Hard Light Productions Forums
General FreeSpace => FreeSpace Discussion => Topic started by: CP5670 on December 22, 2001, 11:46:00 am
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I was testing out one of the missions in my campaign last night, where the player has to disable a Hatshepsut-class destroyer, and noticed something strange: the Stiletto and Trebuchet missiles I was firing at it were not damaging the engines at all! The Maxim and Akheton cannons werebringing the subsystem strength down though, so I was wondering what the problem was. After about a hour of trial and error with various aspects of the tables and mission, I came to the conclusion that the model file itself has an error in it. When I examined the model more carefully, I noticed that the centers of the engine subsystems were not even on the ship. :P This would explain why primary cannons worked on them but homing missiles (which go towards the center) did not; it seems that FS2 first checks to see if the missile has come in contact with the polymodel and then attempts to calculate other damages, and the missiles exploded before they hit the actual ship.
The bug is quite easy to fix; I just moved around the subsystems a bit and it worked fine after that. Too bad the Hatshepsut model is 725.875kb in filesize (about 200kb zipped); just adds more to download for my campaign file... :P
Anyway, has anyone else noticed this or had a problem with it?
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200kb isnt that bad.
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The only problem is that the file containing the mods and the first six missions is already 7.4MB zipped (I'm looking at 7.5MB with the remaing five missions dropped in), so I wanted to keep the filesize from growing any further than that. (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/wink.gif)
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Whoa, smart. (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/smile.gif)
Nice work, dude. (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/smile.gif)
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Originally posted by Setekh:
Whoa, smart. (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/smile.gif)
Very - especially of the Hatshepsut's designers. (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/biggrin.gif) (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/wink.gif)
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Whoa, smart.
Nice work, dude.
Hey, thanks. (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/smile.gif) (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/biggrin.gif)
Very - especially of the Hatshepsut's designers.
I wonder who we should blame; the people working for a corporation located in Sol that is called "Volition" or the engineers at Akheton... (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/wink.gif)
How can a ship like that even work properly? I mean, with an engine floating around behind the ship and one which does not have any mass or volume... (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/biggrin.gif) (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/biggrin.gif)
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Originally posted by CP5670:
I wonder who we should blame; the people working for a corporation located in Sol that is called "Volition" or the engineers at Akheton... (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/wink.gif)
How can a ship like that even work properly? I mean, with an engine floating around behind the ship and one which does not have any mass or volume... (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/biggrin.gif) (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/biggrin.gif)
Must... resist urge... quantum punnery bad...
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--Mik
http://www.404error.com
ruhkferret on ICQ/AIM
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Though you have to admit that it was a very strategic decision by the Vasudans to put the things were they are in the original model.
By the time one finds out the Destroyer's fightercomplement should be all over the attacking fighters... except if Alpha 1 is involved.
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Blame? It's a brillaint idea. It can`t be disabled. Akerton did a great job.
[V] on the other hand screwed up
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Originally posted by karajorma:
[V] on the other hand screwed up
they often do, if you ask me.
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*poing*
Did someone mention Red Faction?
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Theres nothing wrong with RF..
other than the short SP story...
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Originally posted by mikhael:
Must... resist urge... quantum punnery bad...
Steak punnery bad too. (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/wink.gif)
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Originally posted by Thorn:
Theres nothing wrong with RF..
other than the short SP story...
Well, and the renderer that's about 4 years behind the times, the useless weapons (some, not all), the primitive AI, the god-awful voice acting, the shoddy scripting, and the painfully mundane level design.
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ZylonBane's opinions do not represent those of the management.
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Originally posted by ZylonBane:
Originally posted by Thorn:
Theres nothing wrong with RF..
other than the short SP story...
Well, and the renderer that's about 4 years behind the times, the useless weapons (some, not all), the primitive AI, the god-awful voice acting, the shoddy scripting, and the painfully mundane level design.
[/B]
but the box it came in was pretty nice (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/biggrin.gif)
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Originally posted by ZylonBane:
Originally posted by Thorn:
Theres nothing wrong with RF..
other than the short SP story...
Well, and the renderer that's about 4 years behind the times, the useless weapons (some, not all), the primitive AI, the god-awful voice acting, the shoddy scripting, and the painfully mundane level design.
[/B]
? I thought everything you said what cool, (even the french dubbed voices were adequate, for once), only thing that stinked was the really short story.
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Hey, care to release the Big H fix seperately? I think that a lot of us would appreciate it! Thanks!
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Originally posted by venom2506:
? I thought everything you said what cool, (even the french dubbed voices were adequate, for once)
Errr... have you played Half-Life? Or System Shock, or Thief? Prolonged exposure to any of these games tends to raise your expectations of story-based FPSs.
But anyway, if you think it's cool that there's no dynamic lighting, and that it takes over a second to just toss a grenade, and that the level design is utterly forgettable, and that the plot makes no freakin' sense, and that the "sneak" sections suck, and that the enemies scream like little girls when they need to reload... well then, you're welcome to it.
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ZylonBane's opinions do not represent those of the management.
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Originally posted by ZylonBane:
Originally posted by venom2506:
? I thought everything you said what cool, (even the french dubbed voices were adequate, for once)
Errr... have you played Half-Life? Or System Shock, or Thief? Prolonged exposure to any of these games tends to raise your expectations of story-based FPSs.
But anyway, if you think it's cool that there's no dynamic lighting, and that it takes over a second to just toss a grenade, and that the level design is utterly forgettable, and that the plot makes no freakin' sense, and that the "sneak" sections suck, and that the enemies scream like little girls when they need to reload... well then, you're welcome to it.
[/B]
yes, I played half Life, and yes, I played thief (which remains my favourite FPS, tho FPS really doesn't fit to it), and I don't say Red faction is the best ever, but the fact is that I did enjoy it and that it was fun. And excuse me, but appart from a couple of games like Severance, dynamic lightning my a$$ (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/rolleyes.gif)
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Hey, care to release the Big H fix seperately? I think that a lot of us would appreciate it! Thanks!
Sure; I'll zip it up and upload it somewhere in a little bit for those interested. (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/smile.gif)
Actually I have slightly modified the Mentu model as well to make the turrets more effective (just changed the FOVs for the turret submodels); might as well include that too. (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/smile.gif)
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you forgott the multi player part that would be quicker to discribe what works than what doesn't. and the french dubbed voice acting is probly better than the origonal. I didn't think the game as a whole was painful to play(excluding the voice acting) but I guess I had come to expect something more from V, like a game that is four years ahead of it's time (freespace)
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Bobboau, bringing you products that work.............. in theory
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Originally posted by Bobboau:
you forgott the multi player part that would be quicker to discribe what works than what doesn't. and the french dubbed voice acting is probly better than the origonal. I didn't think the game as a whole was painful to play(excluding the voice acting) but I guess I had come to expect something more from V, like a game that is four years ahead of it's time (freespace)
well, technically, V is not the best developper, sorry to break your dream. Freespace 1 and 2 were not flawless either, but FS1 didn't have a real challenger then, and FS2, well, wasn't a hit. You wonder why?
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FS2 is still the best space combat game even though it is getting quite old by now.
Yes it has it's flaws but a lot of them are only obvious cause you haven`t found anything better in the years since it was released.
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Originally posted by karajorma:
FS2 is still the best space combat game even though it is getting quite old by now.
Yes it has it's flaws but a lot of them are only obvious cause you haven`t found anything better in the years since it was released.
And then, there's the community... (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/wink.gif)
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Originally posted by venom2506:
well, technically, V is not the best developper, sorry to break your dream. Freespace 1 and 2 were not flawless either, but FS1 didn't have a real challenger then, and FS2, well, wasn't a hit. You wonder why?
The only reason Freespace didn't make it big was because of Interplay, not because of the games themselves. Hell, Freespace2 won Sim of the Year for crying out loud. Thats got to say SOMETHING. Freespace2 could've been a MAJOR hit if Interplay hadn't screwed things up.
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"You know you've played Freespace too much when you're driving along trying to use countermeasures to shake off pursuing highway police." - Top Gun
"Oh and Kazan - you have some nice rocks" - Thunder
"stapled myself to an office chair, forgot about it, and was stuck for 2 hours for one thing" - Stryke 9
Material Defender Studios ("http://www.mdstudios.f2s.com/index.html")
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Originally posted by MD-2389:
The only reason Freespace didn't make it big was because of Interplay, not because of the games themselves. Hell, Freespace2 won Sim of the Year for crying out loud. Thats got to say SOMETHING. Freespace2 could've been a MAJOR hit if Interplay hadn't screwed things up.
well, lots of people does know FS2, and knows the awards it won... why didn't they buy it? there's a reason (that I can find, I admit), but I doubt it has anything to do with interplay.
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Originally posted by venom2506:
well, lots of people does know FS2, and knows the awards it won... why didn't they buy it? there's a reason (that I can find, I admit), but I doubt it has anything to do with interplay.
The only reason FS2 didn't make it big is pretty much the same reason that Starlancer, FS1, WingCommander:Prophecy and Iwar1 didn't make it big. Most people aren't really after space combat sims. The serious simmers want hardcore fighter jet or helicopter sims and the average gamer wants Quake style fragfests or arcade style action shooters. Games like Quake and Unreal and the like are instant gratification to gamers. The blood and gibs and weapon effects are like popcorn. It takes a different sort of person, a rarer sort, to really get behind the stick of a virtual cockpit and fly in the inkyblack chasing down Shivans and really really like it.
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--Mik
http://www.404error.com
ruhkferret on ICQ/AIM
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Originally posted by mikhael:
The only reason FS2 didn't make it big is pretty much the same reason that Starlancer, FS1, WingCommander:Prophecy and Iwar1 didn't make it big. Most people aren't really after space combat sims. The serious simmers want hardcore fighter jet or helicopter sims and the average gamer wants Quake style fragfests or arcade style action shooters. Games like Quake and Unreal and the like are instant gratification to gamers. The blood and gibs and weapon effects are like popcorn. It takes a different sort of person, a rarer sort, to really get behind the stick of a virtual cockpit and fly in the inkyblack chasing down Shivans and really really like it.
yeah, the times when Wing commander2 make the PC sell, and WC3 the pentium sell, is over now (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/frown.gif)
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LOL I was debugging that mission last night and found another bug with the Hatshepsut model. If you look carefully at turret19, it can be seen that the turret is actually inside the ship model. (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/biggrin.gif) It does not fire weapons properly (I could only get it to fire certain things and even those it did not aim properly) and also shows up as being out of the line-of-sight of the player when targeted (red X mark), no matter which direction it is being approached from. If it is able to fire at you (if you get really close it detects you), it looks like the shots are coming right out of the hull. (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/biggrin.gif)
I don't think I can fix this very easily since I do not know how to reposition the turret submodels, but it seems to work a bit better when firing if the firing point is placed above the actual turret.
Anyway yeah, Interplay did a pretty poor job of marketing and advertising FS2.I bet it would have sold really well if the publisher was any good. (http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~freespace/ubb/noncgi/frown.gif)
[This message has been edited by CP5670 (edited 12-30-2001).]
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Originally posted by venom2506:
well, lots of people does know FS2, and knows the awards it won... why didn't they buy it? there's a reason (that I can find, I admit), but I doubt it has anything to do with interplay.
Because it wasn't advertised enough. Most people (I'm referring to the non-hardcore crowd here) aren't going to spend $40 on a game that they never heard of and know absolutely diddly squat about. They'll go off and spend it on some stupid ground pounder instead. Hell, the original Descent got a frelling TV commercial and I *know* it sold like crazy because stores couldn't keep it on the shelves longer than a day or two!
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"You know you've played Freespace too much when you're driving along trying to use countermeasures to shake off pursuing highway police." - Top Gun
"Oh and Kazan - you have some nice rocks" - Thunder
"stapled myself to an office chair, forgot about it, and was stuck for 2 hours for one thing" - Stryke 9
Material Defender Studios ("http://www.mdstudios.f2s.com/index.html")
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Descent sold well? I thought it didn't do all that well, actually. (it was published by Interplay, so it makes sense)
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Originally posted by CP5670:
Descent sold well? I thought it didn't do all that well, actually. (it was published by Interplay, so it makes sense)
will you lay down with that interplay stuff? If they were that bad, they wouldn't be that famous, d'uh!
Anyway, Descent sold very well (since they got to the 3rd one, unlike a certain series...) in some countries, like the states, but didn't do very well in europe.
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Originally posted by venom2506:
will you lay down with that interplay stuff? If they were that bad, they wouldn't be that famous, d'uh!
Anyway, Descent sold very well (since they got to the 3rd one, unlike a certain series...) in some countries, like the states, but didn't do very well in europe.
Descent itself did very well. Not only did they make three of them (at least two of which had an official expansion), but Freespace1 was called 'Descent: Freespace' with a subtitle of 'The Great War' just to get it the name recognition (yes, there were other reasons, but name recognition was a big one).
One of the places where Descent won big was that it broke ground with the engine and they were able to license that engine to other games. Further, they got Descent into a large number of OEM bundles, so customers got an idea about the game without having to seek out a demo or buy it blindly.
I have to agree with Venom. Interplay is not the uber-monster that most here make them out to be. Nor are they without fault. They're just a publishing house and their goal is to make money. Freespace2 came at a time when space-sims were just not making as much money as other genres. It would be foolish of them to make FS3, no matter how much we might want it. It will only lose them money.
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--Mik
http://www.404error.com
ruhkferret on ICQ/AIM