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After being somewhat disappointed with Trek's new offering I got to thinking about sci-fi shows that stand out to me and one of them has definitely got to be the Expanse.
I'll confess that I haven't read the books yet (Leviathan Wakes is next on my list), but I really enjoy the show. The premise is that our solar system, 200-something years in the future, has been colonised to the point where Earth and Mars are considered as separate states with the asteroid belt somewhat divided between the two. Humans that grew up on Mars or the asteroid belt are unused to Earth gravity and the 'Belters' in particular have all kinds of physical deformities as a result.
The show really caught me for its faithful depiction of Newtonian physics, the likes of which I can't remember seeing since BSG or Babylon 5. Traveling through space is depicted as being routine enough to support trade and travel, but still quite a big deal - high G burns have to be endured by belting into a seat and pumping drugs into the body. Orbital mechanics are likewise well portrayed, although I'll confess my experience stems from Kerbal Space Program. :)
For all its believable depiction of science however, the Expanse is driven very much by its plot and its characters. Some of the main cast can at times seem a bit wooden, but they're very fleshed out and are portrayed as complimenting each other's strengths and weaknesses to make an effective crew.
The season 2 finale was something I very much enjoyed - the "oh ****" moment of the science vessel splitting apart and Naomi's speech were very well done. To hear Naomi tell it, it seemed to me like she was essentially getting at the perpetual arms race that humans seem to find themselves in and it actually made me rethink my stance on Nuclear weps. She understands the need for parity and while her actions might have been somewhat impulsive I think she made the right call in delivering the proto-molecule to Fred Johnson.
If someone's already made a discussion thread, then apologies, I couldn't find it. I like this show very much and feel that it deserves its own thread at the very least.
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The Expanse is probably my favourite space opera novel series right now, and to see that it gets a quality treatment on translation to screen makes me happy.
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My 2'nd favourite sci-fi lore, right behind Freespace and Mass Effect <impossible question, which one I love more>. Get your hands on the books ASAP! I even heard opinions that Expanse is a space GoT, which is pretty good comparison. Mixture of politics, personal agendas, and fight, seen from many perspectives. So far we have 3'rd season confirmed but there is enough source material for at least twice as many. Series interpretation of the books is very accurate, I found maybe 2 or 3 small differences when it comes to the events. Some characters appear earlier in the series, compared to the book timeline but that's not a problem at all.
BTW. #TeamMCR :P <though Avasarala is my fav character so far. Aghdashloo's acting is simply outstanding>
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oh **** it has a second season already I missed out on this ****ing hell be right back ;)
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The Expanse is pretty awesome. I'm staying away from the books for now, but I'll be sure to get them once the series concludes.
I'm waiting on the proto-molecule to go all Beast on everyone and bite them in the ass. I'm also still waiting on practical or theoretical breakthrough coming from the molecule - although Vagabond's (I forget the guy's name) company might have already cashed in on that to some extent.
oh **** it has a second season already I missed out on this ****ing hell be right back ;)
Shame on you !
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I haven't watched the show at all, but the books are fantastic and I cannot recommend them enough. Also, unlike certain fantasy authors - GRRM and Pat Rothfuss, I'm looking at you - they are releasing in a timely fashion. Regardless, it's really interesting to see a sci-fi work set in a future where space travel is routine but still hard and inconvenient, and humans aren't evolved into a utopian social structure.
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I haven't watched the show at all, but the books are fantastic and I cannot recommend them enough. Also, unlike certain fantasy authors - GRRM and Pat Rothfuss, I'm looking at you - they are releasing in a timely fashion. Regardless, it's really interesting to see a sci-fi work set in a future where space travel is routine but still hard and inconvenient, and humans aren't evolved into a utopian social structure.
The series deemphasizes that aspect somewhat, simply because it doesn't have the luxury of taking month-long timeouts whenever the Roci or other ships are travelling somewhere (I mean, it could have? But I guess having to bring up the subject of just how much time is spent travelling all the time gets cumbersome after a while). The series hasn't gone full GoT yet in terms of time compression, but I'm reasonably sure that the writers are competent enough to avoid that impression.
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Vagabond
:banghead:
How the ever living flip did I miss that.
I'm terrified at the fact Flint must have equally aged but I'm too scared to Google it.
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Finished watching the second season.
I can easily conclude that it is, by *far*, the best sci fi show made in 2017. So much better than season 1 it's not even close, it picks up fast and sharp right at the beggining, grabs your attention and never lets it go, until almost the end. The cliffhanger isn't as exciting, but I just can't wait for season 3! It's Games of Thrones in Space and it's so well written!
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So season 3 has started. Just watched the first episode. Loved it, as expected. Frankie Adams has definitely improved from season 2, as has pretty much everybody (except Shoreh Aghdashloo, but she was already great). Super excited for the rest.
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On Netflix?
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Only on Netflix outside of the North America (Amazon gets it in the States), and they won't get the new season for several months, because making the distribution rights simple was apparently beyond Alcon's capabilities. I'm sure there are alternatives, but those would be illegal, and wrong, and wouldn't support the show.
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My PVR is now recording season 3 while I locate the first two. Stupid Syfy and their licensing in North America. Oh, we'll put it on Netflix everywhere else but if you live here then you can pay for yet another service. Ridiculous.
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And the Netflix release being a few months off doesn't make the rest of the world real happy about this whole stupid licensing thing either.
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I'm confused. Season 3 is not on Netlfix UK, did they pull it or something?
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There's a really long delay before it goes up on Netflix UK--we're talking months. Season 3 is airing in the States right now.
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I've read all the Expanse books thus far and watched the series. It got a lot of the original material right but it also took some odd liberties to speed up the plot and some of the casting just doesn't seem right.
Naomi is too short to me, she's supposed to be a tall and gangly Belter, but she's just a mid height, mid build Earther. Considering that they went some way to highlight other Belter's more obviously low-g warped physiques it's a shame that they didn't go the whole way.*shrug*
Holden, Amos and Alex are pretty well cast though.
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First two episodes of this season are killer. I'm impatiently waiting for the third one!
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Okay, found a free trial on a streaming service so I've watched all of season 1/2 in the last week. This show is great. It utterly fails to convey the sense of scale and time lapse in trvale like the books does, but I don't care overly much. It also doesn't really convey the physiological differences between Belters, Martians, and Earthers, though it does try (and I understand why the complexity of that just does not make it worth the expense in production). I'm just starting season 3 now, and so far it's pretty faithful to the books. The casting I think is excellent - the characters are not how I picture them, but that's not a bad thing, just different (e.g. isn't Amos bald? and Alex older? Holden beefier? Naomi taller?). I wasn't sold on Bobbi's casting initially at all, but by the end of season 2 was fully onboard. And actually, the gem in all the casting is Avasarala. Despite not being as old as she should be, she's bloody perfect. The last more hidden gem is Drummer. Also a fantastic casting choice.
All in all, this series is great and it just makes me want the next book that much sooner.
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Holden is pretty much on-point in terms of casting, Amos and Alex are both younger than their book counterparts (Amos more so than Alex), and Naomi's actress has the drawback of having grown up in an actual 1g environment (some blatant earth-centric casting there, really).
You are right that Drummer is kind of a show-stealer though
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I wasn't sold on Bobbi's casting initially at all, but by the end of season 2 was fully onboard.
Part of the issue here is that the show starts off Bobbie's story at an earlier point than the book does, which makes sense from a storytelling perspective, but is frustrating for book readers who are used to Bobbie after she's gotten the gung-ho jarhead crap beaten out of her (which is where her story starts Caliban's War). It's less an issue with the actress, and more with the character--most book readers I've seen complained about Bobbie for the first few episodes, and then the complaints dropped off sharply after 2x06 (Paradigm Shift).
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Okay, what the hell are the writers doing with Drummer, Ashford, and Naomi? This is a complete change from the books that DOES NOT BODE WELL for certain characters unless they're *really* completely change it.
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I know what you're thinking, but I'm not particularly worried. They're going to have to shake things up, or else they'd completely break the later parts of the story.
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https://www.engadget.com/2018/05/26/the-expanse-amazon/
Amazon has decided to back the show
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I can only blame the semi-recent birth of my son as a distraction for not knowing, when did Netflix drop it?
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Netflix didn't drop the show, Syfy did--the situation was kind of a mess. Alcon produces the show, and then licensed it out to Syfy for first-run US cable viewing, and to Amazon for second-day US streaming. iTunes, the Microsoft store, and Google play also got the licensing both in the US and Canada Space got the live airing rights in Canada. Alcon then licensed the international streaming rights to Legendary, who sold it to Netflix (with a several month delay between when a season airs and when it goes up on Netflix).
Everybody involved--Syfy, Amazon, Netflix, Space, paid Alcon for the show, which allows Alcon to produce this super-expensive tv show. Problem is, Syfy could only make money on the show from the cable viewing and ad revenue, and most of the people watching the show didn't watch on live cable tv (considering the cable version of the show on Syfy is censored, has a lower-quality picture, and is constantly interrupted by commercials, who could blame them?). Syfy wasn't making enough money (not helped by Syfy not properly advertising the show), so they dropped it, leaving Alcon to scramble to find someone else to pick it up, and Amazon did (yay).
Netflix apparently wasn't interested in picking up the show after Syfy dropped it--according to the props master, Jim Murray, Netflix already had enough shows filling the niche The Expanse would have occupied. Obviously they weren't particularly interested in US streaming rights either when the show was starting out (also I bet Amazon just plain outbid them since Jeff Bezos is clearly a fan).
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Buuump.
Well I'm slowly catching up with third series. It just still irks me as a veteran how they refer to female officers as Sir and how they stand at ease while at attention.
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200+ years can change military protocols though.
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By the power of relevant news, I bid this thread ARISE.
All three seasons of the show are now available for global viewing on Amazon Prime Video. Hooray for the end of weird distribution schemes!
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Eagerly awaiting for news about season 4. They're still on production, apparently.
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Season three ends with the
Knossos network
Right?
I'm not sure I need to see any further. It ended on a nice tone :)
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I'd like to see the actual name of the show being rendered on screen as a story, and not just as the conclusion of it ;).
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I took that from the first three seasons in my own way, especially the slingshot guy demonstrated how expansive the solar system is even if he got killed trying to impress his ex girlfriend.
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200+ years can change military protocols though.
Sir and ma'am and respective attention states haven't changed in well over that for us Brits.
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True that and as far as traditions go the military tends to be very conservative. Oth, any space navy will undoubtedly be a new arm in its own right and will build up traditions of its own over time. I don't really mind that they call female officers "sir", I kind of prefer it. A lot of the pomp falls by the wayside when you're deployed so that might also explain the relaxed protocols.
I'm interested to see where they go from season 3 since the ending really scaled everything up. I've still to finish the first book too.
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Eagerly awaiting for news about season 4. They're still on production, apparently.
Season 4 just wrapped today. Still have to do post-production and decide on a launch window. Probably going to be after Game of Thrones finishes to avoid having to compete with that behemoth.
Season three ends with the
Knossos network
Right?
I'm not sure I need to see any further. It ended on a nice tone :)
That is where season 3 ends, yes. Season 4 is going to be about what it means politically/socially/economically, and what to do with it.
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My 2'nd favourite sci-fi lore, right behind Freespace and Mass Effect <impossible question, which one I love more>. Get your hands on the books ASAP! I even heard opinions that Expanse is a space GoT, which is pretty good comparison. Mixture of politics, personal agendas, and fight, seen from many perspectives. So far we have 3'rd season confirmed but there is enough source material for at least twice as many. Series interpretation of the books is very accurate, I found maybe 2 or 3 small differences when it comes to the events. Some characters appear earlier in the series, compared to the book timeline but that's not a problem at all.
BTW. #TeamMCR :P <though Avasarala is my fav character so far. Aghdashloo's acting is simply outstanding>
Bloody amazing series! Definitely Space GoT. It may even edge out GoT in the 'major characters can be bumped off at any moment' department.
SPOILER
At least the half the GoT cast were not bumped off half way through the first episode ; -)
Agreed, Avasarala is a fantastic character. As machiavellian as Cersei, only less evil, drunk and without the incest :lol:
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I'm a bit sad about The Expanse.
I know most people don't care, but the shift from TV-14 to TV-MA was too much. The show was already right at the edge of what I was willing to put up with in terms of general graphic-ness, and S3 pushed past my limit. I gave up in the middle of the season.
Like I said, I know most people don't have a problem with it or even embrace it, but I mourn the loss.
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Lemme guess--you gave up at the
splat?
That's straight from the book. There's really not a great way to adapt the story without hitting the TV-MA line. I get that it doesn't work for you, but it's not like they're just doing it to be edgy.
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Agreed. In fact, Season 1 went way too lightly on the consequences of the protomolecule; in the books, its downright horrific and sets the stakes through the entirety of the rest of the series.
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There's really not a great way to adapt the story without hitting the TV-MA line.
Sorry, I don't buy this at all. There are lots of ways to communicate on-screen without being graphic. You can have complex, mature themes in shows without spraying blood & tits & f-bombs everywhere. And it's perfectly achievable to show just enough to imply the event and leave the rest to the imagination, if you want to.
I get that enough people find the graphic stuff appealing that it apparently wins them a bigger audience and more $$$. I'm just bummed that comes at the expense of me not being part of that audience. And the only (tiny, insufficient) influence I have on what route studios take in the future is to vote with my feet. A bit of a futile gesture, perhaps, but I think the only one I can make with integrity.
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Gotta agree with Sushi here, to an extent (as I found Avasarala torturing a belter by hanging him up on hooks in Earth gravity in the pilot episode much more grusome than pretty much anything that happened later): There's always a way to depict violence without going graphic. The producers of the show chose not to; They wanted an adults-only show, and that's what they made.
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I would argue that they're adapting an adults-only book, so making an adults-only show is not exactly an indictment. I also disagree with the idea that there's a way to avoid most of the violence in the show (the point about the hooks is well taken, and I think is one of the weakest moments of the pilot). Part of the story is biological horror of the protomolecule. Another part is physics in space, including the nasty **** that can happen to the human body as a result.
[You can have complex, mature themes in shows without spraying blood & tits & f-bombs everywhere.
Agreed, but that's not what's happening in the show, and I think you know that. This characterization of my post is unfair at best and disingenuous at worst.
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I hadn't even thought about that as an issue. I agree it's not much a big one, but I'm sorry that some people will skip it just because of that, I think they're losing out.
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I really don't want to argue, actually, and I apologize if anything I've said came across as unfair or disingenuous. I'm just bummed.
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Don't apologise for a valid opinion. Nobody can tell you how you feel is wrong.
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Regarding violence and graphic content. Show was very gentle with some events.
Spoilers from Abaddon's Gate below:
When the fleets hit the "slow zone" we've seen just a tiny bit of what really happened. The harshest thing from the show was Tilly pinned to a ceiling of Thomas Prince. Which was a deviation from the source material btw. But there was no sailors cut in half by hatches so not as gore. Heck, even the events on the Behemoth looked less dramatic in the show. In the book there was a real bloodbath out there with Ashford going batsh**-crazy. Including stopping the spin of the ship which took many lives as well. I don't think there was any way to avoid showing graphic stuff here without sacrificing the content of the original.
Already started reading Cibola but can't find enough time to finish :/
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Regarding violence and graphic content. Show was very gentle with some events.
Spoilers from Abaddon's Gate below:
When the fleets hit the "slow zone" we've seen just a tiny bit of what really happened. The harshest thing from the show was Tilly pinned to a ceiling of Thomas Prince. Which was a deviation from the source material btw. But there was no sailors cut in half by hatches so not as gore. Heck, even the events on the Behemoth looked less dramatic in the show. In the book there was a real bloodbath out there with Ashford going batsh**-crazy. Including stopping the spin of the ship which took many lives as well. I don't think there was any way to avoid showing graphic stuff here without sacrificing the content of the original.
Already started reading Cibola but can't find enough time to finish :/
TV!Ashford is a vastly superior character to Book!Ashford.
Also, IMHO, Cibola Burn is the weakest book in the series and can safely be skipped; I don't remember anything happening in it that actually ends up mattering in the rest of the series (except for the whole big-picture "we can colonize other planets now" stuff). Nemesis Games, on the other hand, is straight up awesome again.
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I would strongly discourage skipping CB. There is one major plot thread that concludes, and another one that starts being set up:
Investigator!Miller finding out more about what attacked the Ring Builders, his (apparently final) death, and our first look at the Bullet--although it takes a couple books before that one starts to pay off.
CB is very different. I personally enjoyed it, especially the bits where we see how the Roci crew has grown since the start (in that we actually start to feel out their characters more), but it's definitely got some flaws. Combine that with the change in scope and focus, and it's easy to see why Cibola Burn is one of the less popular books.
Nemesis Games is fantastic.
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Regarding violence and graphic content. Show was very gentle with some events.
Spoilers from Abaddon's Gate below:
When the fleets hit the "slow zone" we've seen just a tiny bit of what really happened. The harshest thing from the show was Tilly pinned to a ceiling of Thomas Prince. Which was a deviation from the source material btw. But there was no sailors cut in half by hatches so not as gore. Heck, even the events on the Behemoth looked less dramatic in the show. In the book there was a real bloodbath out there with Ashford going batsh**-crazy. Including stopping the spin of the ship which took many lives as well. I don't think there was any way to avoid showing graphic stuff here without sacrificing the content of the original.
Already started reading Cibola but can't find enough time to finish :/
TV!Ashford is a vastly superior character to Book!Ashford.
Also, IMHO, Cibola Burn is the weakest book in the series and can safely be skipped; I don't remember anything happening in it that actually ends up mattering in the rest of the series (except for the whole big-picture "we can colonize other planets now" stuff). Nemesis Games, on the other hand, is straight up awesome again.
I agree about Ashford.
In the show he really feels like an experienced captain, a man who has seen a lot of stuff, done some nasty things and was smart enough to survive that long. A Belter to the bone but unlike any other. A man with a vision who seems to understand what the Belters should do to flourish <the "we must act with gratness" line was perfect> To become a true nation, not just bunch of space tribes, bond together mostly by hatred towards Earthers and Martians. There was a very good scene where he talked with Drummer about OPA uniforms and what they symbolize. In the book.... I was a bit disappointed. I actually expected something different but got a guy who simply snapped in a crisis situation instead :/
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Season 4 is available now on Amazon Prime. God damn the show looks great.
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aaaaand I already watched the whole thing
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me too
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Haven't watched it yet. Envy me!
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goddamn it, that was amazing.
(https://i.imgur.com/mpto22X.gif)
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The Nauvoo has the same chairs as the conference room at my job.