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Hosted Projects - FS2 Required => Inferno => Topic started by: Jake2447 on August 25, 2007, 09:31:30 pm

Title: Ship Question
Post by: Jake2447 on August 25, 2007, 09:31:30 pm
Why did the EA design the USilv beam to destoy planets if the Lucifer's two SReds do the trick?
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: darkship on August 25, 2007, 10:18:10 pm
the SRed on the lucifer renders the surface of the planet uninhabitable. Usilv blows a planets to bits, or at the very least makes a pretty big hole.
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: haloboy100 on August 25, 2007, 11:22:35 pm
the SRed on the lucifer renders the surface of the planet uninhabitable. Usilv blows a planets to bits, or at the very least makes a pretty big hole.


The primary weapon of the EASJ Icanus (at least i think that was the name) bombards the planet's surface at certain plate fault lines, causing the tectonic forces to effectively tear the planet apart. It theoretically woulden't destroy the planet out right, the way i see it, but it would cause one hell of an inferno.
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: ssmit132 on August 26, 2007, 12:24:52 am
The Lucifer did not destroy/render uninhabitable planets with SReds. It did it with Shivan Super Lasers. IIRC, Volition just put SReds on the FS2 Lucifer instead of Shivan Super Lasers. (Therefore turning it into a white elephant with less firepower than a Rakshasa-class cruiser!)
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: Snail on August 26, 2007, 01:12:13 am
And it's called the "Punisher Cannon" now, by the way.
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: Kie99 on August 27, 2007, 11:24:42 am
It would be impossible to destroy a planet with a beam cannon unless you vaporised it, gravity would bring the pieces back together.
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: Mobius on August 27, 2007, 12:20:59 pm
[...]but it would cause one hell of an inferno.

What does it mean? :wtf:

:)

It would be impossible to destroy a planet with a beam cannon unless you vaporised it, gravity would bring the pieces back together.

We don't know if the Icanus needs a single volley...I think it would fire almost everywhere, causing eruptions and catastrophe. It should be able to compromise the gravitational field by hitting the "nucleo".
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: TrashMan on August 27, 2007, 01:31:33 pm
rubbish :ick:
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: Mobius on August 27, 2007, 04:41:29 pm
No, not here. Burn him, burn him!!!
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: haloboy100 on August 27, 2007, 04:53:48 pm
[...]but it would cause one hell of an inferno.

What does it mean? :wtf:

Think of it like glassing a planet, but let the planet do the job. Basically, all the damege to the tectonic plates would cause continues gigantic tectonic earthquakes until the whole place ends up like one big volcano. Bottom line: It kills everything on the planet.

Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: Jake2447 on August 27, 2007, 06:29:19 pm
[...]but it would cause one hell of an inferno.

What does it mean? :wtf:

Think of it like glassing a planet, but let the planet do the job. Basically, all the damege to the tectonic plates would cause continues gigantic tectonic earthquakes until the whole place ends up like one big volcano. Bottom line: It kills everything on the planet



But the Lucifer caused the same effect on Vasuda Prime (not exactly, but everyone died) with much less powerful weapons.
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: haloboy100 on August 27, 2007, 06:44:10 pm
not really, they just destroyed all the cities. i think that should be enough to polute the atmosphere enough to render the surface inhospitable.
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: Jake2447 on August 27, 2007, 07:57:41 pm
not really, they just destroyed all the cities. i think that should be enough to polute the atmosphere enough to render the surface inhospitable.

Like I said.  Same effect.  No one lives there anymore.
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: haloboy100 on August 27, 2007, 08:03:48 pm
and in the end, it doesn't matter who's right or wrong,

just that we kill everything on a planet! :)
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: Darius on August 27, 2007, 09:48:32 pm
not really, they just destroyed all the cities. i think that should be enough to polute the atmosphere enough to render the surface inhospitable.

Like I said.  Same effect.  No one lives there anymore.

Except death by volcano has a psychological edge over death by pollution. The Lucifer does the job, the Icanus is there to scare the hell out of everyone.
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: Woolie Wool on August 28, 2007, 10:12:00 pm
It would be impossible to destroy a planet with a beam cannon unless you vaporised it, gravity would bring the pieces back together.

Incorrect. Put a suitably obscene amount of energy into the beam weapon and the fragments would disperse quickly enough to escape each other's gravity. This amount of energy, however, vastly exceeds anything ever seen in FreeSpace by tens of orders of magnitude. It's completelyy impossible with the known FS tech base, other than with the Sathanas subspace weapon, which seems to really open a big hole in subspace out of which pours some of subspace's energy, requiring relatively little output from the firing ship.
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: TrashMan on August 29, 2007, 05:29:22 am
It would be impossible to destroy a planet with a beam cannon unless you vaporised it, gravity would bring the pieces back together.

Incorrect. Put a suitably obscene amount of energy into the beam weapon and the fragments would disperse quickly enough to escape each other's gravity. This amount of energy, however, vastly exceeds anything ever seen in FreeSpace by tens of orders of magnitude. It's completelyy impossible with the known FS tech base, other than with the Sathanas subspace weapon, which seems to really open a big hole in subspace out of which pours some of subspace's energy, requiring relatively little output from the firing ship.

 :wtf:

We know nothing about Shvan susbspace stuff... AFAIK, that thing doesn't even appear to be a "point-and-shoot" weapon
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: colecampbell666 on August 29, 2007, 06:52:16 am
and in the end, it doesn't matter who's right or wrong,

just that we kill everything on a planet! :)
That's how I deal with problems! ;)
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: Colonol Dekker on August 29, 2007, 07:00:20 am
The Punisher cannon creates a similar effect to the T-Bomb from WC3 is that correct? cool :yes:

Quote
I'm not Dekker, please don't Kick me - go away.......IT mAy bE sOOPaH, but it hurts!
:wtf:
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: colecampbell666 on August 29, 2007, 08:04:11 am
You just noticed?
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: Jeff Vader on August 29, 2007, 08:10:45 am
Well, even if one couldn't blow up a planet entirely and the pieces were pulled back together by gravity, the planet would still be a mess and even if it would eventually become inhabitable once more, it would take longer than what dsmart needs to make a bug-free product.

There, happy now? You don't need to vaporize it, just ruin it.
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: Jake2447 on August 29, 2007, 01:13:49 pm
Well, even if one couldn't blow up a planet entirely and the pieces were pulled back together by gravity, the planet would still be a mess and even if it would eventually become inhabitable once more, it would take longer than what dsmart needs to make a bug-free product.

There, happy now? You don't need to vaporize it, just ruin it.

That was my point.  The Lucifer rendered Vasuda prime uninhabitable with just two SSLBeams. Like .1% of the firepower of the USilv.
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: Mobius on August 29, 2007, 02:23:39 pm
The USilver is supposed to destroy a planet by compromising its internal structure.
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: Jeff Vader on August 29, 2007, 02:27:12 pm
But it would still require an awfully strong shockwave, if you wanted to make sure that the fragments of the planet spread tthroughout the galaxy, never to be merged back together again.
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: Mobius on August 29, 2007, 02:32:40 pm
What do you mean with "merged back together again"? It can happen, but it doesn't mean that a new, florid planet would be the result of that process.
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: Jeff Vader on August 29, 2007, 02:38:04 pm
What do you mean with "merged back together again"? It can happen, but it doesn't mean that a new, florid planet would be the result of that process.
What I mean is that I got the idea you wanted to blow a planet up so that the pieces would spread like up to Andromeda or something. Apparently you only wanted to break the planet so that no one could live there. My bad.

I also earlier stated that part about the pieces coming together under gravity and, with the increasing pressure and heat, eventually forming a 'new' planet. But that even if it could some day support life, it would take, um... i dunno, at least hundreds, if not thousands of years.
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: Jake2447 on August 29, 2007, 02:52:35 pm
What do you mean with "merged back together again"? It can happen, but it doesn't mean that a new, florid planet would be the result of that process.
What I mean is that I got the idea you wanted to blow a planet up so that the pieces would spread like up to Andromeda or something. Apparently you only wanted to break the planet so that no one could live there. My bad.

I also earlier stated that part about the pieces coming together under gravity and, with the increasing pressure and heat, eventually forming a 'new' planet. But that even if it could some day support life, it would take, um... i dunno, at least hundreds, if not thousands of years.

try millions or billions of years
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: Jeff Vader on August 29, 2007, 02:58:53 pm
Hmm... yes, I think you are right, young grasshopper. It would indeed be in those readings. If it would even happen.
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: Jake2447 on August 29, 2007, 03:06:32 pm
Hmm... yes, I think you are right, young grasshopper. It would indeed be in those readings. If it would even happen.

Unless the chunks of planet were all exactly the same size, the new planets center would have moved, and most likely have rendered the planet uninhabitable.
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: Woolie Wool on August 29, 2007, 09:25:39 pm
It would be impossible to destroy a planet with a beam cannon unless you vaporised it, gravity would bring the pieces back together.

Incorrect. Put a suitably obscene amount of energy into the beam weapon and the fragments would disperse quickly enough to escape each other's gravity. This amount of energy, however, vastly exceeds anything ever seen in FreeSpace by tens of orders of magnitude. It's completelyy impossible with the known FS tech base, other than with the Sathanas subspace weapon, which seems to really open a big hole in subspace out of which pours some of subspace's energy, requiring relatively little output from the firing ship.

 :wtf:

We know nothing about Shvan susbspace stuff... AFAIK, that thing doesn't even appear to be a "point-and-shoot" weapon


Well, unless the Sathanas juggernauts produced the equivalent of the energy that Capella makes in several billion years, they yielded a great deal more energy than they put in. Furthermore, in Inferno, the subspace thing is a point and shoot weapon.
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: TrashMan on August 30, 2007, 04:38:54 am
Inferno...is....not...canon!

Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: Mobius on August 30, 2007, 10:14:07 am
?

He was refering to the subspace weapon...that's canon. :P
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: Wobble73 on August 30, 2007, 10:27:51 am
?

He was refering to the subspace weapon...that's canon. :P


Well, unless the Sathanas juggernauts produced the equivalent of the energy that Capella makes in several billion years, they yielded a great deal more energy than they put in. Furthermore, in Inferno, the subspace thing is a point and shoot weapon.

Inferno...is....not...canon!



 :P
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: Mobius on August 30, 2007, 10:34:52 am
What did the Shivans use to blow Capella up? :wtf:
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: Colonol Dekker on August 30, 2007, 10:53:59 am
Harsh language...........(etak :p)
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: Mobius on August 30, 2007, 11:11:37 am
Subspace technology. Subspace technology. Subspace technology. It's CANON.
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: TrashMan on August 30, 2007, 01:11:07 pm
But it's not a direct shot weapon like a beam cannon... IMHO, I don't think it can be used aganist anything else than a sun
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: Mobius on August 30, 2007, 01:15:54 pm
You don't know. We don't know if the first Sathanas(and/or Sathanas 17) was/were capable of subspace attacks, so we can't give for sure that they don't use their subspace weapon.

The fact that many Sathanas powered down leds me to think that they're not the same.
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: Dark Hunter on August 30, 2007, 02:23:31 pm
You don't know.

Neither do you.  ;)


The subspace-weapon-as-a-ship-to-ship-beam was added by Inferno. There is no reason to suspect that an FS2 Sathanas could turn its subspace device against a ship, just because an Inferno Sathanas can.

Inferno is not canon. Plain and simple.
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: TrashMan on August 30, 2007, 04:59:39 pm
You don't know. We don't know if the first Sathanas(and/or Sathanas 17) was/were capable of subspace attacks, so we can't give for sure that they don't use their subspace weapon.

The fact that many Sathanas powered down leds me to think that they're not the same.

80 Saths powered those subspace rift thingies for over TWO DAYS... that's really not a good weapon for ship-to-ship combat, even if it could be used like that. Both saths that engaged the GTVA forces never used it - since they can't - nuff said.
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: akenbosch on August 30, 2007, 05:01:43 pm
or dont have the two-days (or more) charging time in the middle of a battle. and engines would slow that time by consuming energy. i think using beams subtracts from built up energy to, so the saths engaged in battle DEFINATELY wouldnt use it.
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: Mobius on August 30, 2007, 05:07:18 pm
I know that Inferno isn't canon!

<for you :P>

1) How do you know that the subspace weapon of INFR1 was intended as an antiship weapon? In ITDoH, if I remember well, it is used to accelerate the shockwave coming from Capella. An indirect use we could see in a planetary bombardment. Many things are possible with FRED;

2) Two days of light pulsations, but just a few seconds of intense ones. *cough*Cutscene*cough*
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: boewolf on October 24, 2007, 10:25:35 am
Just something I remember about how the Lucifer whacked Vasuda Prime.  Didn't it use only those two beam weapons for something like 12 - 18 hours straight?
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: Jeff Vader on October 24, 2007, 12:14:40 pm
Quote from: Exodus Command Briefing
The Lucifer fleet bombarded Vasuda Prime from orbit for thirteen hours straight.
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: Mobius on October 24, 2007, 12:24:26 pm
That comes from FS1 :doubt:

The Lucifer did the job, I don't think other Shivan ships bombarded the planet.

Also, remember that many Vasudans attacked the Shivans. They couldn't destroy the Lucifer, but they surely destroyed many Shivan ships. And are Cains, Liliths and bombers able to bombard a planet?
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: Jeff Vader on October 24, 2007, 12:47:16 pm
1. Yes, it's from FS1. But I didn't start this. He did *points at boewolf*.
2. I'm quoting canon information which states that the fleet bombarded Vasuda. If by that they mean that the Lucy bombarded the planet while the other ships just idled there is not of my concern.
3. Again in the command briefing it was stated that several attacks were launched from nearby installations. All of them failed (well duh, what'd you expect from an attack against the Lucy in normal space?).
4. Dunno. Maybe they can drop something there? Maybe the bombers could bomb some structures on the planet or somethin'?
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: colecampbell666 on October 24, 2007, 01:13:55 pm
Off-topic, but where'd Akenbosch go?

I think that cruisers/'vettes (I know that this is FS1, I'm just saying)/destroyers could bombard planets with laser/missile fire. If Newtonian, A missile would continue indefinitely.
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: Snail on October 24, 2007, 01:30:08 pm
Well the health & safety people made missiles self-destruct when they run out of fuel. Apparently the Shivans have health & safety people too.
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: Dark Hunter on October 24, 2007, 06:11:40 pm
Off-topic, but where'd Akenbosch go?

I think that cruisers/'vettes (I know that this is FS1, I'm just saying)/destroyers could bombard planets with laser/missile fire. If Newtonian, A missile would continue indefinitely.

Did he get banned, or am I thinking of Takashi?

Anyway: I agree that the cruisers in the Lucy fleet took part in the bombardment of Vasuda Prime. It's the old argument of "did the Shivans have BEAMZ in FS1". I think the front of a Cain/Lilith looks an awful lot like the cannons on the Lucy, therefore they had beams, though they never used them in-game.

And, please, let's not start the "FS1 Shivans had beams" argument in here. I'm only stating my opinion.
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: colecampbell666 on October 24, 2007, 07:18:23 pm
He was Taka, or his brother.

EDIT: And WMC (or someone) found incomplete beam code in FS1.
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: Jake2447 on October 24, 2007, 09:40:18 pm
Off-topic, but where'd Akenbosch go?

I think that cruisers/'vettes (I know that this is FS1, I'm just saying)/destroyers could bombard planets with laser/missile fire. If Newtonian, A missile would continue indefinitely.

The missile/bobm would burn up in the atmosphere of the planet (if it was anything like earth).  Considering vasudans have spaceships, I'm assuming they need an atmosphere to breathe.
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: Mad Bomber on October 24, 2007, 10:07:34 pm
Neither Terrans nor Vasudans are shown with breathing equipment in the Command Briefing cutscene in FS1. Infer from that what you will.
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: Titan on October 25, 2007, 02:21:40 pm
i say that they have pressurized cockpits, like the SW Xwing. the suits are just against shrapnel (if the control consol blows up, but the main part of the ship is intact) and in case of atmosphere leaks, it instantly pumps oxygen into the suit, turning it into TIE-fighter style life support.
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: Colonol Dekker on October 27, 2007, 06:35:21 pm
Re: Bombs burning up in atmosphere, how come the harbingers tech entry states that they were primarily reserved for planetary bombardment then? :P
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: ssmit132 on October 27, 2007, 07:24:03 pm
Maybe Harbingers were made so they didn't burn up in the atmosphere?
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: Jake2447 on October 27, 2007, 08:44:57 pm
Re: Bombs burning up in atmosphere, how come the harbingers tech entry states that they were primarily reserved for planetary bombardment then? :P

Not all planets have atmosperes.
Title: Re: Ship Question
Post by: Dark Hunter on October 27, 2007, 11:10:35 pm
But the only planets worth bombing would.