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General FreeSpace => FreeSpace Discussion => Topic started by: Akalabeth Angel on January 26, 2004, 05:45:23 pm

Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Akalabeth Angel on January 26, 2004, 05:45:23 pm
If the Ulysses Space Superiority fighter was a joint design by Vasudan and Terran engineers, why didn't Vasudans fly it?
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Knight Templar on January 26, 2004, 06:06:20 pm
BECAUES VASUDANS SUXOR!!!!!1111
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Liberator on January 26, 2004, 06:52:22 pm
They had a version with similar flight characteristics called the Thoth.
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Stealth[cro] on January 26, 2004, 07:20:34 pm
And a much better version it is, if you ask me...

Then again, I consider the Seth the best fighter of them all, so I should probably shut up :D
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Eishtmo on January 26, 2004, 07:31:23 pm
Bah, the Herc is the best ever.

And Liberator's right, after the Hammer of Light was removed from the Altair shipyards, the Thoth was what they used.  Tthough I'm sure a few squadrons of Vasudan Ulysses made it onto the battle field until they did.
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: redsniper on January 26, 2004, 10:56:35 pm
the Perseus is the best
*ahem*:nervous: um... The Vasudans don't fly the uly 'cuz it sucks.
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Starks on January 26, 2004, 11:07:08 pm
I thought the Vasudan equivalent was the Tauret...
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Knight Templar on January 26, 2004, 11:41:28 pm
Tauret = FS2 & Herc 2 counterpart.
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Trivial Psychic on January 27, 2004, 12:56:22 am
I think I saw Vasudans flying the Ulysses in Operation Templar.   I can't remember which mission exactly.

Later!
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Lightspeed on January 27, 2004, 06:49:41 am
Best Terran fighter ever: Valkyrie
Best Vasudan fighter ever: Horus or Seth
Best Shivan fighter ever: Scorpion.

:)
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Hippo on January 27, 2004, 01:54:12 pm
Quote
Originally posted by Lightspeed

Best Shivan fighter ever: Scorpion.

:)


:nod: Though the dragon comes in close too. T'is a shame they took it from FS2...
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: phreak on January 27, 2004, 02:19:58 pm
Best shivan fighter: Basilisk.

Its not the best stat wise, but i'd rather go up against 20 basilisks than 2 dragons.
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Shadow_jdct on January 27, 2004, 03:04:52 pm
i always liked the Uly, beat FS1 with it.
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Akalabeth Angel on January 27, 2004, 05:38:08 pm
Scorpion? What's so great about the Scorpion? Always seemed to be easy pickings to me.
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Setekh on January 27, 2004, 09:37:53 pm
The Thoth was awesome. I remembered crying tears of joy when a wing of them came out of the Pinnacle and hauled my 4%-hull-integrity ass out of the fire from a squadron of Shivans after all my wingmen had been minced (ahhhh, I love Insane). :yes:
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Taristin on January 27, 2004, 10:19:48 pm
All of the Vasudan fighters were good. Even the Anubis was fun to an extent. ;)
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Liberator on January 27, 2004, 10:58:28 pm
:eek2:
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Ace on January 27, 2004, 11:19:16 pm
Now that's what I want to see, a high-poly Anubis :)
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: ChronoReverse on January 28, 2004, 02:08:30 am
Meh, the only Shivan fighter I fear is the Dragon.  All other Shivan fighters tend to die quickly even in Insane (where I usually drown in the sheer number of enemies and the utter uselessness [even as fodder] of my wingman).

It's actually hard to hit dragons until you get the trebuchet and can sit back and pick them off at long range.
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Janos on January 28, 2004, 02:36:46 am
... yeah, and picking them [Dragons] up at long range is also fun, because they tend to close in so fast that you can shoot one down, lock onto another and perhaps even launch until rest of the goddamn pack is already overwhelming you.

The mission I actually hated the most in FS1 was Enter the Dragon.
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: c914 on January 28, 2004, 05:09:56 am
fighters:
FS1 Apollo ( ive fly in him all campaing ) and  Dragon
FS2 Tauret ( much better than herc 2 ) and my favorite Aserhoth:)
bombers:
sekhmet ( iv hasnt saw him in capmaning but in muli is the best )
and Seraphim ( 12 cannons that a real fire power )
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Stealth[cro] on January 28, 2004, 01:13:35 pm
The Bat isn't such a bad fighter... it steers nicely, carries enough missiles for its job, and besides, it's not easy to get a lock on it visually - it's a thin line in space. (as opposed to a Myrmidon, the next-in-line space superiority fighter which has a radar blip the size of a bowling ball - you can't NOT see it coming :drevil:)!
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Liberator on January 28, 2004, 01:28:39 pm
Yeah, the Myrm is a giant flying target isn't it.  It's only saving grace is the Helios capability, even if it is a typo.
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Setekh on January 28, 2004, 06:29:12 pm
Quote
Originally posted by Ace
Now that's what I want to see, a high-poly Anubis :)


It had better have high-poly debris, too. After all, that's virtually all you see of the Anubis. ;)
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Stealth[cro] on January 31, 2004, 07:05:34 pm
Quote
Originally posted by Liberator
Yeah, the Myrm is a giant flying target isn't it.  It's only saving grace is the Helios capability, even if it is a typo.
Yeah... Not exactly what you'd expect of a space superiority fighter. I could understand the old GTB/F Athena, that thing was more of a multirole ship than anything. Then again, to a degree, you could say the same for the GTB Zeus.

On the topic of Anubi, they aren't anything BUT flying debris. They were used as kamikaze craft, remember? :D
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: DeepSpace9er on February 01, 2004, 10:08:28 pm
Best Terran Ship Ever: Perseus
Worst: Herc - piss poor weapon positioning

Best Shivan Ship Ever: Dragon
Worst: Basilisk - slow, stupid, and big

Best Vasudan Ship Ever: Horus
Worst: Anubis - speaks for itself


Ship Destroyed with the most satisfaction: Nahema
Ship Destroyed with the highest blood pressure: Dragon

;7
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Woolie Wool on February 02, 2004, 11:06:03 am
Quote
Originally posted by Lightspeed
Best Shivan fighter ever: Scorpion.
:)


That thing sucks. I'd pick the Manticore, Basilisk, Mara, or Dragon any day over the Scorpion.

Best Terran ship ever: Apollo
Worst Terran ship ever: Pegasus

Best Vasudan ship ever: Seth
Worst Vasudan ship ever: Ptah or Osiris

Best Shivan ship ever: Dragon
Worst Shivan ship ever: Shaitan

Best overall ship: Apollo
Worst overall ship: Shaitan
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: an0n on February 02, 2004, 11:13:32 am
Even pre-shields, the Apollo could kick the ass of anything in space. Including Saths if you've got enough patience.
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Zarax on February 02, 2004, 11:22:46 am
Best Ships Ever Used: Ares&Ursa
Worst Ship: Loki (And because i'm sadistic i place the player into one of them almost in every mission i design).
Basically, the more missiles it carries, the better.
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Dough with Fish on February 02, 2004, 11:29:34 am
My favorite Terran fighter is a dead tie between the Apollo and the Enyeries (sp?) A close second for me is the Perseus. My least favorite has to be the Myrmidon. God damn, I hate flying that thing. For some reason, I am not that big a fan of flying Vasudan craft...... I don't know why or anything, their all good ships, but I just don't like flying them. (And for those of you who want to fly the Anubis in FS2, check out the Pandoras Box campaign...) And I agree with most everyone that the Dragon is the Shivans best fighter.... What I do whenever I see one of them is target it right away and send my wingmen all after it, as I'd rather deal with swarms of Shivan Basilisks and the like than one Dragon.
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Bobboau on February 02, 2004, 12:02:05 pm
I always loved the Apollo in FS1 used it and the valc right up till I got the Ulysses, at wich point I tended to use Ulysses or Apollo
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Ghostavo on February 02, 2004, 02:40:30 pm
Dough with Fish... my feelings for the Dragon exactly!! ;)

To see how hard is to hit that bloody thing you only have to play the FS1 mission where you have to disable one on insane...

Best Vasudan Ship... Tauret anyone?

Terran... light bombers (athena and artemis) rule!! :rolleyes:
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Flaser on February 02, 2004, 03:34:17 pm
Best All-round fighter: Apollo, Mara
Best Multirole Bomber: Athena, the Zeus comes close
Best Lightning Bomber: Athena, Artemis DH, Hydra, Artemis
Best Interceptor: Valkyre, Horus comes close, Dragon (unless you're given one with Shivan statistics {sliding, correct ETS ect.}, than its on equal grounds with the Valkyre)
Best Assault Fighter: Hercules (it takes practice and a spin-capable joy to use it - it has massive firepower), Erynes (the ETS is unbalanced, you'll have to be a spider to keep it in rein), Herc 2 (I really miss my 4 primaries as one slot)
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Woolie Wool on February 02, 2004, 03:53:23 pm
Quote
Originally posted by Zarax
Worst Ship: Loki (And because i'm sadistic i place the player into one of them almost in every mission i design).


If they didn't **** up the stealth, it would've been a great fighter. But without stealth it's worthless.
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Woolie Wool on February 02, 2004, 03:54:06 pm
Quote
Originally posted by DeepSpace9er
Best Terran Ship Ever: Perseus
Worst: Herc - piss poor weapon positioning

Best Shivan Ship Ever: Dragon
Worst: Basilisk - slow, stupid, and big

Best Vasudan Ship Ever: Horus
Worst: Anubis - speaks for itself


Ship Destroyed with the most satisfaction: Nahema
Ship Destroyed with the highest blood pressure: Dragon

;7


The Aeshma is worse than the Basilisk by a long shot.

LOL @ highest blood pressure. You love it when you fly it and you hate it when you don't.
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Lightspeed on February 02, 2004, 04:50:19 pm
The Scorpion rules, the dragon has poor weaponry ('tis a bit like the serapis) - In FS2 the Erinyes (whee - I can spell) is pretty good, and the Perseus (it's a shame they took out my favourite, the Valkyrie). The best bomber is, and will always be the Ursa.

Worst vasudan ship ever made: The Bakha bomber. It can't carry assault weapons, it cant carry bombs. Its not a fighter. Its not a bomber. Its crap.

Worst terran ship ever: Zeus. No need to explain. Crap Hull, crap weapons, slow, easy to hit, ...

Worst shivan ship ever: the Aeshma (gotta love spelling!) fighter :D
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: karajorma on February 02, 2004, 05:36:37 pm
Quote
Originally posted by Woolie Wool
If they didn't **** up the stealth, it would've been a great fighter. But without stealth it's worthless.


Yeah. You'd think someone would do something about that. But the GTVA went down the road of making the pegasus instead so if you wanted an upgraded loki you'd need to look for someone cut off from the GTVA for at least 32 years. Hmmm. Now in which campaign would you find someone like that  :drevil:
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Black Wolf on February 02, 2004, 08:21:59 pm
Quote
Originally posted by karajorma


Yeah. You'd think someone would do something about that. But the GTVA went down the road of making the pegasus instead so if you wanted an upgraded loki you'd need to look for someone cut off from the GTVA for at least 32 years. Hmmm. Now in which campaign would you find someone like that  :drevil:


BWO! ;)
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Akalabeth Angel on February 02, 2004, 08:53:35 pm
Problem with that idea (upgraded Loki in Sol) is that the Loki didn't see action until Silent Threat which was post-Lucifer destruction. Unless Sol has the plans for the Loki, they would have never used it. One would assume that they would have the plans though, but that assumes that all fighters are designed and built in Sol. If a fighter was built by an non-Sol contractor, and the fighter only saw limited use with the GTI before Sol, it may have never really been used in the system.

It can't carry assault weapons, it cant carry bombs. Its not a fighter. Its not a bomber. Its crap.

     The Bakha carries Cyclops as standard, and also carried the Helios in Bear Baiting even though its not allowed it in the ships.tbl
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: SadisticSid on February 03, 2004, 04:21:06 am
Actually it can carry Helios, only in its primary bank. ;)

Wonder what they were smoking when they put that in...
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: an0n on February 03, 2004, 04:26:54 am
All you ever need is an Apollo or an Ursa.
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: aldo_14 on February 03, 2004, 04:31:06 am
Valkyrie.  Best frontal profile ever. :nod:
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: karajorma on February 03, 2004, 06:19:19 am
Quote
Originally posted by Akalabeth Angel
Problem with that idea (upgraded Loki in Sol) is that the Loki didn't see action until Silent Threat which was post-Lucifer destruction. Unless Sol has the plans for the Loki, they would have never used it. One would assume that they would have the plans though, but that assumes that all fighters are designed and built in Sol. If a fighter was built by an non-Sol contractor, and the fighter only saw limited use with the GTI before Sol, it may have never really been used in the system.


You kind of answered your own question. The Loki was built in secret for the GTI. It seems likely to me that (like the Hades) it was designed in-house. Remember that even the branch of the GTI you were with didn't recognise the Loki when you first encounter it. That suggests a super secret project. Going to an outside contractor to build it would just be a huge security risk.

 Now if you say that the designing was done in Sol (which was no doubt the seat of power for the GTI) you've got a situation where both Sol and the GTI would have had access to the Loki.
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Zarax on February 03, 2004, 08:20:42 am
Well, i once made a mission where your loki was made hidden from sensors (getting only the intermittent blips) with awacs support and you had to scan a ship subsystems before the awacs was taken out... pretty funny
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Eishtmo on February 03, 2004, 07:11:44 pm
Quote
Originally posted by karajorma
Going to an outside contractor to build it would just be a huge security risk.


Must not have been that huge, everything says it was built by Han-Roland, the company that built all but three of FS1's fighters, the Athena, Zues and Ulysses).
Title: yeah
Post by: Star Dragon on February 03, 2004, 09:29:07 pm
Remember the "Skunk Works" McDonald-Douglas (I believe) civillians working on top secret stealth aircraft. Now they do alien ****e...:p

  $20,000 for a hammer my ass! (unless it really IS a single hammer, but one desinged to hammer in ALIEN components that normal hammers can't)...

  Now the uber toilet seat has me stumped however... The one that washes and blow drys you ass is NOT that expensive. Makes me wonder what sort of features the secret military one has? :rolleyes:
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Liberator on February 03, 2004, 09:44:14 pm
scrubbing bubbles?
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: DeepSpace9er on February 03, 2004, 10:49:35 pm
Can we talk about something contructive besides alien toilet seats hammering people's asses?
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: karajorma on February 04, 2004, 03:25:19 am
Quote
Originally posted by Eishtmo
Must not have been that huge, everything says it was built by Han-Roland, the company that built all but three of FS1's fighters, the Athena, Zues and Ulysses).


Ah but was that during silent threat or were the designs turned over to them as part of the reduction of GTI powers and assets that no doubt happened immediately following the Hades Rebellion? ;)
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: TrashMan on February 04, 2004, 03:50:51 pm
The Athena kicks ass.

I used to use her whenever the opportunity arose, even in intercept missions. By far the best ship!
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Eishtmo on February 04, 2004, 07:17:45 pm
Quote
Originally posted by karajorma


Ah but was that during silent threat or were the designs turned over to them as part of the reduction of GTI powers and assets that no doubt happened immediately following the Hades Rebellion? ;)


During, assuming the information in the tables for Silent Threat are accurate.
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Liberator on February 04, 2004, 09:23:19 pm
Quote
Originally posted by TrashMan
The Athena kicks ass.

I used to use her whenever the opportunity arose, even in intercept missions. By far the best ship!


I have to agree, it's in the top five.  Would definitely be the best bomber if it could mount bombs:rolleyes: , it behaves more like a heavy fighter.  It's only major flaw is it's gun placement, it requires high acuracy during dogfights.
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Jal-18 on February 04, 2004, 09:29:22 pm
Not to mention the giant profile when viewed top/down.  But it's almost impossible to see from every other angle.
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: neo_hermes on February 04, 2004, 10:30:26 pm
why doesn't someone fix the Athena.
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Liberator on February 04, 2004, 10:55:39 pm
Fix how?  Like an Athena Mk 2?  All smooth edges and larger payload?
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: IceFire on February 04, 2004, 11:11:46 pm
Who was making fun of the Bakha.  Its probably one of the best pure bombers around...the Sekhmet is a heavy assault bomber more like the Ursa (firepower, flexibility, brute force) while the Bakha is more strike oriented...but I'd say that the Bakha is great...you have a small, compact, tough, and relatively well armed to take on specific targets and dogfight your way out of the battle.

Boanerges is my favorite bomber tho :)
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Drew on February 04, 2004, 11:14:09 pm
i hate the bakha it had a rather...small payload  ....
the Sekhmet is awesome tho. It 0wnz in multi.
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Akalabeth Angel on February 04, 2004, 11:28:39 pm
Boanerges? That unmanoeuvrable piece of crap doesn't even have a turret. I agree with the other guys, the Sekhmet is the coolest bomber in GTVA. (not that the Sekhmet has a turret mind you, but turreted bombers seem to have gone out of flavour for some odd reason)
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Woolie Wool on February 05, 2004, 10:35:46 am
The Ursa owns them all. Nothing can match its payload (except the Seraphim, which doesn't count).
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: CP5670 on February 05, 2004, 01:36:25 pm
Quote
Who was making fun of the Bakha. Its probably one of the best pure bombers around...the Sekhmet is a heavy assault bomber more like the Ursa (firepower, flexibility, brute force) while the Bakha is more strike oriented...but I'd say that the Bakha is great...you have a small, compact, tough, and relatively well armed to take on specific targets and dogfight your way out of the battle.

Boanerges is my favorite bomber tho :)


The nice thing about the Bakha is that it is just as good a heavy fighter as a bomber. This can be crucial in some singleplayer missions in which you cannot rely on the stupid AI wingmen to protect you from enemy fighters. :D The Helios compatibility is a bonus for something of its size and speed. The only problems with it are that misleading line in the tech room about the small profile for heat seekers and the screwy shield HUD ani (although I released a fix for that a few years ago).

The Boanerges has excellent missile capacities but the way its primary gunpoints are placed some distance away from the eyepoint can get annoying. Same goes for the Ursa, actually.

Quote
The Ursa owns them all. Nothing can match its payload (except the Seraphim, which doesn't count).


eh, the Sekhmet and Boanerges have the same total missile capacity. The Boanerges can actually carry an extra Helios bomb due to the way FS2 rounds up missile capacities.
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Woolie Wool on February 05, 2004, 02:08:36 pm
Yeah, but the Ursa has 3 banks instead of two, which means you can carry a ****load of bombs AND have some missiles to defend yourself with (2 bomb banks, 1 missile bank). Plus the Boanerges doesn't have a turret, which is Not Good (tm). It also has 5 gun mounts instead of two. The Ursa has the most firepower of ANY GTVA bomber, bar none.
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: CP5670 on February 05, 2004, 02:40:53 pm
:wtf:

They all have three banks. In fact, the Sekhmet has exactly the same secondary configuration. The Ursa does trump the other two on primary firepower but, like the Boanerges, its gun mount positions make it harder to aim (also, the five gunpoints are split across two guns; it's not like the Shivan bombers). The Sekhmet has a quad mount and does not have problems with the gunmount positions but runs out of weapon energy more quickly. I guess the Ursa's Kayser turret gives it an edge over the others as far as firepower is concerned, but the secondary capacity is very similar to those of the other two.
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: magatsu1 on February 05, 2004, 02:40:58 pm
The Ursa's too slow. Flying it just gets tiresome.

I'd go for the Horus, Serapis if I'm in the mood, and Medusa.
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Hippo on February 05, 2004, 02:49:51 pm
the ursa is the only one with 80 set as its bank sizes...
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Flipside on February 05, 2004, 03:00:14 pm
No-ones mentioned the Ares, I wonder why? ;)

I actually quite liked the Myrmidon, I know it's not the most popular of ships, but it had good missile payload and blistering firepower, but the Apollo was a better interceptor in general performance.

As far as bombers go, the Boanerges could shrug off a hell of a lot of hits, but the Ursa wins for me because although it is no more manouverable, it has the extra protection of a turret. Both are pretty pedantic, but can deliver the goods :)

Least favourite ship : The Loki, a wing of three Loki is often 9 pieces of debris by the time it passes my ship.
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: CP5670 on February 05, 2004, 03:03:44 pm
Quote
the ursa is the only one with 80 set as its bank sizes...


eh...as I just said, the Sekhmet has exactly the same missile capacity and configuration as the Ursa.

Quote
No-ones mentioned the Ares, I wonder why?


I use it all the time actually. :D

Quote
Least favourite ship : The Loki, a wing of three Loki is often 9 pieces of debris by the time it passes my ship.


I think the worst FS2 ship would have to be a tie between the Loki and Osiris; the Loki was already mentioned but the Osiris is just as bad. Even the double turrets cannot make up for its pathetic secondary capacity. :p
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Eishtmo on February 05, 2004, 06:27:06 pm
Quote
Originally posted by Liberator
Fix how?  Like an Athena Mk 2?  All smooth edges and larger payload?


Sounds like the Artemis.
Title: Re: yeah
Post by: Woolie Wool on February 05, 2004, 09:54:31 pm
Quote
Originally posted by Star Dragon
Remember the "Skunk Works" McDonald-Douglas (I believe) civillians working on top secret stealth aircraft. Now they do alien ****e...:p

  $20,000 for a hammer my ass! (unless it really IS a single hammer, but one desinged to hammer in ALIEN components that normal hammers can't)...

  Now the uber toilet seat has me stumped however... The one that washes and blow drys you ass is NOT that expensive. Makes me wonder what sort of features the secret military one has? :rolleyes:


The fact that the military bought it, because anything it purchases automatically costs astronomical amounts of money. Are AIM-54 missiles REALLY worth $2 million?
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Woolie Wool on February 05, 2004, 09:58:24 pm
Quote
Originally posted by Flipside
No-ones mentioned the Ares, I wonder why? ;)

I actually quite liked the Myrmidon, I know it's not the most popular of ships, but it had good missile payload and blistering firepower, but the Apollo was a better interceptor in general performance.


The Myrmidon handles like an original Herc and its weapon placement and secondary capacity is worse. It may be fast, but speed is nothing if you can't maneuver. You'd just be somewhat faster-moving bait for an Apollo's guns.
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Liberator on February 05, 2004, 11:30:58 pm
I think the Myrm sucks so much because V was trying to show how the Terrans had fallen.  

At the end of FS1 they were at the peak technologically speaking, what with the Ursa, IS fighter Jump Drives, and the Banshee.  

By the time of FS2, the designs had become ****e because the sub-contractors had started to cut corners and pay off inspectors.

The Myrm is an example of a corrupt Military/Industrial complex feeding on itself.  It's just good enough to get by.  The Boanerges is another, it doesn't even compare to the Ursa except in the amount of punishment it can take.
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Black Wolf on February 06, 2004, 03:16:14 am
Err... What? The Myrmidon is one of the best fighters in the game. It's almost as fast as the Perseus and almost as strong as the Herc 2. Secondary capacity is a little lightm but you can carry 3 different types of weapon, and you've got six gunpoints to compensate, the most of any Terran Fighter except the Erinyes. It's a Space Superiority fighter, which means it has to be capable of doing pretty much everything, and it is, in most cases.
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Col. Fishguts on February 06, 2004, 04:42:20 am
But the Myrm is just plain UGLY....I remember first playing FS2 and thinking: "OH MY GOD, What have they done ?!?"
Same story with the Boanerges....UGLY. Which is sad, since the design sketches for the Boanerges looked a LOT better than the finished product.
Title: Re: Re: yeah
Post by: SadisticSid on February 06, 2004, 05:46:26 am
Quote
Originally posted by Woolie Wool


The fact that the military bought it, because anything it purchases automatically costs astronomical amounts of money. Are AIM-54 missiles REALLY worth $2 million?


Duh. They're worth whatever the market will pay for them.
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Woolie Wool on February 06, 2004, 11:50:47 am
Quote
Originally posted by Black Wolf
Err... What? The Myrmidon is one of the best fighters in the game. It's almost as fast as the Perseus and almost as strong as the Herc 2. Secondary capacity is a little lightm but you can carry 3 different types of weapon, and you've got six gunpoints to compensate, the most of any Terran Fighter except the Erinyes. It's a Space Superiority fighter, which means it has to be capable of doing pretty much everything, and it is, in most cases.


That means nothing if it can't dodge for ****. It has a huge target profile from any angle and has TERRIBLE maneuverability. They should have stuck with the Uly or redesigned the Apollo. Hell, you don't really need a redesign. Beef up the reactor a bit, increase weapon compatibility, and slap on two more gunpoints and it will be better than the Myrmidon could ever hope to be.
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Flipside on February 06, 2004, 12:03:43 pm
Hercules :

$Rotdamp:                       0.35
$Max Velocity:               0.0, 0.0, 50.0                  ;; in x/y/z -- z only specified forward.  use special tokens for backward movement
$Rotation time:               4.0, 4.5, 4.0
$Rear Velocity:               0.0
$Forward accel:               3.0
$Forward decel:               1.5
$Slide accel:               0.0
$Slide decel:               0.0
$Hitpoints:                     250

Mymidon :

$Rotdamp:                       0.35
$Max Velocity:               0.0, 0.0, 75.0                  ;; in x/y/z -- z only specified forward.  use special tokens for backward movement
$Rotation time:               4.0, 3.7, 5
$Rear Velocity:               0.0
$Forward accel:               2.4
$Forward decel:               2.0
$Hitpoints:                     290

As you can see, the Myrmidon is precisiely what it was designed to be, it's faster, and more manourverable than a Herc, has more hitpoints, and a higher payload. Not a bad upgrade in my opinion :) Admittedly, it doesn't pull up as fast, and it doesn't accelerate as quickly, but then, I'd rather fight the NTF in one of these than a Herc :)
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Akalabeth Angel on February 06, 2004, 12:31:48 pm
More manoeuvrable than a herc? Look at the rotation times, it's only better rotating on one axis, on the last axis its worse. Maybe the Myrmidon is actually the true successor to the Hercules, while the Herc 2 is the successor to the Apollo. The Herc 2 has a better profile, less guns (as in the Apollo) and its more manoeuvrable than either the Myrm or the Mk1 (except for the Rotation Damp). Compared to the Myrmidon, the Mk2 may not be so bad as everyone claims it is.

$Damp:                          0.25
$Rotdamp:                       0.4
$Max Velocity:              0.0, 0.0, 55.0
$Rotation time:              3.8, 4.2, 3.8
$Rear Velocity:         0.0
$Forward accel:         3.6
$Forward decel:         1.3
$Hitpoints:                     275
Title: Re: Re: yeah
Post by: aldo_14 on February 06, 2004, 12:35:42 pm
Quote
Originally posted by Woolie Wool


The fact that the military bought it, because anything it purchases automatically costs astronomical amounts of money. Are AIM-54 missiles REALLY worth $2 million?


They need to siphon off the money to the evil alien conspiracy to put a mindless drone in control of the Whitehouse somehow.
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Flipside on February 06, 2004, 01:15:59 pm
Akalabeth, I did actually say in my post that the Mymidon is worse on one Axis, but for the added firepower, it's worth the loss ;)

Anyway, it's all down to personal preference, and just as some people like flying a bomber that is bigger and slower because it carries more bombs, I like fighters that sacrifice a little agility for the sake of the ability to actually fight ;)
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Liberator on February 06, 2004, 03:27:40 pm
Can someone explain to me how the Myrm is bigger than the Mk2 but has less secondary payload?
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: CP5670 on February 06, 2004, 03:34:22 pm
Poor engineering, I guess. :p
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Flipside on February 06, 2004, 03:35:42 pm
LOL

Naaa... the extra room is for smuggling out all those military secrets to their corporate masters ;)
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: redsniper on February 06, 2004, 04:15:52 pm
to make room for the Helioses
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Deathstorm V2 on February 09, 2004, 04:08:42 am
Call me odd, but I like the Myrm more than most other fighters.  The only ones I'd take over it, are a Perseus or an Ares.

Erinyes comes in fourth.
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Zarax on February 09, 2004, 04:36:42 am
The Myrmidon is out of question for me since it can't carry my beloved Harpoons...
How is a pilot supposed to survive without them?
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Deathstorm V2 on February 09, 2004, 07:22:54 am
Quote
Originally posted by Zarax
The Myrmidon is out of question for me since it can't carry my beloved Harpoons...
How is a pilot supposed to survive without them?

6 gun banks and a supply of Tornadoes?  You can't loose!
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Zarax on February 09, 2004, 08:09:16 am
Nah, i don't really like them...
Nothing can match Harpoon's precision
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Setekh on February 09, 2004, 08:29:16 am
Depends what you're attacking. For an assault run on light cruisers and bombers, I'd take a mix of both.

And who rated the clothes peg so lowly? Deathstorm! How can you not respect the 8 primary banks? :D
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Akalabeth Angel on February 09, 2004, 09:32:23 am
I think the Erinyes has low subsystem armor. Whenever you take a hit in that thing your subsystem damage lights up like a christmas three with three to four suddenly up there.
   The Erinyes is alright but its not my cup of tea. The Tauret owns 'em all.
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Liberator on February 09, 2004, 09:42:00 am
No it doesn't, the primary reserves are entirely too small.  I mean really, toss off two volleys of Prometheus and their drained, two @#[email protected]#$ volleys.
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Deathstorm V2 on February 10, 2004, 05:14:58 am
I guess it depends on your combat style.  I like lots of gun banks over missiles.

Quote
Originally posted by Setekh
And who rated the clothes peg so lowly? Deathstorm! How can you not respect the 8 primary banks? :D


The reason I put the Ares ahead of the Erinyes is that whenever possible I use heavy fighters like turrets.  Sit'n sting, let the enemy come to me.  Erinyes isn't tough enough for that, which is why I put it second.
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Havock on February 10, 2004, 08:05:25 am
myrmi is more like the fighter-bomber i think, it's the GTVA multi-purpose fighter.

i never liked the bat, handles good, but lack of banshee-carrying capability made it end up far below valkyrie in fs1.
we won't mention the ully in fs2.

next up: dragon and mara's, can both be a pain in the ass, though mara's are pretty big, especially from top/bottom.
dragon's are mean, i like it, i mean, hate it.

well, both, it's a cool fighter.
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Janos on February 10, 2004, 08:18:10 am
Quote
Originally posted by Havock

next up: dragon and mara's, can both be a pain in the ass, though mara's are pretty big, especially from top/bottom.
dragon's are mean, i like it, i mean, hate it.

well, both, it's a cool fighter.


"Damn, Dragon-class fighters entering!"

Why is the Dragon so much easier in FS2? :mad: I remember my first contact with Dragons. "Hey, I survided the first real Scorpion/Basilisk attacks, these are just more cannon fodder. Oh sh---"

I mean, I loved them and hated them in the same time. They were a real pain in the ass, a wing of them could easily run over any GTA/PVN wing until you got Uly. Valkyrie had too light shields to stand against them. And with crappy Interceptor/Hornet loadouts I practically always had to use my primaries - unless picking them up at long range with Phoenixes, which only takes down one or two.

Nothing stands equal to FS1-era Dragon in FS2, not even their version of Dragon. They [FS2 Shivans] are "just cannon fodder".
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Woolie Wool on February 10, 2004, 11:17:26 am
Quote
Originally posted by Liberator
Can someone explain to me how the Myrm is bigger than the Mk2 but has less secondary payload?


Because it sucks.
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Zarax on February 10, 2004, 11:22:31 am
Because someone thought that 3 small bays are better than 2 big ones, plus the myrm has a bigger reactor (i think)
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Stryke 9 on February 10, 2004, 11:57:01 am
Isn't most of the space it takes up actually empty, what with the spikes and ****?

Erinyes... feh. Overrated. Most dogfights come down to missiles anyway, if you're not flying an interceptor (at which point you can basically sit right on top of the other guy and pound his ass to dust with primaries).
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: magatsu1 on February 10, 2004, 02:17:57 pm
Quote
Originally posted by Deathstorm V2
Call me odd, but I like the Myrm more than most other fighters.  The only ones I'd take over it, are a Perseus or an Ares.

Erinyes comes in fourth.


You're odd.










a bit late I know, but WTH.
Title: Ulysses Oddity
Post by: Hippo on February 10, 2004, 02:48:04 pm
Quote
Originally posted by CP5670




I think the worst FS2 ship would have to be a tie between the Loki and Osiris; the Loki was already mentioned but the Osiris is just as bad. Even the double turrets cannot make up for its pathetic secondary capacity. :p


Well, since it was never actually in FS2, you can't just rate the Osiris by fan campaigns, or even your own... (no offence)... The only way to see the dignity of the Osiris is in some of the FS1 missions (the shieldless ones mainly, but both), when they would jump in wih several wings of fighters, and you'd have a decision... either take out the bombers and take heavy damage because you lack shields, or let them get into bomb range while dealing with escorts, and either have the capital ships take moderate damage, or hurt yourself a good deal from bomb explosions...


*cough*alittlelate*cough*