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Hosted Projects - Standalone => WoD Forum Game => Wings of Dawn => WoD Forum Game: Generation 1 Archive => Topic started by: Spoon on July 14, 2013, 06:19:39 pm

Title: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on July 14, 2013, 06:19:39 pm
This is the general thread for discussing strategy among each other and for asking questions about the game or rules. The second and third post will be updated as the game progresses. The third post will always display the current turn.
This is not the actual game thread.

Fleet orders:

A fleet can take one major and one minor action each turn. The order in which you declare these actions matter.

Major Action:
Engage enemy: Orders the fleet to fight target enemy fleet in the same system.
Defend: Fleet takes up defensive positions in friendly controlled system giving a +2 bonus to attack strength for the next battle in that system.
Secure: Turns a hostile system into a friendly system. The system can only be secured if no enemy fleets are present.
Travel: Moves a fleet from one system to another.
 - If a fleet moves from a contested system to an other system it is considered a retreat. If there are no friendly fleets to cover the retreat the retreating fleet will take damage.
 - If a fleet is in a contested system with an enemy fleet it cannot move to an enemy control system.
   - The exceptions to this rule are the Aquarius nebula system and the Sol Force Blitz ability.
 - A fleet can move from one contested system to an other contested system. This also counts as a retreat.
Resupply: Can only be done in a friendly system with an open supply route, resupplying will replenish 30% of the fleet's strength and raise the morale back to the fleet's base stat if it was lower than that. Take care not to get attacked while resupplying, its bad for morale and your fleet will take extra damage. Resupplying takes 10 resouces from the global resource pool.

Minor Action:
Travel
Resupply
Use Special:
Uses your fleet's special ability.

Fleet Abilities:

Blitz: Allows a fleet to break through enemy lines and advance into a nearby system.
When using Blitz you must target one enemy fleet and the target system that you want to move into. You will deal half damage to the targeted fleet.
Cooldown: 2 turns

Prepare Barrage: Uses heavy weaponry to deal extra damage to enemy capital ships the next time the fleet does battle. (+4 to next capital ship attack)
Cooldown: 2 turns

Zeal: Raises morale by one step.
Cooldown: 2 turns

Mercs: At the cost of 10 resources, bolsters your fleet with mercenary forces. Adding 75% fighter strength and 50% capital strength
Every turn you contract these mercenaries costs 5 resources upkeep. You can dismiss the mercenaries earlier but you will need to wait out the cooldown before you can contract them again.
Can only be used in friendly controlled systems.
Cooldown: 3 turns (renews contract for 10 resources)

Combined Arms: Using all of the tools available, the LSF fleet gains a +1 to attack strength and takes -2 damage in the next battle.
Cooldown: 2 turns

Global resources:
Each turn every friendly controlled system produces resources that go into the global resource pool. Contracting mercenaries and resupplying take away from this resource pool, but there may also be other events that can affect how much resources will come in or get spend.

Morale:
Fleet morale plays an important factor and it can be affected by a number of things. Scoring important victories, capturing systems and the like will raise morale while losing battles and systems will likely drop it. But there may also be other events that can affect morale that are not directly within your control.
The various states of morale are:
 -Zealous: +3
 -Very high: +2
 -High: +1
 -Normal: 0
 -Low: -1
 -Very low: -2
 -Critical: -3

Systems:
Systems can be Friendly. Meaning they are in your control, if they have a open supply route to Sol these systems will provide resources and can be used to resupply your fleet in.
A system is Contested if there is a fleet of the opposite side in it. If there are no fleets defending it, a contested system can be secured. If the fleet moves out of the system without securing it, it returns to the state it was before it was contested. A contested system that was friendly before it was contested and has an open supply route will produce resources half of its normal value rounded down.
If the system is Hostile it means the Hierarchy has taken it. This system will not do anything good for your side until it has been taken back.

There can be only three fleets of each side in a system at once.

The Aquarius system is shrouded in a thick nebula and has some special rules.
 - Fleets can freely travel to nearby hostile systems. (No need to Blitz)
 - Fleets can retreat out of the system without taking damage.
 - Fleets fighting inside the nebula have a -5 penalty to attack strength.


Admiral ranks&Traits
Rear Admiral: Starting rank
Vice Admiral
Fleet Admiral
High Fleet Admiral

When granted a promotion you can choose 1 of the following traits.

Breakthrough Specialist: Take no damage on a retreat or Blitz
Master in logistics: Resupply recovers 50% instead of 30%
Inspirational leader: Your fleet's base morale goes up by +1. Your fleet becomes more resistant to morale shocks.
Fortification expert: When using the Defense action, the bonus becomes +6 instead of +2
Aggressive leader: +2 to fighter and capital ship attack strength
Glorious bastard: Your Admiral becomes Steele

Player fleet destruction
Your fleet is considered destroyed when your capitalship strength reaches 0%. With your flagship being the last thing that gets destroyed.
When this happens you'll get the choice to continue playing with a new fleet or if for some reason an other fleet is without an admiral, you can immediately jump over to that.
It will take some time for a new fleet to be constructed however and this new fleet will be back to base stats. Depending on how well your faction thinks of you (some factions are more tolerante of failure than others) you may also face a demotion (and lose the last trait you've gained)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on July 14, 2013, 06:19:53 pm
Friendly Fleet base stats:

SF Fleet
Fighter attack strength: 20 (18+2)
Capital attack strength: 18 (18)

Fighters at 100% Strength, 3rd Gen
Capital ships at 100% Strength
Morale: Normal
Special: Blitz

--------------------

DD Fleet
Fighter attack strength: 17 (18-1)
Capital attack strength: 16 (17-1)

Fighters at 100% Strength, 2nd Gen
Capital ships at 100% Strength
Morale: Low
Special: Prepare Barrage

--------------------

CRF Fleet
Fighter attack strength: 19 (16+2+1)
Capital attack strength: 18 (17+1)

Fighters at 100% Strength, 3rd Gen
Capital ships at 100% Strength
Morale: High
Special: Zeal

--------------------

UGC Fleet
Fighter attack strength: 15 (13+2)
Capital attack strength: 15 (15)

Fighters at 100% Strength, 3rd Gen
Capital ships at 100% Strength
Morale: Normal
Special: Mercs

With mercs
Fighter attack strength: 25 (13+2)
Capital attack strength: 22 (15)

Fighters at 175% Strength, 3rd Gen
Capital ships at 150% Strength

--------------------

LSF Fleet
Fighter attack strength: 23 (20+2+1)
Capital attack strength: 15 (14+1)

Fighters at 100% Strength, 3rd Gen
Capital ships at 100% Strength
Morale: High
Special: Combined Arms

--------------------

CSA Fleet
Fighter attack strength: 23 (23)
Capital attack strength: 20 (20)

Fighters at 100% Strength
Capital ships at 100% Strength
Morale: Normal
Special: Acting Smug

Hostile Fleet base stats:

Nordera Fleet
Fighter attack strength: 12 (10+2)
Capital attack strength: 10 (8+2)
Morale: Very High
Special: Kamikaze - 60% Capitalship damage

--------------------

Cordi Fleet
Fighter attack strength: 20 (20)
Capital attack strength: 12 (12)
Morale: Normal

--------------------

Fura'ngle Fleet
Fighter attack strength: 14 (16-2)
Capital attack strength: 18 (20-2)
Morale: Very low

--------------------

Zy Fleet
Fighter attack strength: 22 (21+1)
Capital attack strength: 21 (20+1)
Morale: High
Special: Slipstream

--------------------

Combined Zy&Fura fleet
Fighter attack strength: 15 (15)
Capital attack strength: 25 (25)
Morale: Normal

--------------------

Hertak Fleet
Fighter attack strength: 22 (22)
Capital attack strength: 30 (30)
Morale: Normal
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on July 14, 2013, 06:20:07 pm
Current Turn: 15

(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/WoD%20Forum%20Game/ForumgameStarmapT15_zps912d4f98.png~original)


Sol Force: 4/4
1st Fleet - under the command of Vice Admiral Dovorek Iera (CommanderDJ) on the flagship Hand of Absolution (Master in Logistics)
2nd Fleet - under the command of Vice Admiral Xeus L. Fremont (X3N0-Life-Form) on the flagship Swift (Master in Logistics)
3rd Fleet - under the command of Vice Admiral Aaron Soryu (mobcdmoc3) on the flagship Sovereign (Aggressive leader)
4th Fleet - 'Battlegroup 11' under the command of Vice Admiral Jason Windforce (Jellyfish) on the flagship Firelance (Breakthrough Specialist)

Delest Defense: 3/3
1st Fleet - 'Fist of Silva' under the command of Fleet Admiral Jason Ralwood (AdmiralRalwood) on the flagship Aurora (Inspirational Leader, Aggressive leader)
2nd Fleet - under the command of Fleet Admiral Georgiy Kuznetsov (Admiral MS) on the flagship Nova (Inspirational Leader, Master of Logistics)
3rd Fleet - under the command of High Fleet Admiral Ivan Dimitrievic Kalazonitov (Enioch) on the flagship Katyusha  (Inspirational Leader, Master in Logistics, Breakthrough Specialist)

Commonwealth Royal Fleet: 4/4
1st Fleet - under the command of Fleet Admiral Veers on the flagship Silver Arrow (Aggressive leader, Master in Logistics)
2nd Fleet - under the command of Fleet Admiral Lorric on the flagship Soaring Spirit (Master in Logistics, Breakthrough Specialist)
3rd Fleet - 'Task Force 765'  under the command of Vice Admiral Hilda Alcott (Hartzaden) on the flagship Hood (Aggressive Leader)
4th Fleet - under the command of Vice Admiral Carlos Santiago (Lepanto) on the flagship St. Louis IX (Aggressive leader, Master of Logistics)

United Guilds of Commerce Regulars: 2/2
1st Fleet - 'The Feather Ones' under the command of Fleet Admiral Andrew Bradwater (Andrewofdoom) on the flagship Garuda (Aggressive leader, Master in Logistics)
2nd Fleet - 'The 88's' under the command of Fleet Admiral Yuen Ah Luc (niffiwan) on the flaghship Inevitably Successful in All Circumstances (Master in Logistics, Breakthrough Specialist)

League Star Forces: 2/2
1st Fleet - under the command of Rear Admiral SpardaSon21 on the flagship Dire Wolf
2nd Fleet - 'The Stormlords' under the command of Rear Admiral Augustus Corvus (Dragon) on the flagship Scimitar

Cyrvan Star Armada: 1/1
1st Fleet - under the command of Admiral Freyalis Elsperth Almereya (Droid803) on the flagship Ataraxia (Breakthrough Specialist)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 14, 2013, 07:03:43 pm
Well now Andrewofdoom, it looks like you and I have a bug problem to deal with. There’s no one else anywhere near there, so it’s up to us. (I’m 2nd CRF in the middle of the map on Virgo.)

Aldebaran seems like a key location to hold since if they get past there they can go and take two of the most valuable systems.

EDIT: I see X3N0-Life-Form can get to Aldebaran too in one turn. There are 5 allied fleets on the top and 5 on the bottom. Maybe the three SF fleets could head to Aldebaran. mobcdmoc3's 3rd SF Fleet could get to Virgo on the first turn, then have a choice of where to go next if the bottom needed reinforcing, the bottom looks harder to control. But I think we need at least 4 on the top, 3 to fight on the front and 1 in reserve to take over when someone has to pull back and reinforce, those are my early impressions. I hope we can all have fun!  :)

Hi Spoon! I have questions for you. If I use Zeal, will my morale stay at Very High as long as nothing knocks it down, or will it drop down back down to High after 2 turns? Also, if not and it’s still very high and I use it again after 2 turns, will it rise to Zealous?

Also, to clarify, does every CRF fleet have zeal on a 2 turn cooldown, or if I was to use it, would all the other CRF fleets be deprived of it’s usage for 2 turns?

Again, to clarify, if I use it on turn 0, will it be usable again on turn 2, or turn 3? I’m not sure whether the cooldown means in 2 turns (0-2) or after 2 turns (0-3).

What happens if we take the enemy systems and make the whole map green? Can we do that?

Global resources, if none are spent or lost, will we have a total of 133 next turn? (I think all the numbers add up to 83, did the math twice plus the 50 we have.)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on July 14, 2013, 07:36:56 pm
Hi Spoon! I have questions for you. If I use Zeal, will my morale stay at Very High as long as nothing knocks it down, or will it drop down back down to High after 2 turns? Also, if not and it’s still very high and I use it again after 2 turns, will it rise to Zealous?
The morale of the Britannia knights is hard to break. It is indeed possible to use Zeal to raise your fleets morale to Zealous. Morale will not drop for no reason.

Also, to clarify, does every CRF fleet have zeal on a 2 turn cooldown, or if I was to use it, would all the other CRF fleets be deprived of it’s usage for 2 turns?
It's on a fleet to fleet basis. Abilities do not have a global cooldown.

Again, to clarify, if I use it on turn 0, will it be usable again on turn 2, or turn 3? I’m not sure whether the cooldown means in 2 turns (0-2) or after 2 turns (0-3).
A good question, I have not made that very clear. It's after 2 turns. So if you were to use it on turn 0 it would be available again on turn 3.

What happens if we take the enemy systems and make the whole map green? Can we do that?
It's possible, thought it will not immediately win you the game. New enemy fleets will continue to arrive from the red starlances. Though if you guys are really kicking that much ass it might be needed to expand the starmap and give you guys the opportunity to start a counter offensive. But I'll doubt it'll go that smoothly!

Global resources, if none are spent or lost, will we have a total of 133 next turn? (I think all the numbers add up to 83, did the math twice plus the 50 we have.)
Correcto.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 14, 2013, 08:04:39 pm
Hi Spoon! I have questions for you. If I use Zeal, will my morale stay at Very High as long as nothing knocks it down, or will it drop down back down to High after 2 turns? Also, if not and it’s still very high and I use it again after 2 turns, will it rise to Zealous?
The morale of the Britannia knights is hard to break. It is indeed possible to use Zeal to raise your fleets morale to Zealous. Morale will not drop for no reason.

Also, to clarify, does every CRF fleet have zeal on a 2 turn cooldown, or if I was to use it, would all the other CRF fleets be deprived of it’s usage for 2 turns?
It's on a fleet to fleet basis. Abilities do not have a global cooldown.

Again, to clarify, if I use it on turn 0, will it be usable again on turn 2, or turn 3? I’m not sure whether the cooldown means in 2 turns (0-2) or after 2 turns (0-3).
A good question, I have not made that very clear. It's after 2 turns. So if you were to use it on turn 0 it would be available again on turn 3.

What happens if we take the enemy systems and make the whole map green? Can we do that?
It's possible, thought it will not immediately win you the game. New enemy fleets will continue to arrive from the red starlances. Though if you guys are really kicking that much ass it might be needed to expand the starmap and give you guys the opportunity to start a counter offensive. But I'll doubt it'll go that smoothly!

Global resources, if none are spent or lost, will we have a total of 133 next turn? (I think all the numbers add up to 83, did the math twice plus the 50 we have.)
Correcto.

Excellent.

Excellent again.

I thought 0-2 would be generous. Thanks for clarifying.

Oooh, I like the sound of that! I'd be happy to defend Aldebaran at my end, though there's a tasty +5 up for grabs. But the team below it would surely be to their advantage to take Kardoen so they don't have to protect three systems. I hope you can extend the map in the event of a conquest, so we can see what lies beyond, rather than having no idea what's coming as we're at the edge of the map...

Great. Looks like using the mercs won't put too much of a drain on the global pool then.

Thanks for those. I have some more questions for you:

Defend, if you use it, can you choose to attack fleets in your system if you are defending, or would you lose the bonus if you attacked? And do you have to choose defend again after one battle to get the bonus back, or will it stay active as long as you remain in system?

Can you pick your target if there are multiple targets? If it was 3 v 3 would all 3 attack 1, or would they pair off with each other?

Are there any random elements to the combat, or is it simple math with a 100% result?

As long as you have 1% strength, are you alive? If your fleet is wiped out, is there any way to rebuild that fleet, or is it game over for that individual?

As long as there is another ally fleet in your contested system, you can retreat safely, am I understanding that right?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on July 14, 2013, 08:27:44 pm
Defend, if you use it, can you choose to attack fleets in your system if you are defending, or would you lose the bonus if you attacked? And do you have to choose defend again after one battle to get the bonus back, or will it stay active as long as you remain in system?
"Defend: Fleet takes up defensive positions in friendly controlled system giving a +2 bonus to attack strength for the next battle in that system."
Key words highlighted.

Can you pick your target if there are multiple targets? If it was 3 v 3 would all 3 attack 1, or would they pair off with each other?
"Engage enemy: Orders the fleet to fight target enemy fleet in the same system."
Again, keywords highlighted.

Are there any random elements to the combat, or is it simple math with a 100% result?
For the majority of the battles its simple math. Though there may be some events that can add a random factor.

As long as you have 1% strength, are you alive? If your fleet is wiped out, is there any way to rebuild that fleet, or is it game over for that individual?
Good question, something I forgot to elaborate on in the first post.
As long as you have 1% Capital ship strength left you are considered alive. (The last 1% representing your flagship battered and bruised, hanging on by a thread) If your flagship is destroyed the survival of your admiral will depend on if the player is willing to continue playing. It may take a fair amount of time to assemble a new fleet (if the global resource pool allows for it) and you may face a demotion (some factions will be more tolerant of failure than others). You'll also start with a new fleet, so base stats.
I'll add this to the first post.

As long as there is another ally fleet in your contested system, you can retreat safely, am I understanding that right?
Yes
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on July 14, 2013, 08:31:30 pm

 But the team below it would surely be to their advantage to take Kardoen so they don't have to protect three systems.


Will be interesting to defend Algol as the top fleets can reach it easier than the bottom fleets. While Taking Kardoen would be easier to defend 1 systems than 2, 3 or more, other than Tauri above the reinforcement points are fairly low. So resupplying fleets could be come an issue rather quickly.

On top of that, if it is going to be really easy to take the first enemy systems and hold it. I think Spoon will have a way of forcing us back. Otherwise the game will be seriously overpowered in our advantage.

Guess we'll see soon enough! :)

Spoon, anything in regards to obtaining intelligence about the enemy fleet, movements, reinforcements etcetc? Random chance or nup.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 14, 2013, 08:46:59 pm
Defend, if you use it, can you choose to attack fleets in your system if you are defending, or would you lose the bonus if you attacked? And do you have to choose defend again after one battle to get the bonus back, or will it stay active as long as you remain in system?
"Defend: Fleet takes up defensive positions in friendly controlled system giving a +2 bonus to attack strength for the next battle in that system."
Key words highlighted.

Can you pick your target if there are multiple targets? If it was 3 v 3 would all 3 attack 1, or would they pair off with each other?
"Engage enemy: Orders the fleet to fight target enemy fleet in the same system."
Again, keywords highlighted.

Are there any random elements to the combat, or is it simple math with a 100% result?
For the majority of the battles its simple math. Though there may be some events that can add a random factor.

As long as you have 1% strength, are you alive? If your fleet is wiped out, is there any way to rebuild that fleet, or is it game over for that individual?
Good question, something I forgot to elaborate on in the first post.
As long as you have 1% Capital ship strength left you are considered alive. (The last 1% representing your flagship battered and bruised, hanging on by a thread) If your flagship is destroyed the survival of your admiral will depend on if the player is willing to continue playing. It may take a fair amount of time to assemble a new fleet (if the global resource pool allows for it) and you may face a demotion (some factions will be more tolerant of failure than others). You'll also start with a new fleet, so base stats.
I'll add this to the first post.

As long as there is another ally fleet in your contested system, you can retreat safely, am I understanding that right?
Yes

Understood.

Sorry. Should have got that one on my own.

Thanks.

Interesting. I'm glad about that, a second chance at life. I guess we can get to the mechanisms of that when someone actually gets taken out.

Thanks.

Two more:

The extra damage if you get attacked on a resupply, do you know how that will work, how much extra damage?

Do the hierarchy fleets also pull back and resupply, or will they just come straight on until they die?

I’m also curious about the promotions and such, but I’m sure there’s plenty of time for that. Thanks again for answering.


But the team below it would surely be to their advantage to take Kardoen so they don't have to protect three systems.


Will be interesting to defend Algol as the top fleets can reach it easier than the bottom fleets. While Taking Kardoen would be easier to defend 1 systems than 2, 3 or more, other than Tauri above the reinforcement points are fairly low. So resupplying fleets could be come an issue rather quickly.

On top of that, if it is going to be really easy to take the first enemy systems and hold it. I think Spoon will have a way of forcing us back. Otherwise the game will be seriously overpowered in our advantage.

Guess we'll see soon enough! :)

Spoon, anything in regards to obtaining intelligence about the enemy fleet, movements, reinforcements etcetc? Random chance or nup.

Yes, I’m hoping they don’t come up and swamp us up here, we’ll only be able to defend Aldebaran at first. If that happens, we’ll be in trouble, so I think all the Sol forces for sure need to move on Aldebaran. Reinforcements can always be sent down if necessary. There’s no question of us at the top launching an attack with our flank exposed like that. If we can feed more fleets into the area, then it can be secured.

As for Spoon, he does have a way. The Hertak…
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lepanto on July 14, 2013, 08:49:18 pm
A fluff question, if you'd please. What kind of carriers are the allied fleets using? The Guardian Angel was the only LSF carrier class mentioned in WoD as far as I recall, and there was only one in service during the war.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on July 14, 2013, 09:38:03 pm
As for Spoon, he does have a way. The Hertak…

Of course the Hertak are going to be our biggest threat, at least until we identify any other new additions/changes. I'm interested to see what we will be up against, more enemy ability wise
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 14, 2013, 09:43:14 pm
As for Spoon, he does have a way. The Hertak…

Of course the Hertak are going to be our biggest threat, at least until we identify any other new additions/changes. I'm interested to see what we will be up against, more enemy ability wise

I imagine it will go as it did in the mod. Cordera to start with, then the Fura'ngle, then the Zy, then the Hertak.

It wouldn't surprise me if Zy fleets were superior to ours. I expect the Fura'ngle to have low, maybe even very low morale, so I'd think we might have the edge there.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: SpardaSon21 on July 14, 2013, 10:46:13 pm
I'll be moving over to Draco to see if I can hold the line there.  I'd appreciate it if 2nd LSF Fleet were to fortify Hydra, so assuming we can hold the line well enough we can both push on Kardoen and bottle them up.

My own strategy for this defense if I were in charge: Algol is probably a lost cause as its between the two enemy entry points with no good connections, so 1st UGC and 2nd CRF should focus on Aldebaran.  1st CRF and 1st DD should each take a branch and advance as 2nd DD stays at Tamy as a reserve fleet to bolster whichever line starts to sag more.  2nd and 3rd SF should advance to Aldebaran as 1st SF moves to Virgo as another reserve fleet for when lines start to inevitably sag.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on July 14, 2013, 11:07:24 pm
If making a move towards the front lines, I'll take the 1st CRF towards Vega to reinforce the 1st LSF. Just putting it out there :) (One possible move anyway)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Jellyfish on July 14, 2013, 11:20:20 pm
Welp, looks like I'm on standby for the time being.

Question: can a retreating enemy fleet be Blitzed? Does Blitz reduce 50% of what the enemy has (for example, if it has 4 out of 8 remaining, after the Blitz they have 2), or 50% of its maximum regardless of what strength they currently are at (for example, if the maximum is 16, and after a battle they retreat with 8, Blitz would deal the other 8 damage, destroying that fleet)?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on July 15, 2013, 12:32:53 am
"It takes half damage" probably means that both fleets deal damage to another equal to half of the damage that would have been dealt in a normal fight.

D&D 4th ed rules, yo.

So, if you have 8 remaining, in order for you to survive, the enemy fleet must inflict less than 16 damage to you (rounded down to half).



Looks like I'm part of the reserves too. Oh well.

E-hem:

I am currently sitting in the porch of my manor in Novoye Ligovo with my staff, cursing the REMFs who delayed the supplying of the fleet and instructing my beautiful secretary / executive officer on the proper procedures for exiling them to the crystal mines. I am not in my flagship bridge, as it is currently inoperable, thanks to the aforementioned REMFs' reluctance to properly maintain ships of reserve fleets. Where is the Motherland headed to, I ask you?

I am also drafting a letter to my good friend and academy schoolmate, R.Ad. Georgiy Kuznetsov, informing him of the unforeseen delays, imploring him not to get himself killed until I can reinforce him and requesting his assessment of the front-line situation.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on July 15, 2013, 12:37:37 am
I have some questions about UGC Mercs :)

1) The ability says +50% fighters & +25% capital.  However, the base fleet stats seem to be increased by 75%/50%?  Should the stats be:

Quote
UGC Fleet
...
With mercs
Fighter attack strength: 25 (13+2)
Capital attack strength: 19 (15)

Fighters at 150% Strength, 3rd Gen
Capital ships at 125% Strength

2) When the mercs contract ends where are losses taken from?  e.g.

Starting state with Mercs:
Fighters at 150%
Capital Ships at 125%

Fight, fight, fight, take losses
Fighters at 108% (42% losses)
Capital Ships at 90% (35% losses)

When the Mercs leave, is it:
a) Mercs take all losses
Fighters at 100%
Capital Ships at 90%

b) Relative split of losses between Mercs & Regulars (this probably makes the most sense to me)
Fighters at 72% (100 - 42 * 2/3, 50/100)
Capital Ships at 72% (100 - 35 * 1/5, 25/100)

c) Regulars take all losses
Fighters at 58%
Capital Ships at 65%

d) Something else?



3) Similar question except for hiring mercs when below 100% strength. I'd guess that's as follows:

Starting with:
Fighters at 72%
Capital Ships at 72%

Hiring Mercs gives:
Fighters at 122% (72+50)
Capital Ships at 97% (72+25)

Instead of:
Fighters at 108% (72 * 1.5)
Capital Ships at 90% (92 * 1.25)


4) Lastly, can you choose not to pay the upkeep in order to dismiss the Mercs early?  If you've taken a pounding & can retreat to resupply while other fleets hold the line, it would be good to avoid draining the resource pool.  On the other hand, if the contract must be for 3 turns, then No Retreating with Mercs Active!  Yaaaarrrrh!!

Thanks :D

Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: mobcdmoc3 on July 15, 2013, 01:18:26 am
I think I'll be making my way over to Virgo so that I can intercept any move made by the Cordi, and disappear/retreat into Aquarius if need be.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Torchwood on July 15, 2013, 02:11:18 am
Looks like I'll have to wait for a turn. I blame the REMFs.

Oh well, at least I'll have time to prepare some heroic speeches when it's time to use Zeal.

Now, we can't be sure of this, but judging from the enemy's psych profile, the Nordera will charge and fight to the death. The Cordi have a bit more self-preservation and will likely retreat and regroup if they take too many losses. If my unit is due to encounter Cordi, I'll make sure to drill my fighter pilots in gunnery lessons until they can reliably hit those bloody agile fighters.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 15, 2013, 06:35:22 am
You know, I don't think any of the starting people need to think about being in reserve when there'll be 5 more fleets on the map in just 2 turns. For me, the starting fleets need to immediately head to the front and engage the enemy. Within 4 turns every fleet in the game will be able to reach the front line.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on July 15, 2013, 07:36:12 am
But at what cost, Sir, at what cost?  :p

Seriously, though, if I reach Silva at T2, I will be at Odin / Aquarius on T3 and Vega / Hydra on T4, with Barrage or Defend ready. But there is absolutely nothing I can do prior to that.

So the front line fleets will need to survive for 3/4 turns before reinforcements can contribute in any way (even cover their retreat). That's 3 turns of battering. And if enemy forces concentrate their fire, they will probably be able to take down 1-2 defending fleets (especially if the Nordera go AAAAAARG KILLL EVERYTHING I DON'T CARE IF I DIEEEE). Remember that we have no info on their power figures or their traits i.e. we do not know how hard they hit.

Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 15, 2013, 07:47:31 am
But at what cost, Sir, at what cost?  :p

Seriously, though, if I reach Silva at T2, I will be at Odin / Aquarius on T3 and Vega / Hydra on T4, with Barrage or Defend ready. But there is absolutely nothing I can do prior to that.

So the front line fleets will need to survive for 3/4 turns before reinforcements can contribute in any way (even cover their retreat). That's 3 turns of battering. And if enemy forces concentrate their fire, they will probably be able to take down 1-2 defending fleets (especially if the Nordera go AAAAAARG KILLL EVERYTHING I DON'T CARE IF I DIEEEE). Remember that we have no info on their power figures or their traits i.e. we do not know how hard they hit.

I imagine we'll learn the information we need about the power of the Cordera after the first turn is over. Which will allow us to plan accordingly in that way. But I'd be shocked if our fleets weren't flat out superior, and if we had any difficulty holding the line with our starting 10 fleets long enough for the others to back us up.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on July 15, 2013, 07:52:18 am
Spoon, anything in regards to obtaining intelligence about the enemy fleet, movements, reinforcements etcetc? Random chance or nup.
You'll have pretty reliable information about the enemy stats after the first engagement. Unfortunately for you guys it'll be a suprise what kind of enemy reinforcements will show up.

The extra damage if you get attacked on a resupply, do you know how that will work, how much extra damage?
5 extra damage for each time you resupplied.

Do the hierarchy fleets also pull back and resupply, or will they just come straight on until they die?
You'll have to see about that for yourself

A fluff question, if you'd please. What kind of carriers are the allied fleets using? The Guardian Angel was the only LSF carrier class mentioned in WoD as far as I recall, and there was only one in service during the war.
SF uses Champion class carriers (The one seen in Stranded), the CRF uses Champions in addition to their own Lord class ships (the ship briefly shown in the last vid in the wod dev blog thread). The UGC uses the Rhino and Elephant class ships, which are combined carriers and warships with the models being straight from Gundam 00&Dimensional Eclipse (http://www.hard-light.net/wiki/index.php/FTCVS_Volga). DD has the Volya class ship (no pictures available atm)

Question: can a retreating enemy fleet be Blitzed? Does Blitz reduce 50% of what the enemy has (for example, if it has 4 out of 8 remaining, after the Blitz they have 2), or 50% of its maximum regardless of what strength they currently are at (for example, if the maximum is 16, and after a battle they retreat with 8, Blitz would deal the other 8 damage, destroying that fleet)?
You cannot Blitz a retreating enemy. Enioch is correct about the half damage part.

I have some questions about UGC Mercs :)

1) The ability says +50% fighters & +25% capital.  However, the base fleet stats seem to be increased by 75%/50%?
Gah, I can't believe this slipped through. Especially since I had already fixed one instance during posting yesterday!
It's 75%/50%, sorry about the confusion.

2) When the mercs contract ends where are losses taken from?  e.g.

Starting state with Mercs:
Fighters at 150%
Capital Ships at 125%

Fight, fight, fight, take losses
Fighters at 108% (42% losses)
Capital Ships at 90% (35% losses)

When the Mercs leave, is it:
a) Mercs take all losses
Fighters at 100%
Capital Ships at 90%

b) Relative split of losses between Mercs & Regulars (this probably makes the most sense to me)
Fighters at 72% (100 - 42 * 2/3, 50/100)
Capital Ships at 72% (100 - 35 * 1/5, 25/100)

c) Regulars take all losses
Fighters at 58%
Capital Ships at 65%

d) Something else?
B.

3) Similar question except for hiring mercs when below 100% strength. I'd guess that's as follows:

Starting with:
Fighters at 72%
Capital Ships at 72%

Hiring Mercs gives:
Fighters at 122% (72+50)
Capital Ships at 97% (72+25)

Instead of:
Fighters at 108% (72 * 1.5)
Capital Ships at 90% (92 * 1.25)
Correct, it adds a fixed amount of strength. The mercs do not scale with your fleet's current condition when you hire them.


4) Lastly, can you choose not to pay the upkeep in order to dismiss the Mercs early?  If you've taken a pounding & can retreat to resupply while other fleets hold the line, it would be good to avoid draining the resource pool.  On the other hand, if the contract must be for 3 turns, then No Retreating with Mercs Active!  Yaaaarrrrh!!

Thanks :D
You can indeed dismiss the Mercs early if you so desire. But you'll have to wait out the cooldown before you can contract new ones.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 15, 2013, 08:12:32 am
Thanks Spoon. 5 damage isn't bad at all. It just essentially means you'd have replenished 25% instead of 30% or 50% instead of 60% and received and dealt a normal attack to the enemy.

Will there be any kind of roleplay elements to this Spoon? If so I was thinking we could have a roleplay thread, as well as this questions/strategy thread and the game thread itself.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on July 15, 2013, 08:23:22 am
Thanks Spoon. 5 damage isn't bad at all. It just essentially means you'd have replenished 25% instead of 30% or 50% instead of 60% and received and dealt a normal attack to the enemy.

Will there be any kind of roleplay elements to this Spoon? If so I was thinking we could have a roleplay thread, as well as this questions/strategy thread and the game thread itself.

Remember that you get morale hits every time that you get attacked on resupply.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 15, 2013, 08:32:16 am
Remember that you get morale hits every time that you get attacked on resupply.

Ah yes, I was forgetting that, thanks, that is something much more serious.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on July 15, 2013, 11:51:33 am
Will there be any kind of roleplay elements to this Spoon? If so I was thinking we could have a roleplay thread, as well as this questions/strategy thread and the game thread itself.
That's entirely up to you guys. I won't force it but I will definitely welcome it.

So one question:
When I use prepare barrage will it hold until the next fight no matter how many turns it takes? Is the cooldown still running during that time? If yes can I use it again after 3 turns and get 4+4 damage (like the zeal ability stacking)?
Once you've prepared the barrage there is indeed no limit on the amount of turns it takes to the next battle. And the cooldown starts its count down after you've prepared it. However you cannot stack multiple barrages for massive bonuses.

So for example you could use prepare barrage on turn 3, then have your next battle at turn 8. The ability has come off of cooldown in this time so you can immediately use prepare barrage again in the next turn. This works the same for the LSF's Combined Arms

Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 15, 2013, 12:02:06 pm
REMF

Seen it enough now to google it. Not what I was expecting at all!  :lol:

Spoon, can you use Zeal if you're Zealous? Even if you can't get to +4, could you stack protection against morale drops?

On the RP, I encourage it, but I mean if you'll provide any? People to talk to us, report to us, and maybe we can talk back to. Can we talk to the Heirarchy? Will they talk to us? I'm particularly interesting if you'll lay out some sort of opening for us. A situation report. Or maybe even a demand for surrender from the heirarchy.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on July 15, 2013, 12:33:09 pm
Spoon, can you use Zeal if you're Zealous? Even if you can't get to +4, could you stack protection against morale drops?
No

On the RP, I encourage it, but I mean if you'll provide any? People to talk to us, report to us, and maybe we can talk back to. Can we talk to the Heirarchy? Will they talk to us? I'm particularly interesting if you'll lay out some sort of opening for us. A situation report. Or maybe even a demand for surrender from the heirarchy.
Yes
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 15, 2013, 12:40:56 pm
Unsurprising.

Nice! I'm gonna have a chat with the Cordi... :)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Jellyfish on July 15, 2013, 01:39:06 pm
How are those of us in reserve gonna get some? I don't think the others will leave some for us.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 15, 2013, 01:49:57 pm
How are those of us in reserve gonna get some? I don't think the others will leave some for us.

Don't worry. We'll have to pull back and replenish as we get whittled down, and if you're waiting right behind us, that will be your cue to jump into the battle in our places.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 15, 2013, 02:01:18 pm
The main cannons on the Warrior and Inflexible had both unexpectedly shorted out during firing tests

Nice read, Lepanto. Me, I'm waiting till Spoon opens up the game for us before I try my hand at something like that, since I'm right at the front, I can't do it properly yet.

The highlighted bit I found funny just for one of the names you chose. Inflexible. That which does not bend is all the easier to break. And it broke... :)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 15, 2013, 04:05:23 pm
That's it for now. I'm thinking about sprinting to the front line. This is exciting :)

Yes. Come and join me at Alderbaran :)

Exciting, yes. One after the other people are getting into the spirit of this. I think it has potential to be something special.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Admiral MS on July 15, 2013, 04:45:48 pm
I thought a little bit about my tactical options. I'll probably move the fleet to Hydra as it is the only way to potentially get into combat during the first turn.

Unless the two Nordera fleets are ridiculously overpowered they will be pretty much obliterated at the end of turn 3 if they invade Draco or Hydra without further reinforcements. I suspect both fleets will either attack the same system doing heavy damage to the defending fleet (most likely 1st LSF in Draco) or spread with one fleet taking Algol and the other one trying keeping us away from Kardoen. I'm expecting at least 1 additional fleet within turn 1 or 2 and another one not later than turn 4 to keep us occupied (else Kardoen would be lost case for them with 5 fleets sitting around there).
Alternatively we might see a heavy push towards Aldebaran (or possibly Draco/Hydra) where the defending fleets have to retreat around turn 2 (before reinforcements are even there to engage actively in combat) opening up many fronts that can occupy all fleets including our reinforcements.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 15, 2013, 05:05:56 pm
I thought a little bit about my tactical options. I'll probably move the fleet to Hydra as it is the only way to potentially get into combat during the first turn.

Unless the two Nordera fleets are ridiculously overpowered they will be pretty much obliterated at the end of turn 3 if they invade Draco or Hydra without further reinforcements. I suspect both fleets will either attack the same system doing heavy damage to the defending fleet (most likely 1st LSF in Draco) or spread with one fleet taking Algol and the other one trying keeping us away from Kardoen. I'm expecting at least 1 additional fleet within turn 1 or 2 and another one not later than turn 4 to keep us occupied (else Kardoen would be lost case for them with 5 fleets sitting around there).
Alternatively we might see a heavy push towards Aldebaran (or possibly Draco/Hydra) where the defending fleets have to retreat around turn 2 (before reinforcements are even there to engage actively in combat) opening up many fronts that can occupy all fleets including our reinforcements.

I'm worried about him sending everything to Aldebaran. With some new fleets showing up at Kardoen to block off reinforcements. It's the only thing that worries me. I'm confident we can handle anything else. And it's weird saying this because now he knows this!  :lol:

But hopefully, he'll act in a more role playing way than a trying to destroy us way.

Hydra seems the least valuable of the systems Spoon can invade. If it was me, I'd put you in Hydra like you want, and put the other two LSF fleets in Draco. I'd send the first CRF to Hydra and the 2nd DD to Draco.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Admiral MS on July 15, 2013, 05:20:59 pm
And I got another question:
When there are multiple fleets in one system, does each of them fight for itself or can they act as a combined fleet with shared hitpoints/damage?
If the attacker can choose which of the defending fleets he wants to attack in a 3vs3 Situation one fleet might be nuked off the map in one turn (making such engagements very risky). This would be unrealistic if the defending fleets have similar orders.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on July 15, 2013, 05:47:03 pm
I'm not too worried about Aldebaran, if the Nordera fleets go there I'm confident that the 1st UGC & 2nd CRF can hold them on the defence until the 1st/2nd/3rd SF fleets can arrive.  And that course of action gives the 1st/2nd LSF a chance to take Kardoen and make it a chokepoint.

Of course, if the Hierarchy are qualitatively inferior to our forces, then we can probably expect a *lot* of reinforcements piling in during the early turns, which will make life *interesting*.  At least they can only have 3 fleets in a system at a time...

Lastly, AMS, I see your point about 3v3 & concentrated fire, but IIRC to nuke a fleet out of existence in a single turn the opposition would need a combined attack strength of 100.  (i.e. approx 33 per fleet, or 22/22 Fighters/Capital).  Currently, only our UGC fleets with mercs can muster that sort of firepower, and we only have 2 of those fleets (although some other fleets base stats get close to that on the defence).  And if the Hierarchy are qualitatively inferior to our forces (there's that assumption again :nervous:) then we shouldn't need to worry about being on the receiving end of that.  For now.

/me waves hello to the Zy & Hertak...
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: SpardaSon21 on July 15, 2013, 06:04:47 pm
I don't want to have to back up any further than Aquarius though as that creates a second front up top if they do take it.  If need be we can lose Draco and Vega but we cannot let the Hierarchy open a second front up top through Virgo.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on July 15, 2013, 06:08:27 pm
And I got another question:
When there are multiple fleets in one system, does each of them fight for itself or can they act as a combined fleet with shared hitpoints/damage?
If the attacker can choose which of the defending fleets he wants to attack in a 3vs3 Situation one fleet might be nuked off the map in one turn (making such engagements very risky). This would be unrealistic if the defending fleets have similar orders.
Fleets fight independently so it is indeed possible to focus fire on a single fleet to decimate it.
Rest assure however that I am not so cruel to one turn kill player fleets.

Torchwood asked what kind of ship types/names are in each fleet and I suppose it can't hurt to give you guys a list of names here.

Sol Force:
Fighters:
2nd Gen
 - Light: Dragonfly
 - Medium: Ray IIJS
 - Heavy: Tyrfing

3rd Gen
 - Light: Kaze-B
 - Medium: Ray III, Ray IIIE
 - Heavy: Caliburn

4th Gen
 - Light: Kaze II
 - Medium: Ray IV
 - Heavy: Clarent

Capital ships:
 - Light: Skirmisher
 - Medium: Challenger
 - Heavy: Crusader
 - Carrier: Champion

Delest Defense:
Fighters:
2nd Gen
 - Light: Cheburashka
 - Medium: Zhuravlik
 - Heavy: Shilo

3rd Gen
 - Light: Kaze-H, Spirt-Voz
 - Medium: Terminator, Ray IIIW
 - Heavy: Sodesuka

4th Gen
 - Light: Lastochka
 - Medium: Berkut
 - Heavy: -

Capital ships:
 - Light: -
 - Medium: Grazhdanin 
 - Heavy: Volya

Commonwealth Royal Fleet:
2nd Gen
 - Light: Dragonfly
 - Medium: Ray IIJS
 - Heavy: Tyrfing

3rd Gen
 - Light: Kaze-Page
 - Medium: Esquire, Ray IIIM3v
 - Heavy: Excalibur

4th Gen
 - Light: Hospitaler
 - Medium: Templar
 - Heavy: -

Capital ships:
 - Light: Cavalier
 - Medium: Duke
 - Heavy/Carrier: Lord, Champion

UGC Regulars:
2nd Gen
 - Light: Dragonfly
 - Medium: Firefly
 - Heavy: -

3rd Gen
 - Light: Kaze-B, Cheetah
 - Medium: Ray III, Leopard
 - Heavy: Caliburn, Tiger

4th Gen
 - Light: Sparrow
 - Medium: Hawk
 - Heavy: Eagle

Capital ships:
 - Light: -
 - Medium/Carrier: Rhino
 - Heavy/Carrier: Elephant

League Star Forces

Uses a mix of ships from all factions.

The SF, UGC and CRF each have a share of Hazel bombers in storage. While 'only 2nd gen', Hazel's are considered strategic bombers because of the bloody large amount of secondaries they carry. They didn't stopped producing bombers because they were ineffective but because of a set of agreed upon rules for the proxy wars that each faction has been involved in.
Bet the higher ups are going to regret that!
Anyway bombers are not a factor in this game for the forseeable future.

A large number of these are not yet actually ingame and probably won't be in the nearby future either. I'll apologize in advance to the admirals of the DD fleets that their fleet's combat footage may seem rather sparse compared to the others.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 15, 2013, 06:14:34 pm
Remember Niffiwan, chances are a fleet will attack on it's turn as well, so it will take damage from the counterattack and then damage from 3 seperate attacks.

I shudder to think what the Hertak's stats will be though.  :shaking:

But we've got to get through their minions first.

You mentioned the Hertak and the Zy, but what about the Fura'ngle? Remember all the nasty things they can do to you in the game?  :shaking:

Good (from http://www.hard-light.net/wiki/index.php/Fura'ngle):

"Fura'ngle fear death like no other which makes them terrible soldiers"  :nod:
"And that's when the greatest weakness of the Fura'ngle was discovered, holding a defensive line while large intimidating ships close on you requires courage, courage to face death."  :nod:

Bad:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8CwyKSpLj9U
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dsXp4LjQYjk

Can't fight? Can't run? Then you die...  :shaking:

@ Spoon

Very interesting. Fluff for the RPing if nothing else. Do you intend to create all of these for the new Wings of Dawn? I wonder if we'll see some...

Will you give us a similar list for the heirarchy? If there are now so many for the Terrans, I'm guessing the Heirarchy have more too...
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on July 15, 2013, 06:36:12 pm
I don't want to have to back up any further than Aquarius though as that creates a second front up top if they do take it.  If need be we can lose Draco and Vega but we cannot let the Hierarchy open a second front up top through Virgo.

Well, apart from the lost resources (which could be a dealbreaker in itself), a defensive line at Tamy / Virgo / Polaris shouldn't be harder to defend than Aldebaran / Draco / Hydra.

Remember Niffiwan, chances are a fleet will attack on it's turn as well, so it will take damage from the counterattack and then damage from 3 seperate attacks.

Ah yes, that will change the outcomes... although I can't be bothered to figure out the maths for that at the moment :p  (it won't be a simple 25%-per-attacker-to-one-shot due to the 1st combat being at a higher strength to the three subsequent attacks)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 15, 2013, 06:39:00 pm
Hey Spoon, now we have the types of ships, how about the size of fleets? If we want to talk about losses and ships going down in flames and the like. Of particular interest would be how many of the strongest capital ships there are in a fleet.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Admiral MS on July 16, 2013, 12:16:18 am
And I got another question:
When there are multiple fleets in one system, does each of them fight for itself or can they act as a combined fleet with shared hitpoints/damage?
If the attacker can choose which of the defending fleets he wants to attack in a 3vs3 Situation one fleet might be nuked off the map in one turn (making such engagements very risky). This would be unrealistic if the defending fleets have similar orders.
Fleets fight independently so it is indeed possible to focus fire on a single fleet to decimate it.
Rest assure however that I am not so cruel to one turn kill player fleets.
Remember Niffiwan, chances are a fleet will attack on it's turn as well, so it will take damage from the counterattack and then damage from 3 separate attacks.

Ah yes, that will change the outcomes... although I can't be bothered to figure out the maths for that at the moment :p  (it won't be a simple 25%-per-attacker-to-one-shot due to the 1st combat being at a higher strength to the three subsequent attacks)
Then we have to be careful. Without reinforcements an unexpected 1 vs 2 defense situation can easily turn into a disaster for a defending fleet not at 100% since retreating also causes damage.

Now I thought about retreating and I'm not sure how this is handled with multiple fleets.
In which order do the turns of different fleets happen? For example there are two fleets in the same system and both want to retreat, one heavily damaged and one in a good state but unable to fight the hostile fleets alone. Do both fleets get damage on retreat or just one of them (and which one)? Does it depend on first/second (=major/minor) action?
A similar situation would be one where a fleet jumps into a system to cover another fleet's retreat. Does that work and if yes what are the requirements? Like the covering fleet has to jump in with the first action and the retreating one has to use the second action or it'll get damage.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on July 16, 2013, 01:43:01 am
Then we have to be careful. Without reinforcements an unexpected 1 vs 2 defense situation can easily turn into a disaster for a defending fleet not at 100% since retreating also causes damage.

Hate to say I told you so (well, not you specifically) but I did warn the front-line fleets that they should be careful until the reinforcements arrive. The worst part is that, even if defending a system, you can't resupply unless you retreat to an uncontested system. I.e., damage is permanent, unless you retreat or completely destroy the enemy. That will really mess us up. We will need to coordinate our movements perfectly, so that the new arrivals support the veterans. Best thing would probably be to have two fleets constantly in the front lines, fighting the good fight and two resupplying.

And if I ever manage to get promoted, I know what trait I'll choose. Master of logistics, all the way. 1% to 100% in one turn, suckers!
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on July 16, 2013, 08:00:58 am
Now I thought about retreating and I'm not sure how this is handled with multiple fleets.
In which order do the turns of different fleets happen? For example there are two fleets in the same system and both want to retreat, one heavily damaged and one in a good state but unable to fight the hostile fleets alone. Do both fleets get damage on retreat or just one of them (and which one)? Does it depend on first/second (=major/minor) action?
A similar situation would be one where a fleet jumps into a system to cover another fleet's retreat. Does that work and if yes what are the requirements? Like the covering fleet has to jump in with the first action and the retreating one has to use the second action or it'll get damage.
This is a good example why it matters in what order you do your minor and major action.
In your first retreat example, it is possible for the fleet in good state to cover the retreat of the battered one before retreating itself. The damaged fleet will need to have its first action be the retreat while the other fleet needs to do it second. If both fleets have their retreat action as the first or second action then well, they both retreat at the same time and both take damage.
In the second example, it is as you say. A new fleet can jump into the system first and cover the retreat of the other fleet.

Hey Spoon, now we have the types of ships, how about the size of fleets? If we want to talk about losses and ships going down in flames and the like. Of particular interest would be how many of the strongest capital ships there are in a fleet.
A very large fleet would have around 50 capital ships. (So not the hunderds of ships in the original WoD) You guys are not commanding fleets of that size.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 16, 2013, 08:26:52 am
Ooooh, that's important information there Spoon.

So, with the much smaller fleets, is this something we'll see in the new WoD? The fleets are small enough now that they could actually be on screen, Wing Commander Saga style. Thinking Wing Commander Saga gives me a fair idea about scope for these fleets. If the biggest fleet is about 50 ships, what would we have, about 30 maybe? With such manageable numbers, would it be possible to break down exactly what we have? Or at least just what I have? I could see people giving names to every ship in their fleet with numbers like that... :)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on July 17, 2013, 06:11:22 am
Right now I'm aiming for the game thread to be opened on sunday. With turns happening on wednesday and sundays
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on July 17, 2013, 06:31:13 am
Which time zone Spoon?, just for approximates.

Sounds good, looking very forward to this beginning
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on July 17, 2013, 06:59:27 am
So we submit our moves during the other days, and they 'take place' during wed and sun? Sounds fine to me. But yeah, give us a time deadline for submissions.

Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on July 17, 2013, 08:51:17 am
I'm in the netherlands so I'm at GMT +1 (or +2 I always forget which one it is with daylight saving and what not). The deadline for orders will probably be around 22:00 my time.   
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 17, 2013, 08:59:45 am
Hi, Spoon.

Why 3 and 4 days? Wouldn't 3 and 3 be better? Also, if you're going to do 3 and 4, why not have the weekend inside the 3 day bracket? People will have more free time I would think on the weekend.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on July 17, 2013, 10:03:22 am
Hi, Spoon.

Why 3 and 4 days? Wouldn't 3 and 3 be better? Also, if you're going to do 3 and 4, why not have the weekend inside the 3 day bracket? People will have more free time I would think on the weekend.

This makes sense. However, we must keep in mind that this will probably take up a lot of Spoon's time and that, when all is said and done, it is us who need to adapt to his schedule. If Wednesday suits him better, Wednesday it must be.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 17, 2013, 10:13:25 am
Hi, Spoon.

Why 3 and 4 days? Wouldn't 3 and 3 be better? Also, if you're going to do 3 and 4, why not have the weekend inside the 3 day bracket? People will have more free time I would think on the weekend.

This makes sense. However, we must keep in mind that this will probably take up a lot of Spoon's time and that, when all is said and done, it is us who need to adapt to his schedule. If Wednesday suits him better, Wednesday it must be.

Indeed.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on July 17, 2013, 04:20:34 pm
Excellent! :)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: AndrewofDoom on July 17, 2013, 11:54:08 pm
Seems for me my best move is really simple one. Move to Aldebaran and defend. Though, I'm going to be seriously boned with my super weaksauciness unless I use Mercs so early in the game.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on July 18, 2013, 12:36:31 am
Doesn't being weaker make you less of a target?  You (we :)) are just as easy to hurt, but we do less damage so the incentive for the thinking enemy is to attack the other fleets 1st :)

(that doesn't really help much does it!)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Torchwood on July 18, 2013, 04:32:13 am
Plus, you've got a lot of backup in transit. You could have four fleets total in Aldebaran within two turns, so even if the Cordi fleets turn out to be bigmclargehuge, you'll be fine
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 18, 2013, 10:19:40 am
Seems for me my best move is really simple one. Move to Aldebaran and defend. Though, I'm going to be seriously boned with my super weaksauciness unless I use Mercs so early in the game.

I say use the mercs. We seem to have a vast abundance of resources. While we shouldn't squander them, I am wary of the possibility of everything on the map coming to us in Aldebaran. Your mercenaries would be a big help in repelling such an assault.

Doesn't being weaker make you less of a target?  You (we :)) are just as easy to hurt, but we do less damage so the incentive for the thinking enemy is to attack the other fleets 1st :)

(that doesn't really help much does it!)

Andrew is quite safe either way. If he's weak, he's not worth the effort. If he's strong, he gets bumped up to 150%, so he takes too long to kill.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 21, 2013, 03:24:53 pm
*Lorric uses Zeal!*

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y7OGHKS5_VQ&t=0m23s
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lepanto on July 21, 2013, 08:42:22 pm
The main cannons on the Warrior and Inflexible had both unexpectedly shorted out during firing tests

The highlighted bit I found funny just for one of the names you chose. Inflexible. That which does not bend is all the easier to break. And it broke... :)

Bit late to respond to this, but anyway...

Well, sometimes it's better to stand tall and be broken by the enemy's strength than to bend and submit. Such an attitude would be particularly fitting for the CRF. Not that ships' beam cannons breaking is directly connected with their names' symbolic flexibility, but whatever.

Also, since both our characters are CRF, would you be interested in having some sort of personal connection between them for RP purposes? Gone to the academy together, or something.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 21, 2013, 08:53:58 pm
The main cannons on the Warrior and Inflexible had both unexpectedly shorted out during firing tests

The highlighted bit I found funny just for one of the names you chose. Inflexible. That which does not bend is all the easier to break. And it broke... :)

Bit late to respond to this, but anyway...

Well, sometimes it's better to stand tall and be broken by the enemy's strength than to bend and submit. Such an attitude would be particularly fitting for the CRF. Not that ships' beam cannons breaking is directly connected with their names' symbolic flexibility, but whatever.

Also, since both our characters are CRF, would you be interested in having some sort of personal connection between them for RP purposes? Gone to the academy together, or something.

I'm open to the idea. What do you have in mind?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 21, 2013, 09:11:09 pm
Veers, where are you going? I just saw your move. You can do whatever you want, but if it was me, I would use Zeal on the first turn, and arrive in Hydra on the second. I'd want that permanant stat boost and the clock ticking on when I can get another one immediately. There are plenty of other fleets near you, why not let them take that path and you go to Hydra?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 21, 2013, 09:38:43 pm
Hi Veers.

The code option makes me have to scroll side to side and down to read the text.

Perhaps you could do it this way instead if you want something like this?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lepanto on July 21, 2013, 11:01:16 pm
Nice to see all the RP going on. Things should really heat up once the shooting actually starts.

Lorric, let's say that our characters went to the CRF's naval war college together and collaborated in a pirate-hunting operation a few years before the war's start, with a sort of friendly rivalry going on.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 22, 2013, 03:17:52 am
Nice to see all the RP going on. Things should really heat up once the shooting actually starts.

Lorric, let's say that our characters went to the CRF's naval war college together and collaborated in a pirate-hunting operation a few years before the war's start, with a sort of friendly rivalry going on.

Yes, I've been working on my own opening RP entry as well.

You can try putting up something about this and I'll try and bounce off it if you like.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on July 22, 2013, 06:53:34 am
I put it in the code tags simply to save space. Not cause I like green (on my phone it looks fantastic though!).

As if I didn't it comes out as several paragraphs long. I wrote too much again. :/
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on July 22, 2013, 07:24:43 am
Putting it in code tags makes it really hard to read. Better to just put it in a normal post.
No need to save space, we've got quite a lot of that here.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 22, 2013, 08:07:37 am
I wrote too much again. :/

No, no, I liked it! Don't go feeling all TL DR, it wasn't TL DR for me. There were a few typos and such in there, and of course you'll have to change it now that your game plans have changed, but I enjoyed reading it. I want to see more. Let your creativity out. Have fun! :nod:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on July 22, 2013, 08:53:41 am
Few typos could be spelling, Australian English vs American English. But I haven't really checked, ran straight off to work instead.

Like your idea of the comradeship between Lepanto, could become very interesting later on. But I certainly see no end to the enjoyment that is starting to come from this thread (game) :D
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 22, 2013, 08:57:07 am
I certainly see no end to the enjoyment that is starting to come from this thread (game) :D

And we haven't even got started yet!  :lol:

I said it before further back in the thread, and I believe it even more now, this could turn into something really special.

It's great to see so many creative people at play. A very pleasant surprise how many are getting into the RPing and the quality of their writing.  :yes:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 22, 2013, 10:14:04 pm
Oh wow. I am seriously impressed, Lepanto!

I need to be going to sleep soon, so I'll address this properly tomorrow. I'll send you a PM to see how you want to do this. You surprised me a lot. Oh, feel free to message me any time you want before then if you want to tell/ask me anything.

You've made me out to be some sort of super-admiral, so by the time your fleet gets to the front, if I'm half as good as you say I am, I'll have cleaned everything up! :D

But yes, I like very much what you did with me.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 23, 2013, 09:18:34 am
So Flak, you've decided to RP Andrew's mercs? Oh, now this is a very interesting development, you see the next entry I've been cooking up... well, you'll see in time...  :D
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: AndrewofDoom on July 23, 2013, 09:48:58 am
I've done RP in the past (long, long past). I just don't feel like it right now. :p
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 23, 2013, 09:51:41 am
I've done RP in the past (long, long past). I just don't feel like it right now. :p

For me, this is new and exciting! I've done RP stuff before, either with cooking stuff up in games I've played myself, or two player with a friend, but never a group thing like this.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 23, 2013, 08:24:37 pm
Spoon, a question for the future, what rank would you give someone who was in command of a group of roughly 5 or 6 capital ships within a fleet? I don't know much about ranks, it's something I'll need for later.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Jellyfish on July 23, 2013, 08:42:50 pm
Try "Commodore"
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 23, 2013, 08:45:27 pm
Try "Commodore"

Thanks for the suggestion. I'll see if Spoon has anything to say about it, but otherwise I'll go with Commodore.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on July 24, 2013, 04:52:00 am
Commodore sounds about right.

Due to some unforseen events, the next turn has been delayed one day. So its going to be tomorrow (thursday) instead of today.
Sorry about that.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 24, 2013, 08:31:20 am
Commodore sounds about right.

Thanks. Commodore it will be.

Quote
Due to some unforseen events, the next turn has been delayed one day. So its going to be tomorrow (thursday) instead of today.
Sorry about that.

We are the 2nd CRF. A band of brothers and sisters, united in vision and purpose and will. And our enemies will see that. And they will be afraid.   

Clearly the hierarchy are cringing in fear before the 2nd CRF...  ;)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on July 24, 2013, 12:38:57 pm
Clearly the hierarchy are cringing in fear before the 2nd CRF...  ;)
I think your fleet just became the primary target  :drevil:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 24, 2013, 01:03:48 pm
Clearly the hierarchy are cringing in fear before the 2nd CRF...  ;)
I think your fleet just became the primary target  :drevil:
I would expect it anyway. The 1st UGC is harder to kill, and my stats are better than the 2nd SF.

I am Lorric, and you'll find me where the fighting is thickest.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on July 25, 2013, 12:50:26 pm
Hey, Spoon, can we get a quick detailing of the political structure of the Delest Dynasty? Is it some sort of feudal system, something like the Tzar-era Russia, some constitutional/democratic monarchy like the UK, or something else? Who is on top (President, Tzar, King, Duke etc?) Who is really important (Nobles, Senators, Ministers, MPs?) Who tells the military what to do (Minister, Marshal, High Admiral, the Tzar himself, local military leaders?) How is the society structured (repressed low-class citizens, serfs, middle class citizens, nobles, rich folk etc?)

I'm thinking, since it will take me some time to reach the front lines, I might as well do some political maneuvering and engage in some world building and intrigue behind the scenes.  :P

EDIT: OK, WTF? I assume there is some explanation concerning the reason why certain enemy fleets started with 150% forces.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on July 25, 2013, 02:42:25 pm
Aaand Turn.
I'm working on the video that will accompany the post, should be done in a few hours from now.

Hey, Spoon, can we get a quick detailing of the political structure of the Delest Dynasty? Is it some sort of feudal system, something like the Tzar-era Russia, some constitutional/democratic monarchy like the UK, or something else? Who is on top (President, Tzar, King, Duke etc?) Who is really important (Nobles, Senators, Ministers, MPs?) Who tells the military what to do (Minister, Marshal, High Admiral, the Tzar himself, local military leaders?) How is the society structured (repressed low-class citizens, serfs, middle class citizens, nobles, rich folk etc?)

I'm thinking, since it will take me some time to reach the front lines, I might as well do some political maneuvering and engage in some world building and intrigue behind the scenes.  :P
The Delest Dynasty is wierd, its society is sort of a mix between russia, china and japan.
There is always one Emperor or Empress who is basically treated as a divine ruler, currently that is the 30 year old Empress Yu Ki Kohakuren. The rest of the Delest family take all the high positions everywhere else. There are no political elections.

Society in the DD is a form of communism, overal wealth and technology is high but freedom is low. Once you get out of the education system you are basically assigned a job that is determined to fit you. You are expected to perform your assigned task/job and if you underperform they will find somebody else who fits the job better, usually resulting in you recieving a job with 'less responsibility' (You've just brought shame to yourself and your family).

Being an admiral means you have proven to be talented enough to lead a fleet. However the elite troops and superior equipment are always prioritized to the fleets led by Delest family members. There is rarely a shortage of troops (if need be, anyone can just be reassigned from his/her current job to the military) but the quality of troops can vary greatly in the DD.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 25, 2013, 02:43:28 pm
I think it best if I retreat and someone take my place.

I think it would be a good idea for me to regroup at Tauri. I can get back to full strength and use defend to face whatever is coming. Whatever is coming is neither Cordi or Nordera, and the 1st fleets so far have been at 150% strength. I doubt I can face whatever is coming alone even prepared so.

I would request the newly arrived 4th SF to join me there and when the 2nd UGC arrives for it to also head for me. We cannot take any chances with such valuable systems.

So, the early idea would be:

T-1
move to Tauri
resupply

T-2
resupply
defend

and T-3 would see the enemy arrive.

The 4th SF will be able to do this:

T-1
move to Polaris
move to Librae

T-2
move to Tauri (minor)
defend (major)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 25, 2013, 03:07:14 pm
Hey Spoon...

(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/WoD%20Forum%20Game/CRFOperator200_zps6e95bf8a.png~original)

Unless medieval-style armour has come into fashion amongst the girls of the CRF in this time period, am I wandering around in full knight armour or something?  :lol:

Oh and well done on the first turn, I'll have more to say about it all once the video is in place and watched.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: SpardaSon21 on July 25, 2013, 03:17:25 pm
Oh God my fleet just got gang-banged by a couple Nordera ones.  Help!
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 25, 2013, 03:32:10 pm
Oh God my fleet just got gang-banged by a couple Nordera ones.  Help!

Sparda, I think if you stand and fight, you're going to be destroyed next turn. Your fleet is down to 60% strength from 2 attacks. You will take damage from the Nordera you attacked, then receive 2 more Nordera attacks and the 4th Cordi is in position to move in and attack you as well.

Even if you somehow survive that, no one can cover you, and you'll be destroyed trying to flee the turn after that.

I would retreat 2 spaces to Aquarius, you'll take some damage, but the 1st CRF and 1st DD can arrive in Vega and cover you and block the enemy while you repair after that.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Torchwood on July 25, 2013, 03:51:17 pm
Hey Spoon...

(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/WoD%20Forum%20Game/CRFOperator200_zps6e95bf8a.png~original)

Unless medieval-style armour has come into fashion amongst the girls of the CRF in this time period, am I wandering around in full knight armour or something?  :lol:

Oh and well done on the first turn, I'll have more to say about it all once the video is in place and watched.

I think the uniform just looks like plate armour, but is actually cloth or plastic. The CRF are nostalgic, not impractical.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Droid803 on July 25, 2013, 04:06:45 pm
Eh if you're sitting on the bridge of a spaceship giving orders, platemail is fine. Not like you need to be able to run around and stuff you know. You're just barking orders and occasionally pointing at things.
You don't need to move, and if its got a vacuum-tight underlayer all the better!
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 25, 2013, 05:07:15 pm
Spoon, shouldn't we have some intel on that 1st ? fleet in Algol? Even though there are no fleets there surely an entire system can get us some intel on the enemy? Especially when they can't use secure until the next turn?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on July 25, 2013, 06:03:47 pm
Hey Spoon...
Unless medieval-style armour has come into fashion amongst the girls of the CRF in this time period, am I wandering around in full knight armour or something?  :lol:

Oh and well done on the first turn, I'll have more to say about it all once the video is in place and watched.

I think the uniform just looks like plate armour, but is actually cloth or plastic. The CRF are nostalgic, not impractical.
The CRF, the only military in which it is fashionable to wear plate armor.
It's made of a light, flexible and durable material. It offers a good amount of protection without slowing the wearer down.

Spoon, shouldn't we have some intel on that 1st ? fleet in Algol? Even though there are no fleets there surely an entire system can get us some intel on the enemy? Especially when they can't use secure until the next turn?
Maybe the enemy is really good at jamming. Cause apparantly little to no intel has reached you.

Now what I'm wondering is, why are you retreating out of a good fight right after your Queen has told you to be stalwart?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 25, 2013, 06:17:46 pm
Maybe the enemy is really good at jamming. Cause apparantly little to no intel has reached you.

It's the Fura'ngle. I think

Quote
Now what I'm wondering is, why are you retreating out of a good fight right after your Queen has told you to be stalwart?

I'll write her a report.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on July 25, 2013, 08:40:53 pm
Right now I'm stumped on the following error:

Loading model 'none'
ERROR: Can't open model file <none>
Line: 969
Int3(): From d:\users\swifty\software development\freespace open\git\code\globalincs\windebug.cpp at line 1247

And I havent found it after double and triple checking. So I'm going to catch some sleep and have an other go at it tomorrow, Hopefully I'll be able to actually deliver on the promised video footage tomorrow.

Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: CommanderDJ on July 26, 2013, 06:25:26 am
Someone refresh my memory: the admiral commands the fleet, but there'd be another officer in charge of his flagship when he's sleeping or whatever, right? What rank would that officer be?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Jellyfish on July 26, 2013, 06:34:25 am
Captain. The admiral also gives command of the ship to him when in combat.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 26, 2013, 08:05:08 am
Iera turned to his XO, Arnaya Regulle, a pale, blonde-haired woman who looked like she was chiselled from ice instead of born.
Hmmm...
(http://th06.deviantart.net/fs71/PRE/i/2012/260/5/e/shiva_diamond_dust_by_lenlenbell-d5f2kyd.jpg)
She even looks like she belongs in with the art style of Spoon a bit! :lol:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: CommanderDJ on July 26, 2013, 08:19:48 am
LOL

I have never seen that before!
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 26, 2013, 08:53:42 am
LOL

I have never seen that before!

 :)

It is Shiva from Final Fantasy VIII if you want to look it up. However, that is fan art that is significantly different to Shiva. I was just going to use Shiva, but then I saw that and thought it looked quite like something Spoon would make, so I used that instead.

Lorric, you made me laugh. Shame on you. :P

Shame on me? Do you not like laughter? :D
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 26, 2013, 10:40:21 am
"Jerry actually did us a service by installing his Firespace 4 game to almost every computers in the ship, so it should be installed here. Good thing he also has also installed this Winds of Dusk mod, it does nicely because it has fairly accurate data of every known Terran and Cyrvan ships.

 :D

Did you know about the A Nord Era Day expansion pack?  :)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on July 26, 2013, 05:51:45 pm
Guys I am absolutely loving these write ups  :yes2:

I have spend several hours today finding the source of the mysterious error that's been bugging me (aka preventing me from recording footage) and finally found it thanks to the aid of The E and Zookeeper. But I still don't have a video to show for it. Sunday's turn will continue as planned, but I'm not sure if it'll come with a video too.
My deepest apologies. orz
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 26, 2013, 06:58:22 pm
Guys I am absolutely loving these write ups  :yes2:

I never would have expected such quality and enthusiasm and volume of RP when this all got started. I'm enjoying them too, and I'm just a player, I can only imagine how much you must be enjoying them as the creator, and we're just getting started!  :D

Quote
I have spend several hours today finding the source of the mysterious error that's been bugging me (aka preventing me from recording footage) and finally found it thanks to the aid of The E and Zookeeper. But I still don't have a video to show for it. Sunday's turn will continue as planned, but I'm not sure if it'll come with a video too.
My deepest apologies. orz

Then I salute all of your efforts!  :)

So tomorrow, perhaps we can all watch the glorious footage of us getting our asses kicked our fleets in battle.

And don't worry about the video issues. Teething problems should be expected for something like this.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on July 26, 2013, 07:49:23 pm
Flagship of the 1st CRF is the Silver Arrow, you've accidentally confused me with the 1st UGCR who's flagship is the Garuda.  :)

Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: mobcdmoc3 on July 26, 2013, 08:29:39 pm
Flagship of the 1st CRF is the Silver Arrow, you've accidentally confused me with the 1st UGCR who's flagship is the Garuda.  :)



That's what I get for not triple-checking my writing. :p Sorry 'bout that. Will correct in short order.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on July 26, 2013, 09:39:09 pm
I wouldn't worry about it too much, I try and triple-check everything I do. Impossible to account for every detail. :) But thanks for the change. I should post something..., may be when i get home from work tonight. Sounds like a relaxing idea.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: CommanderDJ on July 26, 2013, 10:56:10 pm
Spoon, is it possible to get Fleet Status info on the enemy fleets at the end of a turn (at least the ones we know of), like we do with friendly fleets? The information's already there, just hidden around the battle results parts, so this might make it easier to pick out targets and so forth. Totally up to you, no pressure, it's just something I could see making it (a tad) easier.

And, of course, thanks for setting up this game for us. :yes:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on July 27, 2013, 12:59:36 pm
Spoon, is it possible to get Fleet Status info on the enemy fleets at the end of a turn (at least the ones we know of), like we do with friendly fleets? The information's already there, just hidden around the battle results parts, so this might make it easier to pick out targets and so forth. Totally up to you, no pressure, it's just something I could see making it (a tad) easier.

And, of course, thanks for setting up this game for us. :yes:
I have considered doing that but then I thought being the mean bastard that I am "haha, no. They'll have to keep track of that themselves!"

Fleet: 2nd SF
First action: Major - Defend
Second action: none
X3NO, your fleet is currently in a contested system. You can only use the defend action when you're in a friendly one.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 27, 2013, 01:17:14 pm
With the 3rd SF heading down to Vega, I am concerned. I hadn't realised that until I saw this:

Fleet: 2nd SF
First action: Major - Defend
Second action: none

It made me think if he is not confident enough to risk an attack, why not retreat and resupply? But we have no reserve in the 3rd SF now which I would have advised take the 2nd's place and attack. I think it would be better for when the 2nd UGC arrives for it to head to Alderbaran instead of Tauri, as under these circumstances, I think it should be down to me and the 4th SF to handle whatever is coming, surely the two of us can take it. I just thought we'd have enough forces around to have 3 in each system with 1 in reserve at Aldebaran to rotate in and out, but now we have no reserve, so the 2nd UGC should act as that reserve when it arrives.

I would still rather that not happen and the 3rd SF stay up here. Our last 3 fleets will be placed on the map next turn, with 2 of those 3 deploying at the bottom. If the 3rd SF goes down, there will be 9 fleets on the bottom and 6 on the top, and I think this is dangerously imbalanced, especially with the top being the closest route to Sol with rich systems along the way. I really believe it's better for it to be 7/8.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: X3N0-Life-Form on July 27, 2013, 02:07:38 pm
X3NO, your fleet is currently in a contested system. You can only use the defend action when you're in a friendly one.
Right. Derp >.< Fixxorization in progress.

EDIT - done
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: AndrewofDoom on July 27, 2013, 02:23:56 pm
Fleet: 1st SF
First action: Minor action - Travel to Aldebaran
Second action: Major action - Engage 2nd Cordi Fleet

Problem here, there are already 3 friendly fleets in Aldebaran.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 27, 2013, 02:27:19 pm
Fleet: 1st SF
First action: Minor action - Travel to Aldebaran
Second action: Major action - Engage 2nd Cordi Fleet

Problem here, there are already 3 friendly fleets in Aldebaran.

I am leaving.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: AndrewofDoom on July 27, 2013, 02:29:28 pm
Fleet: 1st SF
First action: Minor action - Travel to Aldebaran
Second action: Major action - Engage 2nd Cordi Fleet

Problem here, there are already 3 friendly fleets in Aldebaran.

I am leaving.

Oh, didn't see that. My bad .  :nervous:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 27, 2013, 02:32:30 pm
Oh, didn't see that. My bad .  :nervous:

No harm done. And I think your mercenaries will be happy to see me go!  ;)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 27, 2013, 05:12:33 pm
Has anyone taken a look at the comparison between the base stats of the Cordi and the Nordera? Look:

Nordera Fleet
Fighter attack strength: 12 (10+2)
Capital attack strength: 10 (8+2)
Morale: Very High

--------------------

Cordi Fleet
Fighter attack strength: 20 (20)
Capital attack strength: 12 (12)
Morale: Normal

The Cordi are so much more powerful than the Nordera. I wonder if that is an indication of change to come in the new WoD. Maybe the Nordera will be just fodder, while the Cordi are much more of a threat?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Flak on July 27, 2013, 09:30:45 pm
Has anyone taken a look at the comparison between the base stats of the Cordi and the Nordera? Look:

Nordera Fleet
Fighter attack strength: 12 (10+2)
Capital attack strength: 10 (8+2)
Morale: Very High

--------------------

Cordi Fleet
Fighter attack strength: 20 (20)
Capital attack strength: 12 (12)
Morale: Normal

The Cordi are so much more powerful than the Nordera. I wonder if that is an indication of change to come in the new WoD. Maybe the Nordera will be just fodder, while the Cordi are much more of a threat?

I believe that is because of the gunships that the Nordera don't have. Also the EMP missiles which in addition to doing significant damage to capships, they also give the fighter escort an interface screw.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on July 28, 2013, 03:18:42 pm
It's relative fleet strength, the Cordi numbers are high because they have a lot of fighters to throw at you.

Okay so Turn 1 video is up. If some of the transitions seem jittery, its not you. My video editing program does some really strange things with fraps recorded footage and I'm unsure why or how to fix it. (Also the music choice for the first bit was because of popular demand  :p)
Turn 2 happening in a bit.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 28, 2013, 03:33:16 pm
Oooooh, love it-love it-love it!  :D  :D  :D

The Soaring Spirit was right where I said it would be, in the thick of the action kicking ass. Yes, I caught the name on the side of the ship.  :)

So, what class of ship is that, a Champion or a Lord?

Also, what did you mean by "popular demand"? Was it just your way of saying "My choice, deal with it. :cool:" ?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on July 28, 2013, 04:02:06 pm
My choice (http://youtu.be/regl4vTld5E)
But then people were all like "ya gotta use all hail britannia for CRF footage mang"
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 28, 2013, 04:12:28 pm
My choice (http://youtu.be/regl4vTld5E)

I have actually seen that before. I have no clue what it is, but it's something that showed up in my sidebar one time and I clicked it.

Quote
But then people were all like "ya gotta use all hail britannia for CRF footage mang"

Hmmm, what people? Those who helped you fix the bug you were having? Well, whoever they are, I think they made the better choice. Your pick just doesn't have the impact needed for something like this if you ask me, especially for the very first piece of battle footage. I've liked all the music choices so far, including 1st vid, it really adds to the videos. I'm hoping you'll get a turn 2 vid out, as I want to see that lone Nordera fleet get smashed. But if not, perfectly understandable. This is going to be great once the action really heats up, there'll be a lot more activity from here on out.

And please, what ship class is the Soaring Spirit?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lepanto on July 28, 2013, 04:24:02 pm
Lorric, your big carrier is a Lord-class.

Spoon, any chance that some of our characters from here might cameo in the WoD reboot when it comes out?  :)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 28, 2013, 05:36:09 pm
Lorric, your big carrier is a Lord-class.

How do you know?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Torchwood on July 28, 2013, 05:48:35 pm
Well, why wouldn't you want a Lord-clas? It has oodles and oodles of beams and looks mighty sexy to boot. Almost like a pocket Star Destroyer.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 28, 2013, 05:53:28 pm
Well, why wouldn't you want a Lord-clas? It has oodles and oodles of beams and looks mighty sexy to boot. Almost like a pocket Star Destroyer.

I just want to know if it's a Lord or a Champion. Since I don't know what either look like because I've never seen them before. I guess if I see the other vessel I'll know which I prefer, but by name only, I would choose Lord. It seems more fitting for this faction. The Champion would serve under the Lord.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on July 28, 2013, 05:54:52 pm
Lorric, your big carrier is a Lord-class.

Spoon, any chance that some of our characters from here might cameo in the WoD reboot when it comes out?  :)
If you are all okay with you being turned into super kawaii~ moe~ uguu~ girlies
Though Ivan Dimitrievic Kalazonitov is too much of a badass, I can never capture that with my drawing.

How do you know?
He knows because he's been paying attention  :p
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on July 28, 2013, 06:02:29 pm
Just on the music topic.. I'm very biased towards the British Grenadiers right now.. :D (video extended from Girls und Panzer)

http://youtu.be/regl4vTld5E


Hey, awesome ship is awesome isnt it? :)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 28, 2013, 06:03:12 pm
How do you know?
He knows because he's been paying attention  :p

 :confused:

This is all I have to go on, is it not?

Quote
Commonwealth Royal Fleet:
2nd Gen
 - Light: Dragonfly
 - Medium: Ray IIJS
 - Heavy: Tyrfing

3rd Gen
 - Light: Kaze-Page
 - Medium: Esquire, Ray IIIM3v
 - Heavy: Excalibur

4th Gen
 - Light: Hospitaler
 - Medium: Templar
 - Heavy: -

Capital ships:
 - Light: Cavalier
 - Medium: Duke
 - Heavy/Carrier: Lord, Champion

So it's one or the other. Of course, I now know it's a Lord, but I wonder how he knows.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 28, 2013, 06:13:30 pm
*Lightbulb clicks on*

Stranded.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on July 28, 2013, 06:16:56 pm
awesome video Spoon, thanks!   :D :yes:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on July 28, 2013, 08:56:41 pm
Okay guys, it seems like I can't keep up with the two turns a week schedule. It takes me several hours to write the post and make the video to go with it and with the amount of battles only increasing from this point onward, it'll take me more time each... time.
We're switching to a once per week update from here on. Right now this is sunday, but we can also make it saturday if this is more convenient for you guys. (Lemme know)

Again, the video for turn 2 will follow. I simply ran out of time today.

If there are any errors or things that I missed in the turn report, let me know. After looking at the same post for like 3 hours straight I sorta became blind to everything  :p

Oooooh, love it-love it-love it!  :D  :D  :D
awesome video Spoon, thanks!   :D :yes:
Glad you liked it
Though this one was really a rush job! Future vids will be better!
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 28, 2013, 09:16:56 pm
Ah well, sure it's regrettable that we're down to a turn a week, but looking on the bright side, it might mean we get better vids and better RP!

And speaking of the vids, thinking to the future, what fun it will be when this is all over to make a playlist of them and sit back and watch as months are condensed into minutes...

The Nordera are weird. The 3rd fleet gets dismantled, runs away, and their morale goes up...?

I'm also surprised the 2nd Cordi didn't lose morale after getting hammered while our fleets do lose morale when faring poorly.

If you've got a handle on exactly how the morale system works, any concrete insight would be welcome. I believe my drop is a one-off RP element, rather than a standard penalty for retreating.

Oh, and I wanted to talk to the Cordi, but circumstances have stopped that. Anyone else want to try their hand chatting with the aliens?  :)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lepanto on July 28, 2013, 09:23:49 pm
I'm FINALLY here. Right now, I'm thinking of making a dash to reinforce Aldebaran after using Zeal, as the southern front seems to be doing better and for RP reasons. Does anyone have any better ideas for what to do with the 4th CRF?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 28, 2013, 09:36:23 pm
I'm FINALLY here. Right now, I'm thinking of making a dash to reinforce Aldebaran after using Zeal, as the southern front seems to be doing better and for RP reasons. Does anyone have any better ideas for what to do with the 4th CRF?

It's probably better to ask that question the next turn down the line, since using Zeal and moving to Tamy won't have any impact on the decision. The picture will be clearer then.

Hey, got a "zeal speech" up your sleeve, hmmm? :)

I do request reinforcements for the top though, I don't care where they come from.

I guess we know the answer now on whether the heirarchy fleets will retreat. If the 1st UGC had attacked the 2nd Cordi, we would have destroyed it completely. I'm not saying it's a bad thing though, there are benefits to our big fleet cutting the enemy's big fleet down to size, the 1st UGC inflicted some good damage, and we didn't know if they would run or just fight to the death. Now we know.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on July 28, 2013, 09:45:20 pm
Quote
Fleet movement Results:
1st SF Fleet, Fomalhaut -> Aldebaran
3rd SF Fleet, Virgo -> Aquarius -> Vega
4th SF Fleet, Sol -> Polaris -> Librae
1st DD Fleet, Tamy -> Aquarius -> Vega
3rd DD Fleet, Scorpius -> Silva
1st CRF Fleet, Tamy -> Aquarius -> Vega (wrong movement entered - corrected to reflect map/orders given)
2nd CRF Fleet, Aldebaran -> Tauri
3rd CRF Fleet, Ruba Pegasi -> Tamy (wrong movement entered - corrected to reflect map/orders given)
4th CRF Fleet, Harcon -> Ruba Pegasi
2nd UGCR Fleet, Grens -> Sol
1st LSF Fleet, Draco -> Vega -> Aquarius

2nd Cordi Fleet, Aldebaran -> Crux
4th Cordi Fleet, Kardoen -> Draco
1st Nordera Fleet, Draco -> Hydra
2nd Nordera Fleet, Draco -> Hydra
3rd Nordera Fleet, Hydra -> Kardoen
1st ? Fleet, Algol -> Kardoen
1st ? Fleet, In transit to Tauri, ETA Turn 3
2nd ? Fleet, Unknown -> Crux

Other Results:
2nd SF Fleet, Morale from Normal to Low
2nd DD Fleet, Morale from Low to Normal
1st CRF Fleet, Morale Very High (My Morale was already up to Very High from last turn. No change here? )
2nd CRF Fleet, Morale from Very High to High
3rd CRF Fleet, Morale from High to Very High
1st LSF Fleet, Morale from High to Normal
3rd Nordera Fleet, Morale from Very High to Zealous  (well... damn)
2nd DD Fleet, Prepared Barrage (and immediately used it)
2nd LSF Fleet, Combined arms (and immediately used it)

Those are the corrections I've made in accordance to the Map and orders that have been posted. I can't see anything else. :) Hope that helps.

Now RP time :)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 28, 2013, 10:11:34 pm
I see AdmiralRalwood has chosen to defend Vega. I don't think this is the right call. I'd be interested in what others think. If everyone defends Vega, yes, it makes it very hard to take, but it just hands Spoon the initiative. And if I was Spoon I'd just ignore Vega and put all the pressure on Hydra, 5 fleets down there, rotate them in and out and all attack Hydra. Why would he send anything to Vega, it makes no sense for him to do that, he can only even attack it with one fleet next turn, we'll just be wasting a turn for three of our fleets. He didn't attack it this turn and no one was defending.

So I humbly suggest everyone attack the 4th Cordi and put the pressure on. Try to link the two systems back up if possible, but don't just give him a free hand to attack Hydra, we've got 5 against 5 down there, and the 3 Nordera fleets are far inferior to our fleets, attack, put him under pressure.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on July 28, 2013, 10:14:45 pm
Corrected.
Seems like I accidently switched the 1st and 3rd movement results around.

Quote
I'm also surprised the 2nd Cordi didn't lose morale after getting hammered while our fleets do lose morale when faring poorly.
The Hierarchy fleets (mostly) follow the same rules you guys are subject to. You should be able to figure out why the 2nd Cordi fleet seemingly has unchanged morale with some logical thinking.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 28, 2013, 10:19:15 pm
The Hierarchy fleets (mostly) follow the same rules you guys are subject to. You should be able to figure out why the 2nd Cordi fleet seemingly has unchanged morale with some logical thinking.

Did they Resupply? I thought you would have specified it.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: AdmiralRalwood on July 28, 2013, 10:20:05 pm
I see AdmiralRalwood has chosen to defend Vega. I don't think this is the right call. I'd be interested in what others think. If everyone defends Vega, yes, it makes it very hard to take, but it just hands Spoon the initiative. And if I was Spoon I'd just ignore Vega and put all the pressure on Hydra, 5 fleets down there, rotate them in and out and all attack Hydra.
I'm holding in Vega for the very simple reason that I can't enter Draco without being hammered by an attack of opportunity. With already-low morale and 2nd gen fighters, that sounds like a good way to get my ass kicked for little or no return. On the other hand, by staying in Vega with my defensive bonus and my already-prepared barrage, I'll get a sizeable bonus when the enemy shows up. And I do think it's a matter of "when" and not "if", but even if the enemy decides to just ignore me, we can have Rear Admiral Soryu and the 3rd SF use Blitz to break into the system.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 28, 2013, 10:26:18 pm
I see AdmiralRalwood has chosen to defend Vega. I don't think this is the right call. I'd be interested in what others think. If everyone defends Vega, yes, it makes it very hard to take, but it just hands Spoon the initiative. And if I was Spoon I'd just ignore Vega and put all the pressure on Hydra, 5 fleets down there, rotate them in and out and all attack Hydra.
I'm holding in Vega for the very simple reason that I can't enter Draco without being hammered by an attack of opportunity. With already-low morale and 2nd gen fighters, that sounds like a good way to get my ass kicked for little or no return. On the other hand, by staying in Vega with my defensive bonus and my already-prepared barrage, I'll get a sizeable bonus when the enemy shows up. And I do think it's a matter of "when" and not "if", but even if the enemy decides to just ignore me, we can have Rear Admiral Soryu and the 3rd SF use Blitz to break into the system.

You'll be safe. He doesn't have enough. Remember everyone takes the same damage, your stats only determine how much you can deal. He'll probably ignore you and attack a stronger fleet.

But look, here's the way I see it. The 2nd DD and 2nd LSF will defeat the Nordera in Hydra. The three fleets from Vega will devastate the 4th Cordi. The 3rd Nordera is already badly damaged. Only the unknown fleet is in position to attack. Anything off the map can't attack you in Draco, the best they can do is travel there. Please, attack the 4th Cordi. We can put them all on the run and roll them all up. The advantage is ours, please press it.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: AdmiralRalwood on July 28, 2013, 10:29:32 pm
You'll be safe. He doesn't have enough. Remember everyone takes the same damage, your stats only determine how much you can deal. He'll probably ignore you and attack a stronger fleet.
I was very confused by this reply until I realized that I had misread the rules regarding movement; for some reason, I thought moving into a system with a hostile fleet and no friendly fleets caused you to take automatic damage the same as a retreat. I'll be changing my orders now.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 28, 2013, 10:30:24 pm
You'll be safe. He doesn't have enough. Remember everyone takes the same damage, your stats only determine how much you can deal. He'll probably ignore you and attack a stronger fleet.
I was very confused by this reply until I realized that I had misread the rules regarding movement; for some reason, I thought moving into a system with a hostile fleet and no friendly fleets caused you to take automatic damage the same as a retreat. I'll be changing my orders now.

Ah, thank you.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on July 28, 2013, 10:37:05 pm
1st CRF will also support your assault, I just have not written up the RP or order side of it yet :)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 28, 2013, 10:43:02 pm
I see Jellyfish has brought his forces to stand beside me in Tauri  :yes:

1st CRF will also support your assault, I just have not written up the RP or order side of it yet :)

The vid should be fun when it gets to Draco, watching your three fleets crush them like the bugs that they are.  :cool:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on July 28, 2013, 10:54:55 pm
Assuming that fleet does got get reinforced. Nothing is ever as simple as it seems, and I am open to either assaulting or defending.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Jellyfish on July 28, 2013, 10:59:04 pm
Go figure, I thought 1st ? Fleet was coming from Crux, and that Crux was empty of anyone other than them.
I could've blitzed them, but they aren't coming from Crux.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 28, 2013, 11:00:56 pm
Assuming that fleet does got get reinforced. Nothing is ever as simple as it seems, and I am open to either assaulting or defending.

Indeed. But for this turn, there is very little risk in this attack. There will be scope to go back to Vega and defend if necessary.

Go figure, I thought 1st ? Fleet was coming from Crux, and that Crux was empty of anyone other than them.
I could've blitzed them, but they aren't coming from Crux.

Yeah, they're just bypassing it. Perhaps it's an enemy special move. Hopefully they'll be trapped over here with us and we'll be able to destroy them.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Flak on July 28, 2013, 11:15:46 pm
All hail Britannia!

Dang, now I can't get that song out of my head
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on July 28, 2013, 11:15:53 pm
The 2nd SF Fleet status seems to be different in the Battle Status & the Fleet Status.

Assuming that the Battle Status is correct, those poor bastards are in a world of hurt and no one is in range to take their place (except the 1st LSF and they're not ready for another fight).  Lets hope the 2nd ? Fleet doesn't hit too hard... ditto for the Northern 1st ? Fleet since there's no one free to relieve the 2nd CRF & 4th SF (although if I understand correctly, the 2nd UGCR could pass through Aldebaran to Tauri assuming that someone remains in Aldebaran to cover them?) 

Anyway, I think it'd be good to have one more fleet heading towards Aldebaran, maybe the 3rd CRF since the 1st LSF needs two turns to resupply back to near 100%. (edit: no no no, read the rules niffi, resupply is a minor action!)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: AndrewofDoom on July 28, 2013, 11:36:20 pm
I for one would much rather be on the offensive if and when possible.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 28, 2013, 11:39:58 pm
The 2nd SF Fleet status seems to be different in the Battle Status & the Fleet Status.

Assuming that the Battle Status is correct, those poor bastards are in a world of hurt and no one is in range to take their place (except the 1st LSF and they're not ready for another fight).  Lets hope the 2nd ? Fleet doesn't hit too hard... ditto for the Northern 1st ? Fleet since there's no one free to relieve the 2nd CRF & 4th SF (although if I understand correctly, the 2nd UGCR could pass through Aldebaran to Tauri assuming that someone remains in Aldebaran to cover them?) 

Anyway, I think it'd be good to have one more fleet heading towards Aldebaran, maybe the 3rd CRF since the 1st LSF needs two turns to resupply back to near 100%.

Nice spot there niffiwan on the differences, another correction for Spoon to make.

Yes, you could cut right through to us if necessary.

My impulse would have been to take on mercs in the first turn, putting you in a position to take the 150% fleet to either system next. But I've been wondering and I think your your move might be better though. With your move, you'd be in a position to move into Aldebaran with your first action, thereby allowing you to cover the retreat of the others if necessary as they could retreat on their second action. You could also go to Tauri, or you could take on mercs and enter the system. So your choice might well be the better choice. The only thing you wouldn't be able to do is bring a merc fleet to Tauri, but I think me and Jellyfish could at least hold on long enough for our forces to re-organise some help if we're dealing with a super-fleet. So I think your move is the better one.

I'm not sure if it's better for the 2nd SF to fight or retreat.

I for one would much rather be on the offensive if and when possible.

And your powerful fleet ought to allow you to be.

Speaking of which, if we get into a situation where you, niffiwan+mercs and a good third fleet all attack one enemy, it would do a hell of a lot of damage.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Flak on July 28, 2013, 11:49:11 pm
3rd Nordera Fleet, Morale from Very High to Zealous

And this is just right after they have their asses handed to them by the 2nd DD and 2nd LSF?
The Norderas are crazy
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 28, 2013, 11:57:47 pm
Oh, and now we know why Spoon doesn't want to provide us with enemy fleet stats. Because it's down to us to keep track of enemy resupplying.

So I think we can be confident that the 2nd Cordi will now be at 50%/52%.

The 3rd Nordera might be lower due to retreating with no cover, though the 1st and 2nd Nordera had 2 actions and only one was used. 57% damage was inflicted and the stats reflect that, so they might have taken additional damage. They will have been boosted to 73%/73% max, if they were boosted. However, if they retreated under cover, the second action might have been required, so no resupply, I'm not clear on that. I don't know if fleets swapping places on the same action would count as covering I don't think that was asked.

Spoon, if two fleets swap places in a system simultaneously, does it allow one to cover the other's retreat?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: AdmiralRalwood on July 29, 2013, 04:56:33 am
1st CRF will also support your assault, I just have not written up the RP or order side of it yet :)
I actually started writing up an RP post, but I'm in the middle of re-reading the Honor Harrington series, so it turned out to be too much effort not to accidentally write about impeller drives and sidewalls and graser mounts, so... eh. :P

I'll leave the RPing to those of you obviously having so much fun with it and focus on managing my fleet.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on July 29, 2013, 05:14:09 am
1st CRF will also support your assault, I just have not written up the RP or order side of it yet :)
I actually started writing up an RP post, but I'm in the middle of re-reading the Honor Harrington series, so it turned out to be too much effort not to accidentally write about impeller drives and sidewalls and graser mounts, so... eh. :P

I'll leave the RPing to those of you obviously having so much fun with it and focus on managing my fleet.

No problem, I don't expect (for myself at least) that we will RP everything, I'm not great at it but I enjoy it, and as long as we are enjoying ourselves (and not getting annihilated at every turn :P), that is all that matters :)

Oh, I hope you don't mind, the 1st DD is on point! :D I have support elements entering with you and we are assaulting together. I left the Sol Fleet out as I really wanted to write something focusing on the DD and CRF fleets, and it gives mobcdmoc3 a chance to write something up as well, depending on his actions. Either way, if we all move into Draco. The additional details don't really happen.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Flak on July 29, 2013, 05:39:11 am
I think something like this is good for the DD battle music, especially when the ominous Russian chant starts to kick in. I also wonder how the Delest ships looks like.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GTrhnvWTnPg
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on July 29, 2013, 06:02:57 am
My new favourite! Awesome Flak

I think that fits rather nicely, especially since the DD fleet will get stronger over time. This places an emphasis on the mystery of their society and plays rather nicely to their growing strength.  :yes:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 29, 2013, 07:56:55 am
The talk of themes has had me thinking, but I have so much to choose from, how on Earth do you choose?

However, here's something I can throw in, not something I want to see in Spoon's vids, unless maybe at the moment the 2nd CRF destroys/sees off an enemy fleet, then it can serve as victory music. And he uses a piece from the very same game as his WoD victory music, so it might well be fitting...

Allow me to present the Official Anthem of the 2nd CRF:

Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: CommanderDJ on July 29, 2013, 09:55:16 am
Guys, I just want to echo Spoon's sentiments and say that I am absolutely loving these write-ups.

Also, if anyone wants to establish some backstory or whatever between admirals, give me a holler.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on July 29, 2013, 05:21:57 pm
It'd be good to take Kardoen & have only a single point to defend.  My only concerns are:

1) It's further away & takes longer for reinforcements to arrive.  Obviously this doesn't matter in a few turns when all allied fleets have arrived at the front lines
2) Some of the Hierarchy can bypass the Starlances, so this may not guarantee a single chokepoint (but obviously this still applies if we maintain a line at Draco/Hydra)
3) We won't see which Hierarchy fleets are waiting offscreen to ambush us so the fleets in Kardoen should probably resupply sooner, which means we'd need more backup fleets to rotate through the front lines

Having said that, it's still a good idea, we can re-evaluate after we see what Hierarchy reinforcements show up after next turn
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on July 29, 2013, 05:36:08 pm
The 2nd SF Fleet status seems to be different in the Battle Status & the Fleet Status.
When I read this I was all like "hell nah, I'm 99% sure I have this correct!" and then I checked the turn post... "Bugger!"
It's been fixed, good spot.

Spoon, if two fleets swap places in a system simultaneously, does it allow one to cover the other's retreat?
http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php?topic=85046.msg1700482#msg1700482


Edit: In other good news, I have fixed the issues I was having with my video program being glitchy at the beginning of clips. Time to get started on the turn 2 footage.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on July 29, 2013, 06:54:12 pm
Ah, excellent. (to both the retreat and the video). What was causing the problem?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 29, 2013, 06:56:00 pm
On the subject of massing in the South, you've already seen me advocating a push down there. I remember I didn't want one of the fleets to go down there, but it's put the pressure on down there. However, I would want the 1st LSF to go North, not South. If the North does collapse, the South, everyone will be too far away to stop the enemy just cruising to Sol unopposed. So I feel we need the backup of the 1st LSF up North. In the North, maybe we should consider if it would be better to simply stall the enemy rather than trying to destroy them. Though as I've also said before, the two bloated UGC fleets paired with another fleet could inflict a great deal of damage.

Spoon, if two fleets swap places in a system simultaneously, does it allow one to cover the other's retreat?
http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php?topic=85046.msg1700482#msg1700482


Edit: In other good news, I have fixed the issues I was having with my video program being glitchy at the beginning of clips. Time to get started on the turn 2 footage.

Ah, I'm sorry about that Spoon. I really didn't want you to have to reiterate something again, I checked the first two pages looking for the information I wanted, but it was on the third. I'm just glad I didn't ask the question. For the benefit of everyone else, we can't swap two fleets in and out, both have to be there at the same time in order for someone to leave unharmed.

Good to hear about that bug being squashed like your bugs of the 4th Cordi are about to be squashed.  ;)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: CommanderDJ on July 30, 2013, 12:15:10 am

CommanderDJ, I'd be open to that. Do you have any ideas?

I'm just trying to think of what sort of interaction between admirals could have taken place if they're from different factions. Do we have any info on whether relations between factions are peaceful or otherwise? The only thing I found is in the LSF's entry in the explanation/recruiting thread, which mentions proxy wars, but I'm not sure exactly what that means.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on July 30, 2013, 12:28:07 am
I understood proxy as, like a middle man. They would supervise wars, training sessions etc where military power was involved.

I also think they would be a mixed group. Having not only members from each faction, but also some equipment from each.

Edit: I just realised I practically said word for word what Spoon has already noted about the LSF. :banghead:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 30, 2013, 05:33:19 pm
Fleet: 3rd SF
First Action: Minor - Blitz - Draco - 4th Cordi Fleet
Second Action: Major - Engage 4th Cordi Fleet

Hello mobcdmoc3. This isn't what Blitz is for. Spoon's explanation:

Quote
Fleet Abilities:
Blitz: Allows a fleet to break through enemy lines and advance into an enemy control system. (From a contested system to a hostile system)
When using Blitz you must target one enemy fleet and the target system that you want to move into. You will deal and take half damage to the targeted fleet as your fleet breaks through the enemy lines.
Cooldown: 2 turns

You're going from a friendly system to an enemy one. Just attack normally and save your special.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: mobcdmoc3 on July 30, 2013, 06:43:53 pm
I see. Oh well, we should still end up with a terribly stacked brawl against the 4th Cordi. :p

Thanks for pointing that out. I'll just have to blitz some other unfortunate fleet in our crosshairs.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 30, 2013, 07:01:03 pm
You're welcome. :)

I think the Blitz ability is more for pushing forward than doing damage. It's a tactical move. Ideally three Sol fleets would be using it from the same system at the same time, with three more allied fleets coming in to replace them.

You could also use it if the system behind the front line was clear of enemies or what was there could be immediately defeated, and then secure that system, trapping the enemy in place and cutting them off from reinforcements as long as the Sol fleet/s that blitzed could hold it and it was the only path.

EDIT: Oh, also, I'm not sure, but I think the idea is the target fleet is one within your system. The idea being that you smash through that fleet into the next system. In an example with 3 Sol fleets, they could all smash through the same fleet, then 3 more fleets waiting could come in and attack that fleet, which would probably be enough to take it out.

EDIT 2: This also means if I'm right, the potential is there for a Sol fleet to attack an enemy normally, then blitz that same enemy, doing 1.5X damage total. 3 Sol fleets doing that would also I think be able to take something out.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Jellyfish on July 31, 2013, 10:31:01 am
I just realized the 1st ? coming in to Tauri will have first shot. Hope starlance-less jumps are a Major action...
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 31, 2013, 10:36:54 am
I just realized the 1st ? coming in to Tauri will have first shot. Hope starlance-less jumps are a Major action...
If it's a special, specials are minor, so they'll be able to attack.

Although it might be a major, since it takes 3 turns, or it might be something unique.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Flak on July 31, 2013, 11:01:09 am
I think blitz its useful for both doing hit and run at a specific enemy fleet hiding behind their other forces in a hostile system, or to quickly finish off a retreating enemy fleet. For the first purpose, just strike the enemy fleet in the hostile system and just run back. For the second purpose, the blitz the enemy fleet and if it survived, attack it once more, though this may leave your fleet vulnerable, so you need other allied fleets for backup to pull this safely if there are other hostile fleets nearby.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 31, 2013, 11:04:15 am
Yes, I don't think there's much use for Blitz for a single Sol fleet, unless it's to finish off a very weak enemy. It needs to be used by 2 or 3.

I hadn't considered running back, but I guess it's possible if you're just moving to a contested system from a system that has become contested due to your presence in it.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on July 31, 2013, 02:30:59 pm
I feel so silly for giving all these excuses. but I had intended for the turn 2 vid to go up today, but then yesterday I caught some kind of virus or what not. It resulted in me headbutting the toiletseat (yeah I actually passed out in front of it, my face hurts) last night and feeling like absolute crappers today. I very rarely get sick so I'm feeling super sorry for myself today and am spending the day watching anime from my comfy seat going "boohoo im so sad".
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 31, 2013, 02:52:14 pm
I feel so silly for giving all these excuses. but I had intended for the turn 2 vid to go up today, but then yesterday I caught some kind of virus or what not. It resulted in me headbutting the toiletseat (yeah I actually passed out in front of it, my face hurts) last night and feeling like absolute crappers today. I very rarely get sick so I'm feeling super sorry for myself today and am spending the day watching anime from my comfy seat going "boohoo im so sad".

 :(

Ooooh, I don't like the sound of this, Spoon. I hope you've been to a doctor, losing consciousness under any circumstances would be ringing the alarm bells for me.

As for the vid, well, you've basically got until Sunday to release it anyway before you start creating a backlog, and I'm sure we'd all understand if you just weren't up to it due to whatever you've picked up. Time for medicine spoons for Spoon I think. I wish you a quick and easy recovery.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 31, 2013, 05:41:51 pm
URGENT! URGENT! URGENT!

My fellow players, I don't know if I am the first among us to come to this terrible realisation, but up until now, I have been operating under the assumption that Jellyfish and I will have the 1st ? fleet isolated in Tauri when it arrives. This is not so. As soon as the 1st ? fleet arrives in Tauri, the status of the system will change to Contested. Alderbaran next to it will also be Contested. This means that there is nothing to stop heirarchy fleets moving through Alderbaran to Tauri to support the 1st ? fleet, with more taking their place in Aldebaran. We may well receive 3 attacks that turn and be close to defeat. It will be 6 on 6 up here soon and they have reserves and we don't. We will die, and the heirarchy will take Sol.

I believe we must have at least the 1st LSF and one other fleet head North to help us hold off the enemy. Perhaps the 3rd CRF. It may even be worth considering pulling away one of the Vega fleets as well, though my first impulse is the other 7 fleets in the South should continue their assault. More enemy fleets will continue to arrive, we must destroy some, or they will eventually have more than us, then they will make more jumps that bypass the starlances and then they will be able to bring those numbers to bear upon us and we will be overwhelmed.

Now would be a good time for a hero to arrive on the scene to aid us...

*Hint*
(http://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/crystalneutral_4349.png)
*Hint*
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Jellyfish on July 31, 2013, 06:40:23 pm
I thought they had to control a system to get the Hierarchy in. Besides, I'm sure we can handle the ? Fleet quickly, forcing it to retreat or perhaps even destroying it.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 31, 2013, 06:51:23 pm
I thought they had to control a system to get the Hierarchy in. Besides, I'm sure we can handle the ? Fleet quickly, forcing it to retreat or perhaps even destroying it.

They can't move into friendly systems. The system won't be friendly when the 1st ? fleet drops in, fleets from Aldebaran could move to Tauri and attack us before we even get a turn. And if the ? fleet gets to attack as well, we'll be in trouble already.

EDIT:

And here is the relevant bit of information:

- A fleet can move from one contested system to an other contested system. This also counts as a retreat.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Flak on July 31, 2013, 08:49:29 pm
For Tauri, I would be more concerned because if it becomes contested, or even worse captured, we will lose the 10 income from it.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 31, 2013, 09:08:36 pm
For Tauri, I would be more concerned because if it becomes contested, or even worse captured, we will lose the 10 income from it.

If it stays contested, it's still worth 5. I don't know if we'll be able to take it back. Right now we need to simply make sure we don't get destroyed at the top and lose the game.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on July 31, 2013, 09:32:47 pm
- A fleet can move from one contested system to an other contested system. This also counts as a retreat.

Hmmm.  Good pickup & I think you're partially correct.  They could transfer *one* fleet (1st ~74% or 3rd ~90% Cordi - both strengths are before our next attacks take effect, I think it's ~55% damage that will be currently dealt to 1st Cordi) from Aldebaran to Tauri and attack you in concert with the 1st ? fleet.  If both fleets move 1st then attack, it'll be a retreat and they'll get a spanking on the way through from the 1st UGCR & 1st SF so I don't think that is likely.  If both fleets wait for reinforcements to enter Aldebaran before moving to Tauri (to avoid the retreat) they can't attack in the same turn.  Ditto for any other reinforcements from Crux passing through to Tauri (2nd ? & 2nd Cordi).

So while not good I don't think it's panic stations yet.  2 on 2 shouldn't be decisively resolved in a single turn, and the following turn we can move a fleet from Aldebaran to Tauri to assist, and hopefully bring 1st UGCR and/or 1st LSF to cover Aldebaran.  The 2nd SF may also have resupplied enough by then to re-enter Aldebaran, although it would be better to enter & attack on the same turn.  The question is, should the 3rd CRF move north?  The consequences would be a reduced chance of us driving on into Kardoen which should relieve pressure on the south, which would also allow us to divert more fleets north.

What about the idea of having the 3rd CRF continue to Vega, but get the 3rd DD or 4th CRF to double move to Aquarius?  If the situation in the north deteriorates, they could double move to Aldebaran in turn 3, otherwise they could use their specials then.

Of course, this analysis ignores the unknown special abilities the Hierarchy have, if Blitz (for instance) is available to the Cordi, then the situation is looking a whole lot uglier!
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Flak on July 31, 2013, 10:02:55 pm
Cordi already has the ability similar to the UGC I think. It probably need at least 4 hits from fleets in at least 90% condition to completely wipe out an enemy fleet.

I do have to agree that the 1st LSF should go north instead, only the 2nd UGCR is coming to reinforce the northern front and they now have to worry about a second front.

The fleet heading to Tauri is probably Fura'ngle, while fleet waiting in Kardoen is probably Zy, unless Spoon decided to screw us over and have you all face the Hertak.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 31, 2013, 10:14:24 pm
Hi, niffiwan. Thanks.

I have a new plan in mind. The 2nd SF needs to retreat from Aldebaran. The order has not been given yet. I've crunched the numbers, and if we have the 1st UGC and 1st SF attack the 1st Cordi as planned, and then if I go and attack them as well, we can finish them off. I don't want the first Cordi returning at 150/150. Taking them out will be a huge boon for us.

Jellyfish will stand alone in Tauri for that one turn. I'm sure he can survive one turn. I would have stayed there if it was possible, but Jellyfish cannot attack the 1st Cordi so I must do it. I'm changing my orders now. We can go back Jellyfish up on the next turn.

This will put us in a good position. The enemy will only have 2 fleets to attack with in one place. They have the 1st ?, the 2nd ? and the 3rd Cordi. The 2nd Cordi is too weak. The 2nd ? can't hit Tauri. They can only attack one of our fleets twice. Either Jellyfish in Tauri with the 1st ? (if it can attack that turn) and 3rd Cordi, or someone in Aldebaran with the 2nd ? and 3rd Cordi. I doubt the 1st ? will be able to move again, but if it does, the Tauri foothold is lost. I don’t think two fleets’ attacks can kill any of us.

So this MIGHT be enough to allow us to let the 3rd CRF continue on and have one of those you mentioned (preferably 4th CRF) come up and aid us instead.

Hmmm, I’d be surprised if the Cordera have specials, they always seemed like just fodder, but it’s not something we can discount.

Oh, my prediction is the fleet going to Tauri is Zy, and may well be 150%.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 31, 2013, 10:23:49 pm
Alright, some more.

I still think we should have the 3rd CRF come North. More enemies could arrive, and we have to deal with two of the ? fleets and none of the weak Nordera. More enemies could arrive on the next turn. We shouldn't take the chance, get the support here now.

I think it's just the 1st fleets that are bigger, for being the 1st fleets. Both the 1st Cordi and 1st Nordera are supersize. I'm worried both 1st ? fleets will be supersize too.

Oh, and has anyone considered the possibility Spoon might just have another race up his sleeve that he hasn't told anyone about...  :nervous:

I could also imagine us finding something like "1st Cordi Elite" as a ? fleet.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Flak on July 31, 2013, 11:24:17 pm
I believed you didn't missed this because you faced these guys yourself.

1st Cordi Fleet Fighters: 30+9 = 39
1st Cordi Fleet Capital: 18+15 = 33
Fighters at 150% Strength
Capital ships at 150% Strength

They have something like Swarm ability or something similar to UGC mercenaries.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 31, 2013, 11:40:33 pm
I don't think it's a special because these were like this from the start. There were these as well:

1st Nordera Fleet Fighters: 18+8 = 26
1st Nordera Fleet Capital: 15+9 = 24
Fighters at 150% Strength
Capital ships at 150% Strength

Just bigger fleets. They never used a special, they just went straight in and attacked. We'll know if a 100% fleet ever goes up to 150%, but I think it's just their 1st fleet = their best fleet.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on July 31, 2013, 11:59:35 pm
(http://www.ecokids.ca/pub/eco_info/topics/landuse/bugHunt/assets/screen_shot.gif)
Fleet: 1st DD
First action: Minor, move to Draco.
Second action: Major, engage 4th Cordi fleet.
Fleet: 3rd SF
First Action: Minor - Move to Draco
Second Action: Major - Engage 4th Cordi Fleet
Fleet: 1st CRF
First action: Minor, move to Draco.
Second action: Major, engage 4th Cordi fleet.
Fleet: 1st UGCR
First action: Major, engage 1st Cordi Fleet.
Second action: None.
Fleet: 1st SF
First action: Major, engage 1st Cordi Fleet.
Second action: None.
Fleet: 2nd CRF
First action: Minor, Travel to Aldebaran
Second Action: Major, Engage 1st Cordi Fleet
(http://www.bugbusters.com/images/bugbusterlogo-a.gif)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Flak on August 01, 2013, 01:29:42 am
So it is just the elite mooks then. I am not sure if they will become 150% again if they resupplied, so it maybe a good idea if we send them all to hell before they get the chance to resupply.

(http://pecuniarities.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/06/no-rrespassing.jpg)

What are the Nordera? Space orks?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on August 01, 2013, 01:40:44 am
We're going on a bug hunt, We're going on a bug hunt, I'm not scared. I'm not scared.

Anyway, been lurking for the last 7 hours as I forgot my password and couldn't log on at work. Anyway, this is what I was thinking in regards to fleet deployment:


- Split our CRF fleets up. 2 North, 2 South. Their high morale will be a benefit to each sector.

- Send 1 DD fleet north. They are currently fairly weak but will get stronger later on. So we should try and maximise the chances of them getting experience in battle by pairing them with stronger fleets.

1st LSF will be receiving 4th Gen fighters, so move them north to reinforce that area.


We have 15 fleets total, overall I think we need to look at around 8 Fleets north and 7 fleets south for the moment. Making sure we have a mix of fleets in each area. Unless we need to to work as a combined force with their special abilities
 (Blitz for example, could work strongly together)

(EDIT: Or 7 North, 7 South with 1 backwards on standby to move into each area. Cover resupplies etc. Position would have to be rotated)

I wouldnt mind having one of the UGCR Fleets in the southern sector as well. Just for balance and added firepower of mercs if required. However, they may be better use right now moving from Sol towards Tauri.

Mind you, we are currently only vs 10 hostile fleets, 3 of which are unknown to us at this time. 5 in the Northern Sector and 5 in the Southern Sector.

(also noting, there are two unknown 1st Fleets. Which could be due to a lack of intelligence or an additional race as well).
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 01, 2013, 09:48:36 am
What are the Nordera? Space orks?

They've always come across as that to me, but it's never been specified. That's how I'm treating them in my campaign.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: SpardaSon21 on August 01, 2013, 11:35:18 am
What are the Nordera? Space orks?

They've always come across as that to me, but it's never been specified. That's how I'm treating them in my campaign.
WAAAAAAAGH?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 01, 2013, 11:38:05 am
What are the Nordera? Space orks?

They've always come across as that to me, but it's never been specified. That's how I'm treating them in my campaign.
WAAAAAAAGH?

No WAAAAAAAGH. But I have something close. Though you won't see it in my demo, it will be in the 1.02 release if and when that comes.

EDIT: I've also got a "Kill da yoomanz. Kill 'em all."
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on August 03, 2013, 07:11:48 am
Guys unfortunately my illness continues. I'm having a really hard time concentrating on things and I can't really sit behind the pc for more than an hour before my head starts feeling fuzzy.
I was really hoping I would feel better by today but alas.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: CommanderDJ on August 03, 2013, 07:29:10 am
It's all good, Spoon. I am sure no one here would complain at you for taking time off when you're sick. Get some rest, take it easy, we'll still be here when you're feeling better.  :yes:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 03, 2013, 08:15:38 am
Guys unfortunately my illness continues. I'm having a really hard time concentrating on things and I can't really sit behind the pc for more than an hour before my head starts feeling fuzzy.
I was really hoping I would feel better by today but alas.

Have you seen a doctor? I've been a bit worried about you.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 04, 2013, 10:05:41 am
I said a while back I would comment on the first turn. That time has come. I will have a little to say on turn 2 as well. Spoon has certainly thrown a lot of surprises at us early on. First, a pleasant one:

(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/WoD%20Forum%20Game/LSFOperator200_zpse589713d.png~original)
(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/WoD%20Forum%20Game/CRFOperator200_zps6e95bf8a.png~original)

I wondered if we would see these in the new WoD remake, but the urls tell me Spoon cooked these up just for the game. I wonder what else he has up his sleeve for us?

However I wasn't too pleased with having my turn essentially decided for me, and punished for disobeying, even though the punishment was light. It did make for some fun RP between us though, the "scandal" I caused. :) It's the only thing we have control over in the game, what we do with our one fleet every week. I like RP being introduced by Spoon into this, but I would hope our movements and strategies are left solely to us. Maybe some carrots could be dangled in front of us to give us decisions to make or incentives to move a certain way, but please keep the stick away. I don't know how others feel about this though.

The 150% enemy fleets was a surprise. So was the bypassing of Aldebaran, I thought we'd be able to hold there indefinately, but that little fantasy was put to bed on the very first turn, although it's only recently I came to realise the true danger posed by the incoming enemy fleet bypassing the starlance.

Which brings me to another surprise, I didn't think we'd see anything other than Nordera and Cordi for the first few turns, but it looks like the Fura'ngle and Zy are here already. They might not be, we might have "Elite Cordi" and "Elite Nordera" or something like that on our hands instead, who knows.

The difference between the Cordi and Nordera surprised me as well. Bottom line, we've already had a lot of surprises thrown our way, and I think we really need to expect the unexpected here. What else is in store for us? I'm looking forward to finding out...

It's really well presented, I like the map with all our fleets on it a lot, so much more easy on the eye than a simple set of information on that would be. I like how all the individual battles are broken down as well, and we finish up with our fleet status. I particularly like the moves being detailed, with the Unknown system for the enemy, it really feels like they're coming from somewhere rather than just being plopped on the map. I want to go see that somewhere! :)

And finally, the video. That is glorious, and I think it will be eclipsed by future videos. I do hope we get a video every turn, even if the turns need to be delayed to allow it, those videos are screaming out to be put into a playlist and all watched. I must have watched the turn 1 video like 20 times. I also like the mood the Turn 0 video establishes, it gives me a feeling of this alien menace slowly stalking it's prey looking over the systems they've jumped into. Either that or admiring their handiwork, having already conquered it.

On a personal note, in the past, I have said things like "If I was Spoon I would do this", "Spoon's Cordi" etc. But I feel that kind of goes against the spirit of what we have here, Spoon to me seems more like a facilitator of the game rather than a player trying to destroy us. He already told us he wouldn't one turn KO us. So I kind of feel it might have been making things seem competitive when that's exactly what I don't want something like this to be, I want it to be fun, so in future I will say things like "If I was the heirarchy I would do this" and "the Cordi". After all, if it was truly a competitive game, we couldn't be having Spoon read all our moves in advance, now could we? It's kind of like we're playing a turn-based video game, and Spoon is the computer rather than a player, if that makes sense. :)

Something else I'd also like, if it's possible and not too mch trouble, is for us to have a dedicated RP thread seperate from the strategy/chat. I have every confidence that this is going to be quite the saga, and that we're just getting started, and I think it would be good to split all the RP posts right now, for easy reading of what I'm sure will be an epic saga when all is said and done. The RP has exploded, and it is beautiful. It deserves it's own thread. What do others think about that?

Well that should do it. I hope this was of some value.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on August 04, 2013, 10:55:42 am
In all honesty Lorric, I figured that it would play out like it did, and again in honesty, I am quite happy for Spoon to do it like that. Because he is controlling the external forces (Hostile, Our home sectors, ect ect and ect).

At least HRH did not try and relieve you of command though, I'm happy about that.

But we are going to have to weigh our decisions against what is 'expected' or 'required' of our fleets, and it is going to be very hard to do so against external forces that we know nothing or limited about. Rather similar to the your normal RP games and such. Very enjoyable but I think we are stacked against overall.

 I'm contemplating what may happen for the 1st CRF, if anything at this stage.

Otherwise, I definitely agree with the high level of quality and positivity that the game, RPing and everything Spoon (and participants) are doing in general. :)

(Ok, my bedtime. Night)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 04, 2013, 11:07:23 am
You don't mean you saw everything coming, do you? Can you see the future? What does the future have in store for us? :)

It might grow on me potentially, I do think that what happened overall enhanced the game with the RP it produced, I enjoyed that, it was well worth taking the morale hit for in that respect. Besides, it might be other people's turn for that spotlight to fall on them now!  :p

Goodnight. :)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on August 04, 2013, 11:14:11 am
I'm posting while sleep deprived...  :banghead: I think what I mean is Told by HRH not to retreat, and a retreat happened. So that opens the possibility of an action happening.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 04, 2013, 11:53:52 am
I'm posting while sleep deprived...  :banghead: I think what I mean is Told by HRH not to retreat, and a retreat happened. So that opens the possibility of an action happening.

It's like "do as you're told or be punished."  Either way I lose, either take the punishment, or do something tactically unsound. So I did what was best for us, healing and making way for a stronger fleet to take my place.

I'd prefer "Do as you please, but if you do this, something nice might/will happen."

Sleep, Veers. :)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on August 07, 2013, 07:22:02 am
I'm finally recovering. Can't recall I've ever been this miserable for this long before. (Maybe I'm just getting old)

Let's restart where we left off this sunday
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on August 07, 2013, 07:29:46 am
As long as you are recovering, we'll all be looking forward to Sunday.

Until then, coping with WoD-related withdrawals by playing WoD. Makes sense. :)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 07, 2013, 07:40:06 am
I'm finally recovering. Can't recall I've ever been this miserable for this long before. (Maybe I'm just getting old)

Let's restart where we left off this sunday

I am happy for you.  :)

But don't push yourself trying to be ready for Sunday if you end up struggling.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on August 08, 2013, 07:45:13 pm
Quote
Something else I'd also like, if it's possible and not too mch trouble, is for us to have a dedicated RP thread seperate from the strategy/chat. I have every confidence that this is going to be quite the saga, and that we're just getting started, and I think it would be good to split all the RP posts right now, for easy reading of what I'm sure will be an epic saga when all is said and done. The RP has exploded, and it is beautiful. It deserves it's own thread. What do others think about that?
I could make a seperate RP thread in a jiffy if you guys want it.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 08, 2013, 07:51:09 pm
Quote
Something else I'd also like, if it's possible and not too mch trouble, is for us to have a dedicated RP thread seperate from the strategy/chat. I have every confidence that this is going to be quite the saga, and that we're just getting started, and I think it would be good to split all the RP posts right now, for easy reading of what I'm sure will be an epic saga when all is said and done. The RP has exploded, and it is beautiful. It deserves it's own thread. What do others think about that?
I could make a seperate RP thread in a jiffy if you guys want it.

Oh, yes, yes, yes, please!
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lepanto on August 08, 2013, 09:46:16 pm
Sure. The current system has worked well enough, but it would be handy to keep the strategy talk and any remaining rules questions for you in the discussion thread, and keep the RP in its own thread. Problem is, though, with a new RP thread, anyone new coming in and reading all the RP in order would have to read the RP already in the discussion thread, then start over in the RP thread. Maybe someone could make a compilation of the discussion-thread RP we've got so far, and you could link it in the first post of the RP thread, to catch any newcomers up?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 08, 2013, 10:35:47 pm
Sure. The current system has worked well enough, but it would be handy to keep the strategy talk and any remaining rules questions for you in the discussion thread, and keep the RP in its own thread. Problem is, though, with a new RP thread, anyone new coming in and reading all the RP in order would have to read the RP already in the discussion thread, then start over in the RP thread. Maybe someone could make a compilation of the discussion-thread RP we've got so far, and you could link it in the first post of the RP thread, to catch any newcomers up?
I think Spoon can split them out, and that would be the new thread, with all the previous RP posts.

But if he can't, I could take care of it.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on August 09, 2013, 02:09:14 am
He can do that, his board and it's apart of the moderator powers.

Some things they (being mods/admins) can do are pretty nifty at times.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 09, 2013, 05:14:38 pm
I see what you did Spoon, and I thank you very much for it.

Spoon has worked his moderator magic to give us our very own RP-only thread!

http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php?topic=85262.20

Look at all that. Just look at it! And we've only just started! As long as we don't all die quickly, we're going to have a book written in there when this is over!
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 11, 2013, 09:12:46 pm
I wish you well, Spoon.

(http://canime.files.wordpress.com/2010/08/anime-nurse7.jpg)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on August 12, 2013, 06:51:17 am
I fell asleep typing the post up
Today for sure~
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 12, 2013, 07:09:18 am
I fell asleep typing the post up
Today for sure~
Oh no, he's getting bored!  :shaking:

 :lol:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Flak on August 12, 2013, 11:34:03 am
Nevermind, probably someone is going to make some custom campaigns based on this.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on August 12, 2013, 04:41:03 pm
Okay, turn 3 is (finally!) up, be sure to let me know what kind of errors I may have made this time around  :p (There's actually quite a lot to keep track of)

Notice for the UGCR admirals, I've added one line to your Merc ability: 'Can only be used in friendly controlled systems.'

Notice for everyone, the deadline for giving/editing your orders is on each Friday. This so I can spread out processing the turn post over the weekend.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on August 12, 2013, 04:47:13 pm
Notice for the UGCR admirals, I've added one line to your Merc ability: 'Can only be used in friendly controlled systems.'

Oh bother.  At least it simplifies my upcoming decisions :)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Admiral MS on August 12, 2013, 05:24:46 pm
So 1st Nordera was able to resupply to 150%, which means that's their base value. We really have to kill these 1st fleets. See how badly 4th SF did against 1st Zy - and there are two ? fleets sitting in Kardoen: 40-something base strength Hertak incoming?
I think 2nd LSF has to go back and resupply. It might be good if one of the fleets in Tamy can come and support us in Hydra.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 12, 2013, 06:35:15 pm
Right, a lot to get through here. With it established the 150% fleets do indeed have that as their base, it’s great the 1st Cordi is destroyed. I’ll break my early thoughts down piece by piece, post by post so people can respond to them that way instead of having to read through a huge wall of text. We’ll start with the top area:

The 4th SF was left all alone to face the might of the Zy. I hoped they wouldn’t get to attack, no such luck. The 4th SF could survive going another round with them, but anything else coming in would finish them off.

Let’s break down Aldebaran, right now it’s:

SF 1st Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 17 (18+2)
Capital attack strength: 15 (18)
Fighters at 83% Strength
Capital ships at 86% Strength

CRF 2nd Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 16 (16+2+1)
Capital attack strength: 16 (17+1)
Fighters at 84% Strength
Capital ships at 91% Strength

UGCR 1st Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 11 (13+2)
Capital attack strength: 8 (15)
Fighters at 67% Strength
Capital ships at 55% Strength

vs.

2nd Cordi Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 8 (20)
Capital attack strength: 5 (12)
Fighters at 40% Strength
Capital ships at 43% Strength

3rd Cordi Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 16 (20)
Capital attack strength: 10 (12)
Fighters at 80% Strength
Capital ships at 81% Strength

2nd Zy Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 20 (21+1)
Capital attack strength: 19 (20+1)
Fighters at 90% Strength
Capital ships at 91% Strength

Here’s my plan: The 2nd SF in Virgo is still too weak. It needs to do a double resupply. I would pull the 1st UGCR out and perform a resupply.

Have the 4th SF pull back to Librae and resupply.

Have the 2nd UGCR travel to Tauri to take the next hit from the Zy.

If I use zeal and attack the 2nd Cordi and the 1st SF attacks the 2nd Cordi, we can destroy them with minimal damage in return:

SF 1st Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 17+8=25 (18+2)
Capital attack strength: 15+9=24 (18)
Fighters at 83% Strength
Capital ships at 86% Strength

CRF 2nd Fleet: (with zeal)
Fighter attack strength: 17+9=26 (16+2+2)
Capital attack strength: 17+9=26 (17+2)
Fighters at 84% Strength
Capital ships at 91% Strength

vs

2nd Cordi Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 8+3=11 (20)
Capital attack strength: 5+4 =9 (12)
Fighters at 40% Strength
Capital ships at 43% Strength (24+26=50, elimination)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 12, 2013, 06:57:13 pm
This is the next problem:
The 4th Cordi Fleet lost its will to continue fighting and is offering to surrender.
The 4th Cordi had nowhere to run. They’ve been boxed in and are at our mercy. What do we do with them? There is no info on how to handle this sort of thing in game. Me, I would order them to power down their ships and throw down their weapons. Get them shipped away from the front line to a planet in a rear system where they can be held. I very much doubt this is a double cross. The Cordi aren’t fanatics, and their numbers are very low, what damage could they do?

4th Cordi Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 3 (20)
Capital attack strength: 2 (12)
Fighters at 16% Strength
Capital ships at 14% Strength

That pitiful little band should be no problem to deal with. Get them out of the way, so we can decide what to do with the three fleets in Draco. I Recommend have someone in Draco accept the surrender and see what happens. Not the bug-fearing Admiral Soryu Of the 3rd SF. :)

Story-wise, I think the surrender is correct also. We want to encourage others to surrender, rather than fight to the death. Ideally, we want to win the Cordi over to our side. So please don’t harm them.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 12, 2013, 07:29:34 pm
And finally the bottom section.

Do not be concerned about the 1st Nordera fleet. It’s still weak, even for a 150% strength fleet. Of greater concern is the mass of forces at Kardoen. The 3rd Nordera should be at full strength, and I predict the Fura’ngle and Hertak are in attendance. It doesn’t take a genius to figure out there’s only one race left (unless Spoon has another up his sleeve) but, this cements it for me:

1st ? Fleet, Morale from Very Low to Normal

I think the Fura’ngle just got a little “pep talk” from their masters, the Hertak. If the 150% 1st fleet convention is also in place, this means great trouble. Every fleet in Kardoen can attack, and I predict they will do so.

Here’s my plan:

Send the 1st LSF to Aldebaran.

Pull the 2nd LSF out of Hydra and have it resupply.

Send the 4th CRF to Hydra.

Send the 3rd DD to Vega.

Have all 3 fleets in Draco Resupply and Defend.

Have the 2nd DD and 3rd CRF attack and destroy the 2nd Nordera.

Battle calculation:

2nd LSF Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 21+7=28 (19+2+1)
Capital attack strength: 14+11=25 (14+1)
Fighters at 85% Strength
Capital ships at 86% Strength

2nd DD Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 15+8=23 (18)
Capital attack strength: 15+8=23 (17)
Fighters at 82% Strength
Capital ships at 84% Strength

vs.

2nd Nordera Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 5+3=8 (10+2)
Capital attack strength: 5+3=8 (8+2)
Fighters at 34% Strength
Capital ships at 38% Strength (23+25=48 = elimination)

Like the 2nd Cordi, destruction is assured with minimal damage.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on August 12, 2013, 07:40:01 pm
To the Admirals of the 1st DD and 3rd SF,

Well done, how do you guys feel about trying to take the surrender of the 4th Cordi?, I'm going to assume it will require an action from one of our fleets to take them into custody. (Spoon?, yay or nay?)

If we do so, we will have to do so quickly. I'm very happy for the CRF to do that while you guys prepare/retreat/do whatever you wish to plan. I have zeal, so if I had to use an order to capture, I would and want to use Zeal this turn as well. But we must expect enemy reinforcements of at least 2 fleets coming from Kardoen. ( I suspect one of those 1st Fleets belongs to the Fura'ngle )

Perhaps the 1st DD can take the capture operation, while the CRF and 3rd SF hold the line against any intrusion. We don't quite know how it may unfold, perhaps the fleet needs to retreat to a friendly system with them to unload them into custody or etc.

----

We still need to see the reinforcement fleets move to a sector, I'd still prefer to have the 3rd DD & 4th CRF move to the northern sector, as we already have 2 CRF fleets south, and same with the other 2 DD fleets, we should spread the last one out for experience while they remain the weakest force overall (for the moment)

Perhaps the 1st LSF can remain to reinforce Draco instead.

------

Edit:

Only problem is, we cannot resupply and defend Draco. It is still occupied by the 4th Cordi, and we cannot capture them, secure the system, resupply and defend before reinforcements arrive from Kardoen, as we must assume they will attack next turn. And do do all of those actions will require at least 2 turns. 1 to capture/secure now, and 2 to resupply and defend, as the state of the system will not change until the new turn.

So I'm now looking at, depending on how it works. the 1st DD capturing the Cordi and the 1st LSF moving to Vega, DD will probably need to pull out and LSF can jump into Draco to continue the fight if we decide to continue fighting here. Otherwise Hold and defend Vega.

CRF and SF will retreat.


Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: CommanderDJ on August 12, 2013, 07:45:08 pm
As a player, I'm all for accepting the Cordi's surrender. My character, however, will not be pleased. :P
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 12, 2013, 07:48:14 pm
Ah, yes, you should definitely use your Zeal, Veers. I'd recommend Zeal and Resupply.

I'm not too fussed about where the reinforcement fleets go, but one of them should definitely go to Hydra. But the DD Fleets are weak, so I think it's better the 4th CRF goes to Hydra rather than have two in Hydra. So the 3rd DD to Vega and the 1st LSF to Aldebaran.

Speaking of the 1st LSF, check it out:

1st LSF Fleet
Fighter attack strength: 25 (19+5+1)
Capital attack strength: 15 (14+1)
Fighters at 96% Strength, 4th Gen
Capital ships at 100% Strength
Morale: High

4th Gen fighters. +5 to fighters!
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on August 12, 2013, 08:05:02 pm
Not much point asking the DD to go to Vega as it is weaker, it places all the DD fleets in the southern sector, which is not overly helpful in terms of balancing power between our sectors and against hostile fleets. That's why I think it should move North.

Resupply only happens in a friendly system, and unless we retreat. No resupplies happening in Draco this turn I'm afraid, and assuming we are attacked within the next 3 turns. Not happening at all.

So my current plans are:

Action 1: Use Special - Zeal
Action 2: ? (Not in friendly system so Resupply & Defend not options)

As a player, I'm all for accepting the Cordi's surrender. My character, however, will not be pleased. :P

That's why your fleet should not capture them. I don't want to see how bugspray affects them just yet :P

---

The CRF provides a high morale boost, and is beneficial to have two in the northern sector (I think), with two in the southern sector. I'm talking more overall placement rather than what is going to be practical, but if those fleets move north, LSF waits in Vega incase we get nuked by whatever is in Kardoen, you still have the 2nd SF and 2nd UGCR north as well.

Problem being you need reinforcements into Tauri, and movement wise, it is the furthest away from any fleets other than Aldebaren
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: CommanderDJ on August 12, 2013, 08:11:38 pm
Sorry, I should have made it clear: I'm the 1st SF, not the 3rd. :P

I'm not the bugspray guy, but my character hates the aliens nonetheless. :D
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on August 12, 2013, 08:13:24 pm
Derpy Veers... serves me right now not checking. Sorry!
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 12, 2013, 08:39:09 pm
Not much point asking the DD to go to Vega as it is weaker, it places all the DD fleets in the southern sector, which is not overly helpful in terms of balancing power between our sectors and against hostile fleets. That's why I think it should move North.

Resupply only happens in a friendly system, and unless we retreat. No resupplies happening in Draco this turn I'm afraid, and assuming we are attacked within the next 3 turns. Not happening at all.

So my current plans are:

Action 1: Use Special - Zeal
Action 2: ? (Not in friendly system so Resupply & Defend not options)

The CRF provides a high morale boost, and is beneficial to have two in the northern sector (I think), with two in the southern sector. I'm talking more overall placement rather than what is going to be practical, but if those fleets move north, LSF waits in Vega incase we get nuked by whatever is in Kardoen, you still have the 2nd SF and 2nd UGCR north as well.

Problem being you need reinforcements into Tauri, and movement wise, it is the furthest away from any fleets other than Aldebaren
But we have an odd number of fleets. Isn't it better the North has more power while the South has an extra fleet? I also think the North is more important due to the high value systems and closeness to Sol, but either way, the South is still getting an extra fleet.

I suppose Spoon can clarify it, but I'm under the impression that the 4th Cordi is defeated. Thus the system is friendly. It won't matter since the fleets are going to be staying there anyway.

The Southern fleets under my move order, you've got 6 fleets on the front line, and one fleet behind each front line system as backup.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on August 12, 2013, 09:01:53 pm
I'm going off the map, which still states the 4th Cordi is in the system as a hostile fleet. They are offering surrender, but are still a hostile fleet until the next turn. Which:

- 4th Cordi Surrender
- 4th Cordi Destroyed
- Reinforced & Retreat (less likely at this stage)

Regards to Fleets,

Simply due to time limitations, We can't reshuffle the entire rear line. I'd like to (by having another CRF and DD fleet north.) So the 3rd DD and 4th CRF are likely to split up moving towards Vega and Odin.

1st LSF, 2nd SF and 2nd UGCR Stay north, 1st LSF has the additional 4th Gen boost and so far, you do have 2 Zy Fleets to take care of.

Makes sense now, I forgot to double-check the Aldebaran fleets.

And out of curiosity, could it be possible that while we 'know' there are additional fleets in Kardoen, that the intel might be wrong. There are two 1st Fleets there at this time, while we can already account for what races they might be. Could it also be possible that it might actually turn out to be a 1st and 2nd or 3rd fleet instead?

Just thinking Intel might not be upto scratch.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 12, 2013, 09:10:54 pm
I'm going off the map, which still states the 4th Cordi is in the system as a hostile fleet. They are offering surrender, but are still a hostile fleet until the next turn. Which:

- 4th Cordi Surrender
- 4th Cordi Destroyed
- Reinforced & Retreat (less likely at this stage)

Regards to Fleets,

Simply due to time limitations, We can't reshuffle the entire rear line. I'd like to (by having another CRF and DD fleet north.) So the 3rd DD and 4th CRF are likely to split up moving towards Vega and Odin.

1st LSF, 2nd SF and 2nd UGCR Stay north, 1st LSF has the additional 4th Gen boost and so far, you do have 2 Zy Fleets to take care of.

Makes sense now, I forgot to double-check the Aldebaran fleets.

And out of curiosity, could it be possible that while we 'know' there are additional fleets in Kardoen, that the intel might be wrong. There are two 1st Fleets there at this time, while we can already account for what races they might be. Could it also be possible that it might actually turn out to be a 1st and 2nd or 3rd fleet instead?

Just thinking Intel might not be upto scratch.
Another thing, if it required our first action to get rid of the 4th Cordi, surely the system would be regarded as friendly for the 2nd action. We need Spoon to help us out. But I would have thought we could take their surrender now, and the system would be friendly.

I'm not sure what you mean. Are you wanting 8 fleets in the North? I could get behind that later, but not now with seemingly the Hertak down there.

There hasn't been anything wrong with our intel so far. Besides, the morale boost to one 1st ? fleet from Very low to Normal really makes me think that is the Hertak masters "motivating" the Fura'ngle. We still have nothing but a number.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lepanto on August 12, 2013, 09:33:06 pm
Here's my advice; take, leave, or constructively criticize it. I don't want to be annoying by trying to push my strategy on everyone, and I'll stop making suggestions if people get annoyed, but I think we might have an opportunity for a crushing counter-offensive in the south, and I'd like you to at least hear me out.

We're doing well in the south, but we've got 3 enemy fleets in Kardoen, which threaten to either attack our fleets in Hydra or Draco or reinforce Aldebaran. By metagaming process of elimination, as Lorric has concluded, 2 of them are the 1st Fura'ngle and Hertak fleets. Like it or not, we'll be dealing with them shortly, and I'd rather deal with them on our terms. As risky as this might sound, unless taking the Cordi surrender in Draco requires an action (which Spoon hasn't said it does, and maybe even if it does), I propose that the 3 fleets in Draco advance into Kardoen and attack the second 1st ? Fleet. All the Draco fleets are above 90%, and capable of launching an attack. This game's battle system rewards taking the initiative; if we attack the Kardoen fleets first and heavily damage one of them, even if the enemy retreats the damaged fleet and brings in another from the system behind Kardoen to counterattack, we'll at least have pushed the front lines back to Kardoen and have hopefully mangled their strongest fleet in the first volley. I think the second 1st ? Fleet in Kardoen might be the 1st Hertak Fleet, and we do NOT want to hand them the first attack; the 1st Zy Fleet mangled the 4th SF in Tauri by itself when it attacked first, and the 1st Hertak, backed up by the other two Kardoen fleets, could do worse damage to allied forces in either Hydra or Draco if the Draco fleets just hold in Draco and the enemy are allowed to attack unimpeded. If we (hopefully) hit the 1st Hertak first with 3 fleets, we'll at least do serious damage before they can get an attack in. Not to mention, the fleets holding in Draco would be effectively out of the action for a turn if the Hierarchy just ignores our forces in Draco and makes a push into Hydra. Considering all these factors, I believe that defending Draco is a bad idea, and we would be well-served to counterattack instead.

To supplement this push, I recommend moving the 1st LSF into Draco. They would be in position to relieve the fleets which would now be engaged in Kardoen. Even if taking the 4th Cordi's surrender does require an action, and therefore would prevent all of the Draco fleets from moving and attacking if one of them were to take their surrender, I think that if the 1st LSF could be brought into Draco while the current Draco fleets attacked into Kardoen, they could prevent the 4th Cordi from doing anything too dangerous.

I volunteer the 4th CRF to relieve the 2nd LSF in Hydra.

We should be able to hold both Tauri and Aldebaran, especially if the 3rd DD is deployed to reinforce the north.

Frankly, rather than try to keep the fleets on both fronts balanced, I think we should be going for a decisive push in the south and trying to secure Kardoen. With the powerful enemy fleets incoming, it won't be easy, but I don't see a better strategic option. If we can retake Kardoen and wipe/drive out all the southern fleets, we should be able to hold Kardoen against most any expected attack with 5-6 fleets, allowing us to then commit to the north. If we keep doing what we've been doing and just keep trying to hold the enemy, we'll probably lose a war of attrition to the Hierarchy, who probably have many more fleets than we do. Onward, to decisive victory! Who's with me?  :cool:

TL;DR: We should mass and attack to the south, unless we want to get overrun by the enemy fleets massing in Kardoen.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 12, 2013, 09:44:57 pm
Onward, to decisive victory! Who's with me?  :cool:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on August 12, 2013, 10:03:41 pm
I think, that until we know if we need to use a turn to accept the Cordi's surrender or not, means we are stuck with many different options as for our next move.

If we do attack, we face heavy casualties in a retreat, with a minimal reline towards Vega. Otherwise, I am very happy to push forward and attack,

but we need to know about the Cordi Surrender first, and reinforcements for Vega/Draco second. :)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 12, 2013, 10:13:10 pm
Lepanto, it is amusing that this mirrors the previous turn where I had to convince someone of the merit of a push. Now you convince me. I was all for pushing hard, but the two 1st ? fleets stopped me, and I was thinking to wait and observe a turn to learn what they were. But if we can cut Kardoen off, we can have fleets in Draco easily able to reinforce Hydra or Kardoen. That's a tactical advantage. But a disadvantage is we can't see enemy reinforcements. I hope Spoon could fix that for us with us entering battle on the edge of the map.

A potential problem will be we can't attack if the 4th Cordi take an action.

I had also considered the idea of attacking the Hertak, but was stopped by not knowing which one is which, but it is likely the bottom one is the Hertak and that should be the target, split their surely devastating first attack between three fleets and severely weaken them.

I'm nervous about the North but I believe it's worth the risk. I wonder if you should go North and send the 3rd DD South though? I'm not sure. Could you elaborate on the decision to send the 3rd DD North? Regardless of which fleet goes North, I think the North will hold until it arrives. But the 1st LSF with it’s 4th Gen fighters is very powerful. With it joining the Southern attack, perhaps you should go North. I’m not sure. The rest of your plan I’m fully in agreement with, but this I think merits some additional consideration.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Jellyfish on August 12, 2013, 10:51:30 pm
I sure got whacked! And I can't leave, because it'd leave a 10 supply system to the enemy and an open flank to Aldebaran, not to mention the retreat would be disastrous, too.
Stay and be wiped out, leave and be wiped out.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 12, 2013, 10:54:02 pm
I sure got whacked! And I can't leave, because it'd leave a 10 supply system to the enemy and an open flank to Aldebaran, not to mention the retreat would be disastrous, too.
Stay and be wiped out, leave and be wiped out.
Not if my plan is followed for niffiwan to take your place while you repair.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Jellyfish on August 12, 2013, 11:02:28 pm
Can he jump from Aldebaran to Tauri directly?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on August 12, 2013, 11:03:25 pm
In principle I support taking Kardoen, I'm just nervous about how tough that (potentially) Hertak fleet is.  It'll be rather fun if its 200% strength or something.  One issue is that a fleet needs to secure Draco because the Hierachy secured it earlier (ignoring whatever the surrender requires) which means to get 3 fleets attacking Kardoen we'd need one of the 2nd DD / 3rd CRF / 2nd LSF to attack as well. Probably the 3rd CRF.  And then that leaves the battle in Hydra to be quite close, especially if the 2nd LSF retreat for resupply.  And that in turn suggests at least one of the 3rd DD / 4th CRF moving direct to Hydra.  Maybe both.

As for the North... one problem with the 2nd UGCR moving to Tauri to delay the 1st Zy is that it doesn't let the 4th SF retreat unopposed - the 1st Zy will get a free shot on them.

What do the Admirals think of this idea:
4th SF attacks 1st Zy then retreats (ouch)
1st SF AND 2nd CRF move to Tauri & attack 1st Zy (leaves 1st Zy @ approx 56%/59%?)
2nd UGCR move to Aldebaran & attack 2nd Cordi
1st UGCR attack 2nd Cordi & retreats (to resupply/renew mercs next turn)
1st LSF move to Aldebaran, ready to move to Tauri & attack 1st Zy the next turn

In particular, I'm interested to know what would happen in Tauri.  Would the entire 1st Zy counter attack fall on the 4th SF since they attacked in the 1st phase, leaving the 2nd phase attack from the 1st SF and 2nd CRF untouched in return?  That would tip the odds in favour of the 1st SF AND 2nd CRF in subsequent turns, at the obvious heavy cost to the 4th SF / 3 phases of resupply.  It could allow the destruction of the 1st Zy the following turn from 1st SF AND 2nd CRF + 2nd UGCR or 1st LSF.  Or if the 1st Zy attempt to retreat it either pulls other Hierachy fleets around to cover them & dilutes their attacks, or they get pounded in their retreat.  One downside is that we can't destroy the 2nd Cordi with this plan.

The alternative is to send only one of the 1st SF / 2nd CRF to Tauri and have them fight a delaying action.  We'd just need to be careful about Hierachy fleets in Aldebaran moving to Tauri to reinforce the 1st Zy.  This should still allow the destruction of the 2nd Cordi, even if the 1st UGCR does not attack them. 

Hmmm... assuming no one reinforces the 1st Zy the current combo of 2nd Zy & 3rd & 5th Cordi will pretty much wreck one of our fleets next turn in Aldebaran.  The 2nd SF will be resupplied next turn, but the 1st UGCR won't be (not fully). I feel like we need the 1st LSF at the north in order to stem the tide.

edit: in retrospect, I should really have gone to Librae after the 2nd CRF moved back to Aldebaran.  Oh well!!

edit2: forgot part of the travel rules - means max 2 southern fleets available to attack Kardoen...
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lepanto on August 12, 2013, 11:15:55 pm
Thanks for taking my plan seriously, everyone.

I'm nervous about the North but I believe it's worth the risk. I wonder if you should go North and send the 3rd DD South though? I'm not sure. Could you elaborate on the decision to send the 3rd DD North? Regardless of which fleet goes North, I think the North will hold until it arrives. But the 1st LSF with it’s 4th Gen fighters is very powerful. With it joining the Southern attack, perhaps you should go North. I’m not sure. The rest of your plan I’m fully in agreement with, but this I think merits some additional consideration.

I'm still more nervous about the Hertak+Fura'ngle+Nordera in the south than I am about the Aldebaran Meat Grinder, which seems to be stable as of present, so even on further reflection, I'd rather commit the stronger force to the south. Still, if you think I'd be better-used shoring up Aldebaran, or Enioch wants to go south, fine by me.

I understand if everyone's waiting for Spoon's call on the Cordi surrender, but if the 1st LSF were to move into Draco as I suggested, they could hold the 4th Cordi even if the 3 fleets in Draco didn't have the actions to attack and accept their surrender at the same time.

A bit of irony. You, despite playing a passionate and aggressive RP character, wanted to defend in the south. I, despite playing a calmer character, have been advocating risky strategic counter-offensives.

And thanks, Dynasty Warriors Guy!  :D

niffiwan, I'll get back to you tomorrow, when I'm thinking straight and not so tired.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 12, 2013, 11:35:23 pm
Oh damn, you’re right, we need to secure Draco, we can’t move until it’s secured…

I don’t think we can attack the Hertak then. Maybe not attacking would be better, I don’t know. I’m too tired now to think about it, so I’ll let others think about that.

Same for your plan, I must sleep. But I’ll offer the damage calculations.

I think the damage would be split up between all fleets, as I attacked the 1st Cordi in the 2nd phase, yet I took damage.

Being unable to destroy the 2nd Cordi is a big flaw in this plan:

UGCR 1st Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 11+4=15 (13+2)
Capital attack strength: 8+6=14 (15)
Fighters at 67% Strength
Capital ships at 55% Strength

2nd UGCR Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 15+8=23 (13+2)
- Capital attack strength: 15+8=23 (15)
- Fighters at 100% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 100% Strength
- Morale: Normal

vs.

2nd Cordi Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 8+3=11 (20)
Capital attack strength: 5+4=9 (12)
Fighters at 40% Strength (23+15=38)
Capital ships at 43% Strength (23+14 = 37)

They’re going to be down to 2%/6%. I wonder if it will break their will to fight? They’re already down to low morale.

But crippling the 1st Zy is a big boon:

4th SF Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 11+5=16 (18+2)
Capital attack strength: 9+6=15 (18)
Fighters at 51% Strength
Capital ships at 51% Strength

SF 1st Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 17+8=25 (18+2)
Capital attack strength: 15+9=24 (18)
Fighters at 83% Strength
Capital ships at 86% Strength

CRF 2nd Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 16+8=24 (16+2+1)
Capital attack strength: 16+8=24 (17+1)
Fighters at 84% Strength
Capital ships at 91% Strength

vs.

1st Zy Fleet - Roughly 13/13 damage to each ally fleet.
Fighter attack strength: 27+13=40 (22+2)
Capital attack strength: 26+13=39 (21+2)
Fighters at 119% Strength (54% left)
Capital ships at 120% Strength (57% left)

I don’t like the potential that both these fleets could slip away from us and regroup, when we can destroy one for sure.

And won’t we be in a rather precarious situation without two fleets which under my plan would be resupplying being able to resupply?

I’ll look at it again tomorrow, but I feel my plan is better.

You vs Zy:

1st Zy Fleet
Fighter attack strength: 27+13=40 (22+2)
Capital attack strength: 26+13=39 (21+2)
Fighters at 119% Strength (96% left)
Capital ships at 120% Strength (97% left)

vs.

2nd UGCR Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 15+8=23 (13+2)
- Capital attack strength: 15+8=23 (15)
- Fighters at 100% Strength, 3rd Gen (60% left)
- Capital ships at 100% Strength (61% left)
- Morale: Normal
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on August 13, 2013, 02:30:43 am
Can he jump from Aldebaran to Tauri directly?

Nope

As for the North... one problem with the 2nd UGCR moving to Tauri to delay the 1st Zy is that it doesn't let the 4th SF retreat unopposed - the 1st Zy will get a free shot on them.

So yeah, the 2nd UGCR can't cover the 4th SF retreat, only the 1st UGCR / 1st SF / 2nd CRF can do that.  And it's not a good idea for the 1st UGCR considering their damage, and the fact that their merc contract expires this turn & they need to be in friendly space to renew it.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: CommanderDJ on August 13, 2013, 02:32:11 am
The 1st SF is happy to cover the 4th's retreat.

/me salutes.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on August 13, 2013, 05:30:38 am
Huzzah :D

After a reread of the travel rule, I think a southern attack may still work. Assuming the 4th Cordi is no longer a "hostile fleet", we could ignore securing Draco & send the 1st DD / 1st CRF / 3rd SF into Kardoen.  The 2nd LSF retreats to Odin & resupplies (although it'd be cool to figure out some way they could secure Draco instead, I guess it depends on exactly when Draco flips from contested back to hostile).  1st LSF moves to Draco as reinforcements, 4th CRF to Hydra & 3rd DD to Virgo to help the north?

If we could take Kardoen it'd really make this a whole lot easier, Aldebaran & Kardoen only have Algol between them and it'd be much easier to send fleets to the front most in need of reinforcements.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 13, 2013, 07:39:05 am
Should we use my plan in the North then?

Careful now, niffiwan, your next post is going to be your 1,000th post, you want to make it a good one, now, don't you...?  ;)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 13, 2013, 08:37:05 am
Hmmm, so are you and me going to destroy the 2nd Cordi, niffiwan, while DJ covers the 4th SF? That would be a better version of my plan.

CRF 2nd Fleet (+ zeal)
Fighter attack strength: 17+9=26 (16+2+2)
Capital attack strength: 17+9=26 (17+2)
Fighters at 84% Strength
Capital ships at 91% Strength

2nd UGCR Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 15+8=23 (13+2)
Capital attack strength: 15+8=23 (15)
Fighters at 100% Strength, 3rd Gen
Capital ships at 100% Strength
Morale: Normal

vs

2nd Cordi Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 8+3=11 (20)
Capital attack strength: 5+4=9 (12)
Fighters at 40% Strength
Capital ships at 43% Strength (26+23=49 - destroyed)

EDIT: DJ shouldn't attack the Zy if we do this. Just stall them.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Flak on August 13, 2013, 09:45:59 am
Do you think 2nd UGCR should become 150/175% first before going forward? They have to do that in friendly area.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: SpardaSon21 on August 13, 2013, 11:30:52 am
Just tell me where the 1st LSF is needed and I'll go.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 13, 2013, 11:42:46 am
Do you think 2nd UGCR should become 150/175% first before going forward? They have to do that in friendly area.
We simply can't destroy the 2nd Cordi and stall the Zy with the mercs. Hopefully it will be able to pull out and recruit them after the next turn.

Just tell me where the 1st LSF is needed and I'll go.
Thanks. But we're not sure where to send you yet...  :)

We need to know what's going on with the 4th Cordi.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Admiral MS on August 13, 2013, 12:05:46 pm
Another round of fighting against Nordera. I hope 3rd CRF will be doing the same :)
I'm not sure if it's a good idea to destroy 2nd Nordera though. In the worst case another two 1st fleets can come to Hydra and attack right away. If the 2nd Nordera fleet is still present it'll occupy one slot preventing such a massive push.

Whatever... probably the best choice is to try to destroy them anyway.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Flak on August 13, 2013, 12:41:38 pm
If that is the case, just be prepared to deal with 5th Cordi that will most likely take the space of the 2nd Cordi. Also, someone need to stall 1st Zy, but good thing is they are boxed in and have nowhere to run. For sure, 1st UGCR needs to pull out next turn while the 2nd SF needs another turn to resupply before they can get back in the fight. Regardless of what you do to the Nordera fleets, the Fura'ngle and Hertak fleets may try to make a push to Draco.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 13, 2013, 01:14:32 pm
If that is the case, just be prepared to deal with 5th Cordi that will most likely take the space of the 2nd Cordi. Also, someone need to stall 1st Zy, but good thing is they are boxed in and have nowhere to run. For sure, 1st UGCR needs to pull out next turn while the 2nd SF needs another turn to resupply before they can get back in the fight. Regardless of what you do to the Nordera fleets, the Fura'ngle and Hertak fleets may try to make a push to Draco.

They can come into Aldebaran and attack if they want. Or go to the rear. There's nothing stopping them. But someone has to be there to stop them taking Tauri. Units from Alderbaran might attack Tauri as well.

If we don't destroy the 2nd Cordi, it will go to the back to resupply and be replaced by the 5th Cordi anyway.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: mobcdmoc3 on August 13, 2013, 08:45:26 pm
I'm not entirely sure what to make of the 4th Cordi's offer to surrender. Since this isn't detailed in the rules, I don't know whether or not this'll cost any of us an action or anything.

@Spoon - Could you clarify on what surrendering entitles and requires of us?

With regards to Draco, I think we're in serious trouble with the unknown 1st fleets in Kardoen. Judging by how the 1st fleets are stronger than usual, we could be in serious trouble if they both end up here. However, if they split up between Draco and Hydra, I think we can hold out until the 1st LSF, 3rd DD, or the 4th CRF comes in to bail us out.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on August 13, 2013, 09:19:04 pm
@Jellyfish: I think that moving with your 1st action will cause the 4th SF to take damage because the 1st SF won't have arrived yet to cover your retreat.  It sucks that you won't be able to resupply this turn, although given that counterattack damage seems to be split between attackers (even if attacks occur in different phases) an attack vs the 1st Zy as your 1st move may be worthwhile (i.e. ~20% losses to yourself & 1st SF?)

Do you think 2nd UGCR should become 150/175% first before going forward? They have to do that in friendly area.
We simply can't destroy the 2nd Cordi and stall the Zy with the mercs. Hopefully it will be able to pull out and recruit them after the next turn.

Yeah, I'd love to be able to hire mercs before engaging since the UGCR fleet is a bit... anemic without them, but that will let the 2nd Cordi escape.

I'm not sure if it's a good idea to destroy 2nd Nordera though. In the worst case another two 1st fleets can come to Hydra and attack right away. If the 2nd Nordera fleet is still present it'll occupy one slot preventing such a massive push.

I've had these meta-gaming thoughts as well, i.e. when the enemy is qualitatively inferior leave fleets alive to reduce their quantitative advantage, i.e. create a fleet-jam in their systems :)  Still, in the current situation if the 2nd Nordera isn't destroyed then it could probably retreat with two replacement fleets taking its place anyway, even if the attack on Kardoen goes ahead (assuming that there's at least one more Hierachy fleet one system away (offmap) & available to reinforce the "Hertak")

Careful now, niffiwan, your next post is going to be your 1,000th post, you want to make it a good one, now, don't you...?  ;)

Meh - 1024th post trumps the 1000th anyway, 2^10 HLP achievement unlocked!! :D
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on August 14, 2013, 07:04:05 am
Regarding accepting surrender: One fleet needs to spend a major action to take em in and disarm them. The prisoners will then be transported to Sol for interrogation and all that good stuff. If it's done as the first action in the turn then the system itself can be secured with a second action.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 14, 2013, 07:54:52 am
Regarding accepting surrender: One fleet needs to spend a major action to take em in and disarm them. The prisoners will then be transported to Sol for interrogation and all that good stuff. If it's done as the first action in the turn then the system itself can be secured with a second action.
Can someone else secure the system on their first action, or will it have to be done with a second action?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on August 14, 2013, 08:08:21 am
Well I did say second action didn't I?  :p
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 14, 2013, 08:12:14 am
Well I did say second action didn't I?  :p
Next question, will the other two fleets that don't use secure be able to use friendly-system actions on their second action?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on August 14, 2013, 09:33:12 am
No
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 14, 2013, 09:44:02 am
Thanks Spoon.

Okay, with that out of the way, here are my revised recommendations, top:

2nd SF - double Resupply.

1st UGCR - pull back to Virgo and resupply.

4th SF - pull back to Librae and resupply (currently engaging Zy and staying put, this is suicide!)

1st SF - move to Tauri, don’t engage (currently engaging Zy, please don’t, or you will likely die a pointless death. Just stall them.)

2nd UGCR - engage 2nd Cordi (done)

2nd CRF - zeal, engage 2nd Cordi (done)

1st LSF - Travel to Aldebaran.

Bottom:

No one can travel to Kardoen. So here’s what I would do:

2nd LSF - travel to Odin and Resupply.

4th CRF - travel to Hydra.

3rd DD - travel to Vega.

2nd DD and 3rd CRF attack and destroy the 2nd Nordera. (2nd DD has done this.)

1st CRF - Capture the 4th Cordi, Use Zeal.

3rd SF - Travel to Vega and Resupply.

1st DD - Prepare Barrage and Secure the system.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Jellyfish on August 14, 2013, 10:33:59 am
4th SF - pull back to Librae and resupply (currently engaging Zy and staying put, this is suicide!)
1st SF - move to Tauri, don’t engage (currently engaging Zy, please don’t, or you will likely die a pointless death. Just stall them.)
Not if we destroy them.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 14, 2013, 11:08:59 am
4th SF - pull back to Librae and resupply (currently engaging Zy and staying put, this is suicide!)
1st SF - move to Tauri, don’t engage (currently engaging Zy, please don’t, or you will likely die a pointless death. Just stall them.)
Not if we destroy them.

We can't destroy them. And other fleets can come in and attack you two.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Jellyfish on August 14, 2013, 11:11:30 am
We should have advance warning on that. And anything coming from Aldebaran would have to pass through you, right?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 14, 2013, 11:20:08 am
We should have advance warning on that. And anything coming from Aldebaran would have to pass through you, right?

They can go right through. You can pass freely from contested system to contested system:

Travel: Moves a fleet from one system to another.
 - If a fleet moves from a contested system to an other system it is considered a retreat. If there are no friendly fleets to cover the retreat the retreating fleet will take damage.
 - If a fleet is in a contested system with an enemy fleet it cannot move to an enemy control system.
   - The exceptions to this rule are the Aquarius nebula system and the Sol Force Blitz ability.
 - A fleet can move from one contested system to an other contested system. This also counts as a retreat.

So the 5th Cordi could show up in Tauri if it wants to, though it wouldn't be able to attack. Anything from Alderbaran can attack Tauri next turn, and the 1st Zy can attack us in Aldebaran if it wants to, or pass right through to the rear.

Spoon, you might want to add the accepting surrender to the Major actions there.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lepanto on August 14, 2013, 04:06:01 pm
...Well, blast, I guess my counter-offensive won't work.   :sigh:

My revised recommendations:

In the north, I think it's worth it to move some fleets around and take some casualties if it means eliminating or crippling the 1st Zy. They are still very strong, and again, this game's battle system rewards making the first attack. If we just try and stall them, they'll keep mangling our fleets on the attack, give the Hierarchy another attack route in the north, and threaten an eventual breakthrough. Just kill them NOW, take back Tauri, and then we can use those fleets to hold Aldebaran easier / fend off any more flank attacks in the area.

The situation in Aldebaran is stable for now, especially with the 2nd UGCR in the area. I still think the 1st LSF and its 4th Gen fighters would be put to better use in the south. At most, I'd say bring the 3rd DD up north.

In the south, we have to respond carefully or risk getting overrun, especially if we can't attack Kardoen and the fleets there will be attacking Hydra/Draco next turn. Nothing personal, but I think we desperately need the 1st LSF to reinforce the fleets currently defending Draco. Hydra should hold if I bring in the 4th CRF, but our fleets in both systems WILL be getting savaged, and we need reinforcements on standby to relieve both our fleets in Hydra and Draco. If we don't have at least 4 fleets covering both the Draco-Vega and Hydra-Odin axes, I fear the Hierarchy could shatter our defenses and break through by committing enough forces.

Even if we can't do it right away, I think we desperately need to eventually counter-attack into Kardoen and seal off the flow of Hierarchy fleets into the south. As long as we have to defend two or more systems at once in the south and the Hierarchy can keep sending in more fleets through Kardoen, we'll eventually lose the battle of attrition. To push them back, or even to hold in the south with more enemy fleets undoubtedly inbound via Kardoen, we'll need to commit as many fleets as we can while leaving enough to keep the north stable. With some adroit maneuvering, we can still defend the north without sending heavy reinforcements there. The south is a different story. I know I sound like a broken record at this point, but seriously, we could lose the war if the Hierarchy breaks through our lines on either the Hydra or the Draco axis.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on August 14, 2013, 04:18:02 pm
Reading all this,
(http://img189.imageshack.us/img189/5503/czpr.jpg)
I can hardly contain my excitement for the next turn.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 14, 2013, 04:22:52 pm
...Well, blast, I guess my counter-offensive won't work.   :sigh:

My revised recommendations:

In the north, I think it's worth it to move some fleets around and take some casualties if it means eliminating or crippling the 1st Zy. They are still very strong, and again, this game's battle system rewards making the first attack. If we just try and stall them, they'll keep mangling our fleets on the attack, give the Hierarchy another attack route in the north, and threaten an eventual breakthrough. Just kill them NOW, take back Tauri, and then we can use those fleets to hold Aldebaran easier / fend off any more flank attacks in the area.

The situation in Aldebaran is stable for now, especially with the 2nd UGCR in the area. I still think the 1st LSF and its 4th Gen fighters would be put to better use in the south. At most, I'd say bring the 3rd DD up north.

In the south, we have to respond carefully or risk getting overrun, especially if we can't attack Kardoen and the fleets there will be attacking Hydra/Draco next turn. Nothing personal, but I think we desperately need the 1st LSF to reinforce the fleets currently defending Draco. Hydra should hold if I bring in the 4th CRF, but our fleets in both systems WILL be getting savaged, and we need reinforcements on standby to relieve both our fleets in Hydra and Draco. If we don't have at least 4 fleets covering both the Draco-Vega and Hydra-Odin axes, I fear the Hierarchy could shatter our defenses and break through by committing enough forces.

Even if we can't do it right away, I think we desperately need to eventually counter-attack into Kardoen and seal off the flow of Hierarchy fleets into the south. As long as we have to defend two or more systems at once in the south and the Hierarchy can keep sending in more fleets through Kardoen, we'll eventually lose the battle of attrition. To push them back, or even to hold in the south with more enemy fleets undoubtedly inbound via Kardoen, we'll need to commit as many fleets as we can while leaving enough to keep the north stable. With some adroit maneuvering, we can still defend the north without sending heavy reinforcements there. The south is a different story. I know I sound like a broken record at this point, but seriously, we could lose the war if the Hierarchy breaks through our lines on either the Hydra or the Draco axis.

Simply put, I don’t think we’re going to take back Tauri. They’ll just move another fleet in there. Then another. Then another.

And we can’t kill the 1st Zy right away, it’s too strong. I think you underestimate how precarious things are up in the North. You’ll still get your 8 fleets down South with my plan.

I want to wear the 1st Zy down, then finish them. We can keep them under control and weaken their strength. If they stay in Tauri, the next move would be to have the 4th SF resupply again, then go to Tauri to take the next hit at full strength, as the 1st SF pulls back to resupply.

Anything could come through on the next turn up North, another Zy fleet perhaps, or we might even get the Hertak.

Hertak or not, once the 2nd Nordera is wiped out, you’ve only got 4 fleets down there, it’ll be 2 on 1, and the Nordera fleets are pathetic. It’s best to send the 1st LSF up here. If anything, their power will help us to finish off the 1st Zy when the time is right.

Remember, even if we manage to fill up Kardoen with our fleets, they’ll still be able to move past and attack Hydra, it’ll be the same as up North with Tauri, I don’t think we’ll get it down to one entry point.

So, I think it’s more important to focus on ways to eliminate enemy fleets rather than taking Kardoen, because, I just don’t think we’ll ever take it, the enemy are only going to get stronger, we need to destroy fleets, we need to keep a numbers advantage so we can pull back fleets, resupply, and rotate in and out.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: SpardaSon21 on August 14, 2013, 04:30:14 pm
I think Spoon's busy plotting our demise and the end of Terran liberty.  I for one welcome our new space elf overlords!
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Admiral MS on August 14, 2013, 05:05:10 pm
If Jellyfish/4th SF really wants to attack the Zy he should either retreat after the attack (probably surviving with something < 10% due to retreat damage) or attack during turn 2 to share damage with 1st SF (if they still choose to attack). When any additional hostile fleet moves to Tauri 4th SF is likely to blow up next turn and this won't fall under the "no one hit kills" category that Spoon promised not to do.

Generally I expect Spoon to give us more trouble next turn. This may be more hostile fleets, too powerful Hertak, some nasty special abilities or unexpected hostile fleet movements like mass attacking Tauri.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 14, 2013, 05:32:33 pm
I’ll do a calculation on a damage share, and see if the 1st SF (the 4th SF must retreat) can be destroyed next turn:

4st SF Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 11+5=16 (18+2)
Capital attack strength: 9+6=15 (18)
Fighters at 51% Strength (31 left)
Capital ships at 51% Strength (31 left)

SF 1st Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 17+8=25 (18+2)
Capital attack strength: 15+9=24 (18)
Fighters at 83% Strength (63 left)
Capital ships at 86% Strength (66 left)

vs.

1st Zy Fleet (morale boost)
Fighter attack strength: 27+13=40 (22+2)
Capital attack strength: 26+14=40 (21+2)
Fighters at 119% Strength (78 left)
Capital ships at 120% Strength (81 left)

Counterattack:

3rd Cordi Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 16+5=21 (20)
Capital attack strength: 10+8=18 (12)
Fighters at 80% Strength
Capital ships at 81% Strength

2nd Zy Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 20+10=30 (21+1)
Capital attack strength: 19+10=29 (20+1)
Fighters at 90% Strength
Capital ships at 91% Strength

1st Zy Fleet (morale boost) (not sure if right)
Fighter attack strength: 17+8=25 (15+2)
Capital attack strength: 16+9=25 (14+2)
Fighters at 78% Strength
Capital ships at 81% Strength

vs.

63/66 (76/72 - death.)

Alternatively, the worst they can do if the 4th retreats and the 1st stalls is:

SF 1st Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 17+8=25 (18+2)
Capital attack strength: 15+9=24 (18)
Fighters at 83% Strength
Capital ships at 86% Strength

vs.

3rd Cordi Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 16+5=21 (20)
Capital attack strength: 10+8=18 (12)
Fighters at 80% Strength
Capital ships at 81% Strength

2nd Zy Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 20+10=30 (21+1)
Capital attack strength: 19+10=29 (20+1)
Fighters at 90% Strength
Capital ships at 91% Strength

1st Zy Fleet (morale boost)
Fighter attack strength: 27+13=40 (22+2)
Capital attack strength: 26+14=40 (21+2)
Fighters at 119% Strength
Capital ships at 120% Strength

91/88 - but would Spoon be that brutal? That would be extremely harsh. He could drop that on anyone. But a fleet on 66% strength instead of 86% strength would be a more tempting target for elimination. We need to keep our fleets strong.

NOTE: Edited a few times due to much sloppiness. Apologies for any confusion.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 14, 2013, 06:53:30 pm
Torchwood, please, attack the 2nd Nordera, not the 1st.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on August 14, 2013, 07:07:50 pm
Lorric - I don't think your calculations are correct.  If we destroy the 2nd Cordi and the 2nd Zy & 3rd Cordi move to Tauri and attack, then I think the move will be a retreat with damage taken from both 2nd CRF & 2nd UGCR.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 14, 2013, 07:12:56 pm
Lorric - I don't think your calculations are correct.  If we destroy the 2nd Cordi and the 2nd Zy & 3rd Cordi move to Tauri and attack, then I think the move will be a retreat with damage taken from both 2nd CRF & 2nd UGCR.
Not with the 5th Cordi coming in to cover it.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on August 14, 2013, 07:40:05 pm
I thought cover for a retreat had to be not moving in the same action? i.e. if two fleets retreat from a system with their 1st action both will take damage?  IOW, the 5th Cordi is not present at the start of the retreat, only at the end.

Now I thought about retreating and I'm not sure how this is handled with multiple fleets.
In which order do the turns of different fleets happen? For example there are two fleets in the same system and both want to retreat, one heavily damaged and one in a good state but unable to fight the hostile fleets alone. Do both fleets get damage on retreat or just one of them (and which one)? Does it depend on first/second (=major/minor) action?
A similar situation would be one where a fleet jumps into a system to cover another fleet's retreat. Does that work and if yes what are the requirements? Like the covering fleet has to jump in with the first action and the retreating one has to use the second action or it'll get damage.
This is a good example why it matters in what order you do your minor and major action.
In your first retreat example, it is possible for the fleet in good state to cover the retreat of the battered one before retreating itself. The damaged fleet will need to have its first action be the retreat while the other fleet needs to do it second. If both fleets have their retreat action as the first or second action then well, they both retreat at the same time and both take damage.
In the second example, it is as you say. A new fleet can jump into the system first and cover the retreat of the other fleet.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 14, 2013, 07:59:06 pm
Ha ha ha, niffiwan, I knew I'd seen that quote before, look:

Spoon, if two fleets swap places in a system simultaneously, does it allow one to cover the other's retreat?
http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php?topic=85046.msg1700482#msg1700482

Apologies for it somehow not sinking in.

All this stuff really needs compiling into one place.

I think the rules on retreat damage are lurking around somewhere as well, but it took me a while to find that, and I don't fancy searching around again right now.

EDIT: Although it probably doesn't matter, since I think we can be confident the heirarchy won't use such a move.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: mobcdmoc3 on August 14, 2013, 08:15:03 pm
Though my character won't like it, I think it's in our best interests to accept the surrender of the 4th Cordi. It'll let us explore the benefits of such a move and allow us to maintain our position.

I'm considering putting this down for my next turn:

Major Action: Secure System (Like hell my character is going to be the one accepting the surrender :p)
Minor Action: N/A (I'd rather stand and hold Draco, since the 1st LSF will be able to come in and cover us if we get beat up pretty badly. We're not really in need of resupply, since we're at 90%, though I'm still concerned about two 1st fleets being in Kardoen)

Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 14, 2013, 08:18:33 pm
Though my character won't like it, I think it's in our best interests to accept the surrender of the 4th Cordi. It'll let us explore the benefits of such a move and allow us to maintain our position.

I'm considering putting this down for my next turn:

Major Action: Secure System (Like hell my character is going to be the one accepting the surrender :p)
Minor Action: N/A (I'd rather stand and hold Draco, since the 1st LSF will be able to come in and cover us if we get beat up pretty badly. We're not really in need of resupply, since we're at 90%, though I'm still concerned about two 1st fleets being in Kardoen)
I recommended resupply for you because the others can take care of the rest, and they won't die on the next turn. Someone will be just sat there, so we might as well make that decision. On the turn after, you'll be at full strength, and you can just move in and attack.

(You could also have some funny RP, where you don't want to get anywhere near the bugs... :) )
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on August 14, 2013, 08:25:37 pm
/me puts his devils hat on

If we don't accept the surrender, then the 3rd SF could blitz & destroy the 4th Cordi and all three fleets attack 1st ? in Kardoen (maybe?) 

/me takes his devils hat off

I don't recommend this course of action, but it represents what accepting the surrender will cost us. 
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 14, 2013, 08:36:51 pm
The system would still be hostile, would that block us from doing it?

Anyway, I'm hoping taking the surrender may help us storyline-wise.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on August 14, 2013, 08:56:03 pm
The system would still be hostile, would that block us from doing it?

dunno.  I'm not sure the system would go hostile.  It's owned by the Hierarchy now, so "we're" the hostile force, and it'll stay contested until we leave or secure it.  If it's contested, then we can move provided there are no hostile fleets.  Which wouldn't be true until the 4th Cordi is destroyed after the 1st action has concluded... so that means that this doesn't let us attack Kardoen anyway.  Oh well, there's always next turn :)

Anyway, I'm hoping taking the surrender may help us storyline-wise.

Indeed. 
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on August 14, 2013, 09:51:17 pm
Though my character won't like it, I think it's in our best interests to accept the surrender of the 4th Cordi. It'll let us explore the benefits of such a move and allow us to maintain our position.

I'm considering putting this down for my next turn:

Major Action: Secure System (Like hell my character is going to be the one accepting the surrender :p)
Minor Action: N/A (I'd rather stand and hold Draco, since the 1st LSF will be able to come in and cover us if we get beat up pretty badly. We're not really in need of resupply, since we're at 90%, though I'm still concerned about two 1st fleets being in Kardoen)
I recommended resupply for you because the others can take care of the rest, and they won't die on the next turn. Someone will be just sat there, so we might as well make that decision. On the turn after, you'll be at full strength, and you can just move in and attack.

(You could also have some funny RP, where you don't want to get anywhere near the bugs... :) )

I thought it was already established that we must:-

Action 1 - Capture Fleet
Action 2 - Secure system

Simply because Draco will not be friendly until we capture it (end of this turn), so we can only use friendly actions (resupply, defend etc) next turn. Not on our second action (as the system is in the process of being secured)

And from my understanding, the SF can blitz into Kardeon, but they would be alone until next turn. As We (non-SF) cannot move until the system is secure or contested.


Regarding accepting surrender: One fleet needs to spend a major action to take em in and disarm them. The prisoners will then be transported to Sol for interrogation and all that good stuff. If it's done as the first action in the turn then the system itself can be secured with a second action.
Regarding accepting surrender: One fleet needs to spend a major action to take em in and disarm them. The prisoners will then be transported to Sol for interrogation and all that good stuff. If it's done as the first action in the turn then the system itself can be secured with a second action.
Can someone else secure the system on their first action, or will it have to be done with a second action?
Well I did say second action didn't I?  :p
Next question, will the other two fleets that don't use secure be able to use friendly-system actions on their second action?
No
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 14, 2013, 10:05:25 pm
Indeed we did, Veers. But I'm talking about the bolded part in this post:

Thanks Spoon.

Okay, with that out of the way, here are my revised recommendations, top:

2nd SF - double Resupply.

1st UGCR - pull back to Virgo and resupply.

4th SF - pull back to Librae and resupply (currently engaging Zy and staying put, this is suicide!)

1st SF - move to Tauri, don’t engage (currently engaging Zy, please don’t, or you will likely die a pointless death. Just stall them.)

2nd UGCR - engage 2nd Cordi (done)

2nd CRF - zeal, engage 2nd Cordi (done)

1st LSF - Travel to Aldebaran.

Bottom:

No one can travel to Kardoen. So here’s what I would do:

2nd LSF - travel to Odin and Resupply.

4th CRF - travel to Hydra.

3rd DD - travel to Vega.

2nd DD and 3rd CRF attack and destroy the 2nd Nordera. (2nd DD has done this.)

1st CRF - Capture the 4th Cordi, Use Zeal.

3rd SF - Travel to Vega and Resupply.

1st DD - Prepare Barrage and Secure the system.

But hey, it's probably a good thing to get my plan back in place, since I'll be going to sleep soon.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on August 14, 2013, 10:06:16 pm
Sorry Lorric, I missed that part. I thought it was odd that it was just covered and it was being discussed again.

:)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 14, 2013, 10:11:25 pm
Sorry Lorric, I missed that part. I thought it was odd that it was just covered and it was being discussed again.

:)

That's okay. :)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: CommanderDJ on August 14, 2013, 10:52:40 pm
So wait, is the 1st SF's doom certain if it attacks the 1st Zy?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 14, 2013, 10:55:00 pm
So wait, is the 1st SF's doom certain if it attacks the 1st Zy?
We're not sure. But please don't attack. Just go into the system, but don't attack. You should be safe if you do that.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 14, 2013, 11:08:10 pm
You know, I've gone through the thread searching for "retreat" and it looks like no one actually asked how damage works on a retreat.

So I'm going to ask now. How much damage do you take in a retreat?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Jellyfish on August 14, 2013, 11:12:10 pm
So wait, is the 1st SF's doom certain if it attacks the 1st Zy?
We're not sure. But please don't attack. Just go into the system, but don't attack. You should be safe if you do that.
The Zy will attack them.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: AdmiralRalwood on August 14, 2013, 11:15:10 pm
How much damage do you take in a retreat?
I have this vivid memory of reading that every enemy fleet deals 50% damage on a retreat, but I can't seem to find the original post anywhere...
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on August 14, 2013, 11:16:42 pm
You know, I've gone through the thread searching for "retreat" and it looks like no one actually asked how damage works on a retreat.

So I'm going to ask now. How much damage do you take in a retreat?

Lets go to the video tape of the 1st LSF retreat :)

Quote from: http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php?topic=85101.msg1702666#msg1702666
Code: [Select]
Draco, 1st LSF retreating

1st Nordera Fleet Fighters: 16+7/2 = 12
1st Nordera Fleet Capital: 14+8/2 = 11
Fighters at 133% Strength
Capital ships at 135% Strength

2nd Nordera Fleet Fighters: 12+5/2 = 9
2nd Nordera Fleet Capital: 10+6/2 = 8
Fighters at 83% Strength
Capital ships at 85% Strength


End strength:
1st LSF Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 7 (19+2+1)
Capital attack strength: 6 (14+1)
Fighters at 36% Strength
Capital ships at 41% Strength

As AdmiralRalwood said, looks like 50% damage on a retreat from each fleet in the system.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 14, 2013, 11:19:14 pm
So wait, is the 1st SF's doom certain if it attacks the 1st Zy?
We're not sure. But please don't attack. Just go into the system, but don't attack. You should be safe if you do that.
The Zy will attack them.
That's what I want.

@ niffiwan, Admiral Ralwood

Ahhhhhhh. Well done you two. It should be safe for Jellyfish to retreat then, he'll take a hit, but it will be less than the 30% health he'll collect from the resupply.  :D

EDIT: And a minor detail I notice, 50% rounded up.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on August 14, 2013, 11:21:13 pm
I look at it like as if it was a real retreat in game.

So your fleet is massing at the lance, jumping straight out and along arrives the enemy.. they scream "HELLO!"  broadside and slap your vessels silly as you try and pull as many out while your line crumbles and fighters are dropping like flies, all while hostile capship and fighter numbers keep growing

50% is a very large loss regardless though, but I can roughly imagine loosing 50% of a retreat if it was the above scenario..

 :p
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 14, 2013, 11:25:12 pm
Oh, speaking of the enemy saying "hello", a little something I found on my hunt...
/me waves hello to the Zy & Hertak...
They've come to say hello back. Personally...
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: AdmiralRalwood on August 14, 2013, 11:30:38 pm
50% is a very large loss regardless though, but I can roughly imagine loosing 50% of a retreat if it was the above scenario..
No no no, you don't lose 50% of your fleet, the enemy deals 50% of their normal damage.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on August 14, 2013, 11:33:30 pm
Or that..., I was never good with numbers  :blah:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on August 15, 2013, 12:48:49 am
So wait, is the 1st SF's doom certain if it attacks the 1st Zy?
We're not sure. But please don't attack. Just go into the system, but don't attack. You should be safe if you do that.
The Zy will attack them.
That's what I want.

The idea is: the 1st SF can't win a one on one fight vs the 1st Zy.  Therefore we want to delay that defeat so that other fleets can relieve them (while we concentrate fire on fleets in Aldebaran).  I think that if 1st SF does not attack, and 1st & 2nd Zy attack the next turn, then the 1st SF will survive.  If the 1st SF attack the 1st Zy, I think the following turns attack from the 1st & 2nd Zy will destroy them (but they will survive an attack from just the 1st Zy)

Projections:

Case 1: attack by 1st SF

Code: [Select]
SF 1st Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 17+8=25 (18+2)
Capital attack strength: 15+9=24 (18)
Fighters at 83% Strength (43 left)
Capital ships at 86% Strength (46 left)

1st Zy Fleet (morale boost)
Fighter attack strength: 27+13=40 (22+2)
Capital attack strength: 26+14=40 (21+2)
Fighters at 119% Strength (94 left)
Capital ships at 120% Strength (96 left)

1st & 2nd Zy retaliate
Code: [Select]
SF 1st Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 9+4=13 (18+2)
Capital attack strength: 8+5=13 (18)
Fighters at 43% Strength (-21 left)
Capital ships at 46% Strength (-17 left)

1st Zy Fleet (morale boost)
Fighter attack strength: 23+11=34 (22+2)
Capital attack strength: 22+12=34 (21+2)
Fighters at 94% Strength (87 left)
Capital ships at 96% Strength (79 left)

2nd Zy Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 20+10=30 (21+1)
Capital attack strength: 19+10=29 (20+1)
Fighters at 90% Strength (84 left)
Capital ships at 91% Strength (85 left)

If the 2nd Zy don't attack, the 1st SF survives with ~10% forces left.



Case 2: no attack by 1st SF

1st & 2nd Zy retaliate
Code: [Select]
SF 1st Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 17+8=25 (18+2)
Capital attack strength: 15+9=24 (18)
Fighters at 83% Strength (13 left)
Capital ships at 86% Strength (17 left)

1st Zy Fleet (morale boost)
Fighter attack strength: 27+13=40 (22+2)
Capital attack strength: 26+14=40 (21+2)
Fighters at 119% Strength (106 left)
Capital ships at 120% Strength (108 left)

2nd Zy Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 20+10=30 (21+1)
Capital attack strength: 19+10=29 (20+1)
Fighters at 90% Strength (78 left)
Capital ships at 91% Strength (79 left)

1st SF is badly mauled, but survives.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Flak on August 15, 2013, 01:16:09 am
If the 3rd Cordi decides to join the fray, then that may create a problem.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on August 15, 2013, 01:29:36 am
That'll mean the 3rd Cordi & 2nd Zy will take retreat damage from the 2nd CRF & 2nd UGCR... and I think that damage will be just enough to save the 2nd SF.

If the 4th SF stay in Tauri after their attack on the 1st Zy though...
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 15, 2013, 06:43:31 am
That'll mean the 3rd Cordi & 2nd Zy will take retreat damage from the 2nd CRF & 2nd UGCR... and I think that damage will be just enough to save the 2nd SF.

If the 4th SF stay in Tauri after their attack on the 1st Zy though...
Yes. DJ has adjusted his orders now, but Jellyfish is still attacking the Zy and staying put.

Jellyfish, please retreat to Librae and Resupply.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on August 15, 2013, 07:42:29 am
Moving with 1st action means the retreat won't be covered by 2nd SF - that's approx 20% damage going to be dealt by the 1st Zy.  Move with 2nd action means no resupply.  I guess taking the hit leaves 4th SF net +10% fleet strength @ ~60%?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 15, 2013, 08:00:42 am
I think that's exactly what it'll be, 20% down, 30% up, so take the hit and resupply, gain 10%.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Jellyfish on August 15, 2013, 10:24:44 am
Jellyfish, please retreat to Librae and Resupply.
Done AND done. The Zy will secure Tauri and that's a major (10) loss of supply, though.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 15, 2013, 10:32:05 am
Jellyfish, please retreat to Librae and Resupply.
Done AND done. The Zy will secure Tauri and that's a major (10) loss of supply, though.
Thanks. But they will not. The 1st SF will prevent it.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: SpardaSon21 on August 15, 2013, 11:28:16 am
So, 4th SF is retreating to resupply in Librae and two fleets are moving in to Tauri to assault the 1st Zy?  Should the 1st LSF move in to Aldebaran and engage the enemy?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 15, 2013, 01:07:25 pm
So, 4th SF is retreating to resupply in Librae and two fleets are moving in to Tauri to assault the 1st Zy?  Should the 1st LSF move in to Aldebaran and engage the enemy?
Just the 1st SF going to Tauri to stall the Zy.

But Alderaban is exactly where I want you, filling the gap left by the 1st SF. :)

You won't be able to attack though, as you have two systems to traverse.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 15, 2013, 10:22:26 pm
I'm going to sleep now. My fellow players, Friday is the last day we have to enter our orders. Here is the status of said orders and the plan:

Top:

2nd SF - double Resupply. (done)

1st UGCR - pull back to Virgo and resupply. (done)

4th SF - pull back to Librae and resupply (done)

1st SF - move to Tauri, don’t engage (done)

2nd UGCR - engage 2nd Cordi (done)

2nd CRF - zeal, engage 2nd Cordi (done)

1st LSF - Travel to Aldebaran. (done)

Bottom:

No one can travel to Kardoen. So here’s what I would do:

2nd LSF - travel to Odin and Resupply. (no orders given yet.)

4th CRF - travel to Hydra. (done)

3rd DD - travel to Vega. (no orders given yet.)

2nd DD and 3rd CRF attack and destroy the 2nd Nordera. (done and done)

1st CRF - Capture the 4th Cordi, Use Zeal. (done)

3rd SF - Travel to Vega and Resupply. (no orders given yet.)

1st DD - Prepare Barrage and Secure the system. (done)

So 12/15 fleets are following the plan, 3 fleets remain.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 16, 2013, 04:20:37 pm
We might as well give up now if we're down three players and not allowed to take over for them.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Admiral MS on August 16, 2013, 05:15:33 pm
Well giving up is your choice - we don't know what will be the result of this turn and the only fleet in danger of getting destroyed is 2nd LSF. If we get pushed back from Hydra to Odin then at least 4th CRF should already be there (due to being unable to travel to Hydra) and act as reinforcement. The other two missing turns don't kill anyone.
I expect Spoon to keep the game challenging (which in my opinion includes pushing us back at some point) and at least winnable even with some players dropping, for example by postponing the arrival of additional hostile fleets. It's not like people missing their turn comes unexpected in such a forum game - it would be even worse with two turns per week.

Spoon: What happens when an order can't be executed? Do you ignore it? What about conflicting orders like 2 fleets want to move with their first action into a system where already 2 other fleets are stationed?
If I know that I don't have access to the internet for some time and can't give an order, can I allow someone else to give the next order in my place?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on August 16, 2013, 05:37:24 pm
Spoon: What happens when an order can't be executed? Do you ignore it? What about conflicting orders like 2 fleets want to move with their first action into a system where already 2 other fleets are stationed?
If I know that I don't have access to the internet for some time and can't give an order, can I allow someone else to give the next order in my place?
If an order can't be executed, it'll be noted in the turn log. With conflicting orders like that I'd probably just give the person who posted his orders first priority.
And yes, you can. If its for a limited time (say, 3-4 weeks tops) and I know about it.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 16, 2013, 05:40:59 pm
If I know that I don't have access to the internet for some time and can't give an order, can I allow someone else to give the next order in my place?
This should be default. If you don't give an order, someone else should be able to do it for you. If I couldn't take my turn I'd want someone else to do it for me. We shouldn't be victims of circumstance like this. Those players might have missed their turn because they're expecting the deadline to be Sunday, or any number of reasons. We're a team, we should be able to help each other.

Spoon, please explain why you're cutting the legs out from under us like this. This is a long haul that will take months. People are going to drop or miss turns. We should be able to protect ourselves from this.

Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on August 16, 2013, 07:10:30 pm
Hey - it's just a game :)  This just makes it more interesting, it's not like IRL battles/wars always (ever?) go exactly the way the commanders expect.

If we get beaten to a bloody pulp, it's just all the more chances for stirring last stand speeches right?   :lol:

Or maybe this...

I think Spoon's busy plotting our demise and the end of Terran liberty.  I for one welcome our new space elf Ur-Quan Kzer-Za overlords!
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on August 16, 2013, 08:14:21 pm
Stress-less, we're bound to lose fleets sooner or later, think of this as advanced training :)

Also.., just taking some lines from a song I like "Blaze of Glory" - Audio Adrenaline

Quote
Oh, going out in a blaze of glory
My hands are held up high
I'm learning how to hit back
Yes, I'm learning how to fight

We are just lucky, if we go out in a blaze of glory, we really do go out with a bang. :D
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 16, 2013, 08:27:48 pm
Out with a whimper more like.

We've gone from a team to a disorganised mob thanks to this decision. It's little better than every man for himself now. We can't make plans and think a turn or two ahead under these circumstances.

It's killed my enthusiasm. Roleplay too "Oh, for some reason the 2nd LSF just sat there and died."

I don't plan on dropping out or anything yet, but this has taken a massive chunk of the enjoyment out of the whole experience for me.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on August 16, 2013, 08:31:45 pm
Spoon, please explain why you're cutting the legs out from under us like this. This is a long haul that will take months. People are going to drop or miss turns. We should be able to protect ourselves from this.
I was actually more suprised everyone has been so faithfully present up until this turn. From the moment I started writing down the rules I've been fully expecting that people will miss out on a turn or two. But it is their fleet, their command, their responsibility.
Anyway, take an example from Admiral MS, niffiwan and Veers.
And maybe it'll cheer you up to know that I'm (probably) gonna have the turn 2 video up tomorrow (getting the UGC rhino into the game took some time. DD fleets are not yet gonna shine though...)

Or maybe this...

I think Spoon's busy plotting our demise and the end of Terran liberty.  I for one welcome our new space elf Ur-Quan Kzer-Za overlords!
Muhahaha  :drevil:
Yesss.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on August 16, 2013, 08:35:23 pm
Out with a whimper more like.

We've gone from a team to a disorganised mob thanks to this decision. It's little better than every man for himself now. We can't make plans and think a turn or two ahead under these circumstances.
Nothing has changed though. This is merely the first turn in which people have been too late.

It's killed my enthusiasm. Roleplay too "Oh, for some reason the 2nd LSF just sat there and died."
As opposed to "Oh, for some reason the 2nd LSF started taking orders from the 2nd CRF that is in a system several jumps away"?

I don't plan on dropping out or anything yet, but this has taken a massive chunk of the enjoyment out of the whole experience for me.
Well, that's a shame but entirely up to you
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lepanto on August 16, 2013, 08:57:25 pm
Spoon, I know this is your game and I'm just making a request. Still, our responsible players shouldn't suffer in-game because some players failed to move their fleets. I'd like to request that, at least for this turn, you have the Hierarchy go easy on us a bit, if only to be fair to the players that did get their orders in on time.

Also, in the future, I would like to have a formalized system of some sort for controlling missing players' fleets, in case this situation comes up again.

What does everyone else think, about this situation and about handling it again in the future?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 16, 2013, 08:59:05 pm
I was actually more surprised everyone has been so faithfully present up until this turn. From the moment I started writing down the rules I've been fully expecting that people will miss out on a turn or two. But it is their fleet, their command, their responsibility.
Anyway, take an example from Admiral MS, niffiwan and Veers.
And maybe it'll cheer you up to know that I'm (probably) gonna have the turn 2 video up tomorrow (getting the UGC rhino into the game took some time. DD fleets are not yet gonna shine though...)

I just can’t feel the way they do, and I’m surprised by their response. I can understand you wanting people to have to be responsible, but you punish us all by doing this. And the hierarchy fleets aren’t going to be taking any turns off. We didn’t get to beat on the hierarchy fleets last week when you couldn’t make it. Not that I'd have wanted to at the time. There are lots of good reasons why someone could miss a turn, like what happened to you. And if someone drops out, we shouldn’t all be punished for that. Don’t you want this game to be the best it can be? Letting us jump in at the eleventh hour like I tried to do if someone misses a turn would do that. All it takes is one crucial fleet to miss a turn and die, and it’s over. I don’t want to lose like that. I don’t want my fleet to be destroyed because for some legit reason I couldn’t make it. I will like to see the video though.

Nothing has changed though. This is merely the first turn in which people have been too late.
But it has. We've probably already lost one fleet. And if the others don't reappear, then we've lost two more. What's changed is we can't rely on any plan working now. It only takes one crucial fleet to miss a turn. Thus we are reduced to every man for himself in such circumstances. You won't have any such problem.

Quote
As opposed to "Oh, for some reason the 2nd LSF started taking orders from the 2nd CRF that is in a system several jumps away"?
Yes. Taking orders from anyone would be more plausible than just sitting there. If the Fleet Admiral couldn't give the orders, the second in command would take over, but we don't have one.

Quote
Well, that's a shame but entirely up to you
I really don't understand why do this. The game will be so much better for everyone, including you, if you let us move fleets that no one else has at the eleventh hour.

Alas this is not Lorric's singleplayer game.

And what was this about? Unless I've misunderstood, you hurt me with this. Why not just state that it can’t be done like that? I would not have joined this game if I wasn't prepared to work with the others and accept their independent will. I've treated everyone with respect and everything I've done has been imo what's best for the team. I would sacrifice my fleet without a second thought if I thought it was the right thing to do for the team.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: CommanderDJ on August 16, 2013, 09:10:39 pm
Frankly, I'm with Spoon on this. It's not his fault other players haven't responded, and whlist I feel there's some merit to considering something like not moving all the Hierarchy forces in the turn, it's ultimately his prerogative, and it wouldn't be right to decide that some other random player gets to give orders for fleets that aren't his or her own. After all, how do we know who the missing players would want giving orders in their stead?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 16, 2013, 09:16:11 pm
Frankly, I'm with Spoon on this. It's not his fault other players haven't responded, and whlist I feel there's some merit to considering something like not moving all the Hierarchy forces in the turn, it's ultimately his prerogative, and it wouldn't be right to decide that some other random player gets to give orders for fleets that aren't his or her own. After all, how do we know who the missing players would want giving orders in their stead?
In the end if he sticks to his guns, it doesn't matter what I or anyone else thinks. But it doesn't mean I can't try.

I'd rather have anyone do it than my fleet just be sat there! I'd trust anyone on the team to do it. I would treat anyone else's fleet with the same respect as my own, and I don't see why anyone else wouldn't do the same for me. We all want the same thing. Who cares who does it just as long as someone does?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: mobcdmoc3 on August 16, 2013, 10:04:19 pm
Apologies, I left on a camping trip not long after my last post, and got back today later than I was hoping to. Thankfully, I don't think my absence will have had too significant an effect on the next turn, since I'm still sitting at 90%.

I'm not dropping out by any means - The Hertak will have to shoot me out of my ship before that happens. :p
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 16, 2013, 10:12:08 pm
Apologies, I left on a camping trip not long after my last post, and got back today later than I was hoping to. Thankfully, I don't think my absence will have had too significant an effect on the next turn, since I'm still sitting at 90%.

I'm not dropping out by any means - The Hertak will have to shoot me out of my ship before that happens. :p
Well, at least we know we're not going to lose 3 fleets. Your turn was the one I was least worried about, missing your turn is just a minor irritation, in fact, of all 15 of us, I believe your turn being missed is probably the least significant. It's the other two that are the problem, the 2nd LSF in particular.

It's nice to know you would have made the move.

Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on August 17, 2013, 01:15:21 am
It's killed my enthusiasm. Roleplay too "Oh, for some reason the 2nd LSF just sat there and died."
As opposed to "Oh, for some reason the 2nd LSF started taking orders from the 2nd CRF that is in a system several jumps away"?


You can still RP most of  that anyway, just have to be creative.



"Sir, latest reports from our scout wings. They have located and rescued survivors from the 2nd LSF, 3rd attack squadron."

---
The 2nd LSF was caught off guard by a multi-pronged assault force, many vessels were damaged and scattered. The Flagship of the 2nd Fleet received light damage while repelling the force, but suffered engine damage and may have been surrounded by massive inhibitor fields. The Admiral rallied the fleet and signalled allied fleets for reinforcements, to our knowledge none of these messages were ever received.

While we do know that the majority of the 2nd LSF is unaccounted for, we do not know if they survive, have been destroyed or are otherwise incapacitated. Our scout forces will continue to recon the area, enemy presence has so far been light.
---

It can be RP'd, just not a major positive RP but not everything can be good. We are going to suffer losses soon. But anyway, RP side of it. Just have to expand on a reason that may have caused severe damage or destruction, or present several reasons and RP those. Nothing has to be accurate.

But lets just keep having fun ok? :)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Droid803 on August 17, 2013, 02:37:14 am
Well, you could make it so that people that miss their turns simply continue their previous orders...
Even if it means getting them killed.

Plus is players die off others may be able to sneak in...  :warp:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: An4ximandros on August 17, 2013, 03:17:53 am
The Admiral could always have been injured in combat... and a temporary (or permanent depending on the case) replacement could be brought in. This could make for great role-play. *hint* *hint* :nervous:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on August 17, 2013, 04:08:43 am
Oh dear.

Folks, as one of the three (?) admirals that failed to check in, I would like to offer my sincere apologies to all affected comrades. I was away from home on an archaeological dig and thought the deadline was today (as turns were previously acted out on Sundays). I cannot promise that it will never happen again, as I am unable to access the Internet on a daily basis and might once again miss some deadline changes, but I will do my best to keep up.

May I offer a suggestion? In order to avoid cases of 'the player is unable (for RL or other reasons) to play on this turn, the fleet just sits there lololol', might it be possible for admirals to give 'long-term' orders to their fleets? This would allow for some margin of unattendance as well as keeping each admiral in control of his fleet. If the admiral is able to connect, he might change the long-term orders.

So, this might work like this:

Fleet: 3rd DD
Major: do this
Minor: do that

-Next round:
Major: do this
Minor: do that

The first orders are executed on the normal turn. If the admiral fails to show up on his next turn, the orders he specified are executed to the best of the fleet's ability.

Just a suggestion. Think about it.

Again, guys (both players and Spoon), sorry.

And to avoid similar problems, can I have a confirmation on the next deadline?

Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on August 17, 2013, 06:35:35 am
Oh dear.

Folks, as one of the three (?) admirals that failed to check in, I would like to offer my sincere apologies to all affected comrades. I was away from home on an archaeological dig and thought the deadline was today (as turns were previously acted out on Sundays). I cannot promise that it will never happen again, as I am unable to access the Internet on a daily basis and might once again miss some deadline changes, but I will do my best to keep up.
Apologies, I left on a camping trip not long after my last post, and got back today later than I was hoping to. Thankfully, I don't think my absence will have had too significant an effect on the next turn, since I'm still sitting at 90%.

I'm not dropping out by any means - The Hertak will have to shoot me out of my ship before that happens. :p
No problem guys. As I said, I fully expected people to miss their turns eventually for whatever reason. It happens, its no big deal.
I will (probably :drevil:) not outright kill fleets that have not recieved orders. I might give them move orders if they are in the way of other players though.

And to avoid similar problems, can I have a confirmation on the next deadline?
It's always going to be the next friday, so I have the whole weekend to process the turn.

May I offer a suggestion? In order to avoid cases of 'the player is unable (for RL or other reasons) to play on this turn, the fleet just sits there lololol', might it be possible for admirals to give 'long-term' orders to their fleets? This would allow for some margin of unattendance as well as keeping each admiral in control of his fleet. If the admiral is able to connect, he might change the long-term orders.

So, this might work like this:

Fleet: 3rd DD
Major: do this
Minor: do that

-Next round:
Major: do this
Minor: do that

The first orders are executed on the normal turn. If the admiral fails to show up on his next turn, the orders he specified are executed to the best of the fleet's ability.

Just a suggestion. Think about it.
This will be hard for me to keep track of. If you are unsure if you will make next turn I'd rather you'd appoint someone else to do the turn for you (and let me know about it in here)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 17, 2013, 07:41:31 am
This will be hard for me to keep track of. If you are unsure if you will make next turn I'd rather you'd appoint someone else to do the turn for you (and let me know about it in here)
Why are you being so stubborn? Just let them move. It doesn't take a genius to figure out they would want to make the same moves I gave. You've still got loads of time to process the turn. Let the people who are sorry have nothing to be sorry about.

Also, what if we all make a pledge that anyone can move our fleets any turn if we're not there? Then will we be allowed to prevent this?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: The E on August 17, 2013, 07:49:22 am
Lorric, something like this takes a LOT of bookkeeping. Not only would Spoon have to track all moves of all players for the current turn, it also means keeping track of future ones.

I don't know how much time and energy Spoon has to invest in this already, but I would imagine that that amount is limited.

Finally, this is his game, and you are playing by his rules. If he says that posting moves for future turns is not allowed or that those moves will be ignored, those are the rules.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 17, 2013, 08:04:38 am
Finally, this is his game, and you are playing by his rules. If he says that posting moves for future turns is not allowed or that those moves will be ignored, those are the rules.
I know that if he's adamant in the end there's nothing I can do. But I really believe he's making a bad mistake with this for everyone, including himself. I just want to talk. Even if he says no to this turn, maybe we can discuss a workable plan for prevention in future turns.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on August 17, 2013, 08:30:57 am
I believe we already have a workable plan for the future.

If you are unsure if you will make next turn I'd rather you'd appoint someone else to do the turn for you (and let me know about it in here)

I understand where Enioch is coming from with the orders-for-future idea, but I doubt I'd ever use it. It's too hard to consider all factors & make an informed decision when you don't know what the Hierarchy is going to do next.  I'd much prefer to say (for example) "AndrewOfDoom / 1st UGCR can give orders for the 2nd UGCR next turn".
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 17, 2013, 08:38:21 am
I believe we already have a workable plan for the future.
The idea of appointing someone to do your turn if you're unsure you can make it would not work if you missed it when you didn't think you would miss it.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on August 17, 2013, 08:43:39 am
I offered the suggestion, because of Spoon's 'not-a-single-player-game' response, in order to allow each player to control his fleet when unavailable. I agree that any 'old' orders would probably be not perfectly adapted to the situation as it develops; but they would probably be better than the fleet just standing there and taking it (while occupying valuable front-line system slots).

However,

Finally, this is his game, and you are playing by his rules.

And the case is closed. Since it will be possible to assign other players as emergency commanders, the point is moot anyway.

EDIT for Lorric: OK, then. On the record, and for the future, if I fail to give orders to my fleet, you are permitted to do so yourself (pending Spoon's veto). Should you do give any orders before the deadline, and I show up in time, I reserve the right to submit my own orders.

Now really, calm down. You offer some valid arguments and I realize that some of the others and myself have somehow ruined the experience for you and I have apologized for it, but it is still just a game.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 17, 2013, 08:53:16 am
And the case is closed. Since it will be possible to assign other players as emergency commanders, the point is moot anyway.

EDIT for Lorric: OK, then. On the record, and for the future, if I fail to give orders to my fleet, you are permitted to do so yourself (pending Spoon's veto). Should you do give any orders before the deadline, and I show up in time, I reserve the right to submit my own orders.

Now really, calm down. You offer some valid arguments and I realize that some of the others and myself have somehow ruined the experience for you and I have apologized for it, but it is still just a game.
If we're allowed to assign others as emergency commanders on a permanant basis, and not a turn by turn one, I'm fine with that, I can get behind that. And thank you for your trust.

I do not bear any of the absentees any ill will. I just want to help us all get the best we can out of this.

We also need a plan for if someone drops out of the game, not just a turn.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Admiral MS on August 17, 2013, 10:23:22 am
If I know that I don't have access to the internet for some time and can't give an order, can I allow someone else to give the next order in my place?
And yes, you can. If its for a limited time (say, 3-4 weeks tops) and I know about it.
If you are unsure if you will make next turn I'd rather you'd appoint someone else to do the turn for you (and let me know about it in here)
EDIT for Lorric: OK, then. On the record, and for the future, if I fail to give orders to my fleet, you are permitted to do so yourself (pending Spoon's veto). Should you do give any orders before the deadline, and I show up in time, I reserve the right to submit my own orders.
This would be bending the rules as Spoon explicitly stated that it can't be permanent. You can repeat it every 3-4 weeks but that's also kind of stupid. Let's just do things as they come and if someone misses his turn without knowing it beforehand then that's unlucky. Spoon said he expected it and won't go total badass by killing people off directly. Can't we trust him on that matter instead of trying to change the rules of his forum game until he's completely annoyed by it?
I sincerely hope no one here will hold a grudge against someone missing his turn and causing some really huge problems in the game. These things happen frequently in most realtime based browser games and are just part of playing them. I'll have my fun even if we go down cause of this.

We also need a plan for if someone drops out of the game, not just a turn.
I think if it is absolutely clear and there is someone else interested who is not yet playing the game (and Spoon allows it), this person may take over command. Otherwise we get a static fleet sitting around somewhere or it gets destroyed. Might still be of tactical use for us...
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 17, 2013, 10:28:05 am
This would be bending the rules as Spoon explicitly stated that it can't be permanent. You can repeat it every 3-4 weeks but that's also kind of stupid. Let's just do things as they come and if someone misses his turn without knowing it beforehand then that's unlucky.
It would be so easy to fix though, that's what's bugging me. Spoon wouldn't even have to do anything, just leave it to us to take care of. We're quite capable of creating a contingency plan for this among ourselves, he doesn't have to lift a finger.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lepanto on August 17, 2013, 11:19:58 am
Well, now that Spoon has agreed to let people appoint emergency commanders, we have a solution. Problem solved, in the future anyway. I empower Lorric, or anyone else, to take my turn for me if I'm missing (not that I think I'll actually miss a turn, but still). I propose that each of us, now, decides who can control their fleet if they're absent, in case this happens again.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 17, 2013, 11:24:47 am
Well, now that Spoon has agreed to let people appoint emergency commanders, we have a solution. Problem solved, in the future anyway. I empower Lorric, or anyone else, to take my turn for me if I'm missing (not that I think I'll actually miss a turn, but still). I propose that each of us, now, decides who can control their fleet if they're absent, in case this happens again.
I don't know if he's going to let us do it on a permanant basis, but as I said before I would be okay with this as a solution.

I too would be okay with anyone else. If I have to pick a specific person, would you be willing to be my second, and do you think you will be available near the deadline? I'm not sure what timezone you are on.

Maybe if we follow your proposal, Spoon will too.

I would be happy to be anyone's second. Perhaps others could also declare if they are willing to assume the role of second.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on August 18, 2013, 07:11:18 am
You guys have no idea how many times I've mistyped Aldebaran as Alderbaron

I don't know if he's going to let us do it on a permanant basis
I won't.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 18, 2013, 07:21:48 am
You guys have no idea how many times I've mistyped Aldebaran as Alderbaron
I did this for a time, but I did Alderbaran. But I sorted it out. I can't remember where it was, it might have been FS1, but after that I heard the commander pronounce the system name, it wasn't how I expected, and yet it fits the way it is spelt. The deberan part sounds a lot like it is spelt, but think how Debra is said. And the end part is pronounced "on", not "an".

Quote
I won't.
I just do not understand you... why...? :confused:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on August 18, 2013, 07:58:52 am
I just do not understand you...

Or in other words, because this is how I rule it. And that's my final say on the matter. Further attempts to argue about this will fall on deaf ears.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 18, 2013, 11:55:45 am
Well, you know what I think about it. But...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4yaGOS9KyE4&hl=en-GB&gl=GB#t=0m40s

So let's put this behind us and move forward.  :)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on August 18, 2013, 06:09:06 pm
AdmiralRalwood, Admiral MS lemme know here what traits you wanna pick for your promotion (Both of you have admiral in your name, it seemed fitting)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: SpardaSon21 on August 18, 2013, 06:27:44 pm
I'm going to go use Combined Arms and beat the crap out of 2nd Zy in Aldebaran.  Anyone interested in helping me?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on August 18, 2013, 07:05:21 pm
Ladies and Gentlemen, children of all ages (13 and over), may I present to you a kick in teeth. The 1st Hertak Fleet, accompanied by the 1st .... I mean Fura'ngle fleet.

I suggest we kick them back, in the b*lls if they do have them. The 1st CRF and 1st DD won't be able to hold Draco, even with the 3rd SF at full strength.

So if we don't play our cards right, we are going to take a huge beating in the Southern Sector this and next turn. Not to mention Tauri

In other news, congrats DD Admirals. Don't spent all your time playing with your shiny new badges and 3rd gen tech! :D
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lepanto on August 18, 2013, 08:13:47 pm
Okay, here's my thoughts.

Missed players or no, that turn didn't go too bad, but yes, we've got to contain the situation in Tauri and Draco.

Do you think we should just hit the 1st Nordera as hard as we can with our current forces in Hydra and fall back from Draco to avoid destruction by the enemy forces there? Or should we rotate the 3rd DD and one of our fleets from Hydra into Draco, so that we can stall the Hierarchy in Draco for another turn, even if it means having less fleets to attack the 1st Nordera in Hydra with? I'd really like to savage the 1st Nordera with a full three-fleet attack and start wrapping up in Hydra, but the enemy fleets in Draco are simply too powerful to let rampage unchecked.

In the north, I'd say move the 2nd SF into Aldebaran and move the 2nd UGCR or 2nd CRF up into Tauri to attack the 1st Zy and then absorb the Tauri forces' counterattack on their next turn. The 4th SF is well-rested enough to join the 2nd CRF/UGCR in this attack. Hopefully (I haven't done the math), if those two fleets can hit the 1st Zy hard, our two hypothetical fleets can survive the next turn, while having done significant damage to the 1st Zy. Pull the 1st SF out to rest up, of course. That way, we'll still have three strong fleets in Aldebaran to hit the 2nd Zy, and also start hitting the enemy fleets in Tauri. I still think that we need to retake Tauri eventually; that way, we'll be able to hold them at Aldebaran much easier. Hopefully, we should have the fleets available to eventually do that.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 18, 2013, 08:38:04 pm
Okay, here's my thoughts.

Missed players or no, that turn didn't go too bad, but yes, we've got to contain the situation in Tauri and Draco.

Do you think we should just hit the 1st Nordera as hard as we can with our current forces in Hydra and fall back from Draco to avoid destruction by the enemy forces there? Or should we rotate the 3rd DD and one of our fleets from Hydra into Draco, so that we can stall the Hierarchy in Draco for another turn, even if it means having less fleets to attack the 1st Nordera in Hydra with? I'd really like to savage the 1st Nordera with a full three-fleet attack and start wrapping up in Hydra, but the enemy fleets in Draco are simply too powerful to let rampage unchecked.

In the north, I'd say move the 2nd SF into Aldebaran and move the 2nd UGCR or 2nd CRF up into Tauri to attack the 1st Zy and then absorb the Tauri forces' counterattack on their next turn. The 4th SF is well-rested enough to join the 2nd CRF/UGCR in this attack. Hopefully (I haven't done the math), if those two fleets can hit the 1st Zy hard, our two hypothetical fleets can survive the next turn, while having done significant damage to the 1st Zy. Pull the 1st SF out to rest up, of course. That way, we'll still have three strong fleets in Aldebaran to hit the 2nd Zy, and also start hitting the enemy fleets in Tauri. I still think that we need to retake Tauri eventually; that way, we'll be able to hold them at Aldebaran much easier. Hopefully, we should have the fleets available to eventually do that.
I don’t know if I’ll get my plans out tonight, but the way the turn went has restored my enthusiasm, so I’m just as enthusiastic as ever again.

For the bottom, I’d need to start working things out but I’m thinking stall the Nordera and attack the Hertak. The Nordera are just a minor annoyance and should be treated as such.

For the top, I’m actually looking at the 3rd Cordi as the primary target, because I believe we can kill them, while we can’t kill anything else. I need to do the math.

Oh and I’ll add on the promotions, surely the only choice is the morale one, to correct the greatest weakness of the DD.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 18, 2013, 09:18:37 pm
Here is my early proposal for the next move at the top:

1st SF - Travel to Librae, Resupply.

1st UGCR - Resupply, Mercs.

4th SF, 2nd CRF and 1st LSF will all attack the 3rd Cordi, and destroy them:

4th SF Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 17+8=25 (18+2)
- Capital attack strength: 15+9=24 (18)
- Fighters at 81% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 81% Strength
- Morale: Normal

2nd CRF Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 18+9=27 (16+2+2)
- Capital attack strength: 18+9=27 (17+2)
- Fighters at 79% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 86% Strength
- Morale: Very High
- Zeal on Cooldown, Available again on Turn 7

1st LSF Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 25+8=33 (19+5+1)
- Capital attack strength: 15+13=28 (14+1)
- Fighters at 96% Strength, 4th Gen
- Capital ships at 100% Strength
- Morale: High

vs.

3rd Cordi Fleet - will deal minimal damage, approx. 7/6 per fleet.
Fighter attack strength: 15+5=20 (20)
Capital attack strength: 9+8=17 (12)
Fighters at 77% Strength (85 dmg)
Capital ships at 78% Strength (79 dmg - destroyed.)

Just enough! Without the 4th Gen fighters it would have been 77!

Then the 2nd UGCR and 2nd SF attack the 2nd Zy (although we need to find out if the 5th Cordi is a regular Cordi fleet or not. Spoon should be able to tell us, they‘re right in front of us.)

2nd SF Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 20+9=29 (18+2)
- Capital attack strength: 18+10=28 (18)
- Fighters at 100% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 100% Strength
- Morale: Normal

2nd UGCR Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 14+7=21 (13+2)
- Capital attack strength: 14+7=21 (15)
- Fighters at 95% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 96% Strength
- Morale: Normal

vs.

2nd Zy Fleet - will deal approx 15/15 damage per fleet.
Fighter attack strength: 20+10=30 (21+1)
Capital attack strength: 19+10=29 (20+1)
Fighters at 90% Strength (take 50dmg)
Capital ships at 91% Strength (take 49dmg)

We can’t kill the 2nd Zy this turn, but we can kill the 3rd Cordi. So we should. Wipe them out. Wipe out anything except maybe the Nordera when we get the chance.






Spoon, I’m just looking at my fleet in the latest post:

2nd CRF Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 17 (16+2+1)
- Capital attack strength: 17 (17+1)
- Fighters at 79% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 86% Strength
- Morale: Very High
- Zeal on Cooldown, Available again on Turn 7

I should have +2 for Very High morale, right? So should it be like this?

2nd CRF Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 18 (16+2+2)
- Capital attack strength: 18 (17+2)
- Fighters at 79% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 86% Strength
- Morale: Very High
- Zeal on Cooldown, Available again on Turn 7

And may we have intel on the 5th Cordi and 2nd Fura’ngle fleets?

And finally, what happens if the fighter strength is reduced to 0%? does damage start carrying over to Capital Strength then?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Flak on August 18, 2013, 09:27:55 pm
1st CSA Fleet, ETA Turn 5 Silva

So, Isa is coming to save us?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 18, 2013, 09:36:30 pm
And now for my early proposal for the bottom section:

2nd LSF - Double Resupply

1st DD and 1st CRF - Travel to Vega and Resupply.

3rd DD - Travel to Vega, Defend (hey, you’ve got an action, might as well use it, right?)

2nd DD - Prepare Barrage, hold position.

3rd CRF, 4th CRF, travel to Draco and engage the Hertak.

3rd SF - also engage the Hertak.

3rd CRF Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 19+9=28 (16+2+2)
- Capital attack strength: 18+10=28 (17+2)
- Fighters at 96% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 96% Strength
- Morale: Very High

4th CRF Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 20+10=30 (16+2+2)
- Capital attack strength: 19+10=29 (17+2)
- Fighters at 100% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 100% Strength
- Morale: Very High
- Zeal on Cooldown, Available again on Turn 6

3rd SF Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 19+9=28 (18+2+1)
- Capital attack strength: 18+10=28 (18+1)
- Fighters at 91% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 93% Strength
- Morale: High

vs.

1st Hertak Fleet - will deal approx. 16/17 to each fleet.
Fighter attack strength: 28+19=47 (22)
Capital attack strength: 37+14=51 (30)
Fighters at 126% Strength (86 Dmg)
Capital ships at 122% Strength (85 Dmg)
Morale: Normal

It’ll take them awhile to recover from that! Let us show them the power of humanity! There's your kick to the balls, Veers! With a steel toe-capped boot! Let's see what the Fura'ngle think about that as they watch us tear apart their masters, the Hertak!

1st CSA Fleet, ETA Turn 5 Silva

So, Isa is coming to save us?
It's possible. Yaiceca was working under Isa after all, but that was WoD 2. Yaiceca might be running the show...
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on August 18, 2013, 09:59:09 pm
Where possible, I still think it will be beneficial to eliminate enemy fleets, including the Nordera. One less fleet for us to deal with so we can project more firepower onto other targets.

As for Draco, Pull the 1st CRF and DD out to Vega or Aquarius, 3rd DD to Vega.
2nd LSF can move into Hydra while 2 fleets reinforce the 3rd SF and attack in Draco, Assuming the 3rd SF will take a beating, next turn they can retreat and be replaced by the 3rd DD from Vega. - Fleet rotation. Keep the pressure on while we can resupply and return to battle.

While the 2nd LSF and other fleet attack Hyrda against the 1st Nordera
Quote
1st Nordera Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 16 (10+2)
Capital attack strength: 13 (8+2)
Fighters at 136% Strength
Capital ships at 137% Strength

We need to try and secure Hydra and eliminate the 1st Nordera, eliminating 1st Fleet anything is good.

Also noting, it is currently 15 fleets vs 9. We should do our best to maximise our numbers through fleet rotation and constant pressure to eliminate enemy fleets. Regardless of which race.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 18, 2013, 10:10:47 pm
Where possible, I still think it will be beneficial to eliminate enemy fleets, including the Nordera. One less fleet for us to deal with so we can project more firepower onto other targets.

As for Draco, Pull the 1st CRF and DD out to Vega or Aquarius, 3rd DD to Vega.
2nd LSF can move into Hydra while 2 fleets reinforce the 3rd SF and attack in Draco, Assuming the 3rd SF will take a beating, next turn they can retreat and be replaced by the 3rd DD from Vega. - Fleet rotation. Keep the pressure on while we can resupply and return to battle.

While the 2nd LSF and other fleet attack Hyrda against the 1st Nordera
Quote
1st Nordera Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 16 (10+2)
Capital attack strength: 13 (8+2)
Fighters at 136% Strength
Capital ships at 137% Strength

We need to try and secure Hydra and eliminate the 1st Nordera, eliminating 1st Fleet anything is good.

Also noting, it is currently 15 fleets vs 9. We should do our best to maximise our numbers through fleet rotation and constant pressure to eliminate enemy fleets. Regardless of which race.
Why have you changed your mind from kicking the Hertak in the balls? If we do that, that will get them off the front line, then we can work on the other enemy fleets. We can't just leave the Hertak there to deal their obscene damage. By the time they get back on the front, the Cyrvans should be near. The Hertak will be off the front line for at least 2 turns I think, more likely 3.

And if we're lucky, it might scare the Fura'ngle. They were on Very Low morale until the Hertak arrived to "motivate" them.

Please don't worry about the 1st Nordera. Their stats are still weak, 1st or not. I bet one of our fleets could take them 1v1.

The 2nd LSF is too weak.

2nd LSF Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 10 (19+2+1)
- Capital attack strength: 9 (14+1)
- Fighters at 51% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 54% Strength
- Morale: High

It needs to do a double resupply.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on August 18, 2013, 10:16:06 pm
At no point am I trying to change my view of kicking them in the balls, I just want to make sure we put as much constant pressure onto them while maintaining our own fleets.

Odd, I must have read the wrong info as I didn't know the 2nd LSF was down on strength... let me go back and read everything before I try again,
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 18, 2013, 10:20:06 pm
Odd, I must have read the wrong info as I didn't know the 2nd LSF was down on strength... let me go back and read everything before I try again,
You might have looked at the post at the top of the game thread page. I kept doing that initially when scrolling, so in the end I opened another tab, and had the top of Turn 4 in one Tab and the bottom of Turn 4 in the other one. And then I copy-pasted all the ally fleets into a document to start working on my plans.

Also, the 2nd LSF would have been in the 80s if it hadn't missed it's turn. Where is Dragon anyway? He's been active on HLP, but not in here.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on August 18, 2013, 10:45:34 pm
2nd DD vs 1st Nordera seems a fair move, with both sides giving as good as they get.  2nd DD will need to retreat next turn obviously, although it'll get a little close if the 1st Fura'ngle decides to move to Hydra & attack them as well as the 1st Nordera.  Of course, if the 1st Hertak or 3rd Nordera move to Hydra as well, 2nd DD is dead, but I think that unlikely since it'll mean retreat damage for someone, or the loss of the 1st Hertak the following turn.

Actually - consider this, 3rd SF uses Blitz on the 1st Hertak, moves to Kardoen & secures it next turn instead of attacking the 1st Hertak.  Too risky given that we don't know what's off-screen waiting to pounce on them?  The payoff is a good chance of destroying 1st Hertak in turn 5 because they won't be able to resupply... what do you think mobcdmoc3?  Death & Glory? :)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 18, 2013, 10:57:08 pm
2nd DD vs 1st Nordera seems a fair move, with both sides giving as good as they get.  2nd DD will need to retreat next turn obviously, although it'll get a little close if the 1st Fura'ngle decides to move to Hydra & attack them as well as the 1st Nordera.  Of course, if the 1st Hertak or 3rd Nordera move to Hydra as well, 2nd DD is dead, but I think that unlikely since it'll mean retreat damage for someone, or the loss of the 1st Hertak the following turn.

Actually - consider this, 3rd SF uses Blitz on the 1st Hertak, moves to Kardoen & secures it next turn instead of attacking the 1st Hertak.  Too risky given that we don't know what's off-screen waiting to pounce on them?  The payoff is a good chance of destroying 1st Hertak in turn 5 because they won't be able to resupply... what do you think mobcdmoc3?  Death & Glory? :)
If the 2nd DD doesn't attack the Nordera, it should be safe. Their task is simply to be in the system to stop it being taken. And if the Hertak did attack, well, it would be the furthest thing in the World from a pointless death with us being able to avenge them by wiping out the Hertak.

I wouldn't use Blitz. We don't need to take such risks. Plus, no heirarchy fleets came in this turn. Who knows what could show up next turn...

The Hertak would just move back two systems instead of one, and whatever came in would block our attack.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: mobcdmoc3 on August 18, 2013, 11:17:29 pm
If we were chasing down the Cordi, then I just might be tempted to use Blitz on them. :p

But with regards to the Hertak, I don't think my sacrifice would be worth it, especially considering we don't know the consequences of total annihilation and with the Cyrva potentially coming to our aid.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 18, 2013, 11:31:04 pm
If we were chasing down the Cordi, then I just might be tempted to use Blitz on them. :p
He he, isn't your Soryu glad he's not up here with me and all the Cordi? :)

After we take out the 3rd Cordi, I think we should have a little chat with the 5th Cordi, about what happened to the 1st, 2nd, 3rd and 4th Cordi...
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on August 18, 2013, 11:41:01 pm
The Hertak would just move back two systems instead of one, and whatever came in would block our attack.

That'd depend on when the system flips from friendly to contested.  As soon as the cavalry enter from unknown systems?  Then the 1st Hertak can retreat.

If it flips to contested at the end of turn, then the 1st Hertak can't even enter the system without a special ability. 

A moot point anyway since...

But with regards to the Hertak, I don't think my sacrifice would be worth it, especially considering we don't know the consequences of total annihilation and with the Cyrva potentially coming to our aid.

Fair enough, I may have done it if it was my own fleet, but I accept that it's a very risky move to try :)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lepanto on August 18, 2013, 11:42:02 pm
Good to see you're back in the game, Lorric. I'm supporting the attack-the-Hertak plan. We can hold the 1st Nordera without any further investment; the Hertak-led attack in Draco needs to be blunted ASAP. And yeah, let's not take unnecessary risks with Blitz when we're doing alright as it is.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 18, 2013, 11:46:40 pm
Good to see you're back in the game, Lorric. I'm supporting the attack-the-Hertak plan. We can hold the 1st Nordera without any further investment; the Hertak-led attack in Draco needs to be blunted ASAP. And yeah, let's not take unnecessary risks with Blitz when we're doing alright as it is.
Thanks.

Go forth, Lepanto! Go forth and destroy the Hertak and scare the hell out of the Fura'ngle!

Attacking the Hertak. I'm looking forward to your RP account of that! Your first battle, and it's the Hertak! :D
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 18, 2013, 11:57:23 pm
Well, well, lookee here! Look what I found!

Cyrvan Star Armada: 1/1
1st Fleet - under the command of Admiral Droid803 on the flagship Dimensional Eclipse

So the Cyrvans have droids commanding their fleets?  :lol:

A surprise to be sure. I thought Spoon would control them.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on August 19, 2013, 12:39:00 am
We have Droid!, We have Droid!

I declare total Victory under our Elf-Overlords. :D

That came out in my head in a sing-song type way. Interesting... Welcome Aboard Droid803!
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Admiral MS on August 19, 2013, 01:45:15 am
AdmiralRalwood, Admiral MS lemme know here what traits you wanna pick for your promotion (Both of you have admiral in your name, it seemed fitting)
Nice! Now what should I choose? Aggressive leader, Master in logistics or Inspirational leader cause of the low base morale - hard decision...

2nd DD vs 1st Nordera seems a fair move, with both sides giving as good as they get.  2nd DD will need to retreat next turn obviously, although it'll get a little close if the 1st Fura'ngle decides to move to Hydra & attack them as well as the 1st Nordera.  Of course, if the 1st Hertak or 3rd Nordera move to Hydra as well, 2nd DD is dead, but I think that unlikely since it'll mean retreat damage for someone, or the loss of the 1st Hertak the following turn.
If the 2nd DD doesn't attack the Nordera, it should be safe. Their task is simply to be in the system to stop it being taken. And if the Hertak did attack, well, it would be the furthest thing in the World from a pointless death with us being able to avenge them by wiping out the Hertak.
Sitting alone in a front line system makes me feel uneasy. I expect at least one reinforcement fleet to come in either from the back or from Draco forcing me to run away next turn.
Just note that your fleet actions make it hard to get a fresh reinforcement fleet into Hydra out of or through Draco (with 2nd LSF inactive). I might have to do an uncovered retreat in addition to leaving the system alone.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: X3N0-Life-Form on August 19, 2013, 04:44:39 am
Regardless of what the 5th Cordi actually looks like, I'd love to pounce that Zy fleet, give Aldebaran some breathing space before the Fura'ngle comes in. With two fleets focusing their fire in Tauri, they could probably beat the crap out of the Zy there as well.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Flak on August 19, 2013, 05:17:02 am
At least good thing that the DD fleets are beginning to 'turn red'. And did the 1st CRF enjoyed killing the Fura'ngle a little too much?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 19, 2013, 07:33:56 am
Veers, why are you going to Aquarius? You do not need to. You can resupply in Vega.

Sitting alone in a front line system makes me feel uneasy. I expect at least one reinforcement fleet to come in either from the back or from Draco forcing me to run away next turn.
Just note that your fleet actions make it hard to get a fresh reinforcement fleet into Hydra out of or through Draco (with 2nd LSF inactive). I might have to do an uncovered retreat in addition to leaving the system alone.
The 2nd LSF will be on full strength next turn. If it becomes necessary, it can move in on it's first action, and cover your withdrawal on your second action.

On the promotion, you know what I'd take, morale. If you end up taking a heavy beating on low morale, that could be the end of you... don't forget, it not only will provide a permanant 1/1 boost, and protection from what I just said, but it also provides greater resistance to having your morale reduced (I think from the description.)

It is of course your choice.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on August 19, 2013, 07:55:42 am
While I appreciate the enthusiasm, I don't think you have to tell everyone what exactly to do and what to choose, Lorric.  :p
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 19, 2013, 08:03:25 am
While I appreciate the enthusiasm, I don't think you have to tell everyone what exactly to do and what to choose, Lorric.  :p
I don't. They can do whatever they want. I'm just trying to help. Discuss things. No one has had a problem with it so far, and we've done well so far.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on August 19, 2013, 08:38:53 am
I'm just sayin', if I was a player myself I would find it slightly annoying to have someone 'recommend' me every possible thing I might or might not do or pick.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 19, 2013, 08:46:30 am
I'm just sayin', if I was a player myself I would find it slightly annoying to have someone 'recommend' me every possible thing I might or might not do or pick.
I can see that. But I just want what's best for us all, to talk about our moves and our strategy. Surely, that's what we should be doing, planning, discussing the merits of moves. I can't tell anyone what to do. I understand and accept that the final word on their turn must be theirs. As I accepted the final word on the rules of your game must be yours. Everyone has been receptive to my advice so far. And if they take it, they haven't had their turn made for them, they are still making a decision of their own free will, their minds have processed the merits of the idea and accepted it. I want everyone to have the best experience possible, I want us to be a team and maybe even friends.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on August 19, 2013, 08:56:07 am
Hey Spoon, can you please confirm when I will be able to prepare barrage once more? I prepared it at turn 2.

And here's a scenario for you, let me know if I got this right:

I have barrage prepared now. If I double move, and get to Draco, I will be unable to attack. I will probably be attacked, though. When that happens, I will epend barrage for etra delicious damage. Right so far?

Now for the sake of argument, let us assume that I start my next turn in Draco (having just been attacked), with prepare barrage available (Let's say the Countdown just expired). Can I use my minor (first action) to prepare barrage again, and immediately attack with my major (second action) for extra terrible, terrible damage?

And @ Lorric: you suggested I stop at Vega and Defend. Is there any reason why I shouldn't double move to Draco? Are we planning to completely abandon the system? From what I gather, some fleets (1st DD, most notably) are bound to retreat, so doesn't it make sense to plug the holes in the front?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 19, 2013, 09:00:27 am
Hey Spoon, can you please confirm when I will be able to prepare barrage once more? I prepared it at turn 2.

And here's a scenario for you, let me know if I got this right:

I have barrage prepared now. If I double move, and get to Draco, I will be unable to attack. I will probably be attacked, though. When that happens, I will epend barrage for etra delicious damage. Right so far?

Now for the sake of argument, let us assume that I start my next turn in Draco (having just been attacked), with prepare barrage available (Let's say the Countdown just expired). Can I use my minor (first action) to prepare barrage again, and immediately attack with my major (second action) for extra terrible, terrible damage?

And @ Lorric: you suggested I stop at Vega and Defend. Is there any reason why I shouldn't double move to Draco? Are we planning to completely abandon the system? From what I gather, some fleets (1st DD, most notably) are bound to retreat, so doesn't it make sense to plug the holes in the front?
I'm pretty confident this question got asked and that you can't stack specials like that. You will of course be able to use it again straight after your first engagement.

Draco is going to be full if my suggestions are followed. There isn't room for you in the system, the max number of fleets from one side is 3, there will be 3 allied fleets attacking the Hertak.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on August 19, 2013, 09:14:42 am
Hey Spoon, can you please confirm when I will be able to prepare barrage once more? I prepared it at turn 2.
You prepared it for turn 3, regardless your barrage should be off cooldown on turn 5 and not 6. My mistake. It's been corrected.

And here's a scenario for you, let me know if I got this right:

I have barrage prepared now. If I double move, and get to Draco, I will be unable to attack. I will probably be attacked, though. When that happens, I will spend barrage for extra delicious damage. Right so far?
Yes

Now for the sake of argument, let us assume that I start my next turn in Draco (having just been attacked), with prepare barrage available (Let's say the Countdown just expired). Can I use my minor (first action) to prepare barrage again, and immediately attack with my major (second action) for extra terrible, terrible damage?
 
So one question:
When I use prepare barrage will it hold until the next fight no matter how many turns it takes? Is the cooldown still running during that time? If yes can I use it again after 3 turns and get 4+4 damage (like the zeal ability stacking)?
Once you've prepared the barrage there is indeed no limit on the amount of turns it takes to the next battle. And the cooldown starts its count down after you've prepared it. However you cannot stack multiple barrages for massive bonuses.

So for example you could use prepare barrage on turn 3, then have your next battle at turn 8. The ability has come off of cooldown in this time so you can immediately use prepare barrage again in the next turn. This works the same for the LSF's Combined Arms
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 19, 2013, 09:18:55 am
Spoon, while you're answering questions, if you please...

I’m just looking at my fleet in the latest post:

2nd CRF Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 17 (16+2+1)
- Capital attack strength: 17 (17+1)
- Fighters at 79% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 86% Strength
- Morale: Very High
- Zeal on Cooldown, Available again on Turn 7

I should have +2 for Very High morale, right? So should it be like this?

2nd CRF Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 18 (16+2+2)
- Capital attack strength: 18 (17+2)
- Fighters at 79% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 86% Strength
- Morale: Very High
- Zeal on Cooldown, Available again on Turn 7

And may we have intel on the 5th Cordi and 2nd Fura’ngle fleets?

And finally, what happens if the fighter strength is reduced to 0%? does damage start carrying over to Capital Strength then?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on August 19, 2013, 09:46:35 am
Hey Spoon, can you please confirm when I will be able to prepare barrage once more? I prepared it at turn 2.
You prepared it for turn 3, regardless your barrage should be off cooldown on turn 5 and not 6. My mistake. It's been corrected.

So I can use it on turn 5? And it does apply to same-turn attacks, if I use it before attacking?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Admiral MS on August 19, 2013, 10:02:59 am
The 2nd LSF will be on full strength next turn. If it becomes necessary, it can move in on it's first action, and cover your withdrawal on your second action.
If 2nd LSF gets any order this turn and next turn, else I'm alone.

About the promotion: Taking morale assumes I'm getting some heavy beating soon, same for resupply although this might be useful after one battle. Aggressive leader provides a 2/2 bonus that won't go away even under the worst attack. Now what will happen first - loss due to critical morale or due to zero fleet strength?
Why am I so indecisive? :D

So I can use it on turn 5? And it does apply to same-turn attacks, if I use it before attacking?
I used barrage as first order and attacked as second order for turn 2. You just have to use your already prepared barrage this turn so that it can be used again after turn 5.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 19, 2013, 10:09:57 am
If 2nd LSF gets any order this turn and next turn, else I'm alone.

About the promotion: Taking morale assumes I'm getting some heavy beating soon, same for resupply although this might be useful after one battle. Aggressive leader provides a 2/2 bonus that won't go away even under the worst attack. Now what will happen first - loss due to critical morale or due to zero fleet strength?
Why am I so indecisive? :D

I'l make some worst-case-scenario calculations for you soon then. And if necessary someone from Draco could step in instead.

On the spaecial, I'd take the morale one not only for the reasons I stated, but because damage is something that can be amplified with support from our other fleets, while morale, there is no protection from that that the rest of us can help with. You're already going to grow stronger with the addition of 3rd gen fighters, plus the 1/1 you'd get from the morale boost. Your damage output wil be pretty respectable with that, and the morale thing will clear away your only real weakness.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 19, 2013, 10:42:11 am
Right, so worst case scenario (barring a suicide attack from the Hertak) I believe would be the 1st Fura’ngle coming in to attack you together with the 1st Nordera.

2nd DD Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 15+8=23 (18+1)
- Capital attack strength: 15+8+4 (barrage) =27 (17+1)
- Fighters at 78% Strength, 2nd Gen (59dmg)
- Capital ships at 80% Strength (59dmg)
- Morale: High

vs.

1st Nordera Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 16+7=23 (10+2)
Capital attack strength: 13+8=21 (8+2)
Fighters at 136% Strength (12dmg)
Capital ships at 137% Strength (14dmg)

1st Fura'ngle Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 22+14=36 (16)
Capital attack strength: 27+11=38 (20)
Fighters at 136% Strength (12dmg)
Capital ships at 136% Strength (14dmg)
Morale: Normal

I think Spoon might round up these split damage scores.

Now I can tell without calculating an unprotected retreat would destroy you. But you know what this means, don’t you? Only the 3rd Nordera could attack our fleets in Draco. So they’d still be in good shape, so in they’d come to beat on the enemy and cover your retreat if the 2nd LSF doesn‘t move. You’re safe. But I’ve had a little pm exchange with Dragon now. He still intends to play the game, so hopefully he won’t miss the following turn.

The team is back together. :)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lepanto on August 19, 2013, 10:59:56 am
I'm just sayin', if I was a player myself I would find it slightly annoying to have someone 'recommend' me every possible thing I might or might not do or pick.

Well, in a strategic game like this, it's really helpful to have everyone following a unified plan. That requires having a leader to come up with the plan. Lorric's essentially volunteered to do this, and people have been willing to freely follow his suggestions and not complain about it.

In Hydra, I'd support having the 2nd DD hold the line until 2nd LSF can relieve them on the next turn. The enemy isn't stupid enough to move units back from Draco, with a damaged 1st Hertak and 3-4 fleets pressing them, to try and kill one fleet in a system that they can't hold.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 19, 2013, 11:09:03 am
Well, in a strategic game like this, it's really helpful to have everyone following a unified plan. That requires having a leader to come up with the plan. Lorric's essentially volunteered to do this, and people have been willing to freely follow his suggestions and not complain about it.
It's sort of just happened this way. :D

It would have been your turn last turn if we'd been able to follow your plan, I'll follow what I believe is the best plan. But hey, this way you get to personally get yourself a piece of the Hertak!  :nod:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: mobcdmoc3 on August 19, 2013, 11:44:33 am
So if I'm reading everything correctly, everybody in Draco wants to dogpile the 1st Hertak before they steamroll us all, correct? If that's so, then I'll get ready for the charge.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 19, 2013, 11:47:55 am
So if I'm reading everything correctly, everybody in Draco wants to dogpile the 1st Hertak before they steamroll us all, correct? If that's so, then I'll get ready for the charge.
That is correct. And it's going to look great on the video! :cool:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on August 19, 2013, 12:37:07 pm
So I can use it on turn 5? And it does apply to same-turn attacks, if I use it before attacking?
I used barrage as first order and attacked as second order for turn 2. You just have to use your already prepared barrage this turn so that it can be used again after turn 5.

And that is why I am jockeying to get a position in Draco. If I don't, we delay all barrage bonuses of the 3rd DD by a turn.  :blah:

On the other hand, if I double move, I'll have to receive attacks, and not target specific enemies. Which might be problematic (let's say the Hertak target someone else, and I 'waste' the barrage on the Nordies). If, on the other hand, I wait and rotate one of the damaged fleets out, I can hit with a targeted barrage two times in a row (on turns 6 and 7), and knock some heads together. I'll have the benefit of 3rd gen fighters on both attacks as well.  :drevil:

So, on second thought, yeah, Vega looks good for the moment. Don't hesitate to retreat there when the Hertak & Co. have kicked you around for a bit.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 19, 2013, 12:59:23 pm
He he, you're itching for a fight, Enioch!

Don't worry. I think you'll get one on the turn after this one. :nod:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: SpardaSon21 on August 19, 2013, 01:23:13 pm
We have Droid!, We have Droid!

I declare total Victory under our Elf-Overlords. :D

That came out in my head in a sing-song type way. Interesting... Welcome Aboard Droid803!
I for one welcome our new space elf overlords!
Called it!
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Droid803 on August 19, 2013, 02:08:20 pm
Oh no, I've been discovered.
And also I was too slow/lazy picking a name D:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: mobcdmoc3 on August 19, 2013, 03:58:59 pm
I feel like there's a good chance I'm going to get one-hit-killed by these three fleets in Draco if they all shoot at me. :sigh: Is anybody planning on helping? I understand that I have to stay in order to cover the retreat of the 1st CRF and the 1st DD (if both intend to retreat), so that just leaves me here by myself.

Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Admiral MS on August 19, 2013, 04:16:02 pm
I feel like there's a good chance I'm going to get one-hit-killed by these three fleets in Draco if they all shoot at me. :sigh: Is anybody planning on helping? I understand that I have to stay in order to cover the retreat of the 1st CRF and the 1st DD (if both intend to retreat), so that just leaves me here by myself.
4th CRF and 3rd CRF should come to Draco to replace 1st CRF and 1st DD and attack the Hertak so there will be again 3 fleets in the system.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on August 19, 2013, 05:12:38 pm
I'm just sayin', if I was a player myself I would find it slightly annoying to have someone 'recommend' me every possible thing I might or might not do or pick.

Well, in a strategic game like this, it's really helpful to have everyone following a unified plan. That requires having a leader to come up with the plan. Lorric's essentially volunteered to do this, and people have been willing to freely follow his suggestions and not complain about it.

OK then - I won't be a silent minority any longer.  I'm finding it slightly annoying.  Lorric, can you please present your plans more as suggestions/discussion points than orders?  Could you please also not interpret this as a personal attack? I have a problem with the behaviour, not the person.  Also, your plans so far have been good. I'm just concerned about you coming up with a plan that I don't agree with.

Lepanto - except for the bolded part, I agree with your post.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 19, 2013, 05:29:46 pm
I'm just sayin', if I was a player myself I would find it slightly annoying to have someone 'recommend' me every possible thing I might or might not do or pick.

Well, in a strategic game like this, it's really helpful to have everyone following a unified plan. That requires having a leader to come up with the plan. Lorric's essentially volunteered to do this, and people have been willing to freely follow his suggestions and not complain about it.

OK then - I won't be a silent minority any longer.  I'm finding it slightly annoying.  Lorric, can you please present your plans more as suggestions/discussion points than orders?  Could you please also not interpret this as a personal attack? I have a problem with the behaviour, not the person.  Also, your plans so far have been good. I'm just concerned about you coming up with a plan that I don't agree with.

Lepanto - except for the bolded part, I agree with your post.
You surprise me. Truly, of everyone outside Lepanto if I'd been asked to identify someone who had a problem with this I'd have gone through each and every one of the other players first until your name was the only one left. I thought we'd been chatting pleasantly about such things. I have been trying hard not to come across as giving orders, so I don't know what you want me to do, or why you have a problem. Especially if you like my plans.

If I come up with a plan you don't agree with, we should just discuss it.

I have thought about the possibilities. If people don't like one of my plans then it won't get followed, it'll be simple as that. If there are two conflicting plans, I would think there should be a vote, and the plan that wins that vote should be followed. Everyone working to a plan rather than as individuals is best if you ask me, so I'd go along with the other plan if my plan was voted down. If most people are following a plan, surely it would be best for the remaining others to follow it too.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on August 19, 2013, 09:52:51 pm
alright, I'll PM you, no need to clutter the thread with this.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: AndrewofDoom on August 19, 2013, 11:25:27 pm
Since the very top half is being hammered by four armed blue skinned wannabes, I'm going to move up there to assist the 1st SF and yadda yadda yadda.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Admiral MS on August 20, 2013, 12:56:15 am
Since the very top half is being hammered by four armed blue skinned wannabes, I'm going to move up there to assist the 1st SF and yadda yadda yadda.
In the game thread you got the wrong fleet in your post (2nd LSF instead of 1st UGCR).
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: AndrewofDoom on August 20, 2013, 10:05:42 am
Ah, the joys of copy and paste errors. :p
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on August 20, 2013, 05:11:40 pm
I feel like I should probably give you all fair warning that the Hierarchy is going to be activately aiming to kill off your fleets starting next turn.
Better start writing those last wills.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 20, 2013, 05:21:05 pm
I feel like I should probably give you all fair warning that the Hierarchy is going to be activately aiming to kill off your fleets starting next turn.
Better start writing those last wills.
Do we have any sort of protection? Can 100% fleets die?

Now might be a good time to tell us how the fleet restoration works.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Jellyfish on August 20, 2013, 08:18:08 pm
I feel like I should probably give you all fair warning that the Hierarchy is going to be activately aiming to kill off your fleets starting next turn.
Better start writing those last wills.
I think they've made decent attempts so far.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: An4ximandros on August 20, 2013, 08:27:35 pm
The Hertak are coming? You will soon die. Make whatever rituals are necessary for your species.


Spoon, if you don't mind me asking. What exactly inspired you to make the game?

And would you mind ripoffs derivatives based on this? :nervous:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Flak on August 20, 2013, 08:53:12 pm
I feel like I should probably give you all fair warning that the Hierarchy is going to be activately aiming to kill off your fleets starting next turn.
Better start writing those last wills.

SOMEBODY SET US UP THE BOMB! ALL YOUR BASE ARE BELONG TO US! YOU HAVE NO CHANCE TO SURVIVE MAKE YOUR TIME!
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on August 20, 2013, 09:18:52 pm
I feel like I should probably give you all fair warning that the Hierarchy is going to be activately aiming to kill off your fleets starting next turn.
Better start writing those last wills.
I think they've made decent attempts so far.

Well, the 1st Hertak + 3rd Nordera + 1st Fura'ngle could have annihilated one of the 1st DD / 1st CRF / 3rd SF last turn if they had wanted to...

edit: Gah - the 1st Hertak + 1st 1st Fura'ngle could have done it by themselves  :shaking:  (eliminated all capships, if not all fighters, maybe the Admiral could get away in a Caliburn or something)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on August 21, 2013, 08:57:55 am
The Hertak are coming? You will soon die. Make whatever rituals are necessary for your species.


Spoon, if you don't mind me asking. What exactly inspired you to make the game?

And would you mind ripoffs derivatives based on this? :nervous:
Nothing in particular inspired me, I've been playing with this idea in my mind for some time now. But I either didnt had the audience or I couldnt get the mechanics right.
And go ahead and rip this off to your hearts contend.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on August 21, 2013, 06:17:58 pm
Second turn video up at last: http://youtu.be/6IJ8v-wia-4
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on August 21, 2013, 06:48:10 pm
very cool, I especially liked the 1st person POV in the 3rd section :) :yes:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 21, 2013, 06:51:39 pm
Second turn video up at last: http://youtu.be/6IJ8v-wia-4
Hmmm, so what was the hold up, was it more trouble with the Rhino? Badass ship by the way, so much firepower, it crushed that mothership. I wonder how it does against fighters, is it primarily an anti-capship ship?

Anyway, congratulations on getting it out at last and displaying the power of the Rhino. Looking forward to the next one! :cool:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Rodo on August 21, 2013, 08:05:02 pm
Awesome vids Spoon, I'm following this thread for the bling bling :yes:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Droid803 on August 22, 2013, 01:36:04 am
Nice.
So uh...which ship is the Rhino (I presume it is mod. Baikal).
If so, I understand the troubles getting it to work - they're mostly my (and PCS2's) fault, something about zero-radius subsystems and the missile launchers that don't like to cooperate. (and me being too much of an utter failure to discover and fix it)

Also,

Requesting formal naming of my admiral "Freyalis Elsperth Almereya" (you have no idea how long I took to keyboard-roll out a space-elfy name!)
Requesting formal renaming of my flagship from the current placeholder to Ataraxia.

:nervous:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on August 22, 2013, 02:10:53 am
Question, does your character have a cool costume or just a military uniform?

:)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Droid803 on August 22, 2013, 02:16:00 am
Whichever it is, it's all glittery, silver, and fabulous.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 22, 2013, 02:23:32 am
Whichever it is, it's all glittery, silver, and fabulous.
So then, are you a "normal" player (with a badass fleet) like the rest of us, or have you and Spoon cooked something up between you? You obviously had this planned out in advance.

Also, for what it's worth, I actually thought Dimensional Eclipse was a good name, I know it's your mod, but I thought it still sounded Cyrvan-ey. Maybe it could be a ship in your fleet.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: X3N0-Life-Form on August 22, 2013, 04:59:43 am
OK, I've got a gameplay question:
Fleet: 2nd UGCR
First action: major, engage 2nd Zy
Second action: minor, move to Virgo
Since that fleet is moving out of the Aldebaran system with its second action, and is the only one doing so this turn, that means I can't go into the system as my first action due to the 3-fleets-in-one-system limit, correct?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on August 22, 2013, 05:06:46 am
I can move to Formaulhaut instead if it helps.  And which of the other fleets are ending their turn in Virgo?

derp - reading comprehension fail.

I think the other two fleets plan to move to Tauri, and one of then has issued the order (2nd CRF) as it's 1st action.  So you should be fine to move in.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 22, 2013, 05:12:41 am
OK, I've got a gameplay question:
Fleet: 2nd UGCR
First action: major, engage 2nd Zy
Second action: minor, move to Virgo
Since that fleet is moving out of the Aldebaran system with its second action, and is the only one doing so this turn, that means I can't go into the system as my first action due to the 3-fleets-in-one-system limit, correct?
I am leaving too:

Fleet: 2nd CRF
First action: Minor, Travel to Tauri
Second Action: Major, Engage 3rd Cordi Fleet
I am also hoping the 1st LSF will join me and the 4th SF in destroying the 3rd Cordi:

Fleet: 4th SF
First action: minor, move to Tauri
Second action: major, engage 3rd Cordi Fleet
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: X3N0-Life-Form on August 22, 2013, 05:16:11 am
Ok, thanks for clearing that up. I scrolled down a bit too much and missed Lorric's move :P

Alright then, let's blast some Zy. RP will follow within the next few hours, depending on how busy I am.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 22, 2013, 05:21:17 am
Ok, thanks for clearing that up. I scrolled down a bit too much and missed Lorric's move :P

Alright then, let's blast some Zy. RP will follow within the next few hours, depending on how busy I am.
Excellent. :)

If the Zy conquer us, do you think they'll be interested in this product?

(http://www.savvyskin.com/pics/blue-lizard.jpg)

Lizards do do a lot of basking in the sun after all... :nod:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Flak on August 22, 2013, 11:37:05 am
Unlike us, they need the heat rather than anything else, they are cold blooded afterall.  I don't think they are interested in suntanning, so that might as well work. I assume their ships have some kind of heater to compensate for their heat needs.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on August 22, 2013, 11:52:48 am
Nice.
So uh...which ship is the Rhino (I presume it is mod. Baikal).
If so, I understand the troubles getting it to work - they're mostly my (and PCS2's) fault, something about zero-radius subsystems and the missile launchers that don't like to cooperate. (and me being too much of an utter failure to discover and fix it)

Also,

Requesting formal naming of my admiral "Freyalis Elsperth Almereya" (you have no idea how long I took to keyboard-roll out a space-elfy name!)
Requesting formal renaming of my flagship from the current placeholder to Ataraxia.

:nervous:
Yeah its the Baikal, tho' with a shield mesh and a somewhat different turret layout (but you noticed that already).
The missile launchers were indeed kind of a pita, the "wait for animation" flag seemingly does nothing and the doors wanted to close again right the moment the missile had left the bay. It took a lot of fiddling and trial and error.

Unlike us, they need the heat rather than anything else, they are cold blooded afterall.  I don't think they are interested in suntanning, so that might as well work. I assume their ships have some kind of heater to compensate for their heat needs.
I now can't shake this image of a group of Zy all bunched up around this one small heater, shivering.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 22, 2013, 12:01:33 pm
I now can't shake this image of a group of Zy all bunched up around this one small heater, shivering.
Don't shake it, make it! :lol:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Admiral MS on August 22, 2013, 12:02:22 pm
AdmiralRalwood, Admiral MS lemme know here what traits you wanna pick for your promotion (Both of you have admiral in your name, it seemed fitting)
Made my decision: I will be an Inspirational leader. With the Hierarchy now really aiming to destroy our fleets I can expect some heavy moral shocks that otherwise might prove disastrous.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 22, 2013, 12:52:13 pm
Hey everyone. I’m back. :)

I wish to begin with something very important:
Fleet: 1st UGCR
First action: Major, Resupply
Second Action: Minor, Travel to Polaris
Andrew, I’ve seen the post you made, you want to support Tauri. But there is plenty of support heading to Tauri:
Fleet: 2nd CRF
First action: Minor, Travel to Tauri
Second Action: Major, Engage 3rd Cordi Fleet
Fleet: 4th SF
First action: minor, move to Tauri
Second action: major, engage 3rd Cordi Fleet
I am also hoping the 1st LSF under SpardaSon21 will join me and the 4th SF in destroying the 3rd Cordi. The cordi will die if all three of us engage.

Andrew, regardless of what you do, you do not need to skirt all the way around the back. You can pass straight through Alderbaran to get to Tauri and vice-versa.

What I would advise is to stay where you are and resupply and then re-hire your mercs. Then next turn you’ll be able to enter Aldebaran pretty close to full strength and make an impact.

Oh, and here I can see an opportunity to make a slight improvement:
Fleet: 3rd SF
First Action: Major - Attack 1st Hertak Fleet
Second Action: Minor - N/A
The turn will end with three fleets in Draco and one fleet in Hydra. You could use that second action to go to Hydra.

Alright, next, here’s something I’ve noticed:
Fleet: 1st SF
First Action: None
Second Action: Minor, Travel to Librae
DJ has outsmarted me here, and I’m glad he did. I would have had him flee on the first turn and Resupply, thinking the 3rd Cordi would be out of the picture and he’d survive a hit from the 1st Zy. But the 3rd Cordi will be destroyed on the second action, so would have got it’s shot in on the first and together with the 1st Zy would have destroyed him. So I’m very glad he did this, as I don’t feel confident that I would have noticed on my own. So well done DJ! Living up to that Commander moniker! :)

And finally I am most pleased to see that the Hertak attack is now go. WoD is full of scenes of the Hertak destroying our vessels. I can’t wait to see the footage of the boot being on the other foot! Hertak Armageddons exploding under our combined firepower, it’s going to be glorious! :nod:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Jellyfish on August 22, 2013, 01:53:16 pm
Only one Cyrvan fleet joins the fight? Who gives Droid his messages (promotions, next gen reinforcements and the like), Yaiceca?
Also, can we get a list of the Cyrvan ships making the fleet?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 22, 2013, 01:57:50 pm
Only one Cyrvan fleet joins the fight? Who gives Droid his messages (promotions, next gen reinforcements and the like), Yaiceca?
Also, can we get a list of the Cyrvan ships making the fleet?
I'm thinking it must be Yaiceca now. Yaiceca is like those girls that talk to us methinks. I don't think she's with Droid's fleet.

I'm surprised we have any Cyrvan fleets. All the Cyrvans went home in WoD. But Spoon and Droid sprang this on us. Who knows who might show up later on...
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 23, 2013, 01:17:49 pm
I am sorry everyone. :(

I have just realised I made a pretty big mistake.

Remember this:
Alright, next, here’s something I’ve noticed:
Fleet: 1st SF
First Action: None
Second Action: Minor, Travel to Librae
DJ has outsmarted me here, and I’m glad he did. I would have had him flee on the first turn and Resupply, thinking the 3rd Cordi would be out of the picture and he’d survive a hit from the 1st Zy. But the 3rd Cordi will be destroyed on the second action, so would have got it’s shot in on the first and together with the 1st Zy would have destroyed him. So I’m very glad he did this, as I don’t feel confident that I would have noticed on my own. So well done DJ! Living up to that Commander moniker! :)
Now this is good, it's preserved his fleet.

But it means we can't kill the 3rd Cordi, because he has to leave on his second action, and that means the three of us attacking the Cordi can't move in on the first...  :(

So the best we can do is smack up the 3rd Cordi and 2nd Zy.

Maybe switching from the 3rd Cordi to the first Zy would be a better move, I'm not sure, but it's probably too late to find out and then try to make it happen. So all I can say is I'm sorry.

EDIT: But that doesn't mean I'm not going to try.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 23, 2013, 01:41:38 pm
Calculations made. It's too dangerous for me and Jellyfish to attack the 1st Zy. Attacking the Cordi is best. Switching to the Zy, I think we could survive the strongest possible return attack, but Jellyfish, with a slightly weaker capital strength than me could be reduced to 3% capital strength. That's too small a margin if my calculations are off. We'll be safer attacking the Cordi.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on August 24, 2013, 04:55:28 pm
Something came up, next turn post will probably be on monday instead of sunday
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 24, 2013, 05:10:30 pm
Something came up, next turn post will probably be on monday instead of sunday
Oh well, thanks for the heads up. Good luck with whatever it is.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 25, 2013, 04:03:36 pm
Spoon, do you have any idea how many fighters/fighter squadrons do you think would be attached to a fleet? In the RP thread, I noticed Lepanto has given himself a lot of squadrons. I wish to match his post, maybe it's not a lot, but I would have thought no more than 10 squadrons just guessing. There aren't many fighters floating around in your vids. I gave myself 30 capital ships because you said 30. At least I think you did. You said 50 for a very large fleet, I know that. And if a 150% fleet was 50, 30 would be close for a 100% one. Though I actually did 31 including my flagship.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Flak on August 25, 2013, 11:42:44 pm
Seeing Stranded, a Champion carries around one or two squadrons, maybe three but there are probably more they haven't launched. Each squadron has up to 24 fighters, that means around 6 wings, though probably less. The Guardian Angel carries just one. I assume the Lord carry less since it is a battleship rather than a carrier. However, I believe the fleet flagship is not the only carrier the fleet. I am not sure, but if the list is correct, the UGC's Rhino cruiser also carry fighters on its own, probably just 1-2 wings like the Diomedes in Blue planet.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on August 26, 2013, 02:31:21 pm
Seeing as I'm feeling a little under the weather (again) its not gonna be today either.
Sorries.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on August 26, 2013, 05:06:02 pm
'null perspiration chummer :)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on August 30, 2013, 08:03:09 am
(http://img855.imageshack.us/img855/8774/kiof.jpg)
Ha Ha
Reusing old Meme's. I'm so witty.

So yeah, past week I've learned a lot about bowel movement/cramp/constipation and the associated nausea/headache/lackofgoodsleep. And as a result my productivity was reduced to freezing point. (I've taken it as an opportunity to begin watching outlaw star) I will of course strive to not let this happen again. 

So again I offer my apologies orz
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 30, 2013, 08:16:17 am
I'm just glad you're alright. I was getting worried about you, but it was a different illness. I was worried that it was the same one as before, the one which put you unconscious, in which case it would have really made me think it was something serious for it to still be there, especially if you rarely get sick.

Perhaps this was just an opportunistic infection or something coming in and taking advantage of your weakened immune system from it's previous battle.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on August 30, 2013, 08:28:42 am
Whoo! Outlaw Star. I should throw that in my dvd player at some point, only been sitting on the shelf for.. months. :/

Take a forum holiday every 14 days, for a period of a minimum 7 days. I'm sure you can find a doctor to prescribe it. :)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on August 30, 2013, 08:30:06 am
Take a forum holiday every 14 days, for a period of a minimum 7 days. I'm sure you can find a doctor to prescribe it. :)
Noooo...  :D
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on August 30, 2013, 08:34:59 am
I'm no doctor, probably got the figures wrong.

Also did not account for Moe or blue & pink hair, sorry about that :P
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on September 01, 2013, 05:51:08 pm
Rear Admiral John Harkness. Thou Fleet has been bested. Though the soldiers under thy command fought valiantly.
Does thou wish to continue?
Yes / No

If yes, your admiral will have made it to the life pods and lives to fight an other day. A new fleet will be constructed at the cost of 50 resources. But it will take some time before it gets ready.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 01, 2013, 06:08:04 pm
Our brothers and sisters from the 3rd CRF will be avenged.

The 1st Hertak will be exterminated for their blatant arrogance. I'm shocked their morale didn't drop from the severe beating we administered.

The stats of the Cyrvan fleet, at least to me, are a severe disappointment. They're about as good as the Zy and don't have a special. I thought they'd rival the Hertak.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lepanto on September 01, 2013, 07:06:18 pm
Ouch. As bad as things look to the south right now, I think we need to press the attack and kill the 1st Hertak. If we don't blunt their offensive, they'll keep munching on our fleets. The 4th CRF's still in the fight; one round of shooting by us and one other fleet should take them down. Who's with me?  :cool:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 01, 2013, 07:45:47 pm
Ouch. As bad as things look to the south right now, I think we need to press the attack and kill the 1st Hertak. If we don't blunt their offensive, they'll keep munching on our fleets. The 4th CRF's still in the fight; one round of shooting by us and one other fleet should take them down. Who's with me?  :cool:
The 3rd DD and only the 3rd DD should engage the 1st Hertak, because the 3rd DD and only the 3rd DD has exactly enough strength to destroy the 1st Hertak all by itself. What an introduction that will be for the only fleet (besides the Cyrvans) that hasn't engaged yet. See:

3rd DD Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 17+8=25 (18-1)
- Capital attack strength: 16+9+4 barrage = 29 (17-1)
- Fighters at 100% Strength, 2nd Gen
- Capital ships at 100% Strength
- Morale: Low

vs.

1st Hertak Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 7+5=12 (22)
Capital attack strength: 9+4=13 (30)
Fighters at 32% Strength
Capital ships at 29% Strength
Morale: Normal



I also would advise another Hertak dogpile, like so:

2nd LSF Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 22+8=30 (19+2+1)
- Capital attack strength: 15+11=26 (14+1)
- Fighters at 100% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 100% Strength
- Morale: High

2nd DD Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 16+8=24 (18+2+2)
- Capital attack strength: 16+8=24 (17+2)
- Fighters at 78% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 80% Strength
- Morale: Very High
- Barrage on Cooldown, Available again on Turn 8
- Inspirational Leader

3rd SF Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 17+8=25 (18+2+1)
- Capital attack strength: 15+9=24 (18+1)
- Fighters at 75% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 76% Strength
- Morale: High

vs.

2nd Hertak Fleet
Fighter attack strength: 22+15=37 (22)
Capital attack strength: 30+11=41 (30)
- Fighters at 100% Strength
- Capital ships at 100% Strength
Morale: Normal

Total damage inflicted:
Fighters - 79
Capital ships - 74

Total damage received per allied fleet:
Fighters - 12/12/13
Capital ships - 13/14/14



Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: AndrewofDoom on September 01, 2013, 09:39:45 pm
Since I was a derp and was lazy, I'm a bad spot now.

<snip>

[Scary sacrifices are going to be needed if you guys decide to attack the 1st Hertak. Mainly from the counterattack from the other enemy fleets. Remember the goal of a navy is to preserve your fleet.

I'll be making my way south since the north end looks like it's holding for now.

Edit: I misread the map.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 01, 2013, 09:47:04 pm
Since I was a derp and was lazy, I'm a bad spot now.

<snip>

Scary sacrifices are going to be needed if you guys decide to attack the 2nd Hertak. Mainly from the counterattack from the other enemy fleets. Remember the goal of a navy is to preserve your fleet.

I'll be making my way south since the north end looks like it's holding for now.
Ah that's nice. With you putting your move in first, I thought you were going to just do your own thing and ignore any advice.

More advice, you're 100/83 right now. Maybe it would be better to use mercs instead of resupply. That 17% you'd pick up for resupplying will be pretty negligible then, and you'll be in a position to strike hard into Aldebaran the turn after this one at 175/137.

I'll run the numbers probably at some point, but I'm thinking it will be impossible not to lose somebody else next turn, just as it was impossible not to lose someone this turn If the Hertak are not attacked, then they will attack somebody anyway and obliterate them with help from other fleets.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Jellyfish on September 01, 2013, 10:26:32 pm
Things are looking up in Tauri. How about the 1st SF comes back and we all attack the 1st Zy? That should do somethinng, maybe even make them retreat.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 01, 2013, 11:04:22 pm
Things are looking up in Tauri. How about the 1st SF comes back and we all attack the 1st Zy? That should do somethinng, maybe even make them retreat.
I am unsure right now how to proceed at the top. I think I'll need to sleep on it.

But the 1st SF is in no condition to fight:

1st SF Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 4 (18+2-1)
- Capital attack strength: 4 (18-1)
- Fighters at 14% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 26% Strength
- Morale: Low

Neither is the 2nd:

2nd SF Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 9 (18+2)
- Capital attack strength: 8 (18)
- Fighters at 41% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 43% Strength
- Morale: Normal

You and I are exactly the same for strength and damage stats funnily enough:

4th SF Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 15 (18+2)
- Capital attack strength: 13 (18)
- Fighters at 71% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 72% Strength
- Morale: Normal

2nd CRF Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 15 (16+2+2)
- Capital attack strength: 13 (17+2)
- Fighters at 71% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 72% Strength
- Morale: Very High
- Zeal on Cooldown, Available again on Turn 7
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: AdmiralRalwood on September 02, 2013, 12:37:55 am
Ouch. As bad as things look to the south right now, I think we need to press the attack and kill the 1st Hertak. If we don't blunt their offensive, they'll keep munching on our fleets. The 4th CRF's still in the fight; one round of shooting by us and one other fleet should take them down. Who's with me?  :cool:
The 3rd DD and only the 3rd DD should engage the 1st Hertak, because the 3rd DD and only the 3rd DD has exactly enough strength to destroy the 1st Hertak all by itself. What an introduction that will be for the only fleet (besides the Cyrvans) that hasn't engaged yet. See:

3rd DD Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 17+8=25 (18-1)
- Capital attack strength: 16+9+4 barrage = 29 (17-1)
- Fighters at 100% Strength, 2nd Gen
- Capital ships at 100% Strength
- Morale: Low

vs.

1st Hertak Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 7+5=12 (22)
Capital attack strength: 9+4=13 (30)
Fighters at 32% Strength
Capital ships at 29% Strength
Morale: Normal
That looks like a good plan; if Enioch gives his orders before the deadline, I'll switch my target to the 1st Fura'ngle.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: CommanderDJ on September 02, 2013, 01:10:57 am
Things are looking up in Tauri. How about the 1st SF comes back and we all attack the 1st Zy? That should do somethinng, maybe even make them retreat.
I am unsure right now how to proceed at the top. I think I'll need to sleep on it.

But the 1st SF is in no condition to fight:

1st SF Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 4 (18+2-1)
- Capital attack strength: 4 (18-1)
- Fighters at 14% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 26% Strength
- Morale: Low

Neither is the 2nd:

2nd SF Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 9 (18+2)
- Capital attack strength: 8 (18)
- Fighters at 41% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 43% Strength
- Morale: Normal

You and I are exactly the same for strength and damage stats funnily enough:

4th SF Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 15 (18+2)
- Capital attack strength: 13 (18)
- Fighters at 71% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 72% Strength
- Morale: Normal

2nd CRF Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 15 (16+2+2)
- Capital attack strength: 13 (17+2)
- Fighters at 71% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 72% Strength
- Morale: Very High
- Zeal on Cooldown, Available again on Turn 7

Yeah, the 1st SF definitely needs to resupply. At the end of this turn provided no unpleasant surprises occur I'll be back up to almost full strength and I'll be able to rejoin the fray.

Also, condolences to the 3rd CRF, our first fleet lost!
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on September 02, 2013, 02:24:03 am
That looks like a good plan; if Enioch gives his orders before the deadline, I'll switch my target to the 1st Fura'ngle.

Done. Feel free to change targets.

Spoon, about the 2nd Hertak, do we have any intel on its strength? That is, do the Hertak follow the same tactics as all the other fleets, and their 1st fleet is 150% and all the others 100%?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Flak on September 02, 2013, 02:58:56 am
The 2nd Fura'ngle fleet is already demoralized. I wonder what happen if we focus fire on them while sending out YOU HAVE NO CHANCE TO SURVIVE MAKE YOUR TIME message.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 02, 2013, 07:01:08 pm
After much deliberation, I’ve come to the conclusion that we must allow the 1st Zy to Secure Tauri this turn. It’s too dangerous to fight, the combined power of the 3 enemy fleets remaining on the front is enough to take someone out.

So instead, I recommend me and Jellyfish (2nd CRF + 4th SF) pull back, joining the 1st SF. There we will recover, and concentrate those 3 fleets into an iron fist with which to strike the enemy hard back into Tauri next turn. It will be a similar move to the one where Draco was conquered temporarily by the hierarchy. Emphasis on temporarily.

Taking Tauri will actually put a burden on the hierarchy that one turn. They don’t have the power to press the attack and chase us, and if the 1st Zy leaves Tauri without taking it, it flips over to “friendly” and can’t be re-entered. I imagine the 1st Zy will conquer the system and Resupply. (actually, I don't think they can resupply, it will be a broken supply line back to heirarchy space.)

The forces in Aldebaran should be safe from a triple team. Though the 1st LSF can survive one anyway. Have the 1st LSF cover the retreat of the 2nd SF. They can stay put and stall the enemy while the 2nd SF Resupplies and niffiwan with the 2nd UGCR Resupplies and mercs.

Andrew, please don’t go South. And please don't Resupply. I would like you to get mercs this turn, switch your first action to your special, so that we’ll have another set of fleets concentrated into a fist to strike the enemy in Aldebaran next turn. Two merced-up fleets will devastate the hierarchy. If we can crush the enemy here and shove them back, we may then be able to free someone to go down South after that.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 02, 2013, 09:05:25 pm
Alright, here’s what that Fura’ngle attack will look like:

4th CRF Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 18+8=26 (16+2+1)
- Capital attack strength: 15+9=24 (17+1)
- Fighters at 96% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 83% Strength
- Morale: High
- Zeal on Cooldown, Available again on Turn 6

1st DD Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 17+6=23 (18+2+1)
- Capital attack strength: 11+9=20 (17+1)
- Fighters at 73% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 61% Strength
- Morale: High
- Barrage on Cooldown, Available again on Turn 6
- Inspirational Leader

vs.

1st Fura'ngle Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 20+13=33 (16)
Capital attack strength: 26+10=36 (20)
Fighters at 128% Strength
Capital ships at 128% Strength
Morale: Normal

End
4th CRF Fleet:
- Fighters at 79% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 65% Strength

1st DD Fleet:
- Fighters at 56% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 43% Strength

vs.

1st Fura'ngle Fleet:
Fighters at 79% Strength
Capital ships at 84% Strength

You know, I think we might all just survive the turn, if the 2nd Hertak don't go and suicide-kill like the 1st Hertak did. The 1st Nordera would have to cover the retreat of the Hertak if they flee, and the 3rd Nordera can only muster up 15 capship damage with the weakened Fura'ngle hitting for maybe about 24, which is a high estimate. That'll fall just short of killing the 1st DD.

EDIT: I think I've talked about everyone now, but for our newly arrived space elf Cyrvan friends. On that, I am of the firm opinion this fleet needs to get into the battle as quickly as possible. A move to Tamy, then to Odin would put the Cyrvans in a position to engage the enemy the turn after this one by moving into Hydra and attacking.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: AdmiralRalwood on September 03, 2013, 12:28:42 am
Fleet: 4th CRF

Minor, do nothing

Major, attack 1st Fura'ngle
Are you sure you want to perform your actions in that order? If you attack as your second action, that gives them time to hit you first, if they choose to.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Flak on September 03, 2013, 12:41:59 am
No, they will only move after the player move in that turn. He just want to make sure that they hit the enemy together.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lepanto on September 03, 2013, 01:02:01 am
No, they will only move after the player move in that turn. He just want to make sure that they hit the enemy together.

Yup.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on September 03, 2013, 04:14:23 am
BTW, is there a reason why we try to hit the enemy together? Does it somehow improve our damage output? Because it definitely increases the damage we take. Consider this:

If Fleets A and B want to attack fleet C, what is the best way to do so?

If both fleets (A & B) attack Fleet C with their first action, does the damage done by Fleet C get 'spread out' between the two fleets? (If I study the battle results, I am sure I can figure this out, but I'm not gonna bother, if I can ask Spoon). In other words, does Fleet C take damage equal to (Fleet A Damage)+(Fleet B Damage), while Fleet A and B take damage equal to (Fleet C Damage)/2? If so, all fine and dandy, and it makes sense to attack together.

However, if, in the above example, fleets A and B take damage equal to (Fleet C damage), then attacking together is a mistake. If Fleet A attacks with its first action, while Fleet B attacks with its second, then they will deal the same damage (Fleet A +Fleet B). But Fleet B will take less damage, since Fleet A will have already damaged Fleet C. Essentially, Fleet A will take (Fleet C) damage, while Fleet B will take (Weakened Fleet C) Damage.

Does this make sense to you? Spoon, help us out here!
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on September 03, 2013, 04:43:56 am
I don't think it matters what order we attack the enemy.  Last turn, the 2nd UGCR attacked the 2nd Zy 1st, while 1st LSF & 2nd SF attacked 2nd.  The damage dealt to us was 1/3 each of what the 2nd Zy could inflict, i.e. 30/29 became 10/10 each (note that combined arms for the 1st LSF reduced the damage to 8/8 for them).

Code: [Select]
Aldebaran, 1st LSF, 2nd SF and 2nd UGCR vs 2nd Zy

1st LSF Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 25+8+1 = 34
Capital attack strength: 15+13+1 = 29
Fighters at 96% Strength, 4th Gen
Capital ships at 100% Strength
Morale: High

2nd SF Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 20+9 = 29
Capital attack strength: 18+10 = 28
Fighters at 100% Strength, 3rd Gen
Capital ships at 100% Strength
Morale: Normal

2nd UGCR Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 14+7 = 21
Capital attack strength: 14+7 = 21
Fighters at 95% Strength, 3rd Gen
Capital ships at 96% Strength
Morale: Normal

2nd Zy Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 20+10 = 30
Capital attack strength: 19+10 = 29
Fighters at 90% Strength
Capital ships at 91% Strength
Morale: High

End strength:
1st LSF Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 23 (19+5+1)
Capital attack strength: 14 (14+1)
Fighters at 88% Strength, 4th Gen
Capital ships at 92% Strength
Morale: High

2nd SF Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 18 (18+2)
Capital attack strength: 16 (18)
Fighters at 90% Strength, 3rd Gen
Capital ships at 90% Strength
Morale: Normal

2nd UGCR Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 13 (13+2)
Capital attack strength: 13 (15)
Fighters at 85% Strength, 3rd Gen
Capital ships at 86% Strength
Morale: Normal

2nd Zy Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 1 (21+1)
Capital attack strength: 3 (20+1)
Fighters at 6% Strength
Capital ships at 13% Strength
Morale: Normal
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on September 03, 2013, 07:44:24 am
In that case, it is indeed better to concentrate fire, but it seems that all attacks happen at the same 'time', no matter the action (1st or 2nd) used.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 03, 2013, 08:35:35 am
Yes, I can add further confirmation on that, as it stuck in my mind when it happened with me once. When I teamed with two other fleets to destroy the 1st Cordi, they attacked first, but I had to jump into the system, so my attack came 2nd, so I thought they'd end up taking all the damage, but it was spread equally between all 3 of us. And this is a good thing! :D

EDIT: Lepanto, it might be a good idea to switch the attack to your first action, then leave the system on your second action. Then you'll be a step closer to recovery. And you can always come back into the system and attack next turn if recovery isn't the best option.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Droid803 on September 03, 2013, 09:06:43 pm
Right, which front do you need me on? I'm just gonna move up to (age of) Aquarius for easy access to both sides if there's no specific urgency.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 03, 2013, 09:19:06 pm
Right, which front do you need me on? I'm just gonna move up to (age of) Aquarius for easy access to both sides if there's no specific urgency.
I would say go to Hydra. Get into battle as quickly as possible. Especially since the South lost a fleet.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on September 03, 2013, 09:40:06 pm
I'd also suggest the south.  I think the north is OK at the moment, and it's a bit easier to defend overall.

/me crosses fingers that 3x Hertak fleets are not waiting offscreen to prove me wrong  :lol:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 03, 2013, 09:52:57 pm
I'd also suggest the south.  I think the north is OK at the moment, and it's a bit easier to defend overall.

/me crosses fingers that 3x Hertak fleets are not waiting offscreen to prove me wrong  :lol:
I have tried to find it and can't, but I'm sure I remember something in the canon about the Hertak not fighting alongside the Zy, and the Zy have only appeared at the top and the Hertak only at the bottom...
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Droid803 on September 03, 2013, 10:13:08 pm
Alright, heading towards Hydra. Don't all die before I get there.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on September 03, 2013, 10:35:33 pm
I'm sure we won't all die in the next turn :)

And, more seriously, if the Hierarchy go all out offence next turn & the 1st Nordera (or 2nd Hertak) move to Draco, I suspect we could lose the 1st DD.  We'll destroy the 2nd Hertak one way or other if that occurs, but still.  If the 1st Nordera/2nd Hertak stay where they are or retreat, everyone should survive, even if 1st Fura'ngle moves to Hydra and they gang up on the 3rd SF.  Does that match your numbers Lorric?  And should we consider a more conservative turn in the south?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 03, 2013, 10:47:51 pm
I'm sure we won't all die in the next turn :)

And, more seriously, if the Hierarchy go all out offence next turn & the 1st Nordera (or 2nd Hertak) move to Draco, I suspect we could lose the 1st DD.  We'll destroy the 2nd Hertak one way or other if that occurs, but still.  If the 1st Nordera/2nd Hertak stay where they are or retreat, everyone should survive, even if 1st Fura'ngle moves to Hydra and they gang up on the 3rd SF.  Does that match your numbers Lorric?  And should we consider a more conservative turn in the south?

Yes. The 1st DD will survive if the Heirarchy are "sensible". But not if the 2nd Hertak are as fanatical as the 1st. The 3rd SF will survive easily.

I would probably have had the 1st DD resupply, but if he's willing to bear the risk, I have no problem with taking it, it saves the 4th CRF from having to just sit there, and they'll do some decent damage to the Fura'ngle. So we're hitting the only three dangerous fleets (and destroying one.)

EDIT: Further information, if we leave the Fura'ngle alone, then the 3rd SF will become vulnerable to a Hertak suicide attack instead, so there's no benefit to a conservative turn. If the 2nd Hertak attacks, someone dies either way. So it's better we attack, as we are doing.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: AdmiralRalwood on September 03, 2013, 11:26:48 pm
I would probably have had the 1st DD resupply, but if he's willing to bear the risk, I have no problem with taking it, it saves the 4th CRF from having to just sit there, and they'll do some decent damage to the Fura'ngle. So we're hitting the only three dangerous fleets (and destroying one.)
My tactical instincts were to continue to resupply; my strategic instincts told me I didn't have that kind of luxury, and we need to hammer the enemy as quickly as possible to blunt their offensive. If they manage to take me out, so be it; they'll have opened themselves up in the process, and we'll for damned sure not go down alone (I'm looking at you, 1st Hertak).
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 03, 2013, 11:37:28 pm
I would probably have had the 1st DD resupply, but if he's willing to bear the risk, I have no problem with taking it, it saves the 4th CRF from having to just sit there, and they'll do some decent damage to the Fura'ngle. So we're hitting the only three dangerous fleets (and destroying one.)
My tactical instincts were to continue to resupply; my strategic instincts told me I didn't have that kind of luxury, and we need to hammer the enemy as quickly as possible to blunt their offensive. If they manage to take me out, so be it; they'll have opened themselves up in the process, and we'll for damned sure not go down alone (I'm looking at you, 1st Hertak).
I'm not sure if I would have thought of it if you hadn't decided to attack to make me consider the possibilities.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on September 03, 2013, 11:50:55 pm
My tactical instincts were to continue to resupply; my strategic instincts told me I didn't have that kind of luxury, and we need to hammer the enemy as quickly as possible to blunt their offensive. If they manage to take me out, so be it; they'll have opened themselves up in the process, and we'll for damned sure not go down alone (I'm looking at you, 1st Hertak).

I salute you sir, may Fortune Favour the Bold

EDIT: Further information, if we leave the Fura'ngle alone, then the 3rd SF will become vulnerable to a Hertak suicide attack instead, so there's no benefit to a conservative turn. If the 2nd Hertak attacks, someone dies either way. So it's better we attack, as we are doing.

Well, conservative like pull back completely from Draco & Hydra this turn then drop the hammer next turn, similar to the Tauri plan.  Doing that should suck up Hierarchy actions to secure the systems, leaving less of them to attack us next turn (I haven't run the numbers on this, but I'm pretty sure it'd mean no fleet losses).  Ignoring any political implications, trading territory for time often (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eastern_Front_%28World_War_II%29) works (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_invasion_of_Russia)  ;)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 04, 2013, 12:00:30 am
I salute you sir, may Fortune Favour the Bold

Seconded.

Well, conservative like pull back completely from Draco & Hydra this turn then drop the hammer next turn, similar to the Tauri plan.  Doing that should suck up Hierarchy actions to secure the systems, leaving less of them to attack us next turn (I haven't run the numbers on this, but I'm pretty sure it'd mean no fleet losses).  Ignoring any political implications, trading territory for time often (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eastern_Front_%28World_War_II%29) works (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_invasion_of_Russia)  ;)

Oh, I see. I'm still inclined to go for it this turn.

I do not want the enemy to end up getting two Hertak fleets together. We couldn't all pull back and destroy the 1st Hertak. And another Hertak fleet could arrive as well.

And I think there is potential for us to get in a strong position. Of course, we don't know what might show up next turn.

Also to consider is the tactical advantage having Draco and Hydra gives us, if we pull back, it will be much harder to transfer forces to each Southern front, that is an advantage we should not hand the heirarchy unless we're really desperate.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Flak on September 04, 2013, 12:45:52 am
What does the CSA special do? Lower the morale of all fleets in the same system by 1 level, both hostile and friendly?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: AdmiralRalwood on September 04, 2013, 02:32:05 am
1st Fleet - 'Fist of Silva' under the command of Rear Admiral Jason Ralwood (AdmiralRalwood) on the flagship Aurora
2nd Fleet - under the command of Rear Admiral Georgiy Kuznetsov (Admiral MS) on the flagship Nova
I half don't want to mention this in case it turns out to be bad luck and I die, but these should both say Vice Admiral...
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 04, 2013, 09:02:40 am
What does the CSA special do? Lower the morale of all fleets in the same system by 1 level, both hostile and friendly?
I think it's just a joke by Spoon, there's no description on what "Acting Smug" does. I don't think there is a special.

If I could think of anything to do with it as a special, I would have thought of the same effect as zeal, but since we already have zeal, it would be a manipulation tool. The Cyrvans contact a hierarchy fleet, and provoke it into attacking them that turn. It would be great for holding weak enemies in system, or breaking up organised attacks.

1st Fleet - 'Fist of Silva' under the command of Rear Admiral Jason Ralwood (AdmiralRalwood) on the flagship Aurora
2nd Fleet - under the command of Rear Admiral Georgiy Kuznetsov (Admiral MS) on the flagship Nova
I half don't want to mention this in case it turns out to be bad luck and I die, but these should both say Vice Admiral...

Are you nervous? :)

If you die, it won't be in vain though, for two reasons. First, the 2nd Hertak will die. And second, we may well have established a pattern, that the Hertak are crazy and fight to the death. The first time, it wasn't so crazy, they still had a decent chunk of health left, but unless this lot are also 150%, and I'd be surprised if they were because normal Hertak fleets are 100% in Spoon's list of normal stats, then they'll be very weak when they attack, still strong enough to tip you over the edge unfortunately, but very weak nontheless, and no enemy fleet has attacked in anywhere near that condition before, not even the fanatical Nordera.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Flak on September 04, 2013, 11:24:05 pm
If you die while bringing down 2nd Hertak, at least you have a chance to scream at them Madness? THIS! IS! HYDRAAAAA!

How long will the replacement fleet rebuilt after a fleet was destroyed?  Will the map get expanded as well?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: SpardaSon21 on September 05, 2013, 12:34:56 am
So, 1st LSF attacks who?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on September 05, 2013, 12:59:24 am
2nd Fura'ngle is more dangerous and has woeful morale... although I think they need to be reduced to ~50% for morale to be a factor.   Anyway, I believe that if you attack 2nd Fura'ngle and then 1st Zy + 2nd Fura'ngle + 5th Cordi attack you back you'll be left on -4% fighters & 1% capships  :eek2: (actually, what happens if fighters are reduced to -4%?  Does that damage transfer to capships?)

If you don't attack and they all attack you, I think you'll be left with 10% fighters & 16% capships.

edit: for clarity
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: SpardaSon21 on September 05, 2013, 01:23:40 am
Ouch.  I guess I can't defend, either as the system is contested.  I guess 2nd SF and I shall have to hold the line.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on September 05, 2013, 01:31:30 am
Well... the 2nd SF is worse off than you, if they don't leave they'll be destroyed by a triple team (although should just survive a double team), even if they don't attack.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: SpardaSon21 on September 05, 2013, 02:08:30 am
Well, crap.  Looks like 1st LSF is stuck holding the line by itself.  Again.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on September 05, 2013, 02:12:34 am
yeah, just sitting there waiting for the hammer to fall on you is not much fun :(

edit: Ah, why not, the 2nd UGCR will join you to hold the line and give em another target.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 05, 2013, 09:20:16 am
There's no way everyone will attack. They're not just going to let Tauri be inaccessible. If they leave Tauri without taking it, they can't re-enter it.

niffiwan, you're just wasting an action moving into Aldebaran. They'll all attack one fleet whether you're there or not.

And yes, the 1st LSF would be best to simply sit where it is for this turn.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Flak on September 05, 2013, 09:34:51 am
The UGCR fleets are the best tank I think.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 05, 2013, 09:47:14 am
The UGCR fleets are the best tank I think.
Indeed. But now that the hierarchy is in murder-death-kill mode, I don't think they'll oblige us by attacking our tanks. niffiwan will go untouched I'm sure if he moves into Aldebaran. Better to restore to full strength. The 1st LSF is strong. They'll be fine. And I'm sure they won't be triple teamed, my expectation is they'll be able to attack the turn after this one, then leave the system with 2nd action.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Admiral MS on September 06, 2013, 03:38:36 pm
2nd LSF is still missing an order. If things stay this way (only 2 fleets attacking 2nd hertak) the hierarchy can choose to either kill me (2nd DD) or 1st DD by moving either 1st Fura or 2nd Hertak to another system. I think they would choose my fleet since it'll be the last remaining in Hydra (3rd SF has a retreat order) and they can do a higher effective damage (80% fleet strength compared to 60% of the 1st DD). That said, I want to hold Hydra and and I'll survive if I don't attack - the 3rd SF retreats anyway and survives the full damage of 2nd Hertak.
It doesn't matter if I attack them or not since they can destroy 1st DD in both cases if they want. The only difference is if they destroy me and 2nd LSF stays inactive, even 1st CSA will have a hard time against 3 hostile fleets and there are no other fleets ready to reinforce them next turn.
I don't like the idea of losing a fellow fleet but that's a given in case of a 2nd Hertak suicide attack (even if 2nd LSF joined the attack).

I changed my order to do nothing next turn.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 06, 2013, 04:06:02 pm
Gah. We could have got on the front foot, and now we're going to be firmly on the back foot.

No blame to you, MS. It's a smart move under the circumstances.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Legate Damar on September 07, 2013, 01:47:11 am
What, I can't play a Zy? Lame.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on September 08, 2013, 05:26:13 am
The UGCR fleets are the best tank I think.
Indeed. But now that the hierarchy is in murder-death-kill mode, I don't think they'll oblige us by attacking our tanks. niffiwan will go untouched I'm sure if he moves into Aldebaran. Better to restore to full strength. The 1st LSF is strong. They'll be fine. And I'm sure they won't be triple teamed, my expectation is they'll be able to attack the turn after this one, then leave the system with 2nd action.

Agreed that there's a decent chance that 2nd UGCR won't be attacked.  On the other hand, I'm only ~15% down on strength so a resupply represents a small amount of wasted credits.  And, "probably not" attacked is still more likely than "can't be attacked".  Perhaps most importantly, in the event that the 1st LSF gets a pasting, the 2nd UGCR being in-system will let them retreat in the 1st move without damage & then resupply next turn, thus what is probably our best fleet will be back in action sooner.

And, on the triple team chance, if the Zy can bypass a starlance with one fleet, why can't all their fleets do it, thus diminishing the importance of them holding Tauri right now.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 08, 2013, 09:49:10 am
And, on the triple team chance, if the Zy can bypass a starlance with one fleet, why can't all their fleets do it, thus diminishing the importance of them holding Tauri right now.
That's a good point.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on September 08, 2013, 06:16:27 pm
Rear Admiral Jason Ralwood. Thou Fleet has been bested. Though the soldiers under thy command fought valiantly.
Does thou wish to continue?
Yes / No

If yes, your admiral will have made it to the life pods and lives to fight an other day. A new fleet will be constructed at the cost of 50 resources. But it will take some time before it gets ready.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 08, 2013, 06:28:54 pm
Good call niffiwan, you saved the 1st LSF.

Spoon, that system is friendly. Surely Tauri can give us some better intel than that on what the Zy left behind.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: CommanderDJ on September 08, 2013, 06:49:15 pm
I'm happy to send the 1st SF in to investigate if need be, though it's probably not a wondrous idea.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 08, 2013, 07:07:53 pm
I'm happy to send the 1st SF in to investigate if need be, though it's probably not a wondrous idea.
I guess you could Resupply then enter the system and me and Jellyfish could Resupply and Defend (just in case) and be waiting to see what happens.

You'd think you'd have the option to send a wing of scout fighters to check it out and scan it instead of risking the whole fleet though. Only a fool would blunder in with the entire fleet.

I am of the opinion we should check it out. If it's not a trap, it could cost us to leave it there.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: CommanderDJ on September 08, 2013, 07:18:28 pm
Into the void, then. It occurs to me that this could be a lure to get one of our fleets on its own as easy pickings, but we'll see.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 08, 2013, 07:25:45 pm
Into the void, then. It occurs to me that this could be a lure to get one of our fleets on its own as easy pickings, but we'll see.
We could have Jellyfish stay behind and I come with you if you like. Maybe that's the better option. No need to send in all three, but you wouldn't be going in alone.

EDIT: Or alternatively, a big middle finger to the Zy and we all go to Formalhaut.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 08, 2013, 07:46:52 pm
I’d be interested in trying an experiment this turn.

Two of our fleets hit the 1st Fura’ngle last turn. The damage wasn’t even particularly heavy, they only got hit for 49/44. And the 1st Fura’ngle are still very healthy at 79/84. And yet their morale went from Normal to Critical. Normal > Low > Very Low > Critical. Three drops.

The 2nd SF is still only at 71/73. If it engages in battle this turn, it will be vulnerable to a counterattack this turn. So I propose it Resupplies and then remains where it is to force the hierarchy into attacking our big UGCR tanks next turn. Then it can come in at full strength and hit back the turn after, or perhaps go down South to help out there.

We then have the two UGCR fleets attack the 2nd Fura’ngle. It won’t kill them, but it will hit them very hard, and their morale is Very Low. I’d like to see if that is still enough to finish them. Let us see what happens and see what we can learn. Here’s how it would go:

1st UGCR Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 25+11=36 (13+2)
- Capital attack strength: 22+13=35 (15)
- Fighters at 175% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 150% Strength
- Morale: Normal
- Mercs on Cooldown, Available again on turn 10

2nd UGCR Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 23+10=33 (13+2)
- Capital attack strength: 20+12=32 (15)
- Fighters at 160% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 136% Strength
- Morale: Normal
- Mercs on Cooldown, Available again on turn 10

vs.

2nd Fura'ngle Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 10+7=17 (16-2)
Capital attack strength: 14+5=19 (20-2)
Fighters at 77% Strength
Capital ships at 78% Strength
Morale: Very low

Result:

1st UGCR - 166/140
2nd UGCR - 159/126
2nd Fura’ngle - 8/11

So if 49/44 is enough to go from Normal to Critical, what will 69/67 do to Very Low?

EDIT: I was sure there was something in the rules about being able to rout fleets if you cripple their morale, but I can't find it. Maybe it was taken out. So maybe we should just hit the 1st Zy instead.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 08, 2013, 08:25:13 pm
Spoon, the 2nd LSF did not move last turn and was on 100/100. So why is it now on 70/76?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Droid803 on September 08, 2013, 09:12:47 pm
I shot them for not submitting orders.
That, or a clerical mistake miscounted ships.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 08, 2013, 09:27:16 pm
I shot them for not submitting orders.
(http://www.tonylevy.co.uk/images/CDPic02.JPG)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: SpardaSon21 on September 08, 2013, 09:35:02 pm
I'm running the hell away so I can resupply.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 08, 2013, 09:54:52 pm
So Jellyfish, you've chosen to enter Tauri also? Interesting decision to resupply when you get there.

Should I remain, or come too? I'll put a Resupply/stay put order for now.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: CommanderDJ on September 08, 2013, 10:25:15 pm
Jellyfish, perhaps it'd be better for you to resupply first, then move? We don't know what awaits us in Tauri.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on September 08, 2013, 10:37:42 pm
EDIT: I was sure there was something in the rules about being able to rout fleets if you cripple their morale, but I can't find it. Maybe it was taken out. So maybe we should just hit the 1st Zy instead.

I think that Critical morale will result in a retreat where possible (1st Fura'ngle), and a surrender where not (4th Cordi).  If we attacked the 2nd Fura'ngle they'd probably want to retreat anyway to allow someone fresh to enter Aldebaran, so perhaps hitting the 1st Zy would be better since they're more dangerous & I'd rather not have the 1st & 2nd Zy beat on someone together.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: AdmiralRalwood on September 08, 2013, 10:38:26 pm
Rear Admiral Jason Ralwood. Thou Fleet has been bested. Though the soldiers under thy command fought valiantly.
Does thou wish to continue?
Yes / No

If yes, your admiral will have made it to the life pods and lives to fight an other day. A new fleet will be constructed at the cost of 50 resources. But it will take some time before it gets ready.
RIP, Fist of Silva. Your sacrifice was not in vain. Fortunately, Admiral Ralwood's flag lieutenant hit him over the head and threw him into a lifepod before he could finish his speech about going down with his ship.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 08, 2013, 11:30:46 pm
Jellyfish, perhaps it'd be better for you to resupply first, then move? We don't know what awaits us in Tauri.
That was my first impulse too. But unlike you, who are at 74/86 so will be better served taking the sure thing, Jellyfish is at 92/93. So if he does take damage from some trap but retains the ability to Resupply, this will be useful. If he loses the ability to resupply somehow, he only loses out on 8/7. And if all is okay, well he gets the 8/7 anyway.

As for me, I've been thinking some more, and while there is a part of me that wants to come with you in a spirit of all for one and one for all, I think it would be best to err on the side of caution and remain here and see what happens.
EDIT: I was sure there was something in the rules about being able to rout fleets if you cripple their morale, but I can't find it. Maybe it was taken out. So maybe we should just hit the 1st Zy instead.

I think that Critical morale will result in a retreat where possible (1st Fura'ngle), and a surrender where not (4th Cordi).  If we attacked the 2nd Fura'ngle they'd probably want to retreat anyway to allow someone fresh to enter Aldebaran, so perhaps hitting the 1st Zy would be better since they're more dangerous & I'd rather not have the 1st & 2nd Zy beat on someone together.
Agreed. I endorse a plan of having the two UGCR fleets hit the 1st Zy while the 2nd SF remains outside the system and Resupplies.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 08, 2013, 11:49:11 pm
Heh. No sooner said than done. :)

Those lizards are going to pay:

1st UGCR Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 25+11=36 (13+2)
- Capital attack strength: 22+13=35 (15)
- Fighters at 175% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 150% Strength
- Morale: Normal
- Mercs on Cooldown, Available again on turn 10

2nd UGCR Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 23+10=33 (13+2)
- Capital attack strength: 20+12=32 (15)
- Fighters at 160% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 136% Strength
- Morale: Normal
- Mercs on Cooldown, Available again on turn 10

vs.

1st Zy Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 22+11=33 (21+2)
Capital attack strength: 22+11=33 (20+2)
Fighters at 96% Strength
Capital ships at 99% Strength
Morale: Very High

Result:

1st UGCR - 158/133
2nd UGCR - 143/119
1st Zy - 27/32

Comparing the 2nd UGCR to the 1st Zy shows just how strong the Zy are.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on September 09, 2013, 12:29:31 am
(Manly tear for the loss of so many good Delest men and women).

Lorric, could you crunch some numbers on the southern front? I am thinking of attacking something (maybe the 2nd Hertak) and then retreating to Vega (and so I will deal damage while attacking AND while retreating, while ending up safely in a friendly system). I can also just prepare a barrage and stay in Draco and try to weather the assault of the 2nd Hertak + 3rd Nordera +4th Nordera fleets. Would that kill me? ( I think so). Should I just run?

And regarding the rout of the 4th Fura: it's not just the damage they took. Remember that they were in Draco when I took out the 1st Hertak. It might be that the destruction of their masters sapped their will to fight.

Can somebody kill the 1st Nordera? It's ridiculous that they are still alive at turn 6.

And do you want to bet that what the Zy left behind is a Knossos, to allow the Hertak to attack us from behind?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on September 09, 2013, 12:51:28 am
Can somebody kill the 1st Nordera? It's ridiculous that they are still alive at turn 6.
I'd rather have their inferior fleet attacking us (or occupying a system "slot") than a Hertak or Fura'ngle fleet :)

And do you want to bet that what the Zy left behind is a Knossos, to allow the Hertak to attack us from behind?

Yeah, that thought occurred to me too, but surely Spoon wouldn't do that to us... surely  :nervous:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Flak on September 09, 2013, 01:21:05 am
A Fura'ngle fleet is almost the same as Cordi fleet. Nordera junks on the other hand are hardly worth our time.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Admiral MS on September 09, 2013, 01:31:44 am
Can somebody kill the 1st Nordera? It's ridiculous that they are still alive at turn 6.
I'd rather have their inferior fleet attacking us (or occupying a system "slot") than a Hertak or Fura'ngle fleet :)
I've been in Hydra doing "tactical waiting" for 2 turns, always right in front of the 1st Nordera. As a 150% fleet it's the only Nordera fleet that can do some reasonable damage. Cause I'm tired of sitting around I'm going to attack them and retreat to Odin (actually my barrage will be ready again after resupplying).
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on September 09, 2013, 01:44:26 am
I'd rather have their inferior fleet attacking us (or occupying a system "slot") than a Hertak or Fura'ngle fleet :)

I'd rather Hydra was friendly. Good point though.

Yeah, that thought occurred to me too, but surely Spoon wouldn't do that to us... surely  :nervous:

Oh, you poor misguided fool.  :p
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on September 09, 2013, 06:54:52 am
About the thing the Zy left behind. Spend a single action to investigate. Results of the scans/scouting/everything will be known next turn.  :drevil:
Of course you can also just leave it alone.  :drevil:

Spoon, the 2nd LSF did not move last turn and was on 100/100. So why is it now on 70/76?
I uh, huh  :confused:
I am not sure how that happened.

I shot them for not submitting orders.
That, or a clerical mistake miscounted ships.
That must be it. Or mass desertion because of too much smugness.

RIP, Fist of Silva. Your sacrifice was not in vain. Fortunately, Admiral Ralwood's flag lieutenant hit him over the head and threw him into a lifepod before he could finish his speech about going down with his ship.
Very well.
A new fleet will be ready for you to command on turn 10.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on September 09, 2013, 07:24:12 am
I'd keep that Lieutenant if I were you,  :lol:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Legate Damar on September 09, 2013, 09:49:48 am
Those lizards are going to pay

Racist...
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 09, 2013, 10:36:05 am
@ Enioch - I'll get to the South, don't you worry. Later on today.

About the thing the Zy left behind. Spend a single action to investigate. Results of the scans/scouting/everything will be known next turn.  :drevil:
Of course you can also just leave it alone.  :drevil:

So then Jellyfish, you'll have to switch your Resupply to investigating this thing, if you want to check it out.

Spoon, the 2nd LSF did not move last turn and was on 100/100. So why is it now on 70/76?
Quote
I uh, huh  :confused:
I am not sure how that happened.
Thanks.

RIP, Fist of Silva. Your sacrifice was not in vain. Fortunately, Admiral Ralwood's flag lieutenant hit him over the head and threw him into a lifepod before he could finish his speech about going down with his ship.
Quote
Very well.
A new fleet will be ready for you to command on turn 10.
If Torchwood shows up, can he still get his new fleet at Turn 9? If he doesn't, could we have a new fleet at Turn 9 and give it to someone else?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 09, 2013, 07:24:41 pm
(Manly tear for the loss of so many good Delest men and women).

Lorric, could you crunch some numbers on the southern front? I am thinking of attacking something (maybe the 2nd Hertak) and then retreating to Vega (and so I will deal damage while attacking AND while retreating, while ending up safely in a friendly system). I can also just prepare a barrage and stay in Draco and try to weather the assault of the 2nd Hertak + 3rd Nordera +4th Nordera fleets. Would that kill me? ( I think so). Should I just run?

And regarding the rout of the 4th Fura: it's not just the damage they took. Remember that they were in Draco when I took out the 1st Hertak. It might be that the destruction of their masters sapped their will to fight.

Can somebody kill the 1st Nordera? It's ridiculous that they are still alive at turn 6.

And do you want to bet that what the Zy left behind is a Knossos, to allow the Hertak to attack us from behind?

Alright, it took me longer than I expected to get to this, but here we go. Oh and good point about the Hertak masters going down, I was talking about that on an earlier turn and somehow forgot. I believe you are right, and it was the 1st Hertak that inspired the Fura'ngle to Normal morale in the first place.

Okay, I believe we should have a triple attack on the 1st Nordera:

2nd DD Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 16+8=24 (18+2+2)
- Capital attack strength: 16+8=24 (17+2)
- Fighters at 78% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 80% Strength
- Morale: Very High
- Barrage on Cooldown, Available again on Turn 8
- Inspirational Leader

2nd LSF Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 22+8=30 (19+2+1)
- Capital attack strength: 15+11=26 (14+1)
- Fighters at 100% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 100% Strength
- Morale: High

Cyrvan Star Armada: 1/1
1st CSA Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 23+10=33 (23)
- Capital attack strength: 20+12=32 (20)
- Fighters at 100% Strength
- Capital ships at 100% Strength
- Morale: Normal

vs.

1st Nordera Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 15+6=21 (10+1)
Capital attack strength: 12+8=20 (8+1)
Fighters at 136% Strength
Capital ships at 137% Strength
Morale: High

7/7 damage to each ally fleet.
87/82 inflicted.
Nordera down to 49/55.

That’ll cut them down to size nicely at minimal cost.

I’ve then calculated the max enemy retaliation:

Strongest available enemy attack:

1st Fura'ngle Fleet (I THINK)
Fighter attack strength: 15+11=26 (16-2)
Capital attack strength: 21+8=29 (20-2)
Fighters at 109% Strength
Capital ships at 114% Strength
Morale: Very Low

2nd Hertak Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 15+10=25 (22)
Capital attack strength: 20+8=28 (30)
Fighters at 66% Strength
Capital ships at 68% Strength
Morale: Normal

4th Nordera Fleet
Fighter attack strength: 12+5=17 (10+2)
Capital attack strength: 10+6=16 (8+2)
Fighters at 100% Strength
Capital ships at 100% Strength
Morale: Very High

Estimated Max Damage - 68/73

So the 2nd DD’s retreat, which has already been implemented after it’s attack on the Nordera is a good move, as they would be vulnerable to elimination at exactly 73% health.

So looking at the rest, the 1st CRF has moved into position in Vega and Resupplied already. Now if we have the 4th CRF Resupply and enter Draco, and Enioch, we have your 3rd DD remain where it is and prepare it's barrage, we’ll have four fleets in a position to attack next turn, two in each system so the retreat will be covered. The Heirarchy will likely focus on one, most likely the Cyrvans, but can’t finish anyone, everyone’s well over that 73%, leaving three left in position to attack. These three will be in a position to finish the 2nd Hertak on the turn after this one, or if the Hertak retreat, dish out some strong damage somewhere else. By then, the 1st CRF and 3rd SF will be back in business as well. Oh and speaking of which, I also recommend the 3rd SF to perform a double Resupply:

3rd SF Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 9 (18+2)
- Capital attack strength: 6 (18)
- Fighters at 38% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 35% Strength
- Morale: Normal
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Droid803 on September 09, 2013, 08:05:52 pm
Lorric, are you assuming the 2nd LSF will actually do something? You can't count on Jerran fleets to do that, you know.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 09, 2013, 08:13:14 pm
Lorric, are you assuming the 2nd LSF will actually do something? You can't count on Jerran fleets to do that, you know.

It won't screw everything up if he doesn't move, the Nordera will do 11/10 damage and end up at 79/81, so it won't change the maximum damage the heirarchy can inflict. No one will die. But the 2nd Hertak might slip between our fingers the turn after this one.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lepanto on September 09, 2013, 11:31:54 pm
Mind if I just resupply and use Zeal this turn? Unless you want me to meatshield in Draco, I'd rather stock up on health and morale this turn and return to the fight next turn.

Also, 1st DD's and my attack on the 1st Fura'ngle in Draco seems to indicate that Fura'ngle morale collapses quickly when they're attacked, even if their fleet didn't take much damage. Maybe something to keep in mind?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 09, 2013, 11:46:14 pm
Mind if I just resupply and use Zeal this turn? Unless you want me to meatshield in Draco, I'd rather stock up on health and morale this turn and return to the fight next turn.

Also, 1st DD's and my attack on the 1st Fura'ngle in Draco seems to indicate that Fura'ngle morale collapses quickly when they're attacked, even if their fleet didn't take much damage. Maybe something to keep in mind?
I hadn't realised you had Zeal ready. I would like you to go to Draco though. You are at 79/65, so if you Resupply then go to Draco, you'll be at almost full strength at 100/95.

It's about putting three fleets in position to strike at the Hertak. If the Hertak strike in Hydra, which is where I predict they'll go if they do attack in order to hit the Cyrvans, you'll need to travel again. Believe me I like using my Zeal too, but I think it's important to make the move. Also, if you don't, then the Heirarchy might target the 3rd DD instead, and then there'll be no one there to cover the retreat.

We'll have to look at that the next time we hit the Fura'ngle. But I am inclined to agree with Enioch's suspicion that this dramatic drop happened because the 1st Hertak went down.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on September 10, 2013, 05:46:58 am
So, you suggest I should just prepare Barrage and wait there?

What happens if, say, the 2nd Hertak, 3rd Nordera and 4th Nordera/1st Fura all hit me? Do I die?

Please keep in mind that several Hertak fighters survived the destruction of 1st Hertak and they might very well have been picked up by the 2nd Hertak, just as we pick up surviving fighters Can I have a number crunch on that?

If staying in Draco might result in my fleet's death, might it not be better if we abandon the system? Say Lepanto stays in Vega and resupplies, while I hit the 2nd Hertak (Major) and retreat to Vega (minor).

Then the 1st CRF can Double move to Draco and defend the system (it has 90+ health) so the (heavily damaged) Hertak cannot advance to Vega while we resupply and prepare to cover the CRF's rotation to Vega.

If my moves are this:

Major:attack 2nd Hert.
Minor: retreat to Vega (taking half damage from 2nd Hertak (damaged after first fight) and 3rd Nordera)

and Lepanto resupplies and Zeals

and Veers double moves to Draco

We end up pretty well, I think. The 2nd Hertak are at ~30% (after damage inflicted by me during attack & retreat), one fleet resupplying, one fleet holding the line, one fleet preparing to attack. Opinions?

EDIT: Oh, and this:

1st Fura'ngle Fleet (I THINK)
Fighter attack strength: 15+11=26 (16-2)
Capital attack strength: 21+8=29 (20-2)
Fighters at 109% Strength
Capital ships at 114% Strength
Morale: Very Low

is probably wrong. If the Fura resupply, I believe they will not go over 100%. I believe that any '1st fleet' of the enemy are overpowered just for the first attack and will not be able to resupply above 100% if damaged.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Admiral MS on September 10, 2013, 06:06:20 am
EDIT: Oh, and this:

1st Fura'ngle Fleet (I THINK)
Fighter attack strength: 15+11=26 (16-2)
Capital attack strength: 21+8=29 (20-2)
Fighters at 109% Strength
Capital ships at 114% Strength
Morale: Very Low

is probably wrong. If the Fura resupply, I believe they will not go over 100%. I believe that any '1st fleet' of the enemy are overpowered just for the first attack and will not be able to resupply above 100% if damaged.
The 1st Nordera resupplied from 135% back to 150% at turn 2 (even more disturbing they were able to resupply (first action) together with 2nd Nordera (first action as well) while the system was not yet secured (second action by 4th Cordi ) which means their base strength is 150%. I guess the Fura can resupply from below 100% to higher values as well.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on September 10, 2013, 06:59:48 am
Hadn't noticed that. Point taken.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 10, 2013, 11:08:05 am
So, you suggest I should just prepare Barrage and wait there?

What happens if, say, the 2nd Hertak, 3rd Nordera and 4th Nordera/1st Fura all hit me? Do I die?

Please keep in mind that several Hertak fighters survived the destruction of 1st Hertak and they might very well have been picked up by the 2nd Hertak, just as we pick up surviving fighters Can I have a number crunch on that?

If staying in Draco might result in my fleet's death, might it not be better if we abandon the system? Say Lepanto stays in Vega and resupplies, while I hit the 2nd Hertak (Major) and retreat to Vega (minor).

Then the 1st CRF can Double move to Draco and defend the system (it has 90+ health) so the (heavily damaged) Hertak cannot advance to Vega while we resupply and prepare to cover the CRF's rotation to Vega.

If my moves are this:

Major:attack 2nd Hert.
Minor: retreat to Vega (taking half damage from 2nd Hertak (damaged after first fight) and 3rd Nordera)

and Lepanto resupplies and Zeals

and Veers double moves to Draco

We end up pretty well, I think. The 2nd Hertak are at ~30% (after damage inflicted by me during attack & retreat), one fleet resupplying, one fleet holding the line, one fleet preparing to attack. Opinions?
I would like to stick with my proposal. Do not worry. You will not die.

I think Spoon would have told us if the fighters had transferred. But it will be negligible if they have.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on September 10, 2013, 11:25:36 am
You are probably right. Your suggestion gives us a nice followup attack on the next turn.

However, if I get killed, I'm hitching a lifepod, driving it to the North front and strangling you in your sleep.  :arrr:

Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 10, 2013, 11:30:39 am
However, if I get killed, I'm hitching a lifepod, driving it to the North front and strangling you in your sleep.  :arrr:
:lol:

Somehow I don't think escape pods are designed to traverse multiple systems. :)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on September 10, 2013, 11:53:31 am
Mine will be fueled by homicidalrageium.  :mad: Put that in your fuel tank and you can jump without Starlances, like the Zy. Standard issue on Delest fleets.  :drevil:

EDIT: So, to sum up: I prepare Barrage and wait (i.e. no attack?)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Flak on September 10, 2013, 12:16:30 pm
To my brothers,

If you're reading this, then I was probably killed by some slimy Hertak scum who got lucky. Hopefully the bastard is dead and is breathing vacuum, but if not, you better avenge me or I will haunt you until the day you die.

p.s. Kill all the alien bastards that I wasn't able to.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 10, 2013, 12:21:08 pm
Mine will be fueled by homicidalrageium.  :mad: Put that in your fuel tank and you can jump without Starlances, like the Zy. Standard issue on Delest fleets.  :drevil:

EDIT: So, to sum up: I prepare Barrage and wait (i.e. no attack?)
Well, I did use Defend this turn. Perhaps that will help me see you coming... :)

Yes. Barrage, wait.

And don't worry about the Hertak fighters. 5% survived. If they've joined the 2nd Hertak, that will add 1 to their fighter damage. So I haven't checked, but that will mean either +1 on capital damage or nothing at all.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Droid803 on September 10, 2013, 05:29:38 pm
Yay Dragon's back!
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Dragon on September 13, 2013, 06:43:58 am
Yes, I am. :) I was on vacation last week, couldn't log into HLP. I've had some fun sailing, but on land there were a bit too many drunk students. Still, a nice trip.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: X3N0-Life-Form on September 13, 2013, 07:05:51 am
OK, I'm gonna sit in Virgo for this turn and take defensive positions. That way, I'll be ready to either defend Virgo (if things go South in Aldebaran) or go back to the front line.

Now if I could just find the time to write some RP stuff ...
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on September 14, 2013, 07:52:29 pm
You guys sure did a lot of resupplying this turn!
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on September 14, 2013, 08:42:06 pm
I think most of us were just hungry, that's all.

Murdering the Her'tak and their battle thralls really works up an appetite (may or may not have been in simulations this entire time) :)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 14, 2013, 10:14:20 pm
I think most of us were just hungry, that's all.

Murdering the Her'tak and their battle thralls really works up an appetite (may or may not have been in simulations this entire time) :)
It's been nothing but Cordi for us, so we've had plenty of time to experiment in putting our Cordi Cookbook together. Lots of nice recipes coming through now. I recommend the Crispy Cordi Cuisine and the Cordi Concoction myself. Very tasty! :)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on September 14, 2013, 10:29:14 pm
All I learned is that you can pull on certain muscle groups and make them move around.. :D
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 14, 2013, 10:41:30 pm
All I learned is that you can pull on certain muscle groups and make them move around.. :D
Planning a puppet show? The CRF are all about keeping morale up!

We're so disappointed the Zy pulled back. We were so looking forward to seeing if they tasted nice... :(

(http://testdb.msmagazine.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2010/11/bigsadmandtis.jpg)
Tasty!
(http://31.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mal5r8DEkJ1r261dzo1_500.jpg)
Jury's still out...
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Legate Damar on September 15, 2013, 08:29:16 am
Degenerates. Your entire species.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on September 15, 2013, 08:32:55 am
 :lol:
I bet Zy taste like chicken.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 15, 2013, 11:16:35 am
Degenerates. Your entire species.
Hey. I'm sure the Zy as carnivores would eat us. And the Cordi also if they are carnivores.

:lol:
I bet Zy taste like chicken.
I was going to say this if anyone asked what Cordi taste like. :)

Well, if you say the Zy taste like chicken, then bring 'em on, chicken is my favourite meat too! Bring on the Zy Zinger Burgers and the Lounge Lizard Special!

Now, in all seriousness, the men and women of the 2nd CRF are not tucking into Cordi Kebabs and the like. This is just all in good fun. But this actually gave me an idea for something that could be seriously done. I could imagine getting a communique from the Zy, and it flashes up on screen, and there's a group of high-ranking Zy sat around a table enjoying a banquet of human flesh, torsos and limbs and the like being feasted on, and they're partying it up, and they talk about how we're looking at the food chain and that they're the superior species and natural selection and the like, and demand that we surrender or it's the same for us, something like that.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Legate Damar on September 15, 2013, 05:27:38 pm
Cardassian strategy would suggest responding to such a display by deliberately infecting your soldiers with a dormant pathogen that becomes highly virulent, airborne, and contagious after ingestion.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on September 15, 2013, 06:36:49 pm
Yet nobody cares what cardassians want or dont want. Legate Damar, either you post something relevant and on topic or don't post at all. First and final warning, thanks.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 15, 2013, 06:44:36 pm
Yet nobody cares what cardassians want or dont want.
Actually, I find him amusing sometimes. And this is one such time. I'm just saying.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on September 15, 2013, 07:27:28 pm
I was personally waiting for someone else to tell him off, much appreciated Spoon :)

I'm not sure this conversation would be helping our relationships with the Cordi anyway, they probably wouldn't like it if we were eating their dead/prisoners.

Come to think of it, I probably wouldn't either :P

Hey Spoon, how are the videos and all coming along if I may ask?, I kinda miss them :'(
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on September 15, 2013, 07:43:20 pm
I'm not sure this conversation would be helping our relationships with the Cordi anyway, they probably wouldn't like it if we were eating their dead/prisoners.

Come to think of it, I probably wouldn't either :P

Yeah, eating other sentients?   :no: :blah:  Count me out.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on September 15, 2013, 07:46:24 pm
Still hilariously amusing though  :rolleyes:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 15, 2013, 07:49:05 pm
Yeah, eating other sentients?   :no: :blah:  Count me out.
Why would it matter if they were dead and taste nice? I wouldn't want to kill sentients just for food, but in this case...
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on September 15, 2013, 09:13:52 pm
Why would it matter if they were dead and taste nice? I wouldn't want to kill sentients just for food, but in this case...

Can I interest you in some Soylent Green?

I think it'd be far too easy to cross the line between food-of-convenience and harvesting (also note: I would think that the majority of the dead from a space battle would not be in any fit state to eat.  See BP:WIH Laporte & TEV-crewman-ash, so it's not really food-of-convenience anyway)
AND it would probably be a massive propaganda tool for the enemy (although perhaps the Zy would not care, if I've read correctly about their views).

(why am I even *having* this conversation?!?!)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 15, 2013, 09:22:29 pm
Why would it matter if they were dead and taste nice? I wouldn't want to kill sentients just for food, but in this case...

Can I interest you in some Soylent Green?

I think it'd be far too easy to cross the line between food-of-convenience and harvesting (also note: I would think that the majority of the dead from a space battle would not be in any fit state to eat.  See BP:WIH Laporte & TEV-crewman-ash, so it's not really food-of-convenience anyway)
AND it would probably be a massive propaganda tool for the enemy (although perhaps the Zy would not care, if I've read correctly about their views).

(why am I even *having* this conversation?!?!)
Well if we were being serious, before even all that, it would have to be properly tested, we can't just go tucking into aliens, who knows what effect it might have on us, we'd need to know if they were edible.

Cause it's fun! :D
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on September 15, 2013, 09:44:34 pm
Hey Spoon, how are the videos and all coming along if I may ask?, I kinda miss them :'(
Inorite.
I'll delay today's turn so I can put it up with a video this time around. I'mma try hard to catch up with the vids after that.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 15, 2013, 10:20:48 pm
Hey Spoon, how are the videos and all coming along if I may ask?, I kinda miss them :'(
Inorite.
I'll delay today's turn so I can put it up with a video this time around. I'mma try hard to catch up with the vids after that.
Do you mean a video of the current turn or Turn 3?

Well, if you'd posted the turn now, it would have mucked up my new RP post a bit, so there's that too.

However, if it would take more than a day, I would hope you would just post the turn. The videos are pretty, and I'm so looking forward to one day being able to play them all one after another, but they are not necessary to continue the game. Unless you have something special to show us in the video for this turn.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: AndrewofDoom on September 15, 2013, 11:01:30 pm
Right, so I finally came up with fleet's name.

I shall call them The Feather Ones. Hey it was better than I first thought of, The Stellar Assaulters. :p
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on September 18, 2013, 07:37:19 am
However, if it would take more than a day, I would hope you would just post the turn. The videos are pretty, and I'm so looking forward to one day being able to play them all one after another, but they are not necessary to continue the game. Unless you have something special to show us in the video for this turn.

QFT

I must side with Lorric here. If there is to be a turn taking place this week, it should take place as soon as possible, even with no video, to give us time to plan our response. If not (which seems increasingly likely and which doesn't really bother me, when all is said and done), please tell us, so that I won't have to check the forums until Sunday.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on September 18, 2013, 09:08:08 am
orz
It'll be up today, for realz. I promise!
please don't lynch me
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on September 18, 2013, 09:13:02 am
Spoon, m'boy, nobody wants to lynch you. I'm not pressing for you to get the turn up every week and I certainly don't care if it's accompanied by a video. If you have no time, or if you want to take a week to catch up, fine. But if you mean to get the turn up, please do so as early as possible, so that we have time to plan our moves and so that we have time to log in and submit them.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 18, 2013, 11:26:36 am
The deadline will have to be put forward. Two days is not enough for the turn.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: SpardaSon21 on September 18, 2013, 08:35:46 pm
1st CRF, I can't reach you in time to help, not at 48% strength.  Best I can do is resupply once more, then move to Aquarius, and hope I can get to you next turn.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 18, 2013, 08:51:52 pm
Can we destroy the Zy device?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: CommanderDJ on September 18, 2013, 09:22:45 pm
Or move it to another system? :P
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 18, 2013, 09:24:25 pm
Question, if two fleets attack a fleet that has resupplied, do they take 5 extra damage period or 5 extra damage per attacking fleet?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on September 18, 2013, 09:36:45 pm
5 per attacking fleet.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 18, 2013, 09:42:59 pm
5 per attacking fleet.
Excellent! We can kill the 1st Zy!

1st UGCR Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 20+9=29 (13+2)
Capital attack strength: 18+10=28 (15)
Fighters at 142% Strength, 3rd Gen
Capital ships at 117% Strength
Morale: Normal

2nd UGCR Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 19+8=27 (13+2)
Capital attack strength: 15+10=25 (15)
Fighters at 127% Strength, 3rd Gen
Capital ships at 103% Strength
Morale: Normal

Damage: 56/53 +10/10 = 66/63.

vs.

1st Zy Fleet (assume resupply)
Fighters at 57% Strength
Capital ships at 62% Strength
Morale: Very High

Bring on the Zy Zinger Burgers and the Lounge Lizard Special.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 18, 2013, 09:45:50 pm
Okay, another question. Spoon, you told us if we talk to the Hierarchy, you'll have them talk back. But no one has tried it yet. Is there any restriction on who we can talk to? Can I talk to any Hierarchy? just those in my system? Somewhere inbetween?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: CommanderDJ on September 18, 2013, 09:46:48 pm
5 per attacking fleet.
Excellent! We can kill the 1st Zy!

1st UGCR Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 20+9=29 (13+2)
Capital attack strength: 18+10=28 (15)
Fighters at 142% Strength, 3rd Gen
Capital ships at 117% Strength
Morale: Normal

2nd UGCR Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 19+8=27 (13+2)
Capital attack strength: 15+10=25 (15)
Fighters at 127% Strength, 3rd Gen
Capital ships at 103% Strength
Morale: Normal

Damage: 56/53 +10/10 = 66/63.

vs.

1st Zy Fleet (assume resupply)
Fighters at 57% Strength
Capital ships at 62% Strength
Morale: Very High

Bring on the Zy Zinger Burgers and the Lounge Lizard Special.

But the 1st Zy is in Crux... unless you're suggesting a mass offensive push into Crux. Which I am fully willing to participate in. :D
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on September 18, 2013, 09:50:13 pm
5 per attacking fleet.
Excellent! We can kill the 1st Zy!

But the 1st Zy is in Crux... unless you're suggesting a mass offensive push into Crux. Which I am fully willing to participate in. :D

Gets my vote - vroom!

Just make sure someone covers our rears so that we can retreat to Albebaran when it all goes to poo   :P
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 18, 2013, 09:54:31 pm
I just want to kill the 1st Zy. I haven't thought any further than that yet. But I'm glad you're willing, as if we do go for a push, your fleet would be very useful put into position there, we could potentially push forward depending on what shows up next turn.

Go get 'em, niffiwan! This will be a huge victory for the UGCR! Maybe they'll see fit to... hand out promotions...

EDIT: I shall move into Aldeberan to provide cover.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: CommanderDJ on September 18, 2013, 09:56:33 pm
And I just realised I can't move into Crux and attack in the same turn. So I'll hang back and defend Aldebaran in case the 2nd Fura'ngle comes sniffin' around. Or one of the fleets in Crux decides to try and push past you guys.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on September 18, 2013, 10:09:17 pm
I'll post more when I get home,

But 1st CRF will hold Vega. We will hold Vega. Any status reports on the 2nd and 3rd Zy please?

As the 2nd Zy is arriving next turn,
can I go 1st move defend
2nd turn attack? or was it both allied turns followed by hostile turns?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on September 18, 2013, 10:13:36 pm
or was it both allied turns followed by hostile turns?

I think it's this, so they get the 1st shot unfortunately.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 18, 2013, 10:15:36 pm
I'll post more when I get home,

But 1st CRF will hold Vega. We will hold Vega. Any status reports on the 2nd and 3rd Zy please?

As the 2nd Zy is arriving next turn,
can I go 1st move defend
2nd turn attack? or was it both allied turns followed by hostile turns?
You can certainly defend. I wouldn't want to attack though, the Zy are stronger than us, that only helps the Zy to face them 1v1. I don't think you could do it anyway.

I haven't got to the South yet, but I'm looking at the 2nd SF and thinking maybe if they went to Vega instead, and you attacked the 3rd Nordera, we could kill the 3rd Nordera with help from others.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 18, 2013, 10:39:45 pm
Spoon, you haven't applied the bonuses to the 4th CRF (3rd gen + morale.)



Okay, here's what I think we should do this turn. We should be in a very solid position at the end of it, and have destroyed the 3rd Nordera and 1st Zy. Unless two powerful enemy fleets show up in Crux and both can attack.

Okay. For the remaining top fleets, I’m thinking it would be good if the 4th SF goes to Aldebaran and Resupplies, and the 1st LSF double Resupplies. And the 2nd SF travels to Vega to meet the Zy.

South, the 2nd DD can Resupply and Travel to Hydra. The 3rd SF is almost full strength, so I would advise Travel to Hydra and Defend.

The 3rd DD has been summoned to Tamy. I would begin that process by travelling to Vega and Resupplying. Two more travels next turn will bring them into Tamy, but meanwhile, that gives the Zy another potential target…

The 2nd LSF should double Resupply to restore the damage inflicted by the suicidal Nordera.

If the 1st CSA, the 1st CRF and the 4th CRF engage the 3rd Nordera, we can wipe them out. The 4th CRF should use the Zeal special before attacking.

1st CSA Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 21+10=31 (23)
- Capital attack strength: 19+11=30 (20)
- Fighters at 93% Strength
- Capital ships at 93% Strength
- Morale: Normal

1st CRF Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 21+10=31 (16+2+3)
- Capital attack strength: 20+11=31 (17+3)
- Fighters at 100% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 100% Strength
- Morale: Zealous

4th CRF Fleet:
(the stats aren’t right, but it’s obvious it’s enough, we‘re already up to 62/61, we only need to hit 70.)
- Fighter attack strength: 16 (16+2+1)
- Capital attack strength: 17 (17+1)
- Fighters at 100% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 95% Strength
- Morale: High

Damage: Enough. Received - 5/5 per fleet.

vs.

3rd Nordera Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 10+5=15 (10+3)
Capital attack strength: 9+5=14 (8+3)
Fighters at 69% Strength
Capital ships at 70% Strength
Morale: Zealous
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Flak on September 18, 2013, 10:48:49 pm
So that is how the Zy capital ships looks like. The carriers almost as big as Armageddons?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 18, 2013, 10:56:19 pm
So that is how the Zy capital ships looks like. The carriers almost as big as Armageddons?
From about 1:10 here you can get a look at them. Also you can see them directly compared to a Hertak Armageddon:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uT7genOP62c
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lepanto on September 18, 2013, 11:46:52 pm
 :yes: We've got them on the run!

I fully support finishing off the 1st Zy, but after that, I have a suggestion: Once we've cleared out all enemies to the north, I recommend we withdraw to Aldebaran. That way, any Hierarchy fleets arriving from off-map will have to move twice through Crux to get to Aldebaran, so they can't attack on the same turn they arrive.

Also, Spoon, if you wouldn't mind, could you please hand out a few more promotions to some people?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 18, 2013, 11:54:04 pm
:yes: We've got them on the run!

I fully support finishing off the 1st Zy, but after that, I have a suggestion: Once we've cleared out all enemies to the north, I recommend we withdraw to Aldebaran. That way, any Hierarchy fleets arriving from off-map will have to move twice through Crux to get to Aldebaran, so they can't attack on the same turn they arrive.

Also, Spoon, if you wouldn't mind, could you please hand out a few more promotions to some people?
I wonder if Spoon will expand the map for us? We'll have to see how things are after this turn.

On promotions, I was thinking since there have only been two and you can be promoted three times, this game must be set to last a very long time indeed.

I wonder what that ? Hertak fleet is...
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: AndrewofDoom on September 19, 2013, 12:23:50 am
All bets it's the Hertak Flagship fleet.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Jellyfish on September 19, 2013, 02:54:29 am
What if I blitz Crux, 5th Cordi Fleet? It won't kill them, but it may drop their morale, hopefully into surrendering.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 19, 2013, 03:35:09 am
All bets it's the Hertak Flagship fleet.
Oh the thought crossed my mind...

But how can we possibly beat something like that?

What if I blitz Crux, 5th Cordi Fleet? It won't kill them, but it may drop their morale, hopefully into surrendering.
Blitz doesn't work like that, the damage is dished out to you and a fleet in your system, which you "break through" into the next system.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on September 19, 2013, 04:01:48 am
All bets it's the Hertak Flagship fleet.

You got a bet. I say it's '3rd Hertak Fleet'. Too early for the OMGWTFHUGEDESTRUCTORBEAMZSPAWNOFDEATH.

Quote
"Rear Admiral Ivan Dimitrievic Kalazonitov, you presence is requested... or should I say, demanded in the Aquarius system. Your fleet is to rendevous with the 2nd Homeguard by orders of Xiau Yi Delest."

I call bull****. That's no military order, that's an invitation for tea - and a bad one at that. When am I supposed to RDV? Must I double move to Aquarius this turn, or can I fight in Draco / retreat to Vega and go to Aqua next turn?

Spoon, don't hurry to answer, I'll wait for the RP post.

And I expect info on the Homeguard. I am an Admiral of the Delest Navy - I should have some general info on the Homeguard fleets (commanding officers, quality of crews etc), and some idea about why they are pulling me off the front lines (in which I enjoy a forward entrenched position).


And is that (http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/WoD%20Forum%20Game/DDOperator200_zps0f8d54bc.png~original) communication officer wearing a strapless gown or something? Can I make it standard issue in the 2nd Fleet?  ;7

Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on September 19, 2013, 04:07:56 am
Veers, Admiral of the 1st CRF - Vega

Alrighty let me see now...

Judging my the fact we have 2 ZY fleets suddenly going south, I'm going to assume that is definitely (or a high chance of it being the Hertak god Fleet. Or the Hertak are just plain p*ssed at their losses in the southern sector at this time.

The appearance of the CSA may also have grabbed their attention.

Now as for Vega, we have a problem.. 2 Income ZY Fleets.

So far Draco is still contested with two Nordera Fleets, and remains very much open to additional Hertak attack, however, The Hertak may move north to keep the pressure on two fronts or attempt a breakthrough on the south, Through Draco, Vega and Hydra.

If they enter Hydra, we stand a strong chance of losing Draco, simply because we have no friendly systems to jump reinforcements into, and any retreats must pass through Vega or Hydra which may both be occupied next turn.

So potentially, Draco will be lost. And Admiral Kalazonitov may not be in the best position by the sounds of it. Unless all the DD's requests are demands. :/

Anyway, Back to Vega and me. Cause I'm awsum. . .

Vega will need reinforcements, However we stand a good chance at severely damaging several hostile fleets (and destroying said fleets asap) in the next turn or two. I'll dig in and try and hold against the 2nd Zy for their turn, but I may be required to evac shortly afterwards as I don't believe I can hold both fleets at once.

Or I'll go down and take them both with me, that is also acceptable. :P

Final Note. 2nd DD Homeguard. Shiny ship symbol.. ooo



tl;dr

Vega needs reinforcements. 1st CRF will hold against 2nd Zy and will probably have to retreat against 2 Zy Fleets.

Hertak unhappy at losses and appearance of the CSA. Could push North for Pressure or attempt breakthough Via Hydra to claim Draco (no friendly systems attached as Hydra and Vega contested)

I'm awsum and 2nd DD Homeguard as shiny ship symbol.. ooo

:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on September 19, 2013, 04:21:27 am
What REALLY concerns me is the conglomeration of Hertak+Hertak+Fura in Kardoen. I haven't done the math, but I am sure that with the Hertak resupplying and providing a morale bonus to the Fura, the STACK OF DOOM will be able to move to Hydra and 1-turn-kill a defending fleet. Theoretically, they can crawl forward one system at a time, killing one of our fleets every turn and I honestly have no idea how we can stop them without losing 1-2 fleets. I believe the southern front will get absolutely mauled during the upcoming turns.

Also, DAT KAMIKAZE. The Nordera suddenly became quite dangerous.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on September 19, 2013, 04:32:26 am
I reckon the target will be Hydra, if they attack there. They can severely hit our southern from and we lose the ability to defend/stall them at Draco.

They've nearly had Draco twice and we've beaten them by holding it. We'll lose it as we'll loose Vega to Contested status.

So we're in a tad trouble now, however we have several fleets south south, so worst comes to worst. We'll have to fight fire with fire and take heavy damage to halt their attack. Hopefully planned without losses to ourselves.

Could also get the northern fleets to attack Algol and make the Hertak thing we might come straight at their backsides. Could possibly slow any major push to the south if we take it or heavily damage the Fura'ngle there.

Plenty of options, so little time.. haha
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Admiral MS on September 19, 2013, 04:37:20 am
Spoon: In the combat calculation you forgot the barrage my fleet (2nd DD) had prepared and not yet used. Though not sure if these 4% would have reduced the damage of the Nordera kamikaze.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on September 19, 2013, 07:31:47 am
Spoon, you haven't applied the bonuses to the 4th CRF (3rd gen + morale.)
fix'd

Okay, another question. Spoon, you told us if we talk to the Hierarchy, you'll have them talk back. But no one has tried it yet. Is there any restriction on who we can talk to? Can I talk to any Hierarchy? just those in my system? Somewhere inbetween?
Communication range with the enemy is up till one starlance jump away.

Also, Spoon, if you wouldn't mind, could you please hand out a few more promotions to some people?
I was planning on doing that, it just kinda slipped by last night.
Stay tuned.

So that is how the Zy capital ships looks like. The carriers almost as big as Armageddons?
(http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/5172/byjg.png)

Quote
"Rear Admiral Ivan Dimitrievic Kalazonitov, you presence is requested... or should I say, demanded in the Aquarius system. Your fleet is to rendevous with the 2nd Homeguard by orders of Xiau Yi Delest."

I call bull****. That's no military order, that's an invitation for tea - and a bad one at that. When am I supposed to RDV? Must I double move to Aquarius this turn, or can I fight in Draco / retreat to Vega and go to Aqua next turn?

Spoon, don't hurry to answer, I'll wait for the RP post.

And I expect info on the Homeguard. I am an Admiral of the Delest Navy - I should have some general info on the Homeguard fleets (commanding officers, quality of crews etc), and some idea about why they are pulling me off the front lines (in which I enjoy a forward entrenched position).
The RP post will get you most of that info  :nod:
General info about those fleets: They have the best of what the Delest technological department can offer, 4th gen fighters, capital ships that are in excellent condition equipped with the heaviest of weaponry. Crew tends to be well trained and good on morale but inexperienced. 

And is that *pic* communication officer wearing a strapless gown or something? Can I make it standard issue in the 2nd Fleet?  ;7

*Video*
  :lol:
Yes something of the sort, and yes you totally could  :p

Spoon: In the combat calculation you forgot the barrage my fleet (2nd DD) had prepared and not yet used. Though not sure if these 4% would have reduced the damage of the Nordera kamikaze.
Ah sorry!
Well as you said, it wouldn't have mattered in this case, so lets say for the sake of simplicity that your currently prepared barrage has not been expended last fight.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 19, 2013, 07:46:42 am
Communication range with the enemy is up till one starlance jump away.
Nice. No chit-chat for me this turn then, but I think this is definitely something we should discuss and explore possibilities with.

EDIT: Where should we put what we say to the enemy?

(http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/5172/byjg.png)
WANT.

And what are the Hertak doing letting the Zy cruise around in those monsters with their special jump technology, while the Cordi are restricted to those (comparitively) crappy motherships? What was it they used to have, Jelgathi Class Carriers or something?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 19, 2013, 09:39:31 am
Ummm… Veers? I really would prefer it if you would please consider instead helping to destroy the 3rd Nordera. It can’t be done without you. Let me try and explain again, better this time.

The 2nd SF would travel to Vega to meet the Zy. There’s no need to await the Zy. We won’t be able to do anything to them until next turn. The 2nd SF can move to Vega, and the 3rd DD as well. The 2nd SF will be able to cover the 3rd DD as it retreats to meet the Homeguard Fleet. Hopefully the Zy will hit the 3rd DD, leaving us more strength for the counterattack.

South, the 2nd DD can Resupply and Travel to Hydra. The 3rd SF is almost full strength, so I would advise Travel to Hydra and defend. The 2nd LSF should double Resupply to restore the damage inflicted by the suicidal Nordera. Hydra would be able to hold at least a turn even if the STACK OF DOOM comes rolling in. As far as the STACK OF DOOM goes, if it does start taking people out, well, there’s nothing we can do about that. But we’d still have two fleets there even if one was lost.

If the 1st CSA, the 1st CRF and the 4th CRF engage the 3rd Nordera, we can wipe them out. The 4th CRF should use the Zeal special before attacking.

1st CSA Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 21+10=31 (23)
- Capital attack strength: 19+11=30 (20)
- Fighters at 93% Strength
- Capital ships at 93% Strength
- Morale: Normal

1st CRF Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 21+10=31 (16+2+3)
- Capital attack strength: 20+11=31 (17+3)
- Fighters at 100% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 100% Strength
- Morale: Zealous

4th CRF Fleet (+ Zeal)
- Fighter attack strength: 20+9=29 (16+2+2)
- Capital attack strength: 18+10=28 (17+2)
- Fighters at 100% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 95% Strength
- Morale: Very High

Damage: 91/89 (sick damage! :cool:) Received - 5/5 per fleet.

vs.

3rd Nordera Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 10+5=15 (10+3)
Capital attack strength: 9+5=14 (8+3)
Fighters at 69% Strength
Capital ships at 70% Strength
Morale: Zealous

This is the only combination of ships that can engage the 3rd Nordera. If you don’t engage the 3rd Nordera, then the other two are just going to be left twiddling their thumbs, there’s nothing meaningful for them to do. 5/5 damage will barely scratch the allied fleets, it’s a good move to make. Then we can plan out where to move everyone next turn, we’ll have 3 fleets in Hydra, 3 fleets in Draco, and 2 in Vega, though one will be leaving. Everyone will be in good shape, and we’ll have plenty of flexibility to move people around.

Oh, and a tip, I don't do an RP on the current turn's actions until the deadline hits.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: AndrewofDoom on September 19, 2013, 09:48:46 am
I don't know if you're blind Lorric, but Veers is doing the smart thing by covering our rears from a Zy flanking attack.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 19, 2013, 09:50:40 am
I don't know if you're blind Lorric, but Veers is doing the smart thing by covering our rears from a Zy flanking attack.
Ummm, my plan accounts for that...
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on September 19, 2013, 09:53:06 am
Fair point on the RP, but I've had it going in my head all day and wanted to post something.

I did cut out more than 1/2 the post in regards to the actual Zy and all. I was looking forward to it haha

Derpy derp Veers again :)

Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 19, 2013, 09:56:45 am
Fair point on the RP, but I've had it going in my head all day and wanted to post something.

I did cut out more than 1/2 the post in regards to the actual Zy and all. I was looking forward to it haha

Derpy derp Veers again :)
Does this mean you're going to attack the Nordera?

As for the Zy, I don't think you could have done it anyway even if you'd stayed while they're in their special jump. But you'll still be able to talk to them next turn if you like, you'll only be one system away, so that's within range.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on September 19, 2013, 10:03:22 am
Sorry about my delays, I'm currently on a dial-up connection probably no faster than about 36kb/s. Loading these pages takes forever and a day.

I'll make some edits tomorrow Lorric, :) and it gives me a better chance to see what everyone is posting instead of missing all the new ones while I load something.

Yea, I'll attack the Nordera. I can change my RP to setting up Vega's defence and leaving an automated message etc etc.

However I liked the idea of sitting there to welcome them, everything else suddenly became invisible and only Vega, myself and them remained. Was an interesting feeling to be honest. :)

EDIT:

I'll bite with the attack as we can wipe out an enemy fleet, we need to be doing this. Hertak or not, the need to go where ever possible.

But we still stand to loose Draco if both Vega and Hydra go contested, as we cannot reinforce our position. So I still think, we will end up on the backfoot if this occurs, however, the Hertak has the advantage in Draco if this is the case.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 19, 2013, 10:09:13 am
Sorry about my delays, I'm currently on a dial-up connection probably no faster than about 36kb/s. Loading these pages takes forever and a day.

I'll make some edits tomorrow Lorric, :) and it gives me a better chance to see what everyone is posting instead of missing all the new ones while I load something.

Yea, I'll attack the Nordera. I can change my RP to setting up Vega's defence and leaving an automated message etc etc.

However I liked the idea of sitting there to welcome them, everything else suddenly became invisible and only Vega, myself and them remained. Was an interesting feeling to be honest. :)
Thanks.

Oh, and look at what happened to me, I was sat waiting for the 1st Zy earlier in the game, and that's when we had no idea what was coming. And then right at the last minute I had to leave! :D
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 19, 2013, 10:38:13 am
Here's something interesting:

3rd Fleet - 'Task Force 765'  under the command of Rear Admiral John Harkness (Torchwood) on the flagship Senhime

None of the other fleets are struck through. Has Torchwood (or you, Spoon) decided he's not playing anymore?

It appears Rear Admiral John Harkness has fallen in battle... :(
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on September 19, 2013, 10:44:08 am
I noticed that earlier while I was writing,

Could just be struck out until there is a decision made, or it does represent no longer playing. If you'll notice the... was it the 1st DD that was destroyed?, only the flagship name is crossed out.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 19, 2013, 10:46:08 am
I noticed that earlier while I was writing,

Could just be struck out until there is a decision made, or it does represent no longer playing. If you'll notice the... was it the 1st DD that was destroyed?, only the flagship name is crossed out.
Oh yeah, I didn't see that...

The plot thickens! :)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Flak on September 19, 2013, 12:16:08 pm
And are those the old Lao Tzes? Is that the Leopard?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on September 19, 2013, 03:45:49 pm
None of the other fleets are struck through. Has Torchwood (or you, Spoon) decided he's not playing anymore?

It appears Rear Admiral John Harkness has fallen in battle... :(
Torchwood found himself lost in the zone while playing crusader kings and had forgotten about the outside world. I told him it was okay but he hasn't clearly indicated that he wants to continue or not.

And are those the old Lao Tzes? Is that the Leopard?
I'm not completely sure what Lao Tzes are but the fighter in the first part of the T7 video is the Leopard.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 19, 2013, 03:56:56 pm
Torchwood found himself lost in the zone while playing crusader kings and had forgotten about the outside world. I told him it was okay but he hasn't clearly indicated that he wants to continue or not.
And the online World too it appears! :D

Nice to know he can still come back. :)

Quote
I'm not completely sure what Lao Tzes are but the fighter in the first part of the T7 video is the Leopard.
We (Terrans) seem to be getting all these new ships, so very many of them compared to before. Will the Heirarchy get any new gear at some point?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Droid803 on September 19, 2013, 04:29:18 pm
No, those definitely are not the old Lao Tzes. Those were FTF MiGs.

These look completely new.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: X3N0-Life-Form on September 19, 2013, 05:49:44 pm
We (Terrans) seem to be getting all these new ships, so very many of them compared to before. Will the Heirarchy get any new gear at some point?
Well, some of them have started using their heads, maybe others will follow. The Hierarchy already has both lots of special abilities and powerful fleets. I'm not excluding them getting new gear at some point, but we haven't seen that many specials being used - headz, nordera zeal?, slipstream jump, sun trap thingy, hertak moral whip on the furz? (Am I missing any?)

So far, we've seen 2 nordera specials + 2 zy and possibly 1 hertak (assuming it's not some passive ability to motivate the Fura'n'gl), meaning we're still missing cordi and fur stuff. I wouldn't be surprised if the Fura'n'gl were the "wizard" of the group and had a big bunch of abilities up their sleeves (or crystals or whatever).

So tired ... must sleep.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Admiral MS on September 19, 2013, 06:31:03 pm
Well, one special ability of the Fura'ngle more or less killed one of you fleets. Check turn 5 and what damage they did to the 3rd CRF - it doesn't follow the usual calculation.

So what do we have:
Nordera: Kamikaze (the morale up after heavy damage was probably caused by the Hertak)
Cordi: Unless Spoon bends the rules for the hierarchy, they must have something like Blitz that can secure a system directly on arrival. Would fit their fighter/small capitals mobile fleets.
Zy: Slipstream jump and making stars go supernova
Fura'ngle: 100% fighter damage to anti capship damage instead of 50%
Hertak: +1 morale aura

I suspect the morale losses after destruction of 1st Hertak are not part of the regular abilities/rules but more of a story-event. Morale doesn't follow very strict rules anyway. If the Cordi don't have a capture system ability the other fleets (Nordera) must be able to resupply in a contested system without enemies.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on September 19, 2013, 07:19:48 pm
I just checked turn 5, that was a mistake on my part. Fura'ngle fighter damage follows the same rules as everyone else.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 19, 2013, 07:44:45 pm
We (Terrans) seem to be getting all these new ships, so very many of them compared to before. Will the Heirarchy get any new gear at some point?
Well, some of them have started using their heads, maybe others will follow. The Hierarchy already has both lots of special abilities and powerful fleets. I'm not excluding them getting new gear at some point, but we haven't seen that many specials being used - headz, nordera zeal?, slipstream jump, sun trap thingy, hertak moral whip on the furz? (Am I missing any?)

So far, we've seen 2 nordera specials + 2 zy and possibly 1 hertak (assuming it's not some passive ability to motivate the Fura'n'gl), meaning we're still missing cordi and fur stuff. I wouldn't be surprised if the Fura'n'gl were the "wizard" of the group and had a big bunch of abilities up their sleeves (or crystals or whatever).

So tired ... must sleep.
I actually just meant in terms of in-game for release.

And yes, I suspect the Fura'ngle will have a surprise in store for us at some point.

Well, one special ability of the Fura'ngle more or less killed one of you fleets. Check turn 5 and what damage they did to the 3rd CRF - it doesn't follow the usual calculation.

So what do we have:
Nordera: Kamikaze (the morale up after heavy damage was probably caused by the Hertak)
Cordi: Unless Spoon bends the rules for the hierarchy, they must have something like Blitz that can secure a system directly on arrival. Would fit their fighter/small capitals mobile fleets.
Zy: Slipstream jump and making stars go supernova
Fura'ngle: 100% fighter damage to anti capship damage instead of 50%
Hertak: +1 morale aura

I suspect the morale losses after destruction of 1st Hertak are not part of the regular abilities/rules but more of a story-event. Morale doesn't follow very strict rules anyway. If the Cordi don't have a capture system ability the other fleets (Nordera) must be able to resupply in a contested system without enemies.

I think the Zy might be morale shock resistant/immune. We hit them HARD last turn and it didn't drop.

The Hertak apply +2 morale to the Fura'ngle.

I think I've got the Nordera morale figured out. It just works opposite to normal morale, it goes up where someone else's would go down. It also goes down if they don't see action for awhile.

There's no need for the Cordi to have a special. The Cyrvans don't have a special. Don't be giving Spoon any ideas now... :nervous:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Droid803 on September 19, 2013, 08:48:16 pm
The Cyrvans don't have a special.
Oh, really?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Flak on September 19, 2013, 09:02:25 pm
I mean the old Lao Tze from Blue Planet. The new one is the Blizzard from Dimensional Eclipse.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on September 19, 2013, 09:54:18 pm
It's probably more the full and utter power of the CSA has yet to be revealed

Spoiler:
CSA Special: Retreat to defend Cyrvan Space. +10 to movement speed (so, gone from the map in 1 action. haha)
CSA Special 2: Space Elves fantasy. Male Terrans fight harder to protect Female Cyrvans

I dunno.., I'd fight harder but that's just me :)

No idea what their ability could be, possibly something techwise involving mech-forms?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: SpardaSon21 on September 19, 2013, 10:11:20 pm
Their special is they take several transforming ships, combine them into a single giant mecha, and then Inazuma Kick that fleet out of existence.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on September 19, 2013, 10:30:23 pm
I've adjusted my orders and RP thread accordingly as well. Just for reference.

:)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 19, 2013, 11:17:10 pm
The Cyrvans don't have a special.
Oh, really?
Do you know something I do not?

I've adjusted my orders and RP thread accordingly as well. Just for reference.

:)
Excellent.

Lepanto is in position as well.

So Droid, would you mind attacking the Nordera as well, and hammering the final nail into their coffin?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 19, 2013, 11:33:29 pm
Uh-oh Enioch.

I thought you were being summoned by the top authority in the DD. Maybe you shouldn't rendezvous with this guy after all...

But it would be good if you could take his fancy fleet away from him.

What does Spoon have in store for you...?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on September 19, 2013, 11:38:53 pm
Hooboy.  Recommend the 3rd DD rendezvous with a prepared barrage?  :lol:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Flak on September 19, 2013, 11:47:42 pm
What I suspect.

BAD:
- Thank you admiral, for so thoroughly and brutally dispatching my enemies, but now I'm afraid, you have outlived your usefulness.
- Ask for payment, etc
- ???

GOOD:
- 4th Gen Fighters instantly
- Fleet become 150%
- Promotion
- The Admiral becomes Steele
- Get a new fleet
- ???

Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 19, 2013, 11:49:48 pm
Hooboy.  Recommend the 3rd DD rendezvous with a prepared barrage?  :lol:
Hopefully this can be settled with a meeting of minds. Enioch should be able to handle this brash young upstart no problem.

Perhaps the Commodore can be recruited as an ally.

"Operation Ragnarok", talk about pretentious! :lol:

I'd almost like to keep this guy around just to see what name he'd give to a "real" engagement! :D
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on September 20, 2013, 12:11:58 am
"Operation Ragnarok", talk about pretentious! :lol:

I'd almost like to keep this guy around just to see what name he'd give to a "real" engagement! :D


Operation: AAAARGHOHMYGODHELPHELPHEEEEEELPTHEY'RESHOOTINGATMEGETMEOUTOFHERE!

Seriously, I'm going there. In character, I cannot ignore a summons from a Delest family member and hope to retain my position. Out of character, that fleet looks tasty tasty. If I play my cards right, I guess I could earn some gratitude from this upstart popinjay. I'm hoping for a 150% fleet, or a promotion but will be satisfied with any bonus, really.

Barrage is prepared, of course.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 20, 2013, 12:17:38 am
"Operation Ragnarok", talk about pretentious! :lol:

I'd almost like to keep this guy around just to see what name he'd give to a "real" engagement! :D


Operation: AAAARGHOHMYGODHELPHELPHEEEEEELPTHEY'RESHOOTINGATMEGETMEOUTOFHERE!
Ha ha ha ha ha! :D :yes:

Maybe you can take the quote in Jellyfish's sig and use it here if you meet this guy:

"A weapon is only as powerful as its wielder. With this weapon, you'll be but an annoyance, which would greatly dishonor it. With this weapon, I can change history. With me, this weapon can shape the universe."

Modified:

"A weapon is only as powerful as its wielder. With this fleet, you'll be but an annoyance, which would greatly dishonor it. With this fleet, I can change history. With me, this fleet can shape the universe."

 :nod:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on September 20, 2013, 12:24:20 am
Spoon, if my roleplaying would affect the outcome of this Random EventTM, I'm thinking we should roleplay the meeting of the two admirals. Maybe a series of PM exchanges, which will be joined into a single post in the RP thread?

Oh, and what is the buffoon's actual rank? Rear Admiral, Vice Admiral etc?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Jellyfish on September 20, 2013, 02:45:32 am
Ten bucks say he's not even military, just a spoiled prince with a big name. I'm half tempted to go there myself and overwatch to ensure that whatever happens, happens smoothly, but I'm way too far.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on September 20, 2013, 09:15:55 am
Spoon, if my roleplaying would affect the outcome of this Random EventTM, I'm thinking we should roleplay the meeting of the two admirals. Maybe a series of PM exchanges, which will be joined into a single post in the RP thread?

Oh, and what is the buffoon's actual rank? Rear Admiral, Vice Admiral etc?
Yeah I was thinking of something along those lines. PM's or a seperate thread so everyone can see it unfold. Your call.
His rank is High Fleet Admiral, because those are the joys bestowed on a Delest family member.


The United Guilds of Commerce have done the calculations and have determined that the higher payroll would be well offset by the positive propaganda. And thus decided to bestow the rank of Vice admiral on Andrew Bradwater and Yuen Ah Luc. Let me know what trait you guys want.

There are also whispers in the halls of the CRF HQ about a upcoming series of promotions for the brave CRF admirals on the frontlines. Be sure to keep your ears open for the rumours.

And in news for Sol Force, the Kaze II, Ray IV and Clarents are starting to roll off the production lines in large numbers. You guys can expect these to arrive at the frontlines soon.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on September 20, 2013, 09:18:54 am
Hm. PMs, I think. I'm not sure I'd like everybody else to be shouting suggestions at me during what is supposed to be a private meeting. Should we do it now, or after the turn?

Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on September 20, 2013, 09:28:25 am
Pm's it shall be, after the turn.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: AndrewofDoom on September 20, 2013, 10:24:00 am
Okay I get promoted, I choose Glorious Bastard Aggressive Leader.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Jellyfish on September 20, 2013, 12:10:11 pm
Since, if I recall, only three allied fleets can be in one system at the same time, I have changed the orders to go to Virgo.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 20, 2013, 12:12:55 pm
Since, if I recall, only three allied fleets can be in one system at the same time, I have changed the orders to go to Virgo.

There will only be three fleets. You, me and DJ. You don't need to go to Virgo.

Fleet: 1st CSA
First Action: Major, Defend
Second Action: Minor, -op do-nothing

Why don't you want to kill the Nordera :confused:

EDIT: Also, staying in Hydra will block someone else from coming in.

The 2nd LSF is already there and will hopefully perform a double Resupply, and two other fleets are coming:

Fleet: 2nd DD
First action: Major, Resupply
Second action: Minor, Travel to Hydra
Fleet: 3rd SF
First Action - Minor - Travel to Hydra
Second Action - Major - Defend
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Dragon on September 20, 2013, 01:05:22 pm
My smartphone can't zoom in on the map for some reason, I'm afraid I'm out till sunday evening. Will probably give orders on monday.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Jellyfish on September 20, 2013, 01:16:38 pm
There will only be three fleets. You, me and DJ. You don't need to go to Virgo.

True. Missed the UGCR's orders going to Crux. Changing mine (and hope Spoon isn't very confused)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 20, 2013, 01:28:03 pm
My smartphone can't zoom in on the map for some reason, I'm afraid I'm out till sunday evening. Will probably give orders on monday.
NO! :D

The deadline is Sunday. Please trust me and perform a double Resupply. You got hit by the Nordera's suicide attack and took 60% capital ship damage, but the system is now friendly because the Nordera are gone, so you can double Resupply.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: SpardaSon21 on September 20, 2013, 01:38:12 pm
Any idea where the 1st LSF is needed?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 20, 2013, 01:46:33 pm
Any idea where the 1st LSF is needed?
Hi. For you I think you should double Resupply:

1st LSF Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 14 (19+5+1)
- Capital attack strength: 7 (14+1)
- Fighters at 40% Strength, 4th Gen
- Capital ships at 46% Strength
- Morale: High
- Combined Arms on Cooldown, Available again on Turn 8

Then, next turn, your position in Virgo will be excellent for deciding which front you should head to.

EDIT: You'll also be in a position to... "interject" into that meeting in Aquarius if necessary... :)

There will only be three fleets. You, me and DJ. You don't need to go to Virgo.

True. Missed the UGCR's orders going to Crux. Changing mine (and hope Spoon isn't very confused)

Almost forgot you. Thanks. Don't worry about Spoon though, it's easy for him. He doesn't need to pay any attention to that until the deadline hits and the orders become final.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Admiral MS on September 20, 2013, 01:55:28 pm
My smartphone can't zoom in on the map for some reason, I'm afraid I'm out till sunday evening. Will probably give orders on monday.
NO! :D

The deadline is Sunday. Please trust me and perform a double Resupply. You got hit by the Nordera's suicide attack and took 60% capital ship damage, but the system is now friendly because the Nordera are gone, so you can double Resupply.
He can post his turn on monday (first read, then think, then post :p):
Next turn: Sunday 29-09
Order deadline: Wednesday: 25-09

If the space elves want to stay in Hydra I'll move to Tamy and get ready to have some fun elsewhere like Vega (or support a fellow DD Admiral in Aquarius *was just passing by*).
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 20, 2013, 02:01:09 pm
He can post his turn on monday (first read, then think, then post :p):
Next turn: Sunday 29-09
Order deadline: Wednesday: 25-09
Thank you. I mixed them up somehow. Probably because I didn't expect it to be so long to the next turn.

I thought it was deadline this Sunday, turn this Wednesday. :)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on September 20, 2013, 08:54:37 pm
Okay I get promoted, I choose Glorious Bastard Aggressive Leader.

Woohoo!  And "Master in Logistics" for me, efficiency is the motto of the UGCR (and I love not needing missiles in the supply line :))

Edit: I was wondering, there seem to be a number of fleets resupplying near or on the front lines.  What are the exact triggers for the "extra damage if attacked while resupplying" condition?

Quote from: from post 1
Resupply: Can only be done in a friendly system with an open supply route, resupplying will replenish 30% of the fleet's strength and raise the morale back to the fleet's base stat if it was lower than that. Take care not to get attacked while resupplying, its bad for morale and your fleet will take extra damage. Resupplying takes 10 resouces from the global resource pool.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 20, 2013, 09:42:37 pm
Quote from: from post 1
Resupply: Can only be done in a friendly system with an open supply route, resupplying will replenish 30% of the fleet's strength and raise the morale back to the fleet's base stat if it was lower than that. Take care not to get attacked while resupplying, its bad for morale and your fleet will take extra damage. Resupplying takes 10 resouces from the global resource pool.

Hmmm. Aldebaran will be nearly safe since you UGCR guys are going to stop the Heirarchy coming in. And I don't think the Fura'ngle will come in on their own. But unless Droid changes his mind and attacks the Nordera, it would probably be a good idea to pull Dragon off the front and have him Resupply at the back.

You take 5 damage per resupply and 5 damage per fleet. So Dragon could potentially take a massive 30/30 before we even get to damage inflicted if he gets hit by 3 fleets. That's if he does a double Resupply in the system. However, we also suspect being hit by the 3 fleets in Kardoen would be an instant kill on anyone anyway so does it matter? But yes, that's something to think about. If Dragon got hit by 2 fleets, they'd still need to do 73% damage after losing the 20/20 to destroy him. Hertak default is 41 capship damage, so it might be safer to get Dragon off the front line. And we don't need to be taking the morale hit either way. Good thinking niffiwan. Weird that I thought of this for the Zy and not our own.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on September 21, 2013, 01:56:02 am
Uhhh, Spoon? I hate to be an annoyance, but the week after the turn I will have to move to the UK and set up camp for my doctorate studies. I am pretty sure that I will have time to log in, see what's going on and post my fleet's moves, but I will probably not have enough time for RP. Do you think you could find some time during this weekend or next week? I promise I will not disclose the result of our tete-a-tete before the end of the turn.

If it is impossible for you, I understand.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on September 21, 2013, 09:12:26 am
Edit: I was wondering, there seem to be a number of fleets resupplying near or on the front lines.  What are the exact triggers for the "extra damage if attacked while resupplying" condition?
When a fleet is attacked after it has resupplied and before the start of its next turn, it takes the extra damage.
So like
Turn 5: Player Fleet 1 resupplies -> Enemy Fleet A attacks and deals extra damage -> Turn 6: Player Fleet 1 is in pain -> Enemy Fleet A laughs.
In reverse
Turn 5: Player Fleet 1 does whatever -> Enemy Fleet A resupplies -> Turn 6: Player Fleet 1 attacks and deals extra damage -> Fleet A panics.

Uhhh, Spoon? I hate to be an annoyance, but the week after the turn I will have to move to the UK and set up camp for my doctorate studies. I am pretty sure that I will have time to log in, see what's going on and post my fleet's moves, but I will probably not have enough time for RP. Do you think you could find some time during this weekend or next week? I promise I will not disclose the result of our tete-a-tete before the end of the turn.

If it is impossible for you, I understand.
I see I see, no problem.
We'll do it this week instead then!


Oh and Torchwood told me he was willing to continue playing. (I just need him to confirm it in here)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on September 21, 2013, 09:34:36 am
Perfect. I have pretty much established my approach to Aquarius in the RP thread. I will expect the pipsqueak's response whenever you're ready - say Monday?

If you want, we could agree on an RP time, to get through the session quickly. Rapid fired PMs for the win.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: CommanderDJ on September 21, 2013, 09:39:25 am
I'm now considering whether I might be better off moving to Virgo instead of defending Aldebaran: the situation in the northern front seems to be mostly under control, and with those slipstreaming Zy fleets, the situation down south looks to be in much worse shape. Thoughts?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 21, 2013, 11:07:55 am
Oh and Torchwood told me he was willing to continue playing. (I just need him to confirm it in here)
Nice! Will you allow his fleet to be prepared as if he made the decision straight after being destroyed please?

I'm now considering whether I might be better off moving to Virgo instead of defending Aldebaran: the situation in the northern front seems to be mostly under control, and with those slipstreaming Zy fleets, the situation down south looks to be in much worse shape. Thoughts?

I would stay in Aldebaran. We can always send Sparda down as well next turn if necessary, and hopefully, a stronger Enioch will be returning to the front line as well.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on September 21, 2013, 11:48:40 pm
So what about this attack in Draco, if we only have the 1st and 4th CRF engaging..

Lorric can you provide me some numbers please? or pm me how on earth you figure these things out so I can try myself? :)

Much appreciated!
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 22, 2013, 12:01:25 am
So what about this attack in Draco, if we only have the 1st and 4th CRF engaging..

Lorric can you provide me some numbers please? or pm me how on earth you figure these things out so I can try myself? :)

Much appreciated!
I know we can't kill them (or I wouldn't want three of us to attack.) Let's see...

1st CRF Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 21+10=31 (16+2+3)
- Capital attack strength: 20+11=31 (17+3)
- Fighters at 100% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 100% Strength
- Morale: Zealous

4th CRF Fleet (+ Zeal)
- Fighter attack strength: 20+9=29 (16+2+2)
- Capital attack strength: 18+10=28 (17+2)
- Fighters at 100% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 95% Strength
- Morale: Very High

Damage: 60/59 Received - 8/7 per fleet.

vs.

3rd Nordera Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 10+5=15 (10+3)
Capital attack strength: 9+5=14 (8+3)
Fighters at 69% Strength
Capital ships at 70% Strength
Morale: Zealous

So they'll be down to 9/11.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on September 22, 2013, 12:07:43 am
And the 4th Nordera is stronger again yea?.

Hmm.. interesting, this could cause them to ram us and end up with the 3rd being destroyed and the 4th going berserk. (or one can hope I guess).

Considering the small damage, we should probably still consider the attack. The counter-attack is were we'd take our losses, and if reinforcements enter, we're wide open.

Good stuff :D Thanks for figures!
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 22, 2013, 12:10:57 am
And the 4th Nordera is stronger again yea?.

Hmm.. interesting, this could cause them to ram us and end up with the 3rd being destroyed and the 4th going berserk. (or one can hope I guess).

Considering the small damage, we should probably still consider the attack. The counter-attack is were we'd take our losses, and if reinforcements enter, we're wide open.

Good stuff :D Thanks for figures!
4th Nordera is full strength, it hasn't been in battle yet. I too think we should still hit the 3rd Nordera whether Droid engages or not.

Would you still like to learn how to calculate the numbers? I'll walk you through this particular calculation if you like.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on September 22, 2013, 12:12:52 am
Sure :). I'm sure I've got it mostly figured out, I just don't trust my own figures :D
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 22, 2013, 12:23:19 am
Sure :). I'm sure I've got it mostly figured out, I just don't trust my own figures :D
Alright. Let's bring it back up again:

1st CRF Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 21+10=31 (16+2+3)
- Capital attack strength: 20+11=31 (17+3)
- Fighters at 100% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 100% Strength
- Morale: Zealous

4th CRF Fleet (+ Zeal)
- Fighter attack strength: 20+9=29 (16+2+2)
- Capital attack strength: 18+10=28 (17+2)
- Fighters at 100% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 95% Strength
- Morale: Very High

Damage: 60/59 Received - 8/7 per fleet.

vs.

3rd Nordera Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 10+5=15 (10+3)
Capital attack strength: 9+5=14 (8+3)
Fighters at 69% Strength
Capital ships at 70% Strength
Morale: Zealous

So they'll be down to 9/11.

---

Damage is the base stat plus half of the other base stat. So for instance your capital attack strength is 20+ half of your fighter attack strength. 21/2 = 10.5. Spoon rounds up for damage, so it's 11. 20+11 = 31.

the + bonuses in the brackets are absolute bonuses. No matter what your strength, you'll always have them added on in full. So it was a simple task of adding +1 to each of the 4th CRFs stats for his Zeal. No matter how weak he might have been, he'd get the +1 in full.

Finally, the Nordera's damage is split between the fleets. The damage is always spread equally and rounded up. Thus 15/7 = 7.5 = 8 damage per fleet, and 14/2 = 7 damage per fleet.

Do you understand?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 22, 2013, 01:21:35 am
I am making another appeal to Droid to please travel to Draco and kill the 3rd Nordera. In addition to this:

Fleet: 1st CSA
First Action: Major, Defend
Second Action: Minor, -op do-nothing

Why don't you want to kill the Nordera :confused:

EDIT: Also, staying in Hydra will block someone else from coming in.

The 2nd LSF is already there and will hopefully perform a double Resupply, and two other fleets are coming:

Fleet: 2nd DD
First action: Major, Resupply
Second action: Minor, Travel to Hydra
Fleet: 3rd SF
First Action - Minor - Travel to Hydra
Second Action - Major - Defend

Not killing the 3rd Nordera leaves the door open for the 4th Nordera to go up and join the 2nd Zy in a joint attack. Killing the 3rd Nordera means they can't do this without consequences. They either would have to take massive retreat damage from the 3 fleets in the system, or they'd have to wait for another fleet to arrive to cover them, and they then wouldn't be able to attack.

We'll also be in a better formation for the next turn with 3 fleets in the central system free to attack into any of Hydra, Draco or Vega. There'll only be two if the 1st CSA remains in Hydra.

If I'm the Hieracrhy, I don't care about Hydra. I'm going to be pushing into Draco and Vega to support the 2nd and 3rd Zy. The Hierarchy already showed they don't care about Hydra by letting us have it. I'm confident the main battle is moving to Draco and Vega. I will be very surprised if any Hierarchy fleets travel to Hydra next turn.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Droid803 on September 22, 2013, 02:14:45 am
Re:double resupply - that's a good way to bait being killed. A double resupply probably means that it won't even take all three fleets in Karoden to 'alpha' the 2nd LSF into oblivion given their really-low capship count. The 2nd LSF should pull back to Odin to resupply, and NOT risk being horribly murdered by being attacked during/after resupply in Hydra. The "?" also kind of scares me - makes me think it might be something...worse than a regular hertak fleet.

Still, you do make a convincing point of moving and allowing the 2nd DD and 3rd SF to hold Hydra. If someone is going to get alpha'd by the three fleets in Karoden...better to kill them corderas.

It shall be done.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on September 22, 2013, 02:20:32 am
Hey folks

I've been giving some thought on how we should better deal with the STACK OF DOOM and have come to some conclusions.

Provided some conditions are met, we can beat them with no losses. Granted, those conditions would require some work on our part and, possibly, some re-thinking of our plans.

Consider the following scenarios:

(http://img19.imageshack.us/img19/8980/1r0k.jpg)

In the first case, the STACK attacks a defense force of three fleets in a neighboring system. The STACK does terrible terrible damage and we lose a fleet, while they take only little damage, spread out over their three fleets. Essentially, they took a fleet for free. We then reinforce the system and counter-attack, but the fleet is gone.

In the second scenario, the STACK is separated from our defense fleet by a buffer - system. They wish to attack, and so they advance to the intermediate system. They now have two choices (indicated by the upper and lower arrows)

A) they secure the system and wait. If they do that, we can attack them with three fleets next turn, do massive damage to a Hertak fleet and take only limited damage in return. This will drastically improve our fleets' survival chances, because the STACK will be unable to do its full damage next turn. Done properly, our attack will probably do ~90% damage to the Hertak, while we only take ~10-12% damage per fleet.

B) they secure the system (thus losing a fleet's second action) and move on. This is very bad for them. They only advance with two fleets and cannot attack. We can counterattack like in case A, and our position is better.

Essentially, I am suggesting sacrificing systems for fleets. Thoughts? Is this viable?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lepanto on September 22, 2013, 11:15:09 am
Hey folks

I've been giving some thought on how we should better deal with the STACK OF DOOM and have come to some conclusions.

Provided some conditions are met, we can beat them with no losses. Granted, those conditions would require some work on our part and, possibly, some re-thinking of our plans.

Consider the following scenarios:

(http://img19.imageshack.us/img19/8980/1r0k.jpg)

In the first case, the STACK attacks a defense force of three fleets in a neighboring system. The STACK does terrible terrible damage and we lose a fleet, while they take only little damage, spread out over their three fleets. Essentially, they took a fleet for free. We then reinforce the system and counter-attack, but the fleet is gone.

In the second scenario, the STACK is separated from our defense fleet by a buffer - system. They wish to attack, and so they advance to the intermediate system. They now have two choices (indicated by the upper and lower arrows)

A) they secure the system and wait. If they do that, we can attack them with three fleets next turn, do massive damage to a Hertak fleet and take only limited damage in return. This will drastically improve our fleets' survival chances, because the STACK will be unable to do its full damage next turn. Done properly, our attack will probably do ~90% damage to the Hertak, while we only take ~10-12% damage per fleet.

B) they secure the system (thus losing a fleet's second action) and move on. This is very bad for them. They only advance with two fleets and cannot attack. We can counterattack like in case A, and our position is better.

Essentially, I am suggesting sacrificing systems for fleets. Thoughts? Is this viable?

Huh. Let's see if we can make something like this work, as long as we take all strategic factors into account.

The Hydra fleets should be able to fall back to Odin/Tamy without a problem, putting them out of the range of any Hierarchy attack and leaving them well-positioned to counterattack any units that move into Hydra.

If the Draco fleets fall back to Vega, at least one of them will take damage on retreating, the 3rd and 4th Nordera will be able to give chase and attack, and the 2nd Zy will hit one allied fleet for decent damage when it arrives in Draco. They will be out of the DoomStack's attack range, though.

If the Draco fleets fall all the way back to Aquarius, they'll also take damage on retreating, and only be able to counterattack any enemy units that move into Vega. But they'll be out of range of any Hierarchy attack this turn, and will take less damage from any Hierarchy attack for as long as they're fighting in Aquarius. They will definitely be able to counterattack the 2nd Zy, but if the DoomStack moves to Draco on this turn, any fleets attacking the 2nd Zy in Vega on the next turn will be vulnerable to a counterattack by DoomStack units on that turn.

Thoughts, anyone?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 22, 2013, 11:53:45 am
It's nice to see someone else propose a plan, Enioch, and at first, you had me excited about it thinking it might work. But, unfortunately, I don’t think it would work.

First, I think the strategic position of having Hydra, Draco and Vega linked in mutual support is worth the sacrifice of a fleet vs. allowing the Hierarchy to split us all up and losing that support. With the stuff that's coming through in the South, I think we'd be hard pressed to get those systems back. If they force the issue on the front where the Zy are coming in, they'll just smash right through. All they need to do is put the Nordera in Hydra to stall us.

But then I saw the real danger. All they have to do is have the two Nordera fleets conquer the vacant systems and have the rest hang back. We’d have to attack, as they’d just collect more and more reinforcements, then we’d get smashed by the stack of doom anyway.

In addition, the power of the ? Hertak unit might render such a thing moot anyway even if the plan worked exactly as you hope it would. I'd take the damage, then use the position we're in to hit back HARD. We can probably triple team two targets next turn.

Again though, It’s nice to see someone else proposed an idea.

EDIT: And Droid, thank you for switching orders. Operation Fluffcats 2 is go! :)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 22, 2013, 11:51:50 pm
Some comments on the Turn 7 video.

Those Leopard fighters look like beastly ships, no pun intended. Love the weapons on them and the effects when they’re shooting up those Zy fighters, it just gives a feeling of power to me. What are they launching from? I thought it was on a planet at first with the sun shining like that, very cool opening to the video. I really wish I could jump into the Leopard and go fight that battle. It was quite an intense-looking battle.

The second part, Hydra is truly beautiful. That’s probably my favourite background I’ve seen put to WoD, previously it was Lyrae, which is why I took the opportunity to post some shots in the RP thread while I was in… Librae. Damn, I mixed up the systems! :lol: I have a test map for FREDding WoD, and it has the Lyrae background. I enjoyed watching all the Nordera exploding, and seeing the Cyrvans in action. Of course, I didn’t enjoy the Nordera counterattack, although at the time of the first viewing I did because I thought it was just a fun sequence since it doesn’t explain what actually happened. It's good of course, but damn those suicidal fanatics! :hopping:

I've also noticed there seems to be a lot more fighters floating around. I like that. I also like how more time was devoted to individual battles, although there were only three of them this time, so I don't know if that will change in a turn with like 6 battles. They always leave me wanting to see more, see the battle go on longer. :)

Oh, how do those Zy capital ships stack up against Terran capital ships, as in in-game not the forum game?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Droid803 on September 23, 2013, 12:41:03 am
Some comments on the Turn 7 video.

Those Leopard fighters look like beastly ships, no pun intended. Love the weapons on them and the effects when they’re shooting up those Zy fighters, it just gives a feeling of power to me. What are they launching from? I thought it was on a planet at first with the sun shining like that, very cool opening to the video. I really wish I could jump into the Leopard and go fight that battle. It was quite an intense-looking battle.

The thing the fighters are launching from is *probably* a Rhino (Baikal) shown in one of the earlier turn vids (turn 2), judging from how the bay doors open and the launch is "downwards", and you also see one later on in the same battle.

Could be wrong though.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 23, 2013, 12:46:18 pm
The thing the fighters are launching from is *probably* a Rhino (Baikal) shown in one of the earlier turn vids (turn 2), judging from how the bay doors open and the launch is "downwards", and you also see one later on in the same battle.

Could be wrong though.
Sounds reasonable.

Spoon, I have a request. Could you put the names of the music tracks used into the description boxes of your turn videos and future turn videos please? I am particularly interested in the one used for the Nordera gang-bang/suicide. Now doesn't that just sound wrong? :lol:

There are others I will be seeking out too if I know their names.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 23, 2013, 04:33:08 pm
I'm just pondering something. The Turn 0 map:

(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/WoD%20Forum%20Game/ForumgameStarmapT0_zpsb50a4b2a.png~original)

I wonder how things would have gone if the 1st UGCR and 2nd CRF had rushed into Crux and the 1st and 2nd LSF fleets had rushed into Kardoen on the very first turn. I'm sure we could have held them both and bottled up the Hierarchy...

The Zy would of course have eventually come to open up new fronts, but it would have changed everything...

Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on September 23, 2013, 04:36:44 pm
Maybe.  Just remember the 1st fleets are 150%, and our reinforcements would have been 1 move further away.  Perhaps if we hadn't attacked at all we may have held them...
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 23, 2013, 04:46:05 pm
Maybe.  Just remember the 1st fleets are 150%, and our reinforcements would have been 1 move further away.  Perhaps if we hadn't attacked at all we may have held them...
The heaviest damage the Hierarchy could have inflicted going by what they brought in on Turn 1 is as follows:

Aldebaran

1st Cordi Fleet Fighters: 30+9 = 39
1st Cordi Fleet Capital: 18+15 = 33
Fighters at 150% Strength
Capital ships at 150% Strength

2nd Cordi Fleet Fighters: 20+6 = 26
2nd Cordi Fleet Capital: 12+10 = 22
Fighters at 100% Strength
Capital ships at 100% Strength

3rd Cordi Fleet Fighters: 20+6 = 26
3rd Cordi Fleet Capital: 12+10 = 22
Fighters at 100% Strength
Capital ships at 100% Strength

Damage - 91/77

Kardoen

1st Nordera Fleet Fighters: 18+8 = 26
1st Nordera Fleet Capital: 15+9 = 24
Fighters at 150% Strength
Capital ships at 150% Strength

2nd Nordera Fleet Fighters: 12+5 = 17
2nd Nordera Fleet Capital: 10+6 = 16
Fighters at 100% Strength
Capital ships at 100% Strength

4th Cordi Fleet Fighters: 20+6 = 26
4th Cordi Fleet Capital: 12+10 = 22
Fighters at 100% Strength
Capital ships at 100% Strength

Damage - 69/62

That would not be enough. We'd have got our feet well under the table.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on September 23, 2013, 05:08:27 pm
(oh look, a what-if exercise! :))

On our turn 1 so we've got to retreat one fleet in each system (with a resupply each).  No reinforcements arrive on the front line that turn.

On our turn2, both the 2nd fleets needs to retreat but reinforcements will arrive just in time to cover them.  In fact we should have 3 fresh fleets in Crux & Kardoen at the end of the turn, with 2 moderately damaged fleets & 2 fresh fleets behind them.  We've only dealt trivial to the enemy by this point, but it shouldn't matter.  You're right, we would have held them there at the two chokepoints, at least until the Hertak arrived

Of course, it's far easier to make such a call after we know what the enemy stats are & how many reinforcements they got & when.  Hindsight & all :)

Here's another what-if, assume that due to our aggressive 1st moves, the 1st Zy & 1st Fura'ngle arrived one turn earlier in place of the 3rd/4th Cordi (queue-jumpers!)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 23, 2013, 05:31:17 pm
(oh look, a what-if exercise! :))
Yes. Fun. :)

The historians will be picking over the moves we made when this war is over with a fine toothcomb, judging us... but will those historians be Terran or Hertak...

Quote
Of course, it's far easier to make such a call after we know what the enemy stats are & how many reinforcements they got & when.  Hindsight & all :)

Indeed. I have no regrets.

Quote
Here's another what-if, assume that due to our aggressive 1st moves, the 1st Zy & 1st Fura'ngle arrived one turn earlier in place of the 3rd/4th Cordi (queue-jumpers!)

Actually, I've just noticed the 1st Fura'ngle up there in Algol on turn 1, I missed them before. So, new max damage potential in Kardoen:

1st Nordera Fleet Fighters: 18+8 = 26
1st Nordera Fleet Capital: 15+9 = 24
Fighters at 150% Strength
Capital ships at 150% Strength

4th Cordi Fleet Fighters: 20+6 = 26
4th Cordi Fleet Capital: 12+10 = 22
Fighters at 100% Strength
Capital ships at 100% Strength

1st Fura'ngle Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 22+15 = 37
Capital attack strength: 28+12 = 40
Fighters at 150% Strength
Capital ships at 150% Strength

Damage - 89/86

I reckon the addition of the 1st Zy could have smashed a fleet without calculating it, but Spoon did pledge not to do the one hit kill at that time, so he'd have probably sent them to Aldebaran instead of Tauri, with the 2nd Zy going to Tauri instead of showing up on the front, I predict.

Let's see anyway:

1st Cordi Fleet Fighters: 30+9 = 39
1st Cordi Fleet Capital: 18+15 = 33
Fighters at 150% Strength
Capital ships at 150% Strength

1st Zy Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 33+16=49
Capital attack strength: 32+17=49
Fighters at 150% Strength
Capital ships at 150% Strength

3rd Cordi Fleet Fighters: 20+6 = 26
3rd Cordi Fleet Capital: 12+10 = 22
Fighters at 100% Strength
Capital ships at 100% Strength

Damage - 114/104

Yeah I thought so, but it wouldn't have happened.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on September 23, 2013, 05:37:45 pm
The historians will be picking over the moves we made when this war is over with a fine toothcomb, judging us... but will those historians be Terran or Hertak...

From our history, I think it can be safely said that armchair "Admiral'ing" can & will occur even before the historians get involved  :lol:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 23, 2013, 05:45:53 pm
The historians will be picking over the moves we made when this war is over with a fine toothcomb, judging us... but will those historians be Terran or Hertak...

From our history, I think it can be safely said that armchair "Admiral'ing" can & will occur even before the historians get involved  :lol:
Oh yes. Parasite press and politicians will be in long before the historians unfortunately, such is the burden that you and I share as Fleet Admirals... :sigh:

Still, at least they didn't try to pass you off as a Cordi Shapeshifter! :lol:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Droid803 on September 23, 2013, 06:22:16 pm
Dragon's doing a double-resupply at the front lines.
Welp, lets hope that doesn't draw the DoomStack™'s attention.

Also, bottling at Crux is irrelevant. Containing them at Aldebaran serves the same interests, really.
The Karoden scenario, however, is more interesting to explore.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on September 23, 2013, 06:27:31 pm
it may offer an interesting choice to the Hierarchy, reinforce/support the Zy trapped behind enemy lines, or take out the 2nd LSF while they are vulnerable... lets just hope the ?? Hertak fleets doesn't let them do both...
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 23, 2013, 06:59:18 pm
Also, bottling at Crux is irrelevant. Containing them at Aldebaran serves the same interests, really.
The Karoden scenario, however, is more interesting to explore.
It does offer a fall back though if you're in Crux to end up in the same position.

But in the end, things probably wouldn't be much different to what they are now. The Zy would open up the top with their jumps, and then probably open the bottom up as well. I bet we could have contained the Hertak in Kardoen you know, but the Zy can open up more fronts.

it may offer an interesting choice to the Hierarchy, reinforce/support the Zy trapped behind enemy lines, or take out the 2nd LSF while they are vulnerable... lets just hope the ?? Hertak fleets doesn't let them do both...
Indeed. I advised Dragon about the situation shortly after he made his move via PM, but who knows, it could pay off, I think the Hierarchy want to go up to the Zy, not to Hydra. They might kill Dragon, but then they won't be where they want to be. Any fleet in Hydra can't attack into Vega for 2 turns. That's two turns for us to (hopefully) maul them.

Rather him than me though. I'd be pulling back.

It's all about the ? Hertak fleet. They might be able to kill two of our fleets if they're powerful enough.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on September 24, 2013, 07:30:46 am
I still reckon that if they hit Hydra, it will put the pressure onto us to abandon Draco. Which helps break the stalemate that we've held them up with here in the Southern Sector. As it becomes a lot harder for us to reinforce that position through Vega (assuming Hydra is contested), and if Hydra does become contested, then Draco has to flee through 2 systems to get to a friendly location.

However, it's just speculation :) I'm going to help kill the 3rd Nordera first.

EDIT:

As for being able to have held or holding Crux and Karden. Interesting but you have no idea what would come knocking on your doorstep next turn, and they would attack immediately.

But if Karoden was held, it would give back Algol (+3), same with Draco and Hydra (+1 & +3). But hey, we're doing pretty well so far, and we'll just keep at it. Chipping away at the boulder :)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 24, 2013, 11:41:01 pm
2nd Zy, Crux -> Aldebaran -> Slipstream Vega ETA Turn 8
3rd Zy, Unknown -> Crux -> Slipstream Vega ETA Turn 9

Sneaky Zy. I didn't notice this before. This is just cheeky. Especially the 2nd Zy coming into Aldebaran and then "Slipstreaming" out, that system was empty of Hierarchy fleets and we couldn't even deal them retreat damage. I hope there's a cooldown/one time deal on that ability, because it's even more potent if the Zy can just backdoor out of systems without the retreat penalty. Since it only takes one action they could do nasty things like attack, then slipstream somewhere else, getting a guaranteed first strike when they arrive. If there's no limit on the move, they could just slipstream back and forth always getting the first strike and never being able to be pinned down. I imagine there must be some sort of limit on it though, or they'd be doing that already.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Droid803 on September 25, 2013, 12:18:17 am
Well, the question is, why the hell did they go to Aldebaran in the first place?
The other zy fleet slipstreamed from Crux just fine. Apparently it cut down a turn of slipstream travel or something, because it's "closer"?

Also, there was a Hierarchy fleet in Aldebaran : the 5th Cordi were there and ate it on the retreat. Presumably that covered the Zy?
I don't know if it quite works like that know.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 25, 2013, 12:37:44 am
Well, the question is, why the hell did they go to Aldebaran in the first place?
The other zy fleet slipstreamed from Crux just fine. Apparently it cut down a turn of slipstream travel or something, because it's "closer"?

Also, there was a Hierarchy fleet in Aldebaran : the 5th Cordi were there and ate it on the retreat. Presumably that covered the Zy?
I don't know if it quite works like that know.
I'm sure it cut down the distance to the system, you can see it on the map.

If two fleets retreat, they both take damage, you can see it when the 1st Zy hit me and Jellyfish when we exited Tauri. I suppose it's possible the Cordi might have managed to cover the retreat of the 2nd Zy, but I think they were there to cover the retreat of the 1st Zy.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: X3N0-Life-Form on September 25, 2013, 06:19:14 am
Alright, I just posted my move, however, due to me not being able to get a steady connection until the deadline, I authorize other Sol Force admirals to override those orders if necessary.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 25, 2013, 10:12:07 am
Alright, I just posted my move, however, due to me not being able to get a steady connection until the deadline, I authorize other Sol Force admirals to override those orders if necessary.
Hi. Your move should be the correct one. We need someone there to hold the Zy in check, and that someone is you. :)

Hopefully Enioch and someone else will be able to join you next turn.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on September 25, 2013, 03:26:49 pm
Right now I'm on antibiotics (for a possible lyme disease infection), and I'm feeling really sleepy because of it. I'm still on these meds for 7 more days so I'm gonna put the game onhold for a <undefined> period until I'm feeling yay and woohoo again. I'm not really suffering from any symptoms right now (aside from an occasional headache) but I just can't really concentrate on typing proper words or doing math.

So I'm not dying or anything (no need to panic, lorric) and we'll probably be back in business in a week from here.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 25, 2013, 03:58:20 pm
(no need to panic, lorric)

Oh well, in that case I won't need to be sending those nice anime nurses to go and take care of you... ;)

Good luck with that Spoon.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Flak on September 25, 2013, 11:01:52 pm
That aside, any idea how the DD ships are going to look like?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 26, 2013, 11:11:10 am
It's AndrewofDoom's birthday. Happy birthday! :)

How about a birthday present, Spoon? Another promotion? Some shiny new 4th Generation fighters? :D
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Flak on September 26, 2013, 08:46:13 pm
umm, I thought those elves already get 5th gen by default
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on September 26, 2013, 08:53:18 pm
You are maybe confusing Andrew (UGCR) with Droid (CSA)?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Droid803 on September 26, 2013, 09:06:13 pm
Whatever, big diff.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Flak on September 26, 2013, 11:18:48 pm
Maybe I just did? Right, maybe get some present in the form of Cyrvan fighters? Nerfed hard of course, because 'feeble merrans' have trouble with the controls.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 26, 2013, 11:44:30 pm
Maybe I just did? Right, maybe get some present in the form of Cyrvan fighters? Nerfed hard of course, because 'feeble merrans' have trouble with the controls.
They would be wasted on us sadly. We can't handle them. I remember there was a pretty long debate about nerfing Aestivals for Terrans somewhere, and I'm pretty sure the outcome was that it isn't viable/worth it.

We've seen Aestivals before. I want to see Terran 4th Gen fighters in Spoon's vids! :D

If we get Cyrvan stuff, I want to see "2nd CSA" show up on the map. :pimp:

Anyway, the 1st LSF actually has a higher rating than the 1st CSA for fighters with their 4th gen fighters. The Cyrvans have been brutalised with the nerf bat now, they're only a little better than we are now. Who needs Aestivals! :D
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on September 27, 2013, 12:00:44 am
I figure the CSA fleet has approx 1/4 the ships of a Terran fleet  :p
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Jellyfish on September 27, 2013, 02:09:18 am
Weren't Aestivals really outdated, with current CSA forces not using them anymore?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on September 27, 2013, 02:26:10 am
Weren't Aestivals really outdated, with current CSA forces not using them anymore?
The JGASF had a couple of old Aestivals taken in the war. But the Cyrvans still have them, just newer versions. You can see at least one Aestival floating around in the latest turn video.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on October 07, 2013, 08:20:59 am
Hey, Spoon, you still alive? Don't take this to be a 'CAN WE PLAY YET?' complaint - thingy (I leave that for Lorric  :p) but I'm just worried for you, because we've heard nothing from you this last week.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on October 07, 2013, 09:42:41 am
(I leave that for Lorric  :p)
Hey... :hopping:

 :D
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on October 08, 2013, 05:24:11 pm
Sorry about the lack of communication, didnt wanted to turn this into a 'Spoon whines about life blog'
In short its like this:
Yay done with antibiotics, lets get productive again  :)
Blah its hard to get into a working groove  :blah:
Yay LAN party this weekend  :)
I'm now tired from this LAN  :blah:
Augh, I caught a throat virus, and I was just getting used feeling healthy again!  :sigh:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on October 08, 2013, 06:29:20 pm
Spoon you're a mess. A likeable one, but a mess nonetheless. You must have the immune system of ... something with a very poor immune system.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on October 08, 2013, 06:29:50 pm
I very rarely get sick
And that was the moment when fate began to chuckle... :sigh:

Your body must be starting to resemble your forum game with the different types of bugs flooding in to test your defences...

Well, good luck in repelling your "Heirarchy" so then we can continue to attempt to repel ours. :)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on October 08, 2013, 09:35:25 pm
Just like mine.. For some reason my immune system has flicked the off-switch. :/

Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Axem on October 08, 2013, 10:23:55 pm
(http://cdn.someecards.com/someecards/filestorage/feel-better-guiltlessly-make-get-well-ecard-someecards.jpg)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on October 20, 2013, 11:10:33 am
It's been a while!
Good news though, we'll be able to continue the game very soon from now. (Currently resolving the RP bits with Enioch)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on October 20, 2013, 02:56:52 pm
And they're whoppers.  :D
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Droid803 on October 23, 2013, 02:08:56 pm
The DoomStack™ came.
The DoomStack™ saw.
The DoomStack™ claimed one of fleets.

o7 2nd DD o7
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: X3N0-Life-Form on October 23, 2013, 02:12:11 pm
Dat capship strength  :eek:

Things are getting ... interesting.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on October 23, 2013, 02:32:14 pm
A new turn (at last!), vid in a bit. No set new turn deadline yet since I wanna give everyone involved enough time to realize things have restarted again.

Vice Admiral Georgiy Kuznetsov (Admiral MS), your fleet has been crushed under the Hertak tidal wave as you were resupplying.
Would you like to continue y/n?


So to share some of my thoughts on this forum game
First of all, its been far more successful then I expected it would be, even with my (rather frequent) inability to seemingly hold myself to the deadlines (and still not having caught up with the the turn vids), which is of course all thanks to you cool players.

Second of, what I've been struggling with is how long it takes to process a turn for me. (I honestly should get around to make a spreadsheet for easier info management) I'm thinking of ways to streamline this and right now I'm looking at the fighter/capital ship strength part of things. The original intent of having a seperate capital ship and fighter strength mechanic was to have it be... meaningful in some way. But right now, in its current state, I do not feel like it adds much to the game. More often than not, a fleet seems to be taking damage spread equally over fighters and capitalships anyway. So there might be a change to that coming (I'm open to your opinions on this)

Third, I have clearly underestimated the prowess of you admirals. I had fully expected the Hierarchy to have made it far far deeper into Terran territory by this point. Hell, I'm bloody nearly out of fleets to throw at you guys. (I could of course just conjure up some more out of thin air but hey) And because of that, it seems the Sol Force fleets have sort of gotten the short end of the special ability stick. There has been very few occasions where a blitz might have been useful. This in contrast to the other abilities which have seen use throughout the whole game so far. I'm also going to be looking at changing that (again, open to opinions) 


Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lepanto on October 23, 2013, 02:48:38 pm
Yowch.

The North is as secure as it'll get. Some Northern fleets need to reinforce the south, which is in danger of collapse, with the DoomStack running amok. We need to consider our next move VERY carefully. The Hertak Flag Fleet is obviously our main target, but how do we go about killing it? Should we pounce it right now with everything in the area, doing some damage, but inevitably losing at least one fleet next turn? It looks like attrition is the only way we'll be able to take that monster down.

Spoon, nice to see you're back, and we're back in business!  :D

Maybe, if you wanted to keep fighter strength meaningful, you could let players give fighters different orders/stances or something like that. If you put fighters on aggressive stance, you'd take more fighter casualties, but do more damage. Basically, give players some more tactical options with fighters, which will change the combat dynamics, so fighters take damage at different rates than capships do.

Spoon, you have thrown enough fleets at us already.  ;) At this rate, with your DoomStack on the loose, it's entirely possible that we'll still lose. As for Blitz, yeah, at this point, I'd suggest retooling it. Maybe, if you use Blitz, it counts as 2 move actions, so you can move in, hit the enemy, and pull out in the same turn.

 Are you willing to tell us if killing the Flag Fleet is a victory condition? Also, any news on promotions?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Droid803 on October 23, 2013, 03:36:22 pm
It seems the Sol Force fleets have sort of gotten the short end of the special ability stick.

At least they have one!
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on October 23, 2013, 03:55:08 pm
I need some time. Might not be able to contribute today. I've been unusually busy lately. That's why I haven't spoken about Enioch's RP post yet, I need time to do it properly.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on October 23, 2013, 04:58:47 pm
yowsers, that flag fleet... with that kind of toughness I think we'll take losses when attacking it no matter what we do.

Maybe the 2nd CRF / 1st SF / 4th SF could head to Kardoen to cut the Hierachy supply lines and prevent them from resupplying easily?  With the fleets we can currently see, the 1st & 2nd UGCR should be able to hold the north by themselves.

Re the fighters, perhaps you could combine the two ideas mooted so far?  i.e. remove the fighters as a separate component, but also give them the options of stances which affect the base fleet strength, something along the lines of recon would seem very fitting as well, although I can't figure out what sort of bonus that could give at the moment (hmm... less damage dealt due to fighters carrying less ordnance, less damage taken due to better intel?)

For Blitz, maybe remove the requirement that you must move into a non-friendly system?

It seems the Sol Force fleets have sort of gotten the short end of the special ability stick.

At least they have one!

You've got Acting Smug, what are you complaining about? :p

Hmmm... what about an ability to go with that, activate "Acting Smug" when you've just destroyed a fleet, get a bonus +25% fleet strength for a turn?  (take care, I haven't thought that through very much...)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on October 23, 2013, 05:57:39 pm
Hell, I'm bloody nearly out of fleets to throw at you guys.
Kill them all. Ignore the Hertak Flagship fleet. Kill everything else. The Hertak Flagship fleet is nothing without any other fleets backing it up.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Admiral MS on October 23, 2013, 06:11:21 pm
Vice Admiral Georgiy Kuznetsov (Admiral MS), your fleet has been crushed under the Hertak tidal wave as you were resupplying.
Would you like to continue y/n?
Obviously I want to continue. I mean I got a clean 100% kill without any chances  :eek2: :( - how can I leave that standing?  :mad2: :mad:
And I think you forgot my still active barrage again - while it's not much I expect it to be applied in this case! Also I guess my resupplying was already done when I moved to Hydra, doesn't make a difference for the combat but makes my death less "crushed while resupplying" and more "fought to the bitter end with a full strength fleet".

So what do I do now while being out of the game during the most interesting part of it...?

Edit: Do we even have the ressources for all the fleet rebuilding?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on October 23, 2013, 06:22:14 pm
Quote
Kill them all. Ignore the Hertak Flagship fleet. Kill everything else. The Hertak Flagship fleet is nothing without any other fleets backing it up.

No, Lorric. Seriously? Just no.

At this point, the Flag Fleet does 167 Cap damage, more than enough to solo-kill any defender, with the exception of myself (at full capacity). If we slam it hard enough, we might get it down to a ~ 140 damage output  (which would allow a full strength mercenary fleet to survive an engagement)- but we need to drop it to 420% cap strength for that. And while we do that, the other fleets will hammer us.

If we ignore the Flag Fleet and focus on the escorts, we will need ca 1 turn per escort - maybe more. Meanwhile, the Flag Fleet will be killing one of our fleets every turn.

We will take losses here, gentlemen, make no mistake.

I recommend we pull two fleets from Aldebaran to Algol and smash the defenses in Kardoen. Let's leave one fleet upstairs, to provide rotation for the frontline and give us a three-fleet stack, if necessary.

X3NO and myself will hit the Zy in Vega. Let me see: I can output...uh...55 cap damage (with barrage) and he can output...19 cap damage, for a total of 74, so 2nd Zy is dead as a doornail. X3NO, you should then fall back and resupply, I will hold the line (for a turn at least). I recommend the 1st LSF join me as soon as possible. If we kill the incoming 3rd Zy, we will be in a position to flank a single 3-fleet stack (with the Flag fleet) with two three-fleet stacks. Game of numbers.

Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on October 23, 2013, 06:30:24 pm
Quote
Kill them all. Ignore the Hertak Flagship fleet. Kill everything else. The Hertak Flagship fleet is nothing without any other fleets backing it up.

No, Lorric. Seriously? Just no.

At this point, the Flag Fleet does 167 Cap damage, more than enough to solo-kill any defender, with the exception of myself (at full capacity). If we slam it hard enough, we might get it down to a ~ 140 damage output  (which would allow a full strength mercenary fleet to survive an engagement)- but we need to drop it to 420% cap strength for that. And while we do that, the other fleets will hammer us.

If we ignore the Flag Fleet and focus on the escorts, we will need ca 1 turn per escort - maybe more. Meanwhile, the Flag Fleet will be killing one of our fleets every turn.

We will take losses here, gentlemen, make no mistake.

I recommend we pull two fleets from Aldebaran to Algol and smash the defenses in Kardoen. Let's leave one fleet upstairs, to provide rotation for the frontline and give us a three-fleet stack, if necessary.

X3NO and myself will hit the Zy in Vega. Let me see: I can output...uh...55 cap damage (with barrage) and he can output...19 cap damage, for a total of 74, so 2nd Zy is dead as a doornail. X3NO, you should then fall back and resupply, I will hold the line (for a turn at least). I recommend the 1st LSF join me as soon as possible. If we kill the incoming 3rd Zy, we will be in a position to flank a single 3-fleet stack (with the Flag fleet) with two three-fleet stacks. Game of numbers.

?

No it doesn't.

Quote
Hertak Flag Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 25+18 = 43
Capital attack strength: 35+13+5 = 53
Fighters at 200% Strength
Capital ships at 500% Strength
Morale: Normal

It's not much stronger than a regular Hertak Fleet. But it will take 5X as much punishment to kill. I'd rather kill 5 other fleets than this thing, it would serve us a lot better, and we now know that there is a finite number of enemy fleets. That fleet can't kill anything without help.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on October 23, 2013, 06:51:33 pm
Uh...I feel sheepish.

I actually registered the provided numbers as base stats and multiplied with the 500% and 200% factors. Oooops.

Listen to Lorric, folks. Kill the escorts.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on October 23, 2013, 07:18:28 pm
Uh...I feel sheepish.

I actually registered the provided numbers as base stats and multiplied with the 500% and 200% factors. Oooops.

Listen to Lorric, folks. Kill the escorts.
It's alright, I forgive you. :)

This reminds me, I haven't looked at your new fleet yet...

Quote
3rd DD Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 40 (18+5+1)
Capital attack strength: 31 (17+1)
Fighters at 190% Strength, 4th Gen
Capital ships at 176% Strength
Morale: High
Barrage on Cooldown, Available again on turn 10
Barrage prepared
Inspirational Leader
Master of Logistics

Wow... :eek2:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on October 23, 2013, 07:27:53 pm
*Snicker * Snort*
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Jellyfish on October 23, 2013, 08:16:39 pm
I see a very juicy Algol in range, and no hostile fleets defending it. We can jump there, secure it, then jump to Kardoen and start kicking ass and taking names.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on October 24, 2013, 05:55:24 am
I still reckon that if they hit Hydra, it will put the pressure onto us to abandon Draco. Which helps break the stalemate that we've held them up with here in the Southern Sector. As it becomes a lot harder for us to reinforce that position through Vega (assuming Hydra is contested), and if Hydra does become contested, then Draco has to flee through 2 systems to get to a friendly location.

However, it's just speculation :) I'm going to help kill the 3rd Nordera first.

Hmmm.... I was right. I really thought that it would happen, but had no idea we'd lose a Fleet over it.. damn :(

Lets see where this puts us now though

Vega will have the 2nd and 3rd Zy, Draco only the 4th Nord, but can be reinforced by the 2nd Fura'ngle and 3rd Hertak from Kardoen, or by the Stack of Doom. However I would consider them being more keen on moving forwards towards Tamy and really put some pressure on us by mostly removing the Southern Front from our control.

So I'm thinking more, partially in-line with the previous "Stay out of the Stack of Doom's attack range" plan. And propose the following:

- Abandon Draco - Retreat to Vega to battle Zy. 2nd SF to Aquarius
- Abandon Hydra and Odin - Retreat to Tamy for counter attack with 3rd DD
- Northern Fleets to Co-ordinate on eliminating fleets in their sector, while capturing Algol and adjusting pressure on Hertak supply lines from Karoden

Odin and Draco(temporarily) would become buffer systems against the Stack of Doom (but if the Flag Fleet stays behind until the system is secured, could be a problem)

We can prepare a counter attack from Tamy, and rotate fleets through Vega. However the retreat from Draco means we open the Zy up to retreating. So we must co-ordinate a killing blow on at least one fleet in this case.

Algol, primarily out of the way, puts us into striking range of the Hertak rear lines. And gives us an additional +3 to replace the loss of Hydra's income.

But mostly, this idea (assuming the Hertak play along of course) moves our fleets away from the Hertak Flag and opens opportunities for us to eliminate supporting fleets. Before attempting to engage the Flag directly. (possibly somewhere between 1 to 4 approx hostile fleet destroyed within next 2 turns) if we can hit them correctly.

(Yes, I need to do the math though, but it gives us plenty of targets to hit).

EDIT:

- Draco Fleets hold and attempt a push to Kardoen, with Northern Fleets capturing Algol to create an escape route.

That seriously reduces the Southern Fleets effectiveness to rotate and reinforce however.

So many options :)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on October 24, 2013, 06:33:29 am
You mean the 4th Nord?

I mostly agree. However, I really really really want to kill the incoming Zy as quickly as possible, given that they can do nasty thingses like jump without Starlances (think what would happen if we allowed them to survive and jump forward to say, Tamy) and Supernova stars (imagine Vega gone). Like I said before, if the 2nd SF supports me in an attack and then retreats to Aqua to resupply, we can destroy the 2nd Zy now. Then, next turn, I will (hopefully) be able to receive the attack of the 3rd Zy and knock them around a bit. They will have to attack me, because I will be the only defending fleet. Then, on my turn, I hit them back (maybe helped by the Draco fleets, or the 1st LSF?) and retreat to Aqua for teh healz. If we play this right, we can kill both Zy fleets in the next two turns, just after they come out in realspace.

Now, I admit I have tunnel vision and I have no idea how things will work out in the southern end of things but I assume that, with two/three fleets coming down to reinforce via Algol and with the three defenders in Draco, we can make this work - especially if we hit the escorts in concentrated attacks. I am looking at you, 2nd Hertak. Can we output 69 damage in one round? Losing the 2nd Hertak will hurt them a lot.

On the other hand, it's still a Stack of Doom. Flag Hertak + 1st Fura = 86 Damage. Ouch. (Numbers unchecked, Lorric confirm, please).

EDIT: Plus, they can always pull the 2nd Fura or the 3rd Hertak from Kardoen. It would be strategically stupid, considering they'd leave Kardoen empty, but they'd get overwhelming tactical strength back for a turn or so.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on October 24, 2013, 10:02:41 am
Vice Admiral Georgiy Kuznetsov (Admiral MS), your fleet has been crushed under the Hertak tidal wave as you were resupplying.
Would you like to continue y/n?
Obviously I want to continue. I mean I got a clean 100% kill without any chances  :eek2: :( - how can I leave that standing?  :mad2: :mad:
And I think you forgot my still active barrage again - while it's not much I expect it to be applied in this case! Also I guess my resupplying was already done when I moved to Hydra, doesn't make a difference for the combat but makes my death less "crushed while resupplying" and more "fought to the bitter end with a full strength fleet".

So what do I do now while being out of the game during the most interesting part of it...?

Edit: Do we even have the ressources for all the fleet rebuilding?
Gah, its so easy to have things like barrage slip by. I'll go correct that.
There's still some resources left to rebuild your fleet, but after that the resource pool is starting to look kind of... meager.

Quote from: Lepanto
Are you willing to tell us if killing the Flag Fleet is a victory condition? Also, any news on promotions?
Flag fleet is a victory condition, aye.
News on promotions after next turn.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Flak on October 24, 2013, 10:08:02 am
The Hertak Flag itself isn't that major threat. Sure it is 25/35, but it is 200%/500% so it take more hits to bring down their power. Hurting the attendant fleets actually nerf their attack power faster. I think we should start guerilla warfare on the extra fleets following the doomstack and maybe take out the weakened fleets quickly. We should take out 2nd Hertak as soon as we got the chance. 2nd SF and 3rd DD is just enough to kill off 2nd Zy I think.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on October 24, 2013, 11:02:35 am
They are. And the 3rd DD can probably kill the 3rd Zy as well.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on October 24, 2013, 11:49:52 am
Enioch, perhaps in a few hours I should be able to finish my plan, but I can tell you that yes, we can kill the 2nd Zy and 2nd Hertak on this turn, and the 5th Cordi, and that is what I would like to do.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on October 24, 2013, 08:52:43 pm
Hello everyone. So it all begins again soon. This is what I think we should do, although there is a part of this plan at the end that I am not sure about but am leaning one way.

It is time to wipe out our enemies. We can wreak some real havoc this turn and kill three enemy fleets. I’ll start with the top. The two UGCR fleets alone can kill the 5th Cordi, which I’ll show below, but I want to do more than that:

1st UGCR Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 20+9=29 (13+2+1)
- Capital attack strength: 17+10=27 (15+1)
- Fighters at 131% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 106% Strength
- Morale: High
- Mercs on Cooldown, Available again on turn 10

2nd UGCR Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 18+8=26 (13+2+1)
- Capital attack strength: 15+9=24 (15+1)
- Fighters at 116% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 92% Strength
- Morale: High
- Mercs on Cooldown, Available again on turn 10

5th Cordi Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 14+3=17 (20)
Capital attack strength: 6+7=13 (12)
Fighters at 48% Strength
Capital ships at 51% Strength
Morale: Normal

51 capital ship damage exactly. You’d receive a paltry 9/7 damage each in return.

I would like to have the 1st SF enter Crux and attack the 5th Cordi as well, to spread the damage out, so that it would be just 6/4 for each fleet, and because the 1st SF is the only one on full strength. My fleet and Jellyfish’s 4th SF would remain behind, I would Resupply and use Zeal, and Jellyfish would Resupply and Defend. I’m thinking to future turns. Turn 9 will come next. I don’t think anyone would die in Crux, everyone would have high HP, and two new enemy fleets would have to come to put someone in danger. If the situation is favourable, we can think about a push, if not, a retreat. The main issue is the mercs run out on turn 10, so we can’t afford to take Algol or pull anyone else off the front, because on Turn 10, the UGCR fleets will be all weak and vulnerable until they get Resupplied and merc’d back up, so on Turn 9, I would have them pull out of Crux to do that, and the 1st SF would be there to cover them. Which would mean the other three fleets would need to be there to pick up the slack while they do that. If we were to push, me and Jellyfish would join DJ in Crux, and the UGCR fleets would Resupply in Aldebaran. If we needed to defend Aldebaran, the 1st SF would join us there and the UGCR fleets would pull back to Virgo and regroup there.

The 1st LSF though I would have travel to Vega to help in the South.

Now onto the bottom.

On the 2nd Zy, a joint attack with the 2nd SF will just tip them over the edge:

2nd SF Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 14+6=20 (18+2)
- Capital attack strength: 12+7=19 (18)
- Fighters at 67% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 66% Strength
- Morale: Normal

3rd DD Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 40+16=56 (18+5+1)
- Capital attack strength: 31+20+4=55 (17+1)
- Fighters at 190% Strength, 4th Gen
- Capital ships at 176% Strength
- Morale: High
- Barrage on Cooldown, Available again on turn 10
- Barrage prepared.
- Inspirational Leader
- Master of Logistics

2nd Zy Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 16+8=24 (21+1)
Capital attack strength: 15+8=23 (20+1)
Fighters at 71% Strength
Capital ships at 72% Strength
Morale: High

74 Capship damage. Don’t let Spoon forget to apply that barrage! :)

12/12 received in return.

Worst counterattack:

2nd SF:
55/54

Vs.

3rd Zy Fleet
Fighter attack strength: 22+11=33 (21+1)
Capital attack strength: 21+11=32 (20+1)
Morale: High

4th Nordera Fleet
Fighter attack strength: 12+5=17 (10+2)
Capital attack strength: 10+6=16 (8+2)
Morale: Very High

Total = 50/48. The 2nd SF will survive. So I imagine either way the 2nd SF will want to pull back whether it gets attacked after this or not. But the 1st LSF will be there to help the mighty 3rd DD dispose of the 3rd Zy.

We can kill the 2nd Hertak with the following combination:

3rd SF Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 12+5=17 (18+2-1)
- Capital attack strength: 9+6=15 (18-1)
- Fighters at 62% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 55% Strength
- Morale: Low

Cyrvan Star Armada: 1/1
1st CSA Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 21+9=30 (23)
- Capital attack strength: 18+11=29 (20)
- Fighters at 90% Strength
- Capital ships at 90% Strength
- Morale: Normal

1st CRF Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 21+10=31 (16+2+3)
- Capital attack strength: 20+11=31 (17+3)
- Fighters at 97% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 97% Strength
- Morale: Zealous

2nd Hertak Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 14 (22)
Capital attack strength: 21 (30)
Fighters at 65% Strength
Capital ships at 69% Strength
Morale: Normal

75 damage. They’re gone. Now I’ve shown this as it’s the strongest attack, but any combination of the 3rd SF plus two fleets from Draco will kill the 2nd Hertak. 71 is the lowes the damage can be, it’s still enough. So you’re free to debate who stays behind. However, whoever stays behind will likely be on the receiving end of a triple attack by the 4th Nordera, 2nd Fura’ngle and 3rd Hertak, which are all at full strength. We’ll get to that at the end of this message.

The 3rd SF will probably perish, but I think it will be worth the sacrifice, and if we don’t do it, someone is sure to die anyway. So, my dear mobcdmoc3, do you think this is a good day to die? There is simply no other way to kill the 2nd Hertak on this turn. If we try to pull you out you’ll be obliterated with the retreat damage (59, you only have 55). If we cover your retreat, we can’t kill the 2nd Hertak Fleet, and it will pull back and resupply and we’ll have two Hertak fleets and the Hertak Flagship fleet running around.

This leaves 2nd LSF, which I think should Resupply and ready Combined Arms. It will be ready to enter Hydra then at almost full strength next turn.

We may lose one or even two fleets in the counterattack. But I don’t think there’s any way to prevent that happening whatever we do.

Back to the fleet that gets left behind in Draco. If it stays, it will surely take that triple attack. It would deal 86 capship damage, so it wouldn’t be a killing blow, but someone would need to cover them next turn. The other option would be to pull that fleet right out to Aquarius. It would only take minor retreat damage off the Nordera. But the Nordera would take Draco, and I’m sure the Hierarchy would try to split us in half, and it’s really bad if they split us in half because we can’t concentrate our forces anymore. I put the idea out there as an alternative, but I am leaning towards someone taking that hit in Draco. But I am not sure. So I’ll leave you think about that, and what I have said as a whole.

Oh, has anyone given any thought to talking to the Hierarchy?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Jellyfish on October 24, 2013, 09:10:54 pm
My fleet and Jellyfish’s 4th SF would remain behind, I would Resupply and use Zeal, and Jellyfish would Resupply and Defend.
We could do that in Algol. We would be in range to shock jump Kardoen and hit the 3rd Hertak. If we can destroy them, that will hopefully force the 2nd Fur'angle to surrender, and we'd survive the engagement even if both fleets focus on either of us.

Oh, has anyone given any thought to talking to the Hierarchy?
It would be a good idea, but not before isolating, surrounding and hitting the Flag Fleet a few times.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on October 24, 2013, 09:59:24 pm
My fleet and Jellyfish’s 4th SF would remain behind, I would Resupply and use Zeal, and Jellyfish would Resupply and Defend.
We could do that in Algol. We would be in range to shock jump Kardoen and hit the 3rd Hertak. If we can destroy them, that will hopefully force the 2nd Fur'angle to surrender, and we'd survive the engagement even if both fleets focus on either of us.
We can't push into Crux though from Algol. I think we need at least 5 fleets on that front. We don't know what's happening in Tauri yet either.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Droid803 on October 24, 2013, 10:04:01 pm
IIRC Tauri is about to asplode.
Go Capella.
The way of the Nubula.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on October 24, 2013, 10:08:19 pm
IIRC Tauri is about to asplode.
Go Capella.
The way of the Nubula.
We only think it is. We don't know.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on October 24, 2013, 10:18:50 pm
The two UGCR fleets alone can kill the 5th Cordi, which I’ll show below, but I want to do more than that:

1st UGCR Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 20+9=29 (13+2+1)
- Capital attack strength: 17+10=27 (15+1)
- Fighters at 131% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 106% Strength
- Morale: High
- Mercs on Cooldown, Available again on turn 10

2nd UGCR Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 18+8=26 (13+2+1)
- Capital attack strength: 15+9=24 (15+1)
- Fighters at 116% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 92% Strength
- Morale: High
- Mercs on Cooldown, Available again on turn 10

5th Cordi Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 14+3=17 (20)
Capital attack strength: 6+7=13 (12)
Fighters at 48% Strength
Capital ships at 51% Strength
Morale: Normal

51 capital ship damage exactly. You’d receive a paltry 9/7 damage each in return.

I would like to have the 1st SF enter Crux and attack the 5th Cordi as well, to spread the damage out, so that it would be just 6/4 for each fleet, and because the 1st SF is the only one on full strength.

The 5th Cordi may have resupplied twice in turn 8, if so then we can't destroy it as it'll be back @ 100%.  And as Jellyfish said, I think we'd be better served with more fleets moving towards the south, 2 fleets in Algol will encourage the Hierachy to leave fleets in Kardoen, fleets which otherwise could attack our southern fleets.  And Algol is close enough to move back north should something unexpected happen.

As for the 1st SF covering the 2x UGCR, I don't think its absolutely necessary.  The 2x UGCR could attack turn 9, 1st then retreats & resupplies.  2nd remains in Crux to cover them, and then takes retreat damage switching places with the 1st in turn 10 (1st also re-mercs before re-entering Crux), but the 2nd can resupply 50% in a turn, so I'm not too worried by that.

What I'm trying to say is that if we think that having 3 fleets standing by for a devastating attack into Kardoen in turn 10 is worth it, then we should do that rather than cover the 2x UGCR tanks :)


IIRC Tauri is about to asplode.
Go Capella.
The way of the Nubula.
We only think it is. We don't know.

Yes, it would be rather interesting if created a portal (+ Capella-style-BBQ) in Tauri which the Hierarchy could use to bypass Aldebaran...
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on October 24, 2013, 11:18:28 pm
The 5th Cordi may have resupplied twice in turn 8, if so then we can't destroy it as it'll be back @ 100%.  And as Jellyfish said, I think we'd be better served with more fleets moving towards the south, 2 fleets in Algol will encourage the Hierachy to leave fleets in Kardoen, fleets which otherwise could attack our southern fleets.  And Algol is close enough to move back north should something unexpected happen.

As for the 1st SF covering the 2x UGCR, I don't think its absolutely necessary.  The 2x UGCR could attack turn 9, 1st then retreats & resupplies.  2nd remains in Crux to cover them, and then takes retreat damage switching places with the 1st in turn 10 (1st also re-mercs before re-entering Crux), but the 2nd can resupply 50% in a turn, so I'm not too worried by that.

What I'm trying to say is that if we think that having 3 fleets standing by for a devastating attack into Kardoen in turn 10 is worth it, then we should do that rather than cover the 2x UGCR tanks :)

I think it would be a completely unnecessary risk to have just two fleets up there. I don't even want less than 5 up there, 4 if we absolutely have to. All it takes is like a Zy and Fura'ngle fleet to show up next turn, or a Zy fleet slipstreaming in behind us and we've got a proper fight on our hands up there. If anything gets through at the top, they have the fastest route to Sol and some of our richest systems to conquer. Eventually, the vanquished allied fleets will get back here and we can send them down South (or whever they are needed.) There's been some hard fighting up at the top, let's not get overconfident about the top. There's still more coming I'm sure.

Quote
Yes, it would be rather interesting if created a portal (+ Capella-style-BBQ) in Tauri which the Hierarchy could use to bypass Aldebaran...
This is exactly what I have thought of. Though even without it I'd still want 5 fleets at the top.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Jellyfish on October 25, 2013, 12:48:12 am
Prudent as that strategy is, I still see two or three fleets defending against hypothetical threats while actual threats paste our dudes in the south.
And those two or three should still be in a position where they can flex back to respond should the hypotheticals become real.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on October 25, 2013, 01:00:27 am
@niffiwan I forgot this bit. The 5th Cordi can't have resupplied. Last turn, they travelled twice to get to Crux. And your invasion of Crux means they didn't get a chance to resupply.

Prudent as that strategy is, I still see two or three fleets defending against hypothetical threats while actual threats paste our dudes in the south.
And those two or three should still be in a position where they can flex back to respond should the hypotheticals become real.
There are real enemy fleets up there to attack and destroy. If we kill everything up there, then this idea I think would be worth entertaining. I would be shocked if more don't arrive though.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on October 25, 2013, 01:12:50 am
Prudent as that strategy is, I still see two or three fleets defending against hypothetical threats while actual threats paste our dudes in the south.
And those two or three should still be in a position where they can flex back to respond should the hypotheticals become real.

This - and Algol is only a single turns movement from Tauri.  If we don't move to Algol I feel there's more of a chance of fleets in Kardoen joining the attack on the south.  3 fleets on their doorstep would probably make them leave at least one fleet in Kardoen, which means one less fleet for the south front to fight.

And, why didn't the 3rd / 5th Cordi counter-attack the 1st or 2nd UGCR in turn 8?  That would make sense if there aren't many reinforcements up north & they're just trying to delay us.

@niffiwan I forgot this bit. The 5th Cordi can't have resupplied. Last turn, they travelled twice to get to Crux. And your invasion of Crux means they didn't get a chance to resupply.

Quote from: http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php?topic=85101.msg1711712#msg1711712
5th Cordi, Aldebaran -> Crux

??  Am I missing something?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Flak on October 25, 2013, 01:19:08 am
Maybe you end up hitting them while resupplying, with their pants down that is. I wonder what going on with Tauri though. A new portal? Maybe more enemies coming, or unknown fleets (Aleyurians anyone?), or suddenly more allied fleets like Cyrvans or some hidden Terran factions coming in? If that is the case I wish Isa herself is coming to kick the Hertak in the balls.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Jellyfish on October 25, 2013, 01:19:44 am
There are real enemy fleets up there to attack and destroy. If we kill everything up there, then this idea I think would be worth entertaining. I would be shocked if more don't arrive though.
Two weakened Cordi fleets vs. two 100+% UCGR fleets. And I say again, from Algol we can flex to Crux if something else arrives and they can't handle it.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on October 25, 2013, 01:36:22 am
Prudent as that strategy is, I still see two or three fleets defending against hypothetical threats while actual threats paste our dudes in the south.
And those two or three should still be in a position where they can flex back to respond should the hypotheticals become real.

This - and Algol is only a single turns movement from Tauri.  If we don't move to Algol I feel there's more of a chance of fleets in Kardoen joining the attack on the south.  3 fleets on their doorstep would probably make them leave at least one fleet in Kardoen, which means one less fleet for the south front to fight.

And, why didn't the 3rd / 5th Cordi counter-attack the 1st or 2nd UGCR in turn 8?  That would make sense if there aren't many reinforcements up north & they're just trying to delay us.

@niffiwan I forgot this bit. The 5th Cordi can't have resupplied. Last turn, they travelled twice to get to Crux. And your invasion of Crux means they didn't get a chance to resupply.

Quote from: http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php?topic=85101.msg1711712#msg1711712
5th Cordi, Aldebaran -> Crux

??  Am I missing something?
I really don't think we can risk leaving yet.

They could be waiting for help to strike hard.

No, I am. Sorry. And thank you. I don't know how that happened! :)

You are correct, I expect they're like this now:

5th Cordi Fleet:
Fighters at 78% Strength
Capital ships at 81% Strength
Morale: Normal

We can still kill them if you drop back and Resupply, and the 1st SF and 4th SF join the 1st UGCR:

1st UGCR Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 20+9=29 (13+2+1)
- Capital attack strength: 17+10=27 (15+1)
- Fighters at 131% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 106% Strength
- Morale: High
- Mercs on Cooldown, Available again on turn 10

4th SF Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 19+9=28 (18+2)
- Capital attack strength: 17+10=29 (18)
- Fighters at 92% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 93% Strength
- Morale: Normal

1st SF Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 20+9=29 (18+2)
- Capital attack strength: 18+10 =28 (18)
- Fighters at 100% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 100% Strength
- Morale: Normal

5th Cordi Fleet:
Fighters at 78% Strength
Capital ships at 81% Strength
Morale: Normal

84 capital ship damage.

There are real enemy fleets up there to attack and destroy. If we kill everything up there, then this idea I think would be worth entertaining. I would be shocked if more don't arrive though.
Two weakened Cordi fleets vs. two 100+% UCGR fleets. And I say again, from Algol we can flex to Crux if something else arrives and they can't handle it.

3rd Cordi is full strength and there could be more. And the UGCR will not be 100% long. They need to pull out the turn after this.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on October 25, 2013, 11:19:25 am
Turn 8 vid's up
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on October 25, 2013, 11:40:56 am
Hey, Spoon, I was thinking about changes to the Fighter strength mechanic. I also think that stances are the way to go. Here are some suggestions:

Aggressive stances:

Saturation Strike: Things work exactly as they do now. Fighters engage enemy fighters (Damage = Fi + 1/2 * Cap) and they assist the Capships (Damage = Cap + 1/2 Fi). The 'capship support' is considered the stance's ability, for the purposes of interception.

Interception: Fighters focus on enemy fighters with the support of Capital ships (Damage = Fi + 1/2 * Cap). They do not cause damage to Caps. Instead, they reduce the effective strength of the enemy fighters's stanceby their own effective strength. In case of more than one enemy fleets being present, the Admiral MUST specify which fleet's fighters he will intercept (only 1). Intercepted fighters can be intercepted in turn, and this will reduce their own interception capability FIRST.

EXAMPLE: SF fleet VS Zy Fleet (both 100%). Zy flies Saturation, SF flies Interception. Zy would cause 21(cap) + 11 (1/2* Fi) = 32 Damage to SF caps and 22 (Fi) + 11 (1/2 Cap) = 33 Damage to Fighters. However, the SF flies interception. This allows the SF Admiral to reduce the effect of the enemy fighter support by his own fighter strength (20). Which means that the Zy fighters can contribute only (22-20)/2 = 1 Damage to their capship's attack. Note that the Zy fighters still engage the SF strikecraft and still do full damage to them - and they receive full damage as well.

USES: Desperation move, to prevent the killing blow on a friendly fleet, or to support other fleet's saturation strike.

Defensive Stances (If no fleets are adopting aggressive stances, fighters do NOT enter the fight and do NOT contribute in any way)

Ambush Tactics: Fighters ONLY engage the enemy strikecraft if the fleet is targeted. If it is, the fighters deal full (not half) damage to enemy caps (Cap Damage = Cap + Fi). Note that they can still be intercepted (and this can force the enemy to fly interception instead of saturation, thus preventing damage to player's fleet).

Logistics Escort: Fighters ONLY engage the enemy strikecraft if the fleet is targeted. They do NOT cause damage to Caps. Instead, the player can restore HP equal to his fighter strength, by paying enough resources for a resupply. Note that this can be done in a Contested system and that it does NOT count as a resupply for the purposes of determining extra damage to resupplying fleets, or for the purposes of 'Master of Logistics'. Note also that the fighters can be intercepted and that the restoration of HP goes down accordingly.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on October 25, 2013, 12:06:47 pm
Fighter stances were something I've briefly considered when I first started writing down the rules but quickly realized that it would be hard for me to keep track of. (Considering how often I've seemingly missed a prepared barrage already...) It's not that I don't like your suggestion there, but it would make turn calculations increasingly complex for me.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on October 25, 2013, 12:08:59 pm
I personally don't think we should change the rules mid-game anyway.

If Spoon wants to do another game after this one, then we can look at revised rules.

Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on October 25, 2013, 12:32:02 pm
Fully agree on that. Just throwing ideas at Spoon and seeing which stick.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on October 25, 2013, 12:39:33 pm
Fully agree on that. Just throwing ideas at Spoon and seeing which stick.
I had one for how I'd do it if I was running the game regarding the math.

I was thinking to simplify the math. I thought of having values change every 10% only. Take the Cordi for example, I’d have charts for every fleet type, the Cordi would look like this without modifiers (morale/specials):

Cordi Fleet:
(health % - fighter damage/capship damage)
91-100% - 26/22
81-90% - 23/20
71-80% - 21/18
61-70% - 18/15
51-60% - 16/13
41-50% - 13/11
31-40% - 10/9
21-30% - 8/6
11-20% - 5/4
1-10% - 3/2

Then I can just consult the chart and the info is right there, the calculations would be done very fast, open tab with charts, find info, open tab with combat results, add modifiers, apply.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on October 25, 2013, 12:48:17 pm
Uh...you do realize that if you make an Excel spreadsheet you can have all calculations done as quickly as you can type in the percentages?

Like, ten seconds for each fleet.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on October 25, 2013, 12:56:19 pm
Uh...you do realize that if you make an Excel spreadsheet you can have all calculations done as quickly as you can type in the percentages?

Like, ten seconds for each fleet.
I've never really got the hang of spreadsheet formulae, and it's years since I've used one. Would you mind telling me how to do it?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lepanto on October 25, 2013, 01:02:45 pm
Thanks for the awesome vid.

Strategically, I still support pulling what fleets we can spare off the north; we need to handle the actual threats down south, not hypothetical ones up north (besides, Spoon's admitted that he's almost out of fleets).
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on October 25, 2013, 01:31:03 pm
Thanks for the awesome vid.

Strategically, I still support pulling what fleets we can spare off the north; we need to handle the actual threats down south, not hypothetical ones up north (besides, Spoon's admitted that he's almost out of fleets).
Well how about we at least kill off the 5th Cordi this turn, then we'll review it. I don't want to let a fleet we can kill get away.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on October 25, 2013, 01:33:42 pm
Here is my thing. Rather simple, but it does its job. Instructions included.

[attachment deleted by ninja]
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on October 25, 2013, 01:44:43 pm
Here is my thing. Rather simple, but it does its job. Instructions included.
Thanks! :yes:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on October 26, 2013, 03:51:00 pm
I've been thinking about going down South, but it's a bad time, due to what will happen to the 1st and 2nd UGCR fleets when the mercs wear off and they drop down to like 40-60% health. Here's a situation I'd be comfortable going down South:

This turn, we wipe out the 5th Cordi as I laid out earlier.

Next turn we have the 1st UGCR pull back and Resupply, while the 2nd UGCR continues to recover and everyone else attacks the 3rd Cordi.

The turn after, if there still are no new enemies, the fleets in Crux can take Crux, while the UGCR fleets get merced back up and enter Algol. Then we can send two fully merced up fleets down South.

If we wiped everything out up top, then everyone could then come down. If more enemies arrived, our respawned fleets would by then be in a position to move to intercept.

I'll be very surprised if we don't see more enemies though, especially a 4th Zy Fleet.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on October 26, 2013, 03:55:33 pm
Also, Spoon, how long is it going to take for the people on Earth to beat some information out of talk to the Cordi we captured?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on October 26, 2013, 05:01:45 pm
I've been thinking about going down South, but it's a bad time, due to what will happen to the 1st and 2nd UGCR fleets when the mercs wear off and they drop down to like 40-60% health.

The UGCR fleets should lose approx 1/3rd of their capship strength when the mercs wear off (since at full health they comprise 1/3 of the total fleet, and we've been taking losses evenly from UGCR/Merc ships), based on current health that'll leave us approx 60-67% health left.

Apart from that, the plan sounds mostly OK, although I'd push for the 2nd CRF to take Algol next turn, if we pull Hierarchy fleets away from the south with such a move it'll ease the pressure there and it'll also make a subsequent advance quicker.  An attack from both 2nd Fura'ngle & 3rd Hertak the would deal max 41 + 28 = 69% capship damage (I haven't checked what their current health is, so that's worst case), so it's survivable.

Spoon - I have a question about UGCR & resupply when mercs are active - will that add back both UGCR & merc forces, or just UGCR ones?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on October 26, 2013, 05:07:52 pm
Spoon - I have a question about UGCR & resupply when mercs are active - will that add back both UGCR & merc forces, or just UGCR ones?
To both

Also, Spoon, how long is it going to take for the people on Earth to beat some information out of talk to the Cordi we captured?
What would you like to know?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on October 26, 2013, 05:28:48 pm
@ niffiwan

I thought about going into Algol and taking it. The problem is, what if the fleets in Kardoen come up and get me?

Also, Spoon, how long is it going to take for the people on Earth to beat some information out of talk to the Cordi we captured?
What would you like to know?

Can we get the Cordi onside, as we did in Wings of Dawn?

It would be nice if we could solve our little Northern problem by recruiting the Cordi instead of destroying them.

What has been done with the 4th Cordi? How do they feel about us? What do they have to say?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: mobcdmoc3 on October 26, 2013, 11:25:37 pm
So... I'm pretty sure I'm screwed. Anyone to contest that statement? :blah:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Droid803 on October 26, 2013, 11:28:16 pm
Yeah... but did you read this?:

We can kill the 2nd Hertak with the following combination:

3rd SF Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 12+5=17 (18+2-1)
- Capital attack strength: 9+6=15 (18-1)
- Fighters at 62% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 55% Strength
- Morale: Low

Cyrvan Star Armada: 1/1
1st CSA Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 21+9=30 (23)
- Capital attack strength: 18+11=29 (20)
- Fighters at 90% Strength
- Capital ships at 90% Strength
- Morale: Normal

1st CRF Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 21+10=31 (16+2+3)
- Capital attack strength: 20+11=31 (17+3)
- Fighters at 97% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 97% Strength
- Morale: Zealous

2nd Hertak Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 14 (22)
Capital attack strength: 21 (30)
Fighters at 65% Strength
Capital ships at 69% Strength
Morale: Normal

75 damage. They’re gone. Now I’ve shown this as it’s the strongest attack, but any combination of the 3rd SF plus two fleets from Draco will kill the 2nd Hertak. 71 is the lowes the damage can be, it’s still enough. So you’re free to debate who stays behind. However, whoever stays behind will likely be on the receiving end of a triple attack by the 4th Nordera, 2nd Fura’ngle and 3rd Hertak, which are all at full strength. We’ll get to that at the end of this message.

The 3rd SF will probably perish, but I think it will be worth the sacrifice, and if we don’t do it, someone is sure to die anyway. So, my dear mobcdmoc3, do you think this is a good day to die? There is simply no other way to kill the 2nd Hertak on this turn. If we try to pull you out you’ll be obliterated with the retreat damage (59, you only have 55). If we cover your retreat, we can’t kill the 2nd Hertak Fleet, and it will pull back and resupply and we’ll have two Hertak fleets and the Hertak Flagship fleet running around.

You could probably hit them, then pull back to Odin (the other fleets striking would provide you with retreat cover), but if they want to come after you and kill you, they can...
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on October 26, 2013, 11:38:22 pm
I think the 3rd SF can attack, then retreat to Odin.  That way their retreat will be covered while still destroying the 2nd Hertak.

And this:
75 damage. They’re gone. Now I’ve shown this as it’s the strongest attack, but any combination of the 3rd SF plus two fleets from Draco will kill the 2nd Hertak. 71 is the lowes the damage can be, it’s still enough. So you’re free to debate who stays behind. However, whoever stays behind will likely be on the receiving end of a triple attack by the 4th Nordera, 2nd Fura’ngle and 3rd Hertak, which are all at full strength. We’ll get to that at the end of this message.

If there's a fleet parked in Algol, then it's less likely that both the 2nd Fura’ngle and 3rd Hertak will attack into Draco or Hydra.  If they do, then the fleet in Algol can advance, secure Kardoen & cut off  the rest of the Hierachy fleets (assuming that there are no fleets entering Kardoen from offscreen next turn of course...)

(OK, I'll go to Algol, I think the strategic situation warrants the non-optimal resupply/re-merc situation I'll be putting myself in)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on October 26, 2013, 11:41:45 pm
Yes, attack, then retreat to Odin.

But niffiwan, if I go to Algol, I'm sure they'll come up and tear me up. It's just letting the Hierarchy inflict damage. Then someone would have to cover my retreat, and there'd only be you, and then you'd lose your mercs and they'd destroy you. And if you didn't come, they'd destroy me. Then they could crush everyone at the top. We can't do that.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on October 26, 2013, 11:49:08 pm
It's also relieving pressure on the south which I think is worth having my fleet damaged. In other words, I'd rather have the 2nd Fura’ngle and 3rd Hertak attack me than have them (+ the Nordera) attack the remaining fleet in Draco.  And I've got master of logistics so I can repair faster than most.  You just make sure the 2nd CRF is ready to come in and save our butts next turn if we need it :)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on October 26, 2013, 11:56:09 pm
It's also relieving pressure on the south which I think is worth having my fleet damaged. In other words, I'd rather have the 2nd Fura’ngle and 3rd Hertak attack me than have them (+ the Nordera) attack the remaining fleet in Draco.  And I've got master of logistics so I can repair faster than most.  You just make sure the 2nd CRF is ready to come in and save our butts next turn if we need it :)
Master of Logistics is a good point. I can go with this. I just hope we don't get crushed in a pincer up here...

So that just leaves everyone else to wipe out the 5th Cordi.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: X3N0-Life-Form on October 27, 2013, 07:01:40 am
Alright, I'm hitting the 2nd Zy one more time, then retreat to Aquarius & double resupply next turn.
Enioch's fleet should be able to finish off the Zy and hold against the 3rd Zy until I get back. By then, we should be able to finish them off.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: SpardaSon21 on October 27, 2013, 12:33:28 pm
And what does the 1st LSF do in all this?  Are we going to be expected to hold the line again?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on October 27, 2013, 12:39:00 pm
Third, I have clearly underestimated the prowess of you admirals. I had fully expected the Hierarchy to have made it far far deeper into Terran territory by this point.
It is a common theme in sci fi that an alien aggressor underestimates the strength of humanity. Hopefully that story will unfold once again.

Fleet: 4th SF
First action: minor, travel to Algol
Second action: major, secure Algol
Hmmm... at first I wanted to complain about this, since the Cordi can't be killed if this happens, but I could switch my orders instead, and while I want to Resupply and use Zeal, I'm still strong enough to step in and kill the Cordi myself. But would we be overextending ourselves?

Niffiwan, what do you think?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on October 27, 2013, 12:48:16 pm
And what does the 1st LSF do in all this?  Are we going to be expected to hold the line again?
I would like you to travel to Vega to meet the arrival of the 3rd Zy please.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on October 27, 2013, 04:36:24 pm
Fleet: 4th SF
First action: minor, travel to Algol
Second action: major, secure Algol
Hmmm... at first I wanted to complain about this, since the Cordi can't be killed if this happens, but I could switch my orders instead, and while I want to Resupply and use Zeal, I'm still strong enough to step in and kill the Cordi myself. But would we be overextending ourselves?

Niffiwan, what do you think?

I reckon it's OK for you to go & wipe out the Cordi, you may even get a morale boost out of it anyway (it seems to occur sometimes when we destroy an enemy fleet, although I haven't checked it closely in an attempt to determine the conditions).  With 3 fleets in Crux & 2 in Algol we can still move three fleets to Tauri/Virgo/Formalhuat in a single turn if we really have to.  Or have everyone retreat back to Aldebaran and hold there if things really turn sour.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on October 27, 2013, 04:44:40 pm
Fleet: 4th SF
First action: minor, travel to Algol
Second action: major, secure Algol
Hmmm... at first I wanted to complain about this, since the Cordi can't be killed if this happens, but I could switch my orders instead, and while I want to Resupply and use Zeal, I'm still strong enough to step in and kill the Cordi myself. But would we be overextending ourselves?

Niffiwan, what do you think?

I reckon it's OK for you to go & wipe out the Cordi, you may even get a morale boost out of it anyway (it seems to occur sometimes when we destroy an enemy fleet, although I haven't checked it closely in an attempt to determine the conditions).  With 3 fleets in Crux & 2 in Algol we can still move three fleets to Tauri/Virgo/Formalhuat in a single turn if we really have to.  Or have everyone retreat back to Aldebaran and hold there if things really turn sour.
I've tried to figure out Spoon's morale system, but haven't been able to. It might be that he simply makes it up as he goes along, or dice rolls are involved.

Do you think it's for the best? I'll switch my orders if you do. Two fleets in Algol and the system secured will make it more likely the Hierarchy will come. But it's risky.

EDIT: If Andrew retreats to Aldebaran after his attack, it'll be 2 in Crux, 1 in Aldebaran and 2 in Algol.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on October 27, 2013, 04:59:02 pm
Do you think it's for the best? I'll switch my orders if you do. Two fleets in Algol and the system secured will make it more likely the Hierarchy will come. But it's risky.

Yeah, I think it's worth it.  As I said earlier, I'd prefer the Hierarchy to attack us instead of attacking the 4th CRF.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on October 27, 2013, 05:13:13 pm
Do you think it's for the best? I'll switch my orders if you do. Two fleets in Algol and the system secured will make it more likely the Hierarchy will come. But it's risky.

Yeah, I think it's worth it.  As I said earlier, I'd prefer the Hierarchy to attack us instead of attacking the 4th CRF.
It is done.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: AndrewofDoom on October 27, 2013, 06:07:45 pm
So, uh, I'm pretty clueless as to what I want to do. What do you guys think? :nervous:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lepanto on October 27, 2013, 06:11:27 pm
Do you think it's for the best? I'll switch my orders if you do. Two fleets in Algol and the system secured will make it more likely the Hierarchy will come. But it's risky.

Yeah, I think it's worth it.  As I said earlier, I'd prefer the Hierarchy to attack us instead of attacking the 4th CRF.
It is done.

Well, thanks.  :)

Any idea on what I should do? I haven't really been following the details of the situation.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on October 27, 2013, 06:25:01 pm
So, uh, I'm pretty clueless as to what I want to do. What do you guys think? :nervous:
Attack the 5th Cordi then travel to Aldebaran please.

Do you think it's for the best? I'll switch my orders if you do. Two fleets in Algol and the system secured will make it more likely the Hierarchy will come. But it's risky.

Yeah, I think it's worth it.  As I said earlier, I'd prefer the Hierarchy to attack us instead of attacking the 4th CRF.
It is done.

Well, thanks.  :)

Any idea on what I should do? I haven't really been following the details of the situation.

You have kind of drawn the short straw. The two fleets in your system have gone off to fight the Hertak and someone is required to stay behind. So that is you.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on October 27, 2013, 07:33:50 pm
I can change if you would prefer to have a fist fight with the Doom Stack. I'm happy either way. :)

Fleet 1st CRF
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on October 27, 2013, 09:39:36 pm
I don't know if the fleet that stays in Draco is any safer than anyone else.  From my calcs, the Hierarchy have the following to hit us with next turn:

1st Fura + Flag Hertak ~91 capital
4th Nordera ~16 capital
2nd Fura + 3rd Hertak ~67 capital

The 1st Fura + Flag Hertak can (if they choose to) destroy any one of the fleets attacking destroying the 2nd Hertak (except the 3rd SF who are retreating).

The other 3 could combine to do ~83 capital, which would destroy the 4th CRF *if* they attacked the 4th Nordera this turn.  If the 1st CRF stayed behind, then I think they would *just* survive (2% left!) attacking the 4th Nordera and being counter-attacked by them + 2nd Fura + 3rd Hertak.  This obviously assumes that the 2nd Fura + 3rd Hertak go after Draco and ignore Algol, which I'm really hoping they don't.

Anyway, short story is that I think the fleet that remains in Draco should not attack this turn, it'll give you a better chance of surviving the counter-attack.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lepanto on October 27, 2013, 10:51:59 pm
Well, if niffiwan's calculations are correct, then I'll take you up on your offer, Veers. Thanks!
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on October 28, 2013, 12:15:53 am
I'm looking at that Hertak Flagship Fleet.

Some curiosities. It gets a +5 bonus added to capship strength. It also hasn't lost any power according to the end strength. If it worked the normal way, it would have dropped 1 capship strength and 2 fighter strength but it hasn't. It should be dropping 1 fighter strength per 8% damage and 1 capship strength per just over 14.25% damage.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on October 28, 2013, 12:51:02 am
Spoon, did you forget to put niffiwan and AndrewofDoom's promotion bonuses under their fleets? I notice you didn't apply AndrewofDoom's Aggressive Leader bonus, though we had no need of it.

EDIT: I'm not sure whether the bonuses were supposed to kick in this turn or not, I just know Enioch's bonuses are listed under his fleet, while the UGCR Fleets are not listed.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on October 28, 2013, 01:03:58 am
I'm looking at that Hertak Flagship Fleet.

Some curiosities. It gets a +5 bonus added to capship strength. It also hasn't lost any power according to the end strength. If it worked the normal way, it would have dropped 1 capship strength and 2 fighter strength but it hasn't. It should be dropping 1 fighter strength per 8% damage and 1 capship strength per just over 14.25% damage.

I'd expect it to start "acting normally" when it drops past 150%.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on October 28, 2013, 04:02:58 am
No problem Lepanto, adjusting my orders now
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on October 28, 2013, 04:09:38 am
I also had a question about the 4th CRF stats in the summary.

Code: [Select]
4th CRF Fleet:
 - Fighter attack strength: 19 (16+2+1)
 - Capital attack strength: 17 (17+1)
 - Fighters at 100% Strength, 3rd Gen
 - Capital ships at 95% Strength
 - Morale: Very High
 - Zeal on Cooldown, Available again on turn 11

If their morale is very high, should they be 20 (16+2+2) and 18 (17+2)?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on October 28, 2013, 04:16:15 am
We could potentially lose a few fleets here, and if the Nordera use their special. I'll suffer an additional 60% damage. Hmmm

Fun times

Edit: Perhaps if Spardason wishes it, I could ditch Draco and attack a Zy Fleet this turn. Instead of him just showing up in the system. And then can attack next turn.

That however, leaves Draco to the enemy. But they can retreat through it anyway as it is contested.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on October 28, 2013, 04:26:46 am
Non-contested system = system they can resupply in. Beyond that, allowing Draco to go hostile won't hurt us that much. Will that matter (i.e. do we mind?).
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on October 28, 2013, 04:45:35 am
I don't think it really matters if we leave Draco to the enemy.  If we do then I'd recommend that we still take Algol this turn.  i.e. still give the 2nd Fura & 3rd Hertak a reason not to attack the not-killed-by-the-doom-stack allied fleet in Hydra.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on October 28, 2013, 05:01:19 pm
BTW, I improved the spreadsheet. Now it can handle up to three fleets attacking a target and automatically calculates the damage dispersal and the final stats of all the fleets participating in combat. Take it out for a spin and let me know if it works for you.

Spoon, a gift from me to you, to make your life easier.

[attachment deleted by ninja]
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: mobcdmoc3 on October 28, 2013, 06:39:33 pm
Well then. I'll send the Hertak my regards at ramming speed, and stay behind if I'm able to. If they want my flagship so badly, they can pry it from my cold, dead hands. :p
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Flak on October 28, 2013, 09:45:41 pm
Well, I think just like the others, one of your bridge officers is going to hit you in the back of your head with a wrench and stuff you into a lifepod.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on October 29, 2013, 09:17:04 pm
So can I attack into Vega instead of having Andrew jump twice there?, at least I can contribute to an attack this turn and still provide a fleet in that area.

If the Zy want to retreat through Draco, they can regardless of if I remain there or not. And I'd prefer to attack rather than do nothing to assist.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on October 30, 2013, 12:45:41 am
So can I attack into Vega instead of having Andrew jump twice there?, at least I can contribute to an attack this turn and still provide a fleet in that area.

If the Zy want to retreat through Draco, they can regardless of if I remain there or not. And I'd prefer to attack rather than do nothing to assist.
The Zy won't be going anywhere. They will be wiped out.

Some people have brought up the question of should Draco be abandoned to the Hierarchy, or should someone (you) remain to force them to have to take it if they want it.

I really don't know which is best. If they come for you you'll just be a speedbump to them. The question is, should we slow them down with a speedbump, or give them a clear road? If we give them a clear road, I expect they'll show up in Vega. If we don't, they'll still be in Draco, though they'll have taken the system. That is if they go to Draco at all. They could go to Hydra and Algol. Or Hydra and defend Kardoen.

My instinct is to keep you in Draco, but I really don't know if it's best. I just don't want to just give it to them. If they don't drop the hammer on you, they'll drop it on someone else.

Anyway I'm thinking to keep the Hierarchy away from Vega so the Zy can be wiped out.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on October 30, 2013, 01:29:11 am
I think the 3rd Zy will be toast the turn after next (assuming that they can't/don't move straight out of Vega after arriving).  We'll have probably the 3rd DD, 1st LSF and 1st CRF available to attack them, and they'll be able to do something like 107% capital damage (ignoring both the damage suffered by the 3rd Zy when they attack and the corresponding loss in damage from one of our fleets).

I don't believe the 1st CRF staying in Draco will prevent the retreat of the 3rd Zy (if they survive), the Nordera could cover their retreat, then kamikaze one of our fleets anyway.
Of course, if the 1st CRF moves into Vega they'll take retreat damage from the Nordera, weak as it is, that would probably only bump a few percent off their offensive capabilities.

And lastly, the 3rd SF is the only fleet that can escape the flag fleet (& friends) counter-attack, heroic sacrifices aside you might as well retreat to Odin and live to fight another day. Otherwise we may lose two fleets in Hydra next turn, yours and one of the 1st CSA & 4th CRF.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on October 30, 2013, 02:29:34 am
I can stay in Draco, I would prefer to move into Vega though. I'd take retreat damage yes, but can assist in attacks in Vega.

If I stay (which I am fine with, just not my preferred option), I can attack or do nothing. Which in turn means I need to wait and see the outcome of the Hydra attack, and what the Nordera do, and again what the Kardoen fleets do.

I'm expecting the Nodera to attack or Kamikaze.

Edit: I'll hold Draco then, still. May not be pretty :P
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on October 30, 2013, 02:34:08 am
I'm happy if you want to move to Vega :)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on October 30, 2013, 04:01:28 am
So am I. You helping with the Zy attack means that the damage the already available fleets will suffer will be reduced. That is good.

However, leaving Draco undefended still seems wrong. I can't put my finger on it, but it definitely feels like a no-no to me.

Oh well. You can do good no matter where you go/stay. It's your choice.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on October 30, 2013, 08:08:11 am
Change to blitz:
old:
Blitz: Allows a fleet to break through enemy lines and advance into an enemy control system. (From a contested system to a hostile system)
When using Blitz you must target one enemy fleet and the target system that you want to move into. You will deal and take half damage to the targeted fleet as your fleet breaks through the enemy lines.
Cooldown: 2 turns

new:
Blitz: Allows a fleet to break through enemy lines and advance into a nearby system.
When using Blitz you must target one enemy fleet and the target system that you want to move into. You will deal half damage to the targeted fleet.
Cooldown: 2 turns


I also had a question about the 4th CRF stats in the summary.

Code: [Select]
4th CRF Fleet:
 - Fighter attack strength: 19 (16+2+1)
 - Capital attack strength: 17 (17+1)
 - Fighters at 100% Strength, 3rd Gen
 - Capital ships at 95% Strength
 - Morale: Very High
 - Zeal on Cooldown, Available again on turn 11

If their morale is very high, should they be 20 (16+2+2) and 18 (17+2)?
Correcto, it's been corrected.

Can we get the Cordi onside, as we did in Wings of Dawn?

It would be nice if we could solve our little Northern problem by recruiting the Cordi instead of destroying them.

What has been done with the 4th Cordi? How do they feel about us? What do they have to say?
No
They are having fabulous tea parties with milk and cookies.
They think you guys are doing very well and they hope for your continued success.
"asdbuyygq'hjj'jhaklsjdha'khd qoiiqwjeh'asdigfi"

BTW, I improved the spreadsheet. Now it can handle up to three fleets attacking a target and automatically calculates the damage dispersal and the final stats of all the fleets participating in combat. Take it out for a spin and let me know if it works for you.

Spoon, a gift from me to you, to make your life easier.
Please accept all of my love and thanks.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on October 30, 2013, 11:23:15 am
Can we get the Cordi onside, as we did in Wings of Dawn?

It would be nice if we could solve our little Northern problem by recruiting the Cordi instead of destroying them.

What has been done with the 4th Cordi? How do they feel about us? What do they have to say?
No
They are having fabulous tea parties with milk and cookies.
They think you guys are doing very well and they hope for your continued success.
"asdbuyygq'hjj'jhaklsjdha'khd qoiiqwjeh'asdigfi"
Huh? Is this a reference to something?

I like the change to Blitz. Blitz into any system without altering how the move works, it makes sense. Why shouldn't you be able to blitz into any system?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on October 30, 2013, 01:51:22 pm
On a scale of 'oh please no, we need more time' to 'born ready' how ready is everyone for the next turn? Every order given?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on October 30, 2013, 02:48:28 pm
On a scale of 'oh please no, we need more time' to 'born ready' how ready is everyone for the next turn? Every order given?
A few still need to give their orders.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on October 30, 2013, 04:11:21 pm
nice change to Blitz, maybe the 3rd SF could use it to smack up the 1st Fura'ngle on their way to Odin :)

(2nd SF could also use it if the 2nd Zy wasn't dead already :drevil:)

(Edit: I think the only fleet that we don't have orders for is the 1st UGCR / Andrewofdoom)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on October 30, 2013, 05:12:13 pm
nice change to Blitz, maybe the 3rd SF could use it to smack up the 1st Fura'ngle on their way to Odin :)

(2nd SF could also use it if the 2nd Zy wasn't dead already :drevil:)

(Edit: I think the only fleet that we don't have orders for is the 1st UGCR / Andrewofdoom)
The damage would be insignificant, while the damage received would be significant. I wouldn't use it.

Don't worry, the 2nd Zy will die.

Wow, yes. Only Andrew is left. I thought there were more. It must be that our fleets are dying... :(

Though I do think mobcdmoc3 should attack with first action and retreat with second action.

EDIT: So Andrew, you got your orders in before I got this post in. :)

I think if mobcdmoc3 makes the switch, we can rubber stamp this set of orders and let Spoon go to work.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on October 30, 2013, 05:25:11 pm
Change to blitz:
old:
Blitz: Allows a fleet to break through enemy lines and advance into an enemy control system. (From a contested system to a hostile system)
When using Blitz you must target one enemy fleet and the target system that you want to move into. You will deal and take half damage to the targeted fleet as your fleet breaks through the enemy lines.
Cooldown: 2 turns

new:
Blitz: Allows a fleet to break through enemy lines and advance into a nearby system.
When using Blitz you must target one enemy fleet and the target system that you want to move into. You will deal half damage to the targeted fleet.
Cooldown: 2 turns

Note that with the new Blitz, you don't receive any damage from using it :)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on October 30, 2013, 05:29:07 pm
Can we get the Cordi onside, as we did in Wings of Dawn?

It would be nice if we could solve our little Northern problem by recruiting the Cordi instead of destroying them.

What has been done with the 4th Cordi? How do they feel about us? What do they have to say?
No
They are having fabulous tea parties with milk and cookies.
They think you guys are doing very well and they hope for your continued success.
"asdbuyygq'hjj'jhaklsjdha'khd qoiiqwjeh'asdigfi"

Only the finest tea in New Britannia! I knew giving them some was a great idea :D
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: mobcdmoc3 on October 30, 2013, 05:34:55 pm
Wait, so I can blitz my way out of Hydra, but at the cost of 50% damage? I suppose I could do it, but I am concerned that it'll compromise our ability to nuke the 2nd Hertak.

If someone wants to crunch numbers, I'll be happy to modify my orders again.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on October 30, 2013, 05:40:31 pm
I was more thinking of attacking AND using Blitz to retreat, hurting the 1st Fura a little on the way out.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on October 30, 2013, 05:44:33 pm
Wait, so I can blitz my way out of Hydra, but at the cost of 50% damage? I suppose I could do it, but I am concerned that it'll compromise our ability to nuke the 2nd Hertak.

If someone wants to crunch numbers, I'll be happy to modify my orders again.
You can simply leave. Attack the Hertak with your first action, leave with your second.

If you want to use Blitz, I'll show you...

After your battle with the Hertak, here is what it would be:

Before Blitz:

*Calculates Blitz damage to both fleets. Double checks Spoon's changes, sees that Sol Fleets no longer take damage. Laughs and deletes everything.*

Every little helps I guess. You would trim 6 off the fighters and 7 off the capships. I guess you might as well use it.

I thought he'd just increased our options, but it turns out we can deal some free damage!

Can we get the Cordi onside, as we did in Wings of Dawn?

It would be nice if we could solve our little Northern problem by recruiting the Cordi instead of destroying them.

What has been done with the 4th Cordi? How do they feel about us? What do they have to say?
No
They are having fabulous tea parties with milk and cookies.
They think you guys are doing very well and they hope for your continued success.
"asdbuyygq'hjj'jhaklsjdha'khd qoiiqwjeh'asdigfi"

Only the finest tea in New Britannia! I knew giving them some was a great idea :D

Ha ha ha! :lol: :cool:

When this is over, we must ship tea out to all the other races in large quantities. Then we'll all be friends forever for sure! :nod:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: mobcdmoc3 on October 30, 2013, 05:52:02 pm
Awesome ^^ I'll attack the 2nd Hertak, then blitz my way out to Odin and slap the Fura'ngle at the same time ^^

Any objections?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on October 30, 2013, 05:55:53 pm
Just realised I've been talking about Andrew instead of Spardason, in regards to the Vega move. Sorry about that.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on October 30, 2013, 06:01:50 pm
I can't believe how strong the Sol Fleets are now. I thought they only got the special they did because they have the best raw stats. While the rest of us are using specials which do something like +4 capship damage, a Sol Fleet can attack normally, Blitz for even more damage and be in a friendly system next turn ready to either resupply or come right back in and attack again.

Sol Fleets no longer have to worry about being isolated and destroyed if they have Blitz, they can just Blitz right out of the system and avoid that whole retreat damage thing and inflict some of their own instead. They've essentially been given Breakthrough Specialist for free, unless they don't have Blitz.

Before I felt the Sol Fleets were just edged out by the CRF Fleets as the best fleets in the game, thus why I chose the CRF. Now, they're hands down by a huge distance the best fleets in the game. Except for Enioch's super fleet of course.

A full strength Sol Fleet can inflict 15 fighter and 14 capital ship damage free with Blitz. Imagine doing that in one system, then joining in with an attack in another system.

Oh and they're all picking up 4th Gen Fighters on Turn 10, which will add a little more.

Christmas has come early for the Sol Fleets.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on November 01, 2013, 12:51:49 pm
Everything's okay now, isn't it?

So can we now unleash Spoon upon us?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on November 01, 2013, 01:16:32 pm
Waiting for the go signal~
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on November 01, 2013, 02:32:03 pm
In my own words. Not stolen or copied from anywhere.

Engage!
Release the Kraken.. wait.. dont do that. I dont want to see a huge space kraken.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Jellyfish on November 01, 2013, 11:14:02 pm
Cue Cordi Flag Fleet.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lepanto on November 02, 2013, 05:53:03 pm
Orders submitted and ready.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on November 03, 2013, 12:12:03 pm
been busy this weekend and im not sure about the next two days. I cannot promise anything right now
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on November 07, 2013, 02:45:45 pm
Enoich I love the spreadsheet but it unforunately doesn't round the numbers up/down correctly. It'll round a value of 20.4 up to 21 for example, I've always been rounding 20.5 up to 21 and 20.49 and below to 20.

Rear Admiral Carlos Santiago (Lepanto), your fleet gave its life for Queen and Country.
Would you like to continue y/n?

Every CRF Admiral will be Vice Admiral next turn, let's hear those trait choices.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on November 07, 2013, 02:47:54 pm
Spoon, I have a request, if you can. Please show at least one minute of footage of the destruction of the 4th CRF Fleet in the Turn 9 video if you can. I have something planned.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on November 07, 2013, 02:52:33 pm
Aright
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on November 07, 2013, 02:56:36 pm
Aright
Excellent. :)

Oh, and I'll take Master in Logistics for my promotion trait please.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on November 07, 2013, 03:14:01 pm
Enoich I love the spreadsheet but it unforunately doesn't round the numbers up/down correctly. It'll round a value of 20.4 up to 21 for example, I've always been rounding 20.5 up to 21 and 20.49 and below to 20.

Rear Admiral Carlos Santiago (Lepanto), your fleet gave its life for Queen and Country.
Would you like to continue y/n?

Every CRF Admiral will be Vice Admiral next turn, let's hear those trait choices.

Oh, sorry, I thought you always rounded up.

Wait a sec.

Here we go. Try this.

[attachment deleted by an evil time traveler]
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on November 07, 2013, 03:42:18 pm
"The Hierarchy deploys its last reserves for a final push to bring the Terrans to their knees.
Does this mean there will be no more reinforcements for the Hierarchy?

1st Fura and Zy fleet implies there will be at least one more of those.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lepanto on November 07, 2013, 03:44:43 pm
Oh no, I has dead.  :(

I have no intention of staying dead, though. Aggressive Leader, please.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on November 07, 2013, 04:32:11 pm
I input a conservative turn, just to have something up in case i go AWOL (because I will be traveling all over Europe next week). Hey, Spoon, when's the deadline?

I can travel to Draco and knock the 3rd Htk down to 31(F) / 38(C) (Damage: 13/15). This would bring me to 147/130 (Damage: 39/40, with a possible barrage for 39/44). This is not good enough to weather a double kamikaze and an attack by the 4th Hertak:

(3rd Htk pulls back to Kardoen, 4th &5th Nordera Kamikaze on me, 4th Htk moves to Draco and kicks me in the head). Am I selfish for wanting my fleet to survive and smash some more skulls in?

Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on November 07, 2013, 04:43:13 pm
I input a conservative turn, just to have something up in case i go AWOL (because I will be traveling all over Europe next week). Hey, Spoon, when's the deadline?

I can travel to Draco and knock the 3rd Htk down to 31(F) / 38(C) (Damage: 13/15). This would bring me to 147/130 (Damage: 39/40, with a possible barrage for 39/44). This is not good enough to weather a double kamikaze and an attack by the 4th Hertak:

(3rd Htk pulls back to Kardoen, 4th &5th Nordera Kamikaze on me, 4th Htk moves to Draco and kicks me in the head). Am I selfish for wanting my fleet to survive and smash some more skulls in?
I don't think they'd do it. The Nordera can act as sponges to soak up damage to the better fleets when they attack and as blockers. And one is full strength the other nearly full strength.

I definitely think you should be switching to attacking the 3rd Hertak. You need to be on the front using that power on the Hertak.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on November 07, 2013, 04:55:37 pm
Yes. We simply have to kill the supporting Hertak Fleets.

If the 3rd DD, 1st LSF and 1st CRF all attack the 3rd Hertak, we can destroy them.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on November 08, 2013, 02:53:17 am
I don't think they'd do it. The Nordera can act as sponges to soak up damage to the better fleets when they attack and as blockers. And one is full strength the other nearly full strength.

If they're attacking, using Nordera makes no sense. If you have three non-nordi fleets available (they have two, and they might split the Doomstack up, or just sacrifice one Nordera and keep the other), it makes more sense to group them together in a mini-doomstack. The damage still gets spread around and you do more damage. Granted, the damage is split between important fleets, but they are desperate now.

Quote
I definitely think you should be switching to attacking the 3rd Hertak. You need to be on the front using that power on the Hertak.

Well, I could. But if I do A) the 3rd Zy is left alone in Aqua with the damaged 2nd SF and B) In your suggestion, the 1st CRF is used to attack. They are already at 43/40. Bringing them to the front lines is a death sentence. I understand that we want to do damage, but still. Spoon has taken every opportunity to kill defending fleets - if he can do it, he does it, no matter the strategic cost to the Hertak.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on November 08, 2013, 04:49:01 am
I'm still trying to pull some fleets north to relieve pressure on the south.  But if the southern fleets are going to pull back out of reach of most of their fleets this turn I'll pull back too.  I don't know what the best option is right now, we don't have a lot of healthy southern fleets in attack positions this turn.  If we pull back, we may separate the doomstack from the rest of the fleets, giving us a better chance of wiping out the other fleets without too many losses before taking on the doomstack?

As for the North, if the 1st Zy&Fura is a 150% fleet like all the other 1st Fleets were, then it may get a little tight - at least the 5 fleets up there are all in fairly good shape.  For now :nervous:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: AndrewofDoom on November 08, 2013, 07:50:12 am
Pretty certain our Mercs expires next turn niffy. :p That being said, that put me in a dilemma, since I really can't be attacking like this, because I'll lose my mercs right after it. Hmmm....
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on November 08, 2013, 10:01:37 am
@ Enioch

The Nordera will be the last fleets we take down. It makes sense to keep them alive, they'll probably do more damage chipping away over the turns than in big explosions now. And they can still explode later anyway. They haven't exactly been eager to explode. I also wonder if there's a string attached to the Nordera explosions, since the 1st Nordera did it after being hammered by three fleets dealing immense damage. Their morale goes up when they fight. Maybe it gets pushed past zealous to a new level where they explode at you...

The Hierearchy can put out more damage now than we can recover. We must attack until that situation changes. I firmly believe the Hertak fleets must be destroyed at all costs.

@ niffiwan

As Andrew says, the mercs expire. All 5 fleets should remain at the top. I actually think there's a chance that combined fleet will be 200%. But 1st Fleets have always been 150%, and there are two full strength Cordi fleets. To make matters worse, if DJ blitzes out, I'll take the full retreat damage from all three, so I'll have to flee behind the lines. I don't think we can hold them if anyone leaves the front.

I would like DJ to save his Blitz. If he and Jellyfish were to use both blitzes on the same opponent when the Hierarchy advances, combined with attacking that opponent first, that could set up a situation where we eliminate someone.

@Jellyfish

Blitz doesn't work that way I'm afraid. I would like you to go to Aldebaran and Defend.

Same for DJ, travel to Aldeberan, don't attack, don't use Blitz. Travel to Aldebaran and Resupply. I will travel to Aldebaran and Resupply. Andrew should be on the rear to merc up while we hold off the advance.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on November 08, 2013, 11:51:45 am
You're displaying tunnel vision again. Too much focusing on the Hertak, not enough focusing on the big picture.

3rd Zy arrives on Aqua next turn. It doesn't attack the 2nd Sf, but jumps away to Tamy, taking no damage, because of the nebula. Next turn, it seeds Tamy with a supernova device.

Say bye-bye to resupplies, southern front.

BTW, Spoon, that change-of-slipstream-destination trick they pulled was nasty. Shame on you.

Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on November 08, 2013, 11:59:11 am
You're displaying tunnel vision again. Too much focusing on the Hertak, not enough focusing on the big picture.

3rd Zy arrives on Aqua next turn. It doesn't attack the 2nd Sf, but jumps away to Tamy, taking no damage, because of the nebula. Next turn, it seeds Tamy with a supernova device.

Say bye-bye to resupplies, southern front.

BTW, Spoon, that change-of-slipstream-destination trick they pulled was nasty. Shame on you.
Again?

If it wants to do that, we can't prevent it. the 2nd SF can Resupply and play cat and mouse with the Zy if necessary.

Also, it took a few turns for the explosion, and furthermore, it wouldn't cut the supply lines as long as we have an unbroken line through from Sol down South via Virgo and around.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on November 08, 2013, 12:13:44 pm
I suppose they can.

Well, I'm not 100% convinced. However, if there are no other objections, I'm willing to go after the 3rd Hert.

Oh, lovely Draco, I'm coming back to you.

Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on November 08, 2013, 12:17:32 pm
I suppose they can.

Well, I'm not 100% convinced. However, if there are no other objections, I'm willing to go after the 3rd Hert.

Oh, lovely Draco, I'm coming back to you.
This will be the third time you have entered battle. And the third time an enemy fleet has fallen before you. I hope that streak continues.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on November 08, 2013, 06:41:24 pm
Can always drag out a full retreat, back to Tamy and back to Vega/Aquarius.

I'd like to withdraw the 1st CRF for resupply, I'm little help overall right now. After surviving that attack, and appears not joining the doomstack assault worked in my favour too. Sorry about that Lepanto.

Ideally, I think we still need to concentrate on removing several of the smaller fleets first, they are going to cause havoc amongst our lines and rear guards. While the main Her'tak continues along.

Eliminate more of their fleets, less reinforcements available for the Doom Stack. We're going to lose fleets attacking it regardless, but if we deny their reinforcements fleets. It be comes easier.

So I think our priorities for this turn need to focus on stopping the 3nd Zy and Crux Fleets from advancing. Eliminating supporting fleets needs to remain our priority while staying as safe as possible from loosing our own.

EDIT: Spoon, Master in Logistics please. Also, thanks for officially confirming the 1st CRF status as being incredibly awesome.. :D
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on November 08, 2013, 07:00:23 pm
I think it's a mistake not to kill the 3rd Hertak while we can.

The only other fleet that could step in to do the job is the 1st CSA, but they'd take an obscene amount of retreat damage to do it.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on November 08, 2013, 07:11:20 pm
If people don't want to kill the third Hertak, I would advocate a full retreat on both fronts right back to Ruba Pegasi, Lyrae and Polaris to make a final do-or-die stand at full strength with our reborn fleets back on the map. There are no weak Hierarchy fleets, so they won't strengthen themselves much by us doing that.

This is something I have thought we will have to do at some point, but ideally not yet, only after we have inflicted as much damage as possible.

Again I would much rather the third Hertak dies this turn. I would prefer to keep fighting either until we are unable to kill fleets on the front, a serious breach is achieved by the Hierarchy, or our supplies run out, whichever comes first. Then retreat for the final stand.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on November 09, 2013, 03:52:17 am
Pretty certain our Mercs expires next turn niffy. :p That being said, that put me in a dilemma, since I really can't be attacking like this, because I'll lose my mercs right after it. Hmmm....

Oh, I thought that the next moves we posted were for turn 10, and mercs would be available for use then? i.e. expires next turn and can be renewed the same turn?

Code: (turn 9 results) [Select]
2nd UGCR Fleet:
 - Fighter attack strength: 18 (13+2+1)
 - Capital attack strength: 15 (15+1)
 - Fighters at 116% Strength, 3rd Gen
 - Capital ships at 92% Strength
 - Morale: High
 - Mercs on Cooldown, Available again on turn 10
 - Master in Logistics

If I'm wrong, yes, I'll be hauling down the taunt flag PDQ :)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on November 09, 2013, 04:59:34 am

What happens if we take the enemy systems and make the whole map green? Can we do that?
It's possible, thought it will not immediately win you the game. New enemy fleets will continue to arrive from the red starlances. Though if you guys are really kicking that much ass it might be needed to expand the starmap and give you guys the opportunity to start a counter offensive. But I'll doubt it'll go that smoothly!


Oi guys, lets launch that counter-offensive in the Northern Sector once you clear out Crux a little more. Perhaps force the Her'tak into a retreat?.. :D (I can dream sometimes)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on November 09, 2013, 05:30:47 am
Yeah, let's better not. :-P
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on November 09, 2013, 04:04:26 pm
Oh, I thought that the next moves we posted were for turn 10, and mercs would be available for use then? i.e. expires next turn and can be renewed the same turn?
I'll allow it!

Oh no, I has dead.  :(

I have no intention of staying dead, though. Aggressive Leader, please.
Roger

I input a conservative turn, just to have something up in case i go AWOL (because I will be traveling all over Europe next week). Hey, Spoon, when's the deadline?
Let's go with friday, next turn on sunday

Oh, sorry, I thought you always rounded up.

Wait a sec.

Here we go. Try this.
Purrrfect
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on November 09, 2013, 08:22:34 pm
Oh, I thought that the next moves we posted were for turn 10, and mercs would be available for use then? i.e. expires next turn and can be renewed the same turn?
I'll allow it!

Huzzah & thank you :D
(I think, it means I'm following a plan akin to looking like a tasty worm on a hook...)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on November 11, 2013, 03:35:43 pm
Yooooohooooo. We need a plan, time's creeping on. We can't have everyone doing their own thing or we'll be picked apart.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Droid803 on November 11, 2013, 05:16:23 pm
Indeed. I'm staring down the DoomStack currently...anyone want to help?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Dragon on November 11, 2013, 06:29:11 pm
I've got near-100% fleet with Combined Arms prepared. I probably couldn't survive alone, but with two other fleets pounding them...
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on November 11, 2013, 07:09:55 pm
I've got near-100% fleet with Combined Arms prepared. I probably couldn't survive alone, but with two other fleets pounding them...
You and Droid could always attack one of the Fura'ngle fleets. But if we're not killing the 3rd Hertak, I would go for a full retreat. I want to kill the 3rd Hertak though.

Whatever we do, the 3rd SF is free to double Resupply. There is no third fleet to join you and Droid. The 3rd SF, unlike the 1st CRF which is why I want it to attack, can't deliver a killer blow, and as it is in the back, it should heal.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on November 12, 2013, 04:12:21 am
I'm going after the 3rd Htk. But I will require help on that front.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on November 12, 2013, 09:56:19 am
I'm going after the 3rd Htk. But I will require help on that front.
Then Veers must be persuaded not to run away.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on November 12, 2013, 04:07:05 pm
I'm not keen on doing it, but orders changed to attacking 3rd Her'tak.

And please adjust my leadership ability to Aggressive leader instead of Master of Logistics. Thanks Spoon.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on November 12, 2013, 04:39:54 pm
Cheers Veers. That sounds nice, doesn't it? Cheers Veers... :)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on November 12, 2013, 04:42:27 pm
:P
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on November 12, 2013, 07:03:39 pm
Thank you. I appreciate not being left to fight alone and hope we will not come to regret this.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on November 12, 2013, 07:21:01 pm
Thank you. I appreciate not being left to fight alone and hope we will not come to regret this.
Indeed. And now that Veers is on board, Sparda, if you please, attack the 3rd Hertak as well, and then they will fall next turn.

EDIT: I just realised DJ attacking then Blitzing the Cordi covers my retreat. Nice one! :)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: CommanderDJ on November 12, 2013, 07:27:56 pm
That was the intention. :D
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Dragon on November 12, 2013, 07:34:45 pm
OK, so which fleet should we attack? We've got to hit the Doomstack hard if we want any hope of surviving it's retaliation...
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on November 12, 2013, 07:48:20 pm
OK, so which fleet should we attack? We've got to hit the Doomstack hard if we want any hope of surviving it's retaliation...
I'm leaning towards the 2nd Fura'ngle. I wouldn't be fussed if you attacked the 1st, but I would choose the 2nd.

Let's see...

2nd Fura'ngle Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 16 (16)
Capital attack strength: 20 (20)
Fighters at 91% Strength
Capital ships at 91% Strength
Morale: Normal

(oh and that's a quote from the game thread, they shouldn't be doing full damage, it should be 15/18.)

so
15+9=24
18+8=23

vs

1st CSA Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 19+8=27 (23)
Capital attack strength: 16+10=26 (20)
Fighters at 82% Strength
Capital ships at 81% Strength
Morale: Normal

2nd LSF Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 22+7+1=30 (19+2+1)
Capital attack strength: 14+11+1=26 (14+1)
Fighters at 100% Strength, 3rd Gen
Capital ships at 93% Strength
Morale: High
Combined Arms prepared
Combined Arms on Cooldown, Available again on turn 12

So the CSA will take 12 damage to both fighters and capships, while the LSF will take 10 to both due to Combined Arms. The Fura'ngle will take 57/52 and be reduced to 34/39.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Droid803 on November 12, 2013, 08:19:12 pm
The question is would reducing them to 34/39 cause the counterattack from the 1st/2nd Fura+Flag Hertak be survivable? Because if it isn't it may be better to GTFO (I'll eat the retreat damage). Since we're not killing them either way.

Actually from the looks of it, the 1st Fura and Flag Hertak alone could kill me (could be wrong, didn't run the numbers, just looking at their attack strength when they killed the 4th CRF). That extra 12 capship damage from the attack probably seals the deal. Not sure if trading a fleet-and-a-bit for 2/3rds of a fleet is a good trade.

Actually, I could pull back after that attack - more pressing is if the 2nd LSF could survive.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on November 12, 2013, 08:41:45 pm
That's what I'm worried about, we cant go losing fleets. Left and right.

Hence why I'm worried about my position in Draco, not with the attack but the potential counter-attacks. Potential for upto 2 fleets lost there, of course assuming everything proceeds one way, to the letter.

Very tight endgame, lets get it done regardless!
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on November 12, 2013, 08:52:27 pm
Someone dies either way. The Doomstack could simply take in the 4th Hertak and be even stronger.

I wouldn't mind if there was no attack besides the one on the 3rd Hertak either. The way I see it we will lose this current fight eventually. The Hierarchy is just too strong. What we have to do is kill as many enemy fleets as possible in doing so, while having the supplies to replace our losses, which the Hierarchy can't do. When we are finally overstretched, everyone retreats back to the Sol area, our lost fleets will have returned, and then we hit them with everything we have, all our fleets will be restored, everyone will be Defending, everyone will have their specials ready, and we just have to hope we have enough strength to win the final battle.

I wonder if you will respawn at Sol, Droid. You have a Cyrvan fleet...
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Droid803 on November 12, 2013, 08:54:54 pm
I wonder if you will respawn at Sol, Droid. You have a Cyrvan fleet...

I doubt my fleet can respawn at all.
Even if it did, would probably arrive from Silva, like where it first arrived. Not exactly the most ideal location if your last-stand scenario comes into play.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on November 12, 2013, 09:01:25 pm
I wonder if you will respawn at Sol, Droid. You have a Cyrvan fleet...

I doubt my fleet can respawn at all.
I don't think Spoon would cut you out of the game when everyone else gets to come back if they die, provided we have the supplies.

Unless you know something I don't, you must have cooked something up between you and Spoon for your late entry into the game.

You might be okay though. You have the best fleet outside of Enioch, it would make the most sense to eliminate you, yet you've been left alone, you could have been eliminated a while ago.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on November 14, 2013, 09:13:35 pm
I just noticed, we're going to exceed the stack limit in Aldebaran. Maybe one of Lorric/AndrewOfDoom/Jellyfish could move through to Virgo?  Or Jellyfish could stay in Algol?

Edit:  Veers, you could also consider attacking the 3rd Hertak then retreating to Vega?

Edit2: Based on some calculations, if we proceed with:

3 DD / 1 CRF / 1 LSF ==> 3rd Hertak
2 LSF / 1 CSA ==> 2nd Fura

If the Hierarchy leave a fleet in Kardoen, we'll could lose one fleet with a 2nd heavily damaged (e.g. lose 1 CSA, 1 LSF @ 19/10)
If the Hierarchy do NOT leave a fleet in Kardoen (which I consider unlikely, given that the 2nd UGCR could then cut their supply lines unopposed) then we could lose 2 fleets (e.g. 1 CSA & 1 LSF)
If the Nordera fleets kamikaze, then all bets are off, we could lose more fleets, maybe 3.  Or we may lose the 3 DD instead.

Lastly, I'm a little concerned about the 3rd Zy.  Due to the special nature of Aquarius, they can leave straight away and make a run for Sol, or capture Tamy or Virgo.  Therefore it *may* be useful if the 3 SF were to move to Tamy as a block (having to give up a resupply to do so), and ditto for one of the northern fleets & Virgo.

Any thoughts/comments?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on November 14, 2013, 10:23:29 pm
I just noticed, we're going to exceed the stack limit in Aldebaran. Maybe one of Lorric/AndrewOfDoom/Jellyfish could move through to Virgo?  Or Jellyfish could stay in Algol?

Edit:  Veers, you could also consider attacking the 3rd Hertak then retreating to Vega?

Edit2: Based on some calculations, if we proceed with:

3 DD / 1 CRF / 1 LSF ==> 3rd Hertak
2 LSF / 1 CSA ==> 2nd Fura

If the Hierarchy leave a fleet in Kardoen, we'll could lose one fleet with a 2nd heavily damaged (e.g. lose 1 CSA, 1 LSF @ 19/10)
If the Hierarchy do NOT leave a fleet in Kardoen (which I consider unlikely, given that the 2nd UGCR could then cut their supply lines unopposed) then we could lose 2 fleets (e.g. 1 CSA & 1 LSF)
If the Nordera fleets kamikaze, then all bets are off, we could lose more fleets, maybe 3.  Or we may lose the 3 DD instead.

Lastly, I'm a little concerned about the 3rd Zy.  Due to the special nature of Aquarius, they can leave straight away and make a run for Sol, or capture Tamy or Virgo.  Therefore it *may* be useful if the 3 SF were to move to Tamy as a block (having to give up a resupply to do so), and ditto for one of the northern fleets & Virgo.

Any thoughts/comments?
Andrew needs to move. Perhaps he could come and see you. And merc up, since Spoon is letting you merc up. Two merced fleets will give the hierarchy something to think about.

3rd Zy proved this turn they can simply slipstream in and slipstream out without us being able to do anything about it. I'm not worried about Sol, our reborn fleets are up there. If the 2nd SF performs a double Resupply this turn, it will be free to chase the Zy around, if a game of cat and mouse needs to be played.

Bottom line they can jump to anywhere they want and capture it. But if they do, that will leave them open to a counterattack by us. They can't do anything on their own behind us unsupported like that. They are a minor annoyance.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on November 14, 2013, 10:27:13 pm
oh yeah, the reborn fleets, forgot about them.  I just had mad visions of the Zy scurrying off to earth while we stomped everyone else into the ground at the frontlines :D
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on November 14, 2013, 10:39:43 pm
Okay, let's see what we're missing...

The 2nd SF needs to do it's double Resupply.

Sparda needs to attack the 3rd Hertak.

Andrew needs to make his move.

And Droid and Dragon need to decide whether to attack or not. I would.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on November 15, 2013, 01:07:13 am


Edit:  Veers, you could also consider attacking the 3rd Hertak then retreating to Vega?

Any thoughts/comments?

Sorry, attack first move and retreat second?

Would that A) assist everyone in destroying 3rd Her'tak and
B) Allowing me to survive?

Sorry, don't have time to check the figures myself. It's the counter-attack I'm worried about losing the 1st in, not the initial assault.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on November 15, 2013, 01:20:07 am
Yep, attack 1st & move 2nd should still destroy the 3rd Hertak, and give you a better chance of surviving.  i.e. you won't be able to be attacked by anyone except the 3rd Zy... if they do attack you then you're probably doomed though :(  On the other hand if you stay in Draco, I'd say that someone will almost certainly destroy you as well. 

i.e. by my calcs (if they're correct) the Hierarchy have the following damage to dish out next turn in the south:

3rd Zy Fleet: 33/32
1st Fura'ngle Fleet: 33/35
2nd Fura'ngle Fleet: 13/13
Hertak Flag Fleet: 43/48
4th Hertak Fleet: 37/41
4th Nordera Fleet: 16/16
5th Nordera Fleet: 17/16

And all our fleets will be at:
2nd SF Fleet: 100/100
3rd SF Fleet: 100/100
3rd DD Fleet: 167/152
1st CRF Fleet: 32/28
1st LSF Fleet: 89/86
2nd LSF Fleet: 89/81
1st CSA Fleet: 69/67
2nd UGCR Fleet: 166/142

Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Droid803 on November 15, 2013, 02:17:04 am
YOLO.
Let's hit the Fura.

Here's hoping I don't have this totally wrong and the 2nd LSF can actually cover my retreat, and that it's not a completely stupid/futile idea.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on November 15, 2013, 03:02:55 am
well.... the 2nd LSF could still cover your retreat... i.e. you move back to Odin with your 2nd action, leaving them to face the music  :nervous:

No matter what though, someone's fleet is going to be destroyed. Even with the 3rd Hertak down and the 2nd Fura hurting they've got 35+41+48=124% capship damage they can dish out to one fleet in Hydra or Draco (and max 16+16+13=45 to another fleet in Hydra or Draco as well)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on November 15, 2013, 03:57:05 am
If I do happen to die, I have had a death... umm.. Heroic Demise theme all sorted.. :D

Plus a new Royal type-ish theme :) (No, this does not give you permission to wipe me out just for music!)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on November 15, 2013, 07:47:28 am
If they do move to Draco, I will need people to jump in and cover my retreat to Aqua. My superfleet will be on its last legs, if I gets hit for 120+ dmg.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on November 15, 2013, 11:13:07 am
Good, good. Only Andrew remains now.

YOLO.
Let's hit the Fura.

Here's hoping I don't have this totally wrong and the 2nd LSF can actually cover my retreat, and that it's not a completely stupid/futile idea.
Yes, they can.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: AndrewofDoom on November 15, 2013, 06:49:12 pm
Uh.

I totally forgot about this.

Ideas, quick!
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on November 15, 2013, 07:08:16 pm
Uh.

I totally forgot about this.

Ideas, quick!
It seems Spoon is allowing niffiwan to merc up this turn. Therefore you can too. You could perhaps move to Algol and recruit mercs.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: AndrewofDoom on November 15, 2013, 07:35:25 pm
Still have a big fear about the north though. Seems those guys are outnumbered.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on November 15, 2013, 08:36:10 pm
Hah, Iron skin, I love it :)

From Algol, we have the flexibility to support either the north or the south, so if the north gets pasted next turn by the Zy/Fura Frankenfleet we can easily counter attack next turn.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on November 15, 2013, 08:43:27 pm
Hah, Iron skin, I love it :)
Hm? What does it mean? I've seen Andrew's post in the game thread, but I don't know what it means.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on November 15, 2013, 08:48:42 pm
Here's what I was thinking of: http://www.planetbaldursgate.com/bg2/character/spells/priest/priestspell.asp?lvl_id=5&file_name=IronSkins.htm&title=Iron+Skins

(i.e. D&D defensive spell)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on November 15, 2013, 08:58:41 pm
Close, but I think andrew was thinking of http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Iron_Skin (with the ugc having a rhino class ship)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: AndrewofDoom on November 15, 2013, 09:00:08 pm
Hah, Iron skin, I love it :)
Hm? What does it mean? I've seen Andrew's post in the game thread, but I don't know what it means.

(http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20130328051618/warframe/images/5/58/IronSkinCard.png)

Spoon claims the fact that the ships are named Rhinos is totally coincidental. Warframe has corrupted me.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on November 15, 2013, 09:01:35 pm
Here's what I was thinking of: http://www.planetbaldursgate.com/bg2/character/spells/priest/priestspell.asp?lvl_id=5&file_name=IronSkins.htm&title=Iron+Skins

(i.e. D&D defensive spell)
Hm. I thought it would be some sort of anime reference.

Thanks. :)
Close, but I think andrew was thinking of http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Iron_Skin (with the ugc having a rhino class ship)
Or perhaps.

He'll probably show up with a third option now. :D

I've pressed that post button twice now! I see you Andrew. :lol:

Time to press it a third time.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on November 15, 2013, 09:03:29 pm
-------------------------------------
I wish to destroy
Uh-oh... :nervous:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on November 16, 2013, 01:57:00 am
I'm sure most the Her'tak vessels come with a self-destruct key or way to overload something to create a big kaboom. Perhaps this option will satisfy Spoon's desires?

(I know it would satisfy mine...)

(I'm always nuking my own units)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Flak on November 16, 2013, 03:57:39 am
Kakuna used Harden
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on November 16, 2013, 11:40:23 am
Veers, your fleet is in draco but your minor action is to move to draco. I'm assuming you want to move to vega with that?

edit: I'm reminded that I'm being dragged along on a family day tomorrow, turn will be on monday instead
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on November 16, 2013, 06:51:57 pm
And, of course, I just realized that no Draco fleets can resupply, because the Zy fleet in Aqua will make the system contested, cutting off our supply route. Calloo-callay, oh glorious day.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on November 16, 2013, 06:59:06 pm
And, of course, I just realized that no Draco fleets can resupply, because the Zy fleet in Aqua will make the system contested, cutting off our supply route. Calloo-callay, oh glorious day.
You know, with the special rules Aquarius has, maybe it won't matter. If fleets can move freely through the system, maybe supplies can too...

I was also under the impression only if a system is taken does it cut the supply line. Contested friendly systems still provide resources, even if it's only half.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on November 16, 2013, 07:44:12 pm
Yea, I mean Vega. Sorry about that. :/
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on November 18, 2013, 10:01:27 pm
And, of course, I just realized that no Draco fleets can resupply, because the Zy fleet in Aqua will make the system contested, cutting off our supply route. Calloo-callay, oh glorious day.
You know, with the special rules Aquarius has, maybe it won't matter. If fleets can move freely through the system, maybe supplies can too...

I was also under the impression only if a system is taken does it cut the supply line. Contested friendly systems still provide resources, even if it's only half.
Yes contested systems still provide resources, but the supply line to sol IS cut off.

Yea, I mean Vega. Sorry about that. :/
unforgiveable, your fleet is now taken prisoner. It won't be released until you've provided me with 10 boxes of candy.

(turn slightly delayed because I was playing mahjong with Axem... AND LOST.)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on November 18, 2013, 10:06:49 pm
(turn slightly delayed because I was playing mahjong with Axem... AND LOST.)

Speaking of unforgivable...  :lol:


Yes contested systems still provide resources, but the supply line to sol IS cut off.

Well crap.  3rd Zy Delenda Est
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on November 19, 2013, 12:04:38 am

Yea, I mean Vega. Sorry about that. :/
unforgiveable, your fleet is now taken prisoner. It won't be released until you've provided me with 10 boxes of candy.

(turn slightly delayed because I was playing mahjong with Axem... AND LOST.)

Well...

So much for being incredibly awesome. What sort of 'candy' do you like and where can I send it?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on November 19, 2013, 03:40:23 am
Yes contested systems still provide resources, but the supply line to sol IS cut off.

Well crap.  3rd Zy Delenda Est

Ya think?  :p Seriously, I have no idea how we're gonna manage it. They're full strength and we'll probably be on our last legs.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on November 19, 2013, 03:50:51 am
My only consoling thought is that you're not alone, 2/3 of the fleets on the map are about to be cutoff from supply.  Both the UGCR in Algol, and if we attack Kardoen then all the southern Hierarchy fleets well also be cutoff.

At least the 2nd & 3rd SF will be at decent health to attack the 3rd Zy (although only the 2nd will probably be in position to do so next turn).  And if the 3rd Zy stay in Aquarius, at least you can retreat through there without taking damage.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on November 19, 2013, 07:46:56 pm
Bah, things keep popping up.

Here's the Turn 10 map at least
(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/WoD%20Forum%20Game/ForumgameStarmapt10_zps36462e8c.png~original)

Sorry for (yet another) the delay
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on November 19, 2013, 07:58:20 pm
I'm alive!, woo! :P

Ok, this looking interesting overall.. just have to wait for the officials stats :)

Take your time Spoon, thanks again.

Edit: Looks like we've lost the 2nd LSF, destroyed the 3rd Her'tak and gained the 1st DD in Sol
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Droid803 on November 19, 2013, 08:13:32 pm
2nd Fura is crippled, and has pulled back to Karoden, probably to resupply. Algol fleets can probably kill it.
That would also cut off the DoomStack from resupplying, wouldn't it, since they no longer have a supply line to wherever.
Unsure how well that would leave the northern flank, however.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on November 19, 2013, 08:33:09 pm
yeah, cutting off the Doomstack supply would be useful, although it may be more useful to damage the 4th Hertak than eliminate the 2nd Fura (depending on how much overkill there would be vs the Fura). Of course the DoomStack will probably come over and smack us up the next turn so we can't afford to take too much damage this turn.

One other benefit of attacking Kardoen is that it'll give the 3rd DD / 1st LSF an alternate line of retreat that could be easier to resupply from.  Due to the reduced damage done in Aquarius, the 3rd Zy might be able to hold on for quite a while there and continue to block supply to Vega/Draco.

As for the north, they didn't attack this turn which is a little surprising.  Maybe that was to let the 3rd Cordi resupply?  An attack from our three fleets on theirs could give us the advantage temporarily as well as allow us to maintain supply via Aldebaran.  The 1st DD could move to reinforce the North fairly quickly to cover the fact that both UGCR's are leaning towards the South now.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on November 19, 2013, 09:11:49 pm
Well, given that the Doomstack didn't move to Draco and we only have the Nrdy fleet's retreat damage to worry about, I am thinking of falling back to Aqua to give the 3rd Zy another target, hit them where it hurts and maybe get a chance to resupply at some point. This will also give me the chance to prepare my barrage, for later on.

I recommend a retreat to Tamy for the super-south fleets, to get them out of the Doomstack's reach - they have exhausted their reinforcements and the more time that we gain the more of our fleets will return to the front. A 'tempo' round, so to speak, would, maybe do us some good.

I am uncertain of how much an attack in Kardoen would benefit us. True, it would force the Hierarchy to return to retake its supply lines, but it would also mean that the Doomstack would double back and get one of our fleets there. If any of you people want to risk sacrificing yourselves, be my guests.

In any case, the northern front seems secure, now that the 1st DD is back to clean up your mess. The Delest Fleets get all the dirty work around here... :hopping:  :p
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on November 19, 2013, 11:34:09 pm
All that sounds good (i.e. most of the south pulling back) which means the 2x UGCR should probably weigh up the pros & cons of finishing off the 2nd Fura vs getting hit by the DoomStack... probably needs to wait until the stats come in to make a call on it.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on November 20, 2013, 11:01:06 am
My happy happy fun time DnD friends brought with them a virus of sorts so I've been feeling like **** the whole day now D:
Next turn posted, but (disclaimer) I haven't really done a proper check for errors yet.

Rear Admiral Augustus Corvus (Dragon), your fleet sacrficed itself heroically to get your allies out of the system.
Would you like to continue y/n?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on November 20, 2013, 11:44:38 am
Spoon, seriously, your immune system is busted. Take some vitamins, man.  :p

EDIT: Whoohoo, fleet untouched. Actually thinking of staying, now that the 3rd Htk is gone. But I'll be missing my barrage. Dammit. I really want to resupply to 200% and come back like an avalanche, with VH morale+4th gen+Barrage. Plus, I'll probably need to cover the other damaged fleets' retreat via Aqua.

EDIT 2: Dragon, you magnificent bastard. All of 3rd DD mourns for our ally's sacrifice. And we're sharpening our cutlasses too.

2nd Fura is almost dead, folks. Kardoen look mighty tasty.

EDIT 3: Aldebaran. Subspace barrage? SUBSPACE BARRAGE? For 20% damage on two fleets?! Spoon, scratch the vitamins, I'll feed you cyanide.  :mad:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on November 20, 2013, 01:48:32 pm
Spoon, scratch the vitamins, I'll feed you cyanide.  :mad:
  :lol:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: SpardaSon21 on November 20, 2013, 02:54:04 pm
Can 1st CSA and 1st SF help me attack either 5th Nordera or 1st Fura'ngle to start chipping away at the doomstack?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on November 20, 2013, 04:01:46 pm
Spoon doesn't have an immune system, I think we can safety establish this fact  :hopping:

So no resupply in Vega, oh sham...,

Quote
Draco, 2nd LSF, 1st CSA vs 2nd Fura'ngle
. Should be Hyrda?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on November 20, 2013, 04:07:01 pm
My monitor died... :(

I'm on a borrowed laptop until I can sort that out. Hate typing on this thing and using it in general, but beggars can't be choosers.

I believe we can put the Hirarchy under a lot of pressure this turn. I have a plan. I just have to type it up...

And Spoon, I think you need to cut yourself off from face to face human contact for a while to replenish your immune system. Though while I'm stuck on this machine, I don't mind the delay to the next turn.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on November 20, 2013, 04:26:40 pm
Meet our Doomstack!

1st UGCR Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 25+11=36 (13+2+1+2)
- Capital attack strength: 22+13=35 (15+1+2)
- Fighters at 150% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 126% Strength
- Morale: High
- Mercs on Cooldown, Available again on turn 13
- Aggressive leader

2nd UGCR Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 25+11=36 (13+2+1)
- Capital attack strength: 22+13=35 (15+1)
- Fighters at 175% Strength, 3rd Gen
- Capital ships at 150% Strength
- Morale: High
- Mercs on Cooldown, Available again on turn 13
- Master in Logistics

3rd DD Fleet:
- Fighter attack strength: 37+14=51 (18+5+2)
- Capital attack strength: 28+19=47 (17+2)
- Fighters at 168% Strength, 4th Gen
- Capital ships at 153% Strength
- Morale: Very High
- Inspirational Leader
- Master of Logistics

Total = 113/117

Please use it to obliterate the 4th Hertak, and cut the Hierarchy supply line right off.

Next, the 1st CSA and 3rd SF can pressure the 1st Fura'ngle. A joint attack will reduce the capship strength of that fleet to 60%.

And finally we have the 3rd Zy. If we have the 2nd SF and 1st CRF attack them, and the 2nd SF Blitz them, we can reduce their strength by just over half. If the Zy stand and fight after that, they will be destroyed. If they flee, the supply line opens back up.

This leaves the top. We can assume that mob at the top will be back to full strength now, and will probably move in next turn. They'll all attack one fleet, so let's make sure it isn't a resupplying one. Have the fleets that were hit by the missiles pull out and resupply, and he fleet that wasn't hit (4th SF) remain in Aldebaran. I imagine that was the special of the combined Zy/Fura fleet.

The Hierarchy will be under pressure in three places down South. The Doomstack can only hit one... oh and the fleets dealing with the 3rd Zy, while weak, will not be able to be interfered with.

EDIT: Oh, and I would send the 1st DD to Formalhaut.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on November 20, 2013, 04:39:37 pm
Uh, Lorric?

Quote
- If a fleet is in a contested system with an enemy fleet it cannot move to an enemy control system.

I am in a contested system (Draco). I cannot move to Kardoen. Right now, as long as the 4th Nordi is still alive, I can only move to Vega.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on November 20, 2013, 04:40:43 pm
I was about to say the same thing :)  So the Alliance DoomStack can form next turn (subject to the local tactical conditions :))

Edit: and the 1st CRF is attacking at 29% capships left.  Wow!  :eek2:  I hope the 2nd SF can deal enough damage with you to not make that suicide...
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on November 20, 2013, 04:43:35 pm
But if the UGCR Fleets move first (all fleets moving on first action, but they go first) the system becomes contested. Therefore, it is ok to move from contested to contested.

Correct?

Also, throwing up my turn now as I *may* be unavailable later. Just as a precaution :)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on November 20, 2013, 04:44:10 pm
Or not. Since we can't attack now, a tactical retreat and re-organization might be a better idea. If we allow the southern Hierarchy fleets to advance deeper into our territory, they will be forced to lessen their hold on Kardoen. This will seriously mess with their resupplies when the UGCR fleets come down and take it over.

By the way, the Fura fleet in Kardoen is down to half health. Just noting that.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on November 20, 2013, 04:45:34 pm
The system will turn contested, so won't that enable him to move? It will be contested when he arrives.

If it doesn't, then kill the Fura'ngle instead, and have the 1st LSF and 3rd DD smash the 4th Nordera, then the 3rd DD move into Kardoen.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on November 20, 2013, 04:46:55 pm
But if the UCGR Fleets move first (all fleets moving on first action, but they go first) the system becomes contested. Therefore, it is ok to move from contested to contested.

Correct?

No, I don't think so. The system must be already contested when you move to it. So, if I waited until my second action, I might be allowed to do this. However, moving during the same action that makes the system contested is probably forbidden. Otherwise, you could argue that such movements would be allowed anyway, because moving a fleet into a hostile system makes it contested.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on November 20, 2013, 04:51:13 pm
But if the UCGR Fleets move first (all fleets moving on first action, but they go first) the system becomes contested. Therefore, it is ok to move from contested to contested.

Correct?

No, I don't think so. The system must be already contested when you move to it. So, if I waited until my second action, I might be allowed to do this. However, moving during the same action that makes the system contested is probably forbidden. Otherwise, you could argue that such movements would be allowed anyway, because moving a fleet into a hostile system makes it contested.
The argument is a legal move is being made by the UGCR fleets, making your move legal. That's how I thought it would work.

Spooooooon! Can we please go and crush your 4th Hertak fleet? :)

Regardless of whether we can or can't, I believe we should attack.
If it doesn't, then kill the Fura'ngle instead, and have the 1st LSF and 3rd DD smash the 4th Nordera, then the 3rd DD move into Kardoen.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on November 20, 2013, 04:53:25 pm
Sorry, I mean

UGCR 1
First Action: Move
Section Action: Go sight-seeing

UGCR 2
First Action: Move
Section Action: Take a Holiday

1st CRF
First Action: Move to Aquarius
Second Action: Faff around in the clouds

DD 3rd
First Action: Move
Section Action: Do all the hard work

If the Admirals post in this order, then the systems becomes contested when the 1st UGCR enters the system, so by the time we move through the first actions and find the 3rd DD. The system is contested, therefore they can move it.

I hope that makes me clearer, I'm having trouble understanding myself atm. :) (I thought it was allowed anyway)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on November 20, 2013, 05:03:14 pm
Uhhh.... so you're asking for the 3rd DD to attack the Hertak alone? or even the Furangle alone? No. Forget it. I am already unable to resupply and I refuse to attack as anything other than as part of a battlegroup, to spread the damage. Do not argue about how I can afford it, or resupply later - I will not risk it. Especially not in reach of the Doomstack, with two Hertak Fleets in range.

EDIT: can we actually kill the Nordera in Draco this turn? Because that would open up some very interesting strategic possibilities... :drevil:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on November 20, 2013, 05:08:08 pm
Uhhh.... so you're asking for the 3rd DD to attack the Hertak alone? or even the Furangle alone? No. Forget it. I am already unable to resupply and I refuse to attack as anything other than as part of a battlegroup, to spread the damage. Do not argue about how I can afford it, or resupply later - I will not risk it. Especially not in reach of the Doomstack, with two Hertak Fleets in range.

EDIT: can we actually kill the Nordera in Draco this turn? Because that would open up some very interesting strategic possibilities... :drevil:

No. I'm asking you to wipe them out with the UGCR fleets.

EDIT: The Nordera cannot be killed. If the move on the Hertak is impossible, the attack I asked for would reduce them to 18/27.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on November 20, 2013, 05:11:52 pm
I was talking to Veers. Your argument I got, and it makes sense but for the moving-into-non-contested-system thing, which we need Spoon's ruling for.

Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on November 20, 2013, 05:13:57 pm
I was talking to Veers. Your argument I got, and it makes sense but for the moving-into-non-contested-system thing, which we need Spoon's ruling for.
Ah. :yes:
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on November 20, 2013, 05:16:17 pm
I think we'll need Spoon to arbitrate on whether the 3rd DD can move to Kardoen at the same time the UGCR fleets move in.  My personal feeling is that this would not be allowed, all 1st moves happen at the same time, so the DD would have to wait at least until the 2nd action to move, meaning they couldn't attack the 4th Hertak anyway.

As for destroying the 4th Nordera, I think the 1st LSF + 3rd DD can deal 73% capship damage, while they have 84% remaining, so not quite.

(you guys are posting too fast, this is practically out of date now :p)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on November 20, 2013, 05:21:12 pm
My actions there are supposed funny in regard to your comment of the 3rd DD doing all the work :P

In any case, the northern front seems secure, now that the 1st DD is back to clean up your mess. The Delest Fleets get all the dirty work around here... :hopping:  :p

Aww damn, I looked at the wrong data window, I checked the total Allied Fleet total rather than the battle total. Which said I still have 40odd % left, not 20something%

Hmmm...

Code: [Select]
1st CRF Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 12 (16+2+3+2)
Capital attack strength: 10 (17+3+2)
Fighters at 33% Strength, 3rd Gen
Capital ships at 29% Strength
Morale: Zealous
Aggressive Leader

Code: [Select]
Commonwealth Royal Fleet: 4/4
1st CRF Fleet:
 - Fighter attack strength: 12 (16+2+3)
 - Capital attack strength: 10 (17+3)
 - Fighters at 43% Strength, 3rd Gen
 - Capital ships at 40% Strength
 - Morale: Zealous
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on November 20, 2013, 05:25:11 pm
I think we'll need Spoon to arbitrate on whether the 3rd DD can move to Kardoen at the same time the UGCR fleets move in.  My personal feeling is that this would not be allowed, all 1st moves happen at the same time, so the DD would have to wait at least until the 2nd action to move, meaning they couldn't attack the 4th Hertak anyway.

As for destroying the 4th Nordera, I think the 1st LSF + 3rd DD can deal 73% capship damage, while they have 84% remaining, so not quite.

(you guys are posting too fast, this is practically out of date now :p)
It shows what a grey area it is that two of us think the move legal and two don't. I really hope we can do it. Not just for obvious reasons, but it'll look fantastic on the turn 11 vid. I thought the UGCR fleets wiping out the 1st Zy was a big highlight of those videos, beautiful with those Zy capships exploding to the power of the UGCR ships, with that beautiful backdrop. This would be a big step up, a full strength Hertak fleet destroyed in a single stroke.

Heh. :)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on November 20, 2013, 05:34:15 pm
Aww damn, I looked at the wrong data window, I checked the total Allied Fleet total rather than the battle total. Which said I still have 40odd % left, not 20something%

Hmmm...

From my calcs, you should be able to scrape through.  2nd SF + 1st CRF (including the 5 point attack penalty for Aquarius) reduce the 3rd Zy to 44/49, leaving their attack (with the -5) @ 12/13.  Your fleet should be at 23/18, so you'd survive the counter-attack with 5% capships remaining.  And that doesn't include the 2nd SF Blitz, which should do another 5/4 damage to the 3rd Zy, reducing their attack strength slightly further.

Of course, the turn after will get interesting for you, although the Aquarius special does mean you don't have to worry about retreat damage.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on November 20, 2013, 05:36:08 pm
You have absolutely no idea how disappointed I feel that the Delest fleets are not yet ready for the videos, when they've been present in every destruction of a Hertak fleet.

Spoon, I understand that you just don't have the assets ready and that, as they say, is that, but I expect recompense. The Delest Admirals are to be awesome NPCs in the WoD release. You hear?

I got my eyes on you mister. Cyanide is brewing.

EDIT: niffi, excellent calcs, but this still doesn't help him next turn. We need to find a way to get him out of there. Maybe if all Odin Fleets retreated to Tamy, to hold the choke (which would also get them out of range of the Doomstack) and the 2nd SF double moved to Ruba or Silva? Extreme, but it would work.

Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on November 20, 2013, 05:40:02 pm
Thanks for the calculation, but while I was not considering attacking originally. (even though i posted it), I probably won't get a retreat in next turn if the Zy attack, as I'll be gone-skies. Can the Zy be wiped out?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on November 20, 2013, 05:50:43 pm
Not if they stay in Aqua. They're outside my range and I believe that I'm the only hitter heavy enough nearby to kill them.

The only thing I can suggest you do, is retreat NOW. To Formalhaut. Where you will be met by the 1st DD, which will cover any further retreats.

I can't say for sure if you will survive a fight in Formalhaut, though, given that the Zy will have no -5 nebula penalty. Somebody needs to crunch numbers. And I'm going to bed.

Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on November 20, 2013, 08:28:52 pm
I think we'll need Spoon to arbitrate on whether the 3rd DD can move to Kardoen at the same time the UGCR fleets move in.  My personal feeling is that this would not be allowed, all 1st moves happen at the same time, so the DD would have to wait at least until the 2nd action to move, meaning they couldn't attack the 4th Hertak anyway.

As for destroying the 4th Nordera, I think the 1st LSF + 3rd DD can deal 73% capship damage, while they have 84% remaining, so not quite.

(you guys are posting too fast, this is practically out of date now :p)
Posting fast indeed!
You are correct on this though, the 3rd DD would have to wait for its second action to move into kardoen.

You have absolutely no idea how disappointed I feel that the Delest fleets are not yet ready for the videos, when they've been present in every destruction of a Hertak fleet.

Spoon, I understand that you just don't have the assets ready and that, as they say, is that, but I expect recompense. The Delest Admirals are to be awesome NPCs in the WoD release. You hear?

I got my eyes on you mister. Cyanide is brewing.
The reason why there hasn't been a video going with the last two turns and the turns that are still missing them is because I'm secretly working on getting the first DD capitalship into the game! Dear heavens, please put away that cyanide!
It's a Droid803 made ship but I've made a few alterations. I'm still deciding on what colorscheme to go with, right now its a very dark blue, almost black. Makes it kinda hard to see though!
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on November 20, 2013, 10:00:00 pm
Thanks for clearing that up Spoon.

EDIT: niffi, excellent calcs, but this still doesn't help him next turn. We need to find a way to get him out of there. Maybe if all Odin Fleets retreated to Tamy, to hold the choke (which would also get them out of range of the Doomstack) and the 2nd SF double moved to Ruba or Silva? Extreme, but it would work.

The 3rd SF could double move to Aquarius to cover them, but the 1st CRF could still get away the following turn (12?) by double moving away.  No retreat damage, and the 3rd Zy could only follow, not attack. As long as they run towards another fleet, the 3rd Zy would be blocked there, that's even if they'd follow in the 1st place.  They might drop another supernova if they're left alone for a turn...

I can't say for sure if you will survive a fight in Formalhaut, though, given that the Zy will have no -5 nebula penalty. Somebody needs to crunch numbers. And I'm going to bed.

If the 1st CRF double moved to Formalhaut, they should survive an attack this turn from the 3rd Zy even if the 2nd SF doesn't attack or blitz them.  Deals 24/24, leaving them with 5% capships left.

One other thing to consider, the 2nd SF morale is already "very low" due to being attacked while resupplying (I guess).  Will they lose morale again for dropping below 50%?

Maybe the 1st CRF double moving to Tamy would be better, then they could have other fleets to cover their retreat if the 3rd Zy attack them.


Moving on to the UGCR... if we both attack the 4th Hertak we have:
1 UGCR: 131/105
2 UGCR: 156/129
4 Hertak: 26/28

Return fire would be (assuming 2nd Fura resupplied this turn and attack with Flag H + 1st Fura):
1 UGCR: 46/10

If we both attack the 2nd Fura (again assuming they resupplied):
1 UGCR: 143/118
2 UGCR: 168/142
2nd Fura: -20/-12  :nod:  (includes extra resupply damage)

Return fire would be (assuming Flag H + 1st Fura + 4th Hertak):
1 UGCR: 35/-2 :(


So, hitting the 4th Hertak would seem the better option here, even though we're not destroying a fleet.  The following turn, the 3 DD & 2 UGCR could continue the attack while the 1 UGCR retreats to resupply, assuming that Aldebaran isn't contested.  If it is, a double move to Vega (if the 1 LSF/3 DD can still cover Draco) would be better.  Of course, the 2x Nordera + 4 Hertak remnants could attack the 1 LSF for around 32/33.  Or the DoomStack could hit the 1 LSF/3 DD instead of the 2x UGCR, that would be about 85/95 damage which would destroy the 1st LSF.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Flak on November 21, 2013, 01:53:17 am
Aldebaran, Subspace missile barrage

Don't tell me that that whatever Fura/Zy fleet is led by Steele's clone.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Droid803 on November 21, 2013, 02:29:18 am
I don't think Steele's been warping in SSMs from Delta Serpentis.
This seems to be a bit more...long-range.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on November 21, 2013, 03:32:58 am
@niffi: good points. Sounds like a plan to me. Go for the 4th Htk and godspeed.

I will hit the Nordera, then, and prepare my barrage for extra pwnage next turn.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on November 21, 2013, 11:10:34 am
While I think Enioch's move is better than the one I proposed, giving him extra firepower and the flexibility to attack into several systems next turn, I strongly believe we should kill the 2nd Fura while we have the chance. I imagine the 2nd Fura and 4th Hertak will simply retreat behind Kardoen to resupply and the flag fleet will settle into Kardoen so we can't follow, and we will have accomplished nothing.

For the Zy, I would now have the SF Blitz them then re-enter the system. It's now about stalling them.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on November 21, 2013, 11:26:07 am
Note to everybody: I will be able to attack with an extra barrage (unless something nasty happens), but that would require the neighboring system to be contested. This means that I will only be able to attack in Hydra / Kardoen if allied fleets enter them this turn and survive until the next.

Just a pointer.

However, there is the possibility of Nordera headbutting. I reserve the right to back the hell off if they fix bayonets and ram their ships down my throat.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on November 21, 2013, 11:54:16 am
You would think the damage would be much reduced if that happens, the Nordera fleet will be about half the size of the 1st Fleet when it went kamikaze.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on November 21, 2013, 11:57:13 am
You never know. We'll see. It may be flat damage.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on November 21, 2013, 06:02:03 pm
While I think Enioch's move is better than the one I proposed, giving him extra firepower and the flexibility to attack into several systems next turn, I strongly believe we should kill the 2nd Fura while we have the chance. I imagine the 2nd Fura and 4th Hertak will simply retreat behind Kardoen to resupply and the flag fleet will settle into Kardoen so we can't follow, and we will have accomplished nothing.

If the 4th Hertak & 2nd Fura retreat beyond Kardoen then we have bought time with which we can destroy other Hierarchy Fleets (e.g. the Nordera & the Northern fleets).  And we have concentrated our most resilient fleets in the South to fight the Flag fleet. I don't think that destroying the 2nd Fura in exchange for losing the 1 UGCR is a good trade.  We need to be able to attack the Flag fleets escorts without losing our own fleets, so we need tough tanks to be able to absorb the counter attacks.

For the Zy, I would now have the SF Blitz them then re-enter the system. It's now about stalling them.

If they resupply then their morale returns to normal.  I think we've only seen a single fleet fall below very low morale (4th Cordi?) and the result was surrender.  I think we want to avoid that, I doubt a surrendering Admiral will be given a replacement fleet.  And given the special properties of Aquarius, and the slipstream ability, we can't really stall the Zy if they don't want to be stalled.  We just want to give them a poor set of options to choose from.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on November 21, 2013, 07:35:51 pm
Hmmm, you've given me quite a bit to think about, and right now, I don't have the time. I'm not sure if I'll be available tomorrow either. But fortunately time isn't a problem right now with poor Spoon's latest medical malady as his body continues to mirror his forum game with the viral heirarchy continually flooding in to test his battered immune system's defences. So I'll get back to you on this when I can.

Spoon, tell your happy happy fun time DnD friends to stay home the next time they are carrying a virus around with them. :)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Flak on November 22, 2013, 12:42:24 am
So the DD ships are going to be the Hurricane and Typhoon?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on November 22, 2013, 03:26:38 am
The reason why there hasn't been a video going with the last two turns and the turns that are still missing them is because I'm secretly working on getting the first DD capitalship into the game! Dear heavens, please put away that cyanide!
It's a Droid803 made ship but I've made a few alterations. I'm still deciding on what colorscheme to go with, right now its a very dark blue, almost black. Makes it kinda hard to see though!

Muahaha. Double, double toil and trouble; Fire burn, and caldron bubble. Tongue of frog and demon's hide; hyperkilly cyanide.

Regarding the texture work on the ships, you might want to play with the shine and glow maps. If they're bright enough (not mirrory - bright), you might get a very interesting effect of a dark ships silhouetted by its specular reflections.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Droid803 on November 22, 2013, 02:05:26 pm
So the DD ships are going to be the Hurricane and Typhoon?
I didn't even make those. (They're by Vengence)



eedeet:
I shall watch Tamy.
Not resupplying because getting hit by teh Zy while doing so would probably be bad, so I'll sit there and act smug (might as well figure out what that actually does!)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: AdmiralRalwood on November 24, 2013, 02:50:43 pm
Second Action: Major, Use Special (do I even have one!? what does it do? only one way to find out!)
Not as a Major action, you won't.

Minor Action:
[...]
Use Special: Uses your fleet's special ability.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on November 24, 2013, 03:57:03 pm
The Zy can't hit you Droid. They can't go to a friendly system from a contested one, and we get advance warning if they slipstream, so Resupply is safe.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on November 24, 2013, 04:03:23 pm
The Zy can't hit you Droid. They can't go to a friendly system from a contested one, and we get advance warning if they slipstream, so Resupply is safe.

Er, Aquarius is "special".  I believe they could (if they wanted to) move to a neighbouring system and attack someone.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on November 24, 2013, 04:06:28 pm
The Zy can't hit you Droid. They can't go to a friendly system from a contested one, and we get advance warning if they slipstream, so Resupply is safe.

Er, Aquarius is "special".  I believe they could (if they wanted to) move to a neighbouring system and attack someone.
Oh drat, that's twice I've forgotten about Aquarius' special rules.

I'd still resupply. It's only 5 extra damage and -1 morale. They won't hit very hard in their weakened condition.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Droid803 on November 24, 2013, 05:10:35 pm
Second Action: Major, Use Special (do I even have one!? what does it do? only one way to find out!)
Not as a Major action, you won't.

Minor Action:
[...]
Use Special: Uses your fleet's special ability.
Pfft, does it even matter, my other action is a move which can be major or minor.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on November 24, 2013, 09:38:17 pm
Pew pew
Turn 9 vid up: http://youtu.be/uk_eql49h7c
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: mobcdmoc3 on November 24, 2013, 10:06:31 pm
Anybody want to suggest to me what I should do? I'll get steamrolled if the deathstack comes after me. I see three options:

- Sit tight and set up a defense
- Attack the deathstack
- Retreat and camp Tamy in preparation for the 3rd Zy
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on November 24, 2013, 11:25:26 pm
Maybe run over to Aquarius so you can clobber them next turn no matter which system they go to?  (barring them just running away without attacking of course)

edit: such sad music for the 4th CRF, beautiful  :(
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on November 25, 2013, 03:01:36 am
Whooooooo  3rd DD ships. The Katyusha looks awesome.  :pimp:
*Sniff*Sob*, the feels for the 4th CRF...  :(
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Droid803 on November 26, 2013, 08:08:38 pm
Here's the p3d for the DD cap (textureless), may have been modified since.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Dragon on November 26, 2013, 09:34:09 pm
Nice.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on November 28, 2013, 09:21:13 pm
Nice.
I'm still waiting for your answer.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on November 29, 2013, 05:46:34 pm
Can we attempt capture of the 3rd Zy if we knock them down a tad further?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: CommanderDJ on November 29, 2013, 11:53:39 pm
What should I be doing? I haven't checked the thread for a while.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: X3N0-Life-Form on November 30, 2013, 03:28:52 am
Can we attempt capture of the 3rd Zy if we knock them down a tad further?
Seems a bit unlikely, considering that their moral is currently very high. If anything, I'm the one that risks getting captured. I'm not sure I can even risk getting into another fight with them. Is blitzing a fleet in the same system as me valid move?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on November 30, 2013, 04:24:14 am
What should I be doing? I haven't checked the thread for a while.

After that subspace missile barrage hit, I *think* that withdrawing to Formalhaut or Virgo and resupplying could be a good idea.

Is blitzing a fleet in the same system as me valid move?

AFAIK, that's fine as long as you also move out of the system with the Blitz.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on November 30, 2013, 04:46:13 am
I'm assuming if we knock their strength down some more, and attempt a capture (very sure they will not surrender). They can really only retreat via .. slipspace or whatever it was called.

I'm happy to attempt it if they are still there after I've had a quick resupply. But we would need to knock them down in strength further to make it easier to assault the flagship

All assuming Spoon would allow such an attempt, I wonder if we even have enough marines/troops aboard to attempt such a feat or only enough as security (which would be normal..) (Veers, stop trying to add more to the game damnit!)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on November 30, 2013, 06:27:39 am
We still appear to be missing quite a few orders this turn (yeah I know I didnt get a deadline this time but)

Can we attempt capture of the 3rd Zy if we knock them down a tad further?
If you can kill it 'normally' and put it in the orders that you want to (capture) then sure, I'll allow it.

Is blitzing a fleet in the same system as me valid move?
Yes (if you are unsure how blitz work you can check how other admirals have used it these past turns)

Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: SpardaSon21 on November 30, 2013, 12:17:38 pm
So, 1st LSF does what?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on November 30, 2013, 04:48:36 pm
Jellyfish, I'm not sure that the resupply is a great idea.  You'll get back 7% capship health, but if all three enemy fleets from Crux attack you, you'll lose 15% extra capship health and morale if attacked while resupplying.  While it's a waste of an action, only using a defend action may be better.

So, 1st LSF does what?

Hmmm.. hit the 4th Nordera with the 3rd DD, then withdraw to Vega so you don't get splatted by the DoomStack?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on November 30, 2013, 06:01:15 pm
Jellyfish, I'm not sure that the resupply is a great idea.  You'll get back 7% capship health, but if all three enemy fleets from Crux attack you, you'll lose 15% extra capship health and morale if attacked while resupplying.  While it's a waste of an action, only using a defend action may be better.
Indeed. I would also advise DJ to switch his destination to Formalhaut, to avoid potentially being hit by the 3rd Zy while Resupplying.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: CommanderDJ on November 30, 2013, 06:04:39 pm
Can they move that way though? I thought they can't move from a contested to a hostile system unless they have Blitz?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on November 30, 2013, 06:05:44 pm
Can they move that way though? I thought they can't move from a contested to a hostile system unless they have Blitz?
Aquarius' special rules.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: CommanderDJ on November 30, 2013, 06:09:28 pm
Haha, they strike again! Good call, good call. I'll switch over.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on November 30, 2013, 07:57:31 pm
Aaaaaw  :(


So I think we have pretty much everyone now?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on November 30, 2013, 09:01:07 pm
So I think we have pretty much everyone now?
Two left, and Jellyfish to adjust orders.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: X3N0-Life-Form on December 01, 2013, 05:46:58 am
Alrighty, I'm going to Blitz the 3rd Zy, then retreat to Virgo to rebuild my moral & fleet. If I'm reading everything correctly, the 3rd Zy is pretty much boxed in at the moment.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Flak on December 01, 2013, 08:38:56 am
Actually you can just use blitz to make your way out and still haven't used up the second action. You can resupply immediately or just make one more move.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: X3N0-Life-Form on December 01, 2013, 08:47:08 am
OK, orders updated.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on December 01, 2013, 10:32:48 am
1st CSA Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 16 (23)
Capital attack strength: 14 (20)
Fighters at 70% Strength
Capital ships at 68% Strength
Morale: Normal

Droid, you should Resupply instead of using your nonexistant special.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on December 01, 2013, 01:12:15 pm
Let the man have his fun.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on December 01, 2013, 01:42:57 pm
Let the man have his fun.
Where's the fun? There is no special.

It's his fleet, he can do what he wants, but I'm sure there'll be an opportunity when there's only one action to take to try this.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on December 01, 2013, 02:50:46 pm
Let the man have his fun.
Where's the fun? There is no special.

That's the point. He wants to have some nonsensical fun, let him. It's his fleet he's risking.

Not everyone plays the game to win - some play it just so they can goof around and have fun doing silly things.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on December 04, 2013, 03:35:42 am
I banned the 1st Fleet from having any fun. We are the elite of the elite, not some circus moving system to system....

Just say'in  :nervous:

lol :P
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Flak on December 04, 2013, 06:14:24 am
The only 'fun' I know is probably run in head first guns blazing into the face of a Hertak Armageddon. Fine if you can survive that.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Jellyfish on December 04, 2013, 07:36:21 am
We are the elite of the elite, not some circus moving system to system....
But the Firelance DOES have a circus. A three-ring circus, no less.
And a mall. And a zoo.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on December 04, 2013, 10:28:40 am
I only know the missile circus!

So are we good? Shall we turn? Cause right now I think we should turn. Turn circles in the circus. Round and round we go~
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on December 04, 2013, 10:46:23 am
niffiwan, this was your plan. I'm sorry I never got to comparing your plan to my plan to try and see which was the best, I've been having a hard time lately and my thoughts have been too scattered to focus on it properly. Though I suppose that won't bother you, it means you get what you wanted! :lol:

Anyway, like I said, this was your plan. So do you think we're good to go?

Cause right now I think we should turn. Turn circles in the circus. Round and round we go~
You can make the Hierarchy do that if you want. :)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on December 04, 2013, 12:19:34 pm
errr, sure, I think we're ready so lets go :)
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on December 04, 2013, 12:26:15 pm
So are we good? Shall we turn? Cause right now I think we should turn.
History will turn before us! Death to the Hertak!
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: AndrewofDoom on December 04, 2013, 03:31:50 pm
Let's do this, Spoon. I'm alllll ready to be swamped in death.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Veers on December 04, 2013, 03:42:03 pm
We are the elite of the elite, not some circus moving system to system....
But the Firelance DOES have a circus. A three-ring circus, no less.
And a mall. And a zoo.

Really?

Number One, get me those tickets! We are going to the Zoo!
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Spoon on December 06, 2013, 08:25:19 pm
Next turn up, as usual scream at me if there are errors somewhere to be had.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: SpardaSon21 on December 07, 2013, 12:41:48 am
Can 1st CSA engage 5th Nordera at Odin while 3rd SF helps me take down 3rd Zy at Vega?  I figure 1st and 2nd UGCR can run to Draco while 3rd DD Secures and Resupplies there.  If 3rd DD does Secure as first action, shouldn't the 2nd UGCR be able to Defend as their second action as 1st UGCR spends its second action to Resupply?  Next turn 1st and 2nd UGCR can fall back to a Secured Vega to resupply as 3rd SF and my 1st LSF cycle in to replace them.

Spoon: I don't know if Defend already does this, but it should count as said fleet doing a node blockade and forcing the attacking fleets to focus on them.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: AndrewofDoom on December 07, 2013, 01:07:40 am
Well. uh, I'm boned. Looks like Niffy is too.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Jellyfish on December 07, 2013, 01:27:14 am
I wonder if I would survive an attack, then a blitz out against the 1st FuraZy. If not, I can blitz out, then resupply in the same turn.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on December 07, 2013, 02:45:32 am
Can 1st CSA engage 5th Nordera at Odin while 3rd SF helps me take down 3rd Zy at Vega?  I figure 1st and 2nd UGCR can run to Draco while 3rd DD Secures and Resupplies there.  If 3rd DD does Secure as first action, shouldn't the 2nd UGCR be able to Defend as their second action as 1st UGCR spends its second action to Resupply?  Next turn 1st and 2nd UGCR can fall back to a Secured Vega to resupply as 3rd SF and my 1st LSF cycle in to replace them.

Spoon: I don't know if Defend already does this, but it should count as said fleet doing a node blockade and forcing the attacking fleets to focus on them.

You don't have enough damage output to kill the Zy. They are at 62% caps and a joint attack by you (13 +23/2=25) and 3rd SF (18+23/2=30) only outputs 25+30=55 cap damage. If I retreat to Vega, on the other hand, we can wipe the floor with them and take less damage in return. This would mean, of course, that Draco would be left hostile, until we went back.

DoomStack does now 96 cap damage. That would allow a fresh fleet to barely survive them. So, the way I see it, the fleets in Kardoen have the following options:

1) Damaged fleet double retreats to Vega, while the undamaged one covers the retreat. The undamaged fleet can bog down the Doomstack for another turn, before dying.

2) Undamaged fleet double retreats. Damaged fleet dies next turn. We still have a combat-capable fleet available, but two of the Doomstack fleets are free to move / resupply (once, because it will take them their first action to kill our fleet and make the system hostile).
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: niffiwan on December 07, 2013, 04:52:25 am
well Darrell, I think I ****** up.  Damn those Nordera and their 60% capship kamikaze (I thought the damage was proportional to their remaining capship health :sigh:).  I'll have to run some calcs... I think the 3rd DD + 2nd UGCR could destroy the 2nd Fura, but the counterstroke will be... hmmm...  bloody close to the remaining capship health of the 3rd DD.  (note to self, need to include any possible damage from the return of the 4th Hertak after 1x resupply)

FWIW, regardless of anything else, I think the 1st UGCR should retreat & secure Draco. They can't move to Vega without exceeding the system fleet size limit (assuming we trash the 3rd Zy), and moving to Hydra would let the Nordera destroy them. And if the 2nd UGCR is parked in Kardoen, none of those fleets can move to Draco & attack.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on December 07, 2013, 06:01:11 am
I'm not taking my fleet anywhere near Kardoen. That Kamikaze did a number on me and, until I get the chance to resupply, I'm not moving toward the front lines again. When I'm 200/200 again, and doing 50 cap damage every turn, I will call you back.

One of you is dead - either this coming turn or the next, no matter what we do. You can only choose when and how that single fleet will die - and who it's going to be.

If the 1st leaves, with the 2nd covering them and staying behind, they can secure Draco and resupply/retreat further next turn. The Hierarchy will likely retreat the damaged Fura, bring back the 4th Hertak and probably plow through the 2nd. They might even advance two fleets (1st Fura + Flag) to Draco, but they'd be unable to attack.

If the 2nd leaves and the 1st stays, the Hertak will do pretty much the same - but they will only need to attack with one fleet to wipe them out and they will have enough forces to move and attack Draco. However, we will have a combat-worthy fleet near the front lines (which the 1st is no more - it will need 3 resupply actions to be operational again).

We will need to cede more systems to the Hierarchy in the southern front, if we're to win this without any more losses. The way I see it, we might be better off leading them in a merry chase all the way to Tamy, while the upper front wipes out the Cordi enemy fleets up there. Then we hit them from two rotating fronts. They can't hunt us down and keep a doomstack working, because they'll have to either give chase and have the systems revert to friendly the minute they leave, or leave fleets behind to secure them. So, they either give us time to re-group, or they chase us down in a disorganized way.


EDIT: Ran some calcs on the upper front. Our heaviest hitters up there are the two SF fleets and the 2nd CRF. Even if the 4th SF retreats without support (and dies - NOT RECOMENDED!!!1!) and all three of our fleets jump and attack, they do not have enough damage output to kill an enemy. However, they might knock the 1st Fura & Zy to 3/18 (which will make them do a piddly 3/5 damage).

If two of our fleets jump in (Recommended: 2nd SF, 2nd CRF) and the 4th SF joins in the attack (yes, I am suggesting the 14% fleet attacks, problem?) they can bring the 1st FuraZy to 24/38 (Damage next turn: 9/12). The 4th SF will be down to 2%/4% (!!) but will be able to retreat with its second action (I hope the FuraZy do not have another subspace barrage up their sleeves). The 1st SF can resupply and move to Aldebaran as a second action, to be able to attack and retreat next turn, if it gets pummeled. If it doesn't, it will do full damage on its turn, which is always nice.
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on December 07, 2013, 06:51:09 am
Spoon, if the 1st UGCR releases it's mercs from contract, can we save 5 supplies if they are annihilated that turn afterwards?
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Lorric on December 07, 2013, 06:57:49 am
Suggestion:

Have the 4th SF blitz the combined Fura/Zy and Resupply.

Have the 1st SF, 2nd SF and 2nd CRF attack the combined Fura/Zy. This will inflict 84 capital damage and put them out of the fight for a bit, allowing us to work on the Cordi next turn.

1st CRF, double Resupply.

1st DD to Virgo.

3rd CRF to Formalhaut or Zeal/Polaris.

3rd SF, 1st LSF, 3rd DD - crush the 3rd Zy. 1st LSF can then Resupply with the second action.

2nd UGCR can't resupply. Route is blocked both here and in Algol. Attack 2nd Fura'ngle, travel to Draco.

1st CSA - Resupply, Defend.

AndrewofDoom, uncontract your mercs if we save supplies and stay put.

AndrewofDoom will meet his doom by the Doomstack…
Title: Re: Forum game: Rules/Discussion
Post by: Enioch on December 07,