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General FreeSpace => FreeSpace Discussion => Topic started by: Vasudan Commander on January 20, 2007, 08:38:18 pm

Title: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Vasudan Commander on January 20, 2007, 08:38:18 pm
Well i think i've added em all. Let me know if i missed one.

My favourite would have to be the Myrmidon. It packs 6 gun banks, 3 missile banks, and can carry helios torpedoes, so it doubles as a bomber. A wing of Myrmidons packin helios' could easily take down a corvette.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mars on January 20, 2007, 08:49:14 pm
Erinyes... can do everything the Myrmidon can do... only better... as for taking out capships... the Erinyes can disable them in a few seconds and then bomb away with Trebs
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: redsniper on January 20, 2007, 09:04:14 pm
The Perseus just... owns. 8)
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Turey on January 20, 2007, 09:14:22 pm
The Perseus just... owns. 8)

QFT.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Ghostavo on January 20, 2007, 09:29:11 pm
Hercules MK2 FTW! I just love launching missile after missile. :D
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: DrewToby on January 20, 2007, 09:30:04 pm
Much as I love the intercepters (and the anti-son-of-a-***** machine that is the Erinyes), I gotta hand it to the Pegasus.

I love the design, and when I flew it, I fell in love. Beautiful flight characteristics. In a level FREDed for TAGing, nothing beats the thing. And there's something immeasureably cool about being mostly invisible, especially when you have to deal with freakin' AAA beams.

Aside from the Pegasus, definitely the Erinyes. Or the Perseus, if I want to dogfight instead of own everything in one pass.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: BS403 on January 20, 2007, 09:49:03 pm
Where's my Ares?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Tyrian on January 20, 2007, 09:51:04 pm
Where's my Ares?

Yeah, where's the potato?  We demand the potato!

You're not the only Ares lover here, BS403...

In lieu of the Great Potato though, I'll take an Erinyes.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Polpolion on January 20, 2007, 09:57:08 pm
The Enrinyes has great primary firepower (assuming your good at managing power systems), an a decent secondary capacity. It's speed and maneuverability are okay.

[(Kaysers + maxims) - power systems] + (harpoons(16) + trebs(6)) = awesome^86
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mefustae on January 20, 2007, 10:07:52 pm
Technically, the Myrmidon is a joint-venture Terran-Vasudan development akin to the Ulysses. To be accurate, you should either take of the Myr or slap on the Uly.

Anyway, I vote for the Pegasus. You can't hit what you can't see.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Taristin on January 20, 2007, 10:18:19 pm
Loki. <3 how it looks.....
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mars on January 20, 2007, 10:20:18 pm
Technically, the Myrmidon is a joint-venture Terran-Vasudan development akin to the Ulysses. To be accurate, you should either take of the Myr or slap on the Uly.

Anyway, I vote for the Pegasus. You can't hit what you can't see.
The Myrmidon is more in the vein of the Apollo than the Ulysses... really the Ulysses has no real successor... none of the new fighters in FS2 are really very maneuverable... except possibly the Terran Mara.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: BS403 on January 20, 2007, 10:31:29 pm
Yay Ares :nod:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Taristin on January 20, 2007, 11:53:31 pm
except possibly the Terran Mara.

Which isnt Terran at all.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mars on January 21, 2007, 12:05:00 am
The cockpit is  :p
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: asyikarea51 on January 21, 2007, 12:46:16 am
Loki with Kayser and Maxim.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: NGTM-1R on January 21, 2007, 01:47:27 am
Where's my Athena?

Oh wait... :P
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: ShivanSpS on January 21, 2007, 02:15:18 am
The Myrmidon is more an Fighter/Bomber, but only with helios.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Dysko on January 21, 2007, 03:20:35 am
Perseus rocks!
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Vasudan Commander on January 21, 2007, 03:22:17 am
The Myrmidon is more an Fighter/Bomber, but only with helios.

Thats why its 'space superiority'.  It is superior to everything, if used effectively. It can take out fighters, bombers, cruisers, corvettes. a wing of myrmidons, in the right hands, can rip a corvette , and any fighters with it, to shreds.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: peterc10 on January 21, 2007, 04:15:56 am
GTF Perseus fast, manuverable, best dogfighter in the GTA
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Centrixo on January 21, 2007, 04:31:57 am
il take the perseus, it can get out of situations where the erinyes or ares fails. it can carry the fair amount of firepower for the manoverablitiy and speed of the ship. the only fighters that could possibly match it, are the SF Dragon and the GVF Thoth probably.

i wouldnt choose any ship like the erinyes because its 'your early grave' on insane skill.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: -Joshua- on January 21, 2007, 05:28:29 am
The Perseus just... owns. 8)

QFT.

QFTTQFT
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Vasudan Commander on January 21, 2007, 05:45:09 am
The Perseus just... owns. 8)

QFT.

QFTTQFT

What does this 'QFT' mean ?  :wtf:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on January 21, 2007, 05:52:03 am
QFT = Quite ****in True?

Go Ares. Heil the missile capacity and armor!!!
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Admiral Cheater on January 21, 2007, 07:47:39 am
I thought QFT was short for "Quoted For Truth".

As for my favorite fighter, probably the GTF Apollo (yes, I know it isn't in FS2)
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: asyikarea51 on January 21, 2007, 07:50:47 am
I used to like the Apollo, that was until I fired unguided rockets off it. The gunpoint positions are too far off centre IMO. :sigh:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on January 21, 2007, 09:04:17 am
I used to like the Apollo, that was until I fired unguided rockets off it. The gunpoint positions are too far off centre IMO. :sigh:

Yesh, upon playing the Plato mission again I found it was a lot easier to aim using the Valk. But I believe the Apollo was originally a bomber. Look at its size relative to the other ships.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Turey on January 21, 2007, 09:44:23 am
Yay! Perseus is winning!
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on January 21, 2007, 10:05:01 am
The Perseus is a good fighter but I'm never a fan of interceptors. I like lobbing missiles at people. ;)
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: ChronoReverse on January 21, 2007, 10:36:00 am
Secondaries are for the weak!  For that matter, Kaysers are for the weak!

Pegasus with Prom S =D


It's not the best or anything, but it's just really fun to fly something that fast and maneuverable while being a shadow in the theatre.  The Pegasus is probably the only fighter in Insane mode that reduces the difficulty of a mission significantly (unless you count the Ares in a few missions where it can snipe).
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Centrixo on January 21, 2007, 10:39:30 am
Quouted For Truth?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Trivial Psychic on January 21, 2007, 11:59:46 am
Go Ares. Heil the missile capacity and armor!!!
You forgot the 2+4 primaries, and the better weapon energy than Erinyes.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on January 21, 2007, 12:01:59 pm
Talking about its 6 primaries would probably draw comments like

"YOU STUPID TWIT THE ERINYES HAS 2 MORE THAN THAT YOU PRATT!"

(albeit slightly exaggerated)

But yeah.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mongoose on January 21, 2007, 02:10:17 pm
I say "pfeh" to the Perseus.  Give me the good ol' Valkyrie over it any day.  25 m/s faster at top speed, and an afterburner that you could hold down all day.  Nothing gets you into or out of trouble faster. :)

In terms of the poll, the GTF Clothespin, of course.  I <3 quads.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: peterc10 on January 21, 2007, 02:19:14 pm
the GTF Apollo is my favourite ship. Its underated alot. It is also one of the best ships designs ive seen.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: antihostile on January 21, 2007, 02:34:10 pm
Ares ends up being the default ship...even though I think the ship kind of looks like a turkey. Does anyone else think it looks like a turkey? It's got the big belly, and then that colour scheme...but I think the Erinyes is one of the best looking ships I've seen in any sci-fi verse in a long time.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Sarafan on January 21, 2007, 02:46:32 pm
I go with the Myrmidon, its a good all around with weapons, missiles, speed and armor plus its the only fighter wich can be a serious treat for capships, specially cruisers, thanks to those 2 Helios, I really like flying this fighter-bomber. :) A Vasudan version of it would be cool too.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on January 21, 2007, 03:01:25 pm
I go with the Myrmidon, its a good all around with weapons, missiles, speed and armor plus its the only fighter wich can be a serious treat for capships, specially cruisers, thanks to those 2 Helios, I really like flying this fighter-bomber. :) A Vasudan version of it would be cool too.

Damn it all, the ****ty Myrmidon and those ****ing Helios. I really hate that.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Sarafan on January 21, 2007, 04:03:25 pm

Damn it all, the ****ty Myrmidon and those ****ing Helios. I really hate that.

Ok, why?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Cobra on January 21, 2007, 04:13:28 pm
GTF Hercules. It's solid, strong, and firepower to rival the Erinyes.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: S-99 on January 21, 2007, 10:52:59 pm
Why isn't the athena up there? That's my favorite fighter/light bomber. It's a lot better than the artemis or the artemis DH, has much better gunpoints on it, and it's plain old durable, has good missile capacity. The athena should really have been redesignated tactical disruption fighter as opposed to light bomber. Light bombers in fs1 are completely different than normal bombers, mainly the fact that light bombers can't carry bombs in fs1. Light bombers are always carrying payload that takes out subsystems and great for taking out turrets...it really ****s with a target like the taranis. When guarded one light bomber is enough to disable a cruiser when armed properly for the role of fs1 light bomber. If the light bomber isn't guarded, it does great for dogfighting as well. This afternoon i was using an athena with avengers and flails. It was great, it was damaging the enemy fighter while throwing it off course so i could lob a missile at it.

But anyway, in fs1 when you use a light bomber correctly (having subsystem disruption weapons...nothing more powerful than tornadoes or interceptors can be equipped on it), it really becomes a class of fighter that should not have been called light bomber. I mean how confusing is it for a fighter to be called a light bomber when it can't carry bombs? That easily gets people into a situation where they're like hey, wtf i can't equip bombs...how do i use this thing? Then they have a fighter they don't know what to use it for. A class redesignation for the light bomber fighters would be very helpful, even for the shivans shaitan.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Cobra on January 21, 2007, 11:03:09 pm
Light Bombers aren't equipped nor large enough to carry actual bombs. :)
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Vasudan Commander on January 22, 2007, 12:58:10 am
I really REALLY liked the design of the GVF Anubis back in FS1. Although it was meant to be mass-produced cheap cannon fodder, it had a really cool looking design, reminding me of fighters from a different game or movie....cant remember where.


Still, it'd be cool if someone revived the GVF Anubis in a campaign.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mongoose on January 22, 2007, 03:41:28 am
You get to fly one in Shrouding the Light: Origins, if I remember correctly.  The lack of afterburners can come back to bite you, though. :p
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Admiral Edivad on January 22, 2007, 06:55:39 am
Ares... that fighter gets + 10 points only for the colours on the hull... :yes:
Erinyes is also a good fighter.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Vasudan Commander on January 22, 2007, 07:52:52 am
Ares... that fighter gets + 10 points only for the colours on the hull... :yes:
Erinyes is also a good fighter.

Ares isnt really a 'fighter'. It is what it says....'strategic assault'. Meant for hammering slow moving targets, like convoys, installations, cruisers or corvettes, or assisting bombers.

Erinyes is good, but if you use the kayser / maxim combo, you'll chew through energy like a minigun through bullets. Ares has a better reactor, thus, better afterburner and gun energy reserves.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Centrixo on January 22, 2007, 09:03:35 am
I really REALLY liked the design of the GVF Anubis back in FS1. Although it was meant to be mass-produced cheap cannon fodder, it had a really cool looking design, reminding me of fighters from a different game or movie....cant remember where.


Still, it'd be cool if someone revived the GVF Anubis in a campaign.

i could do that :D
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Dysko on January 22, 2007, 09:04:30 am
Ares... that fighter gets + 10 points only for the colours on the hull... :yes:
IMHO, the Ares looks like an Herc 2 tuned à la "Fast'n'Furious"... :nervous:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: asyikarea51 on January 22, 2007, 09:11:21 am
Fast'n'Furious

 :mad: :hopping:

 :nervous:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Dysko on January 22, 2007, 10:10:41 am
Ehm... why? :nervous:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Sarafan on January 22, 2007, 10:34:55 am
IMHO, the Ares looks like an Herc 2 tuned à la "Fast'n'Furious"... :nervous:

 :lol: :lol:

It actually does, it looks to be a lot better and faster but you end up with a flying brick.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Bob-san on January 22, 2007, 01:47:33 pm
I prefer the Myrmidon's fighter/bomber any day! You can't take much damage, but you can get out of the way easily!! Up to 4 Helios and a poweful 4 primary bank, that thing owns! I usually put something like a PromS on the 4 prime or Subach on the 2 prime.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Harbinger of DOOM on January 22, 2007, 03:53:52 pm
Where's the Valkyrie?!
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Vasudan Commander on January 23, 2007, 04:23:28 am
Where's the Valkyrie?!

the perseus improves on the valkyrie in every way. even looks better
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Bob-san on January 23, 2007, 07:04:15 am
Harbinger of DOOM, try playing the beginning of the FSPort or download the D:FS discs.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mobius on January 23, 2007, 03:12:49 pm
GTF PERSEUS
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on January 23, 2007, 03:14:22 pm
GTF POTATO.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mongoose on January 23, 2007, 05:13:56 pm
Where's the Valkyrie?!

the perseus improves on the valkyrie in every way. even looks better
...except, as previously noted, in the cases of top speed and afterburner capacity, for which the Valkyrie is far superior? :p
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Bob-san on January 23, 2007, 06:42:38 pm
If memory serves... 1 missile bank? The Perseus has 2 p00nage banks  :nod:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Trivial Psychic on January 23, 2007, 10:24:10 pm
Perseus has advantage in total secondary bank capacity: ( 40, 40 ) of Perseus, vs. ( 60 ) of Valkyrie.  The split banks also allow for weapon diversity if you've got some varying objectives to complete.  That said, the Valkyrie has the clear advantage in top speed: 80 top normal, 100 top at full engines, 140 with burners, for Perseus, vs. 85 top, 100 top at full engines, 165 with burners.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Vasudan Commander on January 24, 2007, 12:46:17 am
Where's the Valkyrie?!

the perseus improves on the valkyrie in every way. even looks better
...except, as previously noted, in the cases of top speed and afterburner capacity, for which the Valkyrie is far superior? :p

well yer, but the perseus makes up for that in firepower.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: ChronoReverse on January 24, 2007, 01:26:04 am
For those of you who like speed, why aren't you voting for the Pegasus which is super fast and super manueverable as well as stealth?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mefustae on January 24, 2007, 01:38:00 am
For those of you who like speed, why aren't you voting for the Pegasus which is super fast and super manueverable as well as stealth?
Because it has piss-poor offensive and defensive capability.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mongoose on January 24, 2007, 04:29:28 am
If memory serves... 1 missile bank? The Perseus has 2 p00nage banks  :nod:
I can't even tell you the last time I've managed to empty a non-bomber missile bank, no matter how small; not only do I not see the point in firing off something that's probably going to miss a great deal of the time, I figure I'm saving Command a few bucks here and there. :p
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: ChronoReverse on January 24, 2007, 10:19:21 am
Because it has piss-poor offensive and defensive capability.
I suppose... although with Prom-S cannons and two bays of Tempests you can take out any fighter in moments and it's easy to get behind anyone.

I find that in some levels at insane that it simply gives you a lot more breathing room when your wingmen get wiped out and there's an entire wing of scattered fighters all locking missiles on you =)


Too bad about the weapons compatibility; I guess it would make it unfair =D
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: aldo_14 on January 24, 2007, 10:30:01 am
I use missiles because I'm pish (and so is my joystick)

:)
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Admiral Edivad on January 24, 2007, 01:30:05 pm
I use missiles because I'm pish (and so is my joystick)

:)

try a mousestick, then. :lol:
by the way, i tried to launch a bomb against a fighter....
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mobius on January 24, 2007, 01:45:56 pm
GTF POTATO.

GTF *******.


The mousestick is excellent...you have to combine its use with a rapid pressing numpad, but It's awesome.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Admiral Edivad on January 24, 2007, 01:48:29 pm
The mousestick is excellent...you have to combine its use with a rapid pressing numpad, but It's awesome.

i don't have the numpad...
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mobius on January 24, 2007, 02:16:02 pm
Are you serious?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Taristin on January 24, 2007, 03:18:07 pm
Laptops dont have numpads.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Desert Tyrant on January 24, 2007, 08:33:26 pm
Meh, I voted for the Erinyes
 :nervous: >_>
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: General Battuta on January 24, 2007, 08:47:35 pm
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Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Admiral Edivad on January 25, 2007, 09:38:12 am
Are you serious?
I am serious -->
Laptops dont have numpads.
that's the reason for which i'm not doing Steadfast's final testing on the missions i fredded...

...Your head will be donated to the local Vasudan minority.
Are we only a minority here?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: TigrisJK on January 25, 2007, 01:35:26 pm
Pegasus. Sure the Ares can carry boatloads of Trebs and take out everything before they can even get close, and sure, I fly the Perseus as a matter of habit (and because the firepower is more than welcome), but the Perseus flies like a dream. Sure, it can't do much than what you set it up for, but who cares when the enemy can't hit you anyway? Just keep jamming the balance shield button every time you get hit and accomplish what you set out to do, then do dances around the enemy capship's spires after you've tagged it and ride the shockwave outta there when it blows. It's certainly not what I'd fly if my life depended on it, but it's certainly one of the most fun ships to fly in the game.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on January 25, 2007, 02:54:12 pm
I rarely fly the Pegasus, so I don't know, will enemies fire on you? IIRC they still do making the Pegasus mainly useless, but if they don't.......... ;7
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Desert Tyrant on January 25, 2007, 07:11:59 pm
I rarely fly the Pegasus, so I don't know, will enemies fire on you? IIRC they still do making the Pegasus mainly useless, but if they don't.......... ;7

I cant say I've ever flew the Pegasus
EDIT: D'oh!
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mars on January 25, 2007, 07:18:54 pm
flew
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: ChronoReverse on January 25, 2007, 08:07:35 pm
Half the time the AI opponents will ignore you.  Even when they shoot at you, it seems they miss a lot.  Only heatseakers will lock onto you and it's a very weak lock (simply turning to a side would break the lock).  The Pegasus is almost like cheating if not for the low firepower.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Flaser on January 26, 2007, 02:47:40 am
The Erynes, while certainly not an easy ship is too underapreciated.

A dedicated pilot, who constuntly junks the power settings and transfers power to and from banks can turn it into a true death incarnate.

Though none of you quoted the prime reason for its awsome firepower: gun point arrangement.
It has the best arrangement I ever flew, finally a fighter (or gunboat) where both your primary banks share the same arrangement, therefore their spread pattern will ensure an 80% hit most of the time. With other ships, you're forced to use one bank or the other, as linked guns don't have too much sense. Here, you can finally exploit having that many gun-points.

Just slap on a good shield braker and the maxim and you're cooking. Alternativly you could go for the morning star and watch people despair.

As for valnurability: this is a fighter that takes agressive flying - take adventage of the powerful shield, and ignore the pesks and go for the immediate kills.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: TrashMan on January 26, 2007, 04:52:26 am
I'd say Ares - sure it's flies like a brick, but if you're good that's no problem. Let's not forget the heavy armor and beastly shielding.

With 6 primary banks it's allmost as good as the Erynes whe nit comes to primary firepower. I found out that 6 is more than enough to turn any enemy into scrap metal, while drawing less power at the same time.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: brandx0 on January 26, 2007, 05:12:39 am
Why the hell do we need a half dozen "What's your favorite _____" topics in like a week?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Vasudan Commander on January 26, 2007, 05:24:27 am
Why the hell do we need a half dozen "What's your favorite _____" topics in like a week?

Blame me for that. Its good to get peoples opinions on FS2 and let the community have their say, and also lets us exchange our views on guns / fighters / bombers.

If you dont like it, well meh 2 u.  :P


I flew the Pegasus, and i must say, in any circumstances, it is unbelieveably good. Handles like a dream, is sporatic on enemies radar (flew it in multiplayer, and a friend of mine said my radar signature was sporatic and he couldnt lock me), has a very small target profile , and at long distances, its pretty much invisible, save for the minor blip on someones radar.

I think it would act as an excellent bomber escort. If you fly your pegasus alongside a friendly bomber, you'd disguise your radar signature, and the enemy would think it was an undefended flight of bombers....a mistake they'd regret. Sure the pegasus doesnt have alot of hitting power, but its got enough to harass an enemy or kill an interceptor.  8)

Would be a great tactic in multiplayer IMO (given that it would be a large-scale game)
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mobius on January 26, 2007, 06:09:57 am
It's fragile...

It belongs to another line of fighters.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: TigrisJK on January 26, 2007, 07:01:19 am
Oh, another thing about the Pegasus: On nebula maps, as the mission that introduces them shows... they are more than invisible. You have to target the Pegasus by sight and by your fuzzy radar lock, and a good pilot will just dance circles around whoever's chasing him. =)
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on January 26, 2007, 10:56:36 am
Pegasus fighters don't have a radar blip IIRC.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: S-99 on January 26, 2007, 01:34:51 pm
Yeah i don't remember them ever having a radar blip at all. Enemies completely don't shoot at me at all, unless i come into their line of sight, then i actually start getting shot at.
The pegasus is the best stealth ship in the game. Now if you're flying something like the vasudan stealth ship, that one isn't as good, it's stealthy, but you have to keep moving and nothing will find you. It's when  you stop moving in that ship that i think something pops up on the radar. I noticed a big difference in the stealth abilities of the vasudan stealthy bastard on the sath scanning mission, you just get shot at a lot more often compared to the never shot at unless you flew in front of some fighters pegasus.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on January 26, 2007, 03:27:07 pm
I believe this is because the Ptah has a larger target profile?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Goober5000 on January 26, 2007, 03:40:33 pm
Now if you're flying something like the vasudan stealth ship, that one isn't as good, it's stealthy, but you have to keep moving and nothing will find you. It's when  you stop moving in that ship that i think something pops up on the radar. I noticed a big difference in the stealth abilities of the vasudan stealthy bastard on the sath scanning mission, you just get shot at a lot more often compared to the never shot at unless you flew in front of some fighters pegasus.

That's because the Shivans are l33t at finding stealthy ships, not because the Ptah isn't as good.

No, this isn't just my opinion.  :v: specifically hacked that mission so that the Shivans would have an easier time finding you.  Extra points if you can figure out how. :D
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on January 26, 2007, 03:43:25 pm
Sath has AWACS?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Goober5000 on January 26, 2007, 03:44:36 pm
Got it in one.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: mr.WHO on January 26, 2007, 03:44:51 pm
GTF Perseus, coz I'm Suicide King :D
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on January 26, 2007, 03:52:08 pm
Got it in one.

I know because I once made a mission where you had to find the Sath in the nebula, but the damn thing just always came up on sensors. In the end I just made it invisible to sensors. But it still sucked.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mefustae on January 26, 2007, 03:58:26 pm
Got it in one.

I know because I once made a mission where you had to find the Sath in the nebula, but the damn thing just always came up on sensors. In the end I just made it invisible to sensors. But it still sucked.
That's a different issue; the fact that it's just plain tedious to get something invisible to sensors.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Bob-san on January 26, 2007, 05:49:15 pm
And what about using primtive sensors or setting up some SEXPs? Sort of at the start of the mission, make the Sath invisible to sensors. Fly around for a bit or something and set it up that once Alpha 1 gets within 10km or something, the Sath is now on sketchy targeting (like :v:'s nebula missions). At 4km or something, it comes on normal sensors because of its big profile.

That should help you if you didn't do that already.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mobius on January 27, 2007, 05:10:30 pm
It will appear in the escort list even if you can't detect it with your sensors. It happened to me in that STHCRS mission that reminds me your bug, Bob.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Centrixo on January 28, 2007, 08:25:55 am
Pegasus. Sure the Ares can carry boatloads of Trebs and take out everything before they can even get close, and sure, I fly the Perseus as a matter of habit (and because the firepower is more than welcome), but the Perseus flies like a dream. Sure, it can't do much than what you set it up for, but who cares when the enemy can't hit you anyway? Just keep jamming the balance shield button every time you get hit and accomplish what you set out to do, then do dances around the enemy capship's spires after you've tagged it and ride the shockwave outta there when it blows. It's certainly not what I'd fly if my life depended on it, but it's certainly one of the most fun ships to fly in the game.

i like flying into a shockwave at some speed, i dont wait around, i even play chicken against a enemy fighter, bombers, cruisers, corvettes, even the odd destroyer.

this is all with the perseus.

i tried pegasus, its good for missions against alot of enemy fighters, providing you dont fire with an enemy flying the same direction is who is behind you. i usually stock up with infernos to taken down fighters very quickly, and because thier is only one primary bank it fires 2x faster than with 2 banks, so there is more chance you hit the enemy, just keep wearing the enemy down until that ship is in bits.

the ares is ok for extreame flak, and heavy fighter attack but its not much more useful that that, its slow its not manuverable, to be honest it looks like it came out of a scrapyard.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: asyikarea51 on January 28, 2007, 08:41:13 am
I figure the Loki would be a serious rival to the Pegasus if it didn't lose its stealth ability. But the Pegasus is a joy to fly, that I don't dispute.

I tend to like fighters with more afterburner (not to mention my preference to Great War-era vessels), which is why I'm not really a fan of the Hercules 2 or the Myrmidon. I'm okay with the Perseus and don't mind the Ulysses. But I still like the Loki a fair bit. That, and maybe the Erinyes as well (yeah 8 nicely-placed guns = PREPARE TO DIE :mad: :lol:).

I've never actually flown the Ares before. :nervous: (And with that in mind, I'm not a fan of any of the Hercs or the Ares, mainly due to the gun positions, although I don't mind making do with them.)

Just my two cents. :)
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Bob-san on January 28, 2007, 09:43:27 am
What's fun is setting dual PromS's... screw low-refire... set it on bank 2 and switch to dual-mode between shots--you now have a PromS at a fast refire rate! Only problem is you have to reset the banks when you stop firing... it's great none-the-less for anything strong without a good refire!

It is a bit of an art... usually you can get it pretty close to half-way between refires and end up with a very fast and strong weapon. It works on any fighter or bomber with 2 primary banks that have 2 firing points each. Eats weapon energy like mad, but the advantage is not needed it to destroy everything else!
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: asyikarea51 on January 28, 2007, 09:48:52 am
What's fun is setting dual PromS's... screw low-refire... set it on bank 2 and switch to dual-mode between shots--you now have a PromS at a fast refire rate! Only problem is you have to reset the banks when you stop firing... it's great none-the-less for anything strong without a good refire!

I tend to use this 'trick' when I'm busy playtesting with the Gatling Lasers in my mod.

But every now and then I have this thing for variety - sometimes I mount a PromR and a PromS, then do the trick. :lol:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: ChronoReverse on January 28, 2007, 10:09:24 am
I don't do that for the same reason I prefer the Subach over the Mekhu.  I aim my shots and blow away my target =)
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Bob-san on January 28, 2007, 10:42:56 am
I do it because I have a Logitech WingMan Force 3D... aka Force Feedback!! I need faster refire to be able to hit successfully. It even helps when you have good aim... you fire like 2/3 more shots and your target is destroyed that much faster!
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: ChronoReverse on January 28, 2007, 05:22:59 pm
I usually just link fire and fire a quad/hex(?)/oct(?) shot that blows off the shields and then another shot that destroys the fighter myself =/
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Dysko on January 29, 2007, 06:37:19 am
I usually just link fire and fire a quad/hex(?)/oct(?) shot that blows off the shields and then another shot that destroys the fighter myself =/
Try the GTF Keres from Inferno. You can do everything with a single shot (16 guns! ;7)
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Bob-san on January 30, 2007, 07:36:27 am
Whew. I prefer two Kayser shots at close range (5m dogfights are fun!!) with the Ernyes (I cant spell-sorry). Two shots on bank 1 or 1 shot on both banks!
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mathwiz6 on February 03, 2007, 10:32:28 pm
I <3 the Keres... Though I only flew it in ITDoH, it was hilarious. BAM, dead. BAM.

Potato FTW!
It may not fly, but it fry.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on February 04, 2007, 09:31:14 am
The Keres, IMO, is unrealistic (as are many things in Inferno). Just make it so you have to use every shot you fire to hit and not to just spray the sky and I'll be happy. But still, it's fun for blowing things out of the sky (ever used 16 Hastor guns on Ancients?)
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mathwiz6 on February 04, 2007, 08:57:18 pm
So keep the energy levels like the perseus or so?

That would be a nice balancing factor....

But what's this realism thing you speak of?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Iron Wolf on February 10, 2007, 01:08:06 am
Perseus!

I think it is one of the few craft that can handle sustianed Kayser fire.

Eryines close second.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on February 10, 2007, 01:14:00 pm
So keep the energy levels like the perseus or so?

That would be a nice balancing factor....

But what's this realism thing you speak of?

The Keres has 16 guns. Imagine the energy needed to keep those 16 guns firing over a long space of time. It seems unrealistic that it can do that, have a relatively high top speed and maintain shields all at the same time. This is what I'm talking about.

Plus, it makes it stupid to have such a powerful ship spraying deadly 16-shot Aquinas and Hastor fire everywhere.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Dysko on February 11, 2007, 03:55:41 am
Yesterday I fought in multi with a Perseus. It's the only fighter I can use well in multi. And the one in which I obtained most of my kills :D
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on February 18, 2007, 01:26:07 pm
Yesterday I fought in multi with a Perseus. It's the only fighter I can use well in multi. And the one in which I obtained most of my kills :D

It's still targettable in multi...
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Dysko on February 18, 2007, 01:55:43 pm
Also the Pegasus is targettable in multi. Or at least, I think so, since I could target a Pegasus in a TvT, without AWACS around. :nervous:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: S-99 on February 18, 2007, 08:33:21 pm
Lol, i remember doing fs2 multi with pxo. I'd either be using the vasudan stealth ship or the pegasus and they wouldn't show up on radar, idk about reticle targeting though.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on February 19, 2007, 03:30:31 pm
I swear, I was playing multi and there was no AWACS, and I was in a nebula, and the other guy was flying a Pegasus, and I could target him absolutely normally. As if he had no stealth.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Ghost on February 19, 2007, 10:26:43 pm
Oh jesus, Potato wins. Unless I'm flying intercept; then obviously it's the perseus. Put it this way: if I could mount kaysers and maxims on the Perseus, that would be it.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Dysko on February 20, 2007, 12:55:24 am
Code: [Select]
$Name: GTF Perseus
.
.
.
$Allowed PBanks: ( "Subach HL-7" "Akheton SDG" "Morning Star" "Prometheus S" "Prometheus R" "UD-8 Kayser" )
$Allowed Dogfight PBanks: ( "MorningStar D" "Prometheus D" "Maxim D" "Circe" "UD-D Kayser" )
The Perseus can carry Kaysers in single, and both Kaysers and Maxims in multi. :)
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on February 20, 2007, 01:10:35 pm
Perseus with Kayser and Maxim with Tornadoes and Trebs is great.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Killfrenzy on February 20, 2007, 04:16:16 pm
I have, have always had, and always will have a definite weakness for the GTF Valkyrie.

For two reasons:

1) SPEED!!!! All over the place to cause trouble.

2) Has possibly the best word ever as a name. :D (Sorry, but I love the word 'Valkyrie.')

That said, I know its missile capacity stinks. Lucky I don't rely on them. :D

I also like the fact that there's a pair of guns positioned near-as-dammit centrally on the ship's 'chin.' They're shooting right down your axis, which means that if you're aiming in the right direction, they're going to sodding hit! :D
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on February 20, 2007, 04:23:32 pm
Some FS ships have horrible gun placement which makes it impossible to hit with (ie. the old Claymore 2)
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Arkangel on February 21, 2007, 04:52:00 am
It's not up there and its not a fighter, but Damn i love the Athena. It just looks so fricken COOL!
I also prefer ships without spastic turning such as the Claymore or Vesuvius.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: AlphaOne on February 21, 2007, 04:59:42 am
Most of the time I prefer the perseus cuz well its just so freaking cool and fast and manouverable. But if im gooing to a hard battle the i usualy take either a herk mk2 or a Ares or a Eryinyes! Or if I can I go with the terran Mara! That thing is just fenomenal secondary banks larger then a bommber primary banks plentiful as well. Huge armour and shielding and very fast a deadly.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Qwer on February 21, 2007, 10:14:51 am
If you'd put that pool on fs.pl 90% votes would go to either Herc II or Erinyes. :P Anyway I choice Pegasus as I prefer light fighters and stealth tactics rather than heavy tanks.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on February 21, 2007, 12:44:55 pm
Anyway I choice Pegasus as I prefer light fighters and stealth tactics rather than heavy tanks.

The Pegasus, even if it looses its stealth ability, is very deadly in multi. It's deadly fast and when armed with Harpoons, can really give you a hard time. Also, when fighting head on, the suicide ability never works as you just can't hit it. Supernova whacked me good with that thing.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Bob-san on February 21, 2007, 01:01:15 pm
Once you hit the Pegasus, it's done... especially with Morning Stars...

Basically, like in the nebula mission where you test it, you just have to hit it a few times before it's rendered useless... even with stealth, using Rockeyes and Morning Stars will definately allow you to gain the upper hand (until it gets out of sight).It's hard to keep up when you push it away so much...

They should have another weapon like the Morning Comet or something; instead of pushing it pulls.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on February 21, 2007, 01:15:43 pm
They should have another weapon like the Morning Comet or something; instead of pushing it pulls.

There's a Shivan weapon called 'Vapula,' from Lightspeed's pack, which does that..
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Bob-san on February 21, 2007, 01:22:31 pm
I never quite understood LIghtspeed's packs...
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: S-99 on February 22, 2007, 05:40:15 am
Normally having a weapon that pulls would have to achieved by not throwing projectiles to collide with the target. More of a beam that comes out and pulls the target. Or go simple and make a secondary weapon that shoots out a hook line and sinker. Shoot out a cable that stick to the target and do some dragging. That'd be fun, sort of like the empire strikes back in lego star wars.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mobius on February 23, 2007, 02:42:42 pm
Some mediavps ani are named "vapula".
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on February 23, 2007, 02:43:12 pm
, exported from Lightspeed's pack.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mobius on February 23, 2007, 03:01:25 pm
Is that guy in circulation?

Ehm my favourite fighter is the EAF Claymore Mark aye aye aye.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Iron Wolf on February 23, 2007, 04:42:21 pm
Some FS ships have horrible gun placement which makes it impossible to hit with (ie. the old Claymore 2)

I wouldn't say impossible to hit, but it defiantly makes it hard to hit with all your banks on the Troth, Horus, and Ursa...

That being said, I think the Perseus and the Eryinies have great gunpoints.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on February 23, 2007, 05:15:31 pm
I think the Valk and Herc have superb placement as they have guns just under. Also the Ares since they're quite good as they're close the middle.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Bob-san on February 23, 2007, 05:19:46 pm
I don't see how the left-right gun placement doesn't make sense... I'm less accurate "down-the-line" then I am "around-the-line"... then again the Joystick might be part of the reason...
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on February 23, 2007, 05:23:05 pm
Usually you can hit but if it's a small narrow target it gets quite difficult to hit without down the line firing (case in point, Ulysses fighters).
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Bob-san on February 23, 2007, 05:35:08 pm
That's what missiles and maneuvering is for... get above it and you can't miss. Missile hit constantly too. What's good is at close-range, they try to point toward you (and thus try to fly around you). Keep aiming toward them and they keep circling around you, eventually they go a strait line to try to get you off of them.

Oh Trebs work quite well against other fighters... the AI is too stupid to try to avoid them from long range. I took out 6 Lawyers (JAD2) quickly with Trebs.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: S-99 on February 24, 2007, 09:53:03 am
That's because lawyers like big huge long things that go for a long time, they even encourage the huge blast. Lawyers are gross :ick:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Kosh on February 25, 2007, 01:44:55 am
It depends on the situation.


For interception I use the Perseus

For heavy assault I use the Ares

But for general 0wn4g3 I use the Erinyes
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mobius on February 25, 2007, 06:10:41 pm
When you use the Claymore Mark aye aye, you hit a fighter with max 2 laser shots per time. It's effective against warships, however...

Its firing points should be changed. Like WWII fighters, they should convergere in un punto, maximizing the effectiveness.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Bob-san on February 25, 2007, 07:59:18 pm
I'd rather just have guns spread out... it makes a higher chance to hit with OK accuracy. What's cool is taking the Ares with a Subach, Kayser, and two banks of Trebs. You will beat any bomber quickly; especially useful in the final mission.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: EAD_Agamemnon on February 26, 2007, 03:31:05 am
The OLD Hercules! Only because it was my number 1 favorite of the first game. The Erinyes is a close second.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Bob-san on February 26, 2007, 07:24:45 am
What's fun is taking the HercII with two PromSs... you can get the PromS to fire faster then normal (look at my posts on Page 5, iirc).
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Damage on February 26, 2008, 03:53:26 pm
I've always been kinda partial to the Loki.  Yes, it lacks the raw firepower and has almost no secondaries, but it still makes for a nifty little interceptor.  But mostly I just enjoy the shark teeth on the cockpit.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Bob-san on February 26, 2008, 07:36:03 pm
:necro:

Necrothreaded after exactly 364 days, 22 hours, 28 minutes and 41 seconds! Oh... so close! The mods will arrive shortly... I think.

Anyways--I find the Loki too fragile to be an interceptor--and that's saying quite a lot. It's basically a small flying brick with shark teeth--it's not anywhere near my favorite, though I love the HTL version of it!
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Man-Whore on February 26, 2008, 10:25:05 pm
Loki. <3 how it looks.....
:wtf:

Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stealth on February 27, 2008, 01:18:48 am
i know practically nothing about FS2 ships, but FS1 - i'd take the hercules over anything.  6 gun banks... love it ;)
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: BengalTiger on February 27, 2008, 01:08:18 pm
Anyways--I find the Loki too fragile to be an interceptor--and that's saying quite a lot. It's basically a small flying brick with shark teeth--it's not anywhere near my favorite, though I love the HTL version of it!

Try the SOC mission (where you escort the Argo and half the Herc Mk 1's that escort it get blown up by IED's) in the Loki- it's untouchable when you fly and turn almost 2x faster than the enemy.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Colonol Dekker on February 27, 2008, 02:30:27 pm
Erinyes, with kayser, maxim and tornados and either harpoons or trebs. I always have weapon and shield power shunted to engines for slightly better top speed / burner charge. :)
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Woolie Wool on February 27, 2008, 03:26:41 pm
:necro:

Necrothreaded after exactly 364 days, 22 hours, 28 minutes and 41 seconds! Oh... so close! The mods will arrive shortly... I think.

Anyways--I find the Loki too fragile to be an interceptor--and that's saying quite a lot. It's basically a small flying brick with shark teeth--it's not anywhere near my favorite, though I love the HTL version of it!

The GTF Loki has 400 shields and 250 armor, making it tougher than the Valkyrie (200/200), Horus (230/170 or 200/120 depending on whether it's FS2 or FS1), or Serapis (220/200), and about equal to the Perseus (350/265).
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: mr.WHO on February 27, 2008, 03:30:13 pm
Perseus FTL!!
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Woolie Wool on February 27, 2008, 03:41:40 pm
Perseus FTL!!

No, Myrmidon FTL. The Perseus has the speed and maneuverability of an interceptor and the armament and durability of a space superiority fighter. And it's not a huge fat easy target like the Myrmidon is.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Bob-san on February 27, 2008, 04:28:27 pm
:necro:

Necrothreaded after exactly 364 days, 22 hours, 28 minutes and 41 seconds! Oh... so close! The mods will arrive shortly... I think.

Anyways--I find the Loki too fragile to be an interceptor--and that's saying quite a lot. It's basically a small flying brick with shark teeth--it's not anywhere near my favorite, though I love the HTL version of it!

The GTF Loki has 400 shields and 250 armor, making it tougher than the Valkyrie (200/200), Horus (230/170 or 200/120 depending on whether it's FS2 or FS1), or Serapis (220/200), and about equal to the Perseus (350/265).
In FS1, Lokis were good. My question is about turning radius and bank capacity. When I mean fragile, I also mean can't carry a decent load of secondaries and low primary energy too.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Kie99 on February 27, 2008, 05:00:43 pm
Ares with Quad Kaysers and Dual Maxims, combination of Trebuchets and Tornados.  Can annihilate anything.  Kaysers for fighters, Kaysers and Maxims for Bombers, Maxims for Cap ships.  Tornados take out anything at close range, Trebuchets cripple bombers and defang anything below Juggernaut level.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: blowfish on February 27, 2008, 05:14:56 pm
Ares with Quad Kaysers and Dual Maxims, combination of Trebuchets and Tornados.  Can annihilate anything.  Kaysers for fighters, Kaysers and Maxims for Bombers, Maxims for Cap ships.  Tornados take out anything at close range, Trebuchets cripple bombers and defang anything below Juggernaut level.

I usually take two banks of trebs just because quad Kaysers can kill things so quickly.  Only works on lower difficulties though.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: colecampbell666 on February 27, 2008, 05:17:50 pm
Ares, exactly as kie described.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Bob-san on February 27, 2008, 05:27:08 pm
Ares with Quad Kaysers and Dual Maxims, combination of Trebuchets and Tornados.  Can annihilate anything.  Kaysers for fighters, Kaysers and Maxims for Bombers, Maxims for Cap ships.  Tornados take out anything at close range, Trebuchets cripple bombers and defang anything below Juggernaut level.
The Ares is the perfect successor to the Herc and HercII. I like it much more than the Limo. I usually use the dual-bank with Subachs and the single-bank with Kaysers--since Kaysers are essentially powerful Subachs in actual use. Firing off all six banks is a good way to destroy anything--the Subachs fire faster than the Kaysers and do their own share of the damage.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Woolie Wool on February 27, 2008, 05:40:13 pm
:necro:

Necrothreaded after exactly 364 days, 22 hours, 28 minutes and 41 seconds! Oh... so close! The mods will arrive shortly... I think.

Anyways--I find the Loki too fragile to be an interceptor--and that's saying quite a lot. It's basically a small flying brick with shark teeth--it's not anywhere near my favorite, though I love the HTL version of it!

The GTF Loki has 400 shields and 250 armor, making it tougher than the Valkyrie (200/200), Horus (230/170 or 200/120 depending on whether it's FS2 or FS1), or Serapis (220/200), and about equal to the Perseus (350/265).
In FS1, Lokis were good. My question is about turning radius and bank capacity. When I mean fragile, I also mean can't carry a decent load of secondaries and low primary energy too.

In other words, you don't mean "fragile", but "poorly armed".
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Bob-san on February 27, 2008, 06:26:59 pm
:necro:

Necrothreaded after exactly 364 days, 22 hours, 28 minutes and 41 seconds! Oh... so close! The mods will arrive shortly... I think.

Anyways--I find the Loki too fragile to be an interceptor--and that's saying quite a lot. It's basically a small flying brick with shark teeth--it's not anywhere near my favorite, though I love the HTL version of it!

The GTF Loki has 400 shields and 250 armor, making it tougher than the Valkyrie (200/200), Horus (230/170 or 200/120 depending on whether it's FS2 or FS1), or Serapis (220/200), and about equal to the Perseus (350/265).
In FS1, Lokis were good. My question is about turning radius and bank capacity. When I mean fragile, I also mean can't carry a decent load of secondaries and low primary energy too.

In other words, you don't mean "fragile", but "poorly armed".
To me, it's a bit of both. I add the ability to protect one self to being fragile. For example, I'd consider an Ursa without a top-mounted Kayser to be fragile because, even with its monster hull and shield points, it moves and turns too slowly to make a decent attempt at defending itself. Quite a few ships I consider like that--but the Loki is in the group.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: blowfish on February 27, 2008, 06:45:24 pm
That, and the fact that the Ursa is so big that it takes the full force of enemy fire, especially flak, which can be death in an Ursa.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Hades on February 27, 2008, 06:59:59 pm
GTF Erinyes FTW. It has 8 gunpoints, good secondary ammo, and good shields and health. It can beat the Ares easily if piloted right.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Bob-san on February 27, 2008, 07:01:19 pm
That, and the fact that the Ursa is so big that it takes the full force of enemy fire, especially flak, which can be death in an Ursa.
The Ursa is good if you have enough cover. Unfortunately, no FS2 mission gives bombers enough cover.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Woolie Wool on February 27, 2008, 09:21:43 pm
:necro:

Necrothreaded after exactly 364 days, 22 hours, 28 minutes and 41 seconds! Oh... so close! The mods will arrive shortly... I think.

Anyways--I find the Loki too fragile to be an interceptor--and that's saying quite a lot. It's basically a small flying brick with shark teeth--it's not anywhere near my favorite, though I love the HTL version of it!

The GTF Loki has 400 shields and 250 armor, making it tougher than the Valkyrie (200/200), Horus (230/170 or 200/120 depending on whether it's FS2 or FS1), or Serapis (220/200), and about equal to the Perseus (350/265).
In FS1, Lokis were good. My question is about turning radius and bank capacity. When I mean fragile, I also mean can't carry a decent load of secondaries and low primary energy too.

In other words, you don't mean "fragile", but "poorly armed".
To me, it's a bit of both. I add the ability to protect one self to being fragile. For example, I'd consider an Ursa without a top-mounted Kayser to be fragile because, even with its monster hull and shield points, it moves and turns too slowly to make a decent attempt at defending itself. Quite a few ships I consider like that--but the Loki is in the group.

The Loki is not a space superiority fighter. Part of flying the Loki is having to outmaneuver enemy ships and evade enemy fire, and the Loki is fast, agile, and small enough to do that very well. If the stealth had worked properly, it would have been an awesome ship.

EDIT: The Loki has as much weapon energy as a GTF Hercules, which is plenty. So all you're missing is missiles, which I can live without.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: admiral_wolf on February 27, 2008, 11:30:53 pm
I call for this poll to be discounted immediatly, as it seems as if the entire 242nd Suicide Kings have commandeered this thread!  How can anything beat the nostaligia of the original Hercules?

OK, she wasn't the fastest fighter and a Manticore (I hate these more than Dragons) can quite happly piss on the Herc pilot and run away safe in the knowledge that the Shivan git would never get caught.  However, the Herc could carry pretty much every missle and if I remember correctly, the Phoenix V Anti Bomber Warhead.  What heavy assault pilot could ask for more?  Yes they required learned skill to fly them, but once acclimatised, Hercs will soon become your friend.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: AlphaOne on February 28, 2008, 04:05:40 am
Well The ares is a shall we say a better heavy fighter then the Herc since it can also carry almost every missile if i remember corectly. Also it has massive firepower from its gun ports and it has plenty of energy to ensure you take out more then just one figher before its energy get too low. I mean that thing handles more or less like brick made of lead but oh man does it have some sweet firepower on it not to mention massive armour and shields. I love that fighter.

Also the original Hercules is also top 10 in my list.  If im gooing for gun port firepower then the Erynyes take no 1 place all the way. Too bad its energy reserve isnt that big in order to handle  the Kaiser in a decent enough fashion. However the amount of energy it does provide is more then enough to take out any enemy bommber and/or fighter. In fact several of them i might say.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on February 28, 2008, 01:37:43 pm
GTF Erinyes FTW. It has 8 gunpoints, good secondary ammo, and good shields and health. It can beat the Ares easily if piloted right.

GTF Ares FTW. It has 6 gunpoints, really good secondary ammo, really good shields and health. It can beat the Erinyes easily if piloted right.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Hades on February 28, 2008, 02:19:21 pm
Quote
Statistics
Type    Heavy Assault
Manufacturer    Triton Dynamics
Maneuverability    Average
Max Velocity    65.0 - 70.0 ms-1
Max Afterburner Velocity    130.0 ms-1
Armor    Heavy
Hitpoints    325
Shields    500
Length    17 m


[edit] Armaments

    * Gun Mounts

Freespace 2
Bank    Guns    Standard Loadout
1st    4    Subach HL-7
2st    4    Prometheus R
Compatible Primaries
Subach HL-7, Akheton SDG, Prometheus R, Prometheus S, Morning Star, UD-8 Kayser, Lamprey, Circe, Maxim

    * Missile Banks

Freespace 2
Bank    Capacity    Standard Loadout
1st    40    Harpoon
2nd    50    Hornet
Compatible Secondaries
MX-64, Emp. Adv, Harpoon, Tempest, Hornet, Tornado, Trebuchet, Infyrno, TAG-A, TAG-B
[edit] Veteran Comments
Quote
Statistics
Type    Strategic Assault
Manufacturer    Nankam Aeronautical
Maneuverability    Poor
Max Velocity    50.0 - 62.0 ms-1
Max Afterburner Velocity    120.0 ms-1
Armor    Ultra Heavy
Hitpoints    425
Shields    650
Length    20 m


[edit] Armaments

    * Gun Mounts

Freespace 2
Bank    Guns    Standard Loadout
1st    2    Subach HL-7
2st    4    Prometheus R
Compatible Primaries
Subach HL-7, Akheton SDG, Prometheus R, Prometheus S, Morning Star, UD-8 Kayser, Lamprey, Circe, Maxim

    * Missile Banks

Freespace 2
Bank    Capacity    Standard Loadout
1st    90    Harpoon
2nd    100    Hornet
Compatible Secondaries
MX-64, Emp. Adv, Harpoon, Tempest, Hornet, Tornado, Trebuchet, Infyrno
Erinyes beats the Ares hands down in maneuverability and speed.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on February 28, 2008, 02:22:36 pm
And what about armor and secondary capacity?

Maneuverability doesn't matter when you just sit and lob missiles at people without needing to reload.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mobius on February 28, 2008, 02:24:36 pm
Meh, no one talks about the shape...the GTF Perseus owns.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: S-99 on February 28, 2008, 07:24:48 pm
Maneuverability may no matter so much at all. Some people are absolutely way better at flying huge tubs than they are a perseus. Just comes with the preference of handling that people prefer uniquely.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: blowfish on February 28, 2008, 07:28:19 pm
And difficulty level.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on March 01, 2008, 04:01:29 am
I like the Ares. ALL_THE_WAY. :beamz:

Meh, no one talks about the shape...the GTF Perseus owns.

Ah, I'll disagree on that, Möbius. The Perseus IS manoeuvrable, no doubts about that, but I really dislike it because it's way too slippery for me to handle. :warp:

By the way, which is less manoeuvrable...the Ursa or Ares? I once got beamed to death by the NTC Alba while flying the box.

I never used the Loki in both FS1 and FS2. I would always prefer using other craft like the Ulysses, for example.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: blowfish on March 01, 2008, 10:54:27 am
The Ares is actually more maneuverable than the Ursa (and the Artemis for that matter).
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Koth on March 01, 2008, 12:12:34 pm
I make most of my kills with my primaries so the Erinyes is tailor made for me.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: BlueFlames on March 01, 2008, 01:33:02 pm
The Ulysses has been growing on me over the past several months.  Yeah, it's thin-skinned, but damn, it's fun to fly.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Bob-san on March 01, 2008, 02:11:03 pm
The Ulysses has been growing on me over the past several months.  Yeah, it's thin-skinned, but damn, it's fun to fly.
I'll second that. They're dang hard to hit, though. But still, give all your wingmen Ulysses and then give orders to attack a single target. :lol:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Admiral Edivad on March 02, 2008, 01:50:15 pm
Meh, no one talks about the shape...the GTF Perseus owns.

Meh, no one talks about the colour...the GTF Ares owns.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: BengalTiger on March 02, 2008, 02:12:23 pm
Meh, no one talks about the shape...the GTF Perseus owns.

Meh, no one talks about the colour...the GTF Ares owns.

So you've never seen the GTF Pegasus in that case...
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on March 02, 2008, 02:12:53 pm
Brown is the color of poo.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stealth on March 02, 2008, 04:15:13 pm
just finished the FS2 campagin for the first time in 2+ years, and i just have to say:

give me an erinyes with two kaysers, and i WILL kill you.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on March 03, 2008, 05:25:03 am
just finished the FS2 campagin for the first time in 2+ years, and i just have to say:

give me an erinyes with two kaysers, and i WILL kill you.

Whoa, don't scare me, Stealth; only a sharpshooter can say that... :nervous:

The Ulysses has been growing on me over the past several months.  Yeah, it's thin-skinned, but damn, it's fun to fly.

I agree on the thin-skinned part. I reckon it to be the hardest craft to hit behind the Pegasus. Even the Ptah is easier to hit, because it looks like a potato.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: IceyJones on March 03, 2008, 05:34:37 am
erinyes with 2 kaysers?!?! eek.....i take a perseus with one leech and one subach.....you will not even have the chance for one hit on my hull.....

 :lol:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stealth on March 03, 2008, 09:28:49 am
yeah OK... but you'll have to hit me first for that leech to be effective ;)
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: BengalTiger on March 03, 2008, 03:01:01 pm
you all would have to *find* me first if I was in a Pegasus  :p

And that thing can load Trebs IIRC...
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Colonol Dekker on March 03, 2008, 03:53:01 pm
Yeah two. And stealth is scripted. :p
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: IceyJones on March 03, 2008, 04:06:36 pm
yeah OK... but you'll have to hit me first for that leech to be effective ;)

no problem.....as you will never see me in your slow erinyes because i will stick to your butt all the time  ;7
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Colonol Dekker on March 03, 2008, 04:19:44 pm
Erin can take it. She's a fine girl.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Hades on March 03, 2008, 04:29:26 pm
Erin can take it. She's a fine girl.
QFT. :nod:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: NGTM-1R on March 05, 2008, 12:42:43 am
Athena.

...oh wait...
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Gamma_Draconis on March 05, 2008, 01:22:52 am
Athena.

...oh wait...

I miss the old gal too. She was a one of a kind.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on March 05, 2008, 02:14:36 pm
give me an erinyes with two kaysers, and i WILL kill you.
Give me a Sathanas and I'll pawn you and your bloody Erinyes. :P
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Jeff Vader on March 05, 2008, 02:17:58 pm
give me an erinyes with two kaysers, and i WILL kill you.
Give me a Sathanas and I'll pawn you and your bloody Erinyes. :P
Sathanas my ass... give me a cargo container and I'll pwn you all.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on March 05, 2008, 02:22:31 pm
Sathanas my ass... give me a cargo container and I'll pwn you all.

Watchdog FTW.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Colonol Dekker on March 05, 2008, 02:28:05 pm
All will bow before my hermes of infinite doom bringing justice.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Caligma on March 05, 2008, 03:32:27 pm
Hercules Mark II. Best damn fighter in the entire game.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: NGTM-1R on March 05, 2008, 06:25:51 pm
Sathanas my ass... give me a cargo container and I'll pwn you all.

Special Explosion and cargos of "Plotholes" disallowed.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Cobra on March 05, 2008, 06:34:54 pm
Pshaw, give me a Meson bomb any day. :P
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: blowfish on March 05, 2008, 06:41:46 pm
A Mentu could survive a duel with a meson bomb (not by much though).
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mura on March 05, 2008, 07:49:19 pm
hahahaa, indeed, a meson bomb and a cowboy hat is all you need to deliver some pain HAHAHAHA

I would love to see the Meson bomb textured with a pinup girl painted on it, maybe it would be too awesome and my head would implode and it's going off-topic, but wth it's fun XD

Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Goober5000 on March 05, 2008, 08:36:35 pm
Sathanas my ass... give me a cargo container and I'll pwn you all.
QFT.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Retsof on March 05, 2008, 09:16:50 pm
Let me do some creative FREDing and I'll get every one of you with a stealthed Persius armed with my anti-bomber beam cannon!
Actually, nevermind, I'd probably get pawned anyway.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: blowfish on March 05, 2008, 09:27:49 pm
Even if I could kill by just staring at your fighter, I'd still probably die.

Anyway...

I only like the Ares because it is the only fighter with reasonable primary and firepower (except the Tauret, but the Tauret doesn't carry maxims.  But it is ridiculously slow and feels unmanageable even on Very Easy.  I'll probably take an Erinyes if I don't need lots of missiles.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: eliex on March 06, 2008, 03:00:07 am

 I find that playing Alpha1 styled missions when you have minimal friends against 20 enemies that armour really makes a difference, when beams are around.
Ares's are good nutshells.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Titan on March 06, 2008, 06:58:05 am

 I find that playing Alpha1 styled missions when you have minimal friends against 20 enemies that armour really makes a difference, when beams are around.
Ares's are good nutshells.

Attack of the Idaho Potatoes!  :beamz:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Grace_ofGod on March 10, 2008, 08:06:59 pm
i'm a primary weap guy, so I prefer the enryines when available.  My backup would be the myrmidon, because of the 4 linked primary banks.  Too bad it's go pretty weak armor and weapon compatability.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Cobra on March 10, 2008, 08:50:49 pm
Helios, man! HELIOS! :P
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on March 11, 2008, 10:31:24 pm
Give me a Colossus and we can play baseball! :drevil:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: NGTM-1R on March 12, 2008, 05:13:06 pm
Quote
Sathanas my ass... give me a cargo container and I'll pwn you all.
QFT.

...cargos of "Plotholes" disallowed.

QFT
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on March 14, 2008, 05:00:05 am
What's QFT?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Jeff Vader on March 14, 2008, 05:32:59 am
What's QFT?
Quantitative Feedback Theory.
Or "Quoted For Truth", depending on the context.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: MechMantis on March 18, 2008, 02:15:31 pm
Perseus. I will now go into detail as to why the Perseus is the best. Prepare for ranting.



The Hercules is simply too slow to be able to dogfight against the faster ships. I will fly Hercs gladly in an anti-bomber role, but keep me the hell away from Dragons.

The Herc Mk II is more of the same, only it drops the main advantage of the original, mauling anything in front of you with six Prometheus cannons, for some more Hornets. While I am for anything that gives me more Hornets, I hate anything that screws up my ability to rip things to shreds with my guns.

The Erinyes, while fun to fly, has little secondary banks, and eats it's primary energy very very fast, which screws up my playstyle. (Hit delete once for a boost to shields and engines!)

The Pegasus is a very situational fighter, not really useful in most missions. I killed that damn Scorpion with my trusty trusty ML-16s, so the Pegasus I'm going to assume will be easy pickins.

The Myrmidon is the true Herc Mk II. Six guns, decent secondary banks, maneuverable. Not really fast enough to deal with interceptors, so it falls to "light assault", if you will.

The Ares is, as the description notes, a po-ta-to. Slow, hard to handle... this thing's a light bomber.

The Ulysses is my third favorite ship, falling behind the Athena and the Perseus in that order. The Perseus, in my opinion, is a second generation Ulysses. Decent in everything, excels at really nothing. Although, I sometimes found it a little too maneuverable.

Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mobius on March 18, 2008, 02:28:56 pm
IMO the Ares is much more than what you said(I would call it a Heavy Interceptor, too).

In addition, what you said about the Pegasus is based on FS1 experience. I tried the Pegasus in dogfights and interception missions(plus subsystem strikes). It takes longer to accomplish something notable but it can still allow you to do it.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: MechMantis on March 18, 2008, 02:48:16 pm
I never really got the chance to fly against the Pegasus except in that one Freespace 2 mission, and that was awhile ago. So maybe it would rip me a new one, maybe it wouldn't. I never flew it, either, because I simply loved my Perseus too much.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Kie99 on March 18, 2008, 03:19:32 pm
Am I right in thinking the Pegasus was only available in one mission in FS2?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: MechMantis on March 18, 2008, 03:22:33 pm
According to the Wiki, you are.


No wonder I never flied it.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: colecampbell666 on March 18, 2008, 03:37:36 pm
You never flied any ships in FS2. Nor flew.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mobius on March 18, 2008, 03:45:38 pm
Am I right in thinking the Pegasus was only available in one mission in FS2?

Have you ever heard of FRED? The main campaign isn't enough to master a spacecraft *cough* GVB Sekhmet *cough*
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Retsof on March 18, 2008, 03:57:45 pm
IMO the Ares is much more than what you said(I would call it a Heavy Interceptor, too).

In addition, what you said about the Pegasus is based on FS1 experience. I tried the Pegasus in dogfights and interception missions(plus subsystem strikes). It takes longer to accomplish something notable but it can still allow you to do it.

I flew the Ares, and while I tend to go for the Perseus, that thing is pretty much a tank with fusion drives.  :beamz:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Kie99 on March 18, 2008, 04:00:27 pm
Am I right in thinking the Pegasus was only available in one mission in FS2?

Have you ever heard of FRED? The main campaign isn't enough to master a spacecraft *cough* GVB Sekhmet *cough*

Of course I've heard of FRED, I was talking about the Main Campaign.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: MechMantis on March 18, 2008, 04:16:34 pm
You never flied any ships in FS2. Nor flew.


Maybe not well, but I flew. :P


And I did somewhat exaggerate the badness of each ship. It's just that the best, all around fighter I've flown, has been the Perseus. I've flown Hercs. They're hard to kill, but not good against some of the more maneuverable (and faster) Shivan craft. Can it kill them? Yes. It just takes a bit more work. Likewise with the Myrmidon, and less-so than the Herc Mk II. Ares moreso, in my small experience flying them.

Ulysses, I like. It's a nice ship. Fast, maneuverable, able to deal with those thriced damned Dragons nicely. But it can't take as much punishment as I'd like.

The Erinyes simply eats a little more power than I'd like with my playstyle (in which I drop power from guns). Is it a nice ship? Yes. But the power draw.


My favorite ship isn't on the list, so I'm not going there.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Jeff Vader on March 18, 2008, 04:33:34 pm
You never flied any ships in FS2. Nor flew.


Maybe not well, but I flew. :P
But this thing is actually about semantics. We had some discussion about this a while ago and the conclusion was that space ships are piloted. Not flown, not driven, but piloted.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: MechMantis on March 18, 2008, 04:35:54 pm
Wait. Did I make a typo that horrid?


EDIT: No, I didn't. A pox upon your silly semantics!
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Jeff Vader on March 18, 2008, 04:41:12 pm
Touché. I was just inspired to search the unholy source of infinite FS wisdom (Root_fs2.vp, if you didn't figure it out yet) to see whether 'fly' is an acceptable phrase:

Quote from: SM2-03.fs2 debriefing
Flying bombers is hard work, but with a bank of Cyclops torpedoes, you'll have the firepower to neutralize enemy corvettes and destroyers.
There. A canon source says that at least bombers are flown. Alright, who wants a piece of me? We can take this outside. And don't give no 'Vincey doesn't have enough authority' crap.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mobius on March 18, 2008, 04:59:32 pm
Actually...I would reply with a :v: might have made a mistake. This is more a grammar matter than a canon VS not-canon.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Colonol Dekker on March 18, 2008, 05:03:56 pm
Given that that i've listed my favourite Galactic Terran fighter, my favourite terran non-FS fighter is the Dragon from WC4 :) the Shivans wouldn't have stood a chance against it.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: ShadowGorrath on March 19, 2008, 04:41:04 am
Where's the Apollo ?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on March 19, 2008, 08:04:50 am
Where's the Apollo ?

It's in FSPort.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: ShadowGorrath on March 19, 2008, 10:32:09 am
Who said that it's limited only to FS2 craft?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Colonol Dekker on March 19, 2008, 10:36:29 am
The Poll implies it, but as we've no doubt noticed the title leaves it wide open. The Apollo is a Terran fighter and should be included ;) (plus the wc4 dragon too :nervous:)
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: asyikarea51 on March 19, 2008, 10:46:44 am
Loki. :)

Sure, the lack of raw firepower frustrates me when trying to fight things like Erinyes fighters (be it AI or human opposition), but I still like to fly it.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: ShadowGorrath on March 19, 2008, 10:49:37 am
Though the Myrmidon should probably be removed, as a lot of people choose it for it's Helios capabilities.

And in the slightly more un-professional campaigns ( like 'Return to Sol' for example ) you can "cheat" by taking a Myrmidon and placing Helios' bombs in your secondary banks.

And even in the face of the Myrmidon's Helios', and Erinyes fighters, I choose Apollo- best looking Terran fighter ever ! Too bad that the GTA phased it out, because I chose it over Valkyrie anytime I could.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Krallis on March 19, 2008, 11:15:16 am
I like the Ares, it looks mean as anything and pack decent missile and gun banks. Its like an upgraded mark II Hercules.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: ShadowGorrath on March 19, 2008, 12:24:31 pm
It actually IS an upgraded Hercules Mk2 .
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Colonol Dekker on March 19, 2008, 12:45:44 pm
Same cockpit different fighter though. . . . . . . . :beamz:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: asyikarea51 on March 19, 2008, 12:52:33 pm
And even in the face of the Myrmidon's Helios', and Erinyes fighters, I choose Apollo - best looking Terran fighter ever! Too bad that the GTA phased it out, because I chose it over Valkyrie anytime I could.

I used to like the Apollo a lot until I realised that Fury rockets were the only way to shoot down the SF's before the Avenger cannon comes along. The positioning of the secondary bank gunpoints are simply too far out.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Krallis on March 19, 2008, 12:54:17 pm
It actually IS an upgraded Hercules Mk2 .

I realised that a while back. Even though its been heavily modified, modified enough for me to like it because I didn't like the original mark II.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Admiral_Stones on March 19, 2008, 01:52:14 pm
I don't understand why everyone hates the Myrmi. It got 6 gun banks (more then the Herc II, an Assault Fighter), nice variability when it comes to secondaries (although no harpoon), is quite fast and has not to low armor.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: MechMantis on March 19, 2008, 02:52:04 pm
I don't understand why everyone hates the Myrmi. It got 6 gun banks (more then the Herc II, an Assault Fighter), nice variability when it comes to secondaries (although no harpoon), is quite fast and has not to low armor.


It's supposed to be space superiority, and it's not too good at that job. It feels like, to me, a heavier Apollo, and that was right on the border of becoming an assault fighter. I have quite a bit of trouble dealing with any interceptor, and that simply shouldn't happen with a space superiority ship. It's a decent ship, just mis-classed, and somewhat under-armored for it's actual role, in my opinion.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on March 19, 2008, 07:20:12 pm
I realised that a while back. Even though its been heavily modified, modified enough for me to like it because I didn't like the original mark II.

I didn't like the Herc II either. It just looks ugly. The only thing I liked about it was that it is manoeuvrable and that it had huge missile banks given that it was introduced in the early part of the FS2 campaign.

It's supposed to be space superiority, and it's not too good at that job. It feels like, to me, a heavier Apollo, and that was right on the border of becoming an assault fighter. I have quite a bit of trouble dealing with any interceptor, and that simply shouldn't happen with a space superiority ship. It's a decent ship, just mis-classed, and somewhat under-armored for it's actual role, in my opinion.

I agree with you on that. It's nice to fire Subachs from six gunpoints, but what I didn't like about the Myrmidon was that it's secondary bank capacity was garbage. I won't even try to fit it out with Hornets. If I were to fly in a Myrmidon, I'll always load it out with Tempests.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Iranon on July 01, 2008, 12:56:06 pm
I voted for the Pegasus as the next best thing after my beloved Loki (why isn't that one an option?).
All other Terran fighters suffer from either poor handling or poor power output, either of which I find harder to stomach than the low shield capacities of their Vasudan equivalents.

Some time ago, I did some empirical testing of dogfighting ability (because the tables don't take into account things like gun placement or target profile), and only had a 100% survival rate with the Loki and the Mara. Interestingly, I was spectacularly unsuccesful in the Myrmidon: large profile, mediocre shields and power output isn't a combination I handle well. According to my data, I'm better off lobbing Infyrnos everywhere with a Boanerges!
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: blowfish on July 01, 2008, 01:09:19 pm
Whoa,

:necro:

Since you're new here, its ok, but in the future, please try to avoid bumping month-old threads.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Fenrir on July 01, 2008, 06:44:55 pm
I`m curious. How old does a thread have to be for it to be taboo to bump it, anyway?

like, if the poster reeeeally wanted to discuss this topic, should he have simply made another thread, despite the inevitable complaints of "omg we did this last month"?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mobius on July 01, 2008, 06:48:55 pm
I think it's always better to post on old threads rather than creating new ones unless you're looking for something that derails from the main topic.

Look at Campaign threads in Missions and Campaigns, people can't create new threads simply because the specific campaign thread they looked for has relatively old posts.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: BlueFlames on July 01, 2008, 06:57:47 pm
Quote
...people can't create new threads simply because the specific campaign thread they looked for has relatively old posts.

Actually, they can.  They just don't, which is pretty silly, since it becomes difficult to sift through enormous threads for older/popular campaigns, when looking for information on a specific issue related to that campaign.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: haloboy100 on July 01, 2008, 06:59:46 pm
Whoa,

:necro:

Since you're new here, its ok, but in the future, please try to avoid bumping month-old threads.
Dude, it was only a month.

Doesn't have to be older to be a necro?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mobius on July 01, 2008, 07:03:47 pm
Actually, they can.  They just don't, which is pretty silly, since it becomes difficult to sift through enormous threads for older/popular campaigns, when looking for information on a specific issue related to that campaign.

Yes for game issues, no for plot questions and related things...
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Cobra on July 01, 2008, 08:19:05 pm
Oh for the love of God, can we please stop discussing why and when to post in month-old threads? None of you are the ****in' post police except for the admins and mods. If there is a necro post, they will say something.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mongoose on July 02, 2008, 12:22:37 am
If it's someone bumping a random thread for the hell of it, or one that's something like five years old, I'd step right up to lock it.  But if a few-month-old thread gets a bump that results in renewed worthwhile discussion, I don't see much of a problem with letting it slide (unless a particular poster makes a habit of doing so).  That's this mod's opinion, at any rate.  Besides, this thread already had a much larger bump several pages back that resulted in renewed interest, so there's no reason the same can't happen again.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Fenrir on July 02, 2008, 12:45:57 am
Back on topic...

The Perseus is my fighter of choice. It`s fun dodging missiles without even having to use countermeasures, and I like how it can carry a decent amount of missiles. I do concede that the Valkyrie is also an awesome fighter, however. I swear that you can hold that afterburner for more than 5 seconds or something. It`s crazy.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on July 02, 2008, 02:09:08 am
The Perseus is the Terran Dragon if you ask me. The GTF Pegasus may be faster and more maneuverable, but it's too weak in terms of hull strength to compare.

I prefer a slower craft; makes aiming easier. This is why I prefer the Ursa over every other bomber class except the Sekhmet, and the Ares over every other combat fighter. ;)

By the way, how do you do a Necrothreadageded beam?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 02, 2008, 07:02:05 am
The Perseus is the Terran Dragon if you ask me. The GTF Pegasus may be faster and more maneuverable, but it's too weak in terms of hull strength to compare.
I say the Ulysses is the Terran Dragon. The Ulysses is more maneuverable and it has a smaller target profile than the Perseus and it also has the same amount of primary firepower (in dogfights, missiles don't matter as much as lasers, I find).

But the Ulysses sucks even when a Fenris or something big jumps in; I'd take the Perseus anytime.

I prefer a slower craft; makes aiming easier. This is why I prefer the Ursa over every other bomber class except the Sekhmet, and the Ares over every other combat fighter. ;)
If you have trouble aiming with faster fighters, you can always tone down the sensitivity or something (do you use a joystick or a mouse?). And I agree, the Sekhmet and the Ares rule (I actually found the last mission of the Procyon Insurgency easier with the Sekhmet than the Amun Mark 2).

By the way, how do you do a Necrothreadageded beam?
:necro:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 02, 2008, 07:11:43 am
I personally like the Perseus too. Nice blend of speed and firepower; plus it can really move. Although, if there are capital ships, I'd take an Erynies. 8 primaries can put the hurt on most cruisers, even if they're all Subach HL-7s. Plus its secondary banks are respectable. My only irritation is that its side target profile is as long as a limo.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 02, 2008, 07:15:18 am
The Perseus is decent enough for neutralizing capital ships; it can carry the Treb which is good for disabling turrets and subsystems. But if the Erinyes is available I'd probably take it for most missions, for obvious reasons.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Iranon on July 02, 2008, 08:22:03 am
Hmm, I wonder about the role of bias in our assessments... for example, it seems like Volition tried to put people off the Pegasus with the tech room description when all it lacks is firepower (2 Prometheus S at the most). Its durability is only a smidgeon below other Terran light fighters, more than offset by the tiny target profile and faster recharge rate (50% more power output than a Perseus or Ulysses) even before you take into account speed and manoeverability. Most people seem to completely ignore energy output, at least for ships that don't have 4-gun banks and Kayser compatibility.


Terran command seems to approve the oddest of ships... the Perseus is disappointingly slow for an interceptor (while being durable enough for extended dogfights), the Myrmidon is too sluggish for its stated primary role, the Artemis suffers from extremely poor gun placement which is terrible in a Bomber that appears optimised for some dogfighting ability, the Boanerges is a big fat target without even a turret to defend itself...
The Erinyes and Perseus I can accept as crafts meant to fulfil a variety of roles, but the others seem poorly designed.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 02, 2008, 08:28:19 am
IMO quite a few of the new FS2 ships weren't as good as the old FS1 ships.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 02, 2008, 08:58:06 am
I always thought the Apollo was a pretty good fighter; fast for its size, and respectable firepower. And its rear and front target profile is pretty flat.

I had some problems with the Valkyrie's primary placements; the ones on the ends of the wings. More a personal thing than anything ...
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 02, 2008, 09:39:34 am
They weren't on the ends of the wings, they were actually in the middle. I found them easy to aim with.

Does anyone here think the Apollo was better than the Myrmidon?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 02, 2008, 09:57:11 am
*wave* Me. But the Myrmidon has plus points in secondaries. Especially when you have no bombers available, only Helioses and Myrmidons. :D :D :D
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: ShadowGorrath on July 02, 2008, 09:58:24 am
They weren't on the ends of the wings, they were actually in the middle. I found them easy to aim with.

Does anyone here think the Apollo was better than the Myrmidon?

If a Perseus is not present, I'd choose the Apollo. So yea, it's better than the Myrmidon ( or any other fighter other than the Perseus ) in my opinion.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 02, 2008, 10:49:03 am
*wave* Me. But the Myrmidon has plus points in secondaries. Especially when you have no bombers available, only Helioses and Myrmidons. :D :D :D
I still don't accept that :v: ever intended the Myrmidon to be able to carry the Helios.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mongoose on July 02, 2008, 02:00:50 pm
*wave* Me. But the Myrmidon has plus points in secondaries. Especially when you have no bombers available, only Helioses and Myrmidons. :D :D :D
I still don't accept that :v: ever intended the Myrmidon to be able to carry the Helios.
Why not?  After all, real-life bombers aren't the only aircraft that are capable of equipping bombs.  Last time I checked, the F-22 Raptor is able to carry nuclear ordnance, and it's capable of longer sustained supersonic flight than any other fighter craft out there.  Call it an Easter egg, if you will.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: ShadowGorrath on July 02, 2008, 02:03:19 pm
But the Helios torpedo is of ridiculous size compared to the Myrmidon  :p
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mongoose on July 02, 2008, 02:09:43 pm
And your fighters can't physically carry all of the secondary loadout they're able to in the first place. :p
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Iranon on July 02, 2008, 02:21:36 pm
The Apollo is a better space superiority fighter. The Myrmidon doesn't score high on any area that matters for survivability (target profile, shields, power output, agility); the Apollo has a decent target profile and is quite nimble (marginally better than the Perseus on the axes that count... for some reason it rolls like a brick, same as the Ulysses).
The Apollo is well and truly obsolete though since otherwise the Perseus is noticable upgrade.

As it is, the Terrans don't have a widely available space superiority fighter that does its job well. This is not a huge problem since the Loki, Perseus, and Erinyes can all do the job if needed depending on which category you consider least important (secondary capacity/power/agility) , but it is jarring.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 02, 2008, 04:21:11 pm
The point is, it says nothing about it in the tech descriptions, even some of the heavier bombers like the Medusa can't carry the Helios, nor can any other fighter.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Colonol Dekker on July 02, 2008, 07:19:55 pm
To be honest i loved the old Apollo, twin ML-16s and MX-50's. But as soon as i got a Herc with Banshees it was out. Unless they can retrofit an Apollo to carry modern weapons it's strictly a pleasure craft for me.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Blue Lion on July 02, 2008, 07:37:39 pm
Perseus, I love my flying piece of tinfoil.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on July 02, 2008, 08:09:19 pm
If you have trouble aiming with faster fighters, you can always tone down the sensitivity or something (do you use a joystick or a mouse?). And I agree, the Sekhmet and the Ares rule (I actually found the last mission of the Procyon Insurgency easier with the Sekhmet than the Amun Mark 2).

I'm a keyboarder. :drevil:

Actually, I like flying the Pegasus, although I don't have the guts to do so near an enemy corvette.

To be honest i loved the old Apollo, twin ML-16s and MX-50's. But as soon as i got a Herc with Banshees it was out. Unless they can retrofit an Apollo to carry modern weapons it's strictly a pleasure craft for me.

Banshees are great. I didn't know that they were so powerful until I played FSPort again some months back. If I recall correctly, I used the Banshee and Leech Guns whenever they're available.

I still don't accept that :v: ever intended the Myrmidon to be able to carry the Helios.

Concurred. It was probably a designer's joke. :)
The only reason why I fly a Myrmidon is because it has six gun points...and because I can only choose between a Herc II and that. :doubt:

Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Rodo on July 02, 2008, 09:40:53 pm
I would vote for the loky but it's nowere to be found..
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: ssmit132 on July 03, 2008, 04:23:18 am
They haven't been able to exploit the dodgy stealth system yet.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Cyker on July 03, 2008, 06:36:54 am
Myrmidon and Ares!

For me, the Myrmidon is a more heavily armed but slightly slower Perseus.

The Ares is because I'm getting lazy. I love being able to fill it full of trees and just sit there lancing everyone from long range with trees and maxim fire :D

And if anybody gets close, fire some quad PromS into their faces!

The handling is a bit of a weakness 'tho; I once had this amusing situation wherethis dragon was constantly jinking to stay behind me and I couldn't turn or burn fast enough to shake it off. Eventually my friend shot it off my ass after he stopped laughing so much...
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: ShadowGorrath on July 03, 2008, 07:26:11 am
The Ares is the worst choice in mission Apocalypse though :P

And you could have simply turned into the other side than it was going/evading you.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Rodo on July 03, 2008, 08:25:14 am
any slim shaped fighter would do... in my estimation.. If you play it right with a loky you can make shi* almost anything in the game.
The only things from wich you should run from with a loki are the flak cannon trails...

so again.. loki

PD: don´t  understand why terrans call that perseus an interceptor... to big for that... seems more like a shrinked hecate also, then again it's the best choice when chasing bombers.. so I dont think I can argue much about it's functionality.

Rot
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Jeff Vader on July 03, 2008, 08:57:39 am
loky
loky
Psst. It's Loki. Though it seems you also typed it correctly on two instances.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: asyikarea51 on July 03, 2008, 09:11:59 am
Hey, I'm not alone. Loki!!! ^_^

To be fair to the Myrmidon, the tri-slot secondary does have SOME worth. But if I'm playing ammo-conservation mode, I wouldn't have a choice but to fly the Perseus (a craft I personally avoid - rather fragile in combat IMO despite its VERY well-balanced nature).

The secondary bank placement on the Perseus is IMO really perfect, making Tempest rockets real useful. Myrmidon, IIRC tolerable. Apollo... forget it. Only missiles with tracking systems are of any use on that old craft, no matter how much I like it. And I think the Ulysses has similar problems with gun/missile placement too (to me anyway), in addition to being as strong as generic office-grade A4 paper...

I'd actually use a Loki for intercept... but only if the mission has Kayser and Maxim available; at that point, the only drawback with the Loki is that it has too few gunpoints to kill any bomber or the advanced heavy fighters within one pass (i.e. I charge at the bomber with my finger deadlocked on the trigger until the distance gets too close, then I circle around for a second pass)...
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Rodo on July 03, 2008, 09:26:58 am
loky
loky
Psst. It's Loki. Though it seems you also typed it correctly on two instances.

Yes, I was in a hurry.. my boss is looking over my shoulder XD
Hey, I'm not alone. Loki!!! ^_^

To be fair to the Myrmidon, the tri-slot secondary does have SOME worth. But if I'm playing ammo-conservation mode, I wouldn't have a choice but to fly the Perseus (a craft I personally avoid - rather fragile in combat IMO despite its VERY well-balanced nature).

Myrmi quite good.. i dont know why... might be the low payload capability making me somewhat unwilling to use it...

The secondary bank placement on the Perseus is IMO really perfect, making Tempest rockets real useful. Myrmidon, IIRC tolerable. Apollo... forget it. Only missiles with tracking systems are of any use on that old craft, no matter how much I like it. And I think the Ulysses has similar problems with gun/missile placement too (to me anyway), in addition to being as strong as generic office-grade A4 paper...

Yes, try hitting something with the banks of the myrmi, apolo (as you said), herc1 (too spaced) and MY GOD you have to try using a valkirie posiibly worst disigned craft ever! well only in firing points (primary).
Also agreed on the Ulysses... leave it to the AI :P


I'd actually use a Loki for intercept... but only if the mission has Kayser and Maxim available; at that point, the only drawback with the Loki is that it has too few gunpoints to kill any bomber or the advanced heavy fighters within one pass (i.e. I charge at the bomber with my finger deadlocked on the trigger until the distance gets too close, then I circle around for a second pass)...

waiting for some good modder to modifiy a loki and increase it's secondary payload :D
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 03, 2008, 11:01:14 am
They haven't been able to exploit the dodgy stealth system yet.
Let's ask Stealth. :D

To be honest, the myrmidon is a pretty fair fighter. 6 primaries is respectable early in the game, even with all Subachs. It outguns the Lokis in the early game pretty easily.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Iranon on July 03, 2008, 03:13:57 pm
The second bank of the Valkyrie might be the best-positioned guns in the game though; the atrocious positions of the first only matters to me if Shield Breakers are available (Valks don't have the power to support Banshees; I prefer Avengers even against Shivans). I think it's a wonderfully designed craft that excels in its role.

It might be outgunned, but I'd prefer a Loki over a Myrmidon any time the mission doesn't call for a heavy assault fighter in which case I have no business flying either. Slightly more shields, slimmer, better afterburners, more agile, more power. The gap only widens as the game progresses as the Loki is the most manoueverable craft that can carry Kaysers, and unlike the Perseus it can carry them comfortably.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: admiral_wolf on July 03, 2008, 03:59:43 pm
Can someone enlighten me to what the GTF Pegasus is?  It's something I've never come across.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 03, 2008, 04:04:05 pm
Can someone enlighten me to what the GTF Pegasus is?  It's something I've never come across.
I'm sorry, Admiral, but that would cause a rip in time and and space if you knew. (http://www.hard-light.net/wiki/index.php/Pegasus)
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: ShadowGorrath on July 03, 2008, 04:29:47 pm
Really? Nice.

Admiral, it's a prototype stealth fighter that's undetectable on sensors.

Now where's that void ?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 03, 2008, 04:31:22 pm
Really? Nice.

Admiral, it's a prototype stealth fighter that's undetectable on sensors.

Now where's that void ?
Oh don't worry, conveniently the Daleks came and paradoxically prevented this event from ever happening.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: admiral_wolf on July 03, 2008, 05:28:19 pm
Don't you think that just my presence on here is enough of a Paradox!   The hole in the Space Time Continuem is big enough for The Galatea to quite happily fly through! Through this so called "game", I've witnessed my demise over 10 times!  Not exactly fun, especially as I've found a screenshot of it happening!!

----ADDITIONAL----EDIT----

Don't worry, I've found it.  Interesting design if it works.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 03, 2008, 05:43:48 pm
Prove it. Jump in and wipe London off the map.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: admiral_wolf on July 03, 2008, 05:48:33 pm
A- Why would I repeat the move of The Lucifer and destroy a homeworld?

B-Why would I want to do that to MY HOMEWORLD!

C-I have no desire to face a court marshall and execution for high treason

D-Where would you guys meet up next?

It's in your hands!
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Jeff Vader on July 03, 2008, 07:07:27 pm
I've witnessed my demise over 10 times!  Not exactly fun, especially as I've found a screenshot of it happening!!
I'm still convinced that it was admiral Polpolion who perished with the Galatea.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Colonol Dekker on July 03, 2008, 07:36:00 pm
Command said it was Wolf. (btw admiral what's your first name?)

And command never makes mistakes :nervous:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 03, 2008, 09:50:38 pm
I'm still convinced that it was admiral Polpolion who perished with the Galatea.
No, it was Wolf (http://www.hard-light.net/wiki/index.php/GTD_Galatea).
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Cobra on July 03, 2008, 09:58:12 pm
I'm still convinced that it was admiral Polpolion who perished with the Galatea.
No, it was Wolf (http://www.hard-light.net/wiki/index.php/GTD_Galatea).

I hope you realize he was joking.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 03, 2008, 10:08:02 pm
Yea, I know.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Cobra on July 03, 2008, 11:52:49 pm
Reason 955 the internet sucks: Sarcasm never comes through.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Jeff Vader on July 04, 2008, 02:56:38 am
And command never makes mistakes :nervous:
qft ftw wtf

I'm still convinced that it was admiral Polpolion who perished with the Galatea.
No, it was Wolf (http://www.hard-light.net/wiki/index.php/GTD_Galatea).

I hope you realize he was joking.
Who was, now?

Reason 955 the internet sucks: Sarcasm never comes through.
Agreed.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on July 04, 2008, 05:20:26 am
/me waves at the moderators. They should know what to do.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: nvsblmnc on July 04, 2008, 07:54:14 am
At risk of posting something on-topic, I'm split between the Myrmidon and Erinyes.  The Loki also comes pretty high up the list.

I used to like the standoff power of the Ares, but now I'd rather get right in the middle with kaysers and maxims flying everywhere.  With careful monitoring of power usage, a Maxim/Kayser Erinyes is a true terror.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on July 05, 2008, 08:28:48 am
...a Maxim/Kayser Erinyes is a true terror.

I would think so. There was one time I did try using Maxims with Kaysers, but I didn't like the idea of using both, so I switched back to using Kaysers only.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: tifi on July 05, 2008, 08:32:55 am
Words alone cannot adequately describe just how much I love the Pegasus.
It was such a dissapointment to only get to play with it for one mission :blah:

And just for completeness sake, the same can be said for how much I dislike the Myrmidon.
Sure its got a pretty impressive array of firepower but the guns are in a horrid layout, it can't carry the Harpoon, and its altogether too large and clunky to be a decent fighter - it just begs to be shot at.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 05, 2008, 08:52:50 am
I don't like the Maxim's recoil. Makes it a bit of a ***** to use.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Iranon on July 05, 2008, 07:09:34 pm
I've never been too impressed with quad maxims... they eat so much energy that I'm perfectly happy to have them in a 2-gun bank. From my experience, the best way to leverage the Erinyes' 8 primary mounts is a full load of Prometheus S: Good range coupled with impressive accuracy, and the energy output is sufficient to support them.

I share tifi's disaffection with the Myrmidon, it just seems tacky and badly designed. I get the impression of a very poor light fighter with some additional weapons bolted on (off-centre as well)  to make it look good on paper. It's the fighter I have the worst combat record with, and this includes the much-maligned Vasudan featherweights.
The other Terran fighters do their stated job and have some attractive feature (for example, the Herc 2 is quite manoeverable for an assault fighter and has excellent gun mounts). The one thing the Myrmidon excels at is delivering 4 Helios bombs quickly, and that's probably a bug. It's too cumbersome for its stated main role, and for something straddling the line between space superiority and assault fighter, the Erinyes does the job much much better.


Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on July 06, 2008, 02:10:35 am
The only advantages I can see on flying a Myrmidon is its six gun banks and slightly higher grade of maneuverability as compared to a Herc II.

I ought to try flying a Loki sometime soon, although I might not like it... :nervous:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 06, 2008, 07:36:11 am
I don't see how accuracy is relevant at all. All weapons fire in a completely straight line in retail.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 06, 2008, 07:37:14 am
Well. The primary weapon bank placement affects accuracy somewhat.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 06, 2008, 07:41:33 am
Yes, but that's the ship, not the weapon. The Prometheus isn't any more accurate than the Maxim.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 06, 2008, 07:43:10 am
Well, the Maxim does have its recoil, compared to the recoiless Prometheus.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 06, 2008, 07:48:18 am
Well, the Maxim does have its recoil, compared to the recoiless Prometheus.
Doesn't affect accuracy. If you line up your Maxim the write way before you fire, you can hit an Edjo from 1000 meters away.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 06, 2008, 07:50:14 am
Edjo? Whats that?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 06, 2008, 08:59:18 am
A Vasudan sentry gun.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: blowfish on July 06, 2008, 11:54:00 am
I think the maxim's recoil does cause slight inaccuracy.  It's barely noticeable if you can aim though.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Titan on July 06, 2008, 12:24:42 pm
funny, sentry guns are rarely used at all, but theres a rather large number of them available for download anyways.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 06, 2008, 02:40:29 pm
I think the maxim's recoil does cause slight inaccuracy.  It's barely noticeable if you can aim though.
No, it fires in a completely straight line.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 06, 2008, 08:59:21 pm
Because fighters > sentry guns in most situations. And because a mobile defense will beat fixed emplacements most of the time.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: blowfish on July 06, 2008, 09:04:42 pm
I think the maxim's recoil does cause slight inaccuracy.  It's barely noticeable if you can aim though.
No, it fires in a completely straight line.

Hmm ... must have remembered wrong...
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 06, 2008, 09:10:38 pm
But in the end primary weapon placement still means alot.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on July 06, 2008, 09:21:01 pm
But in the end primary weapon placement still means alot.

Indeed. That's why I'd rather fly the classic Hercules than the Herc II if I'm given the choice. :)
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 06, 2008, 09:31:54 pm
Iirc, the two of them have similar placement, don't they? Both their weapons port flank the cockpit, right?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on July 06, 2008, 09:46:24 pm
Iirc, the two of them have similar placement, don't they? Both their weapons port flank the cockpit, right?

If I recall, the Herc II has four gunpoints, two on each side of the cockpit.

The Hercules has SIX gunpoints, surrounding all sides of the cockpit except the top.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 06, 2008, 09:47:27 pm
Ah, yea. Now I remember. Haven't been playing FS recently, so I kinda forgot. Still, the Tauret is better than both of them. Too bad its not Terran.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Akalabeth Angel on July 07, 2008, 03:09:48 am
Ah, yea. Now I remember. Haven't been playing FS recently, so I kinda forgot. Still, the Tauret is better than both of them. Too bad its not Terran.

        Why fly terran when you can fly Vasudan? Terrans suck.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mars on July 07, 2008, 03:23:21 am
The Herc II is significantly more maneuverable than the Tauret, it has a smaller much smaller target profile, has a higher damage threshold, has a bigger primary reserve, and comparable missile banks.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on July 07, 2008, 07:31:39 am
The Herc II is significantly more maneuverable than the Tauret, it has a smaller much smaller target profile, has a higher damage threshold, has a bigger primary reserve, and comparable missile banks.

Actually, I prefer the Tauret. It's still pretty manoeuvrable, and it arguably has the largest missile banks ever mounted on a fighter (200 Hornets! :eek2:).
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 07, 2008, 09:52:28 pm
You barely fly the Tauret anyway. Your default fighter is usually the Seraphis.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mars on July 07, 2008, 10:30:28 pm
The Serapis sucks horribley
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 07, 2008, 10:33:57 pm
I personally like the Serapis. Its a pretty nifty fighter, can turn on a dime. Although, its kinda made out of paper.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: eliex on July 08, 2008, 12:14:12 am
The Serapis weapon compatibility is pretty good for its class, but I never liked it's engine power when turned on max compared to the Myrmidon - even the Tauret nearly matches the Serapis' speed.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 08, 2008, 12:17:01 am
Its still more maneuverable than either fighter, and the Myrmidon's profile is horrible no matter which side your facing.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Iranon on July 08, 2008, 03:29:26 am
The Serapis seems wasted potential. Why the hell did the Vasudans install the most powerful reactor to ever grace a light fighter (more output than that of an Erinyes!) without making sure the craft is compatible with the most beloved energy hog (UD-8 Kayser)? While we're at it, how can they call it an advanced interceptor if it can't carry Trebuchets?
Impressive shield recharge, manoeverability and target profile mean this thing can dodge heavy fire all day long. At the same time, low shield capacity and primary firepower make it difficult to actually do something useful without getting one's butt shot off.
The way the engine responds to different power setting negates some of the excellent energy power plant - top speed suffers significantly when fed less than default yet it doesn't benefit much from additional energy.

Whining aside, it's a craft capable of many different jobs: It's fast enough and has enough secondary capacity to be a reasonable interceptor if you can live without Trebuchets, it's an effective (if unforgiving) dogfighter and it can wield Maxims against capital ships with more than enough power to spare. For a multi-role craft I prefer this over the Myrmidon, but on the whole I expected a more elegant solution from the Vasudans. If I don't need to take cheap shots at capital ships I'd rather fly the Thoth.

***

Regarding the assault fighters...  in this class all of the modern ships are balanced and have their uses. I'm leaning towards the Tauret because it has all I want from a heavy fighter; being less nimble than an Erinyes or a Herc II isn't a problem if you assign 3 Taurets + 1 light fighter to a wing.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 08, 2008, 04:01:05 am
The Serapis seems wasted potential. Why the hell did the Vasudans install the most powerful reactor to ever grace a light fighter (more output than that of an Erinyes!) without making sure the craft is compatible with the most beloved energy hog (UD-8 Kayser)? While we're at it, how can they call it an advanced interceptor if it can't carry Trebuchets?
Actually, the role of interceptor is just to intercept. An interceptor is generally small, and fast, tasked with chasing down enemy fighters and bombers. A Trebuchet is a heavy missiles and carrying these in large capacities would probably slow it down. Interceptors (imo, anyway) tend to use primaries to kill anyway, hence the smaller secondary bank.

Impressive shield recharge, manoeverability and target profile mean this thing can dodge heavy fire all day long. At the same time, low shield capacity and primary firepower make it difficult to actually do something useful without getting one's butt shot off.
Like I said above, its an interceptor. Its supposed to stay on the move, and its definitely not meant for head on strikes on capital ships.


The way the engine responds to different power setting negates some of the excellent energy power plant - top speed suffers significantly when fed less than default yet it doesn't benefit much from additional energy.
Can't really call it suffering significantly. 75ms-1 is still respectable. Although, the measly 3ms-1 is quite ... disappointing. But you can see it as the Serapis already having alot of power drawn from the power plant.

Whining aside, it's a craft capable of many different jobs: It's fast enough and has enough secondary capacity to be a reasonable interceptor if you can live without Trebuchets, it's an effective (if unforgiving) dogfighter and it can wield Maxims against capital ships with more than enough power to spare.
I think the main weapon an interceptor needs to have is the Harpoon, since its the de facto dogfighting missile.

For a multi-role craft I prefer this over the Myrmidon, but on the whole I expected a more elegant solution from the Vasudans. If I don't need to take cheap shots at capital ships I'd rather fly the Thoth.
Agreed.

Regarding the assault fighters...  in this class all of the modern ships are balanced and have their uses. I'm leaning towards the Tauret because it has all I want from a heavy fighter; being less nimble than an Erinyes or a Herc II isn't a problem if you assign 3 Taurets + 1 light fighter to a wing.
GTVA tends to group their wings with similar fighter classes, though. Besides, the single interceptor/space superiority probably won't make much of a different.

Sidenote: Try to space your text out a little, makes it easier to read.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Iranon on July 08, 2008, 10:06:17 am
Actually, the Freespace designations are roughly equivalent to the real-life distinction between interceptors and air superiority fighters in the 50ies to 70ies, the former are optimised for speed and/or standoff capability as opposed to dogfighting ability.

This makes the Serapis slightly misclassed as it's neither terribly fast nor able to carry long-ranged missiles, but very manoeverable. The Vasudans, however, still have a pure interceptor in the Horus (which is optimised for quickly picking off bombers/disabling beam cannons, then retreating to a friendly capital ship instead of picking fights with anything lighter than a Basilisk).

As you said yourself, the Harpoon is also a missile optimised for dogfighting rather than interception although its quick lock-on time makes one bay of them useful: the quickest way to pick off a group of bombers would be to fire Trebuchets from afar, then pick off survivors with Harpoons and primaries.

Regarding the engine I overlooked something; apparently decrease in speed is linear between default and no power assigned to the engines, with the latter resulting at half the normal cruising speed. A measly 3 m/s increase for full power is disappointing though.


About 3+1 wings... many things in the game don't quite work as expected. In the hands of the AI, a a few Medusae loaded with Infyrnos/Piranhas  can be more successful against fighters than the finest space superiority fighters the game has to offer for example. Likewise, 3 assault fighters/bombers slow the enemy down while a manoeverable space superiority fighter rips them to shreds. The only real drawback is if that the lightweight has a low life expectancy if you send the wing into heavy flak. This is usually not a problem if you just let them do their thing though.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 08, 2008, 11:06:46 am
I suppose it returns to your playing style. If you prefer interceptors to have long range missiles, that's your nick. For me interceptors are fast and can turn on a dime, and don't need long range missiles. I actually use the Harpoon to pick off bombs, because of its fast lock on and manueverability. And besides, interceptors are

Quote from: Wikipedia Article
... a type of fighter aircraft designed specifically to intercept and destroy enemy aircraft, particularly bombers, usually relying on great speed.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 08, 2008, 11:32:41 am
Then Interceptors are pointless. The best way to defend a ship is to match its speed in an Ares and Trebuchet anyone who comes near.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 08, 2008, 11:34:37 am
The point to interceptors is that they are meant to destroy all aircraft, but pilots are trained to prioritise bombs and bombers first. So an interceptor has to be fast and nimble, which means having paper thin protection. Because if an interceptor is spending a lot of time still, its obviously not doing its job.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 08, 2008, 11:37:41 am
Trebuchets have made all interceptors pointless.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 08, 2008, 11:39:26 am
Pair Trebs don't take down everything, and they're worthless against bombs because of long lock on time. And besides, the most Trebs I've ever carried were 13 (Herc II), which didn't really last long in game.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 08, 2008, 11:41:32 am
You can Treb a bomber before they fire their ordnance (faster than an interceptor can take a bomber down, anyway).
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Kie99 on July 08, 2008, 12:00:04 pm
Pair Trebs don't take down everything, and they're worthless against bombs because of long lock on time. And besides, the most Trebs I've ever carried were 13 (Herc II), which didn't really last long in game.

Unless you have a big wing of Seraphim coming at you from less than 3 clicks, you should be able to take down a wing of bombers before they can do anything.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Iranon on July 08, 2008, 01:33:58 pm
It's possible to defend in something other than a dedicated interceptor craft... if you don't have to cover a lot of ground, simply staying close to one's charge and lobbing trebuchets from an assault fighter/bomber might be the easiest way. Likewise, it makes sense to use a space superiority fighter for interception duty if surviving the fighter escorts is the bigger problem than shooting down the bombers/bombs in time (often redundant for Terrans since the Perseus is a respectable dogfighter in its own right).
This doesn't magically turn those craft into interceptors though, in the same way that an Ursa full of Infyrnos still isn't a space superiority fighter.

From the same wiki article:
"[Interceptors] sacrifice performance in the air superiority fighter role (ie fighting enemy fighter aircraft) by tuning their performance for either fast climbs or high speeds, respectively. The result is that interceptors often look very impressive on paper, typically outrunning, outclimbing and outgunning less specialized fighter designs. Yet they tend to fare poorly in combat against those same "less capable" designs due to limited maneuverability."

The Horus and Valkyrie are such vulnerable performance craft ('express missile delivery vehicles' rather than superior dogfighters); echoing western aviation history the line between space superiority fighters and interceptors blurred in the following generation: the new designs sacrifice sheer speed for shielding (Terrans) or agility (Vasudans). Dedicated interceptors are still the way to go when defending multiple targets against enemies from different attack vectors; slow craft might be incapable of responding in time even when wielding Trebuchets.
Despite some concessions, the Perseus still functions for pure interceptor duties. The Serapis will usually do, but in many situations the Vasudans have no alternative tot he Horus.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Droid803 on July 08, 2008, 01:55:31 pm
I find an Ares far more efficient than any interceptor at defending a convoy.
However, if I need to defend something big (like an Arcadia or a Destroyer), it is usually better to use an interceptor, as you can't simply lob a trebuchet through the ship you're defending, you often need to cover a click or so before you can actually let loose with the missiles.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mongoose on July 08, 2008, 05:48:03 pm
I find a lot of this debate over missile performance rather amusing, since I usually wind up coming back with almost my full load of them at the end of a mission. :p In my mind, interceptors make for the best defensive ships because I'm able to afterburn over to whatever wing of bombers has last jumped in in the shortest time possible, allowing me to open up on said bombers with whatever primary weapons I had loaded at the time.  Trebuchets are all well and good for attacking slower targets, but they do miss, and one can usually hold only a handful of them.  Give me a nice Prometheus S or Kayser 300 meters behind my target any day of the week.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: lostllama on July 09, 2008, 05:06:23 am
We need one of those big whiteboard-type things like on Top Gear split up into sections titled sub-zero, cool, uncool, seriously uncool, not worth a mention...
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 09, 2008, 10:03:01 am
We need one of those big whiteboard-type things like on Top Gear split up into sections titled sub-zero, cool, uncool, seriously uncool, not worth a mention...
Yea. But where would we put it ?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Rodo on July 09, 2008, 11:32:48 am
Dog fighting is not the same that intercepting, I guess that everyone knows this but I said it anyway..
perseus description seems a little off at this subject, as it can be used as a good dog fighting craft as well.


the best way to difference this is when you try going after a wing whose orders are to kill you and only you.. If you go right straight to them you'll find yourself surrounded by a rain of primaries and they wont miss! dog fighting gets easer when you hold their 6' and gets like an interceptor role kind battle but well..
(and I havent seen an AI wich tries to overcome this scenario by puting at your 6', the only way of being killed is with two fighters against you)

Personally I use the Trebuchets only to bring down turrets from afar, and if I have some to spare I target any kind of fighter/bomber that's coming right straight to me, just to weaken it's front shields, then I charge and throw a couple of 1's on it's face on the approach.

Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: lostllama on July 09, 2008, 03:14:03 pm
We need one of those big whiteboard-type things like on Top Gear split up into sections titled sub-zero, cool, uncool, seriously uncool, not worth a mention...
Yea. But where would we put it ?

....Dunno.

Maybe the results of the above poll could be used to generate an online version of a board like that. On the FS Wiki maybe. Or make another poll using the Top Gear 'standards.'

Or maybe it's a bad idea.  :ick: :no:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Iranon on July 09, 2008, 06:01:33 pm
May I suggest the Loki for the sub-zero section, for being the only real performance craft that doesn't seem out of place in a heavy firefight? Also, there's the old school appeal, the covert operations history and the simple fact that I always wanted sharks with fricking laser beams, attached to their heads or otherwise.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 09, 2008, 08:07:00 pm
I've always found the Loki to be somewhat lacking. Like a ship that's neither here nor there. Its has weak shielding, small secondary bank. Maybe its cause I depend on secondaries for most of my kills, but small secondary banks tend to put me off.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Iranon on July 10, 2008, 06:22:10 am
Good and cool aren't the same things; I think the Loki is both. The lack of secondaries makes it obviously less good, but imo even more cool - you need to dogfight the hard way instead of relying on your weaponry to do your job without your help.

For giggles, here an attempt to emulate the highly subjective - and often unfair - classification according to coolness:



Sub-Zero

Loki - for all the reasons mentioned above.

Thoth - for cramming an unreal amount of firepower into a nimble and tiny package. Deadly to enemies and its pilot. Accept no substitutes if you have the stones.



Cool

Ulysses - quirky and distinctive handling as far as that's possible in this game ; would be sub-zero if it didn't have to compete with the Loki.

Hercules Mk II: Handles nicely for its class, does its job well without pretense or attempting to chase records. Understated, but cool.

Pegasus: Fast, nimble, stylish. Reeks a little too much of high-tech to be sub-zero (really cool people don't need that sort of thing).

Seth: Dogfighting in these is like taking a classic roadster against modern performance cars... sure you're at a disadvantage, but your sleek lines (and correspondingly good profile) and surprising performance when you let your afterburners roar will impress anyone who appreciates the classics. Performing much much better than it should, which is cool in itself.

Serapis: Cool because this tiny ship can do any job and combines excellent handling with ourageous amount of power.



Uncool

Hercules - The craft for people who don't go with the times and will pick anything with firepower when no advanced crafts are available. Great War veterans are excused if their main reason for picking this is nostalgia.

Erinyes - Anything which derives all its attractiveness from firepower is uncool. Good craft, and it can be satisfying to oblitterate enemy fighters in seconds... but you might be asked if you're trying to compensate for something.

Perseus - Flies well and would be cool... if it wasn't a Valkyrie bastardised for pansies who'd rather cower behind solid shields instead of relying on superior speed and acceleration.

Myrmidon - awkward. Feels like a (bad) light fighter with additional weapons bolted on. This would be cool if some grizzled privateer had duct-taped it together, but merely seems badly designed as a production vehicle.

Horus - Yes, this is the fastest craft in the GTVA ever. Yes, it does its job as an interceptor well. It still doesn't have the feeling of precision and responsiveness that the Valk had, nor does it have the satisfying endurance on afterburners.

Tauret - Solid. Balanced. Boooring.

Ptah - Pegasus clone without the style. Also, when picking from a line of Vasudan fighters it seems a coward's choice... 'I'm too scared to fight the lightly-shielded alternatives'



Seriously Uncool

Ares - if your idea of being a hotshot fighter pilot is sitting stationary lobbing missiles at anything that moves, this is the craft for you. Its best defence against manoeverable targets is to come to a full stop and pretending to be a gun turret for crying out loud. Do you want to fly fighters or operate gun turrets, pilot?

Mara - 'Mummy is an admiral and issues me anything I ask for'. Who needs skill if you have this?




Yes, I have a definite bias towards light craft, and towards underdogs that are surprisingly rewarding if you give them a chance. I'm sure more than one person would want to rearrange the wall with a chainsaw.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: tifi on July 10, 2008, 07:23:19 am
I'd make a list thingy, but it wouldn't be very good as everything would be in 'Sub-Zero' except for the Myrmidon which would be on the wall all the way round the studio and over the road from the 'Seriously Uncool' end :P
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Molybdenum on July 10, 2008, 07:34:10 am
 :lol: Well played. But do you think flying a Loki to pick up Kristin Scott Thomas or Fiona Bruce to impress her?  :lol:

Heres my go for Bombers:

Sub-Zero

Ursa - the most badass looking ship in Terran history. Having bombed the Lucifer gives it bonus points. You can feel the power at your hands as you fly it at 30m/s. I choose it over any FS2 era bombers when I'm allowed to and see the smug faces of my wingmates as I score the Ravana kill in style.

Cool

Zeus - you got to have the balls to fly this one. Switching from nuking cruisers to dogfighting is good but gets your ass shot off frequently.

Sekhmet - oh sure we're ripping off Shivans now. How original. Its unused in the FS2 campaign, you learn to respect this one after playing Procyon Insurgency. In this case its simply good = cool.

Athena - this Assault Fighter is more nimble and better at dogfighting than the Herc 1. Someone tagged it as a bomber however and thus it lands here because its a pretty awesome ship.

Medusa - once again a smoking hot Great War relic but there is only room for one of those in Sub-Zero.

Uncool

Boanerges - begins the utterly disgusting array of visuals that the new FS2 Bombers display. A flying slug, utterly defenseless against any bird with functioning primaries. If you are intercept, the usual rule "don't go head-to-head against bombers" doesn't apply.

Osiris - pretty bad really.  Fires its bombs sometimes.

Amun - better but looks like a transport and you don't really fly it so who cares.

Artemis D.H. - the alternate paint job redeems it, a little. It still look pretty pathetic, see below.

Seriously Uncool

Artemis - I know its good but it looks like your kids potty for crying out loud! They could only have painted it pink to make it look less menacing... i bet the first NTF pilot to have encountered it were laughing right up to the moment when their ship blew up. Very embarrassing to fly and changing it is not an option most of the time in the campaign.(well actually it is but you die if you do)

Bakha - meh, its not really more maneuverable than to Sekhmet. Only two secondary banks are a PITA. It has to cheat in order to carry Helios in Bearbating which makes it even more lame.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 10, 2008, 09:43:57 am
Where would Shivans be in this list?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mars on July 10, 2008, 11:02:37 am
The persues is much more like an apollo than a valkyrie
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Iranon on July 10, 2008, 12:03:17 pm
@ Mars: Fair point since it is almost a strict improvement over the Apollo. However, the discontinuation of the Valkyrie, the classification of the Perseus as an interceptor and the tech room description indicate it's meant to replace that as well. I will gladly admit that the Perseus is a good craft and that my verdict is coloured by personal bias... but isn't that the whole point in the first place? :)

@ Stormkeeper: Is there any campaign that allows you to pilot Shivan craft, including multi-directional thrust and Shivan primaries? I'd rather not comment without first-hand experience flying the things -  table entries aren't everything when it comes to coolness.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 11, 2008, 12:34:21 am
Not sure about the multi directional thrust, but I know Flaming Sword just released his Shivan Mod. Its over at this (http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php/topic,55031.0.html) link. Bear in mind its still a work in progress, but I like the initial impressions I have of it.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 11, 2008, 05:14:55 am
You know, this is going to go badly because one tall person's opinion is going to overrule all other opinions, so us short people won't be able to get our say.

Like, I think the Loki should be in seriously uncool and the Ares should be in sub-zero.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Molybdenum on July 11, 2008, 07:31:30 am
You are entitled to your opinion, however, the nature of the cool wall is that it is completely subjective.  And yes I put the stickers so high that you can't reach it and that counts.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Harbinger of DOOM on July 11, 2008, 09:07:28 am
Ares or (if it was on here) Apollo.


I'm nostalgic, so sue me.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: tinfoil on July 11, 2008, 01:30:34 pm
Shieldless Apollo kicks ass - up points if you are using furies and ml-16's

if you have none of those kicking around go for the erinies because 40 kills in a single mission is just awesome

with the ares if you fly it moving or not the difference is minuscule and i hate slow ships

Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Titan on July 11, 2008, 01:51:06 pm
probably for me... it would be herc2, loki, or a next-gen version of the loki (something nobody has truly done)
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mars on July 11, 2008, 03:54:30 pm
The Pegasus kind of was a next gen Loki, especially considering the Loki was basically a ****ty valkyrie
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 11, 2008, 04:50:49 pm
You are entitled to your opinion, however, the nature of the cool wall is that it is completely subjective.  And yes I put the stickers so high that you can't reach it and that counts.
What's the point in doing this again?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Rodo on July 11, 2008, 09:35:43 pm
I find it amussing just re-playing the campaign with the ****tiest craft you can ever choose, and doing so I learned that I love using ****ty craft, just like the loki or the seraphin...
And I dare to tell command that it's concepts about war are completelly wrong! what's that about... "surviving is half the battle"??

I say surviving is all the battle
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 11, 2008, 09:57:14 pm
Seraphim ? The Seraphim is a Shivan bomber. I presume you mean the Serapis, which is in no way a ****ty craft. Not to me anyway.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Retsof on July 11, 2008, 10:17:55 pm
The funnest thing to do in a Loki is to twist the stick and make yourself dizzy with it's super-fast roll.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: tinfoil on July 11, 2008, 10:28:11 pm
you've got bank on twist?!?!?!?!? :eek2:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Iranon on July 12, 2008, 12:48:53 am
I played around with the Shivans a little using the mod Stormkeeper suggest (thanks for the link!). There were a few minor issues - modified secondaries, and apparently some modifications (Dragons having a top speed of 80 at default settings for example.

Still, I got a good enough feel of Shivan craft to say that I'm a little disappointed. The sliding was neither as fun nor as useful as I had assumed. While I knew in advance that Shivan primaries leave much to be desired (all are weaker than the Prometheus R which isn't even worth considering for GTVA pilots), I was appaled by the poor positioning on many of the crafts. And while trading hull strengths for better shields is nice when only facing fighters, it's quite a liability when having to fight near enemy capital ships.


Sub-Zero

Dragon - Not only is its manoeverability unmatched, its 3-gun bank is excellently placed so effective firepower is better than expected for a Shivan craft. It dogfights well, which shouldn't be a surprise to anyone who had to fight against them; the only gripe for a light fighter is the short endurance on afterburner. Looks good as well, but that applies to most Shivan crafts.



Cool

Mara - not too overpowered to be cool like the souped-up Terran version. This is a sweet craft as a standoff fighter, a role the GTVA doesn't provide for well. A blessing to any who want deep missile banks but consider an interceptor too light and an assault fighter too heavy for what they are trying to do.

Manticore - Like with many Shivan crafts, the afterburners suck so its impressive regular speed is actually relevant. While the guns are off-centre, they're close together at least.
A nice enough craft for interception duties, and distinctive enough to be cool... barely.



Uncool

Basilisk - Unexciting. Works as expected for his class with the usual Shivan features (good manoeverability and shielding at the expense of hull strength, energy output and firepower). Mostly eclipsed by the Mara in the fighter role, it benfits from its better shielding mostly when standing back and lobbing Trebuchets.

Astaroth - Why exactly the Shivans introduced this when it is strictly inferior to the Manticore is beyond my comprehension. The horrible placement of gun points is particularly jarring in a light fighter that needs to capitalise on its agility and do relevant damage with sucky primaries before someone's on your tail.



Seriously Uncool

Aeshma - has the distinction of doing nothing well. Not enough missiles for a heavy fighter, not fast enough for intercepting duties, and while the manoeverability actually rivals that of some space superiorty fighters (something you usually don't notice when the AI flies these) both speed and gun positions leave much to be desired.


I won't rate the bombers as I couldn't express my feelings without resorting to profanity. Let me just say that the Seraphim in particular was beyond bad. At least the Nephilim has its (very off-centre) guns close together so a dedicated pilot could learn to dogfight in it....
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Droid803 on July 12, 2008, 01:15:58 am
Then I will do the bombers, based on just using the FS2 ones and making them flyable. Most of this is from playing with the stock shivan bombers in my own campaign.

Sub-Zero

Nahema - Its fast. Its well shielded. It actually has an afterburner. Its secondary banks aren't too large though, but its primary weapons placement is decent. Its like a Herc 2, only faster. Its has a distinction of being slower with all power shafted to engines, which is amusing. Notably, the only decent (stock) Shivan Bomber to fly.

Cool

Nothing

Uncool

Nephilim - Its slow, and having no afterburner makes flying it rather boring (or exciting when you're getting shot at). It maneuvers decently though. Its got a good number of primary points in a single bank, and, as noted, they are decently close together so you could probably get used to dogfighting with it, but its really not worth the effort.

Taurvi - This sits on the borderline between Uncool and Seriously Uncool. Its only redeeming quality, really, is its centerline gunmount, which makes bomb interception easy...or would have, if it could actually move. No afterburner. Well, its also flat, so I guess that counts for something. its not a big fat target like the Seraphim. If you give it an afterburner, it actually becomes a decent bomber.

Seriously Uncool

Seraphim - While this looks good on paper with 11 primary points and four missile banks, it sucks. It has a gaping hole in its forward shield quadrant making it largely useless, and it just so happens that that's the shield quadrant that gets hit the most during a bombing run. Its monstrous size makes it impossible to even dodge blob fire. The primary points are so spread out, you'd be lucky if you could get all of them to hit a cruiser. The only one that you can remotely dogfight with is the triple-point mounted below. At least that has a centerline point that aids in aiming. Oh, did I mention it has no afterburner? Not that having one would do it much good.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Fenrir on July 12, 2008, 01:43:28 am
I`m playing Homesick right now, and so I`m currently spending more time in a Loki than in all the rest of my almost 10 years of playing FS2 combined. It`s starting to grow on me a little bit. Also...

you've got bank on twist?!?!?!?!? :eek2:

Where else would you put it on a joystick?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mars on July 12, 2008, 01:47:28 am
The Seraphim is a terror in the third mission of Silent Threat; especially on Insane.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 12, 2008, 05:08:16 am
The Seraphim is a terror in the third mission of Silent Threat; especially on Insane.
Why the hell would the Shivans summon that many ships to attack a few escape pods, anyway?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: BengalTiger on July 12, 2008, 09:43:25 am
Maybe they have a major target practice exercise?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on July 12, 2008, 10:41:15 pm
Maybe they have a major target practice exercise?

:wtf:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: colecampbell666 on July 13, 2008, 07:49:53 pm
Seraphim ? The Seraphim is a Shivan bomber. I presume you mean the Seraph, which is in no way a ****ty craft. Not to me anyway.
Seraph? The Seraph is an imaginary craft. I presume you mean the Serapis, which is a ****ty craft. To me anyway.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 13, 2008, 07:52:12 pm
It's the new Anubis.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 13, 2008, 08:30:43 pm
Seraph? The Seraph is an imaginary craft. I presume you mean the Serapis, which is a ****ty craft. To me anyway.
Fixed.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 13, 2008, 08:45:35 pm
What did you fix, exactly? They're exactly the same. :wtf:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: NGTM-1R on July 13, 2008, 08:49:59 pm
Where's my Athe-

Oh wait. :P
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 13, 2008, 08:51:43 pm
What did you fix, exactly? They're exactly the same. :wtf:
My previous post.

Where's my Athe-

Oh wait. :P
I don't really like the Athena, because of that weird overhead gun port.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: colecampbell666 on July 13, 2008, 08:52:57 pm
It just isn't useful, IMO. Too bulky, the configs aren't that good, poor bombs, not enough chance to use, not very useful, it's too generalized.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: NGTM-1R on July 13, 2008, 08:56:06 pm
I don't really like the Athena, because of that weird overhead gun port.

Perhaps, but it does have the best gun setup for dogfighting in either game.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 13, 2008, 08:57:18 pm
Really ? Because of the overhead gun port ?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: NGTM-1R on July 14, 2008, 12:11:22 am
Yes, tightest pattern, will hit closest to your reticule, with the two underslung and overhead guns both closely spaced. Best for bomb interception too.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: nvsblmnc on July 14, 2008, 01:33:12 am
I really liked the Athena - I don't remember if you're offered a choice between the Athena and the Herc in FS1, but I fly it at every possible opportunity.  Sure it can't carry the heaviest weapons, but it's fire is concentrated enough to make a mess of almost anything that gets in fron of it.

BTW, what's the quote in NGTM-1R's sig from?  Sounds interesting.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Iranon on July 14, 2008, 03:34:22 am
The Hercules Mark II is very close in capabilities  - the Athena can't actually carry real bombs either, and in FS2 the Stiletto is unnecessary (the Trebuchet can do its job at least as well while being a lot more flexible). All in all, I'd say the Herc II is the better ship although the Athena is more pleasant to fly (mostly due to even better gun placement and superior afterburners).

Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on July 14, 2008, 09:03:49 pm
I'm not a huge fan of strike bombers, though. I'd prefer more exciting stuff like the Ursa, with its gun placements.
/me likes to terrorise a Shivan by using the triple guns on a GTB Ursa to take pot shots. :drevil:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 14, 2008, 09:06:51 pm
You can't actually do that on higher difficulties, especially not against Dragons.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Rodo on July 14, 2008, 09:08:57 pm
You can't actually do that on higher difficulties, especially not against Dragons.

Dragons are hard to hit even with a buch of nukes under your wings... you'll have a hard time hitting it (maybe with a big BIG net)
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on July 14, 2008, 09:17:49 pm
Meh, I'm referring to the main campaign only, where you can fly an Ursa against wave after wave of Basilisks on Slaying Ravana.

Against a Dragon? Hmm...I won't take a bomber, definitely. I might fly the Pegasus. :drevil:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 14, 2008, 09:25:27 pm
I'd just bait the Dragon into range of a friendly Aeolus.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on July 14, 2008, 09:27:12 pm
I'd just bait the Dragon into range of a friendly Aeolus.

Aeolus = Fighter's worst nightmare :yes: :drevil: :ha:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 14, 2008, 09:30:52 pm
I made a 0 miss facter stab beam, and tested it on an Aeolus against 90 dragon fighters. :drevil:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on July 14, 2008, 09:36:13 pm
I made a 0 miss facter stab beam, and tested it on an Aeolus against 90 dragon fighters. :drevil:

All the Dragons snuffed it? :drevil:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 14, 2008, 09:46:52 pm
Totally. The Aeolus got them even when they were doing their fancy slides.

Like,

*slide*
*PEW*
*BOOM*
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Iranon on July 15, 2008, 04:21:13 am
Shivan fighters suck when having to fight near enemy capital ships: Their paper-thin hulls mean they get chewed up by anti-fighter beams, and they lack the firepower to strike a telling blow in the short time before that happens.

However, taking a bomber against Dragons seems... problematic. Actually an Ursa might do best here simply because its turret deals more damage than the 5 Heavy Laser of the Dragon combined (can't keep them in my sights even with light bombers).

Still, I'd argue that Dragons are slightly overrated and that a Loki can fight them on close to even terms; 3 times the firepower has to count for something.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Rodo on July 15, 2008, 02:49:10 pm
I'd just bait the Dragon into range of a friendly Aeolus.

we talk alike... ^^

commands says that you should concentrate on the fighters and let our warships do their job...
but I like watching the accion so I just make them bite my rear for a coulple of secs and then head to the caps :D

that made me think about the last one of the missions in FS2 campaign..
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on July 16, 2008, 12:41:38 am
that made me think about the last one of the missions in FS2 campaign..

...Clash of the Titans II? We've got four Aeoluses and fighter wings protecting a GTD Orion #2 loaded with Meson warheads.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: NGTM-1R on July 16, 2008, 01:04:29 am
BTW, what's the quote in NGTM-1R's sig from?  Sounds interesting.

Campaign concept I'm working on.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 16, 2008, 05:17:29 am
Campaign concept I'm working on.
What happened to FORTUNE ATTEND YOU BROTH---
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 16, 2008, 05:40:15 am
...Clash of the Titans II? We've got four Aeoluses and fighter wings protecting a GTD Orion #2 loaded with Meson warheads.

That is one of the worst missions to show case the abilities of the Aeolus class cruisers, imo.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Rodo on July 16, 2008, 09:50:39 am
that made me think about the last one of the missions in FS2 campaign..

...Clash of the Titans II? We've got four Aeoluses and fighter wings protecting a GTD Orion #2 loaded with Meson warheads.

not that one, the last mission, the one with the supernova.

you'll notice that while you are having fun with the bombers a wing of dragons jumps in and gets some fun out of your wingmen... and it's pretty hard to chase bombers without wingmates so I tend to drag those dragons near the deadelus (the deimos, really dont remember the actual name) so my wingmen can help me take the bombers down (the suck but it's a help)
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: blowfish on July 16, 2008, 11:05:54 am
The Deimos was the Lemnos.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 16, 2008, 12:52:51 pm
I have come to a conclusion: among cannon fighters, the Dragon reigns supreme because of its maneuverability.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Jeff Vader on July 16, 2008, 01:36:12 pm
I'd be intimidated if Dragons had cannons (http://koti.mbnet.fi/reiler/FunkyFreeSpaceStuff/cannondragon.jpg). Pardon, but I tend to whine if a typo misspelling actually changes the meaning of the word.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 16, 2008, 02:13:07 pm
Typos are accidental, that was just a misspelling.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Jeff Vader on July 16, 2008, 02:17:01 pm
Hmm. Quite true.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: terran_emperor on July 16, 2008, 03:28:01 pm
Erinyes or Terran Mara. Once i get in them, I utterly R*** the enemy.

...Clash of the Titans II? We've got four Aeoluses and fighter wings protecting a GTD Orion #2 loaded with Meson warheads.

There were only 3 cruisers and the Bastion
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Droid803 on July 16, 2008, 06:14:26 pm
Templar, Malta, Ertanax, to be exact :P
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: blowfish on July 16, 2008, 10:27:20 pm
That mission really wasn't fair to the Aeolus, since all three were damaged to near-critical levels when the mission started and were being attacked by waves and waves of bombers with Helios bombs.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 16, 2008, 11:40:58 pm
If they were at full strength then it would be just be a bomb hunting mission.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Droid803 on July 16, 2008, 11:57:05 pm
It's already self-playing as-is. Unless they actually dump a Shivan Destroyer into the fray...to justify the name.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 17, 2008, 12:29:46 am
Not really. The bombs can actually get the Aeolus cruisers. If you're unlucky.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mars on July 17, 2008, 12:37:53 am
The cruisers usually start going down once the Seraphim get involved.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on July 17, 2008, 12:38:53 am
Not really. The bombs can actually get the Aeolus cruisers. If you're unlucky.

They're Helios torpedoes. What else is there to expect? :blah:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 17, 2008, 01:05:53 am
Once I modified a laser file to fire high-speed bombs, it used the Helios and I forgot to nerf it ...... And accidentally changed its mass to 1000. My finger slipped.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: General Battuta on July 17, 2008, 01:13:08 am
That mission really wasn't fair to the Aeolus, since all three were damaged to near-critical levels when the mission started and were being attacked by waves and waves of bombers with Helios bombs.

I'm always impressed by how long they can hold out. The Aeolus is a formidable platform (and really easy on the eyes, too.)
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on July 17, 2008, 01:23:25 am
That mission really wasn't fair to the Aeolus, since all three were damaged to near-critical levels when the mission started and were being attacked by waves and waves of bombers with Helios bombs.
(and really easy on the eyes, too.)

Really? How come? :confused:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 17, 2008, 01:35:02 am
Its very sleek, with clean lines. The Fenris and Leviathans remind me of big fishes. I've always preferred Aeolus cruisers because of the way they look.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: NGTM-1R on July 17, 2008, 04:48:53 am
Campaign concept I'm working on.
What happened to FORTUNE ATTEND YOU BROTH---

It was never meant to be anything more than a sig. :P I don't even know if I still have the text around.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Rodo on July 17, 2008, 07:12:03 am
Its very sleek, with clean lines. The Fenris and Leviathans remind me of big fishes. I've always preferred Aeolus cruisers because of the way they look.

It looks more terran than ANY terran cruiser (except for the deimos wich looks kind of terran though it was implemented vasudan tecnology).

Besides I dont know why, but's the only cruiser which seems "complete" in terms of texturing...just look at those turrets!! I hate the bubble turrets of the other models (or is it just me?, or that I have uncomplete mvps..)
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: MT on July 17, 2008, 07:30:43 am
Its very sleek, with clean lines. The Fenris and Leviathans remind me of big fishes. I've always preferred Aeolus cruisers because of the way they look.

It looks more terran than ANY terran cruiser (except for the deimos wich looks kind of terran though it was implemented vasudan tecnology).

Besides I dont know why, but's the only cruiser which seems "complete" in terms of texturing...just look at those turrets!! I hate the bubble turrets of the other models (or is it just me?, or that I have uncomplete mvps..)

I don't think so. Fenris/Leviathans (Feniathans?!) scream Terran as much as the Orion does, with their straight lines. Deimos and Aeolus look more curvy, which is a tendency of Vasudan designs.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Rodo on July 17, 2008, 07:48:27 am

I don't think so. Fenris/Leviathans (Feniathans?!) scream Terran as much as the Orion does, with their straight lines. Deimos and Aeolus look more curvy, which is a tendency of Vasudan designs.

Ahh you are right! I forgot about Fenris and Leviathans.

Orions look terran.. but to clumsy... is as if they teared apart a tall building and sticked some trusters on the back...

the only thing I dislike from the models is that they keep the old turrets, is it hard to mod a new one? maybe Ill work on it, but I dont have a clue about modding or how to modify a model, Ill check out the mod forum later on.

Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 17, 2008, 08:02:41 am
The Orion is not clumsy. It's big, solid brick. Unlike the Hecate which looks like a giant cluster**** of Popsicle sticks, a pile of excrement and big SHOOT ME I'M A TURRENT turrets.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: ShadowGorrath on July 17, 2008, 08:15:07 am
The Orion is not clumsy. It's big, solid brick. Unlike the Hecate which looks like a giant cluster**** of Popsicle sticks, a pile of excrement and big SHOOT ME I'M A TURRENT turrets.

The "TURRENT" thing ( I understand it was intentional here ) is creepy... I mean, I understand when it's a typo. But when some of my classmates start saying "turreNt" as if it was the correct spelling, it creeps me out to no end... And especially when the ones who say it have the top grades in english, and actually say that it's the correct spelling...

By the way, after some time, the Hecate starts to look good. I disliked how it looked before, and the Orion was my fave ship. Now I like the Hecate as much as the Orion.

P.S. In the concept/sketch, the Hecate looks better.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 17, 2008, 09:40:59 am
I always think purple, no matter how light the shade is, is a horrible colour for a military unit to be painted in.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: colecampbell666 on July 17, 2008, 10:49:50 am
The Orion is blue.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Droid803 on July 17, 2008, 10:59:05 am
Meh, I always liked the Majesty color scheme for Orions better. Less paint wastage.
Blue Starships make as much sense as Orange Ninjas.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 17, 2008, 11:10:26 am
The Orion is blue.
It looks more like light purple to me.

Meh, I always liked the Majesty color scheme for Orions better. Less paint wastage.
Blue Starships make as much sense as Orange Ninjas.
Which, as we all know, is the perfect color for ninjas.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 17, 2008, 11:33:53 am
Which, as we all know, is the perfect color for ninjas.
:wtf:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Blue Lion on July 17, 2008, 12:07:01 pm
Ninjas don't need color.

If you see a ninja, you're wrong.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: General Battuta on July 17, 2008, 12:27:36 pm
I always think purple, no matter how light the shade is, is a horrible colour for a military unit to be painted in.

The Covenant laughs at you! (Whatever you think of Halo, you gotta admit those bright purple vehicles were a nice artistic touch.)

Back on-topic, I've found the Pegasus growing on me as a dogfighter, even without its stealth capability. Target profile is razor-thin! Hard to hit at medium range!
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: ShadowGorrath on July 17, 2008, 12:29:53 pm
I always think purple, no matter how light the shade is, is a horrible colour for a military unit to be painted in.

The Covenant laughs at you! (Whatever you think of Halo, you gotta admit those bright purple vehicles were a nice artistic touch.)

Back on-topic, I've found the Pegasus growing on me as a dogfighter, even without its stealth capability. Target profile is razor-thin! Hard to hit at medium range!

Ulysses!
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 17, 2008, 12:41:24 pm
Ulysses!
Harpoon locked on.

Spacebar

Kabloom.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: c914 on July 17, 2008, 12:47:16 pm
Quote
Harpoon locked on.

Spacebar

Kabloom.

Works only if you try to hit AI

Ulysses is my favourite one, tiny with hi manoeuvrability and hasn't got that "noob use only" stealth :P
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mars on July 17, 2008, 01:11:55 pm
Ulysses is kind of like a dualing pistol... it's excellent 1v1, but if you try to drop it in with multiple targets, it'll get chewed to shreds.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: ShadowGorrath on July 17, 2008, 01:36:04 pm
O YEA?

Try playing the 'Pistols at Dawn' mission in SAH mod, on hard or insane. Enjoy spending your time taking down Ulysses fighters.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Rodo on July 17, 2008, 03:05:10 pm
O YEA?

Try playing the 'Pistols at Dawn' mission in SAH mod, on hard or insane. Enjoy spending your time taking down Ulysses fighters.

Ulysses on the hands of the IA is incredibly imposible to hit... when I finished that mission I was like OHH GOD!! and I thought that was a ****ty craft...

Imagine my dissapointment to discover that "if you are not thinking in bits...you will never duck incoming fire like that"

orange ninjas?? jajajja
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: terran_emperor on July 17, 2008, 03:41:18 pm
Which, as we all know, is the perfect color for ninjas.
:wtf:

Best Colour for ninjas is green with Red, Orange, Blue or Purple masks. Especially in the Sewers of the Big Apple
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: NGTM-1R on July 17, 2008, 10:32:38 pm
That sound you heard was the reference hitting the wall somewhere far, far above your head.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: terran_emperor on July 17, 2008, 10:35:50 pm
That sound you heard was the reference hitting the wall somewhere far, far above your head.

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/d/db/TMNT1987Series.jpg)

TEENAGE MUTANT NINJA TURTLES
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on July 17, 2008, 10:40:08 pm
It's a pity the Pegasus can only be used once in the main FS2 campaign. I didn't like it at first because of its hull strength, but after I gave it a try, I got attached to it. I still am. :)
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 17, 2008, 10:42:40 pm
You missed the orange ninja reference, though.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on July 17, 2008, 10:59:18 pm
I always think purple, no matter how light the shade is, is a horrible colour for a military unit to be painted in.

The Covenant laughs at you! (Whatever you think of Halo, you gotta admit those bright purple vehicles were a nice artistic touch.)

Back on-topic, I've found the Pegasus growing on me as a dogfighter, even without its stealth capability. Target profile is razor-thin! Hard to hit at medium range!

SO WAS DURANDAL

You missed the orange ninja reference, though.

I think it was too sublime for me to notice. :nervous:

Purple's a nice colour.

I thought the Hecate looks nice. It's probably the placement of the guns that annoys everyone.

When I first saw the Aeolus in the demo, I was quite impressed. Sometimes, the GTC Adamant can actually hold out on its own until the end of the mission, and it certainly looks more like a fighter than even the GVD Hatshepsut.

What I especially dislike is having to engage the NTC Saharan on a Myrmidon. I was reluctant to engage, which was why I only got pelted once. If I engaged, well...

:beamz:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: terran_emperor on July 17, 2008, 11:21:34 pm
I just stuck to kicking the S*** out of the fighters and let allies bring down the Aeolus
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on July 17, 2008, 11:28:09 pm
I just stuck to kicking the S*** out of the fighters and let allies bring down the Aeolus

I do that too, after realising how dangerous an Aeolus is to fighters.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mars on July 18, 2008, 12:57:32 am
I always took pity on the Adament and destroyed the Molochs beam turrets; the Adament would almost invariably prevail at that point.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 18, 2008, 06:35:38 am
Here. This (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naruto) should help you with the orange ninja reference.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: neo_hermes on July 18, 2008, 08:54:33 am
no, apollo? liked the apollo twas my favorite space pwane.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: terran_emperor on July 18, 2008, 10:18:13 am
Here. This (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naruto) should help you with the orange ninja reference.

Ah! Not seen Naruto. I hear ninja, I automatically think 4 Turtles and a Rat...What can you expect, when it was one of the staple shows of my childhood
***
FS1 i liked the Herc
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Jeff Vader on July 18, 2008, 10:25:03 am
Here. This (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naruto) should help you with the orange ninja reference.

Ah! Not seen Naruto.
Well, do see it. It has some unintentional FS references. Or mainly the fact that the Rasengan remotely resembles the charge-up of an AAAf beam.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Akalabeth Angel on July 18, 2008, 11:44:09 am
Here. This (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naruto) should help you with the orange ninja reference.

Not everyone's a narutard.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 18, 2008, 11:49:07 am
Well most of Singapore's anime fans like him. I, for one think that if a ninja wears orange on a daily basis and even on missions, he clearly has some issues. Like color blindness.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 18, 2008, 11:50:19 am
And I seriously thought that we could avoid Naruto discussion on HLP. Guess I was wrong.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 18, 2008, 11:52:44 am
We can try....

The Eyrinies looks like its in the lead. It'll probably win.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: colecampbell666 on July 18, 2008, 12:21:18 pm
And I seriously thought that we could avoid Naruto discussion on HLP. Guess I was wrong.
I hate anime, but that show is the worst of them all.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: MT on July 18, 2008, 12:42:20 pm
And I seriously thought that we could avoid Naruto discussion on HLP. Guess I was wrong.
I hate anime, but that show is the worst of them all.

There are many good shows out there, wheat among the chaff. For certain mediocre shows, the fanboys/fangirls make things worse; the term Narutard was invented with a reason.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: colecampbell666 on July 18, 2008, 12:43:37 pm
No, I just hate the styling/animation period.

I hate anime because everything is overdramatic.
I hate anime because the animation sucks.
I hate anime because the style does not appeal to me.
I hate anime because the plots on most of them are stupid.
I hate anime because half the time the characters look retarded.
I hate anime because the characters have such retarded facial expressions.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Rodo on July 18, 2008, 12:46:24 pm
Here. This (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naruto) should help you with the orange ninja reference.

Ah! Not seen Naruto. I hear ninja, I automatically think 4 Turtles and a Rat...What can you expect, when it was one of the staple shows of my childhood
***
FS1 i liked the Herc

I though about the ninja turtles too!

migelangelo!!.. it was the name of the orange ninja turtle :P
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Akalabeth Angel on July 18, 2008, 12:49:28 pm
No, I just hate the styling/animation period.

I hate anime because everything is overdramatic.
I hate anime because the animation sucks.
I hate anime because the style does not appeal to me.
I hate anime because the plots on most of them are stupid.
I hate anime because half the time the characters look retarded.
I hate anime because the characters have such retarded facial expressions.

    Watch Akira, Castle in the Sky and Perfect Blue and see if you have the same opinion. Though, Perfect Blue might be a little mature for you. Not sure how old you are.

     Or if you need to watch a tv show watch CowBoy Bebop. Or for an OVA watch Gunbuster.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Jeff Vader on July 18, 2008, 12:52:49 pm
Here. This (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naruto) should help you with the orange ninja reference.
Or better yet... (http://uncyclopedia.org/wiki/Naruto)

And I seriously thought that we could avoid Naruto discussion on HLP. Guess I was wrong.
Damn straight you were.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: MT on July 18, 2008, 01:09:51 pm
No, I just hate the styling/animation period.

I hate anime because everything is overdramatic.
I hate anime because the animation sucks.
I hate anime because the style does not appeal to me.
I hate anime because the plots on most of them are stupid.
I hate anime because half the time the characters look retarded.
I hate anime because the characters have such retarded facial expressions.

    Watch Akira, Castle in the Sky and Perfect Blue and see if you have the same opinion. Though, Perfect Blue might be a little mature for you. Not sure how old you are.

     Or if you need to watch a tv show watch CowBoy Bebop. Or for an OVA watch Gunbuster.

This is waaaay off-topic but my 2 cents:

Hmm, I don't consider Akira to be a very good show (when one compares to the manga). I'd think Onneamise no Tsubasa, Macross Plus and Cowboy Bebop to be better introductions to animu. I have other favourites but those can only be enjoyed by those who understand the culture.

I suspect the problem with animu is that there is too much trash being imported over that create noobish fans. The combination of both only serve to give animu a bad name. In the past decade, we had a deluge of harem and/or ecchi animu (Love Hina being a prime example...) which only serve to make animu get labeled as pr0n and those who admit to watching animu as perverts. Sad thing.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 18, 2008, 01:21:27 pm
Personally, I like mecha series. Cause they has big giant robotz! No seriously. I think my favorite series is still the original Gundam series.

Okay, enough off topicness. Why didn't more people vote for the Ulyssess? Its my number 4 choice actually. I think its pretty quick, and its target profile is thin. Yea, its hull strength is horrible. But it has some good moves. And there are always countermeasures. :p
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 18, 2008, 02:00:19 pm
Look, this is a FreeSpace forum, not an anime forum.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: NGTM-1R on July 18, 2008, 03:05:24 pm
Look, this is a FreeSpace forum, not an anime forum.

We have a long history of going wildly offtopic too.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Rodo on July 18, 2008, 04:34:17 pm
so... the Erinyes is winning right?

I watch at it from the sides and it looks like a giant target, the 8 banks sure make people be thrilled at it... and what about using some shivan addapted like the mara?? they dont fit in this voting session?

Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 18, 2008, 04:35:37 pm
This thread is over a year old FYI.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Droid803 on July 18, 2008, 06:23:41 pm
so... the Erinyes is winning right?
I watch at it from the sides and it looks like a giant target, the 8 banks sure make people be thrilled at it...

Well, don't know exactly why I like the Erinyes. I guess its because its the most suited for my style of fighting. Lob a Harpoon, then close in for mas Subach rape. Its target profile is smaller than that of the Ares from behind...which is usually where I'm being shot at from (I either turn to face an enemy to engage, or turn away from them and run away)
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 18, 2008, 07:38:32 pm
and what about using some shivan addapted like the mara?? they dont fit in this voting session?
Technically speaking, the Mara is Shivan, not Terran, even if SOC did go ape**** modding the thing.

I watch at it from the sides and it looks like a giant target, the 8 banks sure make people be thrilled at it...
Yea. Its as long as a limo from the side. But you'll mostly be behind the your target, which makes the Eyrinies a winner, cause from the rear its target profile is basically a cube.

Well, don't know exactly why I like the Erinyes.
It probably has something to do with the fact that the first mission it appears, the Skulls buttkick any and all comers short of the corvette. And the fact that you first see it in the company of SOC gives it a slight superiority aura.


... Lob a Harpoon, then close in for mas Subach rape.
Another reason the Erinyes is a favored fighter. It combines a massive primary bank with respectable secondary capacity. Plus it has some decent moves to boot.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: peterv on July 18, 2008, 10:23:34 pm
Erinues is also the most beautiful one, along whith the Elysees.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: terran_emperor on July 18, 2008, 10:32:05 pm
And I seriously thought that we could avoid Naruto discussion on HLP. Guess I was wrong.
I hate anime, but that show is the worst of them all.

There int much cole likes is there?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: nvsblmnc on July 19, 2008, 01:45:49 am
I've been replying Homesick the last few days and it's given me a new appreciation of the Loki.

I started off wishing for an Erinyes, Myrm, even a Serapis, but gradually remebered how to use the Loki.  Who needs overwhelming firepower when the enemy can't even get you in their sights?

On the other hand, I'd forgotten just how nasty an Aeolus could be to the Loki until I misjudged a turn and pulled up alongside the Mammon.  Loki + Flak =  :eek2:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: colecampbell666 on July 19, 2008, 09:52:13 am
And I seriously thought that we could avoid Naruto discussion on HLP. Guess I was wrong.
I hate anime, but that show is the worst of them all.

There int much cole likes is there?
Nope, I mainly hate emos, anime, and assholes. That's about it.
Title: Re: Relevant Anime Discussion
Post by: Jeff Vader on July 19, 2008, 09:57:23 am
I mainly hate emos, anime, and assholes. That's about it.
Oh dear. I guess I'm at your black list in that case, since I'm an emo (well, closet emo technically), I watch anime and have been referred to as an asshole repeatedly.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Droid803 on July 19, 2008, 11:46:08 am
I mainly hate emos, anime, and assholes. That's about it.
Oh dear. I guess I'm at your black list in that case, since I'm an emo (well, closet emo technically), I watch anime and have been referred to as an asshole repeatedly.
****. Same.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Rodo on July 19, 2008, 11:46:27 am
Loki + Flak = 

= ****ty ending

but it's ok... since you are just a pilot in a small craft, there's no hope for you bringing down a major ship.


and what about...

loki + kaisers + tempest = ??
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Droid803 on July 19, 2008, 12:40:08 pm
Total Dumbfire OwnageTM
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on July 20, 2008, 08:39:24 pm
Total Dumbfire OwnageTM

Is that an allusion to the old Tell A Story thread? ;)

What I like to do on when I fly an Erinyes is to use dual Kaysers with two full banks of Tempests. :drevil:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Iranon on July 21, 2008, 12:51:33 am
That's the problem with Terrans... hardly wants to fly their true dogfighting craft :)

There's the Perseus which could get away as a space superiority craft if one isn't looking to closely,  or the Erinyes which can compensate its shortcomings in this role by sheer firepower... both of which can carry meaningful numbers of standoff weapons.

In the campagin, enemies usally appear in waves and far away, favouring craft with a respectable missile loadout... but for extended dogfighting, what I really want is a Loki equipped as stated.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Al Tarket on July 21, 2008, 01:37:03 am
the herc 2 is the fighter i like the most. the erinyes has too many draw backs for a fighter but the herc only has 1 to speak of.

herc 2 has lots of room like the tauret for secondary fire support and a thick shield, you cant win a fight on primary fire alone. with that said my favored weapon of choices, kayser ud-8 and trebs combined with a herc 2 equals death. early in fs2 however would be the harpoons if none exist it would be the hornets
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 21, 2008, 03:25:11 am
the herc 2 is the fighter i like the most. the erinyes has too many draw backs for a fighter but the herc only has 1 to speak of.

herc 2 has lots of room like the tauret for secondary fire support and a thick shield, you cant win a fight on primary fire alone. with that said my favored weapon of choices, kayser ud-8 and trebs combined with a herc 2 equals death. early in fs2 however would be the harpoons if none exist it would be the hornets
It depends on your playing style, actually. I score most of my kills using secondaries, but I know my friend prefers using his primaries. And he can do just as well if not better than me.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Al Tarket on July 21, 2008, 03:31:14 am
i never pass up the opportunity to use trebs or harpoons when they become available i can average 30 kills a mission which includes cruisers and destroyers if im up to it. however the hercs drawback is its outright speed, which makes it more clumsy when it comes to destroying something like a dragon fighter when using primaries.

also interesting to note i love using the ursa and combined with a prom in the second primary slot and nothing in the 1st slot, together 5 helios in 2nd and 3rd secondary bank and a cluster bomb bay in 1st. it's not a lethal as you might expect however it does jump your secondary accuracy up quite a bit, my max accuracy was 740% accuracy on secondary and 600% on primary by the ursa bomber alone also in part thanks to that turret.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 21, 2008, 03:34:13 am
Dragon Fighters > Every other fighter

Trebs can only take kills from far out. Within 600ms, they become unwieldy.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Al Tarket on July 21, 2008, 03:40:34 am
im apoligies for last post, firefox crashed. yes as said, the herc 2 has a drawback with speed which makes it clumsy when using primaries on a dragon fighter. if the trebs cant kill it, harpoons take over, but even they become useless within 200m when both you and enemy fighter are heading almost directly at each other. thats where if your me, the helios works well if you need a 3rd fall back. i have taken out a dragon once with a helios torpedo, albeit lucky.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: nvsblmnc on July 21, 2008, 04:25:03 am
I always used to take dual primary weapons, but lately, I've found them to be less useful than mixed primaries.

I like taking a fast firing anti-fighter gun like the Subach or Kayser in one bank (preferably something with 4 firepoints), and pairing it with a more specialised weapon, such as an SDG for capital ships or a Prom S/Maxim for long-range sniping and intercept.  Add in a nice mixture of missiles and you've got a very flexible craft capable of taking on any target that gets in front of it.

Works great on a Myrm or an Erinyes, but less so on fighters that only have 4 gun points.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Iranon on July 21, 2008, 08:38:47 am
Getting into a proper dogfight against a Dragon with an assault fighter isn't pleasant; if the opponent is any good it might be an exercise in futility. There is another option though: Standing still and pretending to be a gun turret negates any mobility advantage, and Shivan fighters don't have the firepower to slug it out like that. Unfortunately, coming to a full stop isn't advisable when under fire from several opponents.

***

I consider, Dragons to be vastly overrated (i.e. I think it's good but hardly overpowered). People simply fly the wrong craft against them. Or maybe the craft are the right ones, and being able to fight Dragons on equal terms simply isn't the most important criterion for the mission. Let's compare the Shivan Dragon against its closest match in terms of manoeverability and the craft I consider the best overall dogfighter in the GTVA.

***

First, let's pit the Serapis (widely regarded a useless craft) against the it. Flight characteristics are close - the Dragon wins on top speed with afterburners and is slightly more manoeverable, the Serapis effectively has almost twice the afterburner capacity though. About even, with a slight advantage to the Dragon (I never found the sliding too useful... others might disagree).

Despite its much-criticized shielding, a Serapis will hold out longer against the Dragon's 5 Heavy Lasers  than the Dragon will against 4 Prometheus S... in other words, Shivan primaries suck even harder than Vasudan shields. Not that it's a major draw for close-in dogfighting, but the Serapis also has a generous missile capacity.
Endurance in a lengthy dogfight could go either way... the Serapis has the problem that more than half its damage capacity is made up of armour instead of shields - which doesn't regenerate. On the other hand, the regeneration rate before shields are breached is impressive thanks to excellent energy output; the Dragon feels underpowered by comparison. On the whole, the Serapis outguns the Dragon even when adjusted for sturdiness.

Target profile of either craft is excellent with a slight edge to the Serapis from my experience. Gun points are open to debate (decent for the Serapis; the Dragon's are quite bad when firing from both banks but the best in the game when giving up 11% of theoretical firepower by just using the triple bank). I for one would take the Dragon's any day.

On the whole, they are closely matched. I would prefer the Dragon when being shot down myself by enemy fighters is a major concern (the Serapis has the annoying tendency to blow up at the first mistake), the Serapis when I have to keep allies alive (killing anything with Shivan primaries takes ages. Doubly so if the targets are Shivan too) or there's a chance of being shot at by antifighter beams (very very bad news for most Shivan craft).

***

The Loki is just as fast as the Dragon, can control the distance thanks to more powerful afterburners and has a better power plant (very important since dogfights between agile yet well-shielded fighters can take some time). It will also last more than twice as long against 5 Shivan Heavy Lasers than a Dragon will against 4 Kaysers; this time the Dragon is solidly outgunned without any way to interpret the sturdiness/firepower comparison to its advantage.
The Dragon has the edge in target profile, gun points and manoeverability, and it is a pleasure to fly... but the Loki moves well enough that I can accept its shortcomings in exchange for almost 3 times the firepower.

***

@ nvsblmnc: Pretty much the only mix I like is Maxims + something against fighters, and that only in 6-gun craft (6 equal guns go to waste; same firepower as using just the 4-gun bank). Otherwise I like a double load of the heaviest weapon that doesn't use a prohibitive amount of energy.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 21, 2008, 08:49:38 am
You're completely forgetting rotational dampening and movement dampening. Those make a lot of difference. And slide movement isn't useless in the slightest - disable it if you don't believe me.

If you still think Dragons are useless, turn the difficulty up to Insane and fight a wing of them in a Loki.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Al Tarket on July 21, 2008, 09:01:02 am
Getting into a proper dogfight against a Dragon with an assault fighter isn't pleasant; if the opponent is any good it might be an exercise in futility. There is another option though: Standing still and pretending to be a gun turret negates any mobility advantage, and Shivan fighters don't have the firepower to slug it out like that. Unfortunately, coming to a full stop isn't advisable when under fire from several opponents.
standing still against a shivan fighter? the only way you can destroy a dragon with a disadvange is to turn away, yet that ship turn and come after you and you turn around quickly and catch that shivan with its pants down (if they have pants :P).
I consider, Dragons to be vastly overrated (i.e. I think it's good but hardly overpowered). People simply fly the wrong craft against them. Or maybe the craft are the right ones, and being able to fight Dragons on equal terms simply isn't the most important criterion for the mission. Let's compare the Shivan Dragon against its closest match in terms of manoeverability and the craft I consider the best overall dogfighter in the GTVA.
the closest if up against the best would be the Ulysses without any doubts.
First, let's pit the Serapis (widely regarded a useless craft) against the it. Flight characteristics are close - the Dragon wins on top speed with afterburners and is slightly more manoeverable, the Serapis effectively has almost twice the afterburner capacity though. About even, with a slight advantage to the Dragon (I never found the sliding too useful... others might disagree).
The serapis is useless, i never ever choose that fighter for anything :lol:.
Despite its much-criticized shielding, a Serapis will hold out longer against the Dragon's 5 Heavy Lasers  than the Dragon will against 4 Prometheus S... in other words, Shivan primaries suck even harder than Vasudan shields. Not that it's a major draw for close-in dogfighting, but the Serapis also has a generous missile capacity.
Endurance in a lengthy dogfight could go either way... the Serapis has the problem that more than half its damage capacity is made up of armour instead of shields - which doesn't regenerate. On the other hand, the regeneration rate before shields are breached is impressive thanks to excellent energy output; the Dragon feels underpowered by comparison. On the whole, the Serapis outguns the Dragon even when adjusted for sturdiness.
i have edited fs2o so i can pilot the shivan crafts, and by far the most manoeuvreable is the astaroth in my view. followed by the dragon, however the dragon is always a deceptive craft, to match two of the most manoeuvreable crafts in a fight, and your trying to track a dragon down with the highest setting, is very very difficult indeed.
Target profile of either craft is excellent with a slight edge to the Serapis from my experience. Gun points are open to debate (decent for the Serapis; the Dragon's are quite bad when firing from both banks but the best in the game when giving up 11% of theoretical firepower by just using the triple bank). I for one would take the Dragon's any day.
the dragon has the firepower to stand up to the enemy, you have one of them on your back and youll be waving bye bye to your serapis before long :P.
On the whole, they are closely matched. I would prefer the Dragon when being shot down myself by enemy fighters is a major concern (the Serapis has the annoying tendency to blow up at the first mistake), the Serapis when I have to keep allies alive (killing anything with Shivan primaries takes ages. Doubly so if the targets are Shivan too) or there's a chance of being shot at by antifighter beams (very very bad news for most Shivan craft).
serapis has the annoying habit of exploding before it enters a mission! so why goto all the trouble to compare the craft if the serapis cant even last before the fight begins :rolleyes:.
The Loki is just as fast as the Dragon, can control the distance thanks to more powerful afterburners and has a better power plant (very important since dogfights between agile yet well-shielded fighters can take some time). It will also last more than twice as long against 5 Shivan Heavy Lasers than a Dragon will against 4 Kaysers; this time the Dragon is solidly outgunned without any way to interpret the sturdiness/firepower comparison to its advantage.
The Dragon has the edge in target profile, gun points and manoeverability, and it is a pleasure to fly... but the Loki moves well enough that I can accept its shortcomings in exchange for almost 3 times the firepower.
if the herc can track a loki easy, i doubt these words are solid, however if you think the loki is as good as the dragon, so be it.
@ nvsblmnc: Pretty much the only mix I like is Maxims + something against fighters, and that only in 6-gun craft (6 equal guns go to waste; same firepower as using just the 4-gun bank). Otherwise I like a double load of the heaviest weapon that doesn't use a prohibitive amount of energy.
which is one of the drawbacks i said the erinyes has.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Rodo on July 21, 2008, 10:01:50 am
You're completely forgetting rotational dampening and movement dampening. Those make a lot of difference. And slide movement isn't useless in the slightest - disable it if you don't believe me.

If you still think Dragons are useless, turn the difficulty up to Insane and fight a wing of them in a Loki.


been there... do not recomend it, I would dare to say that 1 dragon should prove enought challenge on insane.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Iranon on July 21, 2008, 01:11:50 pm
@ Snail: I did plenty of tests... bottom line: Most dogfights that I find hard in a Loki I will also find hard in a Dragon. Usually harder.

@ Al Tarket:

Yes, a Serapis with a Dragon on its tail has a problem. The whole point of my comparison was to point out that exactly the same is true for the reverse and that the best weapons a Serapis can carry will destroy a Dragon faster than the other way 'round. As to the firepower... each and every Terran craft outguns the Dragon, including a Pegasus armed with Subachs.

If you consider light Vasudan craft like the Serapis not survivable enough for some missions, I agree - I stated as much. However, there might be others that would be unplayable in Shivan craft with Shivan weaponry (you might survive, but stand no chance completing the mission because you simply can't take down the opposition before they destroy something you are supposed to protect). Whether you need firepower or survivability depends on the mission, but I thought it quite useful to compare one craft's weaponry to a competitor's damage potential - and the result is that, as a rule, GTVA craft can chew through Shivan craft more quickly than the other way round... if they can hit them.

Re the Herc vs. Loki argument: It actually supports my claim if you think the Herc can fight a Loki with a reasonable chance of success: The difference in manoeverability is comparable to the one between the Loki and the Dragon. However, the Herc is slower, doesn't have an advantage in power output, is a big fat target and the edge it has in terms of 'effective firewpower' (firepower vs. opponent's ability to absorb damage) is considerably smaller than the one of the Loki vs. the Dragon.

I really think most light fighters can take on Dragons reasonably well; GTVA craft are generally well-balanced against one another. Personally I consider the Loki agile enough and prefer its comparatively heavy firepower. The Ulysses always makes me curse its inadequate power plant. However, if other players would prefer the Ulysses or Pegasus I have no objections: Even the Pegasus would outlast the Dragon in a head-on slugout and its sizable speed advantage and tiny target might more than offset the Dragon's incredible manoeverability.

***

All of this assumes the Terran craft are wielding the best weapons compatible with the craft - Kaysers for the Loki, Prometheus S for the other light fighters. With only standard issue weaponry available, I would indeed put my money on the Dragon against anything else.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mars on July 21, 2008, 01:14:48 pm
The Subach is much, much, better than shivan weaponry.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Droid803 on July 21, 2008, 01:23:56 pm
You don't want to face a SF Dragon that actually has decent weaponry.
By that, I mean giving Kaysers to Dragons. BAD END.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 21, 2008, 01:25:50 pm
The bad thing about the Shivans is their weaponry, which is piss weak.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Al Tarket on July 21, 2008, 04:06:18 pm
@ snails observation.

Suback HL-7
Code: [Select]
$Name:                                  @Subach HL-7
+Title:                                 XSTR("GTW Subach HL-7", 3243)
+Description:
XSTR(
"Standard Issue
Level 3 Hull Damage
Level 2 Shield Damage", 3244)
$end_multi_text
+Tech Title:     XSTR("Subach HL-7", 146)
+Tech Anim:                     Tech_Subach_HL-7
+Tech Description:
XSTR(
"The Subach-Innes HL-7 is a xaser weapon, firing an intense, highly focused beam of x-ray emissions. Until the Shivans appeared with their shield technology, these weapons were considered an unnecessary and costly extravagance. But Great War dogfights against Shivan craft quickly taught the Allies that their ships didn't stand a chance unless they could punch through shields. The HL-7 works superbly against shields of all varieties and has become the standard issue Primary weapon for all Terran fighters and bombers.", 3245)
$end_multi_text
$Model File: none
; The following fields (preceded by @) are only required for laser
; rendering, which requires that "Model File:" be none.
; These are the same values that used to be hard-coded:
@Laser Bitmap: newglo9
@Laser Glow: 2_laserglow03
@Laser Color: 250, 0, 0
@Laser Color2: 0, 0, 250
@Laser Length: 10.0
@Laser Head Radius: 0.90
@Laser Tail Radius: 0.90
$Mass: 0.2
$Velocity: 450.0 ;; speed of the weapon (initially) -- may or may not change
$Fire Wait: 0.2 ;; in seconds
$Damage: 15
$Armor Factor: 0.9
$Shield Factor: 0.7
$Subsystem Factor: 0.3
$Lifetime: 2.0 ;; How long this thing lives
$Energy Consumed: 0.20 ;; Energy used when fired
$Cargo Size: 0.0 ;; Amount of space taken up in weapon cargo
$Homing: NO
$LaunchSnd: 76 ;; The sound it makes when fired
$ImpactSnd: 85 ;; The sound it makes when it hits something
+Weapon Range: 100000 ;; Limit to range at which weapon will actively target object
$Flags: ("in tech database" "player allowed" "stream")
$Icon: iconSD4
$Anim: SD4
$Impact Explosion: none

Shivan Heavy Laser
Code: [Select]
$Name:                                  Shivan Heavy Laser
$Model File:                    none ;  laser1-1.pof
@Laser Bitmap:                  laserglow01
@Laser Glow:    2_laserglow03
@Laser Color:    200, 31, 30
@Laser Color2:    200, 31, 30
@Laser Length: 7.0
@Laser Head Radius: 0.90
@Laser Tail Radius: 0.30
$Mass: 0.2
$Velocity: 475.0                           ;; speed of the weapon (initially) -- may or may not change
$Fire Wait: 0.5                             ;; in seconds
$Damage: 15
$Armor Factor:                  1.0
$Shield Factor: 1.0
$Subsystem Factor: 1.0
$Lifetime: 2.0
$Energy Consumed:               0.40                            ;; Energy used when fired
$Cargo Size:                    0.0                             ;; Amount of space taken up in weapon cargo
$Homing: NO
$LaunchSnd:                     103                                     ;;      The sound it makes when fired
$ImpactSnd:                     85                                      ;; The sound it makes when it hits something
$Flags:                         ()
$Icon:                          icongun05
$Anim:                          LoadGun07
$Impact Explosion: none

no difference with exception to the half a second fire recharge rate compared to the quarter of a second.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 21, 2008, 04:19:09 pm
That's still an extremely large difference. Try hitting something with it.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Colonol Dekker on July 21, 2008, 04:22:26 pm
Subach = 2nd best after Kayser :nod:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Al Tarket on July 21, 2008, 04:25:36 pm
i did snail, it's a good weapon once you get around the fact it has a far more slower rate of fire then the subach.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 21, 2008, 05:19:03 pm
The Shivan's weaponry is weak because their Heavy Lasers are weaker than the lowest-grade GTVA weapon.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mars on July 21, 2008, 05:37:13 pm
Half the fire rate = half the firepower in this case, since they do identical damage.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 21, 2008, 05:57:15 pm
It's probably worse than half the $Damage: value because of the AI's inability to aim properly.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Droid803 on July 21, 2008, 06:13:54 pm
As I've said before, would you like to face Shivans armed with weapons superior to Kaysers like they supposedly are?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Jeff Vader on July 21, 2008, 06:21:41 pm
At least it would be challenging.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 21, 2008, 06:21:59 pm
As I've said before, would you like to face Shivans armed with weapons superior to Kaysers like they supposedly are?
No, but less useless weapons. The NTF had Subachs and Prometheus R lasers, and were a much bigger threat dogfighting-wise than the Shivans. But weaponry better than the Kayser is kind of overkill and a formula for frustration...
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Iranon on July 21, 2008, 07:00:54 pm
Why not ask that the Shivans bolt on some armour plates while we're at it? Or that Vasudans start installing some decent shields?

Weapon compatibility matters; otherwise we'll end up discussing an Osiris with BFReds in its turrets. I have no problem accepting that Shivan fighter weaponry is inferior (what I find harder to accept is that they use the same secondaries as the GTVA...).

The tech room description of the Kayser doesn't negate that to me; just because their technology is less effective doesn't mean it's less sophisticated, or that we can't learn something from it.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mars on July 21, 2008, 07:06:50 pm
The Shivan lasers are actually approximately as effective as the prometheus R
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Droid803 on July 21, 2008, 07:07:22 pm
The tech room description of the Kayser doesn't negate that to me; just because their technology is less effective doesn't mean it's less sophisticated, or that we can't learn something from it.

Well, its strange.
Why would you try to copy some advanced-yet-****ty tech when your own already surpasses theirs in effectiveness?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Akalabeth Angel on July 21, 2008, 07:23:14 pm
Subach = 2nd best after Kayser :nod:

Eh, I'll take a Mekhu over a Subach any day of the week.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 21, 2008, 07:24:59 pm
Yeah I agree.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Rodo on July 21, 2008, 07:35:04 pm
but what's the difference between those two??
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 21, 2008, 07:37:58 pm
The Mekhu fires a lot faster.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 21, 2008, 08:53:57 pm
Too bad Mekhus can only be mounted on Vasudan ships.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mars on July 21, 2008, 08:57:58 pm
I actually prefer the subach,  :nervous:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Droid803 on July 21, 2008, 09:22:16 pm
Why? The Mehku is better than the Subach at...everything the Subach is good at.
It spams more shots. Its got a longer range.

If you were looking good single-hit damage, you wouldn't be using a Subach.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on July 21, 2008, 10:06:12 pm
I'm not too sure. I don't use Subachs the moment I can choose between them and the Prometheus S or UD-8 Kayser.

I like the Ares because it's like a tank. To date, I an complete Exodus on Very Easy using only an Ares.

Quote from: What Alpha One might be thinking when he sees that he only has two wingmen and a damaged Vasudan corvette defending a freighter, two transports and a medical ship against over five waves of Shivan fighters and bombers, a Shivan corvette, and a Shivan cruiser
Now this really is sh*t...
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Akalabeth Angel on July 21, 2008, 10:31:45 pm
Too bad Mekhus can only be mounted on Vasudan ships.

     Too bad I have to spend most of my time flying Terran ships.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on July 21, 2008, 10:35:24 pm
     Too bad I have to spend most of my time flying Terran ships.

Oh yeah, that too...

I miss the Tauret. :(
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Droid803 on July 21, 2008, 11:10:05 pm
The Tauret's wimpy reactor can't handle them Kaysers. That's its downfall.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on July 22, 2008, 02:07:31 am
The Tauret's wimpy reactor can't handle them Kaysers. That's its downfall.

Yeah, but ignore that and you get the GTVA's thinnest heavy fighter with the largest missile banks. :drevil:

I'll choose that over the Herc II any day. In fact, I'll choose that over anything except an Erinyes, Ares, or Pegasus. ;)
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Al Tarket on July 22, 2008, 02:39:39 am
Yeah, but ignore that and you get the GTVA's thinnest heavy fighter with the largest missile banks. :drevil:

which is why i brought the tauret up when talking about the herc 2. 2 problems it has, manouvreability and weapon adabtability to weapons.

if your looking at the mekhu then i could take it over the subach any day.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mars on July 22, 2008, 04:11:00 am
The Herc II is in fact more maneuverable than the Tauret
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 22, 2008, 06:19:29 am
The Herc II is in fact more maneuverable than the Tauret
True dat.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Al Tarket on July 22, 2008, 06:24:23 am
maybe so, however you dont have much time within the tauret in the fs2 campaign. so make the most of it.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on July 22, 2008, 07:20:36 am
Actually, I found the Tauret to be a joy to fly. When I fly the Herc II, however, I feel a little depressed. Not sure why... :rolleyes:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Al Tarket on July 22, 2008, 08:40:58 am
maybe the speed of the herc2, i bet you give it 420ms as a max speed you wont be depressed then :lol:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: terran_emperor on July 22, 2008, 10:04:59 am
Erinyes armed with double Kaysers and Harpoons and Trebs = Killing Machine
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: General Battuta on July 22, 2008, 11:20:43 am
The Tauret's wimpy reactor can't handle them Kaysers. That's its downfall.

Yeah, but ignore that and you get the GTVA's thinnest heavy fighter with the largest missile banks. :drevil:

I'll choose that over the Herc II any day. In fact, I'll choose that over anything except an Erinyes, Ares, or Pegasus. ;)

I love the Tauret. With those huge missile banks, it's a veritable 'poon machine!
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Admiral_Stones on July 22, 2008, 01:05:02 pm
Never though that the cheap piece of crap the NTF sends in dozens of waves at you and get slaughtered like nothing else (a.k.a. Loki) would get my favorite craft. I've never ever tried it until shortly, and it really IS A ****ING JOY TO FLY, at least when no capships are near. Even when carrying only eight harpoons, can't wait to fly it when my Saitek Cyborg EVO comes in :cool:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Colonol Dekker on July 22, 2008, 06:59:56 pm
Teh Loki was my favourite in the gap between Silent threat and FreeSpace 2. :yes: back to the subach mekhu discussion, i prefer the Subach because it's not a stinking Zod weapon. (As if people haven't guessed i just don't like Vasudans :ick:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: colecampbell666 on July 22, 2008, 08:38:14 pm
Colonel Aken Tigh Dekker.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Colonol Dekker on July 23, 2008, 03:03:54 am
I like it :yes:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on July 23, 2008, 03:04:54 am
Colonel Aken Tigh Dekker.
/me almost puked.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 23, 2008, 05:22:21 am
Teh Loki was my favourite in the gap between Silent threat and FreeSpace 2. :yes: back to the subach mekhu discussion, i prefer the Subach because it's not a stinking Zod weapon. (As if people haven't guessed i just don't like Vasudans :ick:
Why you no likey?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Colonol Dekker on July 23, 2008, 05:25:45 am
They smell like cat litter, i dunno lol. First impressions stick with me, and FS1 taught me They are the frakkin enemy :yes:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 23, 2008, 05:34:13 am
Did they take your head?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Colonol Dekker on July 23, 2008, 05:41:07 am
Not for lack of trying.....

Plusy they walk around too nekkid all the time, god help anyone who has to attend a command briefing on the Psamtik. No wonder we messed up conversation causing a war, imagine trying to remember alien language while they are blankly smiling with alien wing-wang all aover the place.


stupid zods.. :mad:

]

Anyway, I fancy making an Erinyes Mk 2 :nod: that would be pretty sweet...
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 23, 2008, 06:21:37 am
16 gun mounts ? =P
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 23, 2008, 06:22:46 am
16 gun mounts ? =P
The Keres from INFR1 has that.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on July 23, 2008, 08:07:19 am
The Keres from INFR1 has that.

Ah yes, I like the Keres...but that's only because I have a preference for very heavy fighters... :drevil:

To be perfectly honest, I've never even flown in an Artemis before.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on July 23, 2008, 11:33:14 am
o_O Never flown in an Artemis? What about in the FS2 campaign?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: MT on July 23, 2008, 11:39:25 am
o_O Never flown in an Artemis? What about in the FS2 campaign?

He probably used something else. Bakha is the only bomber forced upon you during the campaign.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 23, 2008, 12:58:02 pm
And you never get to fly the Sekhmet, which is definitely the best bomber in the ****ing game.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Colonol Dekker on July 23, 2008, 06:43:29 pm
And you never get to fly the Sekhmet, which is definitely the best bomber in the ****ing game.

Absolutley bang on perfect statement. :yes:

*carves a tick in the side of Snails shell*
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 23, 2008, 06:45:09 pm
I can't help but notice you still have the swearing filter on. Any reason why?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Colonol Dekker on July 23, 2008, 06:47:41 pm
Me? I never bothered changing the settings and i'm big enough and ugly enough to work it out :)
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on July 24, 2008, 01:13:09 am
I only use the GTB Ursa and GVB Bakha during the main campaign. The Artemis is too small and has no turret, the Boanerges has no turret, the Medusa has only two gunpoints...
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: terran_emperor on July 24, 2008, 02:13:00 am
The Ursa is my favorite bomber.

Sure it handles like a cow, but i pick payload/firepower over manouverability anyday in a bomber.

BTW i can't believe im saying this but...i agree with Mobius about the Seraphim being almost the ideal bomber for the reasons he stated
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Al Tarket on July 24, 2008, 02:53:59 am
seraphim...  :lol:, it's so big i can't miss it. it wouldnt be wise to choose the seraphim just for pure loadout, in the end you might need the manouvreability espeically when you choose a hard setting or atleast 6 fighters are shooting at you from the rear, despite your turret. by the way, never choose the medusa, the turret on that bomber is... weird.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on July 24, 2008, 02:57:29 am
seraphim...  :lol:, it's so big i can't miss it. it wouldnt be wise to choose the seraphim just for pure loadout, in the end you might need the manouvreability espeically when you choose a hard setting or atleast 6 fighters are shooting at you from the rear, despite your turret. by the way, never choose the medusa, the turret on that bomber is... weird.

I haven't tried flying one yet. However, as I've just reached The Great Hunt, I can see that the Seraphim is quite a palaver to fly. Although they are arguably the strongest bombers in the entire game, they are also quite slow. In addition, they have no afterburner, and I use ABs excessively.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 24, 2008, 07:39:13 am
What Mobius was saying was that bombers should be ULTRA ULTRA ULTRA ULTRA ULTRA heavy like the Seraphim, which I think is complete bollocks. I really wouldn't like flying an ULTRA ULTRA ULTRA ULTRA ULTRA unmaneuverable ship (like the Seraphim).

Try flying the Seraphim against an Aeolus. You get killed by its flak and its AAA, but the real funny thing is you can't dodge the Terran Huge Turrets. :lol:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Droid803 on July 24, 2008, 11:35:55 am
Try flying the Seraphim against an Aeolus. You get killed by its flak and its AAA, but the real funny thing is you can't dodge the Terran Huge Turrets. :lol:

What's really bollocks is that the THT's will go straight through your shield mesh to the front :lol:
So you die twice as fast.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Al Tarket on July 24, 2008, 12:08:53 pm
which just adds more to my point about manouvreability :P
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Droid803 on July 24, 2008, 01:31:32 pm
Payload is worthless if you don't make it to your target.
Give the Seraphim an afterburner, and fix its shield mesh. Then it becomes a good bomber. As it stands, its a threat as an AI because it just has to warp in and splashs your convoy with some helios, usually dying in the process (not that it matters as they come in waves). If you have to survive a bombing mission, I wouldn't choose a Seraphim.

I'd take a Sekhmet or a Nahema.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 24, 2008, 02:47:50 pm
Yeah, so the Seraphim is not the ideal bomber, is it?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Rodo on July 24, 2008, 03:02:49 pm
go medusa!!
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on July 25, 2008, 08:43:41 am
What Mobius was saying was that bombers should be ULTRA ULTRA ULTRA ULTRA ULTRA heavy like the Seraphim, which I think is complete bollocks. I really wouldn't like flying an ULTRA ULTRA ULTRA ULTRA ULTRA unmaneuverable ship (like the Seraphim).

Try flying the Seraphim against an Aeolus. You get killed by its flak and its AAA, but the real funny thing is you can't dodge the Terran Huge Turrets. :lol:

It's not a spacecraft if it can't dodge a Terran Huge Turret... :wtf:

I like heavily armoured ships, yes, but the reason why I still prefer fighters to bombers is because fighters are faster. Between the Ursa and the Ares, I'll take the latter.

Any Shivan who attempts to take on an Aeolus in a Seraphim is screaming, "KILL ME!" at 300 decibels.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: colecampbell666 on July 25, 2008, 09:44:23 am
Whenever I dogfight in multi, I use a Sekhmet with Morning Stars and Rockeyes, and I pwn.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mars on July 25, 2008, 09:45:37 am
The Fenris could probably dodge THTs, not certain though.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Droid803 on July 25, 2008, 11:02:39 am
With its measly 20m/s? No way.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: colecampbell666 on July 25, 2008, 11:04:54 am
30 m/s
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mars on July 25, 2008, 11:07:41 am
20 ms-1, but it's by far the most maneuverable large ship in the game.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Droid803 on July 25, 2008, 11:08:37 am
Well, if you count it swinging around, the Colossus could "dodge" THT fire...baseball bat style.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: ShadowGorrath on July 25, 2008, 11:26:49 am
The Aeolus is faster
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mars on July 25, 2008, 11:31:10 am
I know, but maneuverability =/= speed.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Admiral_Stones on July 25, 2008, 12:13:32 pm
What Mobius was saying was that bombers should be ULTRA ULTRA ULTRA ULTRA ULTRA heavy like the Seraphim, which I think is complete bollocks. I really wouldn't like flying an ULTRA ULTRA ULTRA ULTRA ULTRA unmaneuverable ship (like the Seraphim).

Try flying the Seraphim against an Aeolus. You get killed by its flak and its AAA, but the real funny thing is you can't dodge the Terran Huge Turrets. :lol:

It's not a spacecraft if it can't dodge a Terran Huge Turret... :wtf:

I like heavily armoured ships, yes, but the reason why I still prefer fighters to bombers is because fighters are faster. Between the Ursa and the Ares, I'll take the latter.

Any Shivan who attempts to take on an Aeolus in a Seraphim is screaming, "KILL ME!" at 300 decibels.

Whooo... 300 dB is quite ****ing loud. Actually over twenty times as loud as a Jackhammer.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Colonol Dekker on July 25, 2008, 04:17:20 pm
Cole. . . . Next time you use a Sekhmet. Use maxims and morning stars. See the difference.:yes: 4k range is all good.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: NGTM-1R on July 25, 2008, 04:22:50 pm
20 ms-1, but it's by far the most maneuverable large ship in the game.

'cept the Bravos.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Colonol Dekker on July 25, 2008, 10:04:40 pm
If you wanna fly a Bravo you need to learn to gold your breath for quite a while though. .
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: terran_emperor on July 25, 2008, 10:29:35 pm
 :wtf: You mean "Hold your breath"....

If i could "Gold" my breath, i'd have enough money to have bought out :v: a long time agoand made a Foxtrot Sierra Terrathree that would be compatible with campaigns like Derelict, INF SCP + A, Blue Planet and some of the other good ones  :pimp:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Colonol Dekker on July 25, 2008, 10:37:49 pm
Text on my predict'o'phone tends to slip up once every three hundred words or so :lol:
Late night or early morning?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on July 29, 2008, 07:06:13 pm
:bump:

I just used the Erinyes on Blue Planet, and I must admit that it is quite a nice ship to fly. However, is it better than flying an Ares in Exodus in the main campaign?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Akalabeth Angel on July 29, 2008, 07:43:15 pm
:bump:

I just used the Erinyes on Blue Planet, and I must admit that it is quite a nice ship to fly. However, is it better than flying an Ares in Exodus in the main campaign?

      The Ares is cool in Apocalypse(?) until the nova hits and you acutally have to move in a hurry. Then you're dead. In my experience anyway . . . just can't move that darn thing fast enough.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on July 29, 2008, 09:36:01 pm
      The Ares is cool in Apocalypse(?) until the nova hits and you acutally have to move in a hurry. Then you're dead. In my experience anyway . . . just can't move that darn thing fast enough.

Yes, it's called Apocalypse. Here's a tip from Interplay that I remember:

At the eleven-minute mark, fly towards the jump node to Vega and wait there. Jump out when Capella goes supernova.

One more thing: When you're in a rush, divert all power to engines. On faster fighters (e.g. stealth fighters), even the Shivans will have problems catching up.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: haloboy100 on July 30, 2008, 12:21:21 am
In that mission I just sit at the node with time compression set to max and wait till the nova hits. No debriefing means no punishment for making the transports die :D
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: ShadowGorrath on July 30, 2008, 04:57:14 am
I use a Perseus. Fastest fighter.

But last time I played that mission, I still died. Because the Shivans drove me farther away from the node than I already was. And the best part was that I reached the node when there were 5 seconds left.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on July 30, 2008, 05:43:17 am
In that mission I just sit at the node with time compression set to max and wait till the nova hits. No debriefing means no punishment for making the transports die :D

Yeah. The only thing that makes life uncomfortable is Command's whining. Pity you can't turn him off. :doubt:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 30, 2008, 05:44:19 am
End this slaughter now, pilots!
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on July 30, 2008, 05:48:31 am
End this slaughter now, pilots!

Yes, that. I've never heard it in-game, but I've heard it using VPVIEW32, and it sounds corny. :rolleyes:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: haloboy100 on July 30, 2008, 11:19:14 am
It's almost as if :v: is constantly *****ing at you to get out there for the very reason to get you roasted in the nova.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: General Battuta on July 30, 2008, 11:50:40 am
Works, too. I never try to escape -- just keep on defending those transports. It feels like a more heroic way to end the game.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Akalabeth Angel on July 30, 2008, 12:43:06 pm
Works, too. I never try to escape -- just keep on defending those transports. It feels like a more heroic way to end the game.

        I do that sometimes too. First time it happened, I ran. 80 Juggernauts around the sun, I knew there must've been a supernova coming. I think I made it the first time. Not sure. Since then there's been plenty of times that I've failed.

       
        But regardless, I never get within 2 or 3 km until the Nova hits. If you're not playing the mission, what's the point of playing at all? If all a person does is parks their fighter and watches what happens, why not just quit freespace and put in a movie instead? You'll be doing the same thing, not participating, but at least it'll be entertaining to watch.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Excalibur on July 30, 2008, 08:44:43 pm
Pity you don't have a video camera in your fighter.

At least you can use the one behind it, and zoom way out 'till it's in the battle. Or view from some fighters that aren't "a cowarr..."  ;7
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on July 31, 2008, 02:06:03 am
I just got supernova'd in Apocalypse while flying the Ares... :drevil:

Oh, by the way, Command said, "End this slaughter now, pilots!" However, he said it in a manner that sounds like a guy taking a drink and reading a book while watching some bombers hit a Leviathan with 8 Cyclops and watch its hull fall from 94% to 12%.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: haloboy100 on July 31, 2008, 11:18:34 am
Isn't that what he sounds like in most of his orders anyway?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 31, 2008, 11:21:38 am
Isn't that what he sounds like in most of his orders anyway?
One of the most scary things I remember about command was what he said during King's Gambit. A Deimos is supposed to have something like 7,000 people onboard, right? So when I blew up the Perseverance, 7,000 people just died a fiery, horrible death... And what does Command do? He starts rhyming! ("The Perseverance is no more, that's what you flyboys get paid for!")
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: General Battuta on July 31, 2008, 11:46:29 am
Isn't that what he sounds like in most of his orders anyway?

...I always thought the voice acting for Command was pretty good...
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: haloboy100 on July 31, 2008, 12:05:44 pm
The true motives of command will never be revealed...
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on July 31, 2008, 12:15:21 pm
Isn't that what he sounds like in most of his orders anyway?

...I always thought the voice acting for Command was pretty good...

Actually, I think so too. Here and there, I imitate his "Incoming jump signature! Hostile configuration!" :)
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on July 31, 2008, 12:37:57 pm
The true motives of command will never be revealed...
They will be in my campaign... Which isn't really my campaign at all... Which I should be FREDding for... :nervous:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: haloboy100 on July 31, 2008, 02:18:34 pm
[reallybadjoke]Looks like that campaign is running at a snail's pace![/reallybadjoke]
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on July 31, 2008, 11:31:24 pm
Is the Loki a good ship to fly?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on August 01, 2008, 12:33:25 am
[reallybadjoke]Looks like that campaign is running at a snail's pace![/reallybadjoke]
A Snail who is on dope, but yeah.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: nvsblmnc on August 01, 2008, 01:40:17 am
Is the Loki a good ship to fly?
Yes.  You'll need to work for your kills, but it's one of the most responsive ships in the game, and only a handful of fighters are faster.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: bfobar on August 04, 2008, 12:25:11 am
I like the flight characteristics of the myrm. It's a good all-rounder and I never seem to run out of power like in the eyrines. My fighting style is usually to close distance quickly and then swing in behind the ship, shoot the rear shield off, and then put tempests or interceptors up the tail pipe while still shooting.

Sure the eyrines and aeres have the best firepower hands down, but I'd rather take a myrm or a perseus and boost the engines so that I can zip around the battle. That always seems more useful in a dog fight. The mission with the herc II vs maras etc coming through the knossos is maddeningly hard for me because of the speed disadvantage (comparatively)

I've played online and I get spanked by people using eyrines with maxims and flails because they just sit there using mouse aiming and act like turrets, but I just can't bring myself to play like that.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on August 04, 2008, 05:18:17 am
I like the flight characteristics of the myrm. It's a good all-rounder and I never seem to run out of power like in the eyrines. My fighting style is usually to close distance quickly and then swing in behind the ship, shoot the rear shield off, and then put tempests or interceptors up the tail pipe while still shooting.

Sure the eyrines and aeres have the best firepower hands down, but I'd rather take a myrm or a perseus and boost the engines so that I can zip around the battle. That always seems more useful in a dog fight. The mission with the herc II vs maras etc coming through the knossos is maddeningly hard for me because of the speed disadvantage (comparatively)

I've played online and I get spanked by people using eyrines with maxims and flails because they just sit there using mouse aiming and act like turrets, but I just can't bring myself to play like that.

Try using a different fighter. The Myrmidon has a fairly huge target profile, so it's easy to hit. If you want to run rings around slower fighters, try a Loki, Perseus, or Pegasus.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Akalabeth Angel on August 04, 2008, 02:44:49 pm
Try using a different fighter. The Myrmidon has a fairly huge target profile, so it's easy to hit. If you want to run rings around slower fighters, try a Loki, Perseus, or Pegasus.

     The myrm's got a brutal climb rate too. And I'm used to climbing when I pursue a fighter myself.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mars on August 04, 2008, 03:08:49 pm
Climb infers that there's an up  :confused:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Jeff Vader on August 04, 2008, 03:13:57 pm
Most certainly (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Climb).
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mars on August 04, 2008, 03:17:26 pm
Yes, but what is he talking about the Myrmidons "climb rate" for?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Jeff Vader on August 04, 2008, 03:20:51 pm
Idunno. Maybe he needs to increase his "altitude" when pursuing hostile fighters.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Akalabeth Angel on August 04, 2008, 03:35:36 pm
     Er, people. The fighters rotate at different speeds in different directions, and if you pull back in the stick in a Myrmidon, which is essentially climbing in any other aerial combat game, you would realize that the things moves as slow as dirt because it has a rotational factor of 4.0 or 5.0 whereas moving to the sides is about half of that.

     That's a pretty easy concept to grasp I would think.
     There's no real up/down north/south/east/west on a planet anymore than there is in space anyway. Being on a planet only makes the relativity of objects much more obvious. In a solar system like Sol, one could argue that there's an up or a down based upon the plane that the planets are rotating on for example. With the appropriate landmarks directions become more obvious, but all things are essentially relative.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mars on August 04, 2008, 04:16:07 pm
Well yes I understand that... but it would apply to diving as well... therefore vertical rotation would be a better term.

That's why in virtually all fighters it's better to roll and rotate to the side, this is especially true with the Ulysses.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on August 04, 2008, 07:59:19 pm
It's called pitching, I think. Pitch forward is turn down, pitch backward is turn up.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: BengalTiger on August 04, 2008, 09:15:13 pm
Is the Loki a good ship to fly?

"Love the Treason...", Loki with heat seekers, speed high, and tossing a missile at each Herc I while it charges at you does magic (read target practice while being almost untouchable after a small practice session).

Here heat seekers are even more magic than Aspect seekers in this mission, because you have to fly straight for 1-2 seconds to get a lock, making it easier for the Hercs, and a heat seeker can hit a target that flies straight at you with ease.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: bfobar on August 04, 2008, 09:18:30 pm
Try using a different fighter. The Myrmidon has a fairly huge target profile, so it's easy to hit. If you want to run rings around slower fighters, try a Loki, Perseus, or Pegasus.

     The myrm's got a brutal climb rate too. And I'm used to climbing when I pursue a fighter myself.

yeah pitch rate is great. I like the perseus a lot too, but if I need more primary firepower and shields, I'll take the myrm. (It's like... Space superiority vs interceptor roles!)
'
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on August 04, 2008, 10:00:26 pm
yeah pitch rate is great. I like the perseus a lot too, but if I need more primary firepower and shields, I'll take the myrm. (It's like... Space superiority vs interceptor roles!)
He was being sacarstic. IIRC, the myrmidon handles like a potato. And if I needed more primary firepower and shields, I'd just grab a Herc2.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on August 04, 2008, 10:29:55 pm
Speak for yourself, Storm. I'd prefer the Myrmidon to the Horus.

I've just done the first few missions of The Procyon Insurgency, and I find myself flying the Serapis over the Thoth and Horus.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: eliex on August 04, 2008, 10:33:27 pm
A Myrmidon makes its "potatoness" for its strength. Most of the time, a Myrm hit by dual Trebs or Tornados will live unlike ships like the Eryines.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on August 04, 2008, 10:41:25 pm
A Myrmidon makes its "potatoness" for its strength. Most of the time, a Myrm hit by dual Trebs or Tornados will live unlike ships like the Eryines.

:wtf:

But the tech description says that the Myrmidon has average Armor. How can it survive dual Trebuchets if an Erinyes cannot?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on August 04, 2008, 10:43:50 pm
Speak for yourself, Storm. I'd prefer the Myrmidon to the Horus.

I've just done the first few missions of The Procyon Insurgency, and I find myself flying the Serapis over the Thoth and Horus.
Cuz the Serapis are 1337 Haxx0r !!

A Myrmidon makes its "potatoness" for its strength. Most of the time, a Myrm hit by dual Trebs or Tornados will live unlike ships like the Eryines.
Its not a problem if you don't get hit. Countermeasures + noticing a pair of missiles coming at you from long range = dodgability.

And besides, the Eryines wins in bother shields and armour.

:wtf:

But the tech description says that the Myrmidon has average Armor. How can it survive dual Trebuchets if an Erinyes cannot?
Exaxctly! Look at the table entries.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: bfobar on August 04, 2008, 11:22:21 pm
So are we arguing this because the ship we like to fly must obviously be the best at dogfighting and therefore everyone else is wrong?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on August 05, 2008, 01:09:34 am
Nope. I'm just saying if the Eryines can't survive a dual Treb hit, then neither can the Myrmidon.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on August 05, 2008, 01:37:08 am
Nope. I'm just saying if the Eryines can't survive a dual Treb hit, then neither can the Myrmidon.

Hey! That's my line!
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: eliex on August 05, 2008, 02:37:27 am
A Myrmidon makes its "potatoness" for its strength. Most of the time, a Myrm hit by dual Trebs or Tornados will live unlike ships like the Eryines.

:wtf:

But the tech description says that the Myrmidon has average Armor. How can it survive dual Trebuchets if an Erinyes cannot?

 I really have no idea. OK, I just see Myrms in Derelict all the time getting smacking head-on with Tornados (or Trebs) and, well although on 10-20% health, they are still alive.     :eek:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on August 05, 2008, 06:38:02 am
Reactive/reflective armour maybe.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on August 05, 2008, 07:14:29 am
Perhaps it's a feature of having a loose shield system. Note that if you compared the shield quadrants of an Erinyes to a Myrmidon's, the Erinyes' is armour-tight. Shields absorb damage, but they can't absorb everything, so perhaps the extra damage that they can't absorb gets transferred into the substance adjacent to it. In the Erinyes, it's its hull; in the Myrmidon, it's vacuum or thin air.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mars on August 05, 2008, 10:55:07 am
I personally have never seen a Myrmidon survive dual trebs... and I swear I played through all of Derelict.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: blowfish on August 05, 2008, 01:29:14 pm
It's probably just a matter of evasion.  The Myrmidon is faster and smaller, so it is more likely to not suffer a direct hit.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Akalabeth Angel on August 05, 2008, 02:52:56 pm
    Maybe only one of the Trebs actually hit. Just because two are fired doesn't mean they both hit the mark.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: BengalTiger on August 05, 2008, 08:28:36 pm
Erynies (Myrmidon in brackets):

$Max Velocity:               0.0, 0.0, 65.0    (75.0)
$Rotation time:               3.8, 4.2, 3.8   (4.0, 3.7, 5)
$SBank Capacity:            ( 40, 50 )   [ 20, 20, 40 ]
$Shields:                  500   (390)
$Power Output:               3.3    (2.4)
$Max Oclk Speed:            70.0        (95.0)
$Max Weapon Eng:            150.0      (150.0)
$Hitpoints:                     325      ( 290 )
$Afterburner:               YES
   +Aburn Max Vel:            0.0, 0.0, 130.0 (135.0)
   +Aburn For accel:         0.75  (0.8)
   +Aburn Fuel:            420.0 (320.0)
   +Aburn Burn Rate:         55.0 (60.0)
   +Aburn Rec Rate:         29.0 (25.0)
$Countermeasures:            25  (36)

I seriously don't know how a Myrm could survive what an Erynies can't.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Droid803 on August 05, 2008, 10:41:35 pm
Woah. An Erinyes is actually more maneuverable than a Murmidon on two out of three rotation rates! Never knew that.
Also, the Erinyes has a better afterburn. Its 5m/s slower, but it has more fuel, consumes less fuel, and recharges faster (?).
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on August 06, 2008, 12:09:27 am
Yeah, the Erinyes is a pretty maneuverable fighter. It's good for dogfighting and stuff, too.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: bfobar on August 06, 2008, 12:46:00 am
The Erinyes is just so powerful though, especially since you can give it maxims and keysers usually for loadout. Laughing maniacally and wiping out 100 wings of mantacores gets old after the 20th or so wave. I want suspense! I need a new joystick so I can play the FSPort and enjoy the valk again.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on August 06, 2008, 12:50:41 am
The Erinyes is just so powerful though, especially since you can give it maxims and keysers usually for loadout. Laughing maniacally and wiping out 100 wings of mantacores gets old after the 20th or so wave. I want suspense! I need a new joystick so I can play the FSPort and enjoy the valk again.
Valkyries were pretty cool fighters, but I liked the Apollo more.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Droid803 on August 06, 2008, 12:56:52 am
The Valk had an absolutely wonderfully long afterburn time...and an excellent top burn speed of 160m/s. Pity the AI phails using it...and drop like flies. I tried to like the Apollo, I really did, but it kept falling apart faster than a Valk (when I pilot it)...so I ended up taking the Valk whenever a could for FSPort. If not, then a Medusa. I actually managed to play intercept in one of those (Doomsday)...and another time while playing some mission in S:AH. I tried to avoid the Herc due to its shield mesh errors (only present in HTL).

Yeah, I probably just suck.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on August 06, 2008, 12:59:09 am
The Apollo was better than the Myrmidon IMO, but that's just me (pull out all the statistics you can, I'll never like the Myrmidon more than the Apollo).
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: bfobar on August 06, 2008, 01:04:24 am
Visually the Apollo is much sexier. What else matters in single player, really?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Droid803 on August 06, 2008, 01:05:49 am
Apollo (Myrmidon)
Values taken from FSPORT.

$Max Velocity: 0.0, 0.0, 60.0  (75.0)
$Rotation time: 3.2, 3.2, 6.0 (4.0, 3.7, 5)
$SBank Capacity: ( 40, 40 ) [ 20, 20, 40 ]
$Shields: 350  (390)
$Power Output: 2.0 (2.4)
$Max Oclk Speed: 82.0 (95.0)
$Max Weapon Eng: 100.0  (150.0)
$Hitpoints: 240 ( 290 )
$Afterburner: YES
   +Aburn Max Vel: 0.0, 0.0, 140.0 (135.0)
   +Aburn For accel: 0.7 (0.8)
   +Aburn Fuel: 300.0 (320.0)
   +Aburn Burn Rate: 50.0 (60.0)
   +Aburn Rec Rate: 25.0 (25.0)
$Countermeasures: 25 (36)

I'd say they're pretty even.
The Myrm is faster normally, but the Apollo burns faster. The apollo uses less fuel, but also holds less fuel. They have the same secondary capacity, but the Apollo has less weapons energy.
The Apollo handles better (expect in that last value), but has slightly weaker in terms of shield and hull strength (by 40 points each).
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: peterv on August 06, 2008, 02:04:33 am
Visually the Apollo is much sexier. What else matters in single player, really?

Can you define that please?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: FreeSpaceFreak on August 06, 2008, 02:19:34 am
Apollo (Myrmidon)
Values taken from FSPORT.

-data-

I'd say they're pretty even.
The Myrm is faster normally, but the Apollo burns faster. The Apollo uses less fuel, but also holds less fuel. They have the same secondary capacity, but the Apollo has less weapons energy.
The Apollo handles better (expect in that last value), but has slightly weaker in terms of shield and hull strength (by 40 points each).
The Myrm has a quad gun bank, a decisive advantage IMHO.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mars on August 06, 2008, 02:28:09 am
The Myrmidon has significant advantages in primary firepower, and are entirely comparable in every other way.

The Myrmidon does have a larger target profile.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on August 06, 2008, 02:56:10 am
he Myrm has a quad gun bank, a decisive advantage IMHO.
The Eyrines has two, and a small rear target profile. But come at it from the side, and its as long as a limousine.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mars on August 06, 2008, 02:58:18 am
he Myrm has a quad gun bank, a decisive advantage IMHO.
The Eyrines has two, and a small rear target profile. But come at it from the side, and its as long as a limousine.

This is a comparison to the Apollo
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: bfobar on August 06, 2008, 03:03:29 am
Visually the Apollo is much sexier. What else matters in single player, really?

Can you define that please?

I want to rub the HTL Apollo's leg and talk it into coming back to my hotel room?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: peterv on August 06, 2008, 03:10:03 am
 :)
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on August 06, 2008, 03:33:52 am
This is a comparison to the Apollo
Ah, my bad. The Apollo is more manuevuerable tho, compared to the Myrmy.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Akalabeth Angel on August 06, 2008, 03:58:00 am
The Valk had an absolutely wonderfully long afterburn time...and an excellent top burn speed of 160m/s. Pity the AI phails using it...and drop like flies. I tried to like the Apollo, I really did, but it kept falling apart faster than a Valk (when I pilot it)...so I ended up taking the Valk whenever a could for FSPort. If not, then a Medusa. I actually managed to play intercept in one of those (Doomsday)...and another time while playing some mission in S:AH. I tried to avoid the Herc due to its shield mesh errors (only present in HTL).

Yeah, I probably just suck.

       The Valk sucks, take a few hits on the nose and your comm system goes down in seconds. Drove me nuts everytime I flew the bloody thing. I'd take an Athena any time I could . . . or something better than a Valk anyway.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Iranon on August 06, 2008, 05:07:55 am
The mere fact that we are comparing the Myrmidon against a thoroughly obsolete fighter is worrying. The advantages the Apollo has over the Perseus (afterburner, yaw&pitch rate) are so small they are barely perceptible and offset several times over by the Perseus' higher speed alone, never mind the small benefits.

The Myrmidon is a multi-role craft; the Ulysses is still Terran's only craft that deserves its designation of space superiority fighter (although the Loki is also one in all but name).
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Rodo on August 06, 2008, 07:36:54 am
ohh lovely lovely loki ^^
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on August 06, 2008, 07:38:16 am
The Loki has a very nice front. You don't see that on any other GTVA fighter. :drevil:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on August 06, 2008, 07:49:54 am
The Loki has a very nice front. You don't see that on any other GTVA fighter. :drevil:
What, the chompers? I never liked that, made it seem like a mercenary fighter.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on August 06, 2008, 08:07:17 am
It's unique.

The Ares reminds me of a Herc II with its outer armour removed and some fins attached to the sides of each engine.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on August 06, 2008, 08:13:25 am
The Ares reminds me of a Herc II with its outer armour removed and some fins attached to the sides of each engine.
And is that a bad thing?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on August 06, 2008, 09:03:32 am
The Ares reminds me of a Herc II with its outer armour removed and some fins attached to the sides of each engine.
And is that a bad thing?

Aesthetic-wise, yes. It's a nice ship to fly, but it's not very pretty.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on August 06, 2008, 09:35:09 am
Aesthetic-wise, yes. It's a nice ship to fly, but it's not very pretty.
I always thought it looked good... Guess I must be the only one.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on August 06, 2008, 11:00:55 am
I always thought it looked good... Guess I must be the only one.
I just think it needs a better color scheme than maroon/rust red.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Rodo on August 06, 2008, 02:51:15 pm
the ares is the real fighting peacock (fs2 version of course) XD
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mars on August 06, 2008, 05:06:21 pm
The Ares looks like a Herc II that sold its soul to the devil, and transformed.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Kie99 on August 06, 2008, 05:48:21 pm
It's unique.

The Ares reminds me of a Herc II with its outer armour removed and some fins attached to the sides of each engine.

That's exactly what it is, a 3rd generation Herc.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: bfobar on August 06, 2008, 06:02:13 pm
I always though of the herc ii as a second generation apollo with the 4 gun banks and average maneuverability.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mars on August 06, 2008, 06:30:56 pm
The Persues and the Myrmidon are closer to 2nd generation Apollos.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on August 06, 2008, 11:59:56 pm
The Perseus is a second-generation Valkyrie. :blah:
The Myrmidon is NOT the second-generation Apollo. :wtf:
The Herc II is the second-generation Hercules, while the Ares is the third. :blah:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on August 07, 2008, 01:16:14 am
The Persues and the Myrmidon are closer to 2nd generation Apollos.
:blah:

Where'd you get that idea?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on August 07, 2008, 01:34:09 am
The Persues and the Myrmidon are closer to 2nd generation Apollos.
I see 0% connection between the Perseus and the Apollo. I have no idea where you got that from, except perhaps the vaguely aerodynamic shape (in comparison to the other fighters). The fact that the Myrmidon is a Space Superiority fighter doesn't mean it's a second generation Apollo. It looks completely different, and surely wasn't designed off the Apollo in any way.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mars on August 07, 2008, 01:38:53 am
Because other than speed, the Persues and the Apollo are extremely similar
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on August 07, 2008, 01:44:09 am
I don't think that the Perseus was based on the Apollo, though it may have been.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on August 07, 2008, 01:49:28 am
I don't think that the Perseus was based on the Apollo, though it may have been.

Perhaps it's base frame was taken off the Valkyrie, but implemented some bits of the Apollo. There's that "Average" Armor rating to think about. The Valkyrie had "Light" Armor.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on August 07, 2008, 01:51:56 am
Come to think of it, the Perseus looks like a kinda Apollo-Valkyrie hybrid with bits stuck on it. So I see where Mars is coming from.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on August 07, 2008, 02:10:43 am
I'm looking at FS Wiki's articles on the Apollo, Perseus and Valkyrie now, and I just noticed that the Perseus' cockpit looks quite similar to that of the Apollo. :eek2:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on August 07, 2008, 02:13:31 am
Because other than speed, the Persues and the Apollo are extremely similar
Then what about the Mrymi. How does that and the Apollo click?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: FreeSpaceFreak on August 07, 2008, 02:26:27 am
Both standard Space Sup fighters. Though the Myrm is not a technical successor of the Apollo, they do fulfill the same role.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on August 07, 2008, 02:34:47 am
Both ships also have pod-like attachments. :drevil:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: c914 on August 07, 2008, 02:56:18 am
Myrm had one big advantage... Helios warheads ;7
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on August 07, 2008, 02:57:06 am
Myrm had one big advantage... Heliso warheads;7
Urgh.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mars on August 07, 2008, 03:46:17 am
I'd trade the Helei in a heartbeat for Harpoons.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: c914 on August 07, 2008, 04:00:42 am
If you would use them to  fight with fighters maybe... i would prefer tempest + MorningStars and Kaysers and you've got almost same fire power as Erinyes
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on August 07, 2008, 04:43:29 am
I prefer pure dumbfire on a Myrmidon; dual Subachs and all Tempests.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on August 07, 2008, 07:36:21 am
I'd trade the Helei in a heartbeat for Harpoons.
I'd rather use the Myrmidon armed out with Helioses to take on a wing of cruisers or a destroyer over any bomber (except the Sekhmet).
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: bfobar on August 07, 2008, 05:48:05 pm
I know its CANON that the myrm can mount a helios, but it really seems like a mistake or an oversight from V.

The ships in FS1 had very clearly defined roles: You had your Interceptor, your space superiority workhorse, your assault fighter, and your tactical, medium, and strategic bombers, and everyone knows which ships goes in each role.

FS2 has these weird multirole ships. Is the myrm an underarmored assault fighter or a slow space superiority fighter? IS the perseus some weird mash of the valk and apollo? Why does the herc 2 have higher speed and less guns than its predecessor? What exactly is the erinyes for anyway, besides kicking everything's butt? Is the boanerges really cheap to make because they left off the turrets and it kinda sucks? Why do vasudan bombers get used for dogfighting?  ITS MADNESS!
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: ShadowGorrath on August 07, 2008, 06:18:30 pm
The Perseus was designed to replace the Valkyrie.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on August 07, 2008, 09:50:58 pm
FS2 has these weird multirole ships. Is the myrm an underarmored assault fighter or a slow space superiority fighter? IS the perseus some weird mash of the valk and apollo? Why does the herc 2 have higher speed and less guns than its predecessor? What exactly is the erinyes for anyway, besides kicking everything's butt? Is the boanerges really cheap to make because they left off the turrets and it kinda sucks? Why do vasudan bombers get used for dogfighting?  ITS MADNESS!
I've got to agree that some of the ships have weird stats that don't fit their roles and how the Boanerges was crap.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on August 07, 2008, 10:28:36 pm
Ah yes, the Boanerges. Although it has massive secondary banks, it has no turret, and it can only mount one gun configuration. It's not very agile either. I mean, the Sekhmet and Artemis only supports one gun, but at least they can move. The Bakha may not have that much missile space, but it can move. The Medusa only supports one gun, but it has a turret. The Zeus may not have that much armour, but it has the payload capacity of a bomber. The Ursa may not be very agile, but it has enough space to fit six Helios torpedoes, has a very nice gun placement, and has a nice little turret. The Boanerges is not agile, it doesn't have a turret, it only supports one gun, and it can't even carry the Helios. What kind of bomber is that?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: blowfish on August 07, 2008, 10:57:14 pm
:wtf: :wtf: Err ... the Boanerges can carry the Helios.  The Artemis and Bakha can't (this is cheated in bearbaiting because it is a scramble mission).
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on August 07, 2008, 11:11:20 pm
Oh, it can? I didn't notice (been using the Ursa for too long). :nervous:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: MT on August 08, 2008, 03:52:58 am
Ah yes, the Boanerges. Although it has massive secondary banks, it has no turret, and it can only mount one gun configuration. It's not very agile either. I mean, the Sekhmet and Artemis only supports one gun, but at least they can move. The Bakha may not have that much missile space, but it can move. The Medusa only supports one gun, but it has a turret. The Zeus may not have that much armour, but it has the payload capacity of a bomber. The Ursa may not be very agile, but it has enough space to fit six Helios torpedoes, has a very nice gun placement, and has a nice little turret. The Boanerges is not agile, it doesn't have a turret, it only supports one gun, and it can't even carry the Helios. What kind of bomber is that?

The Bakha has a slightly larger payload than the Artemis (180 vs 160). On the other hand the Zeus has a smaller payload than a Herc II. The only thing that makes it a bomber is its ability to carry Tsunamis and Cyclops.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on August 08, 2008, 04:03:40 am
Pffft. I'd take a Sekhmet over any Terran bomber anyday.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on August 08, 2008, 05:02:09 am
For me, either a Sekhmet or an Ursa. Full-stop.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on August 08, 2008, 05:27:39 am
The Sekhmet is the best bomber in the game, period (not full stop). Seriously, because it has 6 linked primaries, they fire real fast, loadout with Maxims and you can eat a light cruiser without firing a single bomb. The bugger can move, too.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on August 08, 2008, 06:33:10 am
Oh, the Sekhmet has six guns? I didn't notice that. :p
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on August 08, 2008, 06:35:37 am
Yea, its has 6. 2 more than the Nahema it looks like, iirc.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: MT on August 08, 2008, 06:55:22 am
FSwiki says a single bank of 4 guns. I only recall seeing 4 when playing Derelict, unless 2 more are merged into the 4 visible ones.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on August 08, 2008, 09:32:33 am
Wait, I was wrong there, it only has 4. :(
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: MechMantis on August 08, 2008, 12:29:19 pm
I have found a use for the Boanerges! I discovered this while in a COMPLETELY random dogfight.

It is a ramming beast. Other fighters just bounce right off it's shields and take some pretty hefty hull damage too. Use Circes to punch through the fighter's shields right before you ram for added damage and bouncing madness.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: bfobar on August 08, 2008, 05:03:06 pm
I'd like to therefore make a request that whoever puts the htl cockpit on the boanerges adds the guy with the drums in the back cockpit that yells 'RAMMING SPEED!' in all the old roman movies.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Droid803 on August 08, 2008, 05:18:28 pm
I have found a use for the Boanerges! I discovered this while in a COMPLETELY random dogfight.
You took a Boanerges to a dogfight?! :confused:

It is a ramming beast. Other fighters just bounce right off it's shields and take some pretty hefty hull damage too. Use Circes to punch through the fighter's shields right before you ram for added damage and bouncing madness.
lol. It's a battering ram.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: eliex on August 08, 2008, 06:46:52 pm

LOOKS like a battering ram, too come to thin about it.  :P
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on August 08, 2008, 09:23:59 pm
No wonder they save cost. It only has one gun, but can kill alot more with out it!
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Rodo on August 08, 2008, 11:20:08 pm
it's of no use.. not even as a bomber, it's just a coffin with thrusters in the back end.

you can actually ram something with it??

I find it hard to believe that you can turn to face your enemy in time.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: blowfish on August 08, 2008, 11:30:54 pm
It's not any less maneuverable than the Ursa, and it has increased speed and a reduced profile :nervous:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: MechMantis on August 08, 2008, 11:48:06 pm
I have found a use for the Boanerges! I discovered this while in a COMPLETELY random dogfight.
You took a Boanerges to a dogfight?! :confused:


Yes. With a Lamprey and Stilletos.


But I so wish I could get the voice chat to work. Otherwise I would have been shouting "RAMMING SPEED!!!" so loud.

EDIT: To be fair I was fighting a Tauret and a Loki, and they basically fought each other until they got bored. Then we started ramming each other. I basically won that round.

But I took down the Loki with my Lampreys! Granted, he was standing still but I SHOT HIM TO DEATH.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on August 08, 2008, 11:59:57 pm
I'll try that later; fly a Boanerges and ram some Shivans. :drevil:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: FreeSpaceFreak on August 09, 2008, 01:14:12 am
Like :nervous: Manticores? Astarothes? Dragons? Good luck, man. You'll need it :p
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on August 09, 2008, 01:26:37 am
How about "Slaying Ravana"? There are lots of Basilisks there; might be good practice. ;)
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Droid803 on August 09, 2008, 01:45:11 am
If only you could take a boanerges to "As Lightning Fall".
Ramming brain-dead Basilisks and Aeshmas.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on August 09, 2008, 02:26:33 am
Weeelll...you could extract the mission from the vp file and FRED it.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on August 09, 2008, 02:31:17 am
It's not any less maneuverable than the Ursa, and it has increased speed and a reduced profile :nervous:
It's got something to do with the model that makes the Bone so crap. The model is off-center, so it turns like weirdly and it can be hit from all these weird angles. Ever seen a Boanerges fly in, launch a bomb and try turn away? It turns like a van, kinda similar to the Isis (but for a different reason)
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on August 09, 2008, 02:48:29 am
Yeah, I've tried it. Very sluggish, as bad as the Ursa, maybe worse.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Rodo on August 09, 2008, 06:48:08 pm
Yeah, I've tried it. Very sluggish, as bad as the Ursa, maybe worse.

definitely better the ursa, probably because it's like just like boanerges but with a turret on its top and a huge primaries capacity.

but hitting an enemy with those primaries?? it's should be concidered as a competition for this year's olimpic games...
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on August 10, 2008, 02:30:43 am
but hitting an enemy with those primaries?? it's should be concidered as a competition for this year's olimpic games...
It's easy [especially when you are drunk] and it's useful to add Maxims there and rip up capital ships (use the center bank for cowfighting and the 3 banks for eating capital ships).
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on August 10, 2008, 03:03:53 am
I did my ram tests yesterday using the Boanerges and Ursa on Slaying Ravana and found that, when ramming a Basilisk. Its hull drops from 100 to 96 with a Boanerges, and 100 to 92 with an Ursa. However, the Boanerges seems less prone to taking recoil damage.

Also, if a Mara has 1% hull integrity and you stroke your Boanerges across it, it dies. :drevil:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Rodo on August 10, 2008, 10:55:50 am
but hitting an enemy with those primaries?? it's should be concidered as a competition for this year's olimpic games...
It's easy [especially when you are drunk] and it's useful to add Maxims there and rip up capital ships (use the center bank for cowfighting and the 3 banks for eating capital ships).

Maxims just drains your energy and I tend to divert more of that to the shields (just because I suck at this game), In Slaying Ravanna it's almost impossible not to die from the freaking flak guns! (probably because this particular model has that know issue that let's you litterally "fly through it" so the 3 flak guns sitting in the back just fire through the hull of the ravanna killing me instantly).
my response to this is: I just select the medusa and hunt down the fighers while my wingmates take the ravana on. I just give it the final hit and that's it ^^
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: General Battuta on August 10, 2008, 11:48:07 am
But then you won't get the kill.

I like to have my wingmates disarm the Ravana (I takeaway their bombs on the loadout screen and make them use other stuff.) Then I do the killing meself!
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Rodo on August 10, 2008, 03:50:57 pm
But then you won't get the kill.

I like to have my wingmates disarm the Ravana (I takeaway their bombs on the loadout screen and make them use other stuff.) Then I do the killing meself!

dont know about that, I've killed that ravana lot of times in the past already... just figured I would aim for something different in the 194746458th time jeje

In my effort to find some new exitment I deemed myself to play through Inferno SCP, i've never played through that because of those akward models and buggy missions (no offense to all of you guys, I actually liked in the end but it's no eye caching in the first couple of missions).. but who would know, story got it's charm ^^

Also tryed to get Inferno Aliance but seem that filefont is not working.. or unleast with me it keeps throwing errors.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Retsof on August 10, 2008, 05:18:59 pm
 :wtf:  But neither of those mods are released, are you on the projects?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Rodo on August 10, 2008, 05:25:24 pm
No, I played the inferno SPC patched version, not the current proyects.
I got it from the inferno site like a week ago.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Droid803 on August 10, 2008, 05:29:31 pm
Uh, Rodo, its not Inferno SCP. Its Inferno R1, with an SCP patch (which makes no difference). INFSCP is neither finished nor released.
Restof, INFA is released. INFASA isn't.
Woot. I think I got that nailed down!
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: colecampbell666 on August 10, 2008, 05:39:22 pm
Inferno SCP is the new version, made for the SCP engine.'

INFR1 is the original, made for retail FS2. It has a patch to make it compatible with FreeSpace SCP, nothing more.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Excalibur on August 10, 2008, 06:18:59 pm
A Terran Mara at full afterburners does about 15% damage to a Ulysses, then just before you ram it, fire your double Subachs and one Harpoon and it nearly dies.

As for getting kills, I have killed an SJ Sathanas, according to the stats...and I need to fly a Sekhmet again, because I keep forgetting about it.

As for the Ursa/Boanerges, I have always used the Boanerges in Slaying Ravana - the Ursa seems to be easier to hit for the AI. Not to mention the fact that you can hide in the fighter bay and still get shot through it from all angles by flak and laser turrets...
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: General Battuta on August 10, 2008, 07:08:51 pm
Can't you just download the fixed Ravana POF?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: blowfish on August 10, 2008, 07:09:25 pm
Its turrets will still shoot through it.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Droid803 on August 10, 2008, 07:13:01 pm
That happens on the retail model...its to do with FOVs
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on August 10, 2008, 10:43:18 pm
A Terran Mara at full afterburners does about 15% damage to a Ulysses, then just before you ram it, fire your double Subachs and one Harpoon and it nearly dies.

As for getting kills, I have killed an SJ Sathanas, according to the stats...and I need to fly a Sekhmet again, because I keep forgetting about it.

As for the Ursa/Boanerges, I have always used the Boanerges in Slaying Ravana - the Ursa seems to be easier to hit for the AI. Not to mention the fact that you can hide in the fighter bay and still get shot through it from all angles by flak and laser turrets...

I agree with that. For some reason, while I was on my ramming spree yesterday, I returned to base with NO DAMAGE on the Boanerges, while I took 4% hull damage on an Ursa.

My method of taking down the Ravana is the same as taking down the Sathanas: target the beam cannons, afterburn towards them, release dual Cyclops at 500m and flyby or fly away.

And about that model glitch...yeah, I've seen it myself. :wtf:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Rodo on August 11, 2008, 08:57:11 am
ups... my bad, it's inferno R1 scp patch, you would already know this but inferno is the most confusing project I've encountered so far in this forum ^^
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on August 11, 2008, 09:21:45 am
ups... my bad, it's inferno R1 scp patch, you would already know this but inferno is the most confusing project I've encountered so far in this forum ^^
Ha ha ha hoo hee ha ha ha.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on August 11, 2008, 09:48:04 am
I thought Just Another Day was the most problematic, since its supplied mod.ini file crashes OS X Launcher 3.0.7
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on August 11, 2008, 10:16:41 am
I thought Just Another Day was the most problematic, since its supplied mod.ini file crashes OS X Launcher 3.0.7
If Goober made a mod.ini for DEM, he'd probably do something similar, just deliberately.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on August 12, 2008, 05:21:20 am
He probably would, after what he made in DEM... :p

I don't fly the Ulysses unless if I really have to. Why do some people like using "the bat"?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on August 12, 2008, 05:51:30 am
Its my choice for a Great War era fighter, that and the Valk.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Rodo on August 12, 2008, 06:59:56 am
GO loki!
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: nvsblmnc on August 12, 2008, 07:04:26 am
I don't fly the Ulysses unless if I really have to. Why do some people like using "the bat"?

Agility.  The Ulysses feels very nimble and it has better-than-average flight performance, even in FS2.

GO loki!

Me agrees.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on August 12, 2008, 07:50:58 am
In The Great War, I find myself flying the Hercules whenever possible. I liked the Herc because of its gunpoints, which allows me to hit things easier. :)
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on August 12, 2008, 10:05:11 am
Why does the AI pilot Lokis so badly? Could someone examine that myth too?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on August 12, 2008, 10:09:23 am
In The Great War, I find myself flying the Hercules whenever possible. I liked the Herc because of its gunpoints, which allows me to hit things easier. :)
I dislike it cause it handles like a rock, but love its secondary bank size.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on August 13, 2008, 04:04:12 am
Why does the AI pilot Lokis so badly? Could someone examine that myth too?

Perhaps the Loki is too agile for them to handle. The AI has its own turn rate limits. ;)
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: [DW]-Hunter on August 13, 2008, 04:11:54 am
Wheres the Athena???
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on August 13, 2008, 04:44:52 am
Wheres the Athena???

It appears to be an FS2 poll, Hunter. :blah:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Jeff Vader on August 13, 2008, 04:47:33 am
Wheres the Athena???

It appears to be an FS2 poll, Hunter. :blah:
And a little... how do you say it... oh yeah, that's right. A little biased one. Loki?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on August 13, 2008, 04:50:28 am
Biased? In what sense? :confused:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: [DW]-Hunter on August 13, 2008, 04:56:33 am
Wheres the Athena???

It appears to be an FS2 poll, Hunter. :blah:

Lame... I want my athena!  :sigh: It is by far the prettiest bomber in the FS series!! Shame :v: didn't allow it to carry bombs...
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on August 13, 2008, 06:54:06 am
Lame... I want my athena!  :sigh: It is by far the prettiest bomber in the FS series!! Shame :v: didn't allow it to carry bombs...
It's a piece of crap, really. It can't carry a single good weapon, except the Avenger. So it's useless at bombing... Useless at dogfighting... Useless at everything, really. Except maybe dying.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Jeff Vader on August 13, 2008, 06:59:35 am
Lame... I want my athena!  :sigh: It is by far the prettiest bomber in the FS series!! Shame :v: didn't allow it to carry bombs...
It's a piece of crap, really. It can't carry a single good weapon, except the Avenger. So it's useless at bombing... Useless at dogfighting... Useless at everything, really. Except maybe dying.
It's good for disarming capital ships. And afterwards you'll have at least a chance at dogfighting since the maneuverability is at least a tad bit better than that of a large planet. Which is certainly not the case with, for example, the Ursa.

Biased? In what sense? :confused:
Loki?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on August 13, 2008, 07:08:20 am
It's good for disarming capital ships. And afterwards you'll have at least a chance at dogfighting since the maneuverability is at least a tad bit better than that of a large planet. Which is certainly not the case with, for example, the Ursa.
The only reason it's good at disarming things is because it can carry the Stiletto. Other than that, it's useless. It'd probably be useful as like a medium-heavy fighter though

(I lost a bet is why)
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Jeff Vader on August 13, 2008, 07:10:36 am
 :wtf: What bet??!?!?!12
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on August 13, 2008, 07:17:04 am
Add $end_multi_text after +Tech Description. It will fix the problem. I assure you. I knew the error the second I saw it.

If that doesn't work, I'll speak in light blue and italics for a week.
Click the link and maybe you can help out SFJ with your problem solving powers.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Iranon on August 13, 2008, 07:43:24 am
Well, despite being discontinued before FS2 started, the Athena was a nominal bomber and so wouldn't belong in this poll.

For all intents and purposes, it has a worthy successor in the Herc II (slightly heavier though).
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on August 14, 2008, 12:56:28 am
I thought the Zeus was supposed to succeed the Athena. :confused:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Iranon on August 14, 2008, 02:30:35 am
The Zeus is significantly worse in a dogfight than the Athena, but good for other things since it can actually carry real bombs.

The Herc II is the successor to the Athena in terms of mission profile - softening up capital ships (no need for Stilettos in FS2; the Trebuchet does the job just as well while being a lot more flexible), then engaging fighters on close to even terms.

One of these is probably better than the Athena for any given mission, but the old lady was more fun to fly for her speed and excellent gun placements.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Akalabeth Angel on August 14, 2008, 02:43:53 am
     Who cares about what it can carry. The Athena looks sexy. I take it out every mission I can until it becomes clear that winning a given mission with the craft is unattainable. If you're going to get down in flames, at least look good while you're doing it. And you're not going to look good in an Ursa.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on August 14, 2008, 03:16:10 am
     Who cares about what it can carry. The Athena looks sexy. I take it out every mission I can until it becomes clear that winning a given mission with the craft is unattainable. If you're going to get down in flames, at least look good while you're doing it. And you're not going to look good in an Ursa.
What about not dying at all?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Akalabeth Angel on August 14, 2008, 03:26:42 am
     Who cares about what it can carry. The Athena looks sexy. I take it out every mission I can until it becomes clear that winning a given mission with the craft is unattainable. If you're going to get down in flames, at least look good while you're doing it. And you're not going to look good in an Ursa.
What about not dying at all?

     Not dying? Blah, living's overrated. You must be one of those guys who's never stayed in Capella to fight when the supernova went off.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on August 14, 2008, 03:29:35 am
I never wanted to die in the supernova; all I did was suffer ten seconds of target fixation and that cost me everything. :lol:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: eliex on August 16, 2008, 03:15:22 am
     Who cares about what it can carry. The Athena looks sexy. I take it out every mission I can until it becomes clear that winning a given mission with the craft is unattainable. If you're going to get down in flames, at least look good while you're doing it. And you're not going to look good in an Ursa.
What about not dying at all?

     Not dying? Blah, living's overrated. You must be one of those guys who's never stayed in Capella to fight when the supernova went off.

Yep. I'm one of those guys. Who cares about those transports when you can save yourself! If Command wants to complain, they should go out onto the front line follow the "don't-criticise-unless-you-do-it-yourself!"

Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Mars on August 16, 2008, 03:45:02 am
Well, not to mention the fact you can't actually save any of the transports, only keep them from blowing up before the supernova comes and does it anyway.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on August 16, 2008, 11:36:47 am
Well, not to mention the fact you can't actually save any of the transports, only keep them from blowing up before the supernova comes and does it anyway.
I don't see the point in staying behind except to get toasted by what is basically a flashbang. I mean, even if I do stay behind to "help the civilians", they'll get toasted anyway. And who survived to tell Petrach about that anyway? Definitely not the transports.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: General Battuta on August 16, 2008, 12:45:22 pm
The point is that you try. It's desperate heroism. Sometimes I park my Ares behind a disabled transport and just start pushing towards the node.

Even if you survived, I'm sure you'd suffer massive survivor's guilt. Better to go out clean and tragic, and become a legend.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: ShadowGorrath on August 16, 2008, 12:49:52 pm
Well, not to mention the fact you can't actually save any of the transports, only keep them from blowing up before the supernova comes and does it anyway.
I don't see the point in staying behind except to get toasted by what is basically a flashbang. I mean, even if I do stay behind to "help the civilians", they'll get toasted anyway. And who survived to tell Petrach about that anyway? Definitely not the transports.

Those are a cowards words. Give me back your medals, if you have any, and prepare to be settled on a planet in Capella.  :lol:

I never run away in that mission though. Why are people so afraid of it?

Volition should have locked the player's subspace drive until the supernova started and the player got into the node.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on August 16, 2008, 08:40:08 pm
*snip*
How dare you challenge my courage?!?!?! I stayed behind countless times to get flashbanged countless times to attempt to help the civilians!!!!11!!!eleven!!!

Granted on the last run I got bored and started pot-shotting the civilians to make them run faster.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Topgun on August 16, 2008, 09:01:25 pm
The point is that you try. Sometimes I park my Ares behind a disabled transport and just start pushing towards the node.
rotfl. :lol: :lol: :lol:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on August 17, 2008, 07:38:36 pm
I got caught in the supernova because of target fixation.
Title: TILT TILT TILT (epic bump)
Post by: Vrets on April 04, 2009, 09:27:10 pm
No love for the Myrmidon?

There need to be some missions that use the Myrmidon to its full tactical-striking potential.

Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Rodo on April 04, 2009, 09:33:42 pm
the myrmi is a good fighter, I prefer it over the hercules Mk2 because of it's double primary cannon, the only dissadvantage would be the crappy secondary loadout capacity but even so...
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Vrets on April 04, 2009, 09:40:21 pm
Well, its seconday loadout is much better than the Perseus in terms of capacity. Think about it like this: the Myrmidon's first secondary bay is just divided into two, in case you want to carry a greater variety of warheads. For example, the Perseus can carry 120-120 tempests, while the Myrmidon carries 80-80-160.

What I really think is lacking in the Myrmidon is its turning speed. It has a great top speed, but it turns only a bit better than the old Athena. The Apollo turns better than the Myrmidon.

What's really NICE about the Myrmidon is how influential its ETS is. Maxing out engines boosts the Myrmidon's top speed to 95m/s from 65, for example (a gain of 30 m/s, wow). Or shunt more power to shields and become a death tank. By comparison, the wheat thin-esque Serapis only gains 3 m/s with engines maxed out.
Title: Re: TILT TILT TILT (epic bump)
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on April 04, 2009, 10:40:31 pm
No love for the Myrmidon?

There need to be some missions that use the Myrmidon to its full tactical-striking potential.

._.

/me fires an SABeam.

(http://v4belg.blu.livefilestore.com/y1pBFAuLL_Czidqxb52zM1_qxq0k9JRPLbtJZu9KJ2_nzruGoGoXuXoKIZePqcSXiWphHPK6BkfXtF-tuk_oy5YJQ/necroancient.png)

I like the Myrmidon for its six gunmounts and because I can fly it better than I can fly a Perseus.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Pred the Penguin on April 04, 2009, 11:01:55 pm
The Myrmidon is actually a very good fighter, we're just lacking proper missions to use it.

I also find the Perseus hard to pilot. o_o
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Scotty on April 04, 2009, 11:05:33 pm
I will always love the Herc Mk. II.  There's just something about being able to launch missile after missile.... after missile.... after missile, etc., etc., et al.

Barring that, the Perseus for the top speed while still having energy for shields.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: blowfish on April 04, 2009, 11:50:57 pm
Well, since this got necroed anyway... :doubt:

I will always love the Herc Mk. II.  There's just something about being able to launch missile after missile.... after missile.... after missile, etc., etc., et al.

I always disliked the Herc2, though, for only having four gunmounts and feeling like it can't go faster than a flying tortise.  Somehow, I always preferred the Ares, which is weird, since it is slower than the Herc2, though it does have six gunmounts.  Maybe it has to do with afterburner...
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: peterv on April 04, 2009, 11:55:52 pm
Also the Herc Mk. II looks like an ugly bird. It apears to me that Volition has an obsession whith this kind.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Krelus on April 05, 2009, 12:16:54 am
The Erinyes with trebs and Prometheus S cannons is probably one of the scariest things to engage at any kind of range. I've actually one-hit-killed an Astaroth with an octuple-hit from a Prometheus.

Second place is probably the Myrmidon. With that quad bank and compatibility with the EMP Adv, you can deliver so much pain unto a bomber wing it isn't even funny.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Commander Zane on April 05, 2009, 12:29:01 am
The Erinyes with trebs and Prometheus S cannons is probably one of the scariest things to engage at any kind of range. I've actually one-hit-killed an Astaroth with an octuple-hit from a Prometheus.
Placing all eight shots on a Basilisk or Mara with Kaysers will vaporise them also, which is easily more braggable than popping paper-for-shields interceptors in one burst.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: General Battuta on April 05, 2009, 12:47:23 am
The Erinyes with trebs and Prometheus S cannons is probably one of the scariest things to engage at any kind of range. I've actually one-hit-killed an Astaroth with an octuple-hit from a Prometheus.
Placing all eight shots on a Basilisk or Mara with Kaysers will vaporise them also, which is easily more braggable than popping paper-for-shields interceptors in one burst.

Except for how the Astaroth is far more difficult to hit.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Commander Zane on April 05, 2009, 12:52:00 am
Still not the easiest thing to do getting eight shots to hit the same spot at the same time.
Except for Nephilims and Seraphims. Or bigger.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on April 05, 2009, 02:12:31 am
... I still stand by my one year old position that its pretty pointless protecting the transports only to have them killed by the flashbang. :v: should have made the transports go full speed towards the node. So that valiant pilots like Battuta wouldn't have to push them towards the node.

... I still love the Erinyes. Most of my kills are done with primaries any how.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on April 05, 2009, 03:21:36 am
My choice for all the various roles would be (by decreasing preference):

Space Superiority - Myrmidon, Herc II, Loki, Pegasus, Hercules, Perseus
Intercept - Myrmidon, Herc II, Loki, Pegasus, Perseus, Hercules
Recon - Pegasus, Loki
Heavy Assault - Herc II, Hercules
Bombing Runs - Ursa, Boanerges, Medusa, Artemis D.H., Zeus, Artemis
All Of The Above - Ares, Mara, Erinyes

The Perseus is a googol times too slippery for me to use properly. It has crap firepower, crap secondary banks and crap shields too.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: castor on April 05, 2009, 05:19:32 am
Myrm is not one of my favourites, mostly because its a big target with not-so-great shields. Love the speed though.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Dragon on April 05, 2009, 05:36:12 am
For dogfighting I prefer Erynies ,for bombing Boanerges or Ursa (useful when you also need to handle fighters) and for all-round missions Myrmidon (two Helios torpedoes ,four Kaysers ,bank of Tornadoes ,bank of Trebuchets and Disruptor in the top bank=prepared for anything).
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on April 05, 2009, 05:41:20 am
Ares.

Stop.

Drop.

Fire missiles at people.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: nvsblmnc on April 05, 2009, 05:43:39 am
The Myrm is one of my favourites because the 2/3 bank setup gives it a great deal of flexibility.  I quite like this seup:

4-gun bank: Prom S or Kayser
2-gun bank: Morning Star or HL-7

Missile 1: Infyrno (or another Tornado bank if I'm going hunting)
Missile 2: Tornado
Missile 3: Trebuchet

You've got assualt, intercept and defense all in one package.  Overall, though, I still prefer the Erinyes.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on April 05, 2009, 06:33:21 am
I'm that kind of person who likes to do long-range missile-lobbing before I get too close and have to switch to primaries. For this reason, I like using ships with large secondary banks. This is why I prefer the Ares, Mara, Tauret, Ursa, Herc 2 and Seth above other flyable ships.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: S-99 on April 05, 2009, 07:32:15 am
My preference i find is that for disarming i do long range if i have the missiles for it. Most of my kills are balanced between primaries and secondaries. I don't use tempests a lot, but i find that when i have them, the way i handle my primaries is a lot different.

For fighter craft. I loove the athena. Great tactical (subsystem bomber) bomber. The firing points on it are dead on. You can only equip avengers as the most primary weapon on it. But, the firing points on it make short work of any fighters even though it's just avengers. I always use the avenger. The prometheus doesn't cut it.

Likely so, the artemis is cool, and meant to be a replacement for the athena. But really, the artemis is ****. I can't do **** with the widespread firing points on it besides lob missiles. I don't have any other qualms with the other fighters and bombers. Just the artemise's primaries are horrible. Why not make them similar to the athena and just only be able to equip subachs for it?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: SPECTRE87 on April 05, 2009, 10:22:44 am
Enrinyes for firepower, Perseus for style!
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on April 05, 2009, 11:20:55 am
Has anyone here tried to disarm or disable a small ship using Stilettos?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Commander Zane on April 05, 2009, 11:25:37 am
No but I've intercepted Dragons with the Helios numerous times.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Rhymes on April 05, 2009, 11:27:20 am
I pick the Pegasus.  It's damn hard to hit, even though it lacks firepower, but one word sums up my reason for picking it.

Transcend.  :nod:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Commander Zane on April 05, 2009, 11:30:06 am
NEVER SPEAK OF THAT BASTARD BATTLE AGAIN! :shaking:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Rhymes on April 05, 2009, 11:46:38 am
What ARE you talking about?  The final level?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Commander Zane on April 05, 2009, 12:04:55 pm
Yes, I can't stand that fight! More loop-de-loops than you can shake a damn stick at!
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Rhymes on April 05, 2009, 01:59:12 pm
It's still EPIC though.  Besides,
Spoiler:
the appearances of the Transcendant before the final battle are absolutely ****ing SCARY.  I remember the first time I saw him, nearly gave me a heart attack.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Ziame on April 05, 2009, 02:20:48 pm
Why no Hercules 2?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Rhymes on April 05, 2009, 04:35:53 pm
 :wtf:  It's there, but it's misspelled as "Herecules MK II"
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: DarthWang on April 05, 2009, 04:38:44 pm
Terran Mara
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on April 05, 2009, 10:30:29 pm
Here are the reasons why I like certain fighters:

Different paint job, same thrusters - SF Mara, GTF Pegasus
Difficult to kill - SF Mara, GTF Erinyes, GTF Hercules Mark II
Odd shape - SF Mara, GTF Pegasus, GTF Myrmidon
Many gun mounts - GTF Myrmidon, GTF Hercules, GTF Erinyes
Huge secondary banks - GTF Hercules Mark II
Good for aim - SF Mara, GTF Pegasus, GTF Hercules Mark II, GTF Myrmidon, GTF Erinyes
All of the above - GTF Ares

...and here are some reasons why I don't like certain fighters that much:

GTF Perseus - Too slippery and crap payload
GTF Loki - Thin hull and shielding + crap payload
GTF Ulysses - Too slippery, thin hull and shielding + crap payload
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: asyikarea51 on April 05, 2009, 10:37:35 pm
Transcend... ugh... that sucker is so hard to hit...!!! and stealth among other things...

@ androgeos exeunt

Your preference is more to the medium and heavy fighters I guess? Or anything that meets a certain criteria?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on April 05, 2009, 11:47:39 pm
Has anyone here tried to disarm or disable a small ship using Stilettos?
You mean a fighter? Yea, I've done that. Rammed a Dragon accidentally and my finger slipped and hit my secondaries and I disabled it. Then, this being an extremely rare thing, I proceeded to disable it subsystem by subsystem until it only had hull strength left. I stiletto'd everything else.

Your preference is more to the medium and heavy fighters I guess? Or anything that meets a certain criteria?
Iirc, A.E said that he tends to do secondary kills, so he tends towards stuff with larger secondary payloads. I tend towards stuff with larger primary banks, and better manueverability.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: General Battuta on April 05, 2009, 11:53:52 pm

Huge secondary banks - GTF Hercules Mark II


Try the Tauret.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Stormkeeper on April 06, 2009, 12:15:24 am
That thing has the largest secondary bank, doesn't it?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on April 06, 2009, 02:23:20 am
That thing has the largest secondary bank, doesn't it?

Nope, it loses out to the Mara.

Try the Tauret.

/me Topic...
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Enigmatic Entity on April 06, 2009, 08:18:09 am
Terran Mara - except that it lacks primary firepower at times.
Ares - Invincible when you can turn around to hit your enemy. Otherwise a hard-to-kill asteroid.
Erinyes - Tempest and Kayser beam.
Hercules MK II - A faster, toned down Ares.

Pegasus - NOT stealthy and gets whipped by flak.
Loki - Did someone mention a painted cardboard box?
Ulysses - ULTRA fast until you run into flak, runs out of missiles to quickly. And it's called a space superiority fighter. It's not.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: General Battuta on April 06, 2009, 08:54:00 am
Terran Mara - except that it lacks primary firepower at times.
Ares - Invincible when you can turn around to hit your enemy. Otherwise a hard-to-kill asteroid.
Erinyes - Tempest and Kayser beam.
Hercules MK II - A faster, toned down Ares.

Pegasus - NOT stealthy and gets whipped by flak.
Loki - Did someone mention a painted cardboard box?
Ulysses - ULTRA fast until you run into flak, runs out of missiles to quickly. And it's called a space superiority fighter. It's not.

The Terran Mara...lacks primary firepower? Do explicate!

The Pegasus is plenty stealthy if it's SEXPed to be stealthy in the mission.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Rodo on April 06, 2009, 09:07:30 am
The Terran Mara...lacks primary firepower? Do explicate!

The Pegasus is plenty stealthy if it's SEXPed to be stealthy in the mission.



with sexps every ship can be stealthy IIRC, on a normal mission there would be no real advantage on using the ship itself if the stealthiness was not active and depending on the fredder to remember activating that is somewhat discouraging, the ship should have an in game key bind to activate the stealthiness :D, taking that into consideration the only advantage of the ship is the maneuverability.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Enigmatic Entity on April 06, 2009, 09:21:26 am
Terran Mara - except that it lacks primary firepower at times.
Ares - Invincible when you can turn around to hit your enemy. Otherwise a hard-to-kill asteroid.
Erinyes - Tempest and Kayser beam.
Hercules MK II - A faster, toned down Ares.

Pegasus - NOT stealthy and gets whipped by flak.
Loki - Did someone mention a painted cardboard box?
Ulysses - ULTRA fast until you run into flak, runs out of missiles to quickly. And it's called a space superiority fighter. It's not.

The Terran Mara...lacks primary firepower? Do explicate!

The Pegasus is plenty stealthy if it's SEXPed to be stealthy in the mission.


You can't hold down the primary fire button on normal energy levels for as long as I'd like with Kaysers, and anything less than four Kaysers is weak. I suppose it makes up with the ability to launch harpoon after harpoon at your enem(y/ies). ;)

Being stealthy doesn't protect you in a flak battle, especially when you're turning to chase that Loki that has 49.8 flak turrets firing at it...
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Krelus on April 06, 2009, 09:55:59 am
Terran Mara - except that it lacks primary firepower at times.
Ares - Invincible when you can turn around to hit your enemy. Otherwise a hard-to-kill asteroid.
Erinyes - Tempest and Kayser beam.
Hercules MK II - A faster, toned down Ares.

Pegasus - NOT stealthy and gets whipped by flak.
Loki - Did someone mention a painted cardboard box?
Ulysses - ULTRA fast until you run into flak, runs out of missiles to quickly. And it's called a space superiority fighter. It's not.

The Terran Mara...lacks primary firepower? Do explicate!

The Pegasus is plenty stealthy if it's SEXPed to be stealthy in the mission.


You can't hold down the primary fire button on normal energy levels for as long as I'd like with Kaysers, and anything less than four Kaysers is weak. I suppose it makes up with the ability to launch harpoon after harpoon at your enem(y/ies). ;)

Being stealthy doesn't protect you in a flak battle, especially when you're turning to chase that Loki that has 49.8 flak turrets firing at it...

Dude, never underestimate a quad bank. Even a quad-Subach bank can rip most things to shreds right quick, and the bonus is you can take some power out of weapons without any downside. I used to play on Very Easy so I thought the Kayser was a god-weapon, but man, that thing is a pain in the ass to use on Medium or higher.

And by the way, there is a solution to that Pegasus problem: Don't fly into a flak cloud.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Commander Zane on April 06, 2009, 11:23:33 am
The Erinyes with eight Kaysers on Medium is interesting especially with Fastmod tables, I did notice however that the shield -> energy transfer doesn't work for beans but it does make weapon recharge faster, even with all allocation taken out of weapon recharge, hitting the S->E key once will suddenly make weapons recharge as if you had energy put into gun recharge.

And there is no solution to the Pegasus problem when Fastmod variables make flak and beams have ludicrous ranges. ;7
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: DeepSpace9er on April 06, 2009, 10:54:29 pm
Erinyes - Kayser in the first slot, Maxim in the second. The way I roll is using the Kayser with turret points on single select to kill fighters. Using the 2 turret point maxim as an anti-cruiser/anti-subsystem long range weapon. Using dual Kayser's drains your power too quickly so even if I didnt use the maxim, i would still only go with 1 kayser on the first slot.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on April 07, 2009, 02:50:45 am
The Pegasus is plenty stealthy if it's SEXPed to be stealthy in the mission.

Alternatively, don't go near a Sathanas. ;)
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: colecampbell666 on April 12, 2009, 09:56:14 am
Erinyes - Kayser in the first slot, Maxim in the second. The way I roll is using the Kayser with turret points on single select to kill fighters. Using the 2 turret point maxim as an anti-cruiser/anti-subsystem long range weapon. Using dual Kayser's drains your power too quickly so even if I didnt use the maxim, i would still only go with 1 kayser on the first slot.
Think you mean Ares.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Commander Zane on April 12, 2009, 10:45:39 am
:wtf:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Imposible Uncorrect on April 12, 2009, 05:16:53 pm
Actually, I can see my fav. ship is also the fav. ship ofmany other members! Actually I like the GTF Perseus because the Perseus is one of the best Allrounders, I ever got to play in this game.  ;)
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: colecampbell666 on April 12, 2009, 06:43:54 pm
:wtf:
The Erinyes has 4+4 gunpoints, the Ares (a big brown Herc II) has 4+2.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Commander Zane on April 12, 2009, 07:42:51 pm
I know that...what I'm not getting is that statement, both ships can house Kaysers and Maxims, and I'd rather go for the ship that fires more rounds per burst.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: colecampbell666 on April 12, 2009, 08:16:03 pm
Erinyes - Kayser in the first slot, Maxim in the second. The way I roll is using the Kayser with turret points on single select to kill fighters. Using the 2 turret point maxim as an anti-cruiser/anti-subsystem long range weapon. Using dual Kayser's drains your power too quickly so even if I didnt use the maxim, i would still only go with 1 kayser on the first slot.
Sounded like it. NVM.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Scotty on April 12, 2009, 08:44:30 pm
I go with one Kayser and one Maxim, especially on escort missions.  With the Kayser, you take out fighters really fast, and the maxims are absolutely flippin' wonderful bomb destroyers, as well as knocking off the lock times on bombers.  Honestly, being an effective escort from 2500 meters?  :lol:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: colecampbell666 on April 12, 2009, 08:49:19 pm
Playing on medium or higher I'd rather an HL-7 variant than a Kayser. Especially on the later missions with ships with 4+2 or 4+4 mounts. Couple it with a Maxim, Trebs and Tornadoes, you can't stop me.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on April 13, 2009, 09:46:20 am
One of the nice things about the Erinyes is that, with eight guns, even the Maxim can do serious damage to shields. I've been doing that quite recently while flying a Sekhmet.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Rodo on April 13, 2009, 10:15:17 am
I still miss the loki option... how much do you think it would get??

+1 over here!
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Imposible Uncorrect on April 13, 2009, 11:40:30 am
I would vote for it! But I think it won't get so much votes than the Perseus or the Erynes. :blah:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: FreeSpaceFreak on April 13, 2009, 01:26:45 pm
Guys. What do you like about it? It carries less missiles than a stealth fighter and it hardly has any armour. The only good things that come to my mind are its speed (but a Perseus is faster) and its HTL-ization.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Rodo on April 13, 2009, 01:34:39 pm
well it's small ,fast and has very good maneuverability AND it's really good looking.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: azile0 on April 13, 2009, 02:25:50 pm
I love Perseus fighters, their smooth feel, their amazing agility, and the ability to blast the crap out of anything in front of it
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on April 14, 2009, 01:04:00 am
And I dislike them more than I dislike most of the other Terran fighters because they're too slippery.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Imposible Uncorrect on April 14, 2009, 03:29:03 am
Actually, I think a lot of Terran Fighters combined together would be something like the ultimate fighter. I don't know. But the Perseus is something like the Valkyrie. You can use it, but if the mission is something for a Hercules, than you've got a problem. Imposible Uncorrect.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Blue Lion on April 14, 2009, 03:39:29 am
Most people in SW missions would skip the Pegasus and use the Ptah.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Enioch on April 14, 2009, 03:41:17 am
+1 for the Ulysses. I know, I know, it's not one for furious missile lobbing, but the speed! Oh, the speed...

Combined with the slippery-est target profile after the Pegasus and extreme maneuverability, it's my dream come true. I know it's not everybody's cup of tea, but it fits my flying style...

'A Game of TAG' is heaven in space... :D
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Imposible Uncorrect on April 14, 2009, 04:48:51 am
I still like the Pegasus. Even he is a bit like the Ulysses, who has the same quality's. Even the Pegasus has a Stealthability, what makes him a bit interesting. Just a bit, I mean its not so exciting to fly with Stealthtechnology. I mean, the Pegasus is good looking, but he isn't a good fighter. Even He's good to fly observationmissions. But I still like the Pegasus. :D Imposible Uncorrect
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: ssmit132 on April 14, 2009, 06:09:19 am
'A Game of TAG' is heaven in space... :D
Except for the fact that you are given a bank of Prometheus R. :ick:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Rodo on April 14, 2009, 06:33:08 am
'A Game of TAG' is heaven in space... :D
Except for the fact that you are given a bank of Prometheus R. :ick:

and it's ****ty primary placings.... damn it's so frikking hard to completely hit a target smaller than a cruiser with those primaries.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Commander Zane on April 14, 2009, 07:16:08 am
And yet with an Apollo it's easier.
At least for me it is. :nervous:
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Enioch on April 14, 2009, 08:39:31 am
'A Game of TAG' is heaven in space... :D
Except for the fact that you are given a bank of Prometheus R. :ick:

So? Do you think I use them at all? :p :D

and it's ****ty primary placings.... damn it's so frikking hard to completely hit a target smaller than a cruiser with those primaries.

You're kidding? :nervous: I always found them to be perfect for me...
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Rodo on April 14, 2009, 08:52:06 am


and it's ****ty primary placings.... damn it's so frikking hard to completely hit a target smaller than a cruiser with those primaries.

You're kidding? :nervous: I always found them to be perfect for me...

not kidding... the two cannons are way too separated, a dragon and other sleek ships will be able to fly right in front of you and when you shoot at them both energy bolts will pass right beside the edges without touching it.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on April 14, 2009, 09:25:35 am
The Ulysses is ideal for A Game of TAG because it's small and fast, so you can TAG a Shivan and run away before the Warspite's ULTRAs open fire.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Enioch on April 14, 2009, 12:09:49 pm


and it's ****ty primary placings.... damn it's so frikking hard to completely hit a target smaller than a cruiser with those primaries.

You're kidding? :nervous: I always found them to be perfect for me...

not kidding... the two cannons are way too separated, a dragon and other sleek ships will be able to fly right in front of you and when you shoot at them both energy bolts will pass right beside the edges without touching it.

Not if you stick to their tail. If you manage to do it, wide firing points are actually better. If you're fighting a Dragon (which jerks around and spins and flies circles around you :D) and flying a fighter with concentrated fire, you're either hit with both bolts, or miss completely. But if you're firing from wide-spaced guns, chances are that, by trying to swerve out of the way, the Dragon will actually run into one of your bolts.

I guess it's our different flying styles... :)
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on April 14, 2009, 09:46:08 pm
You wonder why I don't use the Artemis more often ... but then again, there's always the Ursa. ;)
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Krelus on April 14, 2009, 10:01:19 pm
You wonder why I don't use the Artemis more often ... but then again, there's always the Ursa. ;)

I honestly think the Artemis's gun placement was a balance feature. As is, it's capable of doing a decent job of defending itself, far better than other bombers, but it can't outperform any of the fighters in dogfight roles. I always thought a bit of the ol' Athena's spirit made it in there, myself.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on April 15, 2009, 12:24:43 pm
The way I see it the Artemis was about as good as killing fighters as the Ursa. Mainly because of its terrible gun placement and its very typical bomber maneuverability.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Imposible Uncorrect on April 15, 2009, 04:44:26 pm
The Artemis? I don't use them much often. I like bombers which are...more heavier then others, you know. I like the Artemis, but it isn't a good bomber, especially for them who like the bombers that way I like them too.
The Ursa? I like it, but it it has a terrible placement of weapons, just like you said. My favourite bomber in FS1 is: Athena and the Medusa. In FS2: The Zeus and also the Medusa. Imposible Uncorrect
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: colecampbell666 on April 15, 2009, 05:07:24 pm
I don't see the problem with bomber maneuverability. I can kill any ship, even Dragons in some cases, with a Boa or Ursa. I don't find the maneuverability that much of a handicap. And I can use Helioses. (No Myrm cracks.)

I play on Medium.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on April 15, 2009, 05:55:00 pm
Try hitting a group of Seths or Taurets with the Artemis and you'll be unsuccessful.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: General Battuta on April 15, 2009, 06:10:06 pm
I don't see the problem with bomber maneuverability. I can kill any ship, even Dragons in some cases, with a Boa or Ursa. I don't find the maneuverability that much of a handicap. And I can use Helioses. (No Myrm cracks.)

I play on Medium.

Bombers are suicide on Insane.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: colecampbell666 on April 15, 2009, 07:05:19 pm
Maybe. And Snail, that's why no one in their right mind would use the Artemis.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: General Battuta on April 15, 2009, 07:27:12 pm
Maybe. And Snail, that's why no one in their right mind would use the Artemis.

The problem with flying bombers on Insane is that they're, well, more realistic: they can't do their jobs without heavy fighter cover and tactical strikes to suppress flak.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Commander Zane on April 15, 2009, 08:12:11 pm
Which Retail doesn't offer you. :P
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: colecampbell666 on April 15, 2009, 08:49:05 pm
Go play SGWPII. That's what I'm doing. Gonna make me an admiral.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Commander Zane on April 16, 2009, 05:38:01 am
Now go read a book.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: maelstrom0511 on April 16, 2009, 10:04:42 am
A cross between the Pegasus and the Hercules... both really work for me.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Zantor on April 16, 2009, 10:16:39 am
The Perseus just... owns. 8)

I couldn't have said it better than myself. The Erinyes is nice, but it's a little slower than the Pers in maneuverability even though it holds way more; it isn't as fast, either. I'm an interceptor pilot.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on April 16, 2009, 11:26:34 am
The Perseus was always more of a space superiority fighter to me... Kinda like a watered-down Valkyrie.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Uchuujinsan on April 16, 2009, 02:33:03 pm
Maybe. And Snail, that's why no one in their right mind would use the Artemis.

The problem with flying bombers on Insane is that they're, well, more realistic: they can't do their jobs without heavy fighter cover and tactical strikes to suppress flak.
Well, the bombers with turrets (I think Ursa and Medusa) are also quite flyable on Insane, as the turrets can shoot down fighters quite well.
Every bomber without a autoturret is suicide if there are enemy fighters though :>
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: General Battuta on April 16, 2009, 02:53:01 pm
Maybe. And Snail, that's why no one in their right mind would use the Artemis.

The problem with flying bombers on Insane is that they're, well, more realistic: they can't do their jobs without heavy fighter cover and tactical strikes to suppress flak.
Well, the bombers with turrets (I think Ursa and Medusa) are also quite flyable on Insane, as the turrets can shoot down fighters quite well.
Every bomber without a autoturret is suicide if there are enemy fighters though :>

Unfortunately they're ripped apart by flak and beams at a much higher rate than lighter, smaller bombers. So it's a tradeoff.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: DIO on April 17, 2009, 03:05:29 am
Am I the only person who thinks GTF Apollo has the best looks?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: ShadowGorrath on April 17, 2009, 03:44:12 am
Not the only one ;)
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Commander Zane on April 17, 2009, 04:57:02 am
There's also me that thinks that.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: bastionlover on April 17, 2009, 06:12:30 am
definantly the perseus,

its fast, looks great and has a good enough payload.



EDIT: no one said no 21st century fighters? so the F-22?
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on April 17, 2009, 08:27:42 am
/me hits bastionlover with a BABeam.

(http://v4belg.blu.livefilestore.com/y1puetGKVxUuSMOV2gOpe6x35mTntwiQNd907TOgNJU64inj7sPfjCoQsi2R-7W_tMWk-XgsgugU5Ej6fjZJblNPw/WelcomeAncient.png)

The Perseus is fast, but it's way too agile. Every time I fly it, I feel like I'm flying something worse than a Boanerges.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Snail on April 17, 2009, 08:48:33 am
Am I the only person who thinks GTF Apollo has the best looks?
Nope. I liek it too.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: maelstrom0511 on April 17, 2009, 09:12:05 am
same here... :)
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Androgeos Exeunt on April 17, 2009, 09:25:48 am
I like the Apollo because it was flat.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Zantor on April 18, 2009, 11:30:36 am
Am I the only person who thinks GTF Apollo has the best looks?

The Apollo is very cliche of FS1 in my opinion. I would vote for the Valkyrie as it is faster and more maneuverable than the Perseus, but it wasn't on the list.
Title: Re: Favorite terran fighter
Post by: Pred the Penguin on April 18, 2009, 07:16:45 pm
Am I the only person who thinks GTF Apollo has the best looks?
I do, too.

It's one of my most favorite fictional fighters. :D