Do some counter reseach ... MOST prisons are better living conditions than alot of hotels for christ's sake.
I don't recall the figures and I'm too busy to look them up ...but when Tim Mcfay got juiced ,... I heard a report state that it was like **estimated guess here not exact** a thousand or so for everything needed for the lethal injection,.....yet at his age in the mid twenties...average lifespan being set at 75 ...they estimated 1-2 million to pay for his life sentence in prison.
I have NO problem with killing a killer.
What about killing someone who was innocent? There are, I believe, several convicts on death row who are mentally ill or retarded and thus whose convictions are shaky. there's also the case - in particular - of a Scot on death row in the US who was convicted on Arson evidence - but the courts have so far refused to listen to the fact that he had a broken arm at the time (and was unlikely to be physically capable of the crime) and also counter arguements from other arson experts.
Also, what about frame-ups? The US police service is not infallible in this respect, the 'Rampart' division (I think...) in Los Angeles is a pretty famouys example of police corruption.
and if you think jail is easy, maybe you should look up this word; 'Barlinnie'.
Originally posted by CP5670
Really...look at some of the reasonably developed nations in Asia, for example. Many still have the "lashing in public" thing, but their crime rates are also far lower. Besides, it's quite obvious that people commit crimes because they think it is very easy (and it usually is, in today's system) to get away with them.
I think you'll find those Asian countries have a vastly different belief and social structure to the US, though.... and the efficiency of the police force is also something to consider.
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Lashings for littering would be good, then we could have clean streets like they do in Singapore. Everythings too liberal these days, favours the criminal too much.
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That is indeed so true. I myself would have them hideously tortured before putting them to death, it would be even better to suppress further crime...
That is exactly correct. When you strike fear into the people, they will obey. Why else are punishments of any kind issued in the first place?
(and you claimed the US was the leader in research, the burden of proof is upon you)
hey, I'm just repeating what I have heard and seen from history. :D I can provide you with a list of recent advances in math, but that's about it.
Lashings for littering would be good, then we could have clean streets like they do in Singaport. Everythings too liberal these days, favours the criminal too much.
I agree there; the western society has become way too soft on everything. :p
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My views on random political things:
1) A world government is impossible at the moment. I can't see a reasonable solution to that, barring a giant natural disaster and/or contact with an alien species.
2) Bush is a moron because:
a) Firstly, he wanted to build a missile defense shield, by using (gasp) MORE MISSILES! Honestly, the military is close to having high-powered lasers! And missile vs. missile is not very reliable. Just have a "laser" :drevil: shoot the incoming missile down, and be done with it.
b) Secondly, he's going off and declaring war on everyone. Sure, we had a good reason for going into Afghanistan, and smacking down the Taliban, but now this business with Iraq is ludicrous.
Saddam is an ass, and he might be stocking up nukes, but he's not going to use them unless provoked. He wouldn't be crazy enough to attack Israel straight off, anyway, since he knows that that would mean instant smackdown by Tomahawks and B-2's. Not to mention the Israeli retaliation.
c) Bush's right-wing stance on birth control and such. Does he think that teaching teens less about sex will help lower the teen pregnancy rates?
d) Bush lowered taxes (mainly for the rich) and then spent about twice as much as Clinton, by going into Afghanistan. Can you say deficit, anyone? Very good!
e) Bush's tax cut apparently has not helped the economy. And the deficit definitely won't, either.
3) I think the country is spending too much on the "drug war" and on prisons in general. Legalize pot, hemp, and ecstacy (albeit in limited quantities) and you'll free up about half the prison space! Plus you'll put a good number of drug lords out of business and save a bundle on law enforcement.
And the rest of the convicts could be sent to some sort of job training (sponsored by the govt) so they have actual skills when they get out of jail...
Mind you, I'm talking about ones that aren't insane, murderers, or whatever, just normal criminals like thieves, drug dealers, gang members and such. (So as to avoid the thing that smacked down Dukakis' campaign in '89.)
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Instead of direct quotes I'll label my replies by number/letter to which they relate...I'm being lazy :P
1: Basic dead on
2:
A: You DO realize close is meant as in the next 20 years not weeks. At the moment a laser defense system would be outraeously over costly plus would require a hefty power supply to be as accurate as a point deense missle system
B: "War on TERROISM" remember. Bush didn't just wake up and say "Let's blame Saddam this week. They found more than they'll make public anytime soon. For once the lack of media about the war is perfect. When I was active it used to be a kick to the head seeing mission objectives announced over CNN! lol Sadly it's happened.
C: Honestly...the gov. doesn't NEED to teach kids about sex as much as their damned parents. If ppl aren't adult enough to raise their own damn kids ... WHY expect the government too ? ?
D: Funny ... I'm far from Rich and I noticed a healthy tax cut in mine plus the relief check helped a good deal. And 9-11 caused most of the economy issues .... I meant damn man ... only MOST of the major stocks and the world bank went down there.
E: See "D"
3: To a point legalizing it would improve things .... to a point. These days you give an inch and ppl take 1000 miles.
and training convicts ? Umm I'm only agreeing if it's the "underage kid that's never 'had the chance' type. Else then you go from "I live in a crappy house ...lemme rob a bank and get 3 meals plus a nice pad for 5 years free" ..... to "Well I'm too lazy to go to school after work ... so I'll just rob a bank and if I get caught they'll teach me to get a better job so I won't have to rob that bank again"
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Originally posted by aldo_14
What about killing someone who was innocent? There are, I believe, several convicts on death row who are mentally ill or retarded and thus whose convictions are shaky. there's also the case - in particular - of a Scot on death row in the US who was convicted on Arson evidence - but the courts have so far refused to listen to the fact that he had a broken arm at the time (and was unlikely to be physically capable of the crime) and also counter arguements from other arson experts.
Also, what about frame-ups? The US police service is not infallible in this respect, the 'Rampart' division (I think...) in Los Angeles is a pretty famouys example of police corruption.
and if you think jail is easy, maybe you should look up this word; 'Barlinnie'.
I think you'll find those Asian countries have a vastly different belief and social structure to the US, though.... and the efficiency of the police force is also something to consider.
I realize there's as many convicts falsely accused. Thus at the same time ,..which has been needed for a while,...the entire court system pretty much needs a good overhaul.
Don't get me wrong ... I'm not for "Oh ...we think he's guilty just shoot him" But when it's completely fool prove ,.. got a camera shot showing his face clearly during the crime etc etc ,... then yes .
EVERY hiring is a special case. As such they ALL have to be treated that way.
on one hand you have the guy that got pissed at his GF for coming home 5 minutes late ... was drunk and shot her....
on the other hand you have the guy how's little girl was kidnapped and once they found her he managed to get close enough and capped the kidnapper.
Both cases are a murder ... each with completely different circumstances and events.
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Originally posted by CP5670
Yeah, but after getting their degree (or in many cases, in order to) many of them come over here. :D
weems we know why most math formuale "seems" to come from US, according to you, then :D
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Originally posted by Zeronet
Lashings for littering would be good, then we could have clean streets like they do in Singapore. Everythings too liberal these days, favours the criminal too much.
Actually they have heavy fines or forced labour for 24 hours but the thing that discourages "criminals" is the chance of being caught, not the severity of the sentence.
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weems we know why most math formuale "seems" to come from US, according to you, then :D
Exactly; like I said, the US scientific progression thrives because of this mass immigration. The great minds come here because of the reputations of the nation's universities, and the reputations are further established because of these people, and the cycle keeps going once started. Once they are in the US and plan to stick around, they are Americans as far as our purposes here go. :D (also I think "weems" was supposed to be "seems," right? :p :D )
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:Plans to finish schooling (including college) and US and moving to Canada or Ireland:
:p