Hard Light Productions Forums
Hosted Projects - FS2 Required => Blue Planet => Topic started by: redsniper on September 24, 2012, 11:43:00 pm
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I realize it was already mentioned in some thread, but it's another thing to actually see it...
(http://i.imgur.com/0etPx.png)
:eek::eek::eek::eek: :eek2: :eek2: :shaking::shaking::shaking::shaking:
:eek: :eek: :eek2::eek2: :eek2::eek2: :shaking:
:eek: :eek: :eek2: :eek2::eek2: :eek2: :shaking:
:eek: :eek: :eek2: :eek2: :eek2: :shaking: :shaking::shaking::shaking:
:eek: :eek: :eek2: :eek2: :shaking: :shaking:
:eek::eek::eek::eek: :eek2: :eek2: :shaking::shaking::shaking::shaking:
(but why is that S backwards...?)
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It's referring to Bozch of course, the Evil (Good?) Twin of Bosch.
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The backwards "S" refers to a "2," fool.
This clearly foretells the Second Coming of the Booz-ed One. Boozelbub. I mean Bosch. He's also very handy with tools.
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I'm more surprised you made something out of smilies. I've hit a wall trying to do that.
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My apologies for your unsuccessful attempt to apprehend me, pilots. You would do well to question the wisdom of your leaders. Helm, engage subspace drive.
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(but why is that S backwards...?)
It's not. You're upside down. Notice that every other letter is the same reversed vertically. :P
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Huh, I tried flying to the other side and looking down and it didn't look right though. Guess I just goofed. It was late okay... :nervous:
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"I regret your efforts to intercept us have failed, pilots. You would be well advised to question the wisdom of your leaders. For I have become death, destroyer of worlds."
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Freespace 3: Bosch super shivan smash
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Freespace 3: Bosch super shivan smash
He pilots a Loki and doesn't afraid of anything
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:eek::eek::eek::eek: :eek2: :eek2: :shaking::shaking::shaking::shaking:
:eek: :eek: :eek2::eek2: :eek2::eek2: :shaking:
:eek: :eek: :eek2: :eek2::eek2: :eek2: :shaking:
:eek: :eek: :eek2: :eek2: :eek2: :shaking: :shaking::shaking::shaking:
:eek: :eek: :eek2: :eek2: :shaking: :shaking:
:eek::eek::eek::eek: :eek2: :eek2: :shaking::shaking::shaking::shaking:
You have too much time on your hands. :p
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Except I don't! I just squander it on silly things. :p
I know you're all jealous of my amazing smiley art. It's okay.
So anyways. I know we've worked this out before, but I did some figuring and figured (again) that if Laporte's a young adult during WiH, she could totally have been born either during or a few years before FS2. Which then syncs up nicely with her having nagari acid trips as a child and Bosch getting all YOU WILL ADAPT TO SERVICE US by the Shivans, or whatever happened to him. So I guess his job now is to seek out nagari sensitive humans (at least) and convince them to.... kill ants? Red ants and black ants. Who are the ants? It could be so many pairs, so many wars or potential wars. Fed/Tev, Terran/Vasudan, Vish/Shiv...
So then I wonder, are the Shivans really just trying to take us down from the inside? That seems too simple. Maybe they know something about the Vishnans we don't and they're actually trying to help us (what a tweest! (not likely)). Either way, I'm getting worried about how things will turn out. Poor Laporte... (http://i.somethingawful.com/forumsystem/emoticons/emot-ohdear.png)
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She's getting what she deserves for working for the UEF.
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I hope you all Tev Zod lovers burn, preferably from supernovas. :drevil:
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She's getting what she deserves for working for the UEF.
So defending the country you where born in against an unprovoked attack is making you deserving of seeing your love die a slow and very painfull death by radiation poisening and having someone mess with your head in your opinion?
I hope that was just bravado or spur of the moment rather than a real, well considered opinion or I shudder to think what you'd do with a real criminal....
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She's getting what she deserves for working for the UEF.
:nono:
That's it. I'm joining the HoL.
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She's getting what she deserves for working for the UEF.
So defending the country you where born in against an unprovoked attack is making you deserving of seeing your love die a slow and very painfull death by radiation poisening and having someone mess with your head in your opinion?
I hope that was just bravado or spur of the moment rather than a real, well considered opinion or I shudder to think what you'd do with a real criminal....
Of course it was a spur of the moment joke Norbert, I'm not a blood thirsty maniac.
I actually have a lot of sympathy for Laporte, and for the UEF in general, but I happen to agree with the security council and their priorities.
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She's getting what she deserves for working for the UEF.
So defending the country you where born in against an unprovoked attack is making you deserving of seeing your love die a slow and very painfull death by radiation poisening and having someone mess with your head in your opinion?
I hope that was just bravado or spur of the moment rather than a real, well considered opinion or I shudder to think what you'd do with a real criminal....
Uh... damn, man. You may have noticed that a lot of BP fans like to casually roleplay supporting one side or the other, while IRL recognizing that it's a very morally gray story and neither side is wholly good or bad.
That said, all you bloodthirsty scumbag tevs need to just gtfo Sol and die. Buntu 4 LyFe!
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Free Deneb!
:nervous:
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She's getting what she deserves for working for the UEF.
So defending the country you where born in against an unprovoked attack is making you deserving of seeing your love die a slow and very painfull death by radiation poisening and having someone mess with your head in your opinion?
I hope that was just bravado or spur of the moment rather than a real, well considered opinion or I shudder to think what you'd do with a real criminal....
Uh... damn, man. You may have noticed that a lot of BP fans like to casually roleplay supporting one side or the other, while IRL recognizing that it's a very morally gray story and neither side is wholly good or bad.
That said, all you bloodthirsty scumbag tevs need to just gtfo Sol and die. Buntu 4 LyFe!
You wanna go you Buntu hippie?
I'll have you know that not only do I have the might of the GTVA behind me, I also happen to be a Pokemon Master. So you're toast.
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Me Shivan. Me about to eat all you. All you tribe wars are futile.
Prepare for degustation process.
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Uh... damn, man. You may have noticed that a lot of BP fans like to casually roleplay supporting one side or the other, while IRL recognizing that it's a very morally gray story and neither side is wholly good or bad.
I know. I just don't react well at all to jokes about such horrific things as radiation poisening. Those things are just not funny.
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It's no more not-funny than most of the rest of BP.
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I hate how people go hurrdurr Buntu and hurrdurr gtva
One is a supposed utopia ruled by old people with mind control, and the GTVA appears to be more or less ruled be dicktaters of potatoes, who attack people because apparently ububbytu will eat babies or some stupid **** like that. UEF and BP!GTVA suck. I'll be laughing when the Shivans destroy your pwecious suns.
Plus, they have the same name as the SupCom faction. That's sacrilege.
I mean really god, I like BP, but BP's GTVA is filled with violent buttholes and the ububbytu people are filled with what is clearly mind control. I remember someone here essentially said "hurrdurr read da bakstorrie aigan!11"
The thing is, I have read the backstory for BP. And it is one-hundred percent bull that the Elders can somehow manipulate racists, religious fanatics, genocidal dicks, and a large variety of less than agreeable people and get them to either agree or be nice to people the aforementioned disagreeable people despise or hate the guts out of. In order for them to succeed in somehow manipulating them 100% of the time, as the backstory seems to claim, they either have magic, which they pulled out of their ass, and they have MIND CONTROL
And you want to know what? That's bad. Really bad. So is the GTVA security council being sphess dicktaters of potatoes.
I would be happy to see some schism in the civilian population of the UEF, though. It will put an end to this stupid, stupid, "hurrdurr elders are infallible!11" myth that seems to perpetuate Blue Planet. I would also like to see better reasoning for why Ubuntu is apparently some kind of major threat, unless you're just going to say that imperialists took over the GTVA security council and told them to go kill hippies.
If I ruined any conversation here, I'd like to say that I wanted to get this off my chest, and that no, I will not be apologizing to any crazed RPer's days I might have ruined.
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Basically the only thing that would make your post correct is replacing "mind control" with "education".
Because that's what happened. Education. You'd be surprised how effective it can be.
And I'm not talking about brain washing, but actual education.
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Oh, and there's that too. Indoctrination through education.
Seriously guys, stop having fun
both factions are largely comprised of dicks
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And yes, you should read the backstory, because despite your claims, you obviously have missed huge chunks of it. I redirect you here (http://www.hard-light.net/wiki/index.php/Blue_Planet_Extras_Portal). Any conversation with you will be utterly futile until that happens.
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Sorry, this is a No Shivans Club.
Gather your brethren and GTFO.
(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_bcS60NRiXFk/SuPW5xSsxZI/AAAAAAAACzY/KiMMvlyzqCI/s400/get-out.jpg)
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Just, let us Carl. I need to worship him every night before going to bed.
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Of course it was a spur of the moment joke Norbert, I'm not a blood thirsty maniac.
Too late. They've already initiated me. :P
@BritishShivans:
Oh my God! Look! Their culture is different! :shaking: It's obviously because they are brainwashed sheep! KILL THEM ALL!!!
No, seriously, you're the one who's been brainwashed if you think that way. The citizens in the UEF have achieved a degree of enlightenment that makes the GTVA citizens seems like dumb, barbarous monkeys in comparison. The ideals they stand for are fully achievable as is demonstrated by their own society, and they are now fighting to defend that.
Now, in my opinion:
Are they perfect? No. Nothing is.
Do they have the moral high ground? By all means.
Should they renounce to a part of their pacifism in order to defend themselves more aggressively and have a chance of protecting their society? If the resulting society is still better than the GTVA, hell yes.
Does their ideology make them be less prepared than the GTVA for a Shivan invasion? Maybe. But the point is moot. You can never be prepared for a Shivan invasion. Even if you dedicate every spare inch of the entire industrial complex of both the GTVA and the UEF to produce ships for the next 50 years (which, by the way, is unsustainable for such a long period of time anyway), you would still get lolstomped by the Shivan when they decide to show up with their fleet of 80 Juggernauts and whatever else they find convenient to bring with them this time around.
So I say, our best chance is to live the rest of our time in peaceful coexistence, and maybe, just MAYBE, if what we know of the Shivans and Vishnans is the truth and not some silly and pointless fabrication of the truth on their part (and why would they do that anyway?), then MAYBE they will leave us alone. It still seems like the most reasonable choice, considering a military solution for the Shivan threat is plain impossible in this period of Terran and Vasudan history.
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The citizens in the UEF have achieved a degree of enlightenment that makes the GTVA citizens seems like dumb, barbarous monkeys in comparison. The ideals they stand for are fully achievable as is demonstrated by their own society, and they are now fighting to defend that.
Have they? What are the Fedayeen for, then? If the UEF is so enlightened and so awesome to live in, what's the black ops group for? What are Durgas and Vajradharas and massive antimatter stockpiles for? Why did the pacifist Elders allow the Solaris-class to be built and armed so extensively? None of these things are needed for police action.
I wouldn't go so far as to say mind control, but I'm convinced there's a dark side to the UEF we haven't seen yet.
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I think there's a bit of a misconception here. Just because the "average" UEF citizen is more educated, and less likely to exhibit certain behaviour patterns doesn't mean that all of them are like that. Also note that it is explicitly mentioned in canon that the Jovian Republic populace is noticeably skeptic about the whole Ubuntu thing themselves; they have adapted the economic and some of the social aspects, but they are a distinct culture within the UEF.
And that is without taking the GEF into the equation.
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I'm convinced there's a dark side to the UEF we haven't seen yet.
This I'm pretty certain of and I'm really intrigued to see how it plays out.
I'm also certain that mind control isn't the only way the UEF could reach the state it did. I mean seriously this is way in the future. Look at how far we've come since the 1700s, you know?
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Down with the Buntu's! Bombard their cities!
Reclaim humanities birth cradle from the hippies!
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I would be happy to see some schism in the civilian population of the UEF, though.
If you've played the campaign you've already seen some of this. The cultural divisions between Earth, Mars and Jupiter are fairly profound (and these regions are themselves nowhere near homogenous).
It will put an end to this stupid, stupid, "hurrdurr elders are infallible!11" myth that seems to perpetuate Blue Planet.
By 'perpetuate' I assume you mean, uh, permeate? I think it's hard to support that reading. The fluff certainly doesn't seem to think the Elders are infallible, since they constantly make big strategic blunders, and the characters certainly don't think so, to the point of vicious arguments between high-level command staff about the 'wisdom of the Elders'.
I would also like to see better reasoning for why Ubuntu is apparently some kind of major threat, unless you're just going to say that imperialists took over the GTVA security council and told them to go kill hippies.
The reasoning for why Ubuntu is both so successful and such a major threat is science fiction. Using centuries of data and mind-boggling powerful computers (consider the difference between a modern missile warhead and FreeSpace's nukes, modern armor and FreeSpace's nuke-drinking plating; now consider the difference between a modern mainframe and a UEF supercomputer) they have refined the modern 'soft' sciences of social projection, political analysis, and economic intervention into a rigorous though not infallible technology.
The GTVA took hostile action against the UEF because it believed that the UEF had both the motive and the means to destroy GTVA society from the inside out. As practiced pragmatists it was a risk they couldn't accept. The GTVA is no stranger to extreme risks; during FS2 they allowed Bosch to complete ETAK and conduct his rebellion, at the costs of hundreds of thousands of lives, just so they could get their hands on the schematics. They even sabotaged their own ultra-warship to allow the Iceni to make it through the Knossos blockade.
You're right that both sides are full of assholes and terrible ideas, but they're also both full of good people and great ideas. (It's interesting that people seem to have the same range of perspectives about the BPverse as real life.)
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So when is teh evol Fedayi gonna take over the UESN ?
Also, many people don't get it yet, the GTVA is doomed because in Freespace you don't fight Shivans, Shivans fight you!
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If the Shivans are fighting us they don't seem to be doing such a good job. Their fighters/weapons have their training wheels on, and instead of using those 80 jugs to blow up a star they could've steamrolled over the entire GTVA, it's not like we had the tech to stop them.
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Comrade Skalin likes to let enemies glimpse hope before being crushed mercilessly!
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The reasoning for why Ubuntu is both so successful and such a major threat is science fiction. Using centuries of data and mind-boggling powerful computers (consider the difference between a modern missile warhead and FreeSpace's nukes, modern armor and FreeSpace's nuke-drinking plating; now consider the difference between a modern mainframe and a UEF supercomputer) they have refined the modern 'soft' sciences of social projection, political analysis, and economic intervention into a rigorous though not infallible technology.
The GTVA took hostile action against the UEF because it believed that the UEF had both the motive and the means to destroy GTVA society from the inside out. As practiced pragmatists it was a risk they couldn't accept.
What I wonder right now is what the supercomputers in the GTVA HQ are "predicting" the future psychohistoric outcomes given the last 20 months of GTVA interference.
Do they still project an Ubuntu danger towards the outer terran colonies? Have such negative trends increased or decreased?
And for how long and how frequent are the decisions of the GTVA being processed into their scenarios? Is it possible to conceive that the GTVA's actions can become apparently unintelligible, strange and awkward, seemingly contradictive or downright stupid for a human mind, because too much trust is being placed on the constant consultations on this oracle?
The scenario above is an extreme (and interesting in its own regard, with multiple political ramifications*) but I do wonder given the whole awkwardness of the GTVA's actions in the war, wanting to get ahold of Earth but apparently being shy of actually getting their hands dirty for not wanting to enrage the populations... wanting to win the war quickly using patience as a weapon... and so on.
* a very interesting ramification is the possibility that the catastrophe predicted by the psychohistorians has been oversold, and a very particular strand of groupthink inside a community of psychohistorians and computer AIs has lost its objectivity in their scenarios, jumping to a dark conclusion and starting a war.
Variants of this idea may include political sleaziness fudging the models and their predictions towards the wanted outcomes and wanted "reports". The war would have begun with a premeditated lie. However I prefer the first variant for it is rather more ironic. It can even become more ironic if the acts in this war provoke the very things the war was designed to deter.
I'm a sucker for irony, what can I say?
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The citizens in the UEF have achieved a degree of enlightenment that makes the GTVA citizens seems like dumb, barbarous monkeys in comparison. The ideals they stand for are fully achievable as is demonstrated by their own society, and they are now fighting to defend that.
Have they? What are the Fedayeen for, then? If the UEF is so enlightened and so awesome to live in, what's the black ops group for? What are Durgas and Vajradharas and massive antimatter stockpiles for? Why did the pacifist Elders allow the Solaris-class to be built and armed so extensively? None of these things are needed for police action.
Do you remember the speech at the end of FS1?
"All the jumpnodes have been destroyed, but they can rebuild them, but not in my lifetime" or something like that.
The UEF knew about the existance of the Shivans and they were taking some precausions against them.
And to reiterate a point that was made dozens of times already: The UEF are NOT pacifists!
The very existance of such a powerfull military and the fact that they suvived 18 month of war against the highly tuned warmachine of the GTVA is proof of that. Just because you avoid unnecessary violence doesn't make you a pacifist.
As for the Fedayeen: A black-ops operation is far more effective in rooting out terrorists than the regular military. And if hardly anyone knows they even exists, that makes infiltrating the enemies that much easier.
Apart from that, they are also closely tied into the whole Nagari matter and thus somehow connected with the Shivans and the Vishnans, which is something that we will hopefully learn about in WiH2 and BP3. Not everyhing that is hidden is a dark side.
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Do you remember the speech at the end of FS1?
"All the jumpnodes have been destroyed, but they can rebuild them, but not in my lifetime" or something like that.
What speech? I'm pretty sure this wasn't in vanilla FS1.
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Yeah, it is. It's the end cutscene.
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Do you remember the speech at the end of FS1?
"All the jumpnodes have been destroyed, but they can rebuild them, but not in my lifetime" or something like that.
What speech? I'm pretty sure this wasn't in vanilla FS1.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i5sdlDK0TOw at 2:21
"all the jumppoints from Earth are gone, but the Shivans can rebuild them. I'm told we can expect them again, but not in my lifetime. Such is liberation" being the exact quote.
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So when is teh evol Fedayi gonna take over the UESN ?
Also, many people don't get it yet, the GTVA is doomed because in Freespace you don't fight Shivans, Shivans fight you!
OK no more vodka for you ensign.
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So when is teh evol Fedayi gonna take over the UESN ?
Also, many people don't get it yet, the GTVA is doomed because in Freespace you don't fight Shivans, Shivans fight you!
Comrade Skalin likes to let enemies glimpse hope before being crushed mercilessly!
(http://img266.imageshack.us/img266/5805/wtfamireadingg.jpg)
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What the f*** am I reading?
KEN
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You're reading the words of BOZCH!
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And/or zodsch
e: I really need to stop doing things like this
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Norbert, you are working against things Battuta has explicitly said by trying to depict the UEF as not having a dark side. The UEF-GTVA war is meant to be ambiguous, and part of the reason for that is going to be the Fedayeen and their actions.
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I not saying the UEF doesn't have a dark side. I'm just saying the existance of the military and the Fedayeen alone is by itself not a darkside.
And I hope one day people will stop calling the UEF pacifists, since they aren't.
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:eek2:
Wiki article updated. Take a look. (http://www.hard-light.net/wiki/index.php?title=Ken&curid=6973&diff=40483&oldid=39613)
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BOZCH lives on.
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:eek2:
Wiki article updated. Take a look. (http://www.hard-light.net/wiki/index.php?title=Ken&curid=6973&diff=40483&oldid=39613)
It's BOSCH, not BOZCH. Read the thread on why the OP was slightly wrong and then correct the wiki, please.
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Ah, but Andro wrote "when viewed from above" and if we take "above" to be the +Y axis in FRED (which I did) and look "down" at the containers from there (which I did, much like I would for the enemy's gate too), then it does spell out BOZCH. It's just jokes man. I don't think anyone's going to get seriously misled by it.
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WIKI IS CIRIUS BUSINIISS.
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The Wiki is Sirius, and don't call it Shirley.
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:eek2:
Wiki article updated. Take a look. (http://www.hard-light.net/wiki/index.php?title=Ken&curid=6973&diff=40483&oldid=39613)
It's BOSCH, not BOZCH. Read the thread on why the OP was slightly wrong and then correct the wiki, please.
You know the wiki is a wiki, right? :p
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I'm not registered in it, and I'm not going to to change a Z to an S.
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*Ahem* Gentlemen, I do belive I found the correct angle, with the sun being on the same plane.
[attachment removed and sold on the black market]
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So those are crates.... of BOSCH BEER :eek2:
Now everything is so clear, cristal clear.
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The Wiki is Sirius, and don't call it Shirley.
:yes:
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Ah, good catch. (http://www.hard-light.net/wiki/index.php?title=Ken&curid=6973&diff=40484&oldid=40483)
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The citizens in the UEF have achieved a degree of enlightenment that makes the GTVA citizens seems like dumb, barbarous monkeys in comparison. The ideals they stand for are fully achievable as is demonstrated by their own society, and they are now fighting to defend that.
Have they? What are the Fedayeen for, then? If the UEF is so enlightened and so awesome to live in, what's the black ops group for? What are Durgas and Vajradharas and massive antimatter stockpiles for? Why did the pacifist Elders allow the Solaris-class to be built and armed so extensively? None of these things are needed for police action.
I wouldn't go so far as to say mind control, but I'm convinced there's a dark side to the UEF we haven't seen yet.
Actually, there are some valid arguments for the Solaris project beyond a 'dark side'. For starters, the threat of a future Shivan attack is real; nodes form all the time, and even if a semi-stable node is a rarity, the possibility is nonetheless there, and Vasuda Prime set a chilling example for the consequences of being unprepared.
As for anti-police action: still quite useful. Massive carriers are really helpful in that regard, as you can sortie dozens of wings all over the place and service your fighter complement all in the same place. They also make for geopolitical stabilizers--they're too expensive to churn out in any kind of subtle or ambiguous way; any faction that tries to make a second one immediately becomes very suspicious from a number of angles. And a Solaris is such a powerful strategic force compared to bog-standard Karunas and Narayanas that it makes smaller arms races less significant. It's also a nice psychological aegis--if a big threat were to show up, the Solaris-class destroyers would be a surefire answer.
The technology, science, and experience gains for producing the class is also noteworthy--the lessons learned in so many areas would be valuable.
Could the money be better spent under the circumstances? Sure, you could easily argue that. But it wasn't wasteful even before AoA.
And, of course, that doesn't mean that there wasn't some more discrete or sinister motivations behind it all--just that there are valid reasons for doing it even within the context of official Ubuntu policy.
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Besides, the whole parliament (or whatever they have) must have made a majority vote in favour of the Solaris' being build. I know theoretically such a decision could be made in a ministry alone, but with such a big project, someone's bound to drag it into the parliament (at least in my country it's always like that. Small decisions are made by the defense ministry, but as soon as a big decision is going on, one political party or the other drags it up the juristiction line and tries to get public opinion plusses with it).
While the Elders might have a great deal of influence, they have no actual juristiction over government matters as far as I understand the UEF political system and wether massive battleships are build/bought or not does sound like something only the government(s) can decide.
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The Solaris is next-to-nothing economically speaking inside an economy the size of Sol, with the amount of peaceful time they've had so far, when compared with the amount of military spending of the outer human systems, plus the huge investment on the sol jump gate.
Sol is a sleeping giant. GTVA wants to "awaken it".
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It might be nothing compared to the whole economy of Sol, but that's not where the politicians would look.
They would have compared the cost (both for building and running) of the new design with the cost of those already in service. And compared to the Karuna, Sanctus and Narayana a Solaris is boud to be a massive investment.
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Well that is somewhat meaningless. Isn't the Solaris an investment in the same order of magnitude of what the Orion was dozens of years before?
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Probably, but those were build by the GTA, before the Ubuntu party came to power (or even existed?). Also I imagine that most of the Orions were build during war, which tends to change priorities. On top of that the Solaris were discussed and build in a time when Sol wasn't just at peace, but completely isolated from any possible enemy, except themselfs.
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Weren't Jupiter and Mars independent from Ubuntu Earth?
Perhaps a small arms race build up?