Hard Light Productions Forums
Hosted Projects - Standalone => The Babylon Project => Topic started by: FUBAR-BDHR on January 02, 2009, 03:01:31 pm
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Anyone who wants to vote for TBP as the 2008 Indie Game of the year can do so here: http://www.moddb.com/games/the-babylon-project
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Already did :D
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I put a vote in for Diaspora and Saga as well.
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Done ;)
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I didn't vote for Saga (Tolwyn, don't read this :wtf:) despite being part of the team. Saga just doesn't deserve it with so few released content and I can't vote for it because of things that are team-only, no matter how good. It's too long in development and showing to little new.
Same for Diaspora. I want to see something before I vote. EDIT: Thought about it again. Voted. Kara is at the helm, this will deliver. Also, it has the "it's still new and alive and kicking" bonus.
But I put in an additional vote for ST:R of course :)
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Thought about it again. Voted.
Indie game of the year having not released anything and only existed for part of the year? :nervous: They'll still probably beat us anyway :).
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hey, you're back :)
yeah, Diaspora will come out on top no doubt.
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voted. :D
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Voted
somehow I got the justify that badge...
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yeah, Diaspora will come out on top no doubt.
Actually that's not necessarily true.
1) Diaspora hasn't released anything this year.
2) A lot of people who voted for BtRL last year either don't know about Diaspora or won't vote for us until we do release something
3) Since we're virtually the same team who won it last year, using many of the same models we're probably not different enough from BtRL to get anything above an honourable mention.
4) We're probably going to pull out of the whole thing anyway since we'd rather compete for MotY 2009 once we're competing completely under our own reputation and not based on BtRL's
Although I'm working hard on Diaspora right now, TBP's the indie game I'd be pushing to win this year so if you lot want to make a serious PR campaign I'll be right behind you. :)
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I'd love to see TBP win, so much effort has been put into that mod over the years that it deserves recognition.
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hey, you're back :)
Kinda. My PC is dead.
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I've noticed that the ModDB site has no actual news posted. That has the effect of making TBP look a lot more dead than it actually is. In addition, posting news gets you onto the front page of the ModDB which gets you seen by people who wouldn't otherwise notice your mod.
My suggestion would be to make a "Review of the year" style update post covering all the stuff that TBP has added to the final release since that came out. I'd make one myself but I've not kept up with TBP as much as I should these last few months so I'd miss stuff out.
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Voted.
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my thoughts similar.
We need to note the newly released campaigns, especially DoW 3 of course since that's not in the Campaign Pack. All, let's start writing something and discuss this. TBP year in review sounds great and we had some big releases this year.
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Well the major stuff I can think of that happened last year and there is a lot of it.
Multiplayer is fixed and updaded.
FH2260 ( or was that late 07?)
DC (again not sure if that was 07)
Kara, Vid and I officially join the team.
3.4B goes FINAL
Hip makes the installer
Multiplayer mission pack
Startfury pilot missions are updated and released
EMW released
DVD is released
IP steps into the shadows leaving Vid and I in charge (gasp)
Operations released
3.6.10 testing for multi begins
Several movies released.
Campaign pack 2.0
XMAS pack (includes first mods)
DOW updated and part 3
I know there is more then this but that's just off the top of my head.
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you are right, Dark Children was 08 :eek2:
I recommend nailing it down to:
- TBP going Final
- Release of Fortune Hunters 2260 and Earth-Brakiri War. Maybe DoW3 too but that was still a bit rough in 08. It's better in 09 :lol:
- Implimentation of Multiplayer with tons of missions and the Coop-Operations campaigns
- The Release of the TBP DVD along with the campaign pack 2.0
- Short mentioning of updated and new stuff that came out after CP2.0, especially the updated SF Pilot, Operations and the XMAS package
Not sure about team changes, mini-campaigns (DC) and WIP 3.6.10
Edit: Just for fun: What the hell should we do if we win :lol: :lol: :lol: ? Who to send the prizes :lol: ?
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Who to send the prizes :lol: ?
To JMS. Tell him to release the whole B5 timeline and story for us in order to recieve the prizes. :D
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From watching some of the voting I doubt we will win but I have thought about that. Depending on what it is we probably should give it to the team member(s) that can put it to the best use.
As for the news now all we need is for someone to type it up. I'm terrible at doing that stuff or there would already be news posted. :P
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my thoughts similar.
We need to note the newly released campaigns, especially DoW 3 of course since that's not in the Campaign Pack. All, let's start writing something and discuss this. TBP year in review sounds great and we had some big releases this year.
Voted.
Name the review: The Babylon Project, i was there... it sounds more B5-ish. :)
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Had some time to kill while killing some viruses on someones machine so I compiled a list of all the stuff I could find:
01/22/08 Dark Children - Vid
02/12/08 FH 2260 - Vid
02/17/08 Multiplayer goes public
02/28/08 Thursday Multiplayer sessions being
03/08/08 First MultiPack finalized
03/11/08 Vid, Kara, and FUBAR officially join the team.
03/26/08 Swantz gets his badge
04/11/08 3.4b FINAL
04/24/08 gamona.de special interview
05/09/08 Nightmare single mission - darkmaster
05/20/08 TBP installer - Hip
05/29/08 Modded mainhull and debriefing - Skullar
07/08/08 Achen Flight School - Vid
07/28/08 EBW - madabougames
07/30/08 New icons - Hip
07/31/08 Second multi mission pack
08/04/08 Star Fury Mission Pack - madaboutgames
08/14/08 Operations - Vid
08/22/08 IP transfers control of TBP to VID and FUBAR
09/06/08 DVD released - HIP
10/09/08 EACW teaser released - Skullar
10/16/08 Campaign pack 2.0 - HIP
11/18/08 Human-Narn first contact single mission - darkmaster
11/21/08 Guardian of Light Demo - darkmaster
11/23/08 VERTi60 releases the first of a series of mission recordings
12/03/08 Background collection page added
12/15/08 TBP featured in GamShark
12/19/08 Vidmaster's Defense & Leguille's B5 Font
12/23/08 FREDer package, Civilans package, and HP Auroras - Orph3u5
12/24/08 HTL Container - Col. Fishguts
12/28/08 Drums of War - Orph3u5 & DVD cover art by coderdecoder
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just curious: why is "FUB" missing on the whole list? :) Don't sell yourself short and add it to the multiplayer releases ;). By the way, the tutorial is named Achen Schooling Flight, not A.Flight School.
So how the hell do we summarize all that?
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Just do the campaign releases. That's what the public will really care about anyway. :)
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Sounds good to me.
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I recommend nailing it down to:
- TBP going Final
- Release of Fortune Hunters 2260 and Earth-Brakiri War. Maybe DoW3 too but that was still a bit rough in 08. It's better in 09 :lol:
- Implimentation of Multiplayer with tons of missions and the Coop-Operations campaigns
- The Release of the TBP DVD along with the campaign pack 2.0
- Short mentioning of updated and new stuff that came out after CP2.0, especially the updated SF Pilot, Operations and the XMAS package
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just curious: why is "FUB" missing on the whole list? :) Don't sell yourself short and add it to the multiplayer releases ;). By the way, the tutorial is named Achen Schooling Flight, not A.Flight School.
So how the hell do we summarize all that?
Well FUB is missing on the list because FUB made the list and didn't think about posting it for others to read. :p
I have Achen in my text file. Did it post as A. or something? All I did was copy and paste. :confused:
Summing the whole thing up is the fun part. One thing I would like to see included is links to the stuff not included in the DVD or campaign pack.
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could any of the native speakers do first draft? Maybe starting with It has been an interesting year for TBP :lol:
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Not all at the same time :ick:
Why the hell do I have to do this, I am GERMAN!!! :sigh: , the mother tongue is GERMAN!!! :sigh:
Okay, you ------, I'll do it.
2008 is over and with the contest starting, we thought it would be a good time to look back. The Babylon Project had a somewhat busy year with lots of new campaigns and the spectacular implementation of multiplayer.
But let's start where everything is supposed to start, in the beginning. 08 started with new material for our players, with the mini-campaign Dark Children in January and the highly anticipated sequel to Fortune Hunters, both made by Vidmaster. And while pilots were busy destroying the lesser races or being the galactic underdog going hero, the game itself was being worked on as well. Various changes occurred, most noteably the addition of the new Glide Codes with the help of Karajorma and multiplayer support along with the first missions. After having a few solid battles to take part in online, FUBAR-BHDR was responsible for creating an enormous amount of new and altered missions for players to dogfight each other, while the first Coop-Gauntlets by Vidmaster were released to the public. A regular Multiplayer Session time was introduced later, which is still valid today.
In April, TBP was declared FINAL by project leader IP Andrews and with it came new audiences (and download mirrors).
HIP63 did a great job building new installers and would continue to release packed TBP campaigns for easy install, culminating in the triumphant release of the TBP DVD in September.
But let's stay on track. The unprecedented stability TBP FINAL was a boon to mission designers and the summer brought fresh meat for the grinder again, especially with Madaboutgames' Earth-Brakiri War being finally released. Additional challenges for multiplayer and a new Tutorial mission, as well as various updates for older campaigns kept the Furies flying, we also saw the release of Operations, the first three Coop-Campaigns to tackle online.
The updates kept on coming for the rest of the year, with new fredders (=Mission Designers) joining the community and old ones returning, along with updates and first releases. We had teasers, demos, videos, new tools for fredders and the final chapter to Orph3u5's Drums of War Trilogy. And... ...2008 came to an end. Already. Seemed pretty fast for me.
The year is 2009. The game is The Babylon Project.
See you out there in Hyperspace.
Post it FUBAR? I like it.
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You always had a good way with words. Mother tongue or not. I agree this is extremely well written and very positive. I like the arbitrary use of the word "spectacular" :). One very small change I would make. TBP going FINAL is definitely noteworthy but could be misunderstood as TBP becoming DEAD. I suggest clarifying this and putting an accurately positive spin on it at the same time.
In April, TBP was declared FINAL by project leader IP Andrews and with it came new audiences (and download mirrors).
HIP63 did a great job building new installers and would continue to release packed TBP campaigns for easy install, culminating in the triumphant release of the TBP DVD in September.
The unprecedented stability of TBP FINAL was a boon to mission designers and the summer brought fresh meat for the grinder. Madaboutgames' released his long awaited Earth-Brakiri War. Additional challenges for multiplayer, a surprisingly entertaining new Tutorial mission, as well as various updates for older campaigns kept the Furies flying. We also saw the release of Operations 1.0, the first three Coop-Campaigns to tackle online.
[gramatical error corrected]
Makes me proud of what we all achieved.
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agreed and changed (and one or two other things).
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Fixed FREDders and posted.
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I just uploaded a nice screenshot as the ones we have on the page at the moment are a bit flat and lifeless looking. Were they taken with the video features turned off or something? We could definitely do with some more nice screenshots as the present ones just don't convey how pretty TBP can be.
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I think FUB turned on the gamma.
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I find the screenshots get the default desktop gamma instead of the in game one. So you need to adjust it to get them back to the in game look. As soon as I'm done with one mission and finish playing 3 others I go on another screenshot fest like I did for the DVD.
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Just read FUB's report and I would like to ask someone with power to remove the mission Nightmare from all TBP releases and anouncement since it was really the most stupid mission I have ever made.
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I don't think it is anywhere since I couldn't find the mission just the thread where you talked about it. Only place it might be is the Campaign Pack 2.0 and if it is we can't really remove it from there.
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I'll try to make and post some more videos to MODDB before the voting deadline. Maybe it'll help some getting few more votes.
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Just read FUB's report and I would like to ask someone with power to remove the mission Nightmare from all TBP releases and anouncement since it was really the most stupid mission I have ever made.
that's the way of the internet darkmaster. It remembers everything.
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Getting nervous they started updating the page but the top 100 aren't up yet. :shaking:
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Getting nervous they started updating the page but the top 100 aren't up yet. :shaking:
Slightly obviously, if we can't get in the top 100 we aren't going to win :lol:. So why be nervous? You're screenshots have been a fantastic addition to the page regardless.
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did you expect to win FUBAR :lol: ? BtrL won because of its kick-ass visuals, its crazy well done voice-acting and because BSG is running on TV. B5 hasn't been shown in 10 years (at least here).
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No but I'd like to at least make the top 100 list. Still hasn't been announced. Supposed to be in 2 hours 45 minutes.
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My guess is we'll sneak in at the bottom somewhere.
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If you got some advertising done in time, I'd say you have a good chance :) Plenty people here must have voted (I know I did), which is a solid base to start from. Add any that good pimping brought in and that should probably be enough.
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No such luck. :(
As far as I can tell nothing FS2 related made it in the top 100.
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Yeah, can't find anything either. It's a pity, TBP definitely deserved a spot there. Nothing for it but try again next year I guess... with extra pimping. There are plenty B5 fans around, just need to get their attention and get them to vote.
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Wow. We suck.
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Nah. You just didn't pimp hard enough to get past the fact that the crowd there are mainly FPS fans. :)
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Yeah. If only we'd married the concepts of Lemmings and Dragonball Z we might have been in with a chance. :sigh:
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Yeah. If only we'd married the concepts of Lemmings and Dragonball Z we might have been in with a chance. :sigh:
I wouldn't like to see Songoku wipe out the whole Shadow fleet with Kamekameha... :D
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Well there's always next year. :D
The other big problem we had was that cause we're fairly new to the ModDB we haven't built up a good store of Watchers. Watchers are very good for this sort of thing as you only need to post an update and they'll all be notified to visit your page (at which point they'd probably vote for you).
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TBP has an even bigger flaw. It's released.
Believe it or not but that's a problem :) You can't build a hype with an released product. BtrL succeeded in creating one by releasing an AWESOME demo with extremely high production values but nothing else.
Also, we need another "official" campaign. :)
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Also, we need another "official" campaign. :)
If you and anyone else want to run with my campaign idea I can give you a brain dump. Alternatively finish Fortune Hunters, get it voice acted, and make that official. You are a project leader after all and everyone (me inc) seems to love Fortune Hunters.
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Also, we need another "official" campaign. :)
:yes:
If you and anyone else want to run with my campaign idea I can give you a brain dump.
Me now curious... :D
Alternatively finish Fortune Hunters, get it voice acted, and make that official. You are a project leader after all and everyone (me inc) seems to love Fortune Hunters.
Yep, that's true.
Would be indeed cool to see the FH trilogy go official.
@Vidmaster: My BtRL mission i'm freding for a while now is on hold, 'till i get the Asteroid modelled.
Meanwhile, i started Freding a small campaign which plays in 2259...well, to cut to the point,
is it ok if i mention the FH's in it?
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see my sig :) I am always happy when people do cross overs (and some already have talked their plans over with me).
Problem is, I don't want it to be out of context completely, so send me a PM and we can come up with a way to include whatever you want to include that makes sense.
Hunters2261 will get finished, it's just taking longer than anticipated, don't worry. Late Spring 09.
I would also like to see EACW finished (man, that would be one huge flagship campaign for the mod :eek2:) but Skullar has disappeared again or so it seems.
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I wish they would at least tell you how many votes you got.
Well if nothing else we hit an all time high for downloads in a day on ModDB yesterday.
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And how about new ships ? I read an article somewhere which talked about TBP and they said TBP lack 2 things : ships and campaigns[. Now you have many people working on the campaign aspect but very few is working on the other (except the case of the Christmas pack of course, but those ships are just re-made ships, not new ships). Lack of ship also makes FREDing harder (ex : if you fred an attack on the Brakiri homeworld you will need the presence of a Cormurai, if not it is illogical, or if you want to make a campaign focusing on the Vree you will need Vree fighters...)
I know it's released but we can always include a new ship pack, but it will be hard work though.
The last thing mentioned in the article is that capship reaction is boring (it is in fact the fault of the FS2 engine itself, not the fredders, but the writters did not know about that).
No complain just pointing out something that has been pointed by someone else :)
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Err... what? TBP has so many ships you need an Inferno build to use them all. There are so many that it's almost bewildering to open the ship dropdown in FRED and trying to find the one you want.
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There is nothing stopping anyone from making new ships. All you have to do is follow the rules and make it a mod. New ships for people to use and TBP stays final.
The sad part is all the people say they are going to make new ships for their mission or their campaign but they normally disappear after a few weeks and are never heard of again. No new campaigns, no new ships.
I personally don't do single player stuff because I suck at plot and hate doing research to stay canon. I tend to concentrate on multi so I'm content to work with what is there. Well actually less until regular builds break the 130 ship limit. There is a lot of good stuff you can come up with with what is there now.
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I think besides the Lumati ship and the Thirdspace portal, every other ship seen in the show is available.
And a lot of non-canon designs.
What TBP needs are campaigns, not new ships, imo.
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What TBP needs are campaigns, not new ships, imo.
Exactly. Even single mission packs would help. All I'm saying is that if someone feels they need a new ship for a campaign to work nothing is stopping them from doing it as a mod.
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:D Well as I said before I'm a B5 fan, I see thing from the viewpoint of a B5 fan, not a FREDDer or MODDer. There is 3 types of TBP players : ones who played TBP because it's a mod of FS2, ones who played TBP because they enjoyed the B5 show too much, and the last type is a mix of the previous ones.
So let's begin, what does a B5 fan expect from TBP ? They expect to be able to participate in the Shadow War, the Earth-Minbari war, the Dilgar War, the Drakh war.. and more than that, they expect to know more about the B5 universe. (That is why many people played the B5 war game and purchased their documents, they want just to know more about the different races despicted in the show but never been seen in action)
Yes TBP has a lot of ships, but the B5 universe is huge, there is also a lot of races, and many of these races don't have even a ship in TBP. For example how to visit the Abbai homeworld when there is no Abbai ship ? How to visit Sigma957 when there is no Walker ship ? How about the Cascor, the Lumati ... ? Isn't it a little boring fighting the Vree without their fighters ? In this current state of TBP only the Earth-Minbari war can be made without any flaws (since it involved only 2 races).
How many races are there in FreeSpace ? 4 - I guess, although only 3 races sont despicted, and for 3 races you have how many ships ? Compared to the number of races in TBP we cannot say that TBP has too much ships.
Currently we have a least 6 campaigns in development and I guess all will be released this year, including some huge campaigns like EA civil war of Skullar and some extremely well done campaigns like FH series. After that the FREDDers are gonna need new ships for later development so it will be very great if a new ship pack can also be developped this year.
As I said from the beginning, those above are just my view-point, so don't take it as a serious problem though. This game is already great and as a B5 fan I appreciate it so much, that is why I decided to learn FRED and help improving it. :yes: :pimp:
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Yes TBP has a lot of ships, but the B5 universe is huge, there is also a lot of races, and many of these races don't have even a ship in TBP. For example how to visit the Abbai homeworld when there is no Abbai ship ? How to visit Sigma957 when there is no Walker ship ? How about the Cascor, the Lumati ... ? Isn't it a little boring fighting the Vree without their fighters ? In this current state of TBP only the Earth-Minbari war can be made without any flaws (since it involved only 2 races).
After that the FREDDers are gonna need new ships for later development so it will be very great if a new ship pack can also be developped this year.
As I said from the beginning, those above are just my view-point, so don't take it as a serious problem though. This game is already great and as a B5 fan I appreciate it so much, that is why I decided to learn FRED and help improving it. :yes: :pimp:
I beg to differ in some points.
It might be true that new assets ( ships or whatever ) open new possibility's, but so far only a small percentage of the already existing assets has been used in campaigns.
IIRC, most Races of the League of Non-aligned worlds trade their ships to other members or races ( confirmed are the Drazi and Brakiri ).
EA also sold a lot of freighters to other races due to their low maintenance costs.
I never saw a Vree fighter, only the two saucers that are already ingame.
The Lumati never played a major role in the show, they have been only one or two times mentioned after their appearance.
You can recreate the entire Shadow War, the Narn- Centauri War, the Earth- Minbari War, you can even create a campaign based on the Shadow war that played 1000 years ago, with Sinclair/ Valen, the thirdspace conflict, the Drakh vs ISA conflict and so many more...
I don't have anything against the idea of new ships, but you need a modeler with free time and interest in B5.
I prefer to see new campaigns with known Races, like Vidmasters FH, maybe a Dark Children 2, Skullars campaign and the next part of Guardians of Light, of course. ;)
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It might be true that new assets ( ships or whatever ) open new possibility's, but so far only a small percentage of the already existing assets has been used in campaigns.
IIRC, most Races of the League of Non-aligned worlds trade their ships to other members or races ( confirmed are the Drazi and Brakiri ).
EA also sold a lot of freighters to other races due to their low maintenance costs.
I never saw a Vree fighter, only the two saucers that are already ingame.
The Lumati never played a major role in the show, they have been only one or two times mentioned after their appearance.
I prefer to see new campaigns with known Races, like Vidmasters FH, maybe a Dark Children 2, Skullars campaign and the next part of Guardians of Light, of course. ;)
Just some information to light up some points :
1> Some assets are never used because there is only one context to put them in (like first ones' ships , although we lack the Sigma957 ship). Some can only be used very carefully like Whitestar or Vree ships.
2> Confirmed. They trade old ships (not the newest models though) ( but isn't it strange to visit the Abbai homeworld and see a bunch of Drazi and Vree ships instead of Abbai ships ? )
3> Vrees have saucer fighters (not showed in the show but in they exist in the extended universe).
Generally a campaign doesn't need additional ships, only a full-scale war needs. So far there is still no full-scale war campaign involving many races so until now it is ok but i'm pretty sure we will need more ships in the next year (2010).
Just out of curiosity there are how many campaigns of TBP currently in development ? I'm trying to make a list :
1> EA War
2> FH2261
3> Tales of the EAS Janus remake (yeah this campaign will be out this year, probably before summer, confirmed Minburo)
4> Guardian of Light
5> Awakening of the Beast
6> The Black Hand
7> Dark Ocean
Also, there was anoucements of 3 campaigns but i'm not sure they will be out this year :
7> Earth-Brakiri War 2
8> Battle at ...
9> Crusade - Project (does this project still alive ?)
Does anyone else have more to add to the list ? Judging from the number of developing projects I can say that TBP wouldn't fail in its mission huh ? :D :D
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add mine:
Dark Ocean
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I agree that TBP needs more official single player campaings but that's not the real issue why it wasn't picked in top 100. The single player is fun to play, but it only lasts till you have it completed. And presto, game has been played, ready to uinstall.
The real issue is multiplayer. Take a look at other indie winners.
Most of them are multiplayer-only games. I personally play 2 from those indie winners: C&C Reborn, C&C APB which both made it top just like last year. Guess what. They don't have a single player at all. Not even a tutorial or an official campaign, not even one single mission. It's all multiplayer fps games based on the old W3D engine enhanced with a lot of scripts. It's popular but not because it's fps (it's also based from RTS in some sort), but because it's multiplayer, teamwork and online community based games.
They also made it in top because their multiplayer is far more supported using some old and new assets making it very easy for new players to join (just download a game with the built launcher which has the official server IPs already in). More even the multiplayer is supported with websites, custom maps, online ranks, lots of scripts and bots to help both playing and ranking. The community is large, devided in many clans and the overall support is just huge.
Just take a look into comparrision. C&C APB has really dozents of online moderators and at least two server operators at all times. 8-30 players all the time on their server.
TBP has one multiplayer mod (pokes FUBAR :)) and the session is only available one day (which is reasonable considering the amount of online games).
Now with this there's no doubt that TBP and none of the FS2 mods will make it in top indie games.
So what TBP really needs, is to get a large multiplayer overhaul with at least monthly updates. Yes new campaigns are needed but it would attract more people if they were all co-op or team vs team based. Server and MP should be available all the time not just one session of the week. There should be official missions for multiplayer as well and they should support the plot cannon from the show to reflect the B5 universe as much as possible.
Such a multiplayer mission should also look interesting like e.g. Severed Dreams mission where one team defends bab5 where other are Clarks forces. The action should take place right after starting the mission - e.g one team jumps in and the fighting will start soon.
Also the FRED editors are very open to set various objectives to all multiplayer missions so making interesting missions shouldn't be a problem.
Why else wasn't TBP picked for top Indie games.
As mentioned earlier it's mainly because the project is new on moddb. It also lacks information, feedback and updates so people are not hearing from it much. The new media added and everything else is fine, but still new people are not going to watch the game for long if there are no updates (even if there are but not posted).
I've started to record missions to attract new players into the scene, but that's just a little effort. TBP needs more and serious advertising overall.
And last reason, already mentioned and very clever though, is, that this conversion has gone final. Which isn't exactly true seeming there are updates being done for the builts. I bet there will be updated stuff for the multiplayer. So let's hear from them. All updates should go to public ASAP so people won't run away after a while. And not just this forum but also places where people are searching for new games.
Well just some thoughts.
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at least there is a discussion. But please, don't act here as not getting into the 100 would a horrible failure, I would have been surprised if we made it. FlightSims aren't the most popular genre out there and not the long anticipated and well promoted ST:R made it. Despite Goober's viral marketing was great!
There are other more high-profile mods guys!!!
I agree to some discussion subjects.
Although it spins a bit out of control in the ship department. FACT is that most TBP ships never get used. Don't start argueing about that. The big exception is FH since that campaign was desiged from the beginning with one thing in mind to show what TBP is capable of (yeah okay, maybe also what I was capable of :lol:).
FACT is most campaigns concentrate on a few particular races and their ships.
TBP doesn't need new ships and to counter darkmaster's argument, you don't see many of these alien ships in the show either. Imagine we would cut the list down to canon ships, that would be a nightmare.
I agree with the single player part. We need a new high-profile release. Possible candidates are:
- Drums of War Trilogy with Voice Acting (no date but should take ages)
- Fortune Hunters Trilogy with Voice Acting (late spring 09 without voiceacting hopefully)
- EACW fully voice acted (no date at all)
still, we don't have a campaign team. We have individual fredders and they will release the stuff when it's ready. Basta, nothing to change about that. I'll gladly *pimp* any of these campaigns via modDB but first they will have to get released and they will have to work.
I also agree about Multiplayer getting more newbie friendly and FUBAR and I have already talked about this various times. We can't do anything until 3.6.10 is finally finished, although that should be soon.
I think we got more than enough missions to have some fun, although a few more complex TvT would be something. Still, these are very difficult to balance. I'll get to it when I have the time.
There will be a patch with new instructions when the time is ready.
Master has spoken.
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Seriously if everyone who complained about the lack of missions and campaigns started making use of the ONE 120+ ships and fully featured mission editor we have given them to make missions and campaigns, we would be buried under an avalanche of missions and campaigns. I'm sure we'd even host them for you to share if you asked nicely.
It's not that difficult guys. Get off your lazy asses and make something. We spent 10 years giving you this little Babylon 5 universe in a box. Now take it out of it's box and play with it.
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still, we don't have a campaign team. We have individual fredders and they will release the stuff when it's ready.
Why don't you guys team up and create a "official team" campaign?
A campaign that would work in SP and MP...
IPAndrews and Vidmaster have already worked on large scale campaigns, and FUBAR could handle the multiplayer coop version of that campaign, not alone of course.
Karajorma is also still team member although Diaspora keeps him busy, he might add one thing or another.
Maybe other guys joins in too as well.
It might draw more attention if the TBP team starts working on a "official TBP" campaign.
Just an ( coffein and nicotin induced ) idea, so please don't fire Shadow slicer beams on me... :p
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Why don't you guys team up and create a "official team" campaign?
Because TBP is FINAL. Campaign development teams are fine but they won't be "official" teams.
A campaign that would work in SP and MP...
Because single and multiplayer play completely differently and a great campaign in one is a rubbish campaign in the other.
IPAndrews and Vidmaster have already worked on large scale campaigns, and FUBAR could...
Learn how to use FRED yourselves!!! Stop relying on "official teams" to spoon feed you. I appreciate you don't want to FRED a campaign to play yourself but consider this. If you FRED something it will encourage others to FRED something you might want to play. You scratch my back I'll scratch yours. It's all about making that initial effort and not constantly asking someone else to do it for you. Who knows maybe you'll enjoy releasing something you've created to the public? I know I did.
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Well, in that case a "un-official" team campaign. :D
Like i said, just an idea,
For the FRED-it-yourself part: i work on a mission for BtRL, FREDing is to 90% finished the last 10% as soon i get the darn Asteroid modelled, which is a PITA.
Meanwhile i started FREDing a small campaign for B5.
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IPAndrews and Vidmaster have already worked on large scale campaigns, and FUBAR could...
Learn how to use FRED yourselves!!! Stop relying on "official teams" to spoon feed you. I appreciate you don't want to FRED a campaign to play yourself but consider this. If you FRED something it will encourage others to FRED something you might want to play. You scratch my back I'll scratch yours. It's all about making that initial effort and not constantly asking someone else to do it for you. Who knows maybe you'll enjoy releasing something you've created to the public? I know I did.
First fact : He know how to FRED and he is damn good at it. :D
Second fact : He is making a campaign for TBP (see the list) :D
Want a campaign team ? Easily just create a forum and invite people to join. I'm sure if IP or Vidmaster create one, then a lot of FREDers will join. Or else if Angelus create one then I will join. If I create one then noone will join though. (that is why we need someone with a reputation in the community to begin something).
If we don't want a team, how about a forum for FREDers of TBP to meet and discuss things ? Like a cafeteria ? One can talk about the progress of his latest campaign, can discuss about plot development, but more importantly it is a place for FREDers to overcome his laziness and go on. Imagine if a new Fredder wants to make s,omething for TBP, that will be a perfect place for him to get support from his superiors.
Just an idea though.
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IPAndrews and Vidmaster have already worked on large scale campaigns, and FUBAR could...
Learn how to use FRED yourselves!!! Stop relying on "official teams" to spoon feed you. I appreciate you don't want to FRED a campaign to play yourself but consider this. If you FRED something it will encourage others to FRED something you might want to play. You scratch my back I'll scratch yours. It's all about making that initial effort and not constantly asking someone else to do it for you. Who knows maybe you'll enjoy releasing something you've created to the public? I know I did.
First fact : He know how to FRED and he is damn good at it. :D
Second fact : He is making a campaign for TBP (see the list) :D
I beg to differ, i consider myself still a "nOOb" FREDer, who hates variables and the more i use them, the more i hate them.
I haven't released anything yet, it might, in a worst case scenario, turn out that people will call me "the new Derek Smart of HLP" because of the quality of my work.
Want a campaign team ? Easily just create a forum and invite people to join. I'm sure if IP or Vidmaster create one, then a lot of FREDers will join. Or else if Angelus create one then I will join. If I create one then noone will join though. (that is why we need someone with a reputation in the community to begin something).
If we don't want a team, how about a forum for FREDers of TBP to meet and discuss things ? Like a cafeteria ? One can talk about the progress of his latest campaign, can discuss about plot development, but more importantly it is a place for FREDers to overcome his laziness and go on. Imagine if a new Fredder wants to make s,omething for TBP, that will be a perfect place for him to get support from his superiors.
Just an idea though.
I don't think there is a seperate forum needed, most things can be discussed here or via PM/ IM.
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First fact : He know how to FRED and he is damn good at it. :D
Second fact : He is making a campaign for TBP (see the list) :D
That's great I'm very impressed. Consider me humbled and humiliated.
Want a campaign team ? Easily just create a forum and invite people to join. I'm sure if IP or Vidmaster create one, then a lot of FREDers will join.
Again with the reliance on myself and Vidmaster though. Anyone can start a team. But the best way to approach it is to get your campaign concept together first and then recruit a team. That way you get people onboard who are interested in the idea. The division of work makes things quicker and ensures you get missions written by other people to test. Which keeps things interesting.
Don't get an uber FRED team together and expect them to be enthusiastic about every campaign concept. I remember Skullar kept trying to get me to work on Earth Alliance Civil War but I did _nothing_ for it. Because I had to enthusiasm for it and no amount of convincing could change my mind.
(that is why we need someone with a reputation in the community to begin something)
Reputations are built. Any of you could knock up a three mission mini campaign (multiplayer ones are fun) in a few days. Suddenly, you have a reputation. People like you. Women especially. Hot chicks want to have sex with you. It's a rock and roll lifestyle. I remember the orgy at the Raider Wars wrap party. The girl dressed as Eris blew my... mind.
If we don't want a team, how about a forum for FREDers of TBP to meet and discuss things ?
That's one for the new bosses but Karajorma's general purpose FRED forum is a mecca for FRED experts. Kara himself is *the* expert bar none and will often answer your question before you've actually asked it. Which is quite freaky.
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I beg to differ, i consider myself still a "nOOb" FREDer, who hates variables and the more i use them, the more i hate them.
Expect a love hate relationship with FRED. It's very powerful, but quite strange. I hate FRED but love the things I've been able to do with it.
I haven't released anything yet, it might, in a worst case scenario, turn out that people will call me "the new Derek Smart of HLP"
Only Derek Smart is Derek Smart.
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There is another thing that makes campaign teams difficult. Campaign teams need to work together. :lol:
Which is damn difficult, since every fredder has a different style, uses sexps in a different way, does things different! Not to mention they need to agree on a story, on characters and so on.
Teams are hellishly difficult.
Seriously, I understand you all want to play something new. But creating good things TAKES TIME. Free time to be precise. And you only have full controll over what you are fredding if you are doing it by yourself!
Either Patience or Fred yourselves.
We support new fredders, we answer questions, we help out with some story problems and if you remember I am part of that We.
About that forum: We have one. Just look at your thread. I liked that. I think really benefits missions, especially by new people. But not every fredder likes that. For example, I don't discuss what I am doing in the public. It's just the way I work.
IP said it: Everybody can start a team.
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I beg to differ, i consider myself still a "nOOb" FREDer, who hates variables and the more i use them, the more i hate them.
Expect a love hate relationship with FRED. It's very powerful, but quite strange. I hate FRED but love the things I've been able to do with it.
I have that one already, it isn't that bad actually. It's a more love then hate relationship.
Variables are what makes me want sometimes to through my computer out of the window.
I haven't released anything yet, it might, in a worst case scenario, turn out that people will call me "the new Derek Smart of HLP"
Only Derek Smart is Derek Smart.
I feel relieved somehow... :)
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My experience of working with a team was a positive one. You'll notice there are many people involved in the Raider Wars missions. I think there must have been 4 or 5 mission designers in addition to myself. You will also notice though that my name is in the credits for every mission. That's because in many cases I would take the mission as written by the team member and then tweak the mission until it fitted in with my overall vision of the campaign. So as project leader I put a lot of work into every mission. That said, where someone else is credited for a mission they did a lot of work and it's this wider team that is responsible for Raider Wars being released.
I really want to FRED something else I'm seriously pissed off my computer is fried.
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Women especially. Hot chicks want to have sex with you. It's a rock and roll lifestyle.
now that would be something.
You won't find teammates when it starts like hey, I wrote that cool script, now would you fred it for me?
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Yes it is better to FRED alone than working in a team.
A"team" is there to boost the motivation rather than to work together.
About "that" forum :
I think if you want to chat freely with other FREDDers it is good to have a separate forum. The subject is not only FREDding issues but also plotline issues, real life issues, internet issues, programming issues ...
The spirit is to have a place like the B5 station,which give birth to an "alliance" of TBP FREDders ;7. They work separately but they do "trade" and chat there.
Excuse me I'm a little dreamy today lol
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and how to become a fredder darkmaster? you ask me to give everybody permission to a secret fredder forum or what? and on what conditions? after sb released something for TBP? something good? or if sb claims he or she wants to fred?
I hope you realize that is silly.
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I think if you want to chat freely with other FREDDers it is good to have a separate forum. The subject is not only FREDding issues but also plotline issues, real life issues, internet issues, programming issues ...
General FRED discussion. (http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php/board,89.0.html)
TBP specific FRED discussion. (http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php/board,105.0.html)
Campaign plotlines (http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php/board,105.0.html)
Real life issues (http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php/topic,53623.0.html)
Internet issues (http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php/board,19.0.html)
Programming issues (http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php/board,166.0.html)
First place to look before requesting new forums (http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php)
Hope that helps.
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Want a campaign team ? Easily just create a forum and invite people to join. I'm sure if IP or Vidmaster create one, then a lot of FREDers will join. Or else if Angelus create one then I will join. If I create one then noone will join though. (that is why we need someone with a reputation in the community to begin something).
Let's take Vidmaster as an example. He's a good choice cause I think we'll all agree that he's a very good mission designer. However if you go back in time to a year and a half ago (http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php/topic,49010.0.html) he obviously knew very little about FREDding. Go forwards a mere three months (http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php/topic,50262.0.html) though and he's already releasing campaigns and building a reputation.
My basic point is that Vid went from newbie to respected FREDder in only three months. I do agree that a reputation helps when forming a team. But you can make a solo campaign to get you that reputation quickly if you are good.
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Want a campaign team ? Easily just create a forum and invite people to join. I'm sure if IP or Vidmaster create one, then a lot of FREDers will join. Or else if Angelus create one then I will join. If I create one then noone will join though. (that is why we need someone with a reputation in the community to begin something).
Let's take Vidmaster as an example. He's a good choice cause I think we'll all agree that he's a very good mission designer. However if you go back in time to a year and a half ago (http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php/topic,49010.0.html) he obviously knew very little about FREDding. Go forwards a mere three months (http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php/topic,50262.0.html) though and he's already releasing campaigns and building a reputation.
My basic point is that Vid went from newbie to respected FREDder in only three months. I do agree that a reputation helps when forming a team. But you can make a solo campaign to get you that reputation quickly if you are good.
:eek2: :eek2: :eek2: :eek2: Well he is probably not a human. (no offense here)
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:eek2: :eek2: :eek2: :eek2: Well he is probably not a human. (no offense here)
Frankly. This kind of talk is neither helpful or accurate.
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I had previous game/map/campaign design experience from many other games, Escape Veloctiy, Ares, Warcraft 3.
Still, I was lurking around HLP about 2 years and never even touched FRED. Sometimes, demanding silly things from people (PLEASE DON'T SEARCH THE FORUMS FOR THESE POSTS BACK THEN!!! :shaking:)
But someday, I thought: Hey pal, I know you (=me) are creative, now starting learning this damn editor, make something for yourself and stun a few people :lol:.
FH was sort of a revelation, I agree. I was shocked myself that it turned out to be so popular.