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Hosted Projects - Standalone => Wings of Dawn => Topic started by: Spoon on February 24, 2011, 11:20:33 am

Title: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on February 24, 2011, 11:20:33 am
Today's first subject: A lot of stuff is getting done and no progress is being made.

Now you might be wondering, how is that even possible? Is Spoon just wasting his time playing starcraft 2 again?
Well yeah, that too.

But I'm also fixing up pretty much every WoD 1 ship; Removing seams, welding poorly mirrored ships together, smoothing and adding more debris etc. I'm also learning the joy of Ao baking (not featured on the screenshots below :p )
(http://img829.imageshack.us/img829/274/debris.jpg)
(http://img202.imageshack.us/img202/3497/gunshipf.jpg)
(http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/1436/woda.png)
Unforunately, its a time consuming progress, so work on Fredding hasn't started yet ):

On a far happier note, there's already a ton of new custom effects/explosions, weapons and sounds in WoD2. Not to mention Zy and Cyrvan capital ships along with a whole bunch of other new fighters and ships. I can say with 100% confidence that WoD 2 will be by far the most colorful freespace 2 mod ever.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Rodo on February 24, 2011, 11:30:01 am
mmmmmm... colorful!

yes

Please don't forget about the asteroidz mission
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: NGTM-1R on February 24, 2011, 11:41:23 am
I actually like the Old Cordi more. :nervous:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Ypoknons on February 24, 2011, 11:44:59 am
yea, use of color... that's a toughie. There's a place for B&W photography, there's a place for gadgets with greyscale housing, there's a place for grey Mobile Suits, but masterful use of color, now that has artistic value.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on February 24, 2011, 11:57:08 am
I actually like the Old Cordi more. :nervous:
Only the gunship has been changed, because it was just an upscaled soldier mesh with turrets strapped to it before.

Now I dont know about the artistic value of WoD (I'm just aiming for fun :p )
(http://img153.imageshack.us/img153/3613/pewpewm.jpg)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Jellyfish on February 24, 2011, 12:19:31 pm
All I see is a bunch of frozen frogs.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Deadly in a Shadow on February 24, 2011, 02:02:01 pm
The new Cordi gunship looks beautiful. And the Challenger looks far more better. That ship on the pic, is that a Zy?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: General Battuta on February 24, 2011, 02:04:37 pm
The new Cordi gunship looks beautiful. And the Challenger looks far more better. That ship on the pic, is that a Zy?

cyrvan!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: NGTM-1R on February 24, 2011, 02:12:30 pm
Only the gunship has been changed, because it was just an upscaled soldier mesh with turrets strapped to it before.

Fair 'nuff. I'd sort of like to see some more of the blue come back, but I can live without.

That ship on the pic, is that a Zy?

It has a ring. Who likes rings?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: ssmit132 on February 25, 2011, 02:35:42 am
It has a ring. Who likes rings?

Sonic the Hedgehog. :p

The new Gunship model looks good; I noticed before it was just a large Soldier with turrets.

Now I dont know about the artistic value of WoD (I'm just aiming for fun :p )
*snip*
I like the colours. Although we need a battle where we can see every colour!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on February 25, 2011, 07:26:23 am
The Cordi Gunship definately looks much better.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Quanto on February 26, 2011, 09:38:40 am
I too like the new gunship. Will we see a patch for WoD1?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: AndrewofDoom on March 04, 2011, 08:34:00 am
I too like the new gunship. Will we see a patch for WoD1?

The svn of the WoD Multiplayer project includes the fixed models of the WoD1 ships and the new shine maps for the Zy fighters and Hazel.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on March 04, 2011, 12:44:43 pm
I too like the new gunship. Will we see a patch for WoD1?
Nothing planned for that at the moment
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Ravenholme on March 04, 2011, 06:27:42 pm
All I see is a bunch of frozen frogs.

How the hell did Cirno get in here!

Touhou x Wings of Dawn... That I've got to see.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on March 04, 2011, 06:47:32 pm
All I see is a bunch of frozen frogs.

How the hell did Cirno get in here!

Touhou x Wings of Dawn... That I've got to see.
WTF.
I refrained myself from making Touhou references to Jellyfish's post!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Jellyfish on March 04, 2011, 07:15:00 pm
Wanted to post 'I see Cirno's been at work here, cause all I see is a bunch of frozen frogs', but then I restrained myself too.

Touhou x Wings of Dawn... That I've got to see.

Fund it
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on March 04, 2011, 09:00:40 pm
(http://i743.photobucket.com/albums/xx75/Pharsti/CirnoFrog.jpg)

I'd post something new and useful here, but there isn't anything more to say than "Work on assets is being done, progress is being made"
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Firartix on March 09, 2011, 05:28:53 am
Do you plan on adding some UBAR Disco beams just like in Ridiculous?
That'd sure be colorfull. Do it. Now.

Other than that....... the Cordi Gunship is cool imo... but what's with this Challenger texture o_o ?

(Message unfinished for cause of going eating stuff)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on March 13, 2011, 10:22:59 am
Today's subject: Performance&Paaaarticles

For WoD I've always considered my 6 year old laptop (1,6hz single core, radeon mobility 9700, 1gb ram) to be the minimal system requirement. And sure enough it ran WoD just fine (skybox with 4096^ excluded). Recent tests with WoD 2 on this laptop forever were not as smooth. I guess I'll have to consider releasing a 'lite' version of WoD2 on release that goes a bit more easy on the particle spawning.

(http://img849.imageshack.us/img849/8850/shinystuff.png)
Weeeeee
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on March 13, 2011, 10:26:54 am
I can't help but think of a Freelancer mod on crack. :nervous:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Rodo on March 13, 2011, 12:25:29 pm
particle spammmmm :yes:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on March 13, 2011, 01:36:12 pm
Well turned out that one major performance breaker was a weapon that spawned 30 clusters, with the clusters having a particle spewer assigned
So when 4 of these were fired at once and impacted...

You do the math  :p
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on March 13, 2011, 03:59:16 pm
Doesn't that already go beyond the limit and thus delete some of the shots, or do particles count for another (or non) limit?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dragon on March 13, 2011, 04:50:50 pm
Particles don't count for the weapons limit.
Submunitions do, but that's not a problem, the limit is high enough.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Jellyfish on March 13, 2011, 09:54:24 pm
You call 62.7 FPS 'not as smooth'?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on March 14, 2011, 04:31:47 am
I'm pertty sure he didn't take the screenshot on the old Laptop, which had the performance problems with all the particles.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: guitarfan01 on March 14, 2011, 09:51:58 am
the limit is high enough.

Famous last words, there.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on April 24, 2011, 06:25:10 am
April has almost ended Spoon, how much longer are you going to take?
I'm afraid still quite a bit longer

Yesterday I finally gained a bit of understanding about how Freespace treats hud elements (it involves brutally stretching/upscaling hud elements when resolutions different from 1024 x 768 are used). I also discovered the joy of the hud_gauge table and that dithering makes the 'color' banding in .pcx index mode look slightly less terrible. All on the same day.
What this comes down to is that headani's in WoD2 will be at a slightly higher resolution with significantly less stretching (from 160x120 to 250x188)

An example:
(http://img59.imageshack.us/img59/7724/screen0455.png)
This screenshot (which was posted at the celebration of freespace thread) was 160 x 120 scaled from 1024 x 768 up to 1680 x 1050

(http://img577.imageshack.us/img577/4936/screen0458.png)
And this is 250 x 188, slight upscale as the hud_gauge.tbl is set to 1440 x 900 and my resolution is 1680 x 1050
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Deadly in a Shadow on April 24, 2011, 06:40:45 am
Holy crap, playing as Cyrva? Btw nice head ani.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: ssmit132 on April 24, 2011, 08:42:51 am
High(er)-resolution headanis. Nice! :)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Destiny on April 24, 2011, 09:39:39 am
Well at least you're making awesome progress, Spoon. All you need now is to have smoke/explosive bolts firing when you purge stuff  (Like the Kaze's WoD Booster) from your fighter and it'll one step closer to epicness.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Rodo on April 24, 2011, 10:01:23 am
head ani's are one of those things that make my rig choke on it's own vomit for some reason, I'm waiting for someone to use the hud code to see if there's something with the resolution.....

I'll be waiting for your mod spoon :yes:
Also, Infi did the right thing!, he's kinda cool for an AI :D
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on April 24, 2011, 01:08:30 pm
Well at least you're making awesome progress, Spoon. All you need now is to have smoke/explosive bolts firing when you purge stuff  (Like the Kaze's WoD Booster) from your fighter and it'll be one more step beyond epicness.
Fixed that for you :p
WoD already is epic, anything in addition is beyond even that!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Ravenholme on April 24, 2011, 07:27:48 pm
Oh my, those Hi-res Head ANIs are the sex
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Destiny on April 27, 2011, 05:58:10 am
Well at least you're making awesome progress, Spoon. All you need now is to have smoke/explosive bolts firing when you purge stuff  (Like the Kaze's WoD Booster) from your fighter and it'll be one more step beyond epicness.
Fixed that for you :p
WoD already is epic, anything in addition is beyond even that!
Heheh, that's true. Was a bit thrilled by blowing up all of the motherships in that one mission that I couldn't think right on the epicness thing.


Although, the whole thing about purging stuff is...pretty awesome. I've always dreamed of being able to purge things from my fighter in games, and...seems like my dream has been fulfilled. Hope Spoon'll expand on it, like purging expended ammo stores, drop tanks that increase afterburn recharge but impede mobility, maybe even armor kits when they get too damaged.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Ypoknons on April 27, 2011, 12:25:09 pm
Spoon, I can't help it. I still think the dialogue needs to be less Joker and more Char.

Spoiler:
The people on [that ring planet] are selfish and their souls and bound by gravity. That is why I have decided to destroy them all.
(Char's Counterattack, First Scene)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on April 27, 2011, 12:37:47 pm
I think the overt references should be kept from the game. Small nods and such are fine, but too much would just diminish the atmosphere and uniqueness of WoD I think (music excluded ;) ).
Besides that film was bad even considering it had to fit a story that was planned as a tv series into a single feature film.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: AndrewofDoom on April 27, 2011, 02:07:15 pm
I think the overt references should be kept from the game. Small nods and such are fine, but too much would just diminish the atmosphere and uniqueness of WoD I think (music excluded ;) ).
Besides that film was bad even considering it had to fit a story that was planned as a tv series into a single feature film.

Yes. Expy characters are no fun and kill the experience.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Ypoknons on April 27, 2011, 10:17:13 pm
hahah it was a joke. By no means do I want to limit the team's creativity, but what else is some gunpla obsessed freak going to see when he sees a vaguely asteroid thing facing a planet?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on April 28, 2011, 06:16:59 am
"Oh looks it's a Gef base that somehow got thrown out of it's orbit".
"Look the Goa'uld send an asteroid to crush earth, so Carter has to use the subspace-drive to send it through earth instead".
"We need Bruce Willis to blow that rock up or it will be Armageddon".
They... throw... rocks (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EkUz6Ht9_t4)

Shall I continue?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Jellyfish on April 28, 2011, 11:02:40 am
For some reason, I doubt references to the 20th/21st century will reach whenever WoD occurs.
Unless someone was time displaced. I wonder if the rest of the crew understand Dawn's references to her time.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on April 28, 2011, 12:07:39 pm
Misuzu seems to be well versed in history.... or in the cool stuff of the past anyway.
But I was answering to Ypoknons' post, not suggesting to implement any reference of those examples into WoD 2.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Ypoknons on April 28, 2011, 10:14:55 pm
But I been watching gundam since I was 5 :p I'm worse than a certain Gundam 00 protagonist.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on April 29, 2011, 03:34:22 am
I somehow doubt you are as nuts as Soran Ibrahim. He is actually thinking of himself as a Gundam at times.

Which leads me to another possibility for you to think of an asteroid: "Look it's the hidden spacedock of celestial being! I wonder if the Ptolemy is inside." :p

Also in one of the Gundam 00 comics the innovades tried dropping an asteroid on Earth making it look like an anti-goverment attack to justify A-LAWS (shortly before the 2nd season started), but were thwarted by a secret intervention of either Celestial Being or Fereshte and a battleship under major Lynts command (the evil specialist in wipe out operations).
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Ravenholme on April 29, 2011, 06:53:24 am
"Oh looks it's a Gef base that somehow got thrown out of it's orbit".
"Look the Goa'uld send an asteroid to crush earth, so Carter has to use the subspace-drive to send it through earth instead".
"We need Bruce Willis to blow that rock up or it will be Armageddon".
They... throw... rocks (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EkUz6Ht9_t4)

Shall I continue?

Yes! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P3ALwKeSEYs)

Advent rising reference, insta-internets for you!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Destiny on April 29, 2011, 07:20:08 am
I've been wondering though, Spoon. Will you put nose art for the characters onto their fighters? If they're visible at all, but...you get the idea.



I didn't try to photoshop Dygenguar onto Ophanim 2/4/one of them, honest!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: headdie on April 29, 2011, 08:22:10 am
nose or wing art for the main characters would be cool
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Deadly in a Shadow on April 29, 2011, 09:05:54 am
"Oh looks it's a Gef base that somehow got thrown out of it's orbit".
"Look the Goa'uld send an asteroid to crush earth, so Carter has to use the subspace-drive to send it through earth instead".
"We need Bruce Willis to blow that rock up or it will be Armageddon".
They... throw... rocks (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EkUz6Ht9_t4)

Shall I continue?

Yes! (http://No![url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P3ALwKeSEYs)

Advent rising reference, insta-internets for you!


http://nooooooooooooooo.com/
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on April 29, 2011, 10:35:00 am
I've been wondering though, Spoon. Will you put nose art for the characters onto their fighters? If they're visible at all, but...you get the idea.



I didn't try to photoshop Dygenguar onto Ophanim 2/4/one of them, honest!
nose or wing art for the main characters would be cool
Something akin to that is certainly planned (if BMPman allows it). It was planned for WoD1 too but it just... never really happened.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Destiny on April 29, 2011, 09:44:20 pm
Well, take your time! If it appears in WoD2, it'll be lovely. I hope the GA gets an upgraded model. I'd be blunt and say it's a bit...simple, but...nah. Everything's reflective, and the turrets/particles are really well-done. I've seen that other thread with upgraded stuff, real good I say.

(Hope the Cyrvan fleet has a weapon like Hayate's Hræsvelgr!)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Jellyfish on April 29, 2011, 10:51:29 pm
Something like a Karuna frigate, only it shoots a more powerful version of the Dragon Slave missile instead of Apocalypses?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: PsychoLandlord on April 29, 2011, 11:41:10 pm
Something like a Karuna frigate, only it shoots a more powerful version of the Dragon Slave missile instead of Apocalypses?

That sounds both terrifying and pointless. It must be created.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Destiny on April 30, 2011, 12:12:50 am
Something like a Karuna frigate, only it shoots a more powerful version of the Dragon Slave missile instead of Apocalypses?
Yeah, definitely. I'd hope to see the Dragonslave-ish ball-explosion-thingy completely covering up a Challenger-sized ship. But Hayate's Hræsvelgr is a beam, and we happen to already have missiles that look like 'lasers'. Shouldn't be too hard but...

Quote from: PsychoLandlord
That sounds both terrifying and pointless. It must be created.
...he's right. If Spoon agrees, anyway...
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: PsychoLandlord on April 30, 2011, 12:26:54 am
Actually, you know what? Forget the Capship. What we need are Rays with FAST pack knockoffs. Who needs a Capital ship to fire hundreds of Dragonslaves when you have a dozen fighters capable of the same thing?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Destiny on April 30, 2011, 01:27:38 am
Actually, you know what? Forget the Capship. What we need are Rays with FAST pack knockoffs. Who needs a Capital ship to fire hundreds of Dragonslaves when you have a dozen fighters capable of the same thing?
Well...the standard U.N. Spacy squadron fires MUCH MUCH MUCH MUCH MUCH more things than here... (http://s728.photobucket.com/albums/ww286/TSADestiny/WoD/)

All of those are Dragonslaves, yeah. It might not look impressive, but it's deadly. I can't show you what's on the other side, because I'm afraid of crashing the map...and it crashed non-stop so it went into the recycle bin.

Spoon has made WoD quite well.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on April 30, 2011, 02:57:07 pm
A skirmisher firing dragon slaves from it's 20 missile launchers.... scary. :shaking:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on May 05, 2011, 08:15:02 am
Got my self a brand new pc
Unforunately 3ds max 6 does not seem to be very willing to work under windows 7, there goes my workflow  :(
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: bigchunk1 on May 05, 2011, 07:28:45 pm
Time to learn blender, arrharhahrahr *insert jovial/cruel pirate here.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Droid803 on May 05, 2011, 07:59:41 pm
Got my self a brand new pc
Unforunately 3ds max 6 does not seem to be very willing to work under windows 7, there goes my workflow  :(
Would you like *cough*...

...****...

/me is murdered by the anti-piracy commission
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Jellyfish on May 05, 2011, 08:36:35 pm
Not even compatibility mode?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Ypoknons on May 05, 2011, 10:20:40 pm
Actually, you know what? Forget the Capship. What we need are Rays with FAST pack knockoffs. Who needs a Capital ship to fire hundreds of Dragonslaves when you have a dozen fighters capable of the same thing?
Wasn't the Spoon-y thing working on boosters in WOD2 anyways?

And isn't there like a free student edition for 3DS Max? One year license IIRC.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on May 06, 2011, 06:32:29 am
Happy days of joy and jubilation, max 8 has agreed to reside on my harddrive and cooperate with windows 7.
Workflow restored  :D

Quote
And isn't there like a free student edition for 3DS Max? One year license IIRC.
Yeah but I'm completely tuned to the max pof export plugin. And it only works with max 4,5,6,7 and 8. New versions of max work with the collada export method (which I tried but I find it adds a tremendous amount of extra setting up time, things that the plugin will do for me)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Destiny on May 06, 2011, 06:40:22 am
Looks like we have a spoonful of fortune now, hmm?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on May 31, 2011, 11:52:23 am
I was wondering if we'll see any characters from the former thrall races in WoD 2 flying alongside "us". Since Fura'ngle are basically grown into their ship it would be a bit hard to integrate them wtih any standard unit, but what about a Cordi.

Also, are all Nordera still enemies of the LSF or is there a clan (or more) that either signed a peace treaty with Humans and Cyrvans or maybe even joined some kind of alliance?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Jellyfish on May 31, 2011, 12:01:40 pm
A Nordera alliance with the LSF/CSA is unlikely, considering the Hertak failsafe.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Ravenholme on May 31, 2011, 12:20:57 pm
I was wondering if we'll see any characters from the former thrall races in WoD 2 flying alongside "us". Since Fura'ngle are basically grown into their ship it would be a bit hard to integrate them wtih any standard unit, but what about a Cordi.

Also, are all Nordera still enemies of the LSF or is there a clan (or more) that either signed a peace treaty with Humans and Cyrvans or maybe even joined some kind of alliance?

Peace?! PEACE?! We don't need no stinkin' peace, ya grotz, cos' we's the meanest, da greenest, da toofiest gitz dis side of da Galaxy! We's da OR- Er, sorry, NORDERA! WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGH!

*coff*

I might've been playing DoW 2 Retribution again
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Snail on May 31, 2011, 12:24:59 pm
I advocate genocide of the Nordera.

They probably wouldn't mind anyway as long as we did it in a sporting way.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Jellyfish on May 31, 2011, 12:30:03 pm
Wouldn't be genocide if we were nice with them.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on May 31, 2011, 12:30:52 pm
I might've been playing DoW 2 Retribution again
You forgot to add "an' give us your hats!" in that case.
On a more serious note, Nordera aren't as stupid/violent as warhammer orks. For one thing they don't use firearms inside their own city, so they don't blow up. Warhammer 40K Orks would never even consider not shooting, even if they'd build cities in the first place.
A Nordera alliance with the LSF/CSA is unlikely, considering the Hertak failsafe.
If I remember correctly Spoon said the failsave was only installed in the ships of a few specific clans.

Edit: Yep, I did remember correctly:
Spoiler:
It is installed on a few select clans that are deemed by the Hertak to be too unpredictable, aggressive or just too stupid.
It is likely that after this event most Nordera clans will be double checking their own ships though.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: PsychoLandlord on May 31, 2011, 12:32:01 pm
I advocate genocide of the Nordera.

They probably wouldn't mind anyway as long as we did it in a sporting way.

Course, given how Orky they are, chances are if you screw it up they bounce back ten times as strong and rape your empire. For "Sport."
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Snail on May 31, 2011, 12:35:34 pm
We have space elves on our side. We can't lose.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on May 31, 2011, 12:36:45 pm
I might've been playing DoW 2 Retribution again
That game was a huge disappointment.

We have space elves on our side. We can't lose.
:yes:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Ravenholme on May 31, 2011, 12:49:02 pm
I might've been playing DoW 2 Retribution again
That game was a huge disappointment.

We have space elves on our side. We can't lose.
:yes:

Not for me, but that could be because it was exactly what I expected. And not bad in Coop if you played the IG, had a blast with a mate doing so. And the Ork campaign was humorous, if only for the hat-obssessed Ork Freebootaz
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on June 01, 2011, 10:23:45 am
I advocate genocide of the Nordera.

They probably wouldn't mind anyway as long as we did it in a sporting way.
You'll find that you have many supporters for that agenda

I was wondering if we'll see any characters from the former thrall races in WoD 2 flying alongside "us". Since Fura'ngle are basically grown into their ship it would be a bit hard to integrate them wtih any standard unit, but what about a Cordi.

Also, are all Nordera still enemies of the LSF or is there a clan (or more) that either signed a peace treaty with Humans and Cyrvans or maybe even joined some kind of alliance?
The Cordi are on pretty friendly terms with the LSF&CSA but their fleet doctrines are not really compatible, there has not been any pilots swapping to this date.
And the Nordera are still very much hostile
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on June 01, 2011, 03:02:45 pm
But even without pilot swaping there are ways to indroduce a recurring Cordi character into the story. Any chance for something like that happening in the future?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on July 01, 2011, 10:13:16 am
Click me! Click me! (http://youtu.be/Q73H_ppOkSQ?hd=1)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on July 01, 2011, 10:27:44 am
Oh god yes. :eek:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: AndrewofDoom on July 01, 2011, 11:07:02 am
Oh look, energy wings! Where's the ring though?  :nervous:

Then again, it could be a very recent design, because it definitely has some LSF influences to its design.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Destiny on July 01, 2011, 12:07:24 pm
Hmm, the flashy wings seems a bit fast in terms of...flashing :P But wow, it's just sugoi, that Arclite Swamer and...damn. Lovely work Spoon-kun. Maybe this is a joint LSF-CSA thingy!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Jeff Vader on July 01, 2011, 12:08:11 pm
Sweet. ^^
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Destiny on July 01, 2011, 12:10:18 pm
To spare others from having go back to the previous page and scroll down:

Click me! Click me! (http://youtu.be/Q73H_ppOkSQ?hd=1)

Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Quanto on July 01, 2011, 12:20:50 pm
I already told spoon this in skype, but its very relevent.

>I totally didn't see those particle effects coming
>my jaw dropped and I felt something in my loins
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: NGTM-1R on July 01, 2011, 12:24:56 pm
Particle effects are pretty, but damn do they obstruct your view.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Jellyfish on July 01, 2011, 03:40:27 pm
Just when you thought the Aestival was overpowered!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Ravenholme on July 02, 2011, 12:06:31 am
I already told spoon this in skype, but its very relevent.

>I totally didn't see those particle effects coming
>my jaw dropped and I felt something in my loins

Yeah, that pretty much sums up my reaction. I think I'd better play WoD again to whet my appetite for this!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Snail on July 02, 2011, 05:21:56 am
So awesome.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Deadly in a Shadow on July 02, 2011, 05:30:40 am
That's a lot of firepowa. Just imagine the dozens of nordera ships getting busted by that crazy awesome weapons.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on July 02, 2011, 06:17:47 am
Glad to see you guys are digging it (:

In other 'news'  it's getting close to WoD's first release anniversary, so I decided to count the numbers of the mediafire+moddb downloads+svn request of the core.vp file. The total number adds up to 1800. For those of you who are interested in knowning such a thing.

In terms of development; The assets creation is nearing completion, With tons of new ships, sounds and weapons in the lineup (more than I had originally planned). The storyline is currently still in a state of flux, however. As the original&mission structure has been thrown in the trashbin in favor of something more complex and unique.
 
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Deadly in a Shadow on July 02, 2011, 06:25:51 am
Glad to see you guys are digging it (:

In other 'news'  it's getting close to WoD's first release anniversary, so I decided to count the numbers of the mediafire+moddb downloads+svn request of the core.vp file. The total number adds up to 1800. For those of you who are interested in knowning such a thing.

In terms of development; The assets creation is nearing completion, With tons of new ships, sounds and weapons in the lineup (more than I had originally planned). The storyline is currently still in a state of flux, however. As the original&mission structure has been thrown in the trashbin in favor of something more complex and unique.
 
Wow, over 1800, that's a lot.

Hopefully, I finish FREDding my campaign before WoD 2 is released :D
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Snail on July 02, 2011, 06:50:42 am
I'm seriously looking forward to flying and/or fighting those new ships. Daaaaaaamn.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Ravenholme on July 02, 2011, 09:01:47 am
Glad to see you guys are digging it (:

In other 'news'  it's getting close to WoD's first release anniversary, so I decided to count the numbers of the mediafire+moddb downloads+svn request of the core.vp file. The total number adds up to 1800. For those of you who are interested in knowning such a thing.

In terms of development; The assets creation is nearing completion, With tons of new ships, sounds and weapons in the lineup (more than I had originally planned). The storyline is currently still in a state of flux, however. As the original&mission structure has been thrown in the trashbin in favor of something more complex and unique.

I'll have to get into WoD-Dev sometime when I'm not in the lab and see if I can't contribute to ye olde writing processe
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: PsychoLandlord on July 03, 2011, 01:03:59 pm
Just got around to watching the Celestial video. Incredible work, Spoon. At first i thought they were a tad obstructive, but they kinda grew on me, and they didn't seem to interfere with your ability to play that much. The in-mission equipment system seems like its been well implemented as well. Really looking forward to 2.
Title: Spoon is extremely sour
Post by: Spoon on July 09, 2011, 03:53:44 pm
Step one: Have great plans for wingmen.
Step two: Spend a few hours making a start with these plans, tables and textures are being made.
Step three: Start to realize the A.I. is pants on the head retarded and won't link its primary banks, no matter what flag or setting is used in the ai tables.
Step four: Sour.
Step five: Hope a coder brave enough to challenge the A.I. code comes along and fixes it.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: NGTM-1R on July 09, 2011, 04:24:51 pm
That's...odd. Is it solely with split primaries, or with more than two banks?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on July 09, 2011, 05:50:44 pm
That's...odd. Is it solely with split primaries, or with more than two banks?
2 banks, 3 banks
doesn't matter
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: NGTM-1R on July 09, 2011, 05:58:37 pm
The weird thing is I'm pretty sure I've seen the AI use all the banks available before.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Hartzaden on July 09, 2011, 06:08:41 pm
yea i know i have seen the ai use all its banks before

got poped by a calburn doing just that in one of my own Freded missions.(plasma guns + the beam things + close range = dead)  so i dont know whats up with that.  maybe il do some experiments on my own.  im a FREDer not a Coder but il try and help see if i can git it to work with FRED
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on July 09, 2011, 08:07:12 pm
On a few rare occasions the a.i. will switch banks to do a few shots with them before switching back to a more rapid fire bank. This is noticable with the Caliburn. I doubt you ever saw it firing all of its 3 banks though.
As far as all my tests has shown though, the a.i. only links all banks when attacking capital ships and only picks one bank against fighters with the rare switching going on.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: NGTM-1R on July 09, 2011, 09:08:29 pm
Thing is I know I've been attacked by Hercs that were firing all six guns at the same time, but they had identical loads in both banks.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: bigchunk1 on July 09, 2011, 11:19:35 pm
@video, what the heck is that at the end?

Quote
Step three: Start to realize the A.I. is pants on the head retarded and won't link its primary banks, no matter what flag or setting is used in the ai tables.

I've had similar troubles in my mod trying to get the AI to switch and launch different secondary weapons at times of my choosing. Good-secondary-time has not yet proved useful for more than one weapon. Seems you don't have much of a choice what they fight with short of manually selecting their primary and secondary weapons for them using sexps.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on July 10, 2011, 03:44:56 am
@video, what the heck is that at the end?
To me that looked a lot like funnels (original MS Gundam and sequels), the dragoon system (Gundam SEED and SEED Destiny) or bits/fangs (Gundam 00) depending on which gundam series you base your vocabulary off.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on July 10, 2011, 11:04:54 am
Aye, that be a funnel kinda thing  :nod:

Also: happy days of joy and jubilation
Turns out the wiki derped and herped hard. The flag is suppose to be $allow primary link delay:
The wiki had it listed as $allow primaries link delay:

Again, many thanks to Valathil for figuring this out.

Now fighters are using all their banks good and proper.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on July 10, 2011, 01:18:26 pm
Now that you mention it... can the funnel beams be made to pierce through the target, like larger beams? That would look pretty cool and remind me a lot of Gundam Unicorn.
Though I think with the lack of telepathic controll (i.e. Newtype powers) they should rather be called bits or fangs or something else.... unless the make a "la la" sound :lol:

If someone doesn't know what I'm talking about, you are seriously lacking in anime histry. Go watch the original MS Gundam NOW!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: NGTM-1R on July 10, 2011, 05:34:39 pm
You're assuming we don't have Newtype powers now. :P
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on July 11, 2011, 05:11:25 am
The closest thing WoD has to newtypes (as far as I know) is Dawn and the "only" has enhanced reflexes, a more resistant body and the occasional premonition.
Okay there are the Winged Ones of the Cyrvan, who also have premonitions, but so far I heard nothing of them using psychoframe or a psycommu system to remote-link their minds with any machine.
The only beings of whom we know they are capable of linking (or merging?) with their machines are the Fura'ngle.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Destiny on July 11, 2011, 06:24:09 am
Well...if one were to say, the humans of the LSF-era probably have more resistant bodies than the UEU-era humans. I'm pretty sure the Fura'ngle are their own machines...gotta read up the techroom again. I wonder if they levitate or vibrate to move around while they're being small rocks and crystals :P
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on July 11, 2011, 06:55:14 am
At first they vibrated, but a common consensus on this was soon reached: "This sucks."
This was the first major trigger for the Fura'ngle to start developing technology.

true story
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Jellyfish on July 11, 2011, 09:41:40 am
the humans of the LSF-era probably have more resistant bodies than the UEU-era humans
The teh room does mention some genetweaking.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Deadly in a Shadow on July 11, 2011, 09:54:31 am
the humans of the LSF-era probably have more resistant bodies than the UEU-era humans
The teh room does mention some genetweaking.
Gentweaking yes, but no braintweaking, what the UEU did.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on July 11, 2011, 10:12:03 am
Actually both. They also tweaked the brain to give their pilots faster reaction. Dawns fellow pilots comment on that in the very first misison of WoD.
That is also what gave Dawn the premonition, but wether this is a surprising side effect of the enhencement, or an experiment by the scientists who did the procedure is anyones guess.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: ssmit132 on July 11, 2011, 06:20:25 pm
I think Deadly in a Shadow was saying that the LSF didn't do braintweaking. Dawn was in the UEU, which allowed braintweaking, before travelling to the future.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: NGTM-1R on July 12, 2011, 12:56:17 am
Some measure of genetic alteration has filtered to the population at large; it could include minor tweaks to the brain. Nothing as serious as Dawn, of course.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Destiny on July 12, 2011, 03:21:55 am
Some measure of genetic alteration has filtered to the population at large; it could include minor tweaks to the brain. Nothing as serious as Dawn, of course.
It's not 'some measure', reading up closely, genetic modification had continued long, long long even after when they weren't needed. This would mean most, if not all humans before the rebellion, would have already been living up to 140 years...I think. Technocracy and all that.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Ypoknons on July 13, 2011, 11:42:12 am
Aye, that be a funnel kinda thing  :nod:
I've always wanted to make Freespace Funnelfangs, but not happening given my hours. heh. Thanks Spoon.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: rscaper1070 on July 31, 2011, 12:52:55 am
Spoon, would you be so kind to post your particles.cfg file for the Particles Script? I just started re-playing WoD and I thought it would be cool to see it in action.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on July 31, 2011, 03:43:38 pm
Spoon, would you be so kind to post your particles.cfg file for the Particles Script? I just started re-playing WoD and I thought it would be cool to see it in action.
http://www.mediafire.com/?zs8ncd26x37p902
Had to edit it a bit, pretty sure it works, not sure if it looks good on all ships.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: rscaper1070 on July 31, 2011, 04:28:09 pm
Thanks, that's awesome. :)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on July 31, 2011, 06:09:01 pm
In which folder does the file go?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: rscaper1070 on July 31, 2011, 06:17:05 pm
First you need to grab m!m's particle script from here (http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php?topic=76406.0) and follow it's directions. He set it up as a mod but you can add the folders to any mod you want provided you have a particles.cfg file made for that mod.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Deadly in a Shadow on July 31, 2011, 11:58:01 pm
First you need to grab m!m's particle script from here (http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php?topic=76406.0) and follow it's directions. He set it up as a mod but you can add the folders to any mod you want provided you have a particles.cfg file made for that mod.
Or you create it by yourself.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on August 01, 2011, 09:54:52 am
Thanks for the pointer. Since I already have a mod folder for the post-processing made for WoD, I'll stick those files in there too.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on August 06, 2011, 09:25:38 am
Dear Diary:
How many times am I going to edit this damn ship?
What ship? The Challenger.
This was the second ship I've modelled and the first capital ship I ever did. And even though I've wanted to get rid of it on so many occasions (its a pain to fred with), I don't want to break Axem's heart. So instead this ship has seen half a dozend of revisions. While the main hull mesh has remained largely its low poly old self (though there has been a few subtle changes between the Chal I and II). It has been updated in several ways (seam removal, small collision errors removed, added debris) and now most recently it received new turrets (from Trashman's recent model dump)
(http://img837.imageshack.us/img837/2228/61837082.png)
(http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/443/10750072.png)
(http://img199.imageshack.us/img199/2051/17622016.png)
I never wanna touch this ship again...
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on August 06, 2011, 09:28:02 am
Sexy turrets. :)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: AndrewofDoom on August 06, 2011, 11:08:55 am
More than once I've thought about making a higher poly Challenger, but every time I've thought of it, I've heard...sounds of a flamethrower and muffled sounds of anger and rage and become scared.

Oh no, he's after me! :nervous:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on August 08, 2011, 09:29:15 am
Spend some time giving a sweeper a lot of debris for a 'shattering' effect
Realize ingame that it just produces a lot of flames on hardly visible pieces.

an other lesson learned :p
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dragon on August 08, 2011, 09:31:40 am
If you use the particle script and disable MVPs flame script, you could keep debris flames (now customizable), while getting the shattering effect.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on August 08, 2011, 09:48:26 am
What gas do Fura'ngle breate (assuming those living rocks breathe at all)?
Because that might be a good explenation for why they spew less flames on exploding, that they have a less flamable/non flamabe gas (or no gas at all) inside their ships and thus less/nothing to feed the flames.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dragon on August 08, 2011, 10:54:56 am
Actually, their ships are solid crystal. They don't breathe.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on August 08, 2011, 11:36:49 am
Aye, they don't breath.

Anyway, keeping the mvp flame script because doing things otherwise for every ship is just too damn much work to make it worth it.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dragon on August 08, 2011, 06:44:15 pm
Not really, you can set an entry as "default" and have it trigger on every ship that doesn't have a specific debris trail set.
Never underestimate m!m's scripts.  :)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on August 27, 2011, 04:23:35 pm
This post is dedicated to singing praises to Sab0o. He's responsible for texturing the Ascension and has recently reworked the skins on the Zy capital ships. Making me look like a total noob (again!). Imagine that, it's almost like WoD is going to have standards! This also prompted me to put on better looking turrets on these ships.


Before and After.
(http://img694.imageshack.us/img694/6949/archonbottom.png)
(http://img706.imageshack.us/img706/9697/garchon.png)
So yeah, Sab0o is a total baller and all that.
(I can't actually sing that well, so you're just gonna have to imagine that part yourselves)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on August 27, 2011, 04:25:57 pm
Holy.
****.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Sab0o on August 27, 2011, 04:36:03 pm
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: NGTM-1R on August 27, 2011, 04:41:26 pm
¯\_ :pimp:_/¯

Much more appropriate.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: AndrewofDoom on August 27, 2011, 05:01:26 pm
Is Sab0o going to retexture every ship in WoD? Totally wouldn't be against that. :D
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Jellyfish on August 27, 2011, 09:36:38 pm
Not like it was bad before, but DAYUM!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Destiny on August 27, 2011, 09:42:57 pm
Well...umm....damn. :P
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Droid803 on August 27, 2011, 10:24:09 pm
my only regret is that it has lost some of its fabulous iridescent swirls.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Rodo on August 28, 2011, 12:30:51 am
hohoho, we're havin' a party on next WoD release.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Sab0o on August 28, 2011, 12:52:31 am
I ~might~ do some more work on that texture. It has a few pretty flat places.
Is Sab0o going to retexture every ship in WoD? Totally wouldn't be against that. :D
Lol, nah. Just the ones I want to.

hohoho, we're havin' a party on next WoD release.
You sure do plan your parties ahead of time.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on January 18, 2012, 09:38:53 am
Warning: this topic has not been posted in for at least 30 days.
 :nervous:

So whats new?
Well, thanks to the relentless efforts of Axem, WoD2 is now a stand alone! It no longer needs the mediavp's or freespace to work now. And somewhere down the line, WoD1 might receive the same treatment.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: The E on January 18, 2012, 10:08:50 am
Yayifications!

Hey, I have an idea! Release it as an indie game!

No seriously. FSO could use a new IP like that.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on January 18, 2012, 10:43:59 am
Can I still play it as "only" a mod, so I don't have to have duplicates of any files flying around?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: AndrewofDoom on January 18, 2012, 11:17:43 am
Can I still play it as "only" a mod, so I don't have to have duplicates of any files flying around?

It's standalone, which means mixing it with FS2 resources is a bad idea.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Rodo on January 18, 2012, 11:45:52 am
stand alone? well that's a ton of work right there.

kudos!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: MatthTheGeek on January 18, 2012, 12:31:17 pm
I wouldn't say "ton", after all most WoD was already made of original materials. It's just a matter of taking the time to find and replace missing files here and there. Boring and time consuming for sure though.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Rodo on January 18, 2012, 01:51:41 pm
It's just a matter of taking the time to find and replace missing files here and there. Boring and time consuming for sure though.

Well from my pov, that's a ton of work :p
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Ravenholme on January 18, 2012, 02:15:30 pm
Niiice, that's quite a step there, Sir Spoon.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Jellyfish on January 18, 2012, 04:45:56 pm
Will WoD1's standalone rerelease (if any) contain updated content? A Director's Cut, if you will?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on January 18, 2012, 05:52:16 pm
Yayifications!

Hey, I have an idea! Release it as an indie game!

No seriously. FSO could use a new IP like that.
I'd never thought I would live to see the day in which The E said "Yayifications"  :D

How would you go about releasing it as an indie game? I'm pretty clueless on this tbh.

Can I still play it as "only" a mod, so I don't have to have duplicates of any files flying around?
This was one of the reasons which in my mind justified not going stand alone. (I'm a lazy person too, but that aside) But Axem was all like "You've practically replaced all of the effects and maps already!" and he was mostly right. While there will be some duplicate files, the actual size of these files is probably less than 5% of the total filesize of WoD.

Will WoD1's standalone rerelease (if any) contain updated content? A Director's Cut, if you will?
I do would like to take the chance to change the missions I'm not happy with (and to remove the bugtastic red alert from the missions that use it) and such. But I'd like to get WoD2 out of the door first.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Droid803 on January 18, 2012, 11:51:55 pm
Can I still play it as "only" a mod, so I don't have to have duplicates of any files flying around?

It's standalone, which means mixing it with FS2 resources is a bad idea.

Actually you can run standalones as mods just fine.
I run INFR1U as a mod even though it technically *should* be standalone.

Just need to know a bit about how FS2 loads files. You could also get rid of the redundancies as well if you wanted, in essence going backwards from Standalone to dependent. But that's more work that its worth. Just shove it into a mod folder and just select it in the launcher and it'll still work.

DISCLAMER: DROID803 IS NOT RESPONSIBLE IF SOMETHING GOES HORRIBLY WRONG.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on January 20, 2012, 10:13:34 am
Does this mean I won't be able to FRED WOD2? :(

I wanted the first mission I made to be a Wings of Dawn 2 one. If it came out in the not too distant future anyway. I would have asked permission first. I've had some vague ideas for something set in the Terran-Vasudan war failing that. But am hampered by the lack of a Vasudan vessel between the Aten and Typhon, and the canon limit on Typhon destruction. Can't even use a Vasudan installation as a workaround as there are none.

Or am I barking up the wrong tree here? Do you mean it's running on a different engine to the Freespace 2 one or not?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: MatthTheGeek on January 20, 2012, 10:19:22 am
... wait what.

Standalone means it does not require any retail data. Of course WoD will run on the FSO engine, what else could it run on.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on January 20, 2012, 10:24:44 am
... wait what.

Standalone means it does not require any retail data. Of course WoD will run on the FSO engine, what else could it run on.

Oh, okay. Someone said something about releasing it as an indie game or something, and it made me think someone without Freespace 2 or FSO could just download it and play it, because it didn't run on those anymore. Which might cut my access to FRED.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on January 20, 2012, 11:43:12 am
If it's going to be like The Babylon Project or the Wing Commander Saga, the download will even contain a FRED exe. But if you install it into a different folder than FS2, you'll have to copy the files containing the non-WoD ships over, preferably into their own mod folder, to make sure they don't mess up the "vanilla" WoD2.

Edited for a rather funny typo
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Colonol Dekker on January 20, 2012, 11:49:12 am
The Babylong Project


Roflly-pops.




Can Has Dawn 2.0 screenshot?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on January 20, 2012, 12:10:10 pm
Such things happen, when the food is just finished and just want to dig in, without proof-reading your text before hitting the post button ;)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on January 20, 2012, 12:28:28 pm
If it's going to be like The Babylon Project or the Wing Commander Saga, the download will even contain a FRED exe. But if you install it into a different folder than FS2, you'll have to copy the files containing the non-WoD ships over, preferably into their own mod folder, to make sure they don't mess up the "vanilla" WoD2.

Edited for a rather funny typo

Well, I hope it can just work like the other Freespace 2 mods (like I already know I can FRED WoD1 if I want to, FRED runs on whatever mod is currently selected.)

I don't know why anyone would want to seperate from Freespace in the first place.

Enjoy your food. Mine will be ready pretty soon also :)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on January 20, 2012, 03:28:56 pm
Don't worry Lorric.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on January 20, 2012, 05:54:57 pm
Don't worry Lorric.

Okay.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on April 22, 2012, 10:27:32 am
I was recently very suprised to see that it has almost been a year since I uploaded the WoD2 trailer on youtube. It feels more like yesterday... What have I been doing this whole time and why isn't WoD2 released yet?! Allow me to pretend these questions are frequently asked:

All of the assets have already been created, don't you just have to FRED the missions themselves?

There has been a whole lot of work done on the assets actually. A few models have been redone to some degree and there's a whole slew of new stuff to shoot with and to shoot at.

Well didn't you do all of that stuff for WoD1 too and didn't that get finished in one year or so?

orz
True. But one of the main reasons why WoD2 is taking so much longer to complete is that we're trying several new things that Freespace simply wasn't designed to do. So a lot of complex FREDery is required to make all these things happen.
For example, this is what the event window looks like (of course, minus the blurring that censor all of the possible spoilers) for the first part of WoD2.
(http://img821.imageshack.us/img821/4786/eventsa.jpg)
Impossible to work without a dual screen setup  :p

Thankfully Swifty&Valathil have both been huge helps making a lot of the stuff going into WoD possible. Doing their coding wizardry
While Axem is a total FRED&Model boss and Sab0o has helped make WoD2 prettier with his texture skills.

Release date when?

Unknown but unforunately not in the nearby future.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: NGTM-1R on April 22, 2012, 11:07:01 am
Unknown but unforunately not in the nearby future.

My life is ruined. :(
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Legate Damar on April 22, 2012, 11:55:57 am
Impossible to work without a dual screen setup

This is troublesome. If I wanted to use complex FREDdery in my missions, I would need this dual screen setup? But I only have one computer with one screen.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: The E on April 22, 2012, 12:05:40 pm
This is troublesome. If I wanted to use complex FREDdery in my missions, I would need this dual screen setup? But I only have one computer with one screen.

What spoon showed there is very much an anomaly. You have to have an extremely complex mission to get to that point, and there are very few cases where a mission would require that many events.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: headdie on April 22, 2012, 12:38:00 pm
:wtf: fred is capable of handling that many objects no  :jaw:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Legate Damar on April 22, 2012, 01:54:06 pm
This is troublesome. If I wanted to use complex FREDdery in my missions, I would need this dual screen setup? But I only have one computer with one screen.

What spoon showed there is very much an anomaly. You have to have an extremely complex mission to get to that point, and there are very few cases where a mission would require that many events.

You should not underestimate the potential complexity required to execute some of the ideas I have
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: The E on April 22, 2012, 02:02:30 pm
In FREDing, just as in programming, complexity can have two causes. Either because there is no simpler way to do it, or because the programmer in question didn't see the simpler way. I know that Spoon and Axem are aware of this and wouldn't introduce such complexity needlessly; but it is usually the case that even complex ideas can be reduced to rather simple sexps.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Legate Damar on April 22, 2012, 09:04:05 pm
Is there a simple way to do a time jump (player presses the button and all ships/objects are returned to the position and status they had 10 seconds ago or such)?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: General Battuta on April 22, 2012, 09:20:48 pm
Is there a simple way to do a time jump (player presses the button and all ships/objects are returned to the position and status they had 10 seconds ago or such)?

I imagine it would start out from the same basic principles as this (saving states, then loading states on command): http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php?topic=80383.0
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Legate Damar on April 22, 2012, 09:53:05 pm
Yes, I have ideas on how to accomplish it, but it would be complex to be able to do it for hundreds of ships at once, and on the player's command, multiple times in the same mission, and being able to adjust how far back the jump is...

Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dragon on April 23, 2012, 08:44:09 am
The ship-per-mission limit is 400, so you wouldn't have to worry about "hundreds of ships at once". :)
I've also used to attempt to make missions with way too many ships in them. Even 100 ships at once would be very difficult to handle for any computer and you don't really need that many anyway. Pretty much the only way a well-designed mission could even near the limit would be to use a lot of "special objects", which are considered ships by the game. That, or have a large city made from single building models. Which don't move, so in case you had such a city (unlikely), you don't need to worry about it during the jump.
So, I think that a well-implemented (using argument SEXPs) checkpoint-like solution would work quite well in any reasonably designed mission.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: The E on April 23, 2012, 08:58:07 am
Yes, I have ideas on how to accomplish it, but it would be complex to be able to do it for hundreds of ships at once, and on the player's command, multiple times in the same mission, and being able to adjust how far back the jump is...

If you think you need to use hundreds of ships at once, you have usually made your first mistake. Second, you can't really use battuta's method (or any other method) to accomplish this, as there are three hard limits that will make it impossible. First, there's the ship limit, which limits you to 400 ships in-mission. Second, there's the object limit, which is the maximum number of objects that can be in the game at any given time, which is set to 3000. Note that everything, from single laser bolts to missiles to asteroids to debris to ships, count against this limit. Third, we have the sexp variable limit (currently at 250), which determines the maximum number of variables you can declare in a mission. Your idea would require at least 7 variables per ship (3 to store coordinates, 3 to store orientation, 1 to store health), which makes hitting that limit rather easy.

And that is before we get into the technical (im-)practicalities of missions with that many objects. Let us assume, for the sake of argument, that you have 100 ships in a mission, all of which fire 10 shots. This means we have a total of 1100 objects in the mission, which means the collision detection code has to do 1210000 collision checks each frame (in a worst case scenario, that is. The real number is somewhat below this.). This will slow down even the fastest computers, since collision checks and collision rejections are not exactly easy to do in a game.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: qwadtep on April 23, 2012, 12:56:51 pm
For example, this is what the event window looks like (of course, minus the blurring that censor all of the possible spoilers) for the first part of WoD2.
I can still see "facing high" and "facing low" waypoints! My WoD2 experience is ruined.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Legate Damar on April 23, 2012, 02:39:04 pm
Yes, I have ideas on how to accomplish it, but it would be complex to be able to do it for hundreds of ships at once, and on the player's command, multiple times in the same mission, and being able to adjust how far back the jump is...

If you think you need to use hundreds of ships at once, you have usually made your first mistake. Second, you can't really use battuta's method (or any other method) to accomplish this, as there are three hard limits that will make it impossible. First, there's the ship limit, which limits you to 400 ships in-mission. Second, there's the object limit, which is the maximum number of objects that can be in the game at any given time, which is set to 3000. Note that everything, from single laser bolts to missiles to asteroids to debris to ships, count against this limit. Third, we have the sexp variable limit (currently at 250), which determines the maximum number of variables you can declare in a mission. Your idea would require at least 7 variables per ship (3 to store coordinates, 3 to store orientation, 1 to store health), which makes hitting that limit rather easy.

And that is before we get into the technical (im-)practicalities of missions with that many objects. Let us assume, for the sake of argument, that you have 100 ships in a mission, all of which fire 10 shots. This means we have a total of 1100 objects in the mission, which means the collision detection code has to do 1210000 collision checks each frame (in a worst case scenario, that is. The real number is somewhat below this.). This will slow down even the fastest computers, since collision checks and collision rejections are not exactly easy to do in a game.

The Inferno builds were able to increase the limits. It can be done again. These missions are not necessary until far later in the campaign.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on April 23, 2012, 04:45:52 pm
To my knowledge the Inf builds changed how many different ship-types you can have in a modpack, not how many individual ships and objects you can put into a single mission.

But even if they did, bumping that limit again isn't really a good idea. Right now the limit is so high that if you use it fully, most computers will give you framerates in the single digit area (provided they don't outright crash the game)...
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: headdie on April 23, 2012, 06:48:41 pm
With the stability of Inf builds confirmed from 3.6.14 RC1 forward Inf have become the standard build.  but yes inf builds were created to expand on the limits of the engine in terms of table entry numbers, objects in mission, variables and a whole heap of other stuff and i think most of the community have been using INF builds since 3.6.10 or 12.

I also believe it took *a lot* of work to expand the limits to what is seen in the Inf so good luck finding a coder willing to work on them again, remember the limits are not just simple digit changes but changes in how the code handles the relevant data and move that data to and from memory
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Legate Damar on April 23, 2012, 08:11:33 pm
I will find a work around then. Or learn to do it myself. This campaigns must be made even if it takes me decades.

Also I am planning a mission where there is a supernova but you don't die and instead you fight in the core of an exploding star. I think I might be able to mess with skyboxes or something to work that out, but it would be complex.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on April 23, 2012, 08:12:41 pm
Okay, last time I checked this was the WoD dev blog.
I don't quite see why this is being hijacked for FRED/Mod related questions that are not WoD
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Legate Damar on April 23, 2012, 08:15:35 pm
I'm sorry sir.

If your assets are ready far before the missions, would you consider possibly releasing some to others for projects?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: AtomicClucker on May 20, 2012, 06:06:04 pm
I've been going over some of the vids for the next release of WoD, also the Cavalier kicks some trash. If you want any of my models, just send a pm or a zombie, Either way will work.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on June 11, 2012, 04:50:16 pm
Axem told me to make some kind of post so people won't assume I'm dead.

I hereby obey.
I hope you're happy Axem!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Axem on June 11, 2012, 04:51:21 pm
C'mon Spoon, INFERNO has more shiny pics than you do! INFERNO! How can you be upstaged by them?!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on June 11, 2012, 04:53:00 pm
I dunno man, we just don't have enough 5km long capitalships powered by NANOMACHINES to make pretty pictures of.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Axem on June 11, 2012, 04:54:39 pm
But you have sexy space elfs. Which invalidates all shiny spaceships, up to and including, GARGANTS.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on June 11, 2012, 04:56:54 pm
HmmHmm

I'll think about it. In the meantime, brb ripping off starcontrol 2 some more.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: qwadtep on June 12, 2012, 12:19:15 am
But you have sexy space elfs. Which invalidates all shiny spaceships, up to and including, GARGANTS.
Wait, wait, I've got this.

A 5km long Misuzu head that shoots beams from its eyes!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: NGTM-1R on June 12, 2012, 12:55:34 am
But you have sexy space elfs. Which invalidates all shiny spaceships, up to and including, GARGANTS.

Gargants aren't really shiny...
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Legate Damar on June 12, 2012, 01:06:16 am
Gargant is that thing unused from Inferno? I have the old Gigas, but not Gargant. Hertak mothership was 11km long. If you don't like big ships why add that one then.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dragon on June 12, 2012, 08:13:39 am
The Gargant is 40Km long legendary warship from Inferno. It looks OK, but is quite outdated. The game has problems with such big ships though, so it's more like a landscape model.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Legate Damar on June 12, 2012, 09:20:45 am
I heard someone say you can make ships as big as you want without messing up the game.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: redsniper on June 12, 2012, 10:17:41 am
You heard wrong. While yes, you can make objects even larger than the playable mission space, 1) You'll have a hell of a time actually making it fun, 2) You're going to run into floating point precision errors eventually.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dragon on June 12, 2012, 03:07:15 pm
I heard someone say you can make ships as big as you want without messing up the game.
Well, in theory, you can. However, due to various reasons, moving them around would be difficult, and the mission space isn't big enough to fly around such ship (if you speed the ships up too much, you'll also run into problems). Objects beyond certain size are much better off as background or landscape objects than actual ships.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on June 14, 2012, 08:01:19 pm
Axem told me to make some kind of post so people won't assume I'm dead.

I hereby obey.
I hope you're happy Axem!

I never assumed you were dead. However, the bigger story is if I check your page, you got younger and changed gender. How did you do that, and why? A secret gleaned from the mysteries of the Wings of Dawn universe no doubt.

More worrying though, if I know anything about 11 year old girls, Wings of Dawn 2 is now going to suck... :)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: AndrewofDoom on June 14, 2012, 09:34:01 pm
I never assumed you were dead. However, the bigger story is if I check your page, you got younger and changed gender. How did you do that, and why? A secret gleaned from the mysteries of the Wings of Dawn universe no doubt.

More worrying though, if I know anything about 11 year old girls, Wings of Dawn 2 is now going to suck... :)

You don't know?! Spoon always has wish to be the little loli! Now he finally has.

Hey Spoon, are you sure you're safe? I think there may be a certain Droid that might be hunting for you. :p
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on June 14, 2012, 10:03:31 pm
Droid may molest me anytime <3
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Droid803 on June 15, 2012, 02:37:38 am
/me pets Spoon. Good girl.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on June 15, 2012, 05:56:14 am
This change makes a lot of sense actually now I think about it. Games are more fun when you're younger, and turning into a girl will allow you to truly get in touch with your feminine side. It should be useful in the character development of all those female characters.

Now you be a good little girl and make sure you wash your face, brush your teeth, go to bed on time and keep up the good work on Wings of Dawn 2 :)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on June 15, 2012, 06:04:19 am
I never assumed you were dead. However, the bigger story is if I check your page, you got younger and changed gender. How did you do that, and why? A secret gleaned from the mysteries of the Wings of Dawn universe no doubt.

More worrying though, if I know anything about 11 year old girls, Wings of Dawn 2 is now going to suck... :)

You don't know?! Spoon always has wish to be the little loli! Now he finally has.

Hey Spoon, are you sure you're safe? I think there may be a certain Droid that might be hunting for you. :p

Ah yes, that makes a lot of sense, considering the characters in Wings of Dawn. Spoon is enacting his, I mean her, fantasies. Spoon has now fulfilled his dream! I mean her dream!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Legate Damar on June 15, 2012, 10:52:11 am
I've seen transporter accidents like this before
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on June 15, 2012, 11:37:50 am
There was a transporter accident in Star Trek TNG once that did turn adults into children, but they didn't change gender...
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: SpardaSon21 on June 15, 2012, 12:03:48 pm
This bizarre event is most certainly the work of Valathil, Dark Wizard of Coding and Polymorph.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: headdie on June 15, 2012, 12:10:19 pm
This bizarre event is most certainly the work of Valathil, Dark Wizard of Coding and Polymorph.

nar just run of the mill HLP discontinuum of sense
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Jellyfish on June 15, 2012, 12:17:46 pm
What if it was FRED, one who migrated to WoD? And since there's no Alpha 1 in WoD, who will stop his transgendering antics?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: SpardaSon21 on June 15, 2012, 01:12:46 pm
Seraphim 1 of course, especially if she's next in line to get gender-swapped.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dragon on June 15, 2012, 01:30:28 pm
Not really. Seraphim 1 is a girl, and Mandy's Law of Anime Gender Bending states that (good-looking) girls can't turn into boys, unless they're reversing a previous change.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: AndrewofDoom on June 15, 2012, 01:43:57 pm
Not to mention Misuzu would more likely help FRED in his wild antics. :P
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: SpardaSon21 on June 15, 2012, 01:57:03 pm
Fine then, the mighty and terrible Jewel 1 would stop him.  There's no way Crystal would go along with the crazy scheme of some "FRED" guy who calls himself a god to alter the natural order of things.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Destiny on June 15, 2012, 02:54:13 pm
Fine then, the mighty and terrible Jewel 1 would stop him.  There's no way Crystal would go along with the crazy scheme of some "FRED" guy who calls himself a god to alter the natural order of things.
Especially since Crystal already has an army of fans who would fight FRED on her behalf if she even so subconsciously thinks about it, mhm.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: qwadtep on June 15, 2012, 03:43:06 pm
Maybe FRED isn't interested in genderswapping and just wants more shipping of CrystalxMisuzu. Or KunoichixLuna.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on July 31, 2012, 08:18:51 am
Dear diary
m!m is a super cool dude that does cool script things.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Droid803 on July 31, 2012, 01:22:40 pm
Scripts are teh awesum ikr.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on August 14, 2012, 09:35:45 am
Mentlegen

Soon™ there will be something coming this way (no sorry, its not WoD2)
The aim is August 22, celebrating the second anniversary of WoD. (Buuuut it'll be probably a bit later than that! I'm working on it!)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on August 19, 2012, 11:49:59 am
Deadline is no longer reachable, due to sudden hardware problems.
Two casefans died in a short period of time and one of my harddrives is showing bad sectors. fun fun fun
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: AndrewofDoom on August 19, 2012, 12:34:01 pm
You didn't lose all the data you were working on were you? :(
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on August 19, 2012, 12:37:41 pm
You didn't lose all the data you were working on were you? :(
Thankfully no (and my fear of this has compelled me to make several backups on an external harddrive, svn and laptop.)
it just ate up a huge amount of my time because I had to run several *very slow* scans on the damn thing.
And now I'm trying to determine how bad it actually is, if I should RMA it under warranty or if its still good to go etc.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Rodo on August 19, 2012, 02:03:02 pm
Hardware breakdowns suck, specially for FS related stuff.

I don't know why, they seem to be always affected by those kind of things! even I had troubles with some files a couple of times.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on August 19, 2012, 08:26:45 pm
What is svn?

Apart from short for Slovenia? :)

Good luck with that Spoon.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Legate Damar on August 19, 2012, 09:06:02 pm
That is unfortunate indeed. I wish I could do something to help.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: niffiwan on August 19, 2012, 09:26:28 pm
What is svn?

SVN = SubVersioN (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apache_Subversion)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Flak on August 20, 2012, 04:57:10 am
Snaiperskaya Vintovka whatever
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on August 20, 2012, 08:21:25 am
What is svn?

SVN = SubVersioN (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apache_Subversion)

Thanks.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on August 20, 2012, 08:50:05 am
Well balls.
Today I attempted to install the two new case fans. Unforunately it turns out the one in front (the one thats the most important one) just absolutely won't fit because its too thick! I could get the one on top to fit with some creative screw placement. But that's the only plus really, since my harddrives are still not getting any airflow this way. (though I did move them apart from each other so they both have some more breathing space, I'll have to wait and see how the temps will be)
This corsair case and the fans it came installed with are suprisingly ****ty!

The damaged harddrive is slowly but steadily getting worse, with s.m.a.r.t now reporting 'offline uncorrectable' errors and 'write error rate' increasing (though they are still in 'ok' values). And the 'current pending sector' count also steadily climbs. Time to figure out how the WD RMA works I guess.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: MatthTheGeek on August 20, 2012, 08:53:43 am
Your fans are too thick.

I'm a fan of yours.

I'm definitely thick.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on August 20, 2012, 09:07:01 am
Your fans are too thick.

I'm a fan of yours.

I'm definitely thick.
Oh u  :p
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Legate Damar on August 20, 2012, 11:11:37 am
Probably shut down the computer until you can find a working replacement.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Colonol Dekker on August 20, 2012, 12:28:00 pm
Nooooooo, you has backups...
PUSH IT,
 MAX THE ENVELOPE,
 RAISE XP!
TEACH IT WHO'S BOSSMAN A1SOOPAH!
WORK YOUR PC TIL IT EVOLVES!
Asplodes  :nervous:



Then RAID parents wallet for $$$!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on August 20, 2012, 01:25:37 pm
I guess your computer cannot handle the magnitude of the awesomeness that you are creating :)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dragon on August 20, 2012, 01:30:25 pm
I guess your computer cannot handle the magnitude of the awesomeness that you are creating :)
QFT.
There seems to be an "awesome modder's curse" here on HLP. A suspiciously large number of great mods were delayed due to a HD crash.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on August 20, 2012, 01:49:04 pm
My initial fears of super heated and cooked harddrives has been slightly tempered. Even without the front fan, the temps don't exceed 45 degrees (or 113F). And my room is pretty warm with this weather we have in dutchland right now.
While I do have to inquire about getting RMA for the harddrive with badsectors, http://img18.imageshack.us/img18/2851/smartnm.jpg
for now I can stop *****in' and start freddin'
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Flak on August 21, 2012, 08:13:17 am
superheated?

TREMBLE WORLD BEFORE MY ELECTRIC HEATING COIL     OF DOOOOOM!

nevermind
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on August 28, 2012, 05:39:57 pm
Ugh deadlines.
I deeply apologize but it seems the release I promised will be delayed even more. Reasons being that the last mission took me a lot longer than I expected and the release of Guild wars 2.

I shall now commit seppuku.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: ssmit132 on August 29, 2012, 01:32:39 am
I shall now commit seppuku.
That wouldn't help with the delays, though, would it? :P
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on August 29, 2012, 07:59:36 am

I shall now commit seppuku.

Ah, the wonders of Spoon never cease. First transforming himself into a girl, and now the ability to end his own life, yet still continue with the project.

This is good news for us all. Unlife requires no sleep. Clearly a move on the part of Spoon to speed up the project, which I certainly appreciate.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Flak on August 29, 2012, 10:43:29 am
don't commit seppuku, death by karoshi is better at least.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on August 29, 2012, 03:56:26 pm
Ah, the wonders of Spoon never cease. First transforming himself into a girl, and now the ability to end his own life, yet still continue with the project.

This is good news for us all. Unlife requires no sleep. Clearly a move on the part of Spoon to speed up the project, which I certainly appreciate.
Its the power of magic
I blame Valathil for this personally, his mad wizardry did this to me!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on August 30, 2012, 02:31:19 am
I shall now commit seppuku.
That wouldn't help with the delays, though, would it? :P
That depends. If he comes back as an undead, that would eliminate the need to sleep and thus give him more time to work on WoD :P that is, if he becomes the kind of undead that's still able to think independently. ;)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Jellyfish on August 30, 2012, 04:09:42 am
Hopefully a revenant.
Seriously, if he becomes a ghost, he'll lose the ability to interact with the computer. Cue delays.
If he becomes a vampire, he'll be too busy banging teenage girls left and right. Cue delays.
If he becomes a lich, make a contract with that red-eyed cute bunny creature. Instant WoD! Do this!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Flak on August 30, 2012, 09:09:18 am
better stay alive then, everytime I see any kind of undead, it gives me the urge to go berserk and smash their faces.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: qwadtep on August 30, 2012, 08:34:23 pm
Seriously, if he becomes a ghost, he'll lose the ability to interact with the computer. Cue delays.
He could, I don't know, possess Dekker's body. For the greater good.  :nod:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: SpardaSon21 on August 30, 2012, 09:03:14 pm
But if he becomes Dekker he'll be too busy having sex to work on WoD2.  We don't have to worry about that happening right now because girls can smell that he plays D&D from about 1.6 kilometers away. :P
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: 0rph3u5 on August 31, 2012, 12:22:19 pm
Kids, you have to remember that un-life is not a sure thing ... So no one kills his/herself here ....

Spoon, the easier way to appease us (aka your sometimes-ill-tempered-sometimes-barely-sane audience) is with a screenshot ...
... perhaps ...
... pleeease ...
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on August 31, 2012, 05:23:24 pm
better stay alive then, everytime I see any kind of undead, it gives me the urge to go berserk and smash their faces.

You won't see Spoon though. But you will see his work, which will speed up. Win-win!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Droid803 on August 31, 2012, 05:37:36 pm
Don't worry most spoons are made of recyclable materials, we can just rebuild him if anything happens.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on August 31, 2012, 05:43:37 pm
Don't worry most spoons are made of recyclable materials, we can just rebuild him if anything happens.

Your thinking is flawed, but not unexpected coming from a droid.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: SpardaSon21 on August 31, 2012, 05:54:06 pm
Droid should not supervise the reconstruction though, since if he does there is a high chance Spoon would be rebuilt as some bizarre kind of loli catgirl.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on August 31, 2012, 06:05:56 pm
Droid should not supervise the reconstruction though, since if he does there is a high chance Spoon would be rebuilt as some bizarre kind of loli catgirl.

Forget reconstruction. Spoon clones are the way forward.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Jellyfish on August 31, 2012, 11:04:17 pm
Droid should not supervise the reconstruction though, since if he does there is a high chance Spoon would be rebuilt as some bizarre kind of loli catgirl.
And this is bad... how?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: SpardaSon21 on August 31, 2012, 11:29:19 pm
Well, Droid would probably be molesting him (her?) in that case so Spoon would be too occupied with the mental and physical trauma to work on WoD2.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: qwadtep on September 01, 2012, 03:17:35 am
Droid should not supervise the reconstruction though, since if he does there is a high chance Spoon would be rebuilt as some bizarre kind of loli catgirl.

Forget reconstruction. Spoon clones are the way forward.
Why haven't we already cloned Spoon and made her help herself with WoD2 then?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on September 01, 2012, 09:18:13 am
Droid should not supervise the reconstruction though, since if he does there is a high chance Spoon would be rebuilt as some bizarre kind of loli catgirl.

Forget reconstruction. Spoon clones are the way forward.
Why haven't we already cloned Spoon and made her help herself with WoD2 then?

Spoon was doing just fine. If we make some clones, can I keep one as a slave pet?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Jellyfish on September 01, 2012, 10:36:07 am
Wouldn't a bunch of Spoon clones constantly bicker amongst themselves?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: NGTM-1R on September 01, 2012, 11:02:58 am
Spoon was doing just fine. If we make some clones, can I keep one as a slave pet?

You trying to get this locked too?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on September 01, 2012, 11:09:29 am
Yer'all completely bonkers I tells ya!  :p
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: 0rph3u5 on September 01, 2012, 11:47:37 am
Yer'all completely bonkers I tells ya!  :p

I prefer "mental" - it sounds less pedestrian...
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on September 01, 2012, 11:52:35 am
Spoon was doing just fine. If we make some clones, can I keep one as a slave pet?

You trying to get this locked too?

Uh oh. I have a reputation around here now  :lol:

Anyway, the answer is no. And besides, I don't think it was because of me that the Q&A thread was shut down. I think Spoon just got tired of it, my antics had been well toned down before he shut it down. I miss it more than most I would think.

Yer'all completely bonkers I tells ya!  :p

Usually when one person thinks they are the only sane one, it is they that is not.

Now be quiet, and off to the cloning vats with you!  :lol:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Legate Damar on September 01, 2012, 02:00:21 pm
Make to to make the clones biologically dependent on an artificial substance only you can create in order to ensure their loyalty.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Colonol Dekker on September 01, 2012, 02:31:03 pm
Oh you............... :lol:




Regarding my possession, I don't recommend it, the itching would drive you insane.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: SpardaSon21 on September 01, 2012, 04:56:17 pm
Knowing you there's also probably a slight burning sensation to go with that. ;)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: NGTM-1R on September 02, 2012, 02:06:49 am
Make to to make the clones biologically dependent on an artificial substance only you can create in order to ensure their loyalty.

The whole Jem'Hadar thing ultimately didn't work out so well.

Besides, "We are dead, we go to FRED to reclaim our lives" just isn't as cool.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Ravenholme on September 03, 2012, 09:38:27 am
Make to to make the clones biologically dependent on an artificial substance only you can create in order to ensure their loyalty.

The whole Jem'Hadar thing ultimately didn't work out so well.

Besides, "We are dead, we go to FRED to reclaim our lives" just isn't as cool.

But it rhymes so nicely....
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on September 06, 2012, 01:24:02 pm
Spoon's clones will be happy to do the job. Their interests coincide with ours. So there'll be no problem having to force them to do our bidding. The weakness should still be instilled within them however. They will of course have to be properly disposed of after they are no longer any use to us.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on September 30, 2012, 11:32:18 am
Anyone remember how I said stuff about "Yeah, uh huh. Got something ready around 22th of august!" Yeaaah, well. Stuff happened. I became a drooling guild wars 2 addict for a while and I underestimated how much time would go into the last bit.

But there is good news now. The fierce beta testers of WoD have put their teeth into it (and told me how much it sucks and how bad I should feel), and all the bugs and stuff are now in the progress of getting iron'd out. There might actually be something that gets released soon™ now!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on September 30, 2012, 03:12:32 pm
Unnecessary deadlines are bad. They just put pressure on you. Creativity needs to be able to go wherever it wants to. You can't put a clock on it.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Flak on October 04, 2012, 09:30:42 am
ha, good to hear.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: AtomicClucker on October 04, 2012, 01:26:53 pm
Unnecessary deadlines are bad. They just put pressure on you. Creativity needs to be able to go wherever it wants to. You can't put a clock on it.

Creativity can meander and get lost. Deadlines are useless sign posts. Creativity is a happy medium between getting lost in making stuff and patience do it all over again.

And beams spams negate all because ships blow up like popcorn and that's my sort of fan service.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on October 04, 2012, 08:51:15 pm
Soonish (http://youtu.be/vtLJ2gJBOvs?hd=1)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: CKid on October 04, 2012, 08:55:55 pm
More please!  :yes:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Droid803 on October 04, 2012, 09:02:04 pm
Watch carefully for spoilers.
There's your "more" :P
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: yuezhi on October 04, 2012, 09:12:58 pm
ooh a new character. Sylphia. :yes:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: redsniper on October 05, 2012, 09:01:21 am
ZOMG MOAR WOD!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: yuezhi on October 05, 2012, 11:16:21 pm
she looks mostly tsun.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Veers on October 23, 2012, 09:31:46 pm
I am definately sitting on the edge of my seat now.

Looking WOD-tastic Spoon!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: CKid on October 23, 2012, 10:06:22 pm
Just because of that trailer, I replayed the campaign to ready myself for the upcoming awesomeness.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on October 25, 2012, 08:15:27 am
barring unforeseen circumstances, today should be the day.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: SpardaSon21 on October 25, 2012, 12:00:05 pm
And then unforeseen circumstances happened. :lol:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Jellyfish on October 25, 2012, 05:15:42 pm
Should I buy a crowbar?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: SpardaSon21 on October 25, 2012, 05:21:40 pm
No crowbar, but be prepared to riot here and in #wod on IRC. :drevil:
Title: WoD2 cancelled
Post by: Spoon on December 09, 2012, 10:10:34 pm
So I figured I should give you guys an update on where things are at. I'll pretend (I hope) to be schizophrenic for a moment and hold a Q&A session with myself.

What's with the subject?

Exactly what it says! 'Wings of Dawn 2: Into the void' has been canceled. No more work on it shall be done.

Why?

I'm so glad you asked!
There are several reasons.

Tell us these reasons then.

WoD1's campaign was overall pretty decently balanced. It had some difficulty spikes on some missions but that aside it did pretty well for itself. The problem with WoD1's balancing however is that everything is balanced around two things. The campaign itself and the Ray III.
See, when I was starting out creating WoD I didn't really had a clear plan on where I wanted to take things. I just added weapons/ships as I was creating missions and then altered stats based on what I needed them to be for certain missions. With the Ray III with its 6 gunpoint’s as the baseline. While this worked out okay for WoD1 within its self contained campaign, it proved to be... troublesome expanding on it.

The enemy alien races were completely balanced around the campaign too. The Nordera and Cordi being the first ones you fight and thus stat wise are relatively weak (though im sure some of you will argue that the Cordi are the hardest to fight  :p ), with the Fura'ngle and Zy being introduced midway into the campaign and are thus tougher opponents. Again, this works fine for the WoD campaign, but it makes them hard to use outside of it.

WoD2 was going to be a Cyrvan focused campaign but with the Aestival R4 being one of the most powerful ships available in WoD1 it became rapidly clear that I needed to do some serious re-balancing, as the heavier CSA fighters could almost instant gib a Zy Talon. So as I went to work, creating tables and doing math I realized that I was attempting to fix something that was... well broken beyond a 'simple re-balance'. It was starting to head right down the retcon slope.

This brought up a new technical problem too. WoD2 is stand alone, but I wanted to make WoD1 stand alone as well. But if WoD2 is going to have such completely altered stats from 1... How would I release the two? If I release WoD2 first and then the stand alone version of WoD1 after, I would need to either
A.) Re-balance/ReFRED WoD1's campaign as a whole based on the new stats.
B.) Release WoD1 separately... asking players to download two games that share a large amount of assets. Redundant and not a very pretty solution.
C.) Make the WoD1 re-release dependent on having WoD2 installed.
Or redo WoD1 before proceeding with WoD2.

I decided for the moment to go with A. and take the opportunity to tackle some of the things I didn't liked about WoD1's campaign. Mainly the first missions and the last few missions... This then turned into 'let's remake some of the ****tier assets too' into 'let's redo some of the other missions while I'm at it too, to make the story flow better' into Axem saying "If you are going to revise all of this, might as well just do a complete rebuild of WoD!"

So tl;dr WoD2 is canceled because you are going to rebuild WoD from scratch?

It basically boils down to that, yes.
Some of the goals I aim for with this:

What would you consider the strong points and the weak points of WoD then? And how would you reinforce or improve on them?

On weak points:
As I already mentioned earlier in this post: The beginning of the campaign is weak. Part of this is because the story isn't immediately going to grab the player and an other part is that these first few missions are literally the first mission I ever created. The first mission is frankly just plain boring and the assets aren't exactly helping either (Faustus, Ray I being literally the first spaceship I ever made, the star being put together in 2 hours etc).

The last mission drove some players mad because maneuvering through dark narrow corridors on a time limit wasn't as easy as I thought it was going to be for everyone. :p I also sort of ran out of planned missions and ideas for the last missions and as a result the campaign doesn't nearly have as strong as an ending as it could have had.

-For the rebuild of WoD I will fully plan out each mission from start to finish and hope to make each mission as enjoyable and/or intense as possible!

I already spoke about balance before and how the Ray III was in the center of my (not very planned out) balancing work.
The Ray III is probably the fighter you'll end up piloting the most during the campaign yet is kind of gimped by its single primary bank. Especially unfortunate because WoD makes heavy use of different armors and weapons that have specific weaknesses and strengths. And with a single Pbank, you can't fully exploit this!
The alternatives to the Ray III are the Kaze and the Caliburn...
The Kaze has issues taking down tougher enemies because it only has 4 gun banks (enemies balanced around 6 gun points etc) and is kind of fragile. It also handles in a way that requires some getting use to.
The Caliburn packs a deadly punch but is kind of large and unwieldy and has issues taking down Cordi fighters. Thus isn't suited for some missions at all.

-So in short, WoD's player available fighter arsenal is kind of hit or miss (situationally effective) and will get some serious adjusting and expanding.


On strong points:
I personally consider the character interaction to be one of WoD's stronger points. Despite the majority of characters being faceless and undeveloped.

-In the WoD Rebuild every character will be much more developed with a face to go with it. In elaborate visual novel sections that will keep a lot of chatter out of the missions (and will be skippable)

Unique weapons and opponents to shoot at.

-Well those will of course be in! Only more!

Fun, I think people have called WoD fun on a few occasions.

-There will be Fun.

(Glass half empty look at life, lots of :words: about weak points but hardly any at strong points! :p )

So is it just going to be the same story retold through different missions?

There will be similarities, some parts might be the same. But overall it will be different enough that you won't be able to predict what exactly is going to happen next if you played the original. The ending definitely won't be the same and the story will contain more plot and with different factions at work.

You've typed a Chinese wall worth of text but no doubt you'll type some more as I inquire about what WoD2 was going to be about and what was done of WoD2 already

WoD2's story was going to pick up five years after the end of WoD1 (and as mentioned before) was going to be played from a Cyrvan perspective. A small CSA task force under the command of Isa'emarl Dertanya is tasked with traveling through a newly discovered starlance and finding out what the Zy are up to in this system and to stop them if needed. Based on nothing more but a vague premonition from a winged one.

The campaign's main features were to be:
Choices: The player was going to able to decide on several things, leading to good or bad results and a few branching missions.
Pilot management: Being able to pick which pilots are going to fly on your wing. And each pilot will have a morale status that is affected by your choices and such. Wingmen with a high morale being incredibly deadly on the battlefield whereas they perform sub par if they are feeling down.
Visual novel parts containing all the talky bits.
A whole load of new weapons and fighters

What was actually done so far?

This video that would start the campaign (http://youtu.be/0I4r6Ve5QH4)
The first two mission and the first large VN (http://imageshack.us/a/img202/5866/screen0227.png) section. (http://imageshack.us/a/img195/1889/screen0228.png)
A whole bunch of weapon effects and spiffy looking new ships
A large part of the visual novel portraits (http://img820.imageshack.us/img820/267/portraitsw.png) and some headani's

And all of this work is wasted then?

Hah, surely not.
The vast majority of the assets can and will be used for the rebuild.
The visual novel 'technology' especially (Axem powered™) will be most useful.

So what about all the hard work done by the awesome people that worked on the wiki and tvtropes page? Norbert putting up info found from the ask a character thread and such. Are you ju-


Sorry people!

Why isn't Stranded V1.0 yet?

Because I haven't felt like working on getting it done yet.

You're lazy, stop being lazy

No.


tl;dr blame Axem
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: niffiwan on December 09, 2012, 10:30:00 pm
wow  :eek2:

Sounds interesting though, I'm looking forward to it :)

And on the Caliburn, I quite liked it and used it in many missions (I have a soft spot for gun heavy slugs e.g. WC3 Thunderbolt or the B-Wing).  Sure it's hard to hit the Cordi, but once they're hit, they stay hit :D  So please don't hurt it too much in the re-balance... :)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on December 09, 2012, 10:36:10 pm
Is there nothing you can send us? If WoD2 is dead now, are there any missions we can play or anything?

I'm not sure how I feel about this.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Droid803 on December 09, 2012, 10:50:04 pm
There were no missions completed in the actual campaign (well Spoon says there are two but they're not complete as in tested :P)
Just a (big) bunch of tech-testing missions. These techs will be used in the rebuild, so not much of value was lost :P
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Legate Damar on December 09, 2012, 10:55:47 pm
Wow. This is... surprising. And disappointing.

I'm sorry, but I can't just get as excited for this WoD remake as I was for WoD 2 (even if it will include the assets I need for my campaign).

Are you going to try to make WoD2 again after you finish this project? Or any chance of reopening the ask a character thread?

(Just to be clear I do not hold resentment towards you for this, after all you do this for free so we should be happy for anything we get).
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: An4ximandros on December 09, 2012, 10:57:07 pm
 When I began to read that post this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=_O1hM-k3aUY#t=9s) is what came to mind.
 Once I finished reading Spoon's post I agreed with it, WoD was, quite frankly, a mess.
 Too many assumptions were made when balancing it (:p) and the low tech craft you have to play in some missions are the bane of (my) fun.

 All in all, I wish you the best in revising WoD Spoon, it's a brute diamond you cobbled together, and as the saying goes: A diamond is a piece of coal that finished what it started.

 Lorric, you should be relieved, Spoon has poured so much into this project and having the courage to revise it all should earn him respect form us. It shows how much he enjoys it.

 Oh and REMOVE CORDI! :p
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on December 09, 2012, 10:58:33 pm
There goes the "pick Yaiceca as wingman on first mission, put missile up tailpipe" plan...  :lol:

On a serious note, what I would make of her in the game is something I was very curious about. Would she just be a dick through the whole game, or would you come to like her? I actually think she has the nicest face out of all those Cyrvans in the picture.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Droid803 on December 09, 2012, 10:59:25 pm
Are you going to try to make WoD2 again after you finish this project? Or any chance of reopening the ask a character thread?

I believe such is the entire motivation for remaking WoD1 in the first place, so perhaps "cancelled" is an incorrect term, but rather "shelved", though whenever Spoon gets around to working on WoD2 again it probably won't resemble the current build all too much so perhaps "cancelled" is the correct term after all?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Legate Damar on December 09, 2012, 11:02:31 pm
There goes the "pick Yaiceca as wingman on first mission, put missile up tailpipe" plan...  :lol:

On a serious note, what I would make of her in the game is something I was very curious about. Would she just be a dick through the whole game, or would you come to like her? I actually think she has the nicest face out of all those Cyrvans in the picture.

I do not understand this resentment. Most of what she said was true. As for her face, though... ugh, pass.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on December 09, 2012, 11:06:24 pm
Are you going to try to make WoD2 again after you finish this project? Or any chance of reopening the ask a character thread?

I believe such is the entire motivation for remaking WoD1 in the first place, so perhaps "cancelled" is an incorrect term, but rather "shelved", though whenever Spoon gets around to working on WoD2 again it probably won't resemble the current build all too much so perhaps "cancelled" is the correct term after all?

If it's on the backburner, that's okay. But if not, I would hope that Spoon would tell us the story of what was going to happen.
There goes the "pick Yaiceca as wingman on first mission, put missile up tailpipe" plan...  :lol:

On a serious note, what I would make of her in the game is something I was very curious about. Would she just be a dick through the whole game, or would you come to like her? I actually think she has the nicest face out of all those Cyrvans in the picture.

I do not understand this resentment. Most of what she said was true. As for her face, though... ugh, pass.

Silence, alien scum! Or I'll have to whip out my copy of Star Trek Invasion and destroy that Cardassian convoy...

Perhaps you'll like the Cyrvan on the bottom middle. A very Cardassian complexion.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Legate Damar on December 09, 2012, 11:14:22 pm
Isa has a rather Cardassian personality - that is one good thing. Her sister, on the other hand, would be more suited for the milksop Federation.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on December 09, 2012, 11:19:29 pm
Isa has a rather Cardassian personality - that is one good thing. Her sister, on the other hand, would be more suited for the milksop Federation.

You'd have enjoyed playing as her then. That "milksop" federation seems to have done well enough against your race though... :)

What about the Cyrvan with the zombie Cardassian complexion, what do you think of her?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: NGTM-1R on December 09, 2012, 11:21:59 pm
You were legit going to try and do a VN built into the campaign as well? I'm impressed.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Legate Damar on December 09, 2012, 11:23:20 pm
Blame that fool Dukat, as well as the Klingons and Dominion for that.

As for your question - not enough scales. Zy are more visually appealing. I want a Zy wingman.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: General Battuta on December 09, 2012, 11:42:26 pm
I don't blame you, man, this sounded like hell and a half to work on. I am calling this a Good Decision. Plus WoD2 gave us that amazing trailer
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: yuezhi on December 09, 2012, 11:47:14 pm
after seeing spoons post title: 2 :warp: 12!

thank russel read everything.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: AndrewofDoom on December 10, 2012, 12:05:08 am
So long as you torture and abuse the mary sues with the nerf bat for countless hours, I shall be happy with that. :p

(I means seriously they need a huge nerf. Boring invincible ships are no fun. Give them a glaring weakness that can actually be exploited).
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on December 10, 2012, 12:11:05 am
So long as you torture and abuse the mary sues with the nerf bat for countless hours, I shall be happy with that. :p

(I means seriously they need a huge nerf. Boring invincible ships are no fun. Give them a glaring weakness that can actually be exploited).

I wonder what Cyrvan voices sound like. Because he's going to be hearing a lot of them, in his head, criticising that decision. First he scrubs their very own campaign, then he sets about them with the nerf bat...  :lol:

EDIT: I wouldn't mind seeing the old balance preserved in some form though. Taking the Cyrvans on or just using them and obliterating the other races could be fun.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Droid803 on December 10, 2012, 12:32:40 am
just using them and obliterating the other races could be fun.
I think since that's precisely the reason things happened the way they did.
Do you like punching babies?
Do you?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Legate Damar on December 10, 2012, 12:40:05 am
Speaking of just the Aestival, it has weaknesses. You just need practice and the proper strategies to exploit them. I'm sure that is true of all other CSA ships as well, "nerf" notwithstanding.

What I am really interested in seeing though is an Ayulerian battleship. I would enjoy finding the proper strategy to defeat it.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: mobcdmoc3 on December 10, 2012, 12:43:15 am
Heart stopped cold for a few seconds there. :shaking:

But, I suppose this isn't a bad idea at all. If doing this will improve upon the already-awesome WoD1, then I don't think I'm in any sort of position to be complaining. :p

One question though, if I may - Will the characters of WoD1 return? Or will even this aspect be rebuilt?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on December 10, 2012, 12:51:45 am
just using them and obliterating the other races could be fun.
I think since that's precisely the reason things happened the way they did.
Do you like punching babies?
Do you?

I'd just like to see the raw power of the Cyrvans unleashed in full and in all it's glory before Spoon bludgeons the poor Cyrvans with the nerf bat.

I do hope they remain the strongest race though, it wouldn't feel right if the Hertak took that spot from them.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Droid803 on December 10, 2012, 10:28:00 am
Speaking of just the Aestival, it has weaknesses. You just need practice and the proper strategies to exploit them. I'm sure that is true of all other CSA ships as well, "nerf" notwithstanding.
Sure. Now get the AI to understand that.

I believe therein lies the issue.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Legate Damar on December 10, 2012, 10:35:02 am
That's why if you want AI fighters to defeat them with any sort of regularity, you either have to do a lot of subtle tricks in FRED, or just mod stronger ships... or is it possible to tweak the AI to perform certain strategies? I have never heard much about how the Freespace AI code works. I know it can be modded, such as "Fury AI" but I don't know how that works.

Can you program the AI so when it is facing a certain ship with certain weapons, it will do a certain action? That would be useful... I honestly do not know if this is possible.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: SpardaSon21 on December 10, 2012, 12:40:39 pm
Spoon, you can't reboot Wings of Dawn.  It came out not even three years ago! :P

More seriously, best of luck with this and I look forwards to a better-balanced WoD with a better story.  Please don't retcon any of the minor characters too much though.  Kunoichi is already an excellent ninja. :lol:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on December 10, 2012, 06:40:07 pm
Hi Spoon. I’ve been thinking about your big post. And now I have one for you  :D

   Overall I’m warming to the idea now. The idea that you can make Wings of Dawn 1 be the best it can be with the new skills you’ve learned. I expect then you’ll go back to WoD2, but I would hope if not you would release anything that would not be seen, artwork, story work, ships, etc. Maybe you could even merge the two and the JGASF suddenly gets a load of new Cyrvans. It seems the Cyrvan females seem to be the warlike ones, doesn’t it. One Cyrvan male to 11 Cyrvan females seen so far.

   At first I wondered if you could just pull off a quick and dirty fix by hitting the Aestivals with the nerf bat, but I can see you’ve got bigger plans than that, and especially if you built the campaign to pretty much revolve around the Ray III, that would still, even if the Cyrvan nerf took care of the immediate problems, have the potential to rear it’s head as a problem later, so root and branch rebalancing is for the best if you want to fulfil your ambitions.

   I have recently been looking at the Diaspora stuff, and it sounds like you might be doing similar to them. And really that seems a great way to go for a standalone. It’s not good for a normal campaign, because it means cluttering up your limited space with many pilots, I’ve already had to make a folder to store excess pilots because I’ve maxed out my pilot limit. But for a standalone, that probably won’t be a problem even if we have to create double digits of pilots because the pilot folder is clean and you get to start over. And back to my original point it allows the creator to get instalments of praise and motivation to keep going, and also feedback to potentially discover flaws or perhaps agree with and implement suggestions which otherwise would be missed. And of course, we also get to get our hands on stuff earlier.

   On making it easier, since I had to scrape through the last few missions on very easy, I’m not going to complain. However, there’s a way you could do both. There’s a game on PS2 I have called Battle Engine Aquila that has a great concept I’ve only seen in that game, you can unlock “Evo” (Evolution) missions, which are essentially rebalanced versions of existing missions. Basically there’ll be a lot more enemies on the battlefield, they’ll probably have taken some of your allies out as well, and might even have tweaked the mission objectives in some, I can’t remember. So if you did that, you’d have the best of both Worlds. If the way you made WoD is the level you like to play at, you wouldn’t have to lose that experience that way. Great game by the way people, I’d recommend checking it out.

   I will certainly be glad to see the back of that final mission! :)

   On the Ray III’s single primary bank, I always thought that was precisely because of the armour types! I figured you had to choose, figure out which gun would be most useful, and take it into battle. That the armour types were precisely why you couldn’t have two guns. And also the fact some guns chew shields way better than hull and vice versa. There were some missions where I did plenty of deliberating over which gun to take.

   I basically thought the Kaze and Caliburn sucked. I didn’t take either of them. Pretty much for the reasons you say.

   Maybe you can also get that Hazel bomber into the game. I did some testing with that and I see why you left it out, it just obliterates everything. Kit out the JGASF with Hazel bombers and the game would be a cakewalk.

   So you’re going to redesign all the missions. Will there be any new ones? Or will they be redesigned so much that they actually feel new?

   I am looking forward to the development of the minor characters. I actually preferred from what information I had, the personalities of both Kunoichi and Axe to any of the main characters. So I’m looking forward to seeing them the most. I will certainly jump enthusiastically into the visual novel sequences. There will be no skipping from me there. Yet at the same time, in a repeat play through, the skipping may become welcome.

   Unique opponents is something that can especially spice things up. I take it you mean aces and commanders to contend with who have faces and talk to you?

   Fun. I like fun. Games should be fun above all else. WoD is fun :)

   I’m not so keen on branching storylines in FS2, because of the inflexibility of the pilot system. In order to see everything and replay changed missions/new missions I’d have to keep creating new pilots in order to do so. If you could fix that somehow, bring it on. If not, you might want to think about it a bit. I would normally favour branching paths if not for the reasons I stated.

   Morale system, if you implement it I hope you would let us know what state of morale the people are in, rather than leave us to guess. I really don’t like hidden stats like that.

   The stuff for WoD2 that you showed us really makes me want to play it… :(

   Could you tell us anything about the Cyrvans? At least what their names are if nothing else. It looks like you would have played as Isa, is that right? Or might you have played as several, as in WoD1?

   On the wiki and Tvtropes, that doesn’t have to be overwritten. Treat the current WoD as a separate game to the new one. Maybe give it a tweaked name, to separate it from it’s predecessor. A bit like how the Dynasty Warriors games use the same story every game but are a different game.

   Well there we go. I’ve said my piece. Good luck with it Spoon. I hope it goes well for you and becomes everything you want it to be.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Legate Damar on December 10, 2012, 07:22:51 pm
I prefer the Kaze to most LSF fighters (glide is very useful).
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on December 10, 2012, 07:53:24 pm
I prefer the Kaze to most LSF fighters (glide is very useful).

I never used the glide function (didn't know I could actually, I did before you posted this, though I still don't know how though.) So I'm not in a position to judge on that. The Kaze is paper thin though. I've yet to experience the glide function in any game yet, even Wing Commander Saga which has plenty of it.

You know the name of that fighter makes me think "kamikaze". Suicide to fly in it!  :lol:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: niffiwan on December 10, 2012, 08:03:56 pm
I found the Kaze quite useful in the mission near the end where you're fighting heaps of Nordera.  Two banks of plasma cannons (IIRC) to do massive damage to the Nordera ships, use snapshot firing as you glide past at high velocity, along with banks of Dragonfires (IIRC, the missiles with the *big* boom :)) to take out the few Fura'ngle that show up.  If you get pounded too much, afterburn away, activate glide while above your normal max speed, and lob a few missiles at your pursuers while flying backwards waiting for your shields to recharge.  Keep moving fast, don't get "low & slow" with those damn Nordera :)  Lots of fun, although still a difficult mission.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on December 10, 2012, 09:10:30 pm
You were legit going to try and do a VN built into the campaign as well? I'm impressed.
Absolutely.
This is what it looks like in FRED:
(http://img842.imageshack.us/img842/4868/17711653.png)
Any longer and I'm going to need a third screen.

Heart stopped cold for a few seconds there. :shaking:

But, I suppose this isn't a bad idea at all. If doing this will improve upon the already-awesome WoD1, then I don't think I'm in any sort of position to be complaining. :p

One question though, if I may - Will the characters of WoD1 return? Or will even this aspect be rebuilt?
They will definitely return and better than ever!  :p

Spoon, you can't reboot Wings of Dawn.  It came out not even three years ago! :P

More seriously, best of luck with this and I look forwards to a better-balanced WoD with a better story.  Please don't retcon any of the minor characters too much though.  Kunoichi is already an excellent ninja. :lol:
I wasn't aware there was a minimum time limit on these things :p

I found the Kaze quite useful in the mission near the end where you're fighting heaps of Nordera.  Two banks of plasma cannons (IIRC) to do massive damage to the Nordera ships, use snapshot firing as you glide past at high velocity, along with banks of Dragonfires (IIRC, the missiles with the *big* boom :)) to take out the few Fura'ngle that show up.  If you get pounded too much, afterburn away, activate glide while above your normal max speed, and lob a few missiles at your pursuers while flying backwards waiting for your shields to recharge.  Keep moving fast, don't get "low & slow" with those damn Nordera :)  Lots of fun, although still a difficult mission.
See, this is exactly how you are suppose to use the Kaze  :)



Overall I’m warming to the idea now. The idea that you can make Wings of Dawn 1 be the best it can be with the new skills you’ve learned. I expect then you’ll go back to WoD2
No not quite, WoD 'Rebuild' will follow its own seperate path. It won't replace WoD1 and there (probably) won't be a 'WoD RB 2'. This rebuild will be a continous story that will keep being expanded on with new 'Acts'

I have recently been looking at the Diaspora stuff, and it sounds like you might be doing similar to them. And really that seems a great way to go for a standalone. It’s not good for a normal campaign, because it means cluttering up your limited space with many pilots, I’ve already had to make a folder to store excess pilots because I’ve maxed out my pilot limit. But for a standalone, that probably won’t be a problem even if we have to create double digits of pilots because the pilot folder is clean and you get to start over. And back to my original point it allows the creator to get instalments of praise and motivation to keep going, and also feedback to potentially discover flaws or perhaps agree with and implement suggestions which otherwise would be missed. And of course, we also get to get our hands on stuff earlier.
It's more akin to BP WiH than Diaspora I think ('cept standalone etc) but aside from that: Yes.

Maybe you can also get that Hazel bomber into the game. I did some testing with that and I see why you left it out, it just obliterates everything. Kit out the JGASF with Hazel bombers and the game would be a cakewalk.
The Hazel is actually in the WoD campaign. You can 'unlock' it by completing the planetary blockade mission with Dawn&Infi under a certain time limit, then later on when you fly that scramble mission (in which you bomb enemy ships with the caliburn as the prometheus frame is repairing itself) you can select it from the loadout.


So you’re going to redesign all the missions. Will there be any new ones? Or will they be redesigned so much that they actually feel new?
It'll be 95% new

Morale system, if you implement it I hope you would let us know what state of morale the people are in, rather than leave us to guess. I really don’t like hidden stats like that.
It was going to be a super transparant system

Could you tell us anything about the Cyrvans? At least what their names are if nothing else. It looks like you would have played as Isa, is that right? Or might you have played as several, as in WoD1?
Correct, Isa was going to be the player character. No flipflopping around like in WoD1.
If you open that picture with VN portraits; starting from the top left
Akyha Celbrat, very serious and military minded
Celise Spellweaver, minor role, the person giving Isa the mission
Yaiceca m'es Vera, sub captain, effectively being the little devil on Isa's shoulder. Only flies a fighter on special occasions. Old friend of Isa
Isa'emarl Dertanya, player character, commander of the taskforce
Wynter Cellbrat, unlike her twin sister she doesn't care much about military discipline. Likes getting attention. Awacs pilot.
Rubyica Meerara, hybrid, was probably going to be the weakest pilot overal out of them all. Insecure.
Sera Hanaha, can look a few seconds into the future, flies blind folded. Weakest pilot at low morale. An absolute unmatched killing machine on high morale.
Kaguya Dessler, telepath, likes being alone and dislikes aliens.
Esron Dertanya, minor character, father of Isa&Crystal
Other characters that had a face but aren't on that picture
Emizer Kerducy, sub captain, the little angel on the other shoulder of Isa
Ken Stormchaser, captain of one of the escort ships.
Aira Stormchaser, captain of one of the other escort ships. A married couple.
Atlas, mysterious man that always wears a helmet. Old friend of Isa. Only pilot not affected by morale.

Well there we go. I’ve said my piece. Good luck with it Spoon. I hope it goes well for you and becomes everything you want it to be.
Thanks, I hope so too  :p
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Jellyfish on December 10, 2012, 09:59:26 pm
Will Misuzu still be MC? And will any of those characters appear in WoDR?

It's more akin to BP WiH than Diaspora I think ('cept standalone etc) but aside from that: Yes.
Or like ASW.
Actually, I think it's more like Inferno.

Either way, best of luck!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Flak on December 11, 2012, 12:17:25 am
Those 'faceless' pilots on the GA that has almost no speaking lines, perhaps they can have more spotlight, so far as I see, they only appear when there are not enough fighters to fill up the slots.
Oh, and I think the LSF Rance and probably the accompanying ships too should be some limited edition destroyer/cruiser or a heavily modified one instead of a standard Skirmisher.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Legate Damar on December 11, 2012, 08:39:55 am
Alt-G to glide on standard setup
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Rodo on December 11, 2012, 08:13:05 pm
wow, such dedication.

this is why I love HLP, kudos Spoon, Axem and everyone working on WoD. I'll be waiting for the re-release eagerly :yes:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: AndrewofDoom on December 11, 2012, 09:11:11 pm
You were legit going to try and do a VN built into the campaign as well? I'm impressed.
Absolutely.
This is what it looks like in FRED:
(http://img842.imageshack.us/img842/4868/17711653.png)
Any longer and I'm going to need a third screen.

It's this stuff that bothers me enough to possibly make a script-based solution instead of SEXPs. It seems such a daunting task though, like another certain thing a very specific person is trying to make me create.  :shaking:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dark Hunter on December 11, 2012, 09:22:24 pm
I just read the Big Epic Post from a few pages back.

Sorry to hear that WOD2 is cancelled, but it sounds like you're going to be taking the WOD universe in interesting new directions, so... that's good. I'll be looking forward to the "rerelease" of Wings of Dawn.

So what about all the hard work done by the awesome people that worked on the wiki and tvtropes page? Norbert putting up info found from the ask a character thread and such. Are you ju-[/b]

Sorry people!

Ah well. If you're using the same basic universe and background much of the tvtropes page can still be used.

EDIT: Oy! I didn't mean to change the topic title.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Axem on December 11, 2012, 09:56:06 pm
You were legit going to try and do a VN built into the campaign as well? I'm impressed.
Absolutely.
This is what it looks like in FRED:
(http://img842.imageshack.us/img842/4868/17711653.png)
Any longer and I'm going to need a third screen.

It's this stuff that bothers me enough to possibly make a script-based solution instead of SEXPs. It seems such a daunting task though, like another certain thing a very specific person is trying to make me create.  :shaking:

It's actually not that complex. There are a grand total of 6 events that control the basic structure of the VN system. 90% of the other sexps are just messages (plus character graphic changes plus camera changes). It's no different than if you just made a really really really long message chain/cutscene. For the parts where you need to make a choice, its just 1 more event per choice you need to make.

This is a picture of what most of the events look like: http://imagebin.org/238997

So simple, even a spoon can understand it. :)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Alan Bolte on December 12, 2012, 09:23:57 pm
Looking forward to it!

Quote
-In the WoD Rebuild every character will be much more developed with a face to go with it. In elaborate visual novel sections that will keep a lot of chatter out of the missions (and will be skippable)
I read that as 'shippable'.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: AndrewofDoom on December 12, 2012, 10:21:26 pm
Looking forward to it!

Quote
-In the WoD Rebuild every character will be much more developed with a face to go with it. In elaborate visual novel sections that will keep a lot of chatter out of the missions (and will be skippable)
I read that as 'shippable'.

How did you come to that conclusion from reading it?
CRYSTALXMISUZU HOOAH
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: NGTM-1R on December 12, 2012, 10:22:56 pm
It's a VN. Shippable is all but required.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: SpardaSon21 on December 12, 2012, 10:34:54 pm
There was a WoD shipping thread right after the release.  Spoon locked it with extreme prejudice. :(

First rule of WoD is apparently: Don't Ship WoD.

That being said, the entire female cast of WoD will end up being shipped with one another and possibly clones of themselves at some point.

I just hope Spoon won't completely rewrite Misuzu into a super-serious psychotic killer who collects yaoi instead of mecha just to see how much rage he can get us to generate.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: An4ximandros on December 12, 2012, 10:42:45 pm
Spoon could turn Misizu into a psychologically disturbed young girl which has been blessed/cursed with being able to listen to (and speak to) the minds of others...

Nah! Too common an ani-trope... :p
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: SpardaSon21 on December 12, 2012, 10:45:29 pm
He'll probably also throw in a teenage MCWS pilot who learned how to pilot after a quick read through the manual. :p
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dark Hunter on December 12, 2012, 10:50:38 pm
I would prefer not seeing the characters' personalities altered... but greater detail and development is always welcome, and one thing I'm majorly looking forward to.

If Misuzu was changed to be serious... that would just be depressing. :(
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: NGTM-1R on December 12, 2012, 11:01:34 pm
Dawn = Rei. Calling it now!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: An4ximandros on December 12, 2012, 11:33:13 pm
And she's the key to surviving Second Incursion. Dawn is also devoid of emotion (at first.)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: SpardaSon21 on December 13, 2012, 12:10:30 am
So, does that make Justice Shinji?

Spoon also needs to add the necessary love triangle for this to be an authentic anime space opera. :D

Milkshake/Tempest/Scar triangle anyone? :drevil:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: AndrewofDoom on December 13, 2012, 12:18:31 am
Milkshake/Tempest/Scar triangle anyone? :drevil:

:wtf:

/me cannot see this happening.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: qwadtep on December 13, 2012, 12:45:00 am
What if Dawn is actually dead? They didn't make it through the starlance. Everything that happens past the first mission is Dawn dreaming in her last moments floating through subspace.

Just think about it. Wings of Dawn? The Guardian Angel? It makes perfect sense!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Legate Damar on December 13, 2012, 12:49:45 am
I would personally prefer more political intrigue and backstabbing. And cultural imperialism.

Some fanatical devotion to the state wouldn't hurt either.

Most important, though, is to emphasize how everyone is guilty until proven innocent.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on December 13, 2012, 04:04:10 am
Regarding the Evangelion parallels, no one in WoD is mentally ****ed up enough to be anywhere close to that.
Dawn might seem emotionless in her first mission, but that's during a military operation. I'd call that professional behaviour. Once she's out of the cockpit she does show emotions.

Rei isn't so much the key for saving anyone. She's more the key to killing everyone. For all we know Asuka and Shinji might be the only Humans left alive, with everyone else ending up as orange puddles on the floor.

Justice is very self-assured, adult and mentally stable... so pretty much the polar opposit of Shinji. The only thing they have in common is, that they are both male and good pilots.


Love triangels? Please no... I really hate those, unless it ends the "convenient" way with one of them dying and the survivors, after a period or mourning, living happily ever after. Actually I'd prefer the romance to be completely left out. Light flirting is fine I guess, but please no wanna-be deep and meaningfull romace in WoD.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: An4ximandros on December 13, 2012, 07:08:12 am
Legate: So... you want an Ancient France in space anime game?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: headdie on December 13, 2012, 09:05:02 am
Legate: So... you want an Ancient France in space anime game?

more likely Cardassians
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Legate Damar on December 13, 2012, 12:05:22 pm
Or maybe just some new characters of another species. Like a Cordi pilot.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on December 13, 2012, 02:00:55 pm
Or maybe just some new characters of another species. Like a Cordi pilot.

I don't know if Spoon could do it, but just as they lifted Kilrathi headanis direct from Wing Commander Games for Wing Commander Saga, if Spoon could somehow lay his hands on the headanis of the Nephilim from Wing Commander Prophecy that would be great. They fit the preying mantis description. Maybe even take some of the voice work...

EDIT: On second thoughts, no. The Cordi are hard enough to hit as it is without having to deal with a Cordi ace...  :lol:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dragon on December 13, 2012, 03:41:20 pm
Cordi Ace would most likely be like Nephilim aces though. A completely "out of character" ship for the species. Cordi are only dangerous in large numbers, a single, slightly better ship would make little difference.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on December 13, 2012, 03:47:15 pm
Cordi Ace would most likely be like Nephilim aces though. A completely "out of character" ship for the species. Cordi are only dangerous in large numbers, a single, slightly better ship would make little difference.

If the Zy ace was anything to go by, it wouldn't be anything like "slightly" better...

Or it would be a normal Cordi Soldier, but the equivalent of pad reading you like Mortal Kombat 2 on the top difficulty and loaded out with some powerful weaponry...
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: SpardaSon21 on December 13, 2012, 04:16:41 pm
Cyrvan ace pilot with foresight abilities.  Worse than Psycho Mantis?  Most certainly since you can't swap controller ports.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dragon on December 13, 2012, 04:23:05 pm
Cyrvan ace pilot with foresight abilities.  Worse than Psycho Mantis?  Most certainly since you can't swap controller ports.
You can't really simulate that though, other than setting target position prediction to a ridiculous value, the AI is pretty bad at anticipating player's actions. He/she would be like any other Cyrvan ace, and also like any other AI. Very challenging, most likely, considering the Cyrvans' technological superiority, but by no means undefeatable with the right approach.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on December 13, 2012, 04:30:43 pm
Cyrvan ace pilot with foresight abilities.  Worse than Psycho Mantis?  Most certainly since you can't swap controller ports.
You can't really simulate that though, other than setting target position prediction to a ridiculous value, the AI is pretty bad at anticipating player's actions. He/she would be like any other Cyrvan ace, and also like any other AI. Very challenging, most likely, considering the Cyrvans' technological superiority, but by no means undefeatable with the right approach.

Perhaps you could have hull regeneration triggers. The damage you inflicted never happened beause what you just did the Cyrvan saw coming. The triggers run out after a few times after the Cyrvan's powers have been exhausted.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Legate Damar on December 13, 2012, 04:52:08 pm
I meant a Cordi pilot as an ally
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: NexusCron on December 29, 2012, 08:28:03 am
Spoon, can I be honest? Isa as a player character sounded bloody awesome. Sad that wings of dawn 2 is cancled, would she still be playable? Or crystal?
or is Misuzu still MC?

or Dawn?
Actually Dawn might be fun. She legally gets to troll other pilots.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dragon on December 29, 2012, 08:52:21 am
WoD2 is canceled? Where did you hear that? I don't think this was a reliable source, since it doesn't seem to be canceled. Or do you mean something else?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: General Battuta on December 29, 2012, 11:16:57 am
WoD2 is canceled? Where did you hear that? I don't think this was a reliable source, since it doesn't seem to be canceled. Or do you mean something else?

uh dude, spoon announced it here in this thread
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on December 29, 2012, 12:18:46 pm
WoD2 is canceled? Where did you hear that? I don't think this was a reliable source, since it doesn't seem to be canceled. Or do you mean something else?

There:

http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php?action=post;quote=1662265;topic=74794.360
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dragon on December 29, 2012, 12:38:16 pm
Your link redirects me to "post" screen in which I'm supposed to quote myself. :) My guess is that your browser didn't refresh the adress in the bar.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Legate Damar on December 29, 2012, 12:40:13 pm
Technically it's not cancelled, just delayed.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on December 29, 2012, 12:44:20 pm
Your link redirects me to "post" screen in which I'm supposed to quote myself. :) My guess is that your browser didn't refresh the adress in the bar.

Tch. It's near the bottom of page 14.

EDIT: How strange, it does the same for me too. The url certainly worked when I took it.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dragon on December 29, 2012, 12:53:26 pm
Ah, that. This can hardly be considered canceling, despite Spoon he called it. It's very seriously delayed, but not abandoned. Now I know what NexusCron was talking about. Sorry for offtopic, I need to check the forums more often.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Phantom Hoover on December 29, 2012, 07:13:24 pm
Elves suck too much to make their ships explode properly-- sorry I promised I'd keep this off the wod boards. Sad to see episode 2 ran aground, it seems like all we've had this year are cancellations.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: SpardaSon21 on December 29, 2012, 07:42:57 pm
Elves suck too much to make their ships explode properly-- sorry I promised I'd keep this off the wod boards. Sad to see episode 2 ran aground, it seems like all we've had this year are cancellations.
Have you missed the epic Blue Planet update in preparation for Act 3 of War in Heaven?  Sure, some things got canceled, but since Spoon's promised an even better version of Wings of Dawn with every aspect improved upon I'm not particularly angry about the indefinite delay for WoD 2.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Phantom Hoover on December 29, 2012, 07:59:35 pm
There have not been many releases this year, at least from my perspective.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Flak on January 07, 2013, 10:09:47 pm
I suppose the delay was merely a setback? Just like elves you see, every time they faces a failure, it was 'merely a setback' you see.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Legate Damar on January 08, 2013, 03:27:08 am
I suppose the delay was merely a setback? Just like elves you see, every time they faces a failure, it was 'merely a setback' you see.

This is also official Cardassian policy...
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on January 08, 2013, 03:32:54 am
I think that's called "learning from your mistakes" here on Earth.... though WoD is definately not a mistake!
Title: Ahahahaha
Post by: Spoon on February 02, 2013, 06:40:54 pm
It's the circus! (http://youtu.be/JOzuN9xfkDc)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: AndrewofDoom on February 02, 2013, 06:47:57 pm
I'm going to assume the AI is totally clueless when it tries to use it. :p
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: An4ximandros on February 02, 2013, 07:04:40 pm
That video showcases that the engine needs some kind of audio pitch randomizer (Not sure if that's the proper term). That aside, Lord Dakkalus is pleased by all the Dakkasy.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: NGTM-1R on February 02, 2013, 07:31:12 pm
Now all we need is the original Battlestations playing and my life will be complete.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Legate Damar on February 02, 2013, 07:42:35 pm
How to make multi-locking missiles? Scripting or new table option?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: SypheDMar on February 02, 2013, 07:46:46 pm
Read about reboot. That actually sounds like a great idea! Good luck, and I look forward to this one.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Rodo on February 02, 2013, 08:30:11 pm
that was awesome.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on February 03, 2013, 04:16:52 pm
You're not actually going to put that in the game though, are you? Way, way too powerful.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: niffiwan on February 03, 2013, 04:25:13 pm
It can always be balanced so that it's not too powerful.  And we currently have the tech to do this sort of trick (F-14 Tomcat + AIM-54 Phoenix (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AIM-54_Phoenix)) so why wouldn't it exist & be used in the future? :)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on February 03, 2013, 04:35:19 pm
It can always be balanced so that it's not too powerful.  And we currently have the tech to do this sort of trick (F-14 Tomcat + AIM-54 Phoenix (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AIM-54_Phoenix)) so why wouldn't it exist & be used in the future? :)

No skill though. I really dislike games which are all about homing missiles and not dogfighting. I know it's impractical that in the future there'd be dogfighting. In the future you might be locking missiles on targets thousands and thousands of miles away. No fun for a game though.

EDIT: Maybe if it was toned down and you could only use it once. Might bring a tactical element in for when you use it.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on February 03, 2013, 05:01:34 pm
No skill though. I really dislike games which are all about homing missiles and not dogfighting. I know it's impractical that in the future there'd be dogfighting. In the future you might be locking missiles on targets thousands and thousands of miles away. No fun for a game though.
And heat-seekers defined with "untargeted heat seeker" are any different?

If anything, I'd say those are even worse. At least with the aspect-seeking missiles you have to wait for a lock instead of firing at anything and everything at your leisure.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on February 03, 2013, 05:06:47 pm
No skill though. I really dislike games which are all about homing missiles and not dogfighting. I know it's impractical that in the future there'd be dogfighting. In the future you might be locking missiles on targets thousands and thousands of miles away. No fun for a game though.
And heat-seekers defined with "untargeted heat seeker" are any different?

I don't know what that means. I googled it, and funnily enough, look, it's Spoon:

http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php?topic=80253.5;wap2

I don't know what the untargeted heat seeker actually is though.

I'm trying to keep the destruction you can cause with missiles down to a minimum in my campaign I'm making. I'll probably keep the player with those basic low power homing missiles you start the game with.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on February 03, 2013, 05:12:45 pm
It means you don't need a target selected for heat-seekers to aquire lock. With mods like WoD and DE and their swarm heat-seeking missiles, you just point in a direction and click whenever you feel like it; the missiles take their pick of targets.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: niffiwan on February 03, 2013, 05:14:25 pm
It can always be balanced so that it's not too powerful.

EDIT: Maybe if it was toned down and you could only use it once. Might bring a tactical element in for when you use it.

:D
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on February 03, 2013, 05:21:22 pm
It means you don't need a target selected for heat-seekers to aquire lock. With mods like WoD and DE and their swarm heat-seeking missiles, you just point in a direction and click whenever you feel like it; the missiles take their pick of targets.

Hmmm. They don't have such destructive potential though. Usually it's one ship you're targetting. My main issue is if it comes to a point where there's pretty much no need to fire your primary weapon at all, or rarely, because you're just taking stuff out with missiles. I sometimes get turned off by the supply ship in FS2. Why bother engaging enemies when you can just sit there and wipe everything out with unlimited supplies of long range missiles? If I ever make anything for Freespace 2, there'll be no supply ship. Ideally I want the meat of a mission to be chasing stuff guns blazing.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: An4ximandros on February 03, 2013, 05:25:18 pm
Tone it down? Doesn't WoD stand for Weapons obscenely Destructive? ;7
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dragon on February 03, 2013, 05:27:59 pm
How to make multi-locking missiles? Scripting or new table option?
New table option, but the build is, AFAIK, WoD team exclusive, at least for now. I think it'd be in the trunk in no time if everything works allright though.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on February 03, 2013, 05:31:30 pm
Tone it down? Doesn't WoD stand for Weapons obscenely Destructive? ;7

It just seems strange to me that Spoon is restructuring due to the Cyrvans being overpowered, and then the first thing we see since the announcement is that superweapon.

Thinking of new things for WOD, eh...

Wonderful Orgasmic Destruction! :lol:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: NGTM-1R on February 03, 2013, 05:34:11 pm
You're not actually going to put that in the game though, are you? Way, way too powerful.

GTFO. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BzXfVgYCxWI)

Besides, it hasn't seemed to occurred to you that if it can be used by you, it could also be used against you...
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on February 03, 2013, 05:37:59 pm
You're not actually going to put that in the game though, are you? Way, way too powerful.

GTFO. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BzXfVgYCxWI)

Besides, it hasn't seemed to occurred to you that if it can be used by you, it could also be used against you...


What's with the GTFO?

Oh, it has. I don't want the game to devolve into spamming missiles and countermeasures.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: NGTM-1R on February 03, 2013, 05:41:00 pm
If you haven't clicked the link, you will never understand.

If you have, and are still complaining, you will REALLY never understand.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on February 03, 2013, 05:46:56 pm
If you haven't clicked the link, you will never understand.

If you have, and are still complaining, you will REALLY never understand.

I did click it. Watched for a bit. Yeah, stuff blowing stuff up with missiles. Not fun to play though in a game. Exactly what I don't want.

Anyway, we should get to you now. I know to expect bad things every time I see you show up in a thread I'm in. Why is that?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: NGTM-1R on February 03, 2013, 06:10:13 pm
I daresay because I don't suffer fools gladly and you are eager to play the fool.

This sort of thing shaped the conceptions of a generation on how air/space combat should be portrayed. Wings of Dawn is a product of, and for, those of that generation. The first release included pseudo-Itano weapons, the first of which was a direct reference to this sort of thing (Remember Dawn's loadout with the IT-AN-0?), and it's been stated before that Spoon was doing the best he could with the engine at that time. If you haven't realized yet that this is one of the most cherished anime space/aerial combat tropes in existence, and its appearance in Wings of Dawn is not only inevitable but something that nearly everyone who enjoyed this mod would want, then you're dumber than a brick.

I'd also point out I've actually played good games that feature mechanics like this; Battlecry comes to mind.

EDIT: I mean, jesus, I was able to link you nearly 20 minutes of compiled Itano Circus scenes stretching across something close to thirty years of anime, almost NONE of which involve people getting taken out like punks . (Otherwise we'd have forty minutes from Macross alone.) This is deeply embedded. The fact you didn't pick up on the significance of that does not speak well of you.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on February 03, 2013, 06:32:18 pm
I daresay because I don't suffer fools gladly and you are eager to play the fool.

This sort of thing shaped the conceptions of a generation on how air/space combat should be portrayed. Wings of Dawn is a product of, and for, those of that generation. The first release included pseudo-Itano weapons, the first of which was a direct reference to this sort of thing (Remember Dawn's loadout with the IT-AN-0?), and it's been stated before that Spoon was doing the best he could with the engine at that time. If you haven't realized yet that this is one of the most cherished anime space/aerial combat tropes in existence, and its appearance in Wings of Dawn is not only inevitable but something that nearly everyone who enjoyed this mod would want, then you're dumber than a brick.

I'd also point out I've actually played good games that feature mechanics like this; Battlecry comes to mind.

That doesn't help. In future, stop the insulting and be nice, or I'm just going to ignore you, because nothing productive ever seems to come out of talking to you. Others challenge me on things, but they are polite, and even often win me around to their way of thinking/prove me wrong.

I don't know much about anime or Spoon's motivations. I just know what I like. I've always found it amusing that I'm one of the mod's biggest fans, while completely oblivious to a lot of the stuff it is built upon on the anime side. I relate to the Star Control 2 influence, and the fact I find it the most enjoyable of all mods I've tried to play and for the most part like his characters.

I need to find out what weapon he picked to bear Itano's name. For me, that's the first time I've heard that name. I don't know if the other weapons have significance in their names. I have seen Spoon relate to this missile stuff before, but in non-WoD threads. If he works it in, then I just have to hope I still enjoy the game. However, don't be so elitist. I don't think Spoon is making this game for anyone but himself. If interests of others coincide, good for them. If not, so be it. If the new WoD ends up being all missile based, it's highly likely I won't enjoy it. So be it I guess.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: NGTM-1R on February 03, 2013, 06:50:16 pm
EDIT: I mean, jesus, I was able to link you nearly 20 minutes of compiled Itano Circus scenes stretching across something close to thirty years of anime, almost NONE of which involve people getting taken out like punks. (Otherwise we'd have forty minutes from Macross alone.)

That this took me under twenty seconds should probably have been significant. You had all that you could have needed to educate yourself on how much meaning this particular behavior has to the people who made and who love this mod right at your fingertips. I literally gave you a living history of why the Itano Circus is coming and why nobody is going to listen to your objections so you should probably just let it go. And you waved it off with "Yeah, stuff blowing stuff up with missiles."

And you now wish to plead ignorance of why this trope is significant to Wings of Dawn, and demand politeness and respect. You could have educated yourself, and you could have earned politeness and respect. You chose not to.

Reap the whirlwind.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: SpardaSon21 on February 03, 2013, 07:00:03 pm
Lorric, Wings of Dawn clearly uses a lot of anime tropes, most notably missiles of doom.  The Dragonslave and Heaven's Fire are proof of that, and Spoon has already tried to do an Itano Circus in his mod with his various autonomous fire-and-forget swarm missiles.  You must not have used the Hazel and the heavy swarm missiles in the mission where you have to defend the Prometheus Frame, because that would have certainly told you Spoon fully intends to allow us to fire Macross Missile Massacres.  And, oddly enough, you're complaining about a nerfing to these missile barrages because they now require an aspect lock?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dragon on February 03, 2013, 07:18:28 pm
And you now wish to plead ignorance of why this trope is significant to Wings of Dawn, and demand politeness and respect. You could have educated yourself, and you could have earned politeness and respect. You chose not to.
Isn't it sad we live in times when politeness is something that needs to be earned? In my grandfather's time, such simple things were pretty much granted. It's a shame people can't just be nice to each other like they once were. Don't worry, I know very well who is to blame.
You must not have used the Hazel and the heavy swarm missiles in the mission where you have to defend the Prometheus Frame, because that would have certainly told you Spoon fully intends to allow us to fire Macross Missile Massacres.  And, oddly enough, you're complaining about a nerfing to these missile barrages because they now require an aspect lock?
Actually, the Hazel (the ship in the demonstration vid) is somewhat of a special case. It's a heavy bomber/missile boat. Dogfighting in it is an exercise in frustration, doubly so if you're packing an anti-cap gun. Normal combat will stay gun-focused, I believe, since to demote guns to secondary weapons would be to waste a revolutionary damage resistance system. WoD is great, because it offers you a lot of options on how you want to play it. So, you could fly a heavy fighter, spamming missiles and hoping no Cordi gets you from behind, or fly a nimble dogfighter with rapid-fire guns and hope you don't get dragged into a capship's killzone. I don't think that's gonna change, if anything, the options will be expanded.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on February 03, 2013, 07:20:47 pm
EDIT: I mean, jesus, I was able to link you nearly 20 minutes of compiled Itano Circus scenes stretching across something close to thirty years of anime, almost NONE of which involve people getting taken out like punks. (Otherwise we'd have forty minutes from Macross alone.)

That this took me under twenty seconds should probably have been significant. You had all that you could have needed to educate yourself on how much meaning this particular behavior has to the people who made and who love this mod right at your fingertips. I literally gave you a living history of why the Itano Circus is coming and why nobody is going to listen to your objections so you should probably just let it go. And you waved it off with "Yeah, stuff blowing stuff up with missiles."

And you now wish to plead ignorance of why this trope is significant to Wings of Dawn, and demand politeness and respect. You could have educated yourself, and you could have earned politeness and respect. You chose not to.

Reap the whirlwind.

Doesn't help when I don't know what it is you're showing me exactly. Missed that edit btw.

Why should I educate myself? Wings of Dawn is all that matters. I also quite like not knowing in a way. I feel it will enhance the experience.

(EDIT: This late edit is for anyone reading this. The statement "Why should I educate myself" looks pretty damning on me. It is not an attitude I take towards things in general, I just said it because I didn't feel I need an intimate knowledge of Spoon's inspirations to enjoy his mod, especially when someone is just basically demanding it of me.)

You're also missing something. That video is all anime. Wings of Dawn is a game. It's not the same. An anime is scripted. And it is designed to be watched, not played. The question is whether the game can incorporate it and be fun. It is a game first and foremost, anime influenced second.

Ah, you think like Battuta. I don't understand that mindset. Why do you feel that way? Nobody has to earn the right to basic manners and respect with me. Who are you to demand such things of people?

Lorric, Wings of Dawn clearly uses a lot of anime tropes, most notably missiles of doom.  The Dragonslave and Heaven's Fire are proof of that, and Spoon has already tried to do an Itano Circus in his mod with his various autonomous fire-and-forget swarm missiles.  You must not have used the Hazel and the heavy swarm missiles in the mission where you have to defend the Prometheus Frame, because that would have certainly told you Spoon fully intends to allow us to fire Macross Missile Massacres.  And, oddly enough, you're complaining about a nerfing to these missile barrages because they now require an aspect lock?

Correct. You can even find me saying this somewhere around here, I think it might be in my campaign thread, stating that bomber was never used, and Spoon corrected me about that mission. I also theorised it wasn't included because it was overpowered.

I think there's been a crossed wire there. I was saying it's better to need to get a lock with a missile for it to home in than just fire it off and it homes in itself.

EDIT: I was also referring to missiles in general, not Spoon's work specifically.

I like the Zy swarm missiles btw. Because they're not too fast, or too powerful, you can shoot them down, and then when the initial wave is cleared, it's into standard dogfighting because the Zy missile bank is quite limited. I also like saving allies by shooting those missiles down. And I also like the big missile launches for capship to capship combat. The Cyrvans I feel their weapons are overpowered, but you rarely saw Cyrvans anyway, so it was okay. Used in moderation, I will be perfectly happy.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on February 03, 2013, 07:24:38 pm
And you now wish to plead ignorance of why this trope is significant to Wings of Dawn, and demand politeness and respect. You could have educated yourself, and you could have earned politeness and respect. You chose not to.
Isn't it sad we live in times when politeness is something that needs to be earned? In my grandfather's time, such simple things were pretty much granted. It's a shame people can't just be nice to each other like they once were. Don't worry, I know very well who is to blame.


It is.

And perhaps this is part of why we seem to get along well, Dragon. It is a pleasure to converse with you. What do you mean by "Don't worry, I know very well who is to blame." ?

Are you referring to NGTM-1R, or something else about today's culture?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: NGTM-1R on February 03, 2013, 07:40:34 pm
Why should I educate myself?

What the hell, man. If you are going to state outright that you have no interest in forming a coherent and rational argument (which requires educating yourself about the issues involved), then you might as well declare "I AM THE NEXT LIBERATOR/KAZAN/TRASHMAN PLZ BAN NOW".

Who are you to demand such things of people?

Ah, you've got it completely backwards. You think you never had it. I'm saying you lost it. Arguably, long before this, but in this particular case, as I said, you were given the tools to understand why the Itano Circus is a deeply beloved part of the things Wings of Dawn pays tribute to, and hence why it will be a part of Wings of Dawn if at all possible.

You refused to use them. In so doing, you lost whatever claim to respect or politeness you previously had, by showing that you are uninterested in understanding the issues being discussed and that anything you have to say is uneducated white noise. That you don't understand why you should educate yourself on the issues being discussed if you wish to be taken seriously in the discussion is also pretty good evidence that nobody should bother to treat your contributions with anything but derision. Willful ignorance can not be defended. (I'm sure Dragon will try, regardless.)

Since you admit everything you have to say on the subject is born of your deliberate failure to understand this discussion, you admit that you've just wasted everyone's time and nobody should bother to pay attention, save perhaps to point and laugh.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on February 03, 2013, 07:52:23 pm
Why should I educate myself?

What the hell, man. If you are going to state outright that you have no interest in forming a coherent and rational argument (which requires educating yourself about the issues involved), then you might as well declare "I AM THE NEXT LIBERATOR/KAZAN/TRASHMAN PLZ BAN NOW".

Who are you to demand such things of people?

Ah, you've got it completely backwards. You think you never had it. I'm saying you lost it. Arguably, long before this, but in this particular case, as I said, you were given the tools to understand why the Itano Circus is a deeply beloved part of the things Wings of Dawn pays tribute to, and hence why it will be a part of Wings of Dawn if at all possible.

You refused to use them. In so doing, you lost whatever claim to respect or politeness you previously had, by showing that you are uninterested in understanding the issues being discussed and that anything you have to say is uneducated white noise. That you don't understand why you should educate yourself on the issues being discussed if you wish to be taken seriously in the discussion is also pretty good evidence that nobody should bother to treat your contributions with anything but derision. Willful ignorance can not be defended. (I'm sure Dragon will try, regardless.)

Wrong. I am talking about the anime influence as a whole. I am not completely uninterested either. Without knowing, I get to look at Wings of Dawn just as Wings of Dawn, and nothing else. No standards or expectations to meet. I watched two animes due to Wings of Dawn (see the soundtrack thread I made). I've also googled a multitude of new words due to the threads on here.

Look, I understand what it is paying tribute to, sort of anyway. I watched the video between all this. I've always known it is anime influenced. But what I care about most is what Wings of Dawn itself is. Not where the creator got their motivations from. The bottom line, Spoon's stuff is original. He was influenced by other sources, but aren't we all? I don't need an understanding of anime or even Star Control 2 or anything to understand Spoon's World.

If I am to be educated on these issues, I'd rather let WoD do it for me, by making me want to learn about them, as it did in the Soundtrack Thread. And those words I was curious about. No one told me to do any of that, and I enjoyed watching both animes. Not to meet your standards, which you insist I must meet, while simultaneously brushing aside my standards on how you should treat people. So why should I do what you want me to do, when you refuse to do what I want you to do?

So what terrible thing did I do to lose the right to the basic respect you give to a stranger?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Droid803 on February 03, 2013, 08:17:05 pm
You don't like missile spam.
The rest of us like missile spam [because we understand the trope from which it comes from].
Spoon likes missile spam too - he specifically requested that Swifty add it in to FSO.
Therefore, WoD will have missile spam.

I don't get what's the argument here. If you're really a fan of just WoD and nothing else then at least you should have faith that Spoon is capable of making missile spam fun. If you're not even going to give him the benefit of doubt, nobody is forcing you to follow the development or to play the mod. Seeing as you don't seem interested in putting in the basic time and effort to understand why most of us like what we're seeing, you're not going to convince anyone so you might as well just shut up and leave.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on February 03, 2013, 08:43:41 pm
You don't like missile spam.
The rest of us like missile spam [because we understand the trope from which it comes from].
Spoon likes missile spam too - he specifically requested that Swifty add it in to FSO.
Therefore, WoD will have missile spam.

I don't get what's the argument here. If you're really a fan of just WoD and nothing else then at least you should have faith that Spoon is capable of making missile spam fun. If you're not even going to give him the benefit of doubt, nobody is forcing you to follow the development or to play the mod. Seeing as you don't seem interested in putting in the basic time and effort to understand why most of us like what we're seeing, you're not going to convince anyone so you might as well just shut up and leave.

I don't know what fairly tale land you and dragon come from, but where I come from respect is earned, and you start that by not being a willfully ignorant asshat. Your respect from me as a stranger was lost the moment you said

Quote
Why should I educate myself? ... I also quite like not knowing in a way. I feel it will enhance the experience.

Because that pretty much invalidates absolutely every argument you have, and will ever make.

Actually, I do have faith in Spoon. But I have just as much right to voice my opinion as anyone else.

Again, why should I? I watched the video. It doesn't do anything for me. I don't think it's bad, not at all, but it's nothing more than two or three steps up from meh to me.

I don't think you understand what I mean by that. It's not as if I didn't watch the video. And I looked up Itano Circus as well btw. I would recommend viewing what I have said in the soundtrack thread, it sheds some light on my feelings towards this. This is not wilful ignorance, I have as much contempt for wilful ignorance as anyone.

I have thought of you before you arrived. You are the third person. You're a bit different though. NGTM-1R is insulting. Battuta is condescending. And you are doubting and assuming in a negative way. So what, am I going to get treated worse than before by you as well now?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Droid803 on February 03, 2013, 09:01:23 pm
I don't know man. The whole "this is horrible it's going to be unfun and ruin all skill required in WoD" vibe I get from your posts is quite "doubting and assuming in a negative way", at least as much as I am.

Not everything has to deliver rich and meaningful gameplay. If it does, great! If it doesn't well, so as long as it's visually appealing and not all there is it's totally fine too. I play FSO for the visceral appeal of stuff exploding everywhere as much as I do for gameplay, or for story. At times perhaps more so. A bit of MICHAEL BAY never hurt anyone (except whoever exploded I guess), it's just eyecandy, enjoy the fireworks a bit, man! (or if you can't, can you at least let the rest of us enjoy it?)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dark Hunter on February 03, 2013, 09:05:40 pm
I think everyone needs to take a few chill pills around here. This is one of the silliest and most pointless arguments I've seen on this site.

Lorric doesn't particularly like missile spam. Fine. He's entitled to his own opinion. Whether he is correct in his opinion that this will be to the detriment of the gameplay remains to be seen because the mod is not playable yet.

NGTM-1R shows an example of why missile spam is a long-standing legacy of anime works, and Lorric isn't convinced. For some reason, NGTM-1R is personally insulted by this.

That's all I see going on here. I request that both of you knock it off and let this thread get back to discussing an awesome mod. I love Macross and epic missile spam as much as the next mecha otaku, but this argument isn't going anywhere.

(And just so we're clear, this is aimed at BOTH of you, Lorric and NGTM-1R, equally.)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: NGTM-1R on February 03, 2013, 09:09:45 pm
So you completely missed the part where Lorric admits he has no interest in actually having a reasoned discussion and he's trolling. Got it!

Seriously, he's said openly he has no interest in learning about anything he's talking about and that he sees no reason he should ever have to, and you're going to blame me for reacting to him as a troll? He's said he's a troll and he's wasting everyone's time. He's said he doesn't understand what's going on and doesn't want to understand what's going on.

Lorric admits freely all he's done is **** up the thread pointlessly.

And you're going to blame me when he was doing it long before I got here.

Get the **** out.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on February 03, 2013, 09:11:05 pm
I don't know man. The whole "this is horrible it's going to be unfun and ruin all skill required in WoD" vibe I get from your posts is quite "doubting and assuming in a negative way", at least as much as I am.

Hmm, that's interesting, you agree with my assessment of you, I'm quite surprised, even though it's true and obvious.

I was referring to what is in Spoon's video only. I don't know if you've read the whole escalation of the thread, but I've showed I'm quite open to the concept of masses of missiles being fired off in certain situations, and indeed like some instances of it in the current WoD.

In Spoon's vid, we've got Zy fighters getting taken out with one missile in which a huge number are being fired all locking on to seperate targets. That is hugely imbalanced. I made a suggestion on how it could still get into the game and be okay.

Ah, I see the second part of your message. In my review of WoD, I talk about how I marvel at how much explosive power can end up on the screen at once without everything just dying. If Spoon can keep that feel, I'll be loving every minute of it.

I think everyone needs to take a few chill pills around here. This is one of the silliest and most pointless arguments I've seen on this site.

Lorric doesn't particularly like missile spam. Fine. He's entitled to his own opinion. Whether he is correct in his opinion that this will be to the detriment of the gameplay remains to be seen because the mod is not playable yet.

NGTM-1R shows an example of why missile spam is a long-standing legacy of anime works, and Lorric isn't convinced. For some reason, NGTM-1R is personally insulted by this.

That's all I see going on here. I request that both of you knock it off and let this thread get back to discussing an awesome mod. I love Macross and epic missile spam as much as the next mecha otaku, but this argument isn't going anywhere.

(And just so we're clear, this is aimed at BOTH of you, Lorric and NGTM-1R, equally.)

I agree with your assessment. I was confused before, but I think you're right, he is offended for some reason that I'm not interested.

So you completely missed the part where Lorric admits he has no interest in actually having a reason discussion and he's trolling. Got it!

Seriously, he's said openly he has no interest in learning about anything he's talking about and that he sees no reason he should ever have to, and you're going to blame me for reacting to him as a troll? He's said he's a troll and he's wasting everyone's time.

I did not. It's your problem if you don't understand what I'm saying/believe me.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on February 03, 2013, 09:16:18 pm
Oh you've put more. But you couldn't be more wrong. Why would I troll the mod I love and am making a campaign for? I don't even know how you got to this.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Droid803 on February 03, 2013, 09:19:45 pm
That is hugely imbalanced. I made a suggestion on how it could still get into the game and be okay.

How can you tell it is hugely imbalanced without understanding the context? You even give a suggestion as to how to balance (which, ironically, is based on context), but in doing so you're already assuming a context from a tech demonstration? By doing that you clearly are doubting Spoon's ability to balance despite your declaration of the opposite...

I do not believe you are in a position to make either statement. Your panic is premature.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: NGTM-1R on February 03, 2013, 09:22:24 pm
I did not. It's your problem if you don't understand what I'm saying/believe me.

Quote
Why should I educate myself?

I'm not surprised you don't understand what it means when you say that, despite having two separate people explain it to you. Perhaps you should ponder why this comment reduces everything you say to a waste of everyone's time and pure trolling, and return to this thread when you understand why.

Indeed, it would probably do you good to consider your wording far more carefully, and if you cannot understand why that is (and why it is constantly getting you in trouble with me/Droid/Sparda/basically everyone), you should probably stop talking until you can. Rather than repeatedly making a fool of yourself on scale seldom seen here.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on February 03, 2013, 09:33:22 pm
That is hugely imbalanced. I made a suggestion on how it could still get into the game and be okay.

How can you tell it is hugely imbalanced without understanding the context? You even give a suggestion as to how to balance (which, ironically, is based on context), but in doing so you're already assuming a context from a tech demonstration? By doing that you clearly are doubting Spoon despite your declaration of the opposite...

I do not believe you are in a position to make either statement.

I don't mean purely in terms of level balance. Throw in enough enemies, and it would be a balanced mission.

The Terrans have nowhere near that power. It reduces the Zy from a great, spacefaring race to fodder.

Now sure, maybe they have the weapon too. But then Spoon's armour system and ship tactics and diversity all go up in smoke. Remember, we already have a WoD1. It's not as if we have nothing to go on. The same ships will still be used. The same universe.

It doesn't have to be black and white. I can have faith in Spoon to make it work, yet still question what I see.

I did not. It's your problem if you don't understand what I'm saying/believe me.

Quote
Why should I educate myself?

I'm not surprised you don't understand what it means when you say that, despite having two separate people explain it to you. Perhaps you should ponder why this comment reduces everything you say to a waste of everyone's time and pure trolling, and return to this thread when you understand why.

Indeed, it would probably do you good to consider your wording far more carefully, and if you cannot understand why that is (and why it is constantly getting you in trouble with me/Droid/Sparda/basically everyone), you should probably stop talking until you can. Rather than repeatedly making a fool of yourself on scale seldom seen here.

There is no everyone. You're doing it again, like you did when you spoke for everyone about wanting missile spam in the game.

You are the one if anyone who looks a fool now. Raging like an idiot. Lashing out at people. You took that line and applied it to me as if it applies to everything I do, when I was merely applying it to this one instance. And using it for clarity, rather than asking "Why should I do what you tell me to do?" Yes, tell, not ask.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Droid803 on February 03, 2013, 09:52:26 pm
That is hugely imbalanced. I made a suggestion on how it could still get into the game and be okay.

How can you tell it is hugely imbalanced without understanding the context? You even give a suggestion as to how to balance (which, ironically, is based on context), but in doing so you're already assuming a context from a tech demonstration? By doing that you clearly are doubting Spoon despite your declaration of the opposite...

I do not believe you are in a position to make either statement.

I don't mean purely in terms of level balance. Throw in enough enemies, and it would be a balanced mission.

The Terrans have nowhere near that power. It reduces the Zy from a great, spacefaring race to fodder.

Now sure, maybe they have the weapon too. But then Spoon's armour system and ship tactics and diversity all go up in smoke. Remember, we already have a WoD1. It's not as if we have nothing to go on. The same ships will still be used. The same universe.

>Implying anything shown in that video is representative of the universe.

You have no ****ing clue what a tech demo is, do you?

Let me spell it out for you:
You wouldn't be complaining if those were cargo pods, and if that was a Prometheus Frame launching the missiles, would you? The entire point of that was to show we can have multi-aspect lock. The exact details are irrelevant, we will have multi-aspect lock missiles in WoD, exact details subject to change without notice.

EDIT: I'm going to stay out of the trolling scuffle.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Legate Damar on February 03, 2013, 10:00:13 pm
ITT: People need to grow thicker skins.

Also, Lorric is going to HATE my mod...
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on February 03, 2013, 10:08:18 pm
That is hugely imbalanced. I made a suggestion on how it could still get into the game and be okay.

How can you tell it is hugely imbalanced without understanding the context? You even give a suggestion as to how to balance (which, ironically, is based on context), but in doing so you're already assuming a context from a tech demonstration? By doing that you clearly are doubting Spoon despite your declaration of the opposite...

I do not believe you are in a position to make either statement.

I don't mean purely in terms of level balance. Throw in enough enemies, and it would be a balanced mission.

The Terrans have nowhere near that power. It reduces the Zy from a great, spacefaring race to fodder.

Now sure, maybe they have the weapon too. But then Spoon's armour system and ship tactics and diversity all go up in smoke. Remember, we already have a WoD1. It's not as if we have nothing to go on. The same ships will still be used. The same universe.

>Implying anything shown in that video is representative of the universe.

You have no ****ing clue what a tech demo is, do you?

There is no everyone.

I present to you, exhibit A:

that was awesome.
Yus Plz.
Best. Ever.
Of All Time.
Of All Time.
indeed.

q.e.d.

I know what a tech demo is. This is all out of proportion. He just put it in the thread and I called it like I saw it.

As for the second part, yes they like it. But do they want it to become a main part of the game?

ITT: People need to grow thicker skins.

Also, Lorric is going to HATE my mod...

Scaly, Cardassian skin? No thanks  :lol:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Zacam on February 03, 2013, 10:18:57 pm
I'm going to go with Dark Hunter on this and write out a prescription for everybody to take 2 chill pills and call me in the morning.

If that doesn't work, I have other alternatives. Don't make me quote David Banner from the Incredible Hulk.

That being said, as an individual player of the WoD series, I think we should actually wait and see WHERE and HOW said Itano Circus gambit gets used. Once or twice, within the properly arrangement and context, would sell the feature rather well. And even if it's "All Itano, all the Time!" so what? If that's not your thing that won't change any current version that people are currently playing, and its not like it can't be updated/changed/refined or anything else even post-release. I think Spoon is -highly- aware of his universe and where he wants to put whatever he feels like. Whether or not anybody else happens to agree with it is irrelevant. It will either be your cup of tea and you'll drink it, or it wont be and you can say "Thanks anyway".

In short, while I can understand the 'concern' to some extent (I wouldn't be a big fan of "All Itano, all the Time" campaign) it seems obvious to me that IF such a campaign occurred, I have the option of simply not playing it. Doesn't mean I can't still praise it or the work that went into it and provide constructive criticism that is focused on understanding that such a display is said campaigns primary principle for existence. But the real factor here is that: It's a feature for a function that we haven't even seen how it will be employed yet, so save the concerns and the worries about 'balance' until such a time as IT actually becomes present, if it even manifests at all as being an issue.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Legate Damar on February 03, 2013, 10:28:05 pm
Scaly, Cardassian skin? No thanks  :lol:

You should consider it, it would be a significant improvement
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on February 03, 2013, 10:31:58 pm
I'm going to go with Dark Hunter on this and write out a prescription for everybody to take 2 chill pills and call me in the morning.

If that doesn't work, I have other alternatives. Don't make me quote David Banner from the Incredible Hulk.

That being said, as an individual player of the WoD series, I think we should actually wait and see WHERE and HOW said Itano Circus gambit gets used. Once or twice, within the properly arrangement and context, would sell the feature rather well. And even if it's "All Itano, all the Time!" so what? If that's not your thing that won't change any current version that people are currently playing, and its not like it can't be updated/changed/refined or anything else even post-release. I think Spoon is -highly- aware of his universe and where he wants to put whatever he feels like. Whether or not anybody else happens to agree with it is irrelevant. It will either be your cup of tea and you'll drink it, or it wont be and you can say "Thanks anyway".

In short, while I can understand the 'concern' to some extent (I wouldn't be a big fan of "All Itano, all the Time" campaign) it seems obvious to me that IF such a campaign occurred, I have the option of simply not playing it. Doesn't mean I can't still praise it or the work that went into it and provide constructive criticism that is focused on understanding that such a display is said campaigns primary principle for existence. But the real factor here is that: It's a feature for a function that we haven't even seen how it will be employed yet, so save the concerns and the worries about 'balance' until such a time as IT actually becomes present, if it even manifests at all as being an issue.


Yes, I agree with every word of all of this.

Scaly, Cardassian skin? No thanks  :lol:

You should consider it, it would be a significant improvement

But everyone would stare at me...

Is there anything special about that skin, or are you just being Damar?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: SypheDMar on February 04, 2013, 11:26:42 am
I'm personally more interested in the maneuvers pulled in the video. If that's ever implemented...  :pimp:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: General Battuta on February 04, 2013, 11:38:20 am
Lorric man, everybody starts with the right to courtesy, respect, and consideration. You lost that right with your disruptive and occasionally creepy behavior and now you need to earn it back.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on February 04, 2013, 11:40:45 am
Lorric man, everybody starts with the right to courtesy, respect, and consideration. You lost that right with your disruptive and occasionally creepy behavior and now you need to earn it back.

Oh come on, you can't hold Yaiceca against me now, that's ancient history and it's over. Others laugh and joke about that now or have moved on.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on February 04, 2013, 01:37:25 pm
How can you tell it is hugely imbalanced without understanding the context? You even give a suggestion as to how to balance (which, ironically, is based on context), but in doing so you're already assuming a context from a tech demonstration? By doing that you clearly are doubting Spoon's ability to balance despite your declaration of the opposite...

I do not believe you are in a position to make either statement. Your panic is premature.
This is very true.
The video is to demonstrate the awesomeness of the new feature that Swifty made with very souped up missiles.
For example it also shows manual locking (as in, you need to hold the secondary trigger to aquire a lock on) and lock resetting (lock gets released after firing) aside from 'just' multi locking.
It's not a 'gameplay demonstration'

I daresay because I don't suffer fools gladly and you are eager to play the fool.

This sort of thing shaped the conceptions of a generation on how air/space combat should be portrayed. Wings of Dawn is a product of, and for, those of that generation. The first release included pseudo-Itano weapons, the first of which was a direct reference to this sort of thing (Remember Dawn's loadout with the IT-AN-0?), and it's been stated before that Spoon was doing the best he could with the engine at that time. If you haven't realized yet that this is one of the most cherished anime space/aerial combat tropes in existence, and its appearance in Wings of Dawn is not only inevitable but something that nearly everyone who enjoyed this mod would want, then you're dumber than a brick.

I'd also point out I've actually played good games that feature mechanics like this; Battlecry comes to mind.

EDIT: I mean, jesus, I was able to link you nearly 20 minutes of compiled Itano Circus scenes stretching across something close to thirty years of anime, almost NONE of which involve people getting taken out like punks . (Otherwise we'd have forty minutes from Macross alone.) This is deeply embedded. The fact you didn't pick up on the significance of that does not speak well of you.
This is (bolded part) also very true.

In short, this was a silly discussion.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on February 04, 2013, 02:17:43 pm
This is good to hear. The secondary hold down is interesting. On release, do you get one missile per target, or a set salvo, so you could potentially fire the lot at one target?

I'm glad you didn't bold the last 6 words of that paragraph :D
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Legate Damar on February 04, 2013, 04:55:03 pm
Lorric man, everybody starts with the right to courtesy, respect, and consideration. You lost that right with your disruptive and occasionally creepy behavior and now you need to earn it back.

Oh come on, you can't hold Yaiceca against me now, that's ancient history and it's over. Others laugh and joke about that now or have moved on.

You will never stop being made fun of for that. Ever. Deal with it. :drevil:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Flak on February 04, 2013, 09:24:08 pm
If the missiles move like that, my only concern is how is that possible without them crashing into each other. At least the Zy missiles moves in a straight line and not doing some acrobatic spins.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: SpardaSon21 on February 04, 2013, 09:26:45 pm
The missiles all talk to each other and trade flight plan and trajectory data so they can maneuver to avoid impacting with each other.
/entirelyplausibletechnobabble
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: General Battuta on February 04, 2013, 09:29:15 pm
Some Russian missiles IRL are (at least purportedly) able to do that.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: NGTM-1R on February 04, 2013, 09:32:07 pm
If the missiles move like that, my only concern is how is that possible without them crashing into each other. At least the Zy missiles moves in a straight line and not doing some acrobatic spins.

Pre-launch course alterations to lock them into non-interfering paths until they've spread out would be enough.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: An4ximandros on February 04, 2013, 09:35:04 pm
 WoD is an Anime tribute, so Forget The Logic. Mechanime is about giant mechaplanes firing shiddons of missiles and shidhe getting blown up by said missiles, they are not meant to make sense, it's "cool."

 But for the love of Wod, do not make a technowatsis field nonsebable explanation about it! Just have Crystal say: "Magitech, I don't have to explain ****" It is far more amusing! ...and would probably make more sense anyway. :p
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: SpardaSon21 on February 04, 2013, 09:51:44 pm
Some Russian missiles IRL are (at least purportedly) able to do that.
Hey, if the Russians can do it, we can do it, and then the LSF can certainly do it!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Legate Damar on February 04, 2013, 10:10:32 pm
WoD is an Anime tribute, so Forget The Logic. Mechanime is about giant mechaplanes firing shiddons of missiles and shidhe getting blown up by said missiles, they are not meant to make sense, it's "cool."

 But for the love of Wod, do not make a technowatsis field nonsebable explanation about it! Just have Crystal say: "Magitech, I don't have to explain ****" It is far more amusing! ...and would probably make more sense anyway. :p

There's a technical term for that kind of thing.

It's called "bad writing".
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: General Battuta on February 04, 2013, 10:11:44 pm
The technical term is 'much better writing than Star Trek's approach' dear
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: NGTM-1R on February 04, 2013, 10:41:55 pm
they are not meant to make sense

I hate to tell you this but by simply animating the missile launch they are actually forced to make sense, even if we have multiple possible reasons why.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: An4ximandros on February 04, 2013, 10:59:17 pm
Not Scientifically/Economically/etc. is what I meant.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on February 05, 2013, 03:58:29 am
I have a few questions regarding that missile mechanic:

-Once you pressed down the missile trigger, are the missiles going to launch for sure, or is there some way to cancel the launch?
-How is the number of missiles determined?
I can see two ways for this. One being a fixed number of missiles per target (in which case the max number of targets would be limited by the salvo size). If you lock only a single target, you fire only a single missile (or however many).
The other would the, that the salvo always fires a set amount (like Hornets and Tornados for example). In this case, do they spread among the targets evenly, or are some missiles fired unguided because they couldn't get assigned to a target?
-Either way, what will the double-fire mode do? Double the amount of missiles fired at each aquired target, or double the number of aquirable targets?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on February 05, 2013, 06:40:29 am
I have a few questions regarding that missile mechanic:

-Once you pressed down the missile trigger, are the missiles going to launch for sure, or is there some way to cancel the launch?
If you lose missile lock you can release the secondary trigger safely. Missile will only be fired if you release when you have at least one steady lock on.

-How is the number of missiles determined?
I can see two ways for this. One being a fixed number of missiles per target (in which case the max number of targets would be limited by the salvo size). If you lock only a single target, you fire only a single missile (or however many).
The other would the, that the salvo always fires a set amount (like Hornets and Tornados for example). In this case, do they spread among the targets evenly, or are some missiles fired unguided because they couldn't get assigned to a target?
I guess I can most easily answer this by just showing Swifty's documentation: https://docs.google.com/document/d/10Ii3cUywwl7btBTG31jsssEAvoPl2EnYkNbOtRxmePs/edit
I havent tested every possibility yet but so far I don't think its possible for a missile to go unguided due to it not having a target.
(next on my test list is using $Substitute: with this :p )

-Either way, what will the double-fire mode do? Double the amount of missiles fired at each aquired target, or double the number of aquirable targets?
Double the amount fired at each aquired target.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Flak on February 05, 2013, 07:20:39 am
Reminds me, it probably make sense if the missiles carry no warhead, just an AP penetrator for instance, like real life Patriot missiles. They much less likely to blow up if they knock into each other that way.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Legate Damar on February 05, 2013, 09:59:03 am
The technical term is 'much better writing than Star Trek's approach' dear

http://forums.comicbookresources.com/showthread.php?338207-Linkara-finally-tells-Joe-Quesada-off&p=11853163&viewfull=1#post11853163
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: General Battuta on February 05, 2013, 10:13:41 am
The technical term is 'much better writing than Star Trek's approach' dear

http://forums.comicbookresources.com/showthread.php?338207-Linkara-finally-tells-Joe-Quesada-off&p=11853163&viewfull=1#post11853163

Thanks for this link to some random post in an unreadably bad forum
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Legate Damar on February 05, 2013, 10:31:24 am
I was simply pointing out that this is the same excuse used to justify one of the worst examples of Terran fiction I have ever encountered: The Singular Additional Day of The-Man-Who-Is-A-Spider.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: General Battuta on February 05, 2013, 10:33:15 am
Whether or not you explain how magic works has nothing to do with how terrible One More Day was.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Legate Damar on February 05, 2013, 10:35:50 am
If they had bothered thinking about it, they would have likely realized that the whole thing made no sense and was a bad idea to begin with.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Phantom Hoover on February 05, 2013, 11:55:43 am
meanwhile in star trek they would've said it was all a result of marmiton particles decorroborating the phase coinverters
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Legate Damar on February 05, 2013, 12:15:36 pm
All I know is that when I make weapons, I'm going to explain exactly how all of them work.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: General Battuta on February 05, 2013, 01:28:52 pm
All I know is that when I make weapons, I'm going to explain exactly how all of them work.

No you won't. You will be completely unable to do this - there will be whole swathes of resolution inaccessible to you because you don't understand physics or engineering or any other domain of science or behavior well enough to describe something that fundamentally isn't real. This is true of any fictional enterprise

What you will do if you're wise, what projects like Blue Planet and Wings of Dawn do, is create an internally consistent set of rules and play by it, allowing enough flex to deal with inevitable inconsistencies while still allowing players to understand the general terms by which the technology operates. Rather than attempting to explain everything in exhaustive detail, you paint enough of a picture to let the reader fill in the rest of the gaps herself, avoiding both the sense of an acausal universe and the paralytic and ultimately self-destructive information overload of David Weberesque technobabble.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: SpardaSon21 on February 05, 2013, 02:15:23 pm
Yes, and the internally consistent rules of Wings of Dawn are very anime inspired, which is why we get massive missile swarms, arrogant and advanced space elves, a fighter squadron that's heavily majority female, and most likely a Reverse Harem flag staff for Crystal.  No doubt the actual captain of the Guardian Angel is male with an all-female bridge crew, though. :drevil:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: yuezhi on February 05, 2013, 04:37:18 pm
after watching the first gundam series, something came to mind. shouldn't ships particularly the aestival bleed leak red stuff when they're injured damaged? :P
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dragon on February 05, 2013, 07:43:49 pm
Maybe they should, but you can't do that on this engine anyway. :)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dark Hunter on February 05, 2013, 08:01:35 pm
Couldn't you replace the "damage fire" animations to accomplish that effect?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Jellyfish on February 05, 2013, 10:51:28 pm
Why would an Aestival bleed? They aren't biological.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: An4ximandros on February 05, 2013, 11:01:38 pm
You could pretend it's the pilot or something, but they ain't got no time to bleed.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: yuezhi on February 05, 2013, 11:11:09 pm
correction. it was not gundam but some mecha anime with emphasis on swords. forgot what it was called but every time a robot lost a limb what followed was a fountain of fluid accompanied by a spraying sound.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dragon on February 06, 2013, 03:12:27 am
Couldn't you replace the "damage fire" animations to accomplish that effect?
You couldn't, unless you did that on all ships. There's no table option for doing that. It'd be great to see that sort of thing at least for Cordi ships, but unless somebody implements that, it's impossible.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on February 06, 2013, 03:17:46 am
correction. it was not gundam but some mecha anime with emphasis on swords. forgot what it was called but every time a robot lost a limb what followed was a fountain of fluid accompanied by a spraying sound.
That sounds like Neon Genesis Evangelion to me (did those mecha have cables connecting them to the base?), but in that series the mecha were not actual robots, but a bio-organic construct that's esentially a cloned alien, implanted with technology to enable Humans to controll them. But beneath the robot-looking armor they are actual living beings, including some form of consiousness, so the red fluid actually is blood.

In some Gundam series (though not the first one) you occasionally (or rather very seldomly) see some fluids leeking from damaged or destoyed mobile suits, but it's obviously not blood, but rather some lubricant or hydraulic fluid. The Banshee destroying the Delta plus in Gundam Unicorn episode 5 comes to mind here.

Either way, the only ships were it would make some sense if they bled instead of burning would be the Cordi ships, since they at least look semi-organic.
If race specific damage animations are ever going to be possible it would be a nice touch. Cordi bleeding, Nordera belching ridiculous amounts of smoke, Fura'ngle leaving a trail of small crystals...
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: NGTM-1R on February 06, 2013, 03:56:41 am
You couldn't, unless you did that on all ships.

TBP had Shadow ships bleed once upon a time. They might still. I believe this is incorrect.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: yuezhi on February 06, 2013, 12:46:05 pm
correction. it was not gundam but some mecha anime with emphasis on swords. forgot what it was called but every time a robot lost a limb what followed was a fountain of fluid accompanied by a spraying sound.
That sounds like Neon Genesis Evangelion to me (did those mecha have cables connecting them to the base?), but in that series the mecha were not actual robots, but a bio-organic construct that's esentially a cloned alien, implanted with technology to enable Humans to controll them. But beneath the robot-looking armor they are actual living beings, including some form of consiousness, so the red fluid actually is blood.

In some Gundam series (though not the first one) you occasionally (or rather very seldomly) see some fluids leeking from damaged or destoyed mobile suits, but it's obviously not blood, but rather some lubricant or hydraulic fluid. The Banshee destroying the Delta plus in Gundam Unicorn episode 5 comes to mind here.

Either way, the only ships were it would make some sense if they bled instead of burning would be the Cordi ships, since they at least look semi-organic.
If race specific damage animations are ever going to be possible it would be a nice touch. Cordi bleeding, Nordera belching ridiculous amounts of smoke, Fura'ngle leaving a trail of small crystals...
thank you. That's exactly what I was looking for. I guess we can forgot about SFX for the aestival since the bleeding isn't as frequent as I thought.
For the record I didn't say it was blood. I'm just making a comparison.

On another note I just noticed my custom title :blah:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: SypheDMar on February 13, 2013, 01:05:47 pm
I thought you were looking for Escaflowne originally, but yeah. Fluids!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: yuezhi on February 13, 2013, 01:21:40 pm
I thought you were looking for Escaflowne originally, but yeah. Fluids!
looked up Escaflowne and wow. it's been ages sine i saw that show.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on April 25, 2013, 05:30:45 pm
It's been a while.
So what do I have to tell/show? Not a whole lot!
It's the unforunate consequence of doing nothing but playing 'Derek's smart spreadsheet commander*' as I've mockingly started calling it. Doing nothing but weapon&ship balance and adding them to .tbl's. It's not a terrible exciting job and it involves far more math then I'm usually comfortable with. But progress is being made, there's just nothing to show for it yet. Getting this done and right will put down a strong foundation which will allow me to make the gameplay all the better.




To breakup someone of that monotone work I've started some redesigning of characters:

(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/Forumpost_zpsdf19ac65.png)

Slightly different from the old design (hair will still be blue, dont worry :p ).
Like or Dislike this new direction? Feel free to let me know.




*Not actually made by Derek Smart, nor is it a real thing.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on April 25, 2013, 05:43:44 pm
Hi Spoon  :)

"Couldn't help but think would Dekker approve." That was my first thought before I even read that line.

She doesn't really look different. Which is good because I probably wouldn't like you changing the established character designs too much. I suppose you'd have to colour her in for me to see properly. Changing the eye colour is no biggie, but I wouldn't go wild with unnatural colours. You've got the Cyrvans to crazy on with that, I presume Luna will be getting a design.

I always thought Dawn had green eyes, but it's just the shine from that thing in her hand in the picture with her stats. So I thought she was green eyed, then you tell me brown, now changing maybe to blue/purple. So it's not going to make any difference to me really what her eye colour is now at this point!  :lol:

I'm not sure what to make of that ship. Is it supposed to be the new Prometheus Frame?

You just keep plugging away at the math, I know game balance was a big deal, maybe the biggest deal to you in this project.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: An4ximandros on April 25, 2013, 05:52:18 pm
 Ðat texture. (http://www.abridgedforums.com/images/smilies/abf/datass.gif)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Jellyfish on April 25, 2013, 07:31:41 pm
Blue hair with blue eyes? Can work, I guess. It's the merge and all.
Perhaps if her eyes were a bit more purplish.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on April 25, 2013, 07:33:22 pm
I could still recognize that this is Dawn, so I would say things are going in the right direction.

And the ship, whether this is the Prometheus Frame remade or not, looks great.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Flak on April 27, 2013, 10:29:04 am
It's been a while was it. I wonder what else is updated.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Mr_Blastman on July 07, 2013, 12:08:34 pm
Moar updates?  Spoon, I must admit you spoiled us with WoD.  Normal Freespace just isn't... well, the same anymore.  It is hard to go back after feasting upon all this.  What have you lately to whet our appetites?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on July 07, 2013, 04:12:57 pm
Moar updates?  Spoon, I must admit you spoiled us with WoD.  Normal Freespace just isn't... well, the same anymore.  It is hard to go back after feasting upon all this.  What have you lately to whet our appetites?
Not too much that is showable unfortunately. Such is the nature of working on tables.
Most recent thing I've done is a returret on this ship that Andrewofdoom made for Dimensional eclipse, but it'll make a showing in WoD too.

pew pew beams.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Rodo on July 07, 2013, 08:20:58 pm
oww nous, it's a nightmare for any fs player: AAA's by the thousands!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: An4ximandros on July 07, 2013, 08:28:19 pm
AAA, Stayin' Alive, Stayin' Alive! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=I_izvAbhExY#t=42s) :D
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Rodo on July 07, 2013, 09:53:15 pm
damn you, now I'll have nightmares about this song making an appearance on the next jad.
btw, wow on the background spoon :yes:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dark Hunter on July 07, 2013, 10:00:15 pm
damn you, now I'll have nightmares about this song making an appearance on the next jad.

Song was in JAD 3.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Flak on July 07, 2013, 10:35:32 pm
More Dakka + More Pewpew + More Itano Circus
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Veers on July 08, 2013, 12:56:44 am
Loving it Spoon, loving it.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on July 09, 2013, 03:54:15 am
Those short duriation beams firing in sequence remind me of Sins of a Solar Empire, if you replace the blob lasers with laser-beams on the Advent ships.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Jellyfish on July 09, 2013, 04:35:25 am
Dude are you trying to outbeam Inferno? Because I'm loving what I see.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on July 09, 2013, 07:49:50 am
btw, wow on the background spoon :yes:
Background straight out of strike suit zero. Though they do some neat magic to animate their skyboxes that I can't replicate.

Dude are you trying to outbeam Inferno? Because I'm loving what I see.
Somebody tell Inferno that their beam reign has ended! Mwa ha ha.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on July 09, 2013, 09:57:11 am
Dude are you trying to outbeam Inferno? Because I'm loving what I see.
I take it you havn't seen a Cyrvan strikeforce in action yet.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0I4r6Ve5QH4&feature=youtu.be
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uAADyaAa6DM
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: AndrewofDoom on July 09, 2013, 10:13:59 am
Inferno still have more bigger beams though.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Torchwood on July 09, 2013, 10:40:12 am
That means you've got to up the ante! Aleyurian superbeams for great justice!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Piemanlives on July 17, 2013, 05:31:18 am
Beams bigger then the ship its self!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on July 17, 2013, 10:02:38 am
Looks stupid.

Just put a BFGreen or BFRed on a transporter in FRED and  see for yourself.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: yuezhi on July 17, 2013, 11:02:42 am
I think we can jury rig an ursa
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on January 29, 2014, 12:47:09 pm
Impractical weapons

Some times weapons look neat on paper but turn out to be highly impractical in actual gameplay. One such weapon is the CSA Emerald Splinter.
This secondary weapon is a single missile that before it reaches its target explodes in a torrent of laser fire spread in a cone. A shotgun in a missile so to say. The first objectives of this weapon were to:
1. Look cool
2. Provide a BP-esque slammer style weapon in function. (Anti fighter/bomber wing formation)

However, it soon proved to be too ineffective at taking down a whole wing, after all, laser bolts dont track or explode! So the purpose was changed to be a short range missile with big damage instead. Buuut this didnt really work out either because missile in close range in freespace have a large tendency to just completely miss. So the missile was changed to a medium range head on type of missile instead. But the damage remained inconsistent to a fault. Even tightening the cone did not do much to alleviate the problem. On paper the maximum damage this missile could do should be enough to one shot kill the weakest of Nordera fighters. However ingame the damage ranged from 10-40% hull damage. An unacceptable low amount. Most of the damage was just wasted into the vastness of space and tightening the cone even more would nullify the flavor of the missile.
So I was once again considering of upping its damage value, but then it struck me. What would happen if this missile strikes something that is larger and can actually do its full damage consistently. Targets like capitalships.

A short test later revealed that this weapon was now outperforming almost every dedicated anti capital ship secondary out there! Woops.

(http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/22/pcy3.png)

And as such I've made the hard decision to let the Emerald Splinter go. I'm sorry man, it just wasn't working out between us.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on January 29, 2014, 01:02:05 pm
Damn the Cyrvans and their overpowered weapons! :lol:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dragon on January 29, 2014, 02:56:01 pm
Yeah, that's the usual problem with scatter weapons. Have you thought of deploying this as an anti-ship weapon? :) It'd be rather cool, don't you think? Just think of potential, a weapon that could de-fang a capship in one shot and heavily damage it. Of course, it'd have to be quite bulky to balance out it's power, too.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: General Battuta on January 29, 2014, 03:08:18 pm
He did, check the end of the post.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: AdmiralRalwood on January 29, 2014, 03:57:51 pm
Shades of Honorverse laserheads...
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dragon on January 29, 2014, 05:42:21 pm
He did, check the end of the post.
No, at the end of the post there's just a realization similar to what we had with Slammer - that capship damage is excessive, especially for a rather poor anti-fighter weapon. What I'm suggesting is balancing it for good capship damage, without bothering with anti-fighter aspect at all. That would be quite novel, actually.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: General Battuta on January 29, 2014, 05:50:43 pm
Oh, I gotcha. Yeah, I think that'd be rather cool. We're testing out something similar in BP, though most of the submunitions released are decoys.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: yuezhi on January 29, 2014, 08:59:42 pm
Is this kind of weapon common in anime?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: General Battuta on January 29, 2014, 09:07:14 pm
It's common in real life - many air to air missiles release steel rods (instead of laser beams) when they detonate.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Flak on January 29, 2014, 09:27:17 pm
It is actually more common for MLRS and cluster missiles in real life. It is made like that just to increase the blast radius. Of course it is usually dumb submunitions like Infyrno. Homing submunitions probably is still awesome but impractical.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on January 29, 2014, 09:33:59 pm
after all, laser bolts dont track
Tell that to the Fura'ngle! :pimp:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Flak on January 29, 2014, 10:41:47 pm
Technically, laser moves at the speed of light. It don't need tracking at all. All the Fura'ngle need is aimbot attached to them.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: FrikgFeek on January 30, 2014, 06:11:48 am
Yeah, well, real life weapon designers don't have to worry about balance. If someone were to construct a weapon that's good at taking out fighters and great at punching ship hulls they wouldn't have to worry about it invalidating other weapons that have been previously designed or being generally overpowered and giving 1 side a huge advantage(That's actually the point of designing new weapons).

P.S. I'm not very learned in FSO design, but wouldn't it be possible to make the missile do increased damage within a more narrow cone and have secondary projectiles doing less damage in a wider cone?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Enioch on January 30, 2014, 07:27:01 am
Uh...Spoon? Armor.tbl. Just make the gun do less damage to capital ship armor/increased damage to strikecraft.

*Super-enioch flies away*
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Flak on January 30, 2014, 08:09:40 am
It is still pretty 'realistic' by the way, though that don't look like laser at all, it look more like shards of superheated plasma.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: General Battuta on January 30, 2014, 08:24:23 am
Uh...Spoon? Armor.tbl. Just make the gun do less damage to capital ship armor/increased damage to strikecraft.

*Super-enioch flies away*

Yeah, this is how the Slammer works, but given that Spoon is a master of armor.tbl he probably already considered this option.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dragon on January 30, 2014, 01:26:24 pm
Not to mention Slammer has homing. This weapon doesn't, rendering it near-useless against fighters, no matter it's power. It makes more sense to try it out as an anti-ship weapon, then it'd only need nerfing the damage.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Droid803 on January 30, 2014, 01:42:08 pm
So I was once again considering of upping its damage value, but then it struck me. What would happen if this missile strikes something that is larger and can actually do its full damage consistently. Targets like capitalships.

A short test later revealed that this weapon was now outperforming almost every dedicated anti capital ship secondary out there! Woops.

There are so many solutions to this:
1) It's an anticapital weapon. "Working as intended"
2) Armor.tbl
3) Some combination of the above

TBH I'm a fan of the first option. Could always go the other way and make it worse against fighters, even.
SpaceShotGun is cooool don't kill it D:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dragon on January 30, 2014, 02:17:40 pm
Yeah. :) It's flashy, it spams lasers, and is not afraid of anything. :) Not to mention anti-cap spawners were always some variation on MIRV concept, never something like that.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on January 30, 2014, 03:39:08 pm
Uh...Spoon? Armor.tbl. Just make the gun do less damage to capital ship armor/increased damage to strikecraft.

*Super-enioch flies away*

Yeah, this is how the Slammer works, but given that Spoon is a master of armor.tbl he probably already considered this option.
That'll be a cool title to have, MASTER OF ARMOR.TBL :flex:
I'm going to end all my emails with this:

Hello,

Blablabla

Kind regards,
Spoon, MASTER OF ARMOR.TBL

Yeah, well, real life weapon designers don't have to worry about balance. If someone were to construct a weapon that's good at taking out fighters and great at punching ship hulls they wouldn't have to worry about it invalidating other weapons that have been previously designed or being generally overpowered and giving 1 side a huge advantage(That's actually the point of designing new weapons).

P.S. I'm not very learned in FSO design, but wouldn't it be possible to make the missile do increased damage within a more narrow cone and have secondary projectiles doing less damage in a wider cone?
Good sir, this is actually a very interesting idea. I'm going to give that a try.
I'll report back on this.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dragon on January 30, 2014, 04:22:22 pm
Uh...Spoon? Armor.tbl. Just make the gun do less damage to capital ship armor/increased damage to strikecraft.

*Super-enioch flies away*

Yeah, this is how the Slammer works, but given that Spoon is a master of armor.tbl he probably already considered this option.
That'll be a cool title to have, MASTER OF ARMOR.TBL :flex:
I'm going to end all my emails with this:

Hello,

Blablabla

Kind regards,
Spoon, MASTER OF ARMOR.TBL
Someone get this man a custom title, quick! :)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Colonol Dekker on January 31, 2014, 06:02:58 am
 :nono:

First rule of custom title.

*asking for negates eligibility.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dragon on January 31, 2014, 02:34:57 pm
He didn't ask, I did. :) So it's allright, I think.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Colonol Dekker on January 31, 2014, 03:02:18 pm
Nooooooooooooooo.....
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on January 31, 2014, 05:11:37 pm
So I got thinking on what to do. When Emerald splinter walked in the room, proclaiming "I can change! Please let me stay!"
I looked up from my desk and frowned "We've been over this."
"Let me show you!"

(http://imageshack.com/a/img824/899/3qwb.png)
After the initial shotgun burst at the primary target, the Emerald splinter now releases 3 smaller clusters that each split out into 5 explosive clusters.

(http://imageshack.com/a/img855/8113/wr6z.png)
Resulting in a destructive large area of effect.

The missile is now doing both goals it originally had, dealing with formations and doing destructive damage on a single target.
"Fine, you can stay."



:nono:

First rule of custom title.

*asking for negates eligibility.
A dumb 'tradition' upheld by dull humorless admins.
Either way I wasn't asking for anything. Cause titles on HLP are dumb and pointless. Rarely clever and definitely not a 'reward'.

He didn't ask, I did. :) So it's allright, I think.
Last time people asked for a wizard title for valathil, karajorma went full childish mode 'beacuase you guys asked i will gief him dumb title instead hurrdurr'

Either way, not relevant to this thread. So shut up about it  :p
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: yuezhi on January 31, 2014, 05:28:48 pm
The master had spoken.

Spoon, could you make the lasers rainbow colored, nyan? :D
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on January 31, 2014, 05:40:47 pm
It's... possible...
But I don't think I'm mentally prepared to commit such an atrocity  :p
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on February 03, 2014, 05:02:57 am
Is there a way to reduce friendly fire damage in that weapon? It's hard enough to survive getting to close of an enemy on the receiving end of the currently released Cyrvan missiles, but this monster missile would probably make a dogfight alongside Cyrvans pure suicide.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: General Battuta on February 03, 2014, 08:35:10 am
Yeah that can be done via ARMOIRE.TBL
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: yuezhi on February 03, 2014, 06:02:10 pm
It's... possible...
But I don't think I'm mentally prepared to commit such an atrocity  :p
okay, for a start match Luna's eye color. ;)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: qwadtep on February 11, 2014, 01:21:42 am
Yeah that can be done via ARMOIRE.TBL
Armoire.tbl, for all your ablative space elf clothing needs.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: NGTM-1R on February 11, 2014, 07:21:12 am
Yeah that can be done via ARMOIRE.TBL

What unholy abomination of furniture is this?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on March 12, 2014, 10:48:29 am
Todays subject: Feature creep

Why isn't there a new WoD release yet, Spewn? The answer to that question is ever so simple, I'm spending a lot of time not making missions and adding things to my to-do list instead of doing the things already on the to-do list!
Time management, ha-ha, how does it work.

Doing the forum game videos revealed to me some very glaring issues with some ships. Putting a SF champion next to a CSA Ascension made me want to barf, the difference in visual quality was just too darn big. So one day I woke up and randomly decided to get to work on making the Champion look less rubbish:

(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/champions_zpsc282a4ae.png~original)
(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/champions2_zps1fe6248f.png~original)
(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/champions3_zps2dc1f461.png~original)

The things some new paint with uvmapping can do.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Phantom Hoover on March 12, 2014, 11:17:13 am
ship on the left looks absolutely amazing, ship on the right is probably let down a bit by that tiling — maybe break it up a bit along structural and textural lines?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: yuezhi on March 12, 2014, 11:36:09 am
スプーン!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on March 12, 2014, 12:02:56 pm
ship on the left looks absolutely amazing, ship on the right is probably let down a bit by that tiling — maybe break it up a bit along structural and textural lines?
Thanks!
And yes, the old Champion on the right is definitely a let down, that's why the new Champion on the left is replacing it  :p

スプーン!
(^v^)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on March 12, 2014, 03:16:16 pm
That looks badass. Are there plans to repurpose the original Champion or will it be removed completely?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Droid803 on March 12, 2014, 03:35:11 pm
such creature feep
much pretty
wow
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Flak on March 12, 2014, 08:55:26 pm
Remove some of the heavier guns and reuse the model for civilian ship? Or just use as it is, maybe with a little facelift and use it as a pirate/privateer ship.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on March 14, 2014, 08:00:13 pm
Hades told me to show off this fighter and who could possibly say no to Hades?
Based on a concept drawing done by Thaeris, 90% of the model done by Hades, touched up with some modifications and textures done by me.

The Dragonfly is a UGC second generation medium fighter, designed as a direct competitor to the Ray II.
(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/screen0284_zpsac4241e3.png~original)
(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/screen0282_zps15434fb2.png~original)
Sol force however choose the Ray II over the Dragonfly, due to the former having overal slightly better specs on paper (and a biased for a home produced design).
The Dragonfly is a affordable fighter and is still highly popular with mercenary forces due to its parts being cheap and readily available. It also served with the UGCR for a while but has been phased out with the introduction of the next generation of fighters.

In reaction to the Ray IIJS upgrade project, the Dragonfly EX upgrade kit was developed.
(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/screen0285_zps9e563e18.png~original)
(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/screen0286_zps8e2b011c.png~original)
Slightly increasing its structural strength, upgrading its shields with a smaller but more powerful generator, allowing for more secondaries to be loaded. As well as a adding two extra engine gunpods, doubling its firepower and making the craft more maneuverable. This kit can be fitted 'in the field' by any competent engineer.

Despite the SF not adopting the design, the Dragonfly has nonetheless turned out quite profitable for the UGC... as most of their ventures do.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Jellyfish on March 14, 2014, 08:05:55 pm
Looks like an interceptor. Razor thin profile.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: niffiwan on March 14, 2014, 09:53:53 pm
Despite the SF not adopting the design, the Dragonfly has nonetheless turned out quite profitable for the UGC... as most of their ventures do.

Huzzah for the UGCR :)

It's also a really neat looking fighter. Just one question though, is that a canopy at the front?  If so does that reflect a different design philosophy from the UGCR vs the Ray III which doesn't seem to feature an exposed cockpit?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: AndrewofDoom on March 15, 2014, 01:54:51 am
My name is Andrew, and as part of the UGCR, I say Praise Profit!

Though, I want to say I'm having trouble seeing the details of the ship due to the lighting settings.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on March 15, 2014, 08:53:54 am
Huzzah for the UGCR :)

It's also a really neat looking fighter. Just one question though, is that a canopy at the front?  If so does that reflect a different design philosophy from the UGCR vs the Ray III which doesn't seem to feature an exposed cockpit?
Indeed, the SF 3rd generation and onward fighters all feature an internal cockpit. While the 3rd generation UGC designed fighters still have an exposed one.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Droid803 on March 15, 2014, 01:13:17 pm
The exposed cockpit is a beneficial feature when you get hit by saturation emp!
With these, at least you won't have to revert all the way back to some dinky ass UEU Ray 1!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: niffiwan on March 15, 2014, 06:51:51 pm
Indeed! You only have to worry about having a wee little "ion particle burst" impacting your canopy when your shields are down  :)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: CKid on March 15, 2014, 07:07:30 pm
Those wings, will they swing back when you hit the burners? (like a F-14)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on March 15, 2014, 08:18:25 pm
Those wings, will they swing back when you hit the burners? (like a F-14)
They do.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: CKid on March 15, 2014, 09:06:10 pm
They do.

YES!!  :D
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: NGTM-1R on March 15, 2014, 11:12:35 pm
Those wings, will they swing back when you hit the burners? (like a F-14)
They do.

You are a god among men.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lepanto on March 15, 2014, 11:47:42 pm
NuWOD's fleetpack will certainly be a lot more expansive than the ships of WoD 1, in terms of sheer asset quality, number of ships, and even ship complexity.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on March 19, 2014, 03:34:11 pm
Indeed! You only have to worry about having a wee little "ion particle burst" impacting your canopy when your shields are down  :)
Or if you're cockpit is hit by a tachyon weapon that completely ignores shields.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Flak on March 19, 2014, 10:46:13 pm
Any chance the WoD wiki will be updated?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Rodo on March 20, 2014, 12:30:15 pm
WoD is awesome. Me want WoD.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dragon on March 21, 2014, 04:15:04 pm
NuWOD's fleetpack will certainly be a lot more expansive than the ships of WoD 1, in terms of sheer asset quality, number of ships, and even ship complexity.
But will it have custom freighters and missiles? :)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on March 23, 2014, 02:54:44 pm
I always thought the Champion looked like just another capital ship, while the other flagships looked like flagships. That has been emphatically changed. Love the new design.

That looks badass. Are there plans to repurpose the original Champion or will it be removed completely?

I think this is an excellent idea. It looks like just another ship, so it could be used as one, perhaps some sort of light carrier for example, compared to what I would assume the flagships to be, heavy carriers. Or just as a destroyer vessel.

Those wings, will they swing back when you hit the burners? (like a F-14)
They do.

That's something I certainly didn't expect.

You know, all this has had an unexpected side effect. When the forum game first started, I expected it to help rekindle my desire to work on my WoD campaign. But as we've gone on and I've seen more and more put into Wod, and now all this, it's actually having the opposite effect. You see...

NuWOD's fleetpack will certainly be a lot more expansive than the ships of WoD 1, in terms of sheer asset quality, number of ships, and even ship complexity.

I may only have one campaign in me, if that, and I want to be able to play with all the new and improved toys, so I'm probably going to shelve it until the WoD Remake arrives. If this was WoD2, that would be different, but it isn't, and I expect the remake will obsolete WoD, thus it will obsolete my campaign as well.

EDIT: Also, another factor in me wanting to use the new WoD is that it's going to be standalone, so the inexorable march of the SCP won't introduce bugs or imbalances into the campaign.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Phantom Hoover on March 23, 2014, 08:20:06 pm
??? If you want a stable WoD, just use the 3.6.12 MVPs and whatever build of FSO works out for you. Nobody's forcing anyone to stay up-to-date with the latest developments.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: niffiwan on March 23, 2014, 09:44:45 pm
well - at least until 3.6.12 no longer runs on your current OS of choice ('coz the rest of the world isn't going to stand still :)) And for Linux users at least WoD won't reliably run on 3.6.12 anyway, you probably need 3.6.14...
Title: Nu Guardian Angel
Post by: Spoon on April 14, 2014, 08:41:28 am
Despite being only 12 years old, Hades did yet an other awesome contribution to WoD. Though he left me to my fate when it came to uv mapping and texturing ;-;


(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/gaold_zpsa2433a7f.png~original)


Oh wait, no... That's the old one. I made that when I was 12.

Here's the new one.
(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/ganew_zps67e034fd.png~original)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: The E on April 14, 2014, 09:04:37 am
Damn, that's beautiful.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Flak on April 14, 2014, 09:21:18 am
Great, like I said long ago, my complain with the original GA was it feels too small.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: NGTM-1R on April 14, 2014, 09:27:55 am
Stacked flight decks.

Shiny.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: X3N0-Life-Form on April 14, 2014, 12:53:04 pm
Yup, it's awesome :)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on April 14, 2014, 01:40:28 pm
That's one hell of an improvement for the Guardian Angel. The screenshot on the celebration of FreeSpace thread is beautiful as well.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: The Dagger on April 14, 2014, 01:41:27 pm
That's awesome! :eek2:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on April 14, 2014, 02:21:09 pm
Oh wow, Spoon... :eek2:

You know I wasn't sure at first about the radical new design, I thought it might take some getting used to, but after seeing the screenshot on the celebration of Freespace thread, I knew that it was glorious. I'm going to put a link for anyone who hasn't seen it:

http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php?topic=25406.msg1744494#msg1744494
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dragon on April 14, 2014, 04:09:59 pm
Spoon, I want my badge back. :) I want to gawk at this in 3D test the heck out of it.  :D
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Hades on April 14, 2014, 06:22:25 pm
I had fun making the model but it wasn't just me, Axem redesigned the 'legs' where the engines are in and the engine layout as well as the big turrets on the top. Kudos to that cool dewd.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on April 14, 2014, 07:15:56 pm
I had fun making the model but it wasn't just me, Axem redesigned the 'legs' where the engines are in and the engine layout as well as the big turrets on the top. Kudos to that cool dewd.
I totally forgot to mention that, shame on me.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Jellyfish on April 14, 2014, 08:06:19 pm
It looks like a mecha. And quite cel-shaded, too. Great for the anime look.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LoneFan on April 14, 2014, 10:03:11 pm
OH, so they've redone the Guardian Angel, well that's nice, lets just have a look and HOLLY ****!!!! This isn't humanly possible!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Veers on April 15, 2014, 10:01:36 am
OMG, I do love them both but OMG Thats amazing!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: THEllisor on April 15, 2014, 03:19:52 pm
Pardon me while I just look on in awe.

Now, where'd I put the Daedelus? The Guardian Angel is gonna  needs arms for punching.  :nervous:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Torchwood on April 17, 2014, 01:18:28 pm
Marvelous, simply marvelous.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: procdrone on April 17, 2014, 01:32:59 pm
This ship ended up on my wallpaller... that means something!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: procdrone on April 23, 2014, 08:49:27 am
I don't know why, but after i while, and watching some anime, ships in WoD reminds me of this

(http://fc09.deviantart.net/fs48/f/2009/176/3/8/3858cf25870c65a678983a1bf3b9c2c7.png)

Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on April 23, 2014, 09:30:53 am
The skirmisher is very much based on the LoGH Imperial destroyer
(http://gineistatic.com/w/images/thumb/a/ab/ImperialDestroyer%28DVD-CA%29.jpg/294px-ImperialDestroyer%28DVD-CA%29.jpg)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: procdrone on April 23, 2014, 10:31:45 am
Yes! That's what i had in mind, Legend of the Galactic Heroes series! I knew it was this ^^
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: yuezhi on April 23, 2014, 01:57:26 pm
at least those designs seem to match function  ;7
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on April 28, 2014, 07:41:38 pm
Productivity reduced to zero due to DARK SOULS II
I don't even regret a thing
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Axem on April 28, 2014, 08:49:46 pm
Praise the sun. \[T]/
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: DahBlount on April 28, 2014, 09:50:28 pm
Correction: Productivity reduced to *near* zero. Some of us don't have new games to try.    :sigh:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on May 10, 2014, 08:32:43 pm
So as some of you may have already seen in that other thread (http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php?topic=87364.0), Dahblount has been working on giving the Ray 3 a work over. So today he handed it over and now it resides within the WoD svn, a warm and cozy place to be~


Pretty sexy isn't it? Feel free to praise Dahblount all you want, I will allow it.

(Waiting on Andrew to get his II done, so I can make a happy four generations worth of Ray's picture of it)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: AtomicClucker on May 17, 2014, 02:16:09 pm
Dat angled space rump  ;7
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on May 17, 2014, 10:10:55 pm
So as some of you may have already seen in that other other thread (http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php?topic=87300.0), AndrewofDoom has been working on making the Ray 2 come to life.

I made a few tweaks here and there to his design with a slightly different coat of paint:
(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/screen0323_zps989ceb7a.png~original)
A dated fighter, it mostly sees use with mercenaries.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Destiny on May 18, 2014, 01:25:39 am
It's a killer.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on May 18, 2014, 06:56:03 am
That is BADASS Spoon. :pimp:

Why is it for me every single thing you touch turns to gold?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: starwolf1991 on May 18, 2014, 07:36:32 am
O_O I need me one of those! That's a REAL sexy beast.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on May 18, 2014, 08:52:16 pm
My other nickname is Midas.
But this was 90% Andrew's work so praise him instead ;)

Imma make a 4 generations worth of Ray's picture soonish, just for the heck of it.


Now for the real question, where can we find space for more weapons?
(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/gentlemen_zps0c66af41.png~original)
 :p
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: niffiwan on May 18, 2014, 09:03:15 pm
There's still outer wing pylon space that you could slap more rocketpods on... and maybe a centreline BFG...  :nervous:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on May 18, 2014, 09:07:07 pm
But this was 90% Andrew's work so praise him instead ;)

I did, in his thread, some days ago. :nod:

Quote
Imma make a 4 generations worth of Ray's picture soonish, just for the heck of it.

So will we also see an upgraded version of the Ray I?

Quote
Now for the real question, where can we find space for more weapons?

Heh. Oh, I think there's room for some kind of beam weapon in the nose and some racks of missiles underneath the lower wings... :)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Rodo on May 19, 2014, 03:58:16 pm
Is it a fighter or a gun plataform?, cause you could just replace the pilot and put some high-grade explosive instead and use it as kamikaze after all the loadout is used  :p
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on May 19, 2014, 04:37:57 pm
(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/screen0329_zpsf918a88b.png~original)
(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/screen0328_zpsee89928c.png~original)

Now the MkIV looks kinda dated in comparison
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: headdie on May 19, 2014, 04:47:36 pm
I love the revamped Ray I
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on May 19, 2014, 05:02:27 pm
Wow. Awesome! :pimp:

Yes, a completely new design for the Ray I, and I am liking it too! It's a very nice ship in it's own right. And with them all lined up like that, it really does look like a progression, it isn't just 4 ships.

So is the IV then going to get some treatment too?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on May 19, 2014, 05:09:17 pm
The Ray I is a piece of ****, its firing points are too wide! I almost feel bad for making people fly it  :P
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on May 19, 2014, 05:18:39 pm
The Ray I is a piece of ****, its firing points are too wide! I almost feel bad for making people fly it  :P
Still, isn't the Ray I like 100 years behind the Ray III, and the Ray II still being around must mean it wasn't designed too long before the Ray III. So I guess it's supposed to be drastically inferior.

Of course, you might have taken the old Wings of Dawn story and crumpled the whole thing into a ball and tossed it in the bin for all we know... :)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: niffiwan on May 19, 2014, 05:49:49 pm
The Ray I is a piece of ****, its firing points are too wide! I almost feel bad for making people fly it  :P

That's what gun convergence is for :)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on May 19, 2014, 05:54:39 pm
It has gun convergence, doesn't help much!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: niffiwan on May 19, 2014, 05:57:06 pm
:( Well ain't that a shame...

(not that I've played with convergence on in FSO, IIRC the XWA one worked pretty well on the Xwing/Bwing)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on May 19, 2014, 06:04:22 pm
It has gun convergence, doesn't help much!
How are its weapons? The Eon-17W felt pretty slow and had limited range from what I remember, which I could see making convergence only marginally effective.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on May 19, 2014, 08:52:12 pm
Axem is making things happen.
This excites me greatly!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on May 19, 2014, 09:06:02 pm
I watched that with a wide smile on my face. I'm excited too. Being an admin doesn't seem to have slown him down any. If anything, he's doing more (at least visibly) than I've ever seen before. Keep it up Axem! :D
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: AndrewofDoom on May 19, 2014, 11:03:43 pm
Of course, you might have taken the old Wings of Dawn story and crumpled the whole thing into a ball and tossed it in the bin for all we know... :)

He did.

The Ray IV is just fine as it is mesh wise. It just needs a new paintjob.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: 0rph3u5 on May 20, 2014, 05:38:15 am
The Ray I is a piece of ****, its firing points are too wide! I almost feel bad for making people fly it  :P

You should feel bad, not just almost ... but then again, as long as you keep it to the 3 missions which featured the Ray I originally you might be forgiven ;)

Axem is making things happen.
This excites me greatly!

Yay!
also: PIZZA!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Flak on May 20, 2014, 07:33:17 am
Can't wait to see the rest of DD and UGC fighters
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on May 20, 2014, 07:53:59 am
The Terrans are getting so many new ships, and yet the Hierarchy, at least from what we've been shown, have very little new.

Perhaps the campaign will go somewhat like the Forum Game 2, with fighting among themselves first, then the invasion of the Hierarchy. Or maybe Spoon is keeping the Hierarchy's new toys a secret from us, so we have to face them in battle...
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Rodo on May 20, 2014, 09:45:49 am
That end...
Clearly best end. Unless it's in the middle of noon, then you need to put a glass of milk and some Oreos.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: starlord on May 20, 2014, 11:51:04 am
aren't you being too tough on the ray 1 when you consider ships like the star?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Piemanlives on May 26, 2014, 08:54:42 pm
Wait, so are you saying that WoD could turn into a VN like experience, where we can make choices and stuff through dialogue? Would this be self contained or part of a customized SCP EXE set?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Axem on May 26, 2014, 09:15:49 pm
Its a few LUA scripts working together to do all of that. So its within FreeSpace, just doing stuff that I'm sure no one would have ever expected to be added to FreeSpace. ;)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: General Battuta on May 26, 2014, 09:52:07 pm
Wait, so are you saying that WoD could turn into a VN like experience, where we can make choices and stuff through dialogue? Would this be self contained or part of a customized SCP EXE set?

We already have making choices through dialogue working without any need for LUA or customized EXEs. This is a new and way more sophisticated/awesome place to do it.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LoneFan on June 01, 2014, 09:01:34 pm
The Terrans are getting so many new ships, and yet the Hierarchy, at least from what we've been shown, have very little new.

Perhaps the campaign will go somewhat like the Forum Game 2, with fighting among themselves first, then the invasion of the Hierarchy. Or maybe Spoon is keeping the Hierarchy's new toys a secret from us, so we have to face them in battle...
Well remember that the Ur-Quan, uhhh, I mean the Hertak limit their thralls technological development as one means of keeping them under control. That said, I would like to see a Cordi lite strike cruiser, 
a Fura'ngle bomber equivalent,
a Zy frigate and big colony ship, their entire population is supposed to be living in space right?
and finaly a large Nordera supply ship for the lulz. Opportunity for comic relief on that last one, those Nordera are so dumb and un-prepared for life in space.
That should fill out the bare bones ship fields with what has aready been seen for the WOD universe.
Oh and also Fir'Kyr?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on June 02, 2014, 05:54:34 am
For someone who shoots out wagon-loads of ammunition and who's fighters look like they run on chemical fuels a massive supportship actually makes a lot of sense in my opinion.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on June 02, 2014, 10:06:17 am
You just know they'd spend more time trying to slam those things into things than supplying with them... :D

And if you thought the explosion when you blow one of their fighters is bad... :lol:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Jellyfish on June 02, 2014, 02:14:01 pm
Well remember that the Ur-Quan, uhhh, I mean the Hertak limit their thralls technological development as one means of keeping them under control.
But after losing thralls, you'd think they'd give their remaining ones (particularly their one willing one) more leeway.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on June 02, 2014, 02:20:07 pm
Also, technological advancement limitations don't stop diversity.

And we've already seen the proof of leeway with the special Zy fighter in Stranded.

Though we can also throw all of our preconceptions out of the window as it looks like the new WoD is going to be very different to the current one.
Title: Fs2 default control scheme sucks donkey
Post by: Spoon on July 12, 2014, 01:41:27 pm
I'm just gonna throw out this controversial statement like its nothing. But it's true.
It's one of those things I got used to over the years and haven't spend much time thinking about, until I let a friend of mine (experienced gamer, newbie to space sims) play the first few missions of WoD. Watching him struggle against the controls opened my eyes to the atrocity that is the default FS2 control scheme. Let me elaborate:

First off all, Freespace has a huge amount of utterly redundant keys. Look at the default keys (http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php?topic=49759.0), 6 different keys just to set your throttle! That's not counting Forward/Reverse thrust and afterburners. Over 20 targetting keys! Holy ****, I never use more than like 6 of these (which is still a lot). And worse of all, the keys you use the most are literally all over your keyboard. Thankfully some wise coder made Controlconfigdefaults.tbl a while ago (which Axem pointed me to after hearing me ramble about this subject), allowing me to give WoD an actual nice and sane WASD casual/accessible/streamlined layout. With all the commonly used keys right within hand reach.

And for those that are now going "Spoon, your face sucks donkey, give me back my classic control scheme!", you can easily switch between the new and classic control scheme by hitting the default key in the controls config. Everybody wins.

Also in my ungoing struggle to make WoD casual accessible, lets talk about shield management.
Equalizing shields under fire allows a player to easily take three times as much punishment. But it often just comes down to mashing the Q button a lot when under fire. Yet I've heard of players who don't actually manage their shields at all. Either because they are playing on a gamepad, are not very good players, or are simply not thinking about it because there is often so much stuff going on in a freespace mission. Consequently they get stuck on missions because they keep dying with plenty of unspend shield hitpoints to spare. Therefore I asked Axem to write me a simple script that makes your shield automatically equalize. It frees up one more key on an already crowded keyboard, makes lesser skilled pilots survive for longer and allows veteran pilots to focus on hitting those other important keys instead of mashing that Q.

In other news, Dahblount told me that I had show off the MkIIIW

(http://i.imgur.com/aKH3AIt.png)
(http://i.imgur.com/t4igqF8.png)
(http://i.imgur.com/avwMYiG.png)
(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/screen0355_zps9476d129.png~original)

With two medium and two heavy gunmounts, the W variant allows for a completely different weapon set up than the normal Ray MkIII. Mostly employed by the Delest Dynasty who favor putting heavier armaments on their strike craft.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on July 12, 2014, 05:24:32 pm
That is shiny and pretty, albeit on the dark side. Again, I really like the glow on the intakes and vanes(?).
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on July 12, 2014, 05:40:48 pm
Spoon! I strongly dislike shield management, so that is beautiful! Can the script be used on other mods too?

I'll also be interested to try out your new control scheme.

That must be a DD colour scheme on the Ray III-W. I love it.

So yeah, I'd been thinking you'd been quiet for a while, but this is all brilliant news! :nod:

(EDIT: Of course, a big thanks for Axem too. :))
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: FrikgFeek on July 12, 2014, 06:12:25 pm
But Spewn, I get a raging boner when I beat a mission on insane knowing that I had to do everything myself. Is there an option to disable the auto-equalisation so that I  can still feel smugness and superiority because I'm a better FS2 pilot than the medium/hard playing scrubs?

EDIT: This is a joke, I don't actually get a raging boner(just an ordinary one) when I beat a mission on insane.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dragon on July 12, 2014, 06:30:51 pm
Yeah, disabling it would be nice. As a HOTAS user, I've got shields bound to one of the numerous HAT switches in my setup, making it really easy and intuitive. As such, automatic management could even be a hindrance.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on July 12, 2014, 07:09:33 pm
Spoon! I strongly dislike shield management, so that is beautiful! Can the script be used on other mods too?
Yeah, its actually a super simple script.

But Spewn, I get a raging boner when I beat a mission on insane knowing that I had to do everything myself. Is there an option to disable the auto-equalisation so that I  can still feel smugness and superiority because I'm a better FS2 pilot than the medium/hard playing scrubs?

EDIT: This is a joke, I don't actually get a raging boner(just an ordinary one) when I beat a mission on insane.
Yeah, disabling it would be nice. As a HOTAS user, I've got shields bound to one of the numerous HAT switches in my setup, making it really easy and intuitive. As such, automatic management could even be a hindrance.
I had originally intended for the script to only work on medium and lower difficulties but Axem informed me that we can't check for difficulty with LUA (at least, not at the moment).
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Droid803 on July 12, 2014, 07:44:24 pm
You could make the script not run always, but only when called via script-eval, no?
Then just use a difficulty check every mission and script-eval when not difficulty-at-least hard.

Thus difficulty checked. :P
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on July 12, 2014, 07:48:59 pm
Why tie it to difficulties at all though?

Couldn't there be a way for the player to choose? Is there a way the script could be a separate download, so those who don't want it can leave it out?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LoneFan on July 13, 2014, 12:59:15 am
How making it a select able function such as "auto match speed", and "auto targeting", that can be switched on and off as the player sees fit in mission. Now that would be something truly remarkable.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: niffiwan on July 13, 2014, 04:01:05 am
Yeah, disabling it would be nice. As a HOTAS user, I've got shields bound to one of the numerous HAT switches in my setup, making it really easy and intuitive. As such, automatic management could even be a hindrance.
I had originally intended for the script to only work on medium and lower difficulties but Axem informed me that we can't check for difficulty with LUA (at least, not at the moment).

Since there's already a SEXP to get the current difficulty, adding scripting access to the same thing should be really easy...
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on July 13, 2014, 09:46:14 am
How making it a select able function such as "auto match speed", and "auto targeting", that can be switched on and off as the player sees fit in mission. Now that would be something truly remarkable.
Yes that would be the best set up if possible, those who don't want it just switch it off and leave it off. And me, I can toggle it off on those occasions when my shields are mostly stripped and I want all protection channelled to one quadrant (likely the rear.)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on July 13, 2014, 12:28:03 pm
SVN commit message:
Shield Equalizer now uses Alt-Q to toggle
Windshield script fixed
hud gauges thing fixed so it doesnt crash debug

Now even the hardcore of hardcore progamers can get their shield managing fix.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on July 13, 2014, 12:46:41 pm
Shield Equalizer now uses Alt-Q to toggle
(http://www.glenbrookbaptistchurch.org.au/Websites/glenbrookbaptist/images/Fireworks.jpg)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lepanto on July 13, 2014, 09:12:02 pm
I approve of these efforts to bring common sense to FS2's outdated control scheme. :yes:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Veers on July 15, 2014, 10:42:56 am
Surprisingly FS2 is the only game that I use the default binds in (I do have ETS mapped to the Gx keys on my keyboard though). Every other game I chop and change everything,

Oh god... I am going to die. I can already see my ship exploding before I can even turn it on. :D
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: tarasis on August 31, 2014, 11:33:31 am
SVN commit message:
Shield Equalizer now uses Alt-Q to toggle
Windshield script fixed
hud gauges thing fixed so it doesnt crash debug

Now even the hardcore of hardcore progamers can get their shield managing fix.

I presume this change/fix won't be in the 3.7.2 release candidates?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: niffiwan on August 31, 2014, 04:13:02 pm
Scripts like this are not included in the FSO engine. i.e. they're completely independent of FSO releases like 3.7.2.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on October 13, 2014, 12:29:45 pm
For those thinking "ded mod" and for those thinking "Spoon you handsome beast" here is a completely empty post to assure you all that I am in fact still doing WoD related things. (Never minding my small detour into modding a hentai game  :nervous:) The fact that there hasn't been a single release in years is mere a testament to my devotion to a quality bar that is set slightly higher than the original WoD.
Surely.


Man, I really do like boobies.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Flak on October 16, 2014, 09:03:39 am
You mean picture of a hen wearing a tie right?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on October 16, 2014, 09:45:37 am
S-sure... let's go with that.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on October 16, 2014, 11:07:09 am
You mean picture of a hen wearing a tie right?

No, no, no. It's tai, not tie.

Obviously this is what he's talking about:

(http://forums.na.leagueoflegends.com/board/attachment.php?attachmentid=1069000&d=1410535529)

See, it's an anime dude, that's what Spoon's all about, anime. And he has a hen on his head. :)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: DahBlount on November 21, 2014, 10:16:13 pm
It might not be noticeable now, but the Ray III now features (Cycles) baked glow maps.

(http://i.imgur.com/DUE3Gne.png)

(http://i.imgur.com/M0fZLv3.png)

+10 to realism
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: headdie on December 02, 2014, 05:54:46 am
very cool, how did you set it all up?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: DahBlount on December 02, 2014, 06:35:40 am
I used The Dagger's tutorial, found here http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php?topic=87535.msg1747905#msg1747905

I modified the settings a little bit on my end but it works in the same manner.
Title: The state of WoD
Post by: Spoon on December 24, 2014, 08:15:41 pm
Merrrry Christmas~

(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/WoD/screen0382_zpsaf6283be.png~original)

I probably don't update this nearly often enough and when I do, its probably not even all that interesting! This is mostly because I didn't wanted to create 'hype' when I didn't even know when I would be able to release anything. Let's 'solve' this by setting some kind of release date!

(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/WoD/screen0425_zpsde6c2305.png~original)

So right now I am working my hardest to get Episode 1's release out early next year (Aiming for january, but don't hold me to it!). It'll feature around 7 mission (+1 tutorial one), 10 visual novel segments and a large amount of new and reworked ships. Making nuWoD look visually far more appealing than its original release and a story that goes into far more depth than "aliens invade, we blowup their flagship and win."

While the new release is still Wings of Dawn, its a reboot and a lot of things, be it story, lore, weapons and characters will be completely different from the original. A lot of this is due to the amazing Axem turning Freespace into a visual novel, giving me access to a whole new way to tell a story in Freespace, keeping a lot of the 'dialogue clutter' out of combat missions and making it far more replay friendly because it cuts out the unskippable talking sections.

(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/WoD/screen0430_zps8a56bffe.png~original)

Also, its a stand alone release. No Freespace 2 installation required. You can share it with those friends that are too stingy to get FS2 for 5 bucks off Steam/GoG  :p

(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/WoD/screen0420_zps3f49dba4.png~original)

A lot of development time went into updating existing assets and adding new stuff, while also completely reworking the ship and weapon balance from the ground up. So while I don't know what kind of release schedule I'll be able to keep after releasing Episode 1, rest assured that it won't take another 2-3 years for Episode 2 to get out.  :p
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lepanto on December 24, 2014, 08:25:39 pm
Looks awesome. I'm pumped.  :nod:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Torchwood on December 24, 2014, 09:09:53 pm
I'll hold you to that 'release schedule' thing, you know.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: niffiwan on December 24, 2014, 11:59:08 pm
wow, looking really awesome!  :yes:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on December 25, 2014, 03:28:41 am
Hey, we'll get to see our comrades out of helmet on something other than a loading screen  :yes:

I'm looking forward to it.

Though I have to say you're selling yourself (or rather your previous release) a bit short. There was more depth to it than just "there be evil aliens, let's blow them up".
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on December 25, 2014, 07:41:13 am
This looks good in ways I can't describe.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Hades on December 25, 2014, 07:42:17 am
Here's a new (WiP) Caliburn model, based upon a gundam core-fighter variant.


It is currently missing four guns - two heavy and two medium guns, they'll be added shortly (probably).
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: FrikgFeek on December 25, 2014, 09:55:19 am
The Caliburn finally looks like an assault fighter, it looked more like mini-bomber before. Hope it actually handles normally now(at least for WoD standards), and not like a heavy truck loaded with heavy trucks.
Also, if WoD is now standalone, does that mean we won't be able to use FS2 secondary mods(like Axem's Scripted Message) with it? Or will it just use a standard FSO launcher but just won't require FS2 Vps?

Weapon rebalance... goodbye my dear OP VK-01N, you let even a mediocre pilot beat the game on insane, I shall forever miss you. Although the weapon itself was just OK, it was completely ridiculous on the Ray's 6 gun bank. Making the Zy useless by shooting down their missiles, destroying the Fur'angle ships from 2000 metres, the mad spray easily dealing with the Cordi, and still being decent vs the Nordera.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on December 25, 2014, 05:45:15 pm
Looks incredible Spoon! :eek2:

Comparing to the old Wings of Dawn, it's akin to the old Wings of Dawn being a console game at least a generation ago. It just looks so damn GOOD!

I hope you don't fall into the trap so many people here seem to fall into when it comes to release dates. But if anyone can meet a release date, I think it's you, since you managed to turn out Wings of Dawn at impressive speed all by yourself, and if you're setting for just a month from now, you must be really close.

I'm obviously greatly looking forward to playing the game, but perhaps even more, I want to get my hands on the new ships and tinker with them in FRED... :)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Veers on December 25, 2014, 06:27:08 pm
Will the original WoD remain available and awesome for awesomeness sake? :)

Looking good Spoon, looking forward to January* !!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on December 25, 2014, 07:35:49 pm
The Caliburn finally looks like an assault fighter, it looked more like mini-bomber before. Hope it actually handles normally now(at least for WoD standards), and not like a heavy truck loaded with heavy trucks.
Also, if WoD is now standalone, does that mean we won't be able to use FS2 secondary mods(like Axem's Scripted Message) with it? Or will it just use a standard FSO launcher but just won't require FS2 Vps?
Won't require any FS2 Vps, so if you wanna add any mods, you totally can.

Weapon rebalance... goodbye my dear OP VK-01N, you let even a mediocre pilot beat the game on insane, I shall forever miss you. Although the weapon itself was just OK, it was completely ridiculous on the Ray's 6 gun bank. Making the Zy useless by shooting down their missiles, destroying the Fur'angle ships from 2000 metres, the mad spray easily dealing with the Cordi, and still being decent vs the Nordera.
Fear not, the VK-01N is still present, and still has that same dakkadakka feel to it (though for some reason it got renamed to VK-03N, don't ask me why).

Will the original WoD remain available and awesome for awesomeness sake? :)

Looking good Spoon, looking forward to January* !!
I won't go out of my way to remove original WoD from the internet, so it should still be available for download for the very few that are interested.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: FrikgFeek on December 25, 2014, 07:42:06 pm
Well, that's reassuring. I always thought that the VK-01N's damage and energy consumption must have been a tabling error. IT does 25% more DPS than the VX-02a, has 2500 range, and drains so little energy that you can basically divert ALL of your power to shields and engines and not run for the whole mission, especially if you recharge it when you're just flying around reading messages.
Dakkadakka indeed.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on December 25, 2014, 07:48:28 pm
People sometimes ask if they should play Freespace without the SCP to appreciate what it was like before.

Maybe one day people will ask if they should play the original Wings of Dawn before playing the new version for kind of the same reason... :)

BTW, you kept this one quiet, didn't you. I was under the impression it was still a long way away. Then "Oh, I'll be releasing the first part next month." :cool:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on December 26, 2014, 05:45:29 am
Reminds me of the original release.

There I never even heard of WoD before the release.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on December 26, 2014, 06:02:01 am
I'm probably just terrible at advertising my stuff  :p
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on December 26, 2014, 02:29:09 pm
I'm probably just terrible at advertising my stuff  :p

Well...

Going by the description of the game on the site where I downloaded it and by the opening movie, this has to be the biggest example of underselling I have ever seen.

But that's not going to matter to those of us who have already experienced the magnitude of the awesomeness that is Wings of Dawn, and are blissfully anticipating this release.

So come on everyone! If he delivers, it's our job to create a buzz and spread the word that something awesome has arrived! :)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: AtomicClucker on December 27, 2014, 05:17:28 pm
Impressive.

I'll look forward to this. Might inspire me to get back into Freespace modding.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Colonol Dekker on December 28, 2014, 02:38:57 pm
Nu dawn with added white t shirt.  ;7

 :p
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on December 28, 2014, 03:03:57 pm
Impressive.

I'll look forward to this. Might inspire me to get back into Freespace modding.
Can I draw your attention to this thread? You probably missed me necroing it.
http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php?topic=84975

Nu dawn with added white t shirt.  ;7

 :p
Oh u  :lol:

Spoiler:
there's also Nu Dawn without any t shirts, for that matter

So come on everyone! If he delivers, it's our job to create a buzz and spread the word that something awesome has arrived! :)
Put those social medias to work~ (because I dont have any...)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: NGTM-1R on December 28, 2014, 06:17:54 pm
This is probably the excuse I need to actually play FS again.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: FrikgFeek on December 29, 2014, 12:40:45 am
All that beam spam looks pretty GPU intensive. Should be a good excuse to heat up my R9 290X so I don't have to turn up my radiators and burn expensive butane, especially with the sky-high prices in Europe now.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: AtomicClucker on December 29, 2014, 10:36:52 am
@Spoon: Well, since I'm finally graduated and shifting towards kicking my conspiratorial nutters family, I'd be more than willing to get those models to anyone who wants them. I had to stop modding and most personal projects due to the madness I deal with at home. I have a DVD/hard disk backup of my old work. And several other projects that I scrapped due to conflicts with team members (one project had my team members revolt against me because I became incoherent and disillusioned with it after they tried to meddle with all the inner workings).
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on December 29, 2014, 11:22:20 am
Ouch, sounds like you had some **** to deal with. Good luck with that dude!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LoneFan on December 31, 2014, 01:10:01 am
It's all so PRETTY!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Flak on December 31, 2014, 06:03:55 am
New fura ships?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dragon on December 31, 2014, 12:08:24 pm
Looks like some really great progress was made. I don't play FS much anymore, but I might come back just for that. :) I kind of wish I was still on the team, but I don't think I could be of much use now.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on January 03, 2015, 12:31:14 pm
Are all of the new and reworked ships going to be available to play with in FRED when this is released? Or just the ones that appear in these missions?

I have a favour to ask, if it's not too much trouble. If the Lord class is available, could you include the Soaring Spirit? It doesn't have to be in the main release, it could be a little side download that I could put in to be able to FRED and play with my forum game flagship. :)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on January 04, 2015, 08:32:26 pm
All the ships that are done are going to be in the first episode release, and a bunch of them are still on my to rework list and will probably be redone by the time of episode 2.

I checked the maps and the Soaring spirit texture (its just the same texture with a name on it) is still in there. No harm in keeping it there for you I guess!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on January 05, 2015, 12:36:32 pm
Wonderful! :)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: AtomicClucker on January 07, 2015, 11:43:29 pm
Well, when I'm not struggling to squelch my desire to yell at family members, I'll get to work on digging out my hi-poly models and donate them to the fine cause here.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on January 16, 2015, 12:07:35 pm
So maybe a January release is slightly too optimistic of a goal, so allow me to quickly distract you with the website Axem put together for WoD:
http://wingsofdawn.hard-light.net/index.html
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: CKid on January 16, 2015, 04:05:23 pm
*DISTRACTED*
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Destiny on January 16, 2015, 07:28:26 pm
Sounds like Dawn's going to be player character now?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on January 16, 2015, 08:21:23 pm
Unless it's a just for show screenshot, or some extenuating circumstances storyline-wise, looks like we aren't friendly with the Cyrvans if the SF are going up against the Cyrvans in that first screenshot.

I see the old WoD2 intro video up on the site. Is that just for show, or are you taking things in the direction you intended to for WoD2 and that's our actual opening movie?

I also see you get to fly with the Cyrvans if the screenshot is anything to go by with the player in an Aestival.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on January 17, 2015, 09:20:04 am
That Terran vs. Cyrvan screenshot could be anything from a history-cutscene of the war, over a rebellion in which the Cyrvans help out, destroying a ship that got captured by aliens a simulated fleet battle or even a nightmare of the player character. I'm not going to interprete too much into it for the time being without more information.

It is a nice page.

"Though the developer feasts on compliments and constructive feedback, so feel free to give him that in the forums"  :lol:
I'll try to feed you a bit once the first release comes out. ;)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: AndrewofDoom on January 17, 2015, 09:58:31 am
Sounds like Dawn's going to be player character now?

She was before for a few set of missions.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on January 17, 2015, 11:09:00 am
That Terran vs. Cyrvan screenshot could be anything from a history-cutscene of the war, over a rebellion in which the Cyrvans help out, destroying a ship that got captured by aliens a simulated fleet battle or even a nightmare of the player character. I'm not going to interprete too much into it for the time being without more information.
Yeah, I did say extenuating story circumstances. However, like you, I also thought of some such scenarios. My personal favourite would be a faction of Cyrvan supremacists. Can you just imagine the dialogue, when normal Cyrvans have varying degrees of that smug superiority? It would make you enjoy blowing them up so much! :lol:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Flak on January 17, 2015, 09:14:32 pm
Or maybe Cyrvans vs Pirates or perhaps terrorists?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: FrikgFeek on January 17, 2015, 10:06:46 pm
I'm just going to point out that we haven't seen a single Cyrvan die in the series so far(And we've seen plenty of Terran ships get owned by the Hertak). It's all because of Spoon's elf fetish. So I doubt that we'll actually get to blow up some smug space elves.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dragon on January 18, 2015, 04:10:30 am
I'm just going to point out that we've only seen a few Cyrvans get significant screentime in the "series" so far. :) There were a total of two of them directly involved in action in WoD. Stranded also didn't have that many. All of the notable ones were main characters, too, and WoD isn't exactly the kind of series that likes to kill those off. I'd expect some CSA redshirts to appear eventually, especially since they have capital ships now.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on January 18, 2015, 07:47:56 am
I'm just going to point out that while the elf fetish part is totally true, Dragon points out a good point. And as a final point, Slyphia could in fact die in stranded.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on January 19, 2015, 11:01:13 am
I think it's more a question of circumstance than design that we haven't got to shoot up any Cyrvans yet. Because they haven't ever been our enemy. For not dying, he was constrained by the story saying they only had two Aestivals. So those Aestivals couldn't get blown up in missions, they had to be invulnerable. But the Guardian Angel can still go down in missions, with Crystal, Luna, and the other three unnamed Cyrvans onboard dying with the rest of the crew.

I did get a chuckle when thinking about it though thinking that iirc Droid and his Cyrvan fleet went unmolested throughout the course of the forum game, as in never got attacked on the Hierarchy turn... Plus, I bet Spoon wanted to show off those Cyrvan ships! :D

I think that too was perhaps out of circumstance though, to not have to deal with the question of how Cyrvans can resupply in Terran systems. He also spent a good number of turns out of the action anyway.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dragon on January 19, 2015, 01:19:21 pm
CSA fleet appeared too late in the forum game to really see much action. It was an important strategic asset, but it really didn't do that much. Had the game lasted longer, perhaps it would have taken loses. The Hierarchy didn't really have a reason to attack it, it was one of the strongest fleets in play. They were really better off taking their chances with other fleets that were shorter on supplies, which they did (especially that by that point, Hierarchy fleets already took a beating as well).

GA could be downed in WoD, just like Aestivals could, if you were flying one of them. But seeing as it was a game-over, I wouldn't count that. The only Cyrvan death that still led to a proper (though there was a better one) ending was in Stranded.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on January 20, 2015, 11:20:40 am
CSA fleet appeared too late in the forum game to really see much action. It was an important strategic asset, but it really didn't do that much. Had the game lasted longer, perhaps it would have taken loses. The Hierarchy didn't really have a reason to attack it, it was one of the strongest fleets in play. They were really better off taking their chances with other fleets that were shorter on supplies, which they did (especially that by that point, Hierarchy fleets already took a beating as well).

Strength didn't have any influence on defence though. So they would have been the most desirable target to take down. I'm not complaining though. Especially when it would have deprived us of being able to see the fleet in action. I never saw any pattern to who got targeted in the game. Spoon had his fleets gang up on individual fleets, but I wonder if the target was chosen at random. It's probably for the best that way, as if you had one of the stronger fleets and he targeted the strongest, that would make the game pretty unfun for those of us with the stronger fleets, while those with the weaker fleets would be able to stay on the frontlines turn after turn.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on January 27, 2015, 07:32:12 pm
January has pretty much passed now, and lo and behold, no release. <yet>
Some things that are holding it up, the fact that I apparantly severely underestimated the time it would take to write the last VN segments. I, the amateur, took the art of writing lightly.
And there is also that I want to have my friends that I play D&D with to play test it first, but setting a date for this was turning out to be a bit more troublesome that I had expected. Right now we finally set a date, but it'll be two weeks from now.
So realistically speaking, it'll probably be sometime in march before I actually feel confident that its been tested more than enough for release.

First accept my deepest apologies and second this screenshot of the new Caliburn. Model by Hades, based on a Gundam Corefighter design.
(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/WoD/Caliburn_zpsc1a646e1.png~original)

And here's the 'original three' fighters, all in their new updated forms next to each other
(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/WoD/Fighters_zps464c2722.png~original)
(Not pictured, the DD Kaze-H with its ridiculously large cannon.)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: niffiwan on January 27, 2015, 07:36:46 pm
Nice models  :yes:

(and don't worry about the release date, it's done when it's done :))
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on January 28, 2015, 07:31:37 am
Nice fighters.

But why is one of the KAZE called PAGE? What does that stand for?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on January 28, 2015, 12:31:02 pm
No, Spoon! You set another release date! That means because it's Hard Light you'll miss that one too! :shaking: :D

I'm glad you posted the group of fighters together, because looking at the Caliburn on its own, I didn't think it looked like a heavy fighter, but next to the others, now it does look the part. Especially the one with the camo, makes it look tough. Very nice design as well just on its own merits.

Is there anything different about the Kaze-Page vs. the normal Kaze aside from the paint job?

They're all really great designs. Can't wait to see them in action.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dragon on January 28, 2015, 12:35:05 pm
If you want an additional tester, I might be available... about two weeks from now, give or take. :) Depending on how bogged down I get in college stuff, mostly. Sadly, it's the days when I had enough free time to help out on half the projects on this forum are long gone, but for something like WoD I'd definitely try to muster some of it. :)

The ships sure do look wonderful, but what I'm really excited about are the VN segments (having gotten a sneak-peek of the technology a long time ago, now I can't wait to see more of it).
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on January 28, 2015, 02:29:46 pm
But why is one of the KAZE called PAGE? What does that stand for?
Is there anything different about the Kaze-Page vs. the normal Kaze aside from the paint job?
The CRF ship naming scheme is one of titles. The bigger the ship, the more important its title. The medieval Page was basically an apprentice squire, so yeah, not really high up there. The CRF didn't produce any of their own second generation fighters and their first attempt at a 3rd generation one, the Esquire, was... not great. So they started licensed production of the Ray MkIII and the Kaze, but as the Commonwealth's economy continued to struggle, the CRF found itself forced to bring down the production costs. So they designed their own variations without the expensive 'subspace storage module' and while they were at it, they adjusted the Kaze's thrusters to give it a more balanced performance.

What this translates into for gameplay terms is that the MkIII has 2 banks of 6 medium guns that it cannot link, but will allow it to bring two sets of guns for greater versatility. The same for the Kaze except it has 2 banks of 6 light guns. The Kaze-page variant instead has one bank of 2 medium and one of 4 light guns. In terms of rotation times, the Kaze has 1.5 3.5 values and the Page 2.4 2.6.

The DD on the other hands found the Kaze to better fit their military doctrine if it had somewhat heavier armament.

(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/WoD/Kaze-H_zps116b66e3.png~original)
So they put a massive cannon on it.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on January 30, 2015, 08:55:07 am
Thanks Spoon. But I don't actually understand if this means the Kaze is better or worse. The subspace storage module, is that just fluff, or does it mean something?

And the guns, are you saying the regular Ray can fire all guns at once but only have one type, while the CRF Ray can only fire half at once but have 2 types? And the same for the regular Kaze firing all 6 light guns, while the CRF Kaze-Page has to choose between firing 4 light or 2 medium?

And the thrusters being more balanced... does that mean it's better or worse?

And the rotation times, is that rate of fire? Sorry for being so ineffective at comprehending the information you've given me.

The DD variant is interesting, I could see the DD Kaze hitting and running with the big gun if it has a slow rate of fire.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on January 31, 2015, 09:30:58 am
Okay so, the subspace storage module is the ability for a ship to have two primary banks using the same firing points, but you can't link the two banks. Whereas the CRF variants can link their banks, but their setup is different. The normal Kaze will always fire from 6 points, no matter what bank is selected, wheras the Page will have one bank of 4 and one bank of 2 which it can choose to link or not.

The rotation times is ship rotation, pitch and yaw. The time it takes the ship to do a 360 degree motion on one axis.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: FrikgFeek on January 31, 2015, 11:21:51 am
So, the LSF fighters basically have a hammerspace inventory. Also, aren't there supposed to be 3 different rotation times? Yaw, Pitch, and Roll.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on January 31, 2015, 11:29:28 am
Okay so, the subspace storage module is the ability for a ship to have two primary banks using the same firing points, but you can't link the two banks. Whereas the CRF variants can link their banks, but their setup is different. The normal Kaze will always fire from 6 points, no matter what bank is selected, wheras the Page will have one bank of 4 and one bank of 2 which it can choose to link or not.

The rotation times is ship rotation, pitch and yaw. The time it takes the ship to do a 360 degree motion on one axis.
I'm still really confused. Linking the banks means you can fire all the guns at the same time, right? And does same point mean the guns all fire at the same point? They'd all hit the middle of the targetting reticule? I must be missing something, because with the subspace storage module it sounds like you're saying you can fire all guns at the same point but can't fire all guns at the same time, without it you can fire all guns at the same time but can't hit the same point.

But thankfully I do now understand what you mean about the rotation and why the Page is more balanced.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on January 31, 2015, 11:41:19 am
The firing point is the point of origin for the projectile. A normal Kaze has two weapons that share the same six firing points, meaning both weapons produce projectiles from the same location. The CRF Kaze has one bank that uses four of the six total firing points, and a second that uses the remaining two.

A normal Kaze acts like the Uriel in WiH, it cannot link its primaries. The CRF Kaze can link its primaries like a normal FS ship.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on January 31, 2015, 11:47:51 am
The firing point is the point of origin for the projectile. A normal Kaze has two weapons that share the same six firing points, meaning both weapons produce projectiles from the same location. The CRF Kaze has one bank that uses four of the six total firing points, and a second that uses the remaining two.

A normal Kaze acts like the Uriel in WiH, it cannot link its primaries. The CRF Kaze can link its primaries like a normal FS ship.
So is it like having 6 guns and shooting one type of bullet from all 6 guns and then switching to a different type of bullet and shooting that type of bullet from all 6 guns? And the Page can shoot both types of bullet at the same time, but can only shoot one type from 4 guns and the other type from the other 2 guns? That does make sense.

I haven't played WiH so I can't relate. But I think I understand. The Uriel can fire all guns but can only shoot one type of weapon from those guns at a time, yes?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on January 31, 2015, 01:40:13 pm
So, the LSF fighters basically have a hammerspace inventory. Also, aren't there supposed to be 3 different rotation times? Yaw, Pitch, and Roll.
Yes :p and Yes, but roll wasn't relevant in this comparison between Kaze's because its the same, so I didn't mention it.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: FrikgFeek on January 31, 2015, 01:50:13 pm
I asked because if the Kaze has a relatively quick roll compared to it's yaw(kinda like in the original WoD) then it pays to roll and pitch when trying to chase maneuverable fighters.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on January 31, 2015, 04:55:19 pm
Fair point, the Kaze has a roll rate of 2.2
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on January 31, 2015, 11:22:00 pm
Here's a question... can we fly the Hierarchy fighters?

Oh, and can we fly all of the Terran and Cyrvan fighters?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dark Hunter on February 19, 2015, 08:51:04 pm
So I recently watched Crest of the Stars...

Spoon, were the Abh an inspiration for the Cyrvans?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on February 19, 2015, 09:01:50 pm
Yup.
Title: A WoD dev blog update
Post by: Spoon on February 28, 2015, 10:43:19 am
Feb is almost over. Good, because it overstayed its welcome for way too long anyway. It's not even a proper month, only 28 days? Does it even try?
I said March for a WoD release didn't I? I probably did, it'll probably happen too. The campaign itself is done, it's just the polish around the edges that is being worked on now. I also have a friend, grammar checking it for me, which is taking a lot of time due to the large amount of words and the large amount of incompetence inside. I'd say he's about 40% done, and he's been at it for several days already.

Another thing that had me downright baffled was an A.I. related story. The A.I. kept doing this to me: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PIhkD0Sc-_U (ignore the botched sound, that's my video editing software's fault). A suicide run, guns blazing with no regards for personal safety of any sort. And I could not figure out why it was doing that! I went through every A.I. related table, tested things up until 8 in the morning. Nothing I tried worked.
In retail and BP though, the A.I. was acting more like you'd expect. So why?!

I turned to people that are smarter than me, and they too, could not figure out at first why it was happening. Until Axem and Admiral Ralwood (Mageking17) discovered that this A.I. behavior was related to what kind of secondary weapon they have. If it has an aspect seeker, it'll act more like you'd expect. If it has anything else, or nothing at all, it'll go full retard. Dumbfire missiles make the A.I. go dumb, imagine that.
But while that is figured out, Niffiwan and Admiral Ralwood have not yet discovered in the code why it is doing that, or how to fix it yet. Stay tuned for more news on this mystery as it develops.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on February 28, 2015, 11:52:12 am
So I recently watched Crest of the Stars...
And now, so have I.

Funnily enough, even though I was armed with the knowledge that the Abh were an inspiration for the Cyrvans, and that being the reason I went off to watch the 13 episodes, that insipration never jumped out at me. I was able to make a few possible connections, but nothing jumped out at me.

But maybe the new Wings of Dawn Cyrvans might yet do that.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on February 28, 2015, 12:55:52 pm
Make sure you watch Banner of the stars too, it has a lot of mines and a lot of pew pew.
And well an inspiration is always just that, an inspiration. Doesn't mean I copied the Abh 100%  :p
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on February 28, 2015, 01:10:45 pm
Make sure you watch Banner of the stars too, it has a lot of mines and a lot of pew pew.
And well an inspiration is always just that, an inspiration. Doesn't mean I copied the Abh 100%  :p
I will, I like the show enough on its own merits to continue. Are there only Crest of the Stars and Banner of the Stars, or is there anything following after that?

I like Jinto and Lafiel's awkward/cute relationship a lot. Jinto really reminds me of someone... :D

(http://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/seikai/images/a/a0/Jinto_Linn.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20080911040503)

(http://games-open.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/suikoden-2-riouriou---suikoden-wikia-phwyvmwn.png)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on February 28, 2015, 02:49:07 pm
Heh, definitely a resemblance there.
Banner of the stars has three seasons (total of 25 episodes), though season 3 is only two episodes long. It's a pretty easy to follow order; crest, banner I, banner II, banner III
Banner I is my personal favorite.

(But let's try to stay on topic somewhat, shall we? :p )
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: AdmiralRalwood on February 28, 2015, 03:06:32 pm
Another thing that had me downright baffled was an A.I. related story. The A.I. kept doing this to me: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PIhkD0Sc-_U (ignore the botched sound, that's my video editing software's fault). A suicide run, guns blazing with no regards for personal safety of any sort. And I could not figure out why it was doing that! I went through every A.I. related table, tested things up until 8 in the morning. Nothing I tried worked.
In retail and BP though, the A.I. was acting more like you'd expect. So why?!

I turned to people that are smarter than me, and they too, could not figure out at first why it was happening. Until Axem and Admiral Ralwood (Mageking17) discovered that this A.I. behavior was related to what kind of secondary weapon they have. If it has an aspect seeker, it'll act more like you'd expect. If it has anything else, or nothing at all, it'll go full retard. Dumbfire missiles make the A.I. go dumb, imagine that.
But while that is figured out, Niffiwan and Admiral Ralwood have not yet discovered in the code why it is doing that, or how to fix it yet. Stay tuned for more news on this mystery as it develops.
There's now a Mantis issue (http://scp.indiegames.us/mantis/view.php?id=3147), but research has been somewhat stalled by the fact that stepping through with a debugger doesn't seem to reveal where the difference in behavior is coming from.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on February 28, 2015, 05:24:50 pm
Heh, definitely a resemblance there.
Banner of the stars has three seasons (total of 25 episodes), though season 3 is only two episodes long. It's a pretty easy to follow order; crest, banner I, banner II, banner III
Banner I is my personal favorite.

(But let's try to stay on topic somewhat, shall we? :p )
Thank you Spoon. :)

On topic, I hope the AI thing gets sorted, amusing video, even headbutts you at the end of the attack run! But I'm glad you mentioned the sticking plaster solution for it if it doesn't for if I ever decide to start making stuff with your stuff. Also of course, glad to hear March remains on schedule. When I first read your post, the way you were going, I thought you were going to say you weren't going to be able to make March... :D
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Admiral MS on March 02, 2015, 09:50:37 am
Another thing that had me downright baffled was an A.I. related story. The A.I. kept doing this to me: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PIhkD0Sc-_U (ignore the botched sound, that's my video editing software's fault). A suicide run, guns blazing with no regards for personal safety of any sort. And I could not figure out why it was doing that! I went through every A.I. related table, tested things up until 8 in the morning. Nothing I tried worked.
In retail and BP though, the A.I. was acting more like you'd expect. So why?!

I turned to people that are smarter than me, and they too, could not figure out at first why it was happening. Until Axem and Admiral Ralwood (Mageking17) discovered that this A.I. behavior was related to what kind of secondary weapon they have. If it has an aspect seeker, it'll act more like you'd expect. If it has anything else, or nothing at all, it'll go full retard. Dumbfire missiles make the A.I. go dumb, imagine that.
But while that is figured out, Niffiwan and Admiral Ralwood have not yet discovered in the code why it is doing that, or how to fix it yet. Stay tuned for more news on this mystery as it develops.
There's now a Mantis issue (http://scp.indiegames.us/mantis/view.php?id=3147), but research has been somewhat stalled by the fact that stepping through with a debugger doesn't seem to reveal where the difference in behavior is coming from.
Seems like the A.I. wanted to avoid but was prevented to do so by some magical force keeping it pointed towards the target and rolling helplessly.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: FrikgFeek on March 20, 2015, 05:52:49 pm
Funny how Nu Wod is set to release relatively close to the Director's cut of BP:WiH acts 1 and 2. The only thing that's missing is some kind of remastered Vassago's Dirge.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on March 21, 2015, 11:17:03 pm

Soon or something


I shouldn't make posts at 5:15am
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: niffiwan on March 21, 2015, 11:48:03 pm
Very Nice :)

(and is that HLP-1 multi-lock missiles that I see?  ;7)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Veers on March 22, 2015, 02:16:31 am
+1
Can't Wait Spoon!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on March 22, 2015, 07:38:45 am
I'm suited, where's the hangar? :D
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: NGTM-1R on March 22, 2015, 07:55:17 am
Reinstalling FS reason detected. Clearing disk space.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lepanto on March 22, 2015, 09:45:33 am
Your efforts to build hype are successful. I am hyped. Many are hyped. Now fulfill the hype.  :)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: CKid on March 22, 2015, 11:33:06 am
Reinstalling FS reason detected. Clearing disk space.

I think Spoon said that WoD will be stand-alone.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: NGTM-1R on March 22, 2015, 11:38:57 am
Reinstalling FS reason detected. Clearing disk space.

I think Spoon said that WoD will be stand-alone.

Well, I need the disk space either way, don't I?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: eragon2890 on March 22, 2015, 11:40:23 am
can´t wait! Will this contain new missions XD ?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on March 22, 2015, 01:23:36 pm
Spoon. You've learned how to sell. :yes:

The anticipation is building... :)

can´t wait! Will this contain new missions XD ?
Yes.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on March 22, 2015, 01:59:55 pm
Right, so the current status of nuWoD is that it is 99% complete. It's even spell&grammar checked (that's a first!) by a good friend of mine who really put a lot of time and effort into it! The past days have mostly been sorting out little issues, debugging, playtesting. You know, the boring stuff.
Swifty has been doing cool things with the code; like the multilocking, shadows, deferred lighting and optimizations (to stuff like trails and the shadows). So WoD comes with it's own custom super build~ and Axem is currently putting the final touches to a really cool cutscene he's making. (Axem's contributions in general have been massive!)

For all the time it's been in the making, episode 1 is not actually a very long campaign to play through, but I hope it'll be a good introduction for things to come, and that it will be enjoyable!


Reinstalling FS reason detected. Clearing disk space.

I think Spoon said that WoD will be stand-alone.

Well, I need the disk space either way, don't I?
Stand alone indeed, and you'll need around 3GB of disk space
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: ngld on March 22, 2015, 03:25:05 pm
Swifty has been doing cool things with the code; like the multilocking, shadows, deferred lighting and optimizations (to stuff like trails and the shadows). So WoD comes with it's own custom super build~ [...]
Hm... Will you provide a patch against FSO's source? It'd be nice if I could compile my own build.
Also, did you test your build on Linux and MacOS? Swifty's branch had several problems on Linux, IIRC.

Anyway, I'm looking forward to this.  :D
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lepanto on March 22, 2015, 04:01:36 pm
Will you be making a version compatible with lower-end machines? You know how a bunch of people couldn't play WiH act 3 upon release because the custom BP builds wouldn't work on their computers.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on March 22, 2015, 04:20:14 pm
Hm... Will you provide a patch against FSO's source? It'd be nice if I could compile my own build.
Also, did you test your build on Linux and MacOS? Swifty's branch had several problems on Linux, IIRC.

Anyway, I'm looking forward to this.  :D
I can't directly support linux or mac because I don't have any machines that run it (also my general ignorance to anything related to those operating systems). I'm hoping there will (eventually) be builds for those two though. (I hope Swifty can provide some more insight here)

Will you be making a version compatible with lower-end machines? You know how a bunch of people couldn't play WiH act 3 upon release because the custom BP builds wouldn't work on their computers.
How much lower-end are we talking about here? I mean, you can disable shadows and all the resource intensive things in the launcher.
My really old laptop (a 1.6ghz single core) could run old wod, but chokes on launch with this build. But ya know, that's because it's like a ten year old machine. So uhm yeah, if lower-end means a computer that's like a 8 year old laptop, you can probably expect it won't run.

Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lepanto on March 22, 2015, 04:39:38 pm
Not THAT lower-end, so I'll give it a shot. Thanks.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: AdmiralRalwood on March 22, 2015, 04:47:12 pm
Not THAT lower-end, so I'll give it a shot. Thanks.
If you want to see how your computer handles the deferred lighting & shadows branch, I've compiled a fresh set of SSE2 (http://deviance.duckish.net/downloads/fs2_open_shadows_SSE2.7z) and AVX (http://deviance.duckish.net/downloads/fs2_open_shadows_AVX.7z) builds (although these obviously won't have multilock or any other goodies).
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lepanto on March 22, 2015, 06:01:07 pm
I can run the shadows build on debug, barely-sorta. Maybe it's about time I upgraded from Intelgrated to a proper graphics card.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: niffiwan on March 22, 2015, 06:31:21 pm
Hm... Will you provide a patch against FSO's source? It'd be nice if I could compile my own build.
Also, did you test your build on Linux and MacOS? Swifty's branch had several problems on Linux, IIRC.

Anyway, I'm looking forward to this.  :D
I can't directly support linux or mac because I don't have any machines that run it (also my general ignorance to anything related to those operating systems). I'm hoping there will (eventually) be builds for those two though. (I hope Swifty can provide some more insight here)

If a patch vs trunk is made available I can help with providing Linux builds, but I can't help with Mac/OSX (as I don't own one)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: X3N0-Life-Form on March 23, 2015, 07:33:02 am
*Prepares to go into Hype-space*
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: procdrone on March 23, 2015, 10:15:57 am
*Prepares to go into Hype-space*

(http://fc03.deviantart.net/fs38/f/2008/356/4/a/Hyperspeed_Animation_by_Skywalker4JAS.gif)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Swifty on March 23, 2015, 02:28:36 pm
I'll try to make Mac OS and Linux builds available. I don't have Mac or Linux readily accesible right now but I'll make sure to pull in some cross platform favors from people with build capable machines.

I tried my best to optimize the engine against the latest whiz bang as much as I could but there's only so much I can do. If the game doesn't run well on your machine, you're going to have to turn off shadows and deferred lighting. However, the build should still run better than trunk without shadows and deferred lighting turned on because of those optimizations.

And if shadows and deferred lighting aren't ready for cross platform primetime, we'll just have Linux and Mac versions of what's currently in trunk with just the requisite gameplay code.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: General Battuta on March 23, 2015, 02:59:05 pm
This **** is gonna blow minds.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: niffiwan on March 23, 2015, 04:51:57 pm
I tried my best to optimize the engine against the latest whiz bang as much as I could but there's only so much I can do. If the game doesn't run well on your machine, you're going to have to turn off shadows and deferred lighting. However, the build should still run better than trunk without shadows and deferred lighting turned on because of those optimizations.

I ran some tests with your shader_transform_deferred branch on Linux (with nvidia GTS 450) and it ran really well with shadows off.  Enabling shadows reduced the framerate to ~15fps instead of (capped at) 60, but the card is over 4 years old.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Swifty on March 23, 2015, 05:18:00 pm
Huh well there you have it. I'm glad the new stuff doesn't drag everything else down with it when it's not even being used.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Rodo on March 23, 2015, 10:13:33 pm
oh yisss.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Flak on March 24, 2015, 08:07:05 am
Thankfully I have a second 2TB hard disk. My Steam library already filled about a quarter of it though.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on March 24, 2015, 01:14:24 pm
I almost regert having finally gotten a full-time job.

Oh well, it'll make the weekends all the sweeter :D
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: General Battuta on March 24, 2015, 06:16:58 pm
I posted a beautiful Battutiful breview of the upcoming Wings of Dawn which I will QUOTE HERE

Wings of Dawn is HLP's first all-original IP! And it's about to hit YOUR FACE with a standalone, free, no-fiddling-required release!

(http://i.imgur.com/x25Dmjk.jpg?1)

What's Wings of Dawn? Wings of Dawn is the hybrid space baby of anime and Star Control, set in a universe where fractious humanity is just beginning to confront titanic alien powers, built on systems-driven gameplay designed to give players a lot of toys and a lot of power.

I don't really like anime but it doesn't really matter because Wings of Dawn is a technical tour de force and a real kick to the ass of FreeSpace modding in general. Axem and Spoon have been holed up in their cabal making arcane impossible things out of the guts of FreeSpace. In Wings of Dawn you'll get:

  • Striking presentation! No more dots of light filling up the load screen. Wings unfold from a heraldic shield. The custom HUD is full of unique, mission-specific gauges. The mainhall is fully modeled and bits light up when you mouse over them. There are entire menu elements that didn't exist in core FS2, like a full-screen reading view for fiction, a diary, and more. Even the difficulty levels have been renamed.
  • Rich gameplay systems. Anyone who played the original Wings of Dawn release already got to see the carefully crafted damage model, with specific weapons excelling against specific targets, and the diverse range of enemy behaviors, with each species full of its own tricks and weaknesses to learn. But it's been five years and there's a lot more happening now - although if anything it's cleaner to pick up. LUA wizardry makes it easy to dogfight in a crevasse between three asteroids while dodging VLS missiles from a nearby ship and timing command-detonated mines. There are a ton of quality-of-life touches, including a beginner-friendly control scheme and an option to revert to FS classic with a single button!
  • Bafflingly seamless narrative. This is what really struck me! YOU CAN WANDER AROUND YOUR BASE SHIP AND TALK TO PEOPLE. It's not a 3D space, more like a choose-your-own-adventure, but you can decide to move between places, ask characters prying questions about their personal lives, read the news, eat breakfast, and so on. The Sorcerers Supreme may have gone TOO FAR. I don't want to overhype this like some Star Citizen bull**** but it really is very very cool. So instead of leaping from mission to debrief to CB to brief, you get downtime to see what's up and get to know people.
  • Really creative missions! You will do stuff you haven't done before, except in the tutorial, which is dull right now. Fix that tutorial, Spoon! I don't want to talk about this too much because it'll spoil the fun but I will say that it's all cleanly taught, low-stress, and fun to repeat. And it will repeatedly expand your idea of what's possible in FSO. Particularly cool is the fact that 'walk around the ship' segments can cut right to space, so you might hear a character say 'we're jumping!' and get an external shot of the ship warping.
  • A killer look! I am a sucker for campaigns, like Diaspora, that manage to make their models look tactile. Wings of Dawn has a lot of sharp, colorful, interesting ships. Generous FXAA helps, sure, but the models also play to the colorful anime aesthetic, occasionally looking almost handdrawn. Your cockpit will actually get cracked and start fuzzing with errors as you take damage!

(http://i.imgur.com/itRVLjH.gif)

Of all the projects still active on HLP I think that WoD (and JaD, but hey, it's not like they don't sleep together) is the one most concerned with the player's fun. In a campaign like BP you can ask a question like 'can I go do that?' and the answer is probably 'no you fool and MEDITATE ON THE HORROR OF WAR!!' Wings of Dawn is happy to say 'yeah, sure!'

The upcoming WoD episode is short, sharp, consumable, and fun. It installs fast, runs fast, and plays fast. I really encourage you to check it out.

Since I am smart you know my words are true.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dark Hunter on March 25, 2015, 12:32:31 am
I don't think I can possibly be more hyped for this than I am right now.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on March 25, 2015, 05:22:31 pm
Hey Spoon... If this lives up to all the hype, you're going to regret releasing it in parts once we hit the end of this first part and the incessant pestering for you to release more content begins with all the fervour of a junkie desperate for his next fix... :p :lol:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on March 28, 2015, 12:01:02 am
Since I am smart you know my words are true.
I cannot agree enough.

Hey Spoon... If this lives up to all the hype, you're going to regret releasing it in parts once we hit the end of this first part and the incessant pestering for you to release more content begins with all the fervour of a junkie desperate for his next fix... :p :lol:
I wouldn't mind~

Okay, so assuming Axem&Swifty deliver this weekend, release should be monday or tuesday. (If nothing else unforseen pops up)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on March 28, 2015, 05:39:02 am
And by writing "if nothing else unforeseen pops up" you pretty much assured that something will :P
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: z64555 on March 28, 2015, 07:09:55 am
If something does indeed pop up, our team of intrepid coders will most assuredly HEY LOOK A SQUIRREL!
 :warp:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on March 29, 2015, 12:06:58 pm
If something comes up and you end up being able to release on Wednesday, don't. Or everyone will think the new WoD is an elaborate many months in the making April Fool. :lol:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on March 29, 2015, 12:57:29 pm
Hah, yeah  :p
If everything fails, next date would be friday.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: procdrone on March 29, 2015, 01:00:27 pm
*randomly sabotages this thread because of his own mod-campaign nearing completion*
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on March 29, 2015, 08:04:07 pm
*randomly sabotages this thread because of his own mod-campaign nearing completion*
o:
I must destroy your campaign with a devastating review now.

(looks like its gonna be a friday release, since I haven't heard anything from Swifty yet ): )
Title: Important announcement
Post by: Spoon on April 01, 2015, 12:16:36 pm
Due to:

I have decided to drop this project.
I am instead moving onto to creating a kinetic visual novel romantic comedy dance simulator, using TyranoBuilder Visual Novel Studio™ and Artificial Academy 2. 
Have a look at my progress and wish me well.



Farewell HLP.
Title: Re: Important announcement
Post by: Lorric on April 01, 2015, 12:32:46 pm
Can't fool me. I know what day it is. Very funny though with the video. :lol:

EDIT: That goes double for the video description! :lol: :lol: :lol:

  • Having to endure people complaining about licensed music for a non commercial project

This though isn't so funny. I was just looking at some of the Forum Game videos yesterday, and was annoyed to see the copyright hammer has been dropped on Turn 1. It hardly seems worth the effort for a year old video with just over 300 views. Why did they even bother?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Phantom Hoover on April 01, 2015, 02:11:47 pm
It's done automatically, they have algorithms that detect copyrighted music in their videos.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Axem on April 01, 2015, 05:18:31 pm
Wait, what about our pre-orders?

I'm still getting my bonus pre-order talking Crystal reversible body pillow... right?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: General Battuta on April 01, 2015, 05:31:25 pm
NO SPOON DON"T GO
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: swashmebuckle on April 01, 2015, 08:40:21 pm
I like the new direction, but the (hopefully unlicensed) music could be A LOT louder.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Veers on April 02, 2015, 01:41:30 am
Spoon!

Can you provide us with the link?, trying to hide your trail makes me think you don't want us to play your works!

I'm hurt, sad, maybe a little bit hungry...
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Flak on April 02, 2015, 09:32:43 am
Maybe I should start making music as well
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LoneFan on April 02, 2015, 02:42:22 pm
(http://www.nooooooooooooooo.com/vader.jpg)

In this seen, Spoon is playing the part of Emperor Palpatine.
I am off to play the original campaign again, while crying and eating ice cream.   
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on April 02, 2015, 06:22:08 pm
(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/fortehemprah_zpsewdsqawc.png~original)
Ack Ack Ack

Man, do you guys not want a Kinetic visual novel romantic comedy dance simulator or something? Sheesh.

Okay so tiny bit of devblog:
WoD has been haunted by a bunch of mysterious errors, models that don't get their texture loaded, an interface error that it can't find a briefing mask, which appears seemingly at random. All of these errors tend to go away after reloading the game. Very frustrating! After talking with Admiral ralwood (Mageking17) on irc for a bit, it seems the most likely cause for this, is that WoD has so many explosion and effect bitmaps that it hits the 4750 BMPMAN limit. Ergo, the Freespace engine simply cannot contain the whole of WoD. 
I've asked Swifty to increase the number of slots for WoD's build, see if this will make the issue go and stay go.

I'm super anxious to get this dumb game of mine released, so you nerds can play it and say it sucks. So I'm definitely slightly frustrated that I've had to delay it so many times because of all these little ****ty errors popping up that need to be fixed. I'm really hoping it can be this weekend, but every time I seem to say that, something else pops up.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: karajorma on April 02, 2015, 07:28:53 pm
So I'm definitely slightly frustrated that I've had to delay it so many times because of all these little ****ty errors popping up that need to be fixed. I'm really hoping it can be this weekend, but every time I seem to say that, something else pops up.

When you've had that happen after you've built the VPs, installer AND uploaded them all so that the Linux and Mac versions can be made, then you can talk to me about frustration with little niggling errors. :p

Seriously though, I agree sometimes it's the little niggles that are the most annoying things.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Veers on April 02, 2015, 08:31:56 pm
WoD has so many explosion and effect bitmaps that it hits the 4750 BMPMAN limit. Ergo, the Freespace engine simply cannot contain the whole of WoD. 

Well, the apocalypse is nigh... Repent! Repent! You non-believers! Repent! Crystal is the way!

I'm not sure if I should be impressed or terrified that you hit the limit and potentially have kept going. This will be good!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Swifty on April 03, 2015, 02:32:30 am
We've temporarily raised the bitmap limit to 6000 for now for stability's sake. Although the engine aggressively loads select bitmaps it determines being used in a mission, the engine doesn't aggressively release bitmaps if they're not being used. A more long term solution is to implement a smarter page-in/page-out system before considering a permanent SCP decision to raise the bitmap cap.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: X3N0-Life-Form on April 03, 2015, 04:41:05 am
I terms of future-proofing, that sounds like the better solution.


In any case, congrats to WoD for getting Full-Game'd.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on April 03, 2015, 10:53:24 am
congrats to WoD for getting Full-Game'd.
I'll second that, though it is kind of sad to see old WoD get shunted away into that new WoD Archive board.

I know you must have made that board yourself Spoon, but I wonder with that name, will anyone who doesn't already know know there's quality content in there to be played? I think that would be a shame. I know it says it in the description when you come into the board, but how many people will look?

I wonder if it would be better to make a sticky thread with the release information for the old releases in the main board?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on April 03, 2015, 04:07:07 pm
So.... will we get a new "ask the crew" thread once the release finally manages to squish the bugs?

Except for that one person who took it a bit too serious the old one was a lot of fun and a wealth of information.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: AtomicClucker on April 03, 2015, 09:48:03 pm
Perhaps the bugs will evolve into their own Moe Idol Group?

Stopping spoon with their songs about bugs, errors, and missing textures~
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on April 03, 2015, 10:46:20 pm
Onore, Moe Idol Group! You have stopped my progress for the last time!

So.... will we get a new "ask the crew" thread once the release finally manages to squish the bugs?

Except for that one person who took it a bit too serious the old one was a lot of fun and a wealth of information.
Maybe, I promise nothing regarding this.

I do make the promise that tomorrow (or technically, for me today, after I sleep) shall be release day.
For realzies.
True story.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LoneFan on April 03, 2015, 11:47:30 pm
Wow, can't wait to get my hands on the tech database. Got to learn about all these new ships. BRAND THEM INTO MY BRAIN!
Will WOD Remake have it's own WIKI?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on April 05, 2015, 08:24:06 am
Wow, can't wait to get my hands on the tech database. Got to learn about all these new ships. BRAND THEM INTO MY BRAIN!
Will WOD Remake have it's own WIKI?
The tech database is honestly not really my proudest part of WoD. Because I'm just not really good at writing tech entries. I don't think I've even spell checked it  :nervous:
A wiki for it would be nice, but I'll definitely won't be the one making it  :p


So what's next?
Well, episode 2 eventually. Naturally.
When? I wish I could even give the slightest of indication on this. Seeing at how many previous deadlines I've missed, I can say with a fair bit of confidence that I have no good grasp on how long things can or will take. :p I'd like episode 2 to have somewhat more playtime than 1 (people have really been blasting through it!), so it's likely the missions will end up being more straightforward as a result (think more like mission 5 rather than mission 3) for episode 2.

As for things to do: There are a bunch of ships that are still in queue to receive a visual update (Zy fighters, the Cordi, the Hertak) and a whole batch of characters (old and new faces) that need their portraits drawn. So it's not just straight up mission building and visual novel writing from here on on. 

And for those that want to do some modding themselves, or are just interested in the various scripts used in WoD, here is some of the documentation written by Axem and Swifty
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/6576073/Docs.rar
Couldn't have done without it.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on May 11, 2015, 01:59:37 pm
I recently discovered the existence of a program called emofuri, which is capable of animating a static picture through the power of ancient japanese magic. Or something to that effect.
I spend the last couple of days aquiring basic mastery of this program and all of its moonrunes. (Because why release an english version right? Nippon only, baka gaijin go home.)

So I'd just like to take a moment to compare an old wod's headani with one of the future.
(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/WoD/Crystalheadaniold_zpsu3ty82kz.gif~original) (http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/WoD/Crystalheadaninu_zpskxrgdzqq.gif~original)




I don't know what she is talking about.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: SpardaSon21 on May 11, 2015, 02:37:53 pm
She's probably asking why we're staring at her if you drew the rest of it like I think you did. :lol:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on May 11, 2015, 02:47:18 pm
That's pretty damn cool and impressive when you think about how much more lively characters would appear having a greater range of motion and emotion.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LoneFan on May 11, 2015, 04:43:28 pm
She's obviously asking where her clothes have gone.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Rodo on May 11, 2015, 09:23:14 pm
Looks quite neat and smooth.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LoneFan on May 12, 2015, 02:47:51 am
Hy Spoon, maybe this will help.
Here try "I'm Hoarding all the EmoFuri tutorials" http://emofuritutorials.tumblr.com/ (http://emofuritutorials.tumblr.com/)

This has the potential to be something truly awesome, again., like doing something awesome is a weekly thing for you.  (http://38.media.tumblr.com/d5112eb5fb2bc512eb59e2e696e3ce08/tumblr_inline_n85vzvGm1c1qzg5ws.png)
An Emofuri menu guide: http://kirstenly.tumblr.com/post/90508981079/emofuri-menu-navigation (http://kirstenly.tumblr.com/post/90508981079/emofuri-menu-navigation)
head - 輪郭
eye whites - 白目通常
eye pupils and irises - 瞳通常
open eyelids - マブタ通常
closed eyelids - マブタ閉じ
eyebrows - 眉
nose - 鼻
mouth closed - クチ
mouth open - クチ開き
bangs  - 前髪
chest - 胸
body - 胴体
hair at the back - 後髪
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on May 12, 2015, 10:34:03 am
Thanks, though I've been going through all the tutorials I could find extensively over the past few days, those two included.  :)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on May 12, 2015, 10:58:03 am
Well really it should be compared to a current head ani rather than an old one, but I suppose Crystal doesn't have one.

Personally, I think the current head anis in the new WoD are excellent. A real highlight of the whole package. I think they just overflow with so much personality, and I hope that isn't lost with the new version.

But I can certainly see the potential. You've got more tools to use here, and I imagine you'll indeed be able to make the head anis even better, so I wish you luck. :)

And Crystal, don't worry. You're obviously a work in progress and I think we're all pleased to see you back again after your first appearance in the old WoD. I know I am, and I'm looking forward to seeing what role you're going to play in the new WoD. I'm sure he'll get around to giving you some clothes to wear.

Eventually...
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LoneFan on May 24, 2015, 01:46:43 am
Hmmmm, after toying with it for awhile, I can't figure out how a taking off helmet animation would work.

Well anyway, hey Spoon. How much of the original lore concerning the battle thrall races and how they were conquered, is going to translate into the new universe. BTW, I really like the new Cordi ships.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on May 25, 2015, 09:15:42 am
Yeah, you can't really do an animation like that with emofuri.

Some of the battle thrall lore will be similar, some stuff will be different
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LoneFan on July 06, 2015, 01:03:53 am
Hey Spoon, your ships look so great. What 3D Graphics program do you use?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on July 06, 2015, 09:44:55 am
I use the ancient 3D max 8 myself, for the sole reason that I like using the .pof export plugin for it.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LoneFan on July 06, 2015, 04:19:17 pm
Thanks Spoon, its been a nightmare to convert file types to use Blender since it no longer supports .cob files.
Title: Height chart
Post by: Spoon on July 06, 2015, 05:59:47 pm
I randomly felt like creating a height chart for the (female) crew. It doesn't contain everyone yet and it's kinda rough, line art wise.

(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/WoD/Height_zpskwpzuri2.png~original)  (http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/WoD/Height_zpskwpzuri2.png~original)

(No, the Cyrvan ships don't have super comfy carpets that make them go barefooted onto their ships. I just lazed out and couldn't come up with shoes.)
Title: Re: Height chart
Post by: Axem on July 06, 2015, 06:24:59 pm
(No, the Cyrvan ships don't have super comfy carpets that make them go barefooted onto their ships. I just lazed out and couldn't come up with shoes.)

Well there go my plans to defect. You could've had something, Cyrvans!

Also Dawn pose, best pose.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dark Hunter on July 06, 2015, 08:59:27 pm
Are you falling into the trap of having official female military uniforms include a miniskirt, Spoon?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on July 06, 2015, 09:25:47 pm
Yes, pants (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-oJrmFkYuAg) are boring (https://youtu.be/FADIw1djnxs)

Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: NGTM-1R on July 07, 2015, 01:45:33 am
Yes, pants (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-oJrmFkYuAg) are boring (https://youtu.be/FADIw1djnxs)

Exploding ordnance. Flashburns, dude, flashburns!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Veers on July 07, 2015, 05:02:24 am
Hubba Hubba <3 <3

(Translation: I think it means, love your work, or love Cyrvans. Can't quite tell. Screen is fogging up)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on July 07, 2015, 04:30:16 pm
Too bad about the lack of carpets. I'd have been funny if a Cyrvan stepped through the airlock and  complained how the metal floor on Human craft was ugly and cold to their bare feet. ^^
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: niffiwan on July 07, 2015, 08:59:44 pm
Jello Warrior? WTF?  :lol:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on August 13, 2015, 04:19:43 pm
Post 4000~
I felt compelled to make it in the wod forum, even though I don't really have anything new to say at the moment.
Yeah...

Well I guess for those of you interested in this sort of thing, I've been putting up some occasional lewd on my deviantart account. I don't have to point out that it's NSFW, right? (http://kingspoon.deviantart.com/)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LoneFan on August 13, 2015, 10:26:31 pm
Post 4000~
I felt compelled to make it in the wod forum, even though I don't really have anything new to say at the moment.
Yeah...

Well I guess for those of you interested in this sort of thing, I've been putting up some occasional lewd on my deviantart account. I don't have to point out that it's NSFW, right? (http://kingspoon.deviantart.com/)

It's cool Spoon. Just glad to hear from you.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dragon on August 14, 2015, 09:38:23 am
Glad to see some new artwork. Do you have any more? :) I do recall there being older art from WoD1 era that was pretty good. Do you still have those?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on August 14, 2015, 09:50:35 am
I... do have those but...
I'd rather pretend those don't exist, because all the stuff I made back then just looks so incredibly bad to me now.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on February 01, 2016, 09:09:09 pm
https://my.mixtape.moe/pwvmyx.webm
Swifty improved the shield code, no longer do shields look terrible, distorted and start glitching all over the place once the limit of 20 has been reached (thats raised to 200 now!). So now I'm in the progress of making new shield hit effects. Because you can just feel the pixels of those 128x128 effects in the mediavp.
The shields activating before the shot gets there is a bug in the collision code (that's been there for a while), Swifty is on the case.

Edit: And swifty already fix that issue. What a boss.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: AdmiralRalwood on February 01, 2016, 11:11:38 pm
...Holy carp.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: niffiwan on February 01, 2016, 11:31:43 pm
Looks great! :)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on February 02, 2016, 06:26:00 am
Pretty.

Even if it's a bug that's already been fixed, that behavior gives the impression that the shield is proactively stopping the shots instead of reacting to being struck.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: X3N0-Life-Form on February 02, 2016, 10:00:08 am
[...] the shield is proactively stopping the shots instead of reacting to being struck.
That's' a concept I love but barely ever see, most shields out there either work on the "invisible unless struck" principle or the "always visible" principle.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on February 02, 2016, 11:20:05 am
https://my.mixtape.moe/ykghbl.webm
https://my.mixtape.moe/hkxozy.webm
(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/Junk/****typop.001_zpsf4ycujfp.gif~original)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on February 02, 2016, 11:35:29 am
Oh my. Those Terran shield effects are niiice.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dragon on February 02, 2016, 01:34:56 pm
Could anyone upload those to YouTube or somesuch? I can't view them.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: tomimaki on February 02, 2016, 03:41:19 pm
That shield :yes:
Nice effect
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on February 02, 2016, 09:04:20 pm
One more then: https://my.mixtape.moe/lfofem.webm
(Boy, do those cordi ship need a good texture job)

Edit: or two, whatevs
https://my.mixtape.moe/eaiexn.webm
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Swifty on February 03, 2016, 03:01:59 am
Man, I did a good job.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Enioch on February 03, 2016, 03:17:48 am
...That 'mixtape' site gives me all sorts of hostile site warnings. Any alternative upload sites, please?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: CKid on February 03, 2016, 05:18:12 pm
Looking good, love how each species gets their own shield effects. Really makes them diverse, just like their ships. Terrans are my favourite. (How soon until it's added to FS2?)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on May 02, 2016, 07:27:59 pm
Axem gave the Nordera Battleaxe a bit of a visual update... over a year ago. But better late than never, I finally took the time and effort to take all the steps required to put it ingame.

(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/WoD/screen0898_zpsgprj6eov.jpg~original)
The torpedo launchers are no longer tediously unreachable, hurrah for that.


The rest of my time is spend dying in Dark Souls III a lot (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jBr5soU8KwA)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on May 08, 2016, 01:31:46 am
Wow... that looks really rusty and used... which is great for Nordera. :D
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dragon on May 10, 2016, 06:57:41 am
The rest of my time is spend dying in Dark Souls III a lot (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jBr5soU8KwA)
And making perverted artwork, as I can see from the rest of the album. :)

Seriously, though, nice screenshots, I really love how the overhaul is turning out. The Battleaxe changes are welcome, but I think it could use a little more detailing. As it stands, it might look a bit out of place next to all those hi-poly models.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on May 11, 2016, 02:24:43 pm
Well you don't have to go through albums for that, I have a NSFW deviantart (http://kingspoon.deviantart.com/) for that  :p

I think you are overestimating a bit how hi-poly the other models are though, I don't think its going to look particularly out of place compared to the rest.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dragon on May 12, 2016, 04:57:41 am
Maybe it's just that on the Battleaxe, the low-polyness looks more obvious. The triangular spikes and sharp edges (mostly on the side pod) give it a somewhat crude look, not "crudely built", but rather "crudely modeled". Changing this while preserving the look and feel of the ship could be a challenge, though.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: manwiththemachinegun on June 02, 2016, 12:03:47 am
Spoon, what have you dooone? I'm back in! After I swore I was out! I keep getting pulled back to Freespace 2!

I guess I will have to enjoy these games, AGAIN, while my backlog continues to grow. *sigh* ;)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on June 02, 2016, 05:23:56 pm
Spoon, what have you dooone? I'm back in! After I swore I was out! I keep getting pulled back to Freespace 2!

I guess I will have to enjoy these games, AGAIN, while my backlog continues to grow. *sigh* ;)
Sorry  :p
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on June 03, 2016, 06:09:59 pm
Another ship receives a visual update:
(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/WoD/screen0913_zpspv0uewej.jpg~original)
(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/WoD/screen0915_zpsmrewvpwu.jpg~original)

In this case, the CSA Breaker.
One of the ships that was modeled by Axem and one I was really happy with back in the day.
But then sometimes, you look back at past work and decide it's just not really living up to present standards anymore.
In the Starlight and the Breaker's case, they weren't really on the list for getting an update, but when we looked at the ships again we all agreed the proportions of the ship made it look kind of stubby. And while I'm still not exactly a master texturer, I do wanted to bring the texture a bit more inline with the rest of the CSA ships.

(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/WoD/screen0914_zpsxnd8oqpb.jpg~original)
(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/WoD/screen0918_zpsbtkt20fr.jpg~original)

So a bit of tweaking was done.

Next up is the Starlight, who will probably see a bigger overal overhaul of the hull. With the planned addition of a hangar, so it won't compete for the same role as the Breaker anymore. And allows me more flexibility with CSA capitalships for mission design.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: 0rph3u5 on June 04, 2016, 02:21:09 am
The new textures do a lot to make it look smooth and sophisticated  :yes:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LoneFan on June 24, 2016, 01:46:29 am
Very nice, I can see so much more detail now.  Did you lengthen the haul just a bit?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on June 26, 2016, 12:48:06 pm
Yeah, stretched the whole ship out a bit to make it not appear as stubby as before. Which somehow gives it a better sense of scale too.

Also, for what its worth, I made a dev blog update (http://www.moddb.com/mods/wings-of-dawn/news/wings-of-dawn-status-update-1) on moddb. (But it probably doesn't tell you guys a lot of new that you haven't already heard here)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LoneFan on June 26, 2016, 01:53:29 pm
Well it certainly has been beautified and with more details visible is definitely more intimidating. 
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on July 03, 2016, 10:40:46 pm
Long on the agenda to be visually updated, the Zy's fighters (Not to be confused with the Z fighters)
All done now, the latest that got finished is the Zy Nocturnal. Here is how it appeared in old wod's stranded.

(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/WoD/screen0865_zpsp412ewqp.jpg~original)

And this is the new remade model (by Axem) and retextured (By me).
(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/WoD/screen0958_zpshon5rgvi.jpg~original)
(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/WoD/screen0959_zps2ovyty5g.jpg~original)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: FrikgFeek on July 04, 2016, 12:13:45 am
Going for that bright red stealth aesthetic, eh?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: niffiwan on July 04, 2016, 12:53:27 am
oooh, errr.. never got around to playing stranded  :nervous: Was the Nocturnal supposed to be a stealth fighter, 'coz I think it looks pretty schmick, and the red racing stripes suit it :D
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: AdmiralRalwood on July 04, 2016, 01:05:35 am
Going for that bright red stealth aesthetic, eh?
clearly they went to the Naruto School of Stealth
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Hades on July 04, 2016, 03:00:59 am
clearly they went to the Naruto School of Stealth
Believe it
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on July 04, 2016, 06:09:45 am
It's a deliberate choice for gameplay to give it some visual cue. Not being able to target a ship is kind of a pain in the butt to begin with, having it be pitch black on a black background on top of that is just mean.

(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/WoD/screen0960_zpststfc882.jpg~original)
I'm considering to make the red parts into glowmaps for it actually, Because I never subscribed to the 'no ambient lighting is immersive' school of thought that some people on hlp seem to enjoy so much. I very much enjoy seeing what I'm shooting at.
(http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s490/kingspoon/WoD/screen0961_zpssskgz1j9.jpg~original)
Then again, can't really beat freespace's giant particle spews on damaged ships for visibility.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LoneFan on July 05, 2016, 01:42:09 am
Yeah, I remember the Pegasus mission in FS2. It was actually a good thing the mission took place in nebula, it would have been cruel otherwise. And I cant tell you how many times I would have passed up an enemy fighter if it wasn't bracketed. 
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: FrikgFeek on July 15, 2016, 01:28:18 pm
Huh, wouldn't the standard WoD bright and thick engine trails kinda fix most issues with poor visibility? They're super useful for tracking untargeted or stealth ships.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on August 01, 2016, 06:07:38 pm
Trying to make these dev posts a semi regular thing so everyone can stay under the illusion something is happening up to date on the progress.

First off some bug hunting, turns out there has been a naughty bug hiding in the multilock code with regards to heatseekers. As it happens, heatseekers will effectively always go for countermeasures over any other target, if a CM is in sight, not exactly intended behavior as it makes 50% of all missiles in WoD considerably less effective. Woops.
Something I should have noticed much earlier, but only did recently as I was testing out AdmiralRalwood's addition of +Pulse Interval
Observe glorious bughunting in this thread (http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php?topic=92256.0) (along with all the wrong assumptions I make, good thing AdmiralRalwood actually knows what he is talking about.)

Second off, embracing PBR. Something the mighty wizard Swifty has been working on for a long time has been added to the nightlies recently. Boy, does it make beams and glows and every thing look so good. On the unfortunate flipside, turns out it brings a lot of extra (unforseen) work with it. As the shine on the majority of ships now looks really off (kind of a plastic wrapping effect) and it means learning how to make a decent looking reflect map and then... doing it for a whole lot of models.
I'll be honest, not exactly thrilled about that, it's a lot of work that isn't really the fun part of game development. The end result should be worth it though!

And then in updated ship news:
(http://i.imgur.com/CLkF3O0.jpg)
The Ray MkIV was still in line for it's update

(http://i.imgur.com/BkC23Vr.jpg)

And another fourth generation fighter craft also makes its debut; the CRF Templar:

(http://i.imgur.com/jL9Hy9S.jpg)
Model by Hades

Both fighters are currently undergoing test trials on the Guardian Angel. Maybe if Dawn asks the test pilots nice enough, they'll let her try them out.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on August 01, 2016, 06:21:57 pm
They're both beauties. The Templar is a CRF exclusive design?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Rodo on August 01, 2016, 08:58:13 pm
They sure look quite good now.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on August 04, 2016, 09:18:25 pm
They're both beauties. The Templar is a CRF exclusive design?
Yeah, though unforunately, the CRF struggle designing modern fighters. So the Templar performs more like a 3.5 generation fighter. It will probably not end up being the favorite for a lot of people.


So onto another little bit of devving
Out of the four medium primary weapons (the four weapons you got to choose from episode 1), its been bugging me why the CHI-MPC1v Proton just didn't really felt right to use. On paper it's not a bad weapon at all... but when given the choice, I found myself always gravitating towards loading up the VK-03N instead. And I got the impression from players that they too, rather have the DAKKA DAKKA over the pew kew. I thought it over for a bit, and decided on doing two simple adjustments, the first was switching it from cycle firing to burst firing. I figured that maybe the weapon is just too slow firing to be proper for cycle firing. Since it has a rate of fire of once per second, making it more than twice as slow as the VK03N.
Second off, I fiddled a bit with the sound effect, gave it a bass boost, mixed in another sound effect etc. to make it sound a bit less like a pewpewlaser.
Minor tweaks, it still has the same raw stats as before; the result: https://my.mixtape.moe/lhnulh.webm
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: niffiwan on August 04, 2016, 09:54:26 pm
looks & sounds good, and I do like alpha (IMHO it better suits joystick style play :))
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Phantom Hoover on August 05, 2016, 08:31:33 am
the ray looks great, the templar looks too flat and planey
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Droid803 on August 05, 2016, 08:03:32 pm
This is some nice lookin' stuff.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LoneFan on August 06, 2016, 02:53:17 am
the ray looks great, the templar looks too flat and planey
It looks like a beefed up caliburn with more armor. https://youtu.be/AnBAroskMTo (https://youtu.be/AnBAroskMTo)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Mammothtank on August 06, 2016, 04:23:55 am
I don't really have a problem with the Templar. But there's just something that I can't put my finger on about it.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on August 06, 2016, 08:25:36 am
Here's a shiplab rotation of the Templar: https://my.mixtape.moe/gbjagg.webm
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Phantom Hoover on August 06, 2016, 08:55:04 am
i like the no-cockpit look
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: FrikgFeek on August 06, 2016, 10:01:52 am
Well, that sure looks lively and cheerful for what is basically a flying coffin.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: niffiwan on August 06, 2016, 07:27:49 pm
looks good  :yes:

Also makes me think there's a bug in the code, the thruster plume seems to vanish when the origin (i.e. nozzles) is out of sight, but the plume should still be in sight.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on August 06, 2016, 09:33:51 pm
looks good  :yes:

Also makes me think there's a bug in the code, the thruster plume seems to vanish when the origin (i.e. nozzles) is out of sight, but the plume should still be in sight.
As far as I know, this has always been how it was. It'd definitely be nicer if the plume was always properly visible as it should be though!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LoneFan on August 07, 2016, 01:23:18 am
Here's a shiplab rotation of the Templar: https://my.mixtape.moe/gbjagg.webm

Actually I like the no-cockpit look. I just like pointing out its really more functional than standard cockpit would be. Also, doesn't the new caliburn actually have a traditional cockpit? Can't seem to find a picture anywhere. Looks like they've all been taken down.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on August 07, 2016, 07:31:48 am
Caliburn has a 'coffin' cockpit too, the black part is not actually glass
(http://i.imgur.com/hfrhB7k.jpg)



On a different note, photobucket has suddenly decided to resize every image in existance down to 1024x786, in the year 2016, because they like going out of business I guess.  :blah:
Guess I'll move to imgur
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: FrikgFeek on August 07, 2016, 11:35:43 am
Well, if it's as slow and sluggish as it was before a "coffin" cockpit would fit nicely :P
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LoneFan on August 07, 2016, 05:41:55 pm
Well, if it's as slow and sluggish as it was before a "coffin" cockpit would fit nicely :P
Now now, that just adds a bit to the challenge. I happened to love the original caliburn,  so much firepower.

Getting attacked while trying to kill a particular cordi fighter. "Just form a line and I'll be with you in a minute." :lol:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on August 07, 2016, 09:37:52 pm
If memory serves, the Caliburn in old wod had rotation values of 4+
So with 3.4 3.8 it at least has that beat! For comparison, the Ray MkIII has 2.9 2.9.  The GTF Perseus rotates at 3.3 3.3


So in other dev news (hey, since I'm posting anyway), the species I'm currently working on are the Cordi. Honestly was kind of stumped on what to do with them. I had already changed their models from old WoD, but they still had that tiling (vasudan) texture going. But uh, I still don't really consider myself a texture expert or anything, and space bugs is a different style from all the other ship textures ingame. So without a real plan or a real inspiration, I just started ~trying~ things. Basically the 'throw stuff at wall and see what sticks' approach.

The result so far is not what I would consider amazing, but I feel its pretty passable at least. And compared to the old tilling texutre, I'd say it's a pretty big improvement. I'm also happy with how the turrets work with the rest of the ship (Red ones are anti capital turrets, teal ones are point defense), making it look like silly bug eyes of sorts.

(http://i.imgur.com/h15vLEl.png)

Still at least 3 more models that need to be done for them, so work a plenty.
There's also a plan to rework the Hertak ships into something thats quite a lot different looking from their old spikey look. (And unlike the Cordi, there's actually a concept to work with there) But that's still a fair amount out, and a fair amount of more work.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LoneFan on August 08, 2016, 01:09:31 am
Is that the cordi gunship, massive improvement. Hmmm, are those little holes missile launchers. These actually have kind of a "Star Control" feel to them.
(http://orig13.deviantart.net/fe04/f/2011/182/4/e/the_spathi___fwiffo_by_dczanik-d3kmjil.jpg)

As far as armor goes, I always considered that the cordi's was comparatively lite. How about giving them the highest armor regen in the game and balance that out so as to make the bio-engineering in their ships more sensical. 

That brings back an old idea of mine.Way back I was thinking about how the cordi would have initially resisted Hertak encroachment into their territory given how week they appear in the original WOD. Obviously, and I think this was even suggest in-game during mission 19 Breakthrough,  that the cordi had ships and weapons back then that would have been much more effective.

Here are the ideas I came up with to explain the situation.
One such concept was a cordi battleship capable of going toe to toe with Hertak Armageddon dreadnoughts, but this seems a little out of character for the bugs.
Another was a strike craft or bomber capable for swarming and destroying Armageddons, I kinda liked this one. 
The final concept would be a super weapon.
For this I finally settled on was a sort of plasma area effect weapon that, because of its unusual characteristics, penetrated shields and eats away at enemy's hauls, small craft die first, larger hips later and cordi ships would be immune from this effect due to their organic hauls.
The area of effect would be massive and I would suggest just using the FreeSpace2 nebula effect.

Any thoughts.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on August 08, 2016, 10:16:18 am
Hah, definitely Backwards Utilizing Tracking Torpedo's  :p

The Cordi's backstory is now quite a bit different from how it was before, but you wouldn't mind if I take inspiration from:
Quote
The final concept would be a super weapon.
For this I finally settled on was a sort of plasma area effect weapon that, because of its unusual characteristics, penetrated shields and eats away at enemy's hauls, small craft die first, larger hips later and cordi ships would be immune from this effect due to their organic hauls.
The area of effect would be massive and I would suggest just using the FreeSpace2 nebula effect.
This idea, would you?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dragon on August 08, 2016, 12:44:32 pm
Were the Boron from the X series an inspiration for the new Cordi design? It resembles their early vessels somewhat.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on August 08, 2016, 01:05:38 pm
I've never played any of the X games
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LoneFan on August 09, 2016, 01:32:50 am
Hah, definitely Backwards Utilizing Tracking Torpedo's  :p

The Cordi's backstory is now quite a bit different from how it was before, but you wouldn't mind if I take inspiration from:
Quote
The final concept would be a super weapon.
For this I finally settled on was a sort of plasma area effect weapon that, because of its unusual characteristics, penetrated shields and eats away at enemy's hauls, small craft die first, larger hips later and cordi ships would be immune from this effect due to their organic hauls.
The area of effect would be massive and I would suggest just using the FreeSpace2 nebula effect.
This idea, would you?
YES, I contributed, please by all means help yourself.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on August 09, 2016, 04:00:16 am
I remember that there were some efforts to make animated hull textrues for Vorlon and Shadow ships in TBP so their hulls could have moving patterns like in the TV show, but I don't know if that was ever accomplished/finished.

Any chance you or someone else could do something like that for the Cordi? Having the patterns on their hull move would make them look that much more alive (for the big ones anyway, since you don't see the small ones long enough to notice such sublte changes with them scittering around all over the screen ^^) .
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LoneFan on August 09, 2016, 04:19:10 am
I remember that there were some efforts to make animated hull textrues for Vorlon and Shadow ships in TBP so their hulls could have moving patterns like in the TV show, but I don't know if that was ever accomplished/finished.

Any chance you or someone else could do something like that for the Cordi? Having the patterns on their hull move would make them look that much more alive (for the big ones anyway, since you don't see the small ones long enough to notice such sublte changes with them scittering around all over the screen ^^) .
I seem to remember that XY warships have animations like that. They look kind of like amorphous liquid metal, it's a cool affect.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dark Hunter on August 09, 2016, 04:26:28 am
I've never played any of the X games

I just started playing X and I was going to ask if it was an inspiration. Go figure.

The Xenon M (at least as it looks in the first game) reminded me a LOT of Zy fighters.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dragon on August 09, 2016, 05:50:17 am
I remember that there were some efforts to make animated hull textrues for Vorlon and Shadow ships in TBP so their hulls could have moving patterns like in the TV show, but I don't know if that was ever accomplished/finished.
It worked, at least for the Shadows. This is a good idea, but the animations should be short and there shouldn't be too many separate animated textures. I don't know if anything was done about BMPMan limits recently, but using lots of animated textures was a good way of running headfirst into them.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: FrikgFeek on August 09, 2016, 09:10:15 am
.apng support helps with BMPMan limits but I'm not sure .apngs can be used for textures.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: AdmiralRalwood on August 09, 2016, 12:24:49 pm
They can, but AFAIK using an APNG in a non-streaming fashion (like an animated texture instead of a headani) will still result in each frame taking a BMPMAN slot.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: niffiwan on August 09, 2016, 06:52:16 pm
Yeah, apng's used for textures will use a bmpman slot per frame.

Also, apng's are not really recommended for "release" textures, use an EFF with DDS frames instead to save of video RAM.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Misuzu Stella on August 31, 2016, 09:12:27 pm
Hidden Text: Show
(http://i.imgur.com/xneHPpF.png)
Hi!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: QueenHolley on August 31, 2016, 09:22:06 pm
Hidden Text: Show
(http://lazymodders.fsmods.net/axemart/JAD/MFW/holley_boast.png)
Blonde power, unite!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: FrikgFeek on August 31, 2016, 09:58:23 pm
Since when does Misuzu even know what a brush is? Her hair looks surprisingly spike-less.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: niffiwan on September 01, 2016, 12:27:15 am
 :yes:  Nice to see WoD getting some animated VN love :)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LoneFan on September 01, 2016, 01:52:14 am
Ah! The anticipated return of the Bug Destroyer.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on November 11, 2016, 01:11:45 pm
I'd really like to make these development update posts more often, unforunately there's a lot of times in development when there is just not a lot to actually show. Showing off a new spaceship model or pretty new shield effects and such is easy, but a lot of other work doesn't always lend itself so well for showing off. (Though on the note of models, Hades made an awesome starbase that is currently in queue, waiting for me to get in the mood for texturing). So I figured I'd talk abit about what I've mostly been doing in recent weeks, drawing characters.

Back in 2015, not too long before the release of the first episode of the redone WoD, I learned of the existence of Emofuri, a japanese program that allows you to 'animate' a drawing by manipulating layers. It rotates, scales and translates various layers and creates a beautiful illusion of movement. For me it was love on first sight, a wonderful tool that makes up for my own lack of animation skills and talent. Back then though, there was no support for really using this in Freespace yet. Additionally, Emofuri is a demanding mistress who requires layers to be setup in very specific ways and things to be drawn in a way I hadn't done with anything before yet. It was effectively impossible to convert any already done art for use with Emofuri, and I wasn't quite feeling up to redrawning everything I had just done. So I decided to explore the program for future use, but to go ahead with releasing the first episode as planned.
2016 is coming to an end, and the Freespace landscape has changed once again, ever evolving and developing. Archwizards like Niffiwan and Axem developed APNG support and created arcane lua scripts that allow mere mortals to super easily create all these insane visual novel segments in a space sim engine from 1999. Meanwhile I've obtained a level of mastery of Emofuri, with all of its moonrunes, that I would really like to use with WoD (had plenty of practice because of JAD!) so redoing character portraits has been the name of the game for me recently.

Now you may think "but Spoon, showing a newly drawn character is just as easy as showing a new spaceship model". Well, you are not wrong. It is just that so far every character I've done is very much naked, which would make for a very nsfw blog :p
"Then why are you drawing them naked you old perv?" is perhaps the next thing you'd ask. To which the answer is that 1. It's a good base to work from. If I want to give a character different clothes it's easiest for me to draw them ontop of the naked body. Especially because of the way Emofuri wants the layers setup. 2. I wasn't sure yet what I wanted to do with the uniform and flightsuit designs (still am not atm) 3. I'm a perv and I like to draw boobs.
Now one other thing you may or may not be thinking is "Drawing characters shouldn't take you this long!". But alas, I am really just that slow. I'm a ultra rare specimen (dumbass) that draws things with a mouse and the Photoshop pentool. I can't really churn out flawless characters in the span of a few hours, I'm just not that good. Additionally, setting a portrait up for Emofuri easily doubles the time it takes for completion. 

Allow me to give a very basic rundown how a .psd for Emofuri has to be setup:
In a nutshell, there is the body layer, the face layer, the eyes which are split into the white, shadow, the iris and the outline. Then the eyes at a half closed state (white, shadow, outline) and closed eyes. The various eyebrows, and mouth layers that have an open and closed state. The hair is generally split up in front hair and back hair, but requires multiple layers to look good when doing a ponytail and such. When adding custom layers in Emofuri you have to define what it is attached to and what kind of physics it uses (its is pretty often trial and error).

But it often gets a bit more tricky and more ahead thinking and planning in layer setup is required. To give an example:
(http://i.imgur.com/JXUcln1.jpg)
For Kunoichi her hair has 6 seperate layers on different depths with different properties. The hair back layer for example has to move with the rest of the head, but its not allowed to sway. The side hairs had to be on seperate layers or else they'd be in conflict with the scarf in terms of depth. The scarf had to be divided in two layers, the front part isn't allowed to sway and has to be infront of the face layer, the back part is behind everything else and is allowed to move. Usually arms and hands and such just go onto the body layer, but since the hand is infront of the scarf and the rest of the body isn't, on to its own layer it goes.

Now when doing layers that are normally hidden behind a layer infront of it, I was used to just draw up until the point at which it was visible. I mean, whats the point of drawing a hairstrand that goes behind the face and won't be visible at all, right?
Like here:
(http://i.imgur.com/7x89Ups.jpg)
I'd draw the hair lines right up to the jawline and donezo. But I can't be lazy like that anymore.
Cause just slant the head and:
(http://i.imgur.com/mzI1X2H.jpg)
Out comes the hair that was previous hiding behind the face.

So there we go, stuff I've been up to. Drawing animu grills for some niche dying space game.

Let's end this entry with a wip old-new comparison:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: FrikgFeek on November 11, 2016, 05:14:50 pm
No matter what anyone else says, animating still images is black magic. Spoon has been practising the dark arts for the past year, his soul now lost to the black mage Axem.
Then again, you don't really need a soul to make full conversions of some 1999 space game that nobody remembers.

Serious talk though, if all this is being done now, including all the remodels and the all the arcane .tbl exploration would it mean the delay between ep2 and ep3 would be a bit shorter than ~2 years?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on November 11, 2016, 06:18:52 pm
At the risk of sounding like a Chris roberts, I really like to answer that question with a yes. But release estimates are notoriously tricky.
I mean, in my mind when I released episode 1 in 2015 I had fully thought that most of the groundwork was done, and that I'd could start on episode 2 pretty soonish and have it out of the door in a bit more than a year. But then, that evidently totally didn't happen. I willingly sold my soul to the black mage Axem for about a year, doing stuff for JAD. And then there's unplanned stuff like doing reflect maps for the new PBR code, and a whole load of models did end up getting reworked and updated kind of on a whim.
I'm also redoing a few mission related things to episode 1 to improve the flow of the campaign and such. (I think I've even made the Ray 1 a bit more fun to fly)

But in an ideal world, when epsiode 2 releases the game should be in such a solid state that the vast majority of work thats then done on episode 3 is mission/content focused and not the stuff that facilitates it.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: FrikgFeek on November 11, 2016, 06:59:36 pm
I'm also redoing a few mission related things to episode 1 to improve the flow of the campaign and such.

Neat. Would that include some kind of dragonfly buff? With how sweet it looks it's a shame that the Ray outshines it in almost every way.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on November 11, 2016, 08:17:30 pm
Well, it's intended that the Ray should feel like the newer generation fighter compared to it. But I really haven't had that much feedback on this, what kind of improvements do you think the Dragonfly would need to be a semi-viable alternative to the Mk III?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Thisisaverylongusername on November 11, 2016, 08:24:05 pm
I already prefer to fly the Dragonfly over the Ray Mk III. Maybe it's just that I like firing all 8 guns.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: FrikgFeek on November 11, 2016, 08:34:16 pm
So the ray3 is a jack of all trades and it's half a gen ahead of the dragonfly, but the problem is that compared to the dragonfly it's almost a MASTER of all trades. It's tougher, faster, more manoeuvrable, has glide, higher total secondary armament, and more versatile primaries.

I think the dragonfly would feel better as a more specialised design. Maybe make it faster and slightly more manouverable than the ray3(with added glide?) but reduce its shields and armor even more below the ray.  Maybe instead of glide it could be given side-thrusters for a bit of extra manoeuvrability(and style) in dogfights. It still wouldn't infringe on the Kaze in terms of pure speed but it would be kinda like the Ray3-E from the oldwod. More Serapis than Horus to the Ray3's Perseus. Just some checkbox it would have over the ray3 aside from "2 extra pews".

That way it'll be glass cannon compared to the ray3 lightning bruiser. Maybe also expand on that idea of "goes fast and kills fast but also goes down fast" by slightly expanding one of the secondary banks. Having 3 small banks makes it hard to get a good balance of dumbfires and other missiles. Having 1 bank a bit larger to fit in at least ~100 LDRPs would give it more secondary versatility. Fill up only 1 bank with LDRPs which gives you 2 banks for situational missiles. Having both HLP-1s and Darts would be quite useful.

Even if it's overall power level would still be below the ray3 it would offer a different way to play. Use your manoeuvrability and firepower to kill everyone before they chew through your squishy hull rather than the more balanced ray3 that can take it as well as dish it out(well, if you mess with the AI tables the ray3 stops being all that amazing at tanking firepower :P).
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on November 11, 2016, 09:35:38 pm
Good feedback! I'll give it some thought.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on November 12, 2016, 10:46:32 pm
Some thought has been given and the changes I decided to make to the Dragonfly-ex is a significantly stronger afterburner, increasing it from 140 to 170, with an acceleration speed of 0.5 seconds to reach 63% of its top speed. To increase the contrast with the Mk III a bit in this regard, the Mk III got its afterburner acceleration time doubled, from 0.7 to 1.4. Which is still really fast, but now the Dragonfly feels considerably more snappy when accelerating in comparison.
Additionally, its secondary banks went from 15 15 15 to 15 25 15. It's still 55 total vs 80 total capacity, but the gap has been decreased a bit.

Fiddling with numbers like this has always been one of my favorite things to do.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LoneFan on November 13, 2016, 12:58:44 am
So the ray3 is a jack of all trades and it's half a gen ahead of the dragonfly, but the problem is that compared to the dragonfly it's almost a MASTER of all trades. It's tougher, faster, more manoeuvrable, has glide, higher total secondary armament, and more versatile primaries.

I think the dragonfly would feel better as a more specialised design. Maybe make it faster and slightly more manouverable than the ray3(with added glide?) but reduce its shields and armor even more below the ray.  Maybe instead of glide it could be given side-thrusters for a bit of extra manoeuvrability(and style) in dogfights. It still wouldn't infringe on the Kaze in terms of pure speed but it would be kinda like the Ray3-E from the oldwod. More Serapis than Horus to the Ray3's Perseus. Just some checkbox it would have over the ray3 aside from "2 extra pews".

That way it'll be glass cannon compared to the ray3 lightning bruiser. Maybe also expand on that idea of "goes fast and kills fast but also goes down fast" by slightly expanding one of the secondary banks. Having 3 small banks makes it hard to get a good balance of dumbfires and other missiles. Having 1 bank a bit larger to fit in at least ~100 LDRPs would give it more secondary versatility. Fill up only 1 bank with LDRPs which gives you 2 banks for situational missiles. Having both HLP-1s and Darts would be quite useful.

Even if it's overall power level would still be below the ray3 it would offer a different way to play. Use your manoeuvrability and firepower to kill everyone before they chew through your squishy hull rather than the more balanced ray3 that can take it as well as dish it out(well, if you mess with the AI tables the ray3 stops being all that amazing at tanking firepower :P).

I like many of these ideas.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LoneFan on November 13, 2016, 01:18:31 am
Some thought has been given and the changes I decided to make to the Dragonfly-ex is a significantly stronger afterburner, increasing it from 140 to 170, with an acceleration speed of 0.5 seconds to reach 63% of its top speed. To increase the contrast with the Mk III a bit in this regard, the Mk III got its afterburner acceleration time doubled, from 0.7 to 1.4. Which is still really fast, but now the Dragonfly feels considerably more snappy when accelerating in comparison.
Additionally, its secondary banks went from 15 15 15 to 15 25 15. It's still 55 total vs 80 total capacity, but the gap has been decreased a bit.

Fiddling with numbers like this has always been one of my favorite things to do.
You know. I have had too much fun with the dragonfly. I would hate to see it become obsolete too quickly. How about third upgrade to come later Dragonfly-EX-S.
Dragonfly -> Dragonfly-Extra -> Dragonfly-Extra-Special.  Its like a pokemon.

For the EX-S upgrade, I would recommend a more powerful power source resulting in more weapon energy, faster boost recharge, and new more powerful shields.
The question here should be, is this Tempests custom upgrade for snarky, or a commercially available upgrade from the UGC in an attempt to keep one of their best selling products relevant.

"With this last upgrade kit, there has to be at least one more market cycle left in these birds." 
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dragon on November 13, 2016, 05:49:05 pm
Now you may think "but Spoon, showing a newly drawn character is just as easy as showing a new spaceship model". Well, you are not wrong. It is just that so far every character I've done is very much naked, which would make for a very nsfw blog :p
Perhaps you could upload those to your Deviant Art page? It's already NSFW anyway, and it'd be a good way of showing off your artwork.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on November 14, 2016, 08:35:19 am
You know. I have had too much fun with the dragonfly. I would hate to see it become obsolete too quickly. How about third upgrade to come later Dragonfly-EX-S.
Dragonfly -> Dragonfly-Extra -> Dragonfly-Extra-Special.  Its like a pokemon.

For the EX-S upgrade, I would recommend a more powerful power source resulting in more weapon energy, faster boost recharge, and new more powerful shields.
The question here should be, is this Tempests custom upgrade for snarky, or a commercially available upgrade from the UGC in an attempt to keep one of their best selling products relevant.

"With this last upgrade kit, there has to be at least one more market cycle left in these birds."
Fun fact, there already is a Dragonfly Ex_s in the tables, it's snarky's entry. So would it be Dragonfly Ex-S_S ?  :p
If there are going to be any Dragonfly upgrades in the future, it'd be a custom job. Not even the UGC would think that upgrading a 2.5 generation fighter for the market that is about to be introduced to the 4th generation, is going to be a viable idea.

Perhaps you could upload those to your Deviant Art page? It's already NSFW anyway, and it'd be a good way of showing off your artwork.
I made an imgur album, but I'm kind of iffy about putting the link in any publicly visible places, with imgur being so censor happy when it comes to nipples. I try to have my deviant be for stuff that doesn't appear ingame.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: FrikgFeek on November 14, 2016, 11:43:23 am
Dragonfly-Ex_pimp maybe? Civilian use only, 12 new wings and 22 belts added. Pure style over function, 4th gen be damned :P
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on November 15, 2016, 12:49:33 am
And don't forget the neon lights on the underside of the wings.  :lol:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dragon on November 20, 2016, 05:43:32 pm
I made an imgur album, but I'm kind of iffy about putting the link in any publicly visible places, with imgur being so censor happy when it comes to nipples. I try to have my deviant be for stuff that doesn't appear ingame.
That works just fine, I've seen it. FIY, it can be accessed from any embedded image from it (I sometimes do that when the forum refuses to properly display embedded images).
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on November 21, 2016, 05:11:18 pm
huh, okay well, that's good to know then.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Woolie Wool on November 26, 2016, 05:40:07 pm
Fun fact, there already is a Dragonfly Ex_s in the tables, it's snarky's entry. So would it be Dragonfly Ex-S_S ?  :p

The Dragonfly EX-SS, preferred fighter of the secret Space Nazis faction.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: FrikgFeek on December 10, 2016, 03:26:21 pm
So I edited my ships.tbl to reflect the Dragonfly changes you listed because I wanted to see how much of a difference it would make. While losing glide is still a big price to pay the 170m/s super-accelerating afterburner is definitely fun. It still feels weaker than the Ray3 but it does give me a reason to fly it other than "does slightly higher DPS with primaries".

When you punch that burner to quickly get outside an enemy's shooting FOV and then get behind them it just feels so good. And being able to carry a "good enough" supply of LDRPs in a single bank is rather nice, gives me more opportunity to play with HLP-1s and the Volley.

Ya did good, Spewn.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on December 10, 2016, 03:30:12 pm
Good to hear  :yes:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on January 13, 2017, 08:08:49 pm
I asked Axem if he could add a map of sorts, with like, buttons you can click on, with a mouse. He made the addition to the vn script really quickly. I wanted to shout "it's just a prank bro! I didn't mean it!" but he had already made it so quickly and professionally. So now I'm kind of obligated to make use of it. Delaying the next release of WoD by another 6 months.
I just don't understand gamedevelopment.

I made a youtube of it, you can look at it yourself by clicking on this little box here:
I don't really know how it works, there's a triangle and then images start moving when you click on it. I believe they call it a video on the internets. I'm not really sure.

Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on January 13, 2017, 08:09:11 pm
I swear I'm not drunk.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: FrikgFeek on January 13, 2017, 08:36:21 pm
Are those rapidfire cycle weapons for the UEF? Being able to spray and pray would help with the Ray 1's godawful weapon placement.
Also how long until we have to start buying pictures of ships anime girls to help you release delay WoD?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: AdmiralRalwood on January 14, 2017, 12:48:17 pm
Hmm, excellent; one step closer to Persona: FreeSpace...
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on January 14, 2017, 02:46:37 pm
Are those rapidfire cycle weapons for the UEF? Being able to spray and pray would help with the Ray 1's godawful weapon placement.
The Ray 1 is roughly 10% less of a chore to fly with the new primary and secondary it got.
Also how long until we have to start buying pictures of ships anime girls to help you release delay WoD?
Probably soon, when I run out of funds to keep feeding the Axem that I've got locked in my basement.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LaineyBugsDaddy on January 14, 2017, 08:28:52 pm
I asked Axem if he could add a map of sorts, with like, buttons you can click on, with a mouse. He made the addition to the vn script really quickly. I wanted to shout "it's just a prank bro! I didn't mean it!" but he had already made it so quickly and professionally. So now I'm kind of obligated to make use of it. Delaying the next release of WoD by another 6 months.
I just don't understand gamedevelopment.

I made a youtube of it, you can look at it yourself by clicking on this little box here:
I don't really know how it works, there's a triangle and then images start moving when you click on it. I believe they call it a video on the internets. I'm not really sure.

If Tolwyn still came around here, this would make him livid that he left the rest of FSO behind, because it's just the thing that would let him make Wing Commander Saga actually be able to be like WC3, WC4, and WC: Prophecy. I'm sure it would be possible to have things like a ship's lounge and various NPCs there with branching conversation lines and have different scripted outcomes for various NPCs in different missions based on VN interface interactions now, if someone was willing to get that complex with it.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Jellyfish on January 15, 2017, 06:27:15 pm
I'm sure it would be possible to have things like a ship's lounge and various NPCs there with branching conversation lines and have different scripted outcomes for various NPCs in different missions based on VN interface interactions now, if someone was willing to get that complex with it.
Like the Dreamscape sequences from War in Heaven.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on January 16, 2017, 05:14:38 am
WoD: Challenging the seperation of genres!

I think we need to come up with a new term to describe it. Just Space Sim doesn't cut it anymore... maybe "Visual Space Simulation Adventure"?  :lol:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on January 16, 2017, 10:38:16 am
I asked Axem if he could add a map of sorts, with like, buttons you can click on, with a mouse. He made the addition to the vn script really quickly. I wanted to shout "it's just a prank bro! I didn't mean it!" but he had already made it so quickly and professionally. So now I'm kind of obligated to make use of it. Delaying the next release of WoD by another 6 months.
I just don't understand gamedevelopment.

I made a youtube of it, you can look at it yourself by clicking on this little box here:
I don't really know how it works, there's a triangle and then images start moving when you click on it. I believe they call it a video on the internets. I'm not really sure.

If Tolwyn still came around here, this would make him livid that he left the rest of FSO behind, because it's just the thing that would let him make Wing Commander Saga actually be able to be like WC3, WC4, and WC: Prophecy. I'm sure it would be possible to have things like a ship's lounge and various NPCs there with branching conversation lines and have different scripted outcomes for various NPCs in different missions based on VN interface interactions now, if someone was willing to get that complex with it.
I can't see him being livid about it since it would have meant only now, years after the release of WCS, would he be able to get his hands on it, and then it would have to be implemented into the game, which would take a very long time I'm sure. Would the team even have been able to stay together that long to get the job done? The WCS board is dead, all those guys seem to have gone.

Also, I don't know, would the fork that WCS went on even be a barrier to implementing it on WCS now if they wanted to?

WoD: Challenging the seperation of genres!

I think we need to come up with a new term to describe it. Just Space Sim doesn't cut it anymore... maybe "Visual Space Simulation Adventure"?  :lol:
Spoon called it a Space Opera in his promotional material. I think that fits the bill nicely.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LaineyBugsDaddy on January 16, 2017, 01:14:22 pm
Since WCS hasn't, to the best of my knowledge backported ANYTHING since they forked, yeah, I kinda think it would be. Also, the WCS forums are dead because Tolwyn was a dick got mad about some sort of conflict, I think having to do with a disagreement with the SCP and where the SCP wanted to wait until they had thoroughly tested and debugged the features WCS coders (mostly, Tolwyn I think) added, but Tolwyn didn't care so long as the feature did what he wanted for WCS, and so WCS forked and Tolwyn took his forked FSO and went off to the wcsaga website that he was in charge of and thus did not have to listen to anyone tell him that a feature needed to be stress tested and edge case tested, etc. It's almost like IPAndrews and TBP, only IPA stuck around to whine about how his work was supposedly getting stolen when the community took it upon themselves to fix what he chose to ignore.

EDIT: I think we might be derailing the dev blog. Perhaps WCS discussion should be split off?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on January 16, 2017, 02:09:02 pm
It doesn't matter, because I don't intend to have a discussion in that direction as I see nothing good coming from it. Just remember that history is written by the victors. I've been around long enough to see how many people get chewed up and spat out around here and who does the chewing and the spitting. Be careful of who you trust.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LaineyBugsDaddy on January 16, 2017, 04:06:16 pm
History may be written by the victors, but I was around for the WCS fiasco. Tolwyn would be as helpful as could be about WCSaga stuff when someone needed help, but when the FSO crew kept telling him that a feature wasn't ready for prime time, or that it needed more testing before it could be merged into trunk, he got rude. Tolwyn was someone who, like his namesake character from the Wing Commander games, didn't like being told no.

And that is all I have left to say on the subject. Consider it dropped on my end too.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: X3N0-Life-Form on January 16, 2017, 11:23:56 pm
I wasn't as active when the split happened, so I don't remember how thing went exactly. However, I've never really had much problems with Tolwyn himself to be honest. To me, it's KeldorKatarn that was being a constant dick to everyone and deliberately sabotaged any chance for WCS to have a future of any kind.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LaineyBugsDaddy on January 16, 2017, 11:48:33 pm
Oh Jesus have mercy. I forgot about that guy. Yeah, he was the one who never stopped being a grade 4F prick. Tolwyn just had issues with wanting the features he wanted just as soon as they would let him do what he wanted to do with WCS, and making sure they didn't cause problems elsewhere just wasn't something that mattered to him. He would get downright cranky when the SCP team insisted on doing it right rather than just giving him what he wanted when he wanted it for his pet project. Outside of that, Tolwyn could and would be quite pleasant and helpful. Not sure why he put up with ole' KeldorKatarn's crap attitude. The guy must have been a complete wizard at something Tolwyn needed for his baby; that's the only thing I can come up with.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on January 17, 2017, 08:16:26 am
Okay, that's enough about WCS history.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LaineyBugsDaddy on January 17, 2017, 08:53:32 am
I'm kinda sorry I ever brought it up. I was just thinking that your new feature is kind of the last missing piece for making a true Wing Commander style game on FSO and used a bit of hyperbole about it. Sorry Spoon.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LoneFan on January 18, 2017, 02:12:59 am
I'm kinda sorry I ever brought it up. I was just thinking that your new feature is kind of the last missing piece for making a true Wing Commander style game on FSO and used a bit of hyperbole about it. Sorry Spoon.
I had no idea it was so caustic over at WCS. I thought the end result was spectacular. As for Spoons work, yeah, we're seeing some real innovation with the program. To take it any further we would need a FSO foundation. 
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: FrikgFeek on January 18, 2017, 02:21:50 am
Not sure where you'd actually want to go from here in terms of VN mechanics. You've got pretty much everything you need. Also even if I did know how to expand I'd keep it to myself to avoid further delays :P
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Colonol Dekker on January 18, 2017, 03:58:27 pm
I can personally tell ya that Tolwyn is a national geographic photographer jet setting around the world in RL and probably doesn't remember any of the details you're going on about.


Back in topic though. Will WoD ever feature overdrive weapon mechanics?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: FrikgFeek on January 18, 2017, 04:55:08 pm
Weapon overdrive ala JAD is probably a bit too arcadey for WOD.
Though maybe something that would "overdrive" your weapons with slightly more powerful ones at the cost of shields or engines with a limited number of uses and duration would fit into it.
That or an "alpha strike" script that would launch multiple volleys of missiles from your banks at the cost of locking up missiles for some amount of time.

...**** I'm giving Spoon ideas. RIP 2017 release date.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on January 19, 2017, 10:43:25 am
Spoon called it a Space Opera in his promotional material. I think that fits the bill nicely.
It's an incredible broad term, a lot of games fit that description. Mass effect for example is a space opera, but a completely different beast from a freespace based game.
WoD: Challenging the seperation of genres!

I think we need to come up with a new term to describe it. Just Space Sim doesn't cut it anymore... maybe "Visual Space Simulation Adventure"?  :lol:
Visual Dating* Space Adventure Anime Space Simulation

*there may not actually be dating in WoD.

Back in topic though. Will WoD ever feature overdrive weapon mechanics?
As cool as it is in JAD, it'll likely never be in WoD.

Not sure where you'd actually want to go from here in terms of VN mechanics. You've got pretty much everything you need. Also even if I did know how to expand I'd keep it to myself to avoid further delays :P
(https://i.somethingawful.com/forumsystem/emoticons/emot-argh.gif) keeping ideas from me!

Weapon overdrive ala JAD is probably a bit too arcadey for WOD.
Though maybe something that would "overdrive" your weapons with slightly more powerful ones at the cost of shields or engines with a limited number of uses and duration would fit into it.
That or an "alpha strike" script that would launch multiple volleys of missiles from your banks at the cost of locking up missiles for some amount of time.

...**** I'm giving Spoon ideas. RIP 2017 release date.
Ah ha! You slipped up.
Release confirmed 2019 now.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LoneFan on January 20, 2017, 02:05:25 am
WoD: Challenging the seperation of genres!

I think we need to come up with a new term to describe it. Just Space Sim doesn't cut it anymore... maybe "Visual Space Simulation Adventure"?  :lol:
Visual Dating* Space Adventure Anime Space Simulation

*there may not actually be dating in WoD.

Ok, I ship Tempest x Justice.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Jellyfish on January 20, 2017, 03:46:36 am
WoD: Challenging the seperation of genres!

I think we need to come up with a new term to describe it. Just Space Sim doesn't cut it anymore... maybe "Visual Space Simulation Adventure"?  :lol:
Visual Dating* Space Adventure Anime Space Simulation

*there may not actually be dating in WoD.
Can't date Crystal while playing as Misuzu? Hopes deleted.
We better still be able to grope her.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: FrikgFeek on January 20, 2017, 04:13:09 am
Dating Crystal confirmed as secret unlock. Beat both episodes on super-duper-double-insane hidden difficulty and find all 871 forks to unlock the Crystal route :P
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on January 21, 2017, 01:38:47 am
Route... why do I suddenly have the Type-Moon structure of routes flashing before my eyes where you have to play the entire game/novel through several times...

I don't mind too much in VNs where you can just make a save before the decision or skip though the stuff you already know quickly... but FS2 doesn't have such an option. The missions need to be played and there are no save-games unless you back up your pilot file between missions.

Speaking of which, was creating an actual save-game system ever considered by the SCP? I don't mean in-mission waypoints like in BP, but between missions. With several mods either planning to make branching stories or already doing it, it would be a useful feature.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on January 21, 2017, 12:27:48 pm
I'm not that cruel, it'll only be 869 forks!

An actual save game system has never been created or really considered afaik, but JAD has the campaign map, which could 100% support branching paths. And I'd dare say would be even much more elegant at it than just mudane saves.

On that subject, JAD 2.21 re-re-rerelease soon and 2.22 next month. I put some degree of effort into helping JAD be 11% more rad than before. Be sure to check it out!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dragon on January 21, 2017, 09:32:57 pm
I really like the idea of that ship view. It's not FMVs, but it'll do. :) TBH, a complete lack of this sort of thing in FS was exactly why I always liked Wing Commander better. BP got really creative with their Dreamscape, but as far as character interactions go, I'd rather have something like what you're making.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on February 01, 2017, 10:35:15 pm
It randomly occured to me to look at the WoD tvtropes page, and was pleasantly suprised to see someone having updated it to include NuWoD things. Cheers to whoever did that!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dark Hunter on February 01, 2017, 10:42:22 pm
You're welcome. :yes:

(It was a long, long time ago I added that, though.)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on February 01, 2017, 11:03:11 pm
I'm caught in a time-dilation field. I'm sorry for not noticing it sooner.
It also just occurred to me, that we're approaching the two year mark since the last release. Bloody hell, it feels like it was yesterday. I should redouble my production efforts.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LoneFan on February 03, 2017, 03:35:19 am
I'm caught in a time-dilation field. I'm sorry for not noticing it sooner.
It also just occurred to me, that we're approaching the two year mark since the last release. Bloody hell, it feels like it was yesterday. I should redouble my production efforts.

We need to get you an assistant Spoon.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: JSRNerdo on February 03, 2017, 03:45:44 am
I'm caught in a time-dilation field. I'm sorry for not noticing it sooner.

Does that mean you will stay a 13 year old magical girl forever?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on February 03, 2017, 06:33:00 am
Does that mean you will stay a 13 year old magical girl forever?
Ideally, yes.

The more likely thing to happen is that I'll become a wizard in two months.

We need to get you an assistant Spoon.
With JAD 2.22 getting close to release, Axem promised he'd help out with fredding some. I can't think of a more dependable asssitant.
I've also resolved to do my best to power through the long to-do art list this month, no more playing games. But full on productivity.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Torchwood on February 24, 2017, 03:41:11 pm
I'm caught in a time-dilation field. I'm sorry for not noticing it sooner.
It also just occurred to me, that we're approaching the two year mark since the last release. Bloody hell, it feels like it was yesterday. I should redouble my production efforts.

Great, now I've got the image of Spoon in a Miraculous Ladybug costume stuck in my head.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on February 26, 2017, 02:32:32 am
You can always try to get rid of that by staring into Kyubeys eyes...

/人◕‿◕人\

"Contract?"  :P
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Torchwood on February 28, 2017, 01:49:22 pm
You can always try to get rid of that by staring into Kyubeys eyes...

/人◕‿◕人\

"Contract?"  :P
Thanks to Madoka, I will never look at the Heart of Kandrakar (http://vignette1.wikia.nocookie.net/witch/images/3/34/The_hrart.png/revision/latest?cb=20130927175034) the same way again.

Yeah, I think I'll stick with vivid hallucinations.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Mammothtank on March 02, 2017, 08:44:10 pm
I dunno if I stick with them or the Hounds of Tindalos.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dark Hunter on March 03, 2017, 05:38:07 pm
How do dog monsters that teleport through angles help?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Torchwood on March 06, 2017, 06:22:08 am
It's a good reminder that no matter how bad you think this situation is, Lovecraft can always make it worse.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on March 06, 2017, 03:50:57 pm
I just had a very late thought after looking around and seeing the Ray MkIV and Templar again, would we see Fourth Generation strike craft from either the DD or UGC?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on March 06, 2017, 04:49:16 pm
The 4th gen DD fighter is in the works! Finished the diffuse texture just a few days ago. No plans for the UGC 4th gen, but there's another 3rd gen UGC fighter in the works (model was just recently finished) that's gonna be quite a unique fighter to fly. I'll try do a proper blogpost about it soonish when they're both ingame. (WoD is starting to have a stupid amount of assets, of which 60% haven't actually been used in the campaign yet)

In the meantime, I wish you all a happy Spoon day. (Well, in 15 minutes from posting when the clock hits 0:00 and its 7 march) I once again turn 13 years old.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on March 06, 2017, 05:42:22 pm
The 4th gen DD fighter is in the works! Finished the diffuse texture just a few days ago. No plans for the UGC 4th gen, but there's another 3rd gen UGC fighter in the works (model was just recently finished) that's gonna be quite a unique fighter to fly.
Makes sense when I think about it. They don't need a great deal of force projection as I remember and what has been said about the UGC tells me they're much better at punching people in the wallet than having to have the latest and greatest toys. There's also the mercenary thing and that if they really went for next-gen I could see them getting a production license from the SF.

Quote
In the meantime, I wish you all a happy Spoon day. (Well, in 15 minutes from posting when the clock hits 0:00 and its 7 march) I once again turn 13 years old.
By now I'm no longer sure if this is a blessing or a terrible night for a curse.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Jellyfish on March 06, 2017, 08:32:29 pm
If there are 4th gen fighters, what's the need for 1st gen ones? It's like flying biplanes when there are Raptors and Lightning IIs around.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on March 07, 2017, 06:42:26 am
Other than the first mission taking place during the time the Ray was a fresh design by the UEU, if you remember the fourth mission, it was used again because the Heralds would remember who you were the moment you showed up in a blue-painted Ray MkIII or Dragonfly.

The only other time it was brought up was in the second mission where Justice points out that it wouldn't be smart to use it, hence why the only ship options are the MkIII and Snarky.
Title: Volition your countermeasure code is assbackwards.
Post by: Spoon on March 07, 2017, 09:57:33 am
A tale of missiles and countermeasures

Boy, there are a lot of things you have to start taking into account when making a standalone like WoD. There's this plethora of customizable things that I dont always take the time to think about. They simply get lost in all of the other things, like texturing, drawing, modeling, mission design, writing, interface design and so forth. These take up the majority of my brain cycles.
Things like ship behavior, that is of course at the absolute core of the gameplay, have a lot of variables going for them. Like: What kind of damp values should ship have? A universal value or for ship specific? What about the rotational damp? Banking constant? What kind of speed values should the ship have for each direction, its engine overclock value, its afterburner speed, burn time and recovery rate. The list goes on.

The most recent example that I've been running into are Countermeasures. For the longest of time, this has been extremely low on my priority list. Freespace 2's countermeasure system is extremely simple really. Every ship, every race, all use the same 'Type one' countermeasure. It has the default effective radius of 300 meters and a default effectiveness of 1 for heat and aspect seekers.
I was content with this for a long time, you hear a beep and a yellow triangle shows up on your hud, you press the CM button until the beeping stops. Simple!
Then at some point during development, Dragon made a bunch of custom effects for species specific CM (like the cool flares that Terran ships use). I included them, but I still wasn't really aware just what kind of stinkyhole the underlying countermeasure system was, until the scp coders stumbled upon its dark secrets.

So what exactly smells about the CM system you may wonder, allow me to explain:
As I currently understand it, countermeasures are active for exactly 2 frames. You drop one, it checks if it can spoof anything in those 2 frames, it goes inactive. Until any new CM is dropped. Then every CM currently in the mission becomes active again for 2 frames.
What the poopoo, right?

So in addition to the retail code just being silly, the WoD build with multilock code had an additional issue with heatseekers, if there was a CM in sight, they'd 100% go for the CM instead of any other target, even if the CM wasn't active or in effective radius. I blogged about this issue earlier, but bring it up again because after many months and asking three different coders, Dahblount has totally fixedz0red the issue. Many jubiliations.
Now of course, there is still that dumb 2 frame active behavior. But thanks to this feature that AdmiralRalwood has added, it's possible to set 'pulse intervals' for countermeasures. Making CM behave in a sane way, a way you'd actually expect them to behave from the start.

So now I'm looking into how to balance and rebalance missile seeker strength vs the various countermeasures. And how to make the CM's of various species unique in their behavior, giving the player some more loadout considerations to make. For example making Nordera CM's good against aspect seekers but bad against Heatseekers because their ships produce a lot of heat with all their mechanical moving parts and so forth. There's also the possibility of turning CM's into straight up mines, since they are technically just weapons with an additional flag.
There's a lot of unexplored ground in countermeasure country!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: FrikgFeek on March 07, 2017, 10:22:37 am
Woo, indirect heatseeker buff. This is nice because heatseekers are awesome. They are even more awesome in WoD because the Dart is tabled to fly lead pursuit instead of the standard heatseeker lag curve.

There's also the possibility of turning CM's into straight up mines

Plsno. I am scared of WoD mines.  :shaking:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Torchwood on March 07, 2017, 11:13:23 am
Even with all the bugs, I do like the custom countermeasures in Wings of Dawn. Those flares look damn impressive. Looking forward to see the revised version.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Dragon on March 07, 2017, 04:50:05 pm
Someone remembered that the flares were originally my idea. :) I only vaguely remember the time I was doing stuff for WoD (other than an amusing "Fura'ngle detergent" typo I found in one of the briefings :)), but the CMs were one of the highlights. IIRC, the first iteration of was actually a crazy cluster flare spam in an "atmospheric flight" mod I was working on back in the day (sort of what BP uses now in a few places, though theirs probably isn't a direct a derivative). I had no idea that the CM system was so bizarre, only that it was extremely limited even after the first improvements that SCP made to it.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Joshua- on March 11, 2017, 12:33:03 pm
Quote
As I currently understand it, countermeasures are active for exactly 2 frames.

/me makes plans to replay the FS2 campaign on insanity with VSync turned off.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Torchwood on March 11, 2017, 03:56:40 pm
I've recently tried my hand making my own countermeasures. As it turns out, things that move slowly (capital ships) or not at all are pretty helpless against massed fire from aspect missiles. Standards CMs can make an aspect seeker lose tracking, but that doesn't help the unfortunate target if the missile can still hit with its heading by the time it's spoofed.

The solution is creating a CM that has the "pulls aspect seekers" flag. Many thanks to SCP for that one, by the way. If you time its deployment right, you can create a very cool looking effect where the missiles veer off into space wildly at the last moment. You could use that to make very anime looking ECM jamming effects or give capital ships another defense against guided missiles besides shooting them down - which is not viable against an Itano circus-ful of incoming swarm missiles.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: niffiwan on March 12, 2017, 04:54:32 am
You can also set the "die on lost lock (http://www.hard-light.net/wiki/index.php/Weapons.tbl#.22die_on_lost_lock.22)" flag on aspect missiles to help save slow moving targets, certainly not a pretty as pulls-aspect-seekers though.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on April 03, 2017, 09:28:38 pm
And it has been 2 years since release. To celebrate, please enjoy the cool stories that Enioch will be posting (http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php?topic=93394.0).

In other development news, Axem has updated the HUD and also added health and shield gauges.
(http://i.imgur.com/vIoAKVN.jpg)
Everyday we stray further from Freespace's simulation light.
But I embrace the age of arcade dark.
Don't link the fire, Seraphim one.


Also added to the game is the last 4th generation medium fighter. That's one more thing off the to-do list.
(http://i.imgur.com/qH8LOhU.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/IEZwEzZ.jpg)
The highly maneuverable DD Berkut. With 4 light and 2 heavy mounts, it's not as heavily armed or armored as the Ray MkIV but it comes with reverse afterburner, glide, strafe and it's engine can be overclocked to a high degree. A very dangerous fighter in the hands of a skilled pilot.
Modelled by Hades

Also in the works is the UGCR Vulture (formerly called Leopard), if my idea for it actually ends up working well ingame (that's always a if with Freespace), you'll see why Vulture will be a very fitting name for it.
(http://i.imgur.com/1swpks5.png)
2 heavy and 8 medium guns make this the heaviest medium fighter, though it doesn't come with any secondary banks. These fighters are primarily deployed as fleet defenders by the UGCR, and don't really have the endurance to be doing any kind of long range missions.
Modelled by Axem


Episode 2 is still totally slated to be released sometime this year though.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: niffiwan on April 03, 2017, 09:42:40 pm
Nice fighters, huzzah for the UGCR Vulture  ;7
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on April 03, 2017, 10:07:58 pm
Is that also a new Celestial? Can't quite tell.

The other ships and HUD update, ermegerd.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Torchwood on April 03, 2017, 11:15:27 pm
Good eye, the new and improved Celestial now has 6 medium primaries instead of the anemic 4 you may have seen during Dawn's dreams. And the placement has been much improved.

Sorry, but it will not be featured in Emerald Dreams. Can't be stealing all of Spoon's thunder now can I?

Nonetheless, the other Cyrvan strikecraft are more than formidable as is. You'll never find a more fun bomber to fly than the Verian. Except for Delta 1's suped up Rhea, maybe.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on April 04, 2017, 06:18:02 am
I'll leave it to the campaign experience before making that decision. There will be a Cyrvan bias to deal with.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: FrikgFeek on April 04, 2017, 07:48:23 am
You made a fighter called the DD Berkut and it doesn't even have inverted wings? Spoon, I am disappoint.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on April 04, 2017, 12:20:00 pm
I thought about this and have a question now, if there's a bar-style shield gauge on the HUD, does this mean shields will now be single-section instead of a quadrant shield? Or does the bar display its relative strength by total points, as in 0/150/150/250 of 1,000 is a 55% filled bar?

There's also about four hours until the second anniversary by the release post's timestamp, so here's to more awesome WoD development.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Axem on April 04, 2017, 01:05:17 pm
It's based off of total shield energy. But there's a script that auto balances the player's shields (which can be toggled with Alt+Q), so its like only the player has a single segment shield. Everything else has normal shield quad mechanics.

If you turn off the auto equalization and a shield quad goes below 5%, the shield bar sort of hollows out letting you know that "yo dude, shields may not be effective".
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on April 04, 2017, 01:13:18 pm
Clever. :)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: FrikgFeek on April 04, 2017, 01:18:56 pm
With how low TTK is in WoD I don't think you'll have too much time to check your shield strength gauge before you just die when you **** up and let someone get behind you. Though it's still a pretty cool addition and a bar-type indicator is much more readable than the opacity-based quadrant strength in the default HUD.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Torchwood on April 04, 2017, 01:36:50 pm
Depends on what you're flying. In the test runs, I've found that MCWS are remarkably survivable if you take advantage of your slide controls. Better still, the Zervium and Verian have hitscan beam weapons so no amount of lateral maneuvering can throw off your aim - just point them directly at the enemy and shoot.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: FrikgFeek on April 04, 2017, 01:41:46 pm
The Zervium does lose a turnfight against a Ray3 though, if only slightly. So it's possible to simply stay out of its firing line. And yes, by manoeuvring you can make yourself dodge pretty much any non-hitscan primary.

Though you can still get from full health + full shields to dead in 4.7 seconds against 6 banks of the VK01N and no secondaries. Get hit by some point-blank darts or DRPs and that can easily go under 3 seconds.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on April 08, 2017, 10:17:49 am
Well, the UGC Vulture is in game, with the dubious honor of being the first and probably the only fighter that has thruster bitmaps for rotating and strafing and the like. And boy, what a ride that turned out to be. You see, the way these $Thrusters are defined in the tables did not exactly align with what I considered to be... logical.

From the wiki:

$Thruster:
+Used For:
    Defines the maneuver that triggers the maneuvering thruster
    List of maneuvers: Bank right, Bank left, Pitch up, Pitch down, Roll right, Roll left, Slide right, Slide left, Slide up, Slide down, Forward, Reverse
    Syntax: ("String" "String")

This seems easy enough right? Now, let's get a picture from the interwebs so we're all on the same page:
(https://ibin.co/3INCbBmLoRrp.jpg)

Now :v: in their infinite wisdom thought a bit differently about how these terms are used. The Roll keys are labeled as Bank in the FS2 control keyconfig. While Yawing is Turn.
So okay, weird, but this is the same developer that labeled the biggest capitalship as destroyers and the smallest ones as cruisers, while the inbetween is a frigate and a corvette. So hey, not the first time terms are used a bit differently from the norm.

So I got started with assigning the rcs thrusters in the table entry. The thruster on the top right and bottom left should fire if the ship rolls right, so I'd assign 'Roll right' to these. Now if the ship would slide to the right, I would want the thrusters on the left to engage. When the ship turns right... that would be banking, right? So the thrusters on the left would fire if the ship Banks right.

Ha! Joke is on me. None of these were true.
Cause you see. Banking is rolling. Rolling is turning. Slide right is actually Slide left. But then 'Roll right' and 'Roll left' don't follow that reverse logic of the Slide.
(http://i.imgur.com/OasoNnC.gif)

Makes perfect sense right? When none of the terms in the tables actually correspond to their actual movement and directions are reversed willy nilly. And the only real way to figure it out involves trial and error. Edit table, start up game, see what actually works, edit table, start up game. Rinse and repeat.
So boy, was I bamboozled trying to make any sense of this.

Good times.

But hey, here it is ingame:
(http://i.imgur.com/mCWHEmS.png)
Shooting so many guns at once feels good though.
The ship has a unique way of shielding that sets it apart from other fighters. Its shield mesh only covers the front end. The back and sides are completely unshielded. So the pilot has to keep facing its opponent at all times to keep its strong frontal shield to the incoming fire. (The AI is remarkably good at this, with the right ai profile) It's afterburner only provides a short 2 second speed burst and overclocking the engine doesn't give you that much of a boost.

The Zervium does lose a turnfight against a Ray3 though, if only slightly. So it's possible to simply stay out of its firing line. And yes, by manoeuvring you can make yourself dodge pretty much any non-hitscan primary.

Though you can still get from full health + full shields to dead in 4.7 seconds against 6 banks of the VK01N and no secondaries. Get hit by some point-blank darts or DRPs and that can easily go under 3 seconds.
The Ray3 rotates 2.9 2.9 2.9 vs 2.4 2.4 3.0 of the Zervium, if the Zervium loses this turnfight, its on the pilot!

I'll take a look at the TTK and tweak if necessary, those numbers you say seem a bit on the low end for what I want the player's survival time to be.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: FrikgFeek on April 08, 2017, 11:08:22 am
My numbers are on the low end because I am good at this game so I tweaked both the ai-profiles.tbm and ai.tbl to make the TTK lower.
With the release version a wingman-average Ray3 with 6 VK01Ns would need 7.01 seconds to 100-0 you because it has a 1.2 fire delay scale and the player has a 0.8 damage scale. I momentarily forgot that my version is edited since I did that over a year ago.

Realistic TTK with missiles involved should be around 6 seconds which seems long enough. The player's TTK is around 3 seconds against most Terran fighters, it seemed only fair that the AI should be able to do the same to you.

The Ray3 rotates 2.9 2.9 2.9 vs 2.4 2.4 3.0 of the Zervium, if the Zervium loses this turnfight, its on the pilot!

Whoops, my bad. I think I must've been looking at the Verian when I checked the turn times since it's right under the Zervium and rotates just slighty slower than the Ray3.


Uhmm.... yeahh. If the Zervium rotates faster too then there should be almost no reason it should ever lose to a Ray3 unless its piloted by a complete noob.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on April 08, 2017, 02:35:02 pm
Sounds like the Vulture was made to fly like Descent's Pyro, that's pretty cool.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Hades on June 23, 2017, 10:19:30 am
To dust off the thread and to make my first real post here as a WoD team member guy, I present the Kaze MK2.

More heavily armed and armored, the Kaze Mark 2 can also make use of a special booster package to go, like, double fast or something.

The coloring is just materials at the moment but it's the way that the textures will be done on the basic level.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: QuakeIV on June 23, 2017, 03:55:29 pm
Exciting!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: FrikgFeek on June 23, 2017, 04:15:31 pm
More heavily armed and armoured and it's red so it goes like three times faster.

So... what's the catch? It's rotation times, right? The great holy trinity of numbers to rule all numbers in Freespace fighter evaluation.

Also those x-wings are super sexy.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on June 23, 2017, 04:29:24 pm
While I wasn't particularly a fan of flying it in old WoD, I always really liked the Kaze's design. It's nice to see it getting some love here. I'll probably like flying it more upgraded, and it looks great in that colour scheme too. :)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: FrikgFeek on June 23, 2017, 04:34:38 pm
Yeah, in old wod anything but the Ray3 was kinda pointless until you get the Ray3-E which is basically cheatmode.

Aside from the Aestival but you only get to fly it in a few missions.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Droid803 on June 24, 2017, 03:27:31 pm
(https://puu.sh/wtief/d0c92036c7.png)

:U
I like the face. It's cute.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Darius on June 25, 2017, 07:54:11 am
Incidentally, I'm digging the rotated Kaze 2 as a vertically-aligned fighter design :nervous:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on June 26, 2017, 05:12:33 am
Incidentally, I'm digging the rotated Kaze 2 as a vertically-aligned fighter design :nervous:
Makes me think of:

https://youtu.be/fd_6SYW2xwA?t=53
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on June 27, 2017, 02:25:43 pm
I've had this post reply tab open for roughly 4 days, but instead of actually typing the damn post, I spend most of my time being stupidly absorbed in total warhammer. But hey, finally united and saved the empire, so there's that.
Game development is hard, especially when I can't muster any motivation to do unfun things that are work and effort, and completely make no progress towards that internal deadline I had set for myself.

While I wasn't particularly a fan of flying it in old WoD, I always really liked the Kaze's design. It's nice to see it getting some love here. I'll probably like flying it more upgraded, and it looks great in that colour scheme too. :)
Old WoD's Kaze had a lot of... issues, it wasn't particularly fun to fly with. I think I've adressed most of these issues in nuWoD at least.
Also that is definitely not the color scheme it will end up with. Unless the CRF ends up importing them from the SF...

More heavily armed and armoured and it's red so it goes like three times faster.

So... what's the catch? It's rotation times, right? The great holy trinity of numbers to rule all numbers in Freespace fighter evaluation.

Also those x-wings are super sexy.
There's no catch, it's just a straight up better Kaze!


In other development blog news, once more about missiles. Previously (http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php?topic=74794.msg1844130#msg1844130) when I complained how countermeasures are so backwards, and I finally got a build that fixed all of the issues I had with them, I figured I'd be done with missiles for a while! But as I was test playing, I just couldn't help but keep noticing how bad most missiles seemed at just hitting their damn target. Even missiles like the DHSM-3c Dart, which has a turn time of 0,6 seconds will often just not turn right. Most missiles seem pointless to use at close ranges too. I randomly mentioned/complained about it on irc that I just didn't liked how missiles felt in Freespace, no matter what kind of settings I seemed to fiddle with. This prompted DahBlount to look into the code for me, and he discovered it was actually something simple and silly. It's swarm missiles that can't hit things for ****, and well, most WoD missiles tend to have swarm enabled to some extend.
I didn't really had any indication that making a missile a Swarm, would innately mess with its ability to track. But hey, the more you know.

To give you an idea how it affects missile behavior: https://my.mixtape.moe/njonia.webm with Swarm
https://my.mixtape.moe/jcvmrh.webm With Corkscrew without any twist applied to it.

So I ended up changing most of the swarm missiles to corkcrews instead, but this means I'll have to go mess with all of their turn values again, since over the years I've just been giving them really low values to try and compensate for bad swarm tracking...
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LoneFan on June 30, 2017, 05:09:53 am
While I wasn't particularly a fan of flying it in old WoD, I always really liked the Kaze's design. It's nice to see it getting some love here. I'll probably like flying it more upgraded, and it looks great in that colour scheme too. :)
Old WoD's Kaze had a lot of... issues, it wasn't particularly fun to fly with. I think I've adressed most of these issues in nuWoD at least.
Also that is definitely not the color scheme it will end up with. Unless the CRF ends up importing them from the SF...

More heavily armed and armoured and it's red so it goes like three times faster.

So... what's the catch? It's rotation times, right? The great holy trinity of numbers to rule all numbers in Freespace fighter evaluation.

Also those x-wings are super sexy.
There's no catch, it's just a straight up better Kaze!

I always avoided the Kaze when possible due to its low defense and my play style, so an improved Kaze excites me. It's also worth taking a look at how changes and refinements in weapons between classic WOD and nuWOD have effected its performance.

Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on June 30, 2017, 06:56:34 am
The above post was Spoon's when I first read it, and now it's been deleted and replaced and it's now LoneFan's. I know that post was there before today, and now it's supposedly only been there just under two hours. What's going on??? :nervous:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: FrikgFeek on June 30, 2017, 08:45:46 am
LoneFan ****ed up the quote feature and copied Spoon's post instead of quoting it, that's all.
You're not going crazy.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LoneFan on July 02, 2017, 01:37:50 am
OOPS
..............
............
..........
.........
...... There, all better now.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on July 21, 2017, 02:42:53 pm
Well, missed my own internal deadline for stuff by two months, game development is hard.
Or more precisely, staying motivated and on target is hard. It's not that I set impossible goals, it's just that a lot of development is just kinda unfun work, work that is required to achieve a certain level of quality.

In all honesty, I'm not even sure at this point if I can live up to the promise of a release this year. If I could muster full focus/concentration/motivation and just get a lot of hours in. Sure.
But hey...
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on July 21, 2017, 03:29:56 pm
Because you've now surely fallen deeply in love with War of the Three Kingdoms (Three Kingdoms 2010 as I know it), right? :D
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on July 21, 2017, 04:01:09 pm
It's a nice distraction while I do work that doesn't require a lot of attention.

Perhaps what WoD needs is some good old baby tossing?  :p
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on July 21, 2017, 04:06:41 pm
Well, for a more serious post, I remember marvelling at how long it took to deliver Episode 1, and how people were getting through it in a length of time measurable in hours on one hand. If I had the same ability as you, I would not see that as an acceptable return on investment. The quality gap between NuWoD and old is immense, and yet old still brought me here, as in signing up to post.

http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php?topic=79476.0

I'd discovered this place and been playing for months before that. I may well have never signed up at all without WoD. I certainly had no desire to beforehand until I played through WoD and enjoyed it so much that I felt compelled to talk about it here. Don't feel you have to chase after Blue Planet or anything else to deliver a certain standard of quality. Even Blue Planet seems to be collapsing under its' own weight now with the oracle thread opened out of fear the project will not be finished. WoD doesn't need to collapse under its' own weight, even if you drop standards considerably, it will still outdo old WoD by a wide margin.

As for the baby tossing, The Nordera could perhaps do that with their young, believing it to toughen them up. Those that die in the process were just too weak anyway. They don't seem to have made the connection about the lack of intelligence in their race resulting from being dropped on their heads multiple times when infants.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on July 21, 2017, 05:07:32 pm
They don't seem to have made the connection about the lack of intelligence in their race resulting from being dropped on their heads multiple times when infants.
Their love for fighting ultimately comes from being butterfingers then?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on July 21, 2017, 06:02:58 pm
They don't seem to have made the connection about the lack of intelligence in their race resulting from being dropped on their heads multiple times when infants.
Their love for fighting ultimately comes from being butterfingers then?
  :lol:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on July 21, 2017, 06:19:53 pm
Except in this case the baby is thrown to the ground on purpose rather than because the baby was dropped accidentally.

In the material we're talking about, in one of the most unintentionally hilarious clashings of ancient vs modern values you're ever going to see, a man intentionally throwing his infant son who's just been rescued heroically by the man who hands him over to the ground manages to be by the values of the time seen as a positive thing. You can watch it happen here if you want:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rhdqnsiDSa8

And here someone's had a bit of fun at the end:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QHQPFWWHyMU
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on August 02, 2017, 03:23:55 pm
Another comparison between old and new. Because of the larger portraits, some of the old scenes have to be rearranged a bit, as you can see, the old version easily has enough space for 5 characters on screen at once, but with the larger new size, there's gonna need to be some swapping of positions.
But hey, ~animations~ and stuff. Neat.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on August 02, 2017, 03:38:46 pm
Neat.
Indeed it is.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on August 02, 2017, 07:47:51 pm
I can just imagine Tempest elbowing her way into Dawn's position when she shows up, even though that's not what happened. :)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Axem on August 02, 2017, 08:45:06 pm
(http://i.imgur.com/GAEDQd0.jpg)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on August 03, 2017, 09:28:07 am
Hades' WiP of a Hertak strike craft made me realize WoD never really did have tall ships. While the Fura'ngle capitals are tall, they also have radial width, and majority of others is oriented lengthwise first, width second, with any depth coming from stabilizer structure like the Zy capitals or Prometheus Frame.

I'd like to see how this turns out, if the design theme continues.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on August 03, 2017, 12:56:03 pm
Leaks! Spoils! O:
The Hertak rework is top sekret, I've given Hades' a brutal flogging for being so careless.

But yeah, Hades also noticed the lack of tall ships in WoD, so it was his suggestion to go with height for the redesign. It'll be the theme for all the Hertak vessels.

Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Flak on August 14, 2017, 09:39:35 am
Actually I am also interested in how the Nordera and Fura'ngle look like
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: manwiththemachinegun on August 14, 2017, 03:44:58 pm
You can do it Spoon! You can dooooit!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on August 14, 2017, 07:53:55 pm
Actually I am also interested in how the Nordera and Fura'ngle look like
Ship wise, there were some new additions, but the overal style and design hasn't seen any changes. As for the actual aliens themselves, that will probably forever remain a mystery! Well, the Fura'ngle quite literally become their ships, so I guess your seeing them as they are ingame.

You can do it Spoon! You can dooooit!
Thanks, I try!  :D
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: manwiththemachinegun on August 15, 2017, 01:15:27 am
Ah well, I scream on the Penny Arcade space sim thread whenever there's a new, big FS2 release on Hard Light, so know there's definitely an interest in your work still!

Think of it this way, you've already made more content than Star Citizen! *badum-tish* ;)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: QuakeIV on August 16, 2017, 12:34:16 am
You can do it Spoon! You can dooooit!
Thanks, I try!  :D

You can (https://i.ytimg.com/vi/kmqOV4JkRcs/hqdefault.jpg)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on August 16, 2017, 09:21:43 am
Ah well, I scream on the Penny Arcade space sim thread whenever there's a new, big FS2 release on Hard Light, so know there's definitely an interest in your work still!
Getting the word out is always super helpful! (Especially since I'm objectively garbage in promoting things myself)

Think of it this way, you've already made more content than Star Citizen! *badum-tish* ;)
Well, that's a rather low standard to overcome :P
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on August 16, 2017, 10:41:56 am
I know I'm totally late to comment (two weeks? Did I really not check HLP that long?), but that looks really nice.

Though I do have a suggestion. Would it be possible to make the frame and/or background of the currently talking character brighter (or stand out in some other way) while they talk, to make it easier to keep track of who's speaking right now?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Axem on August 16, 2017, 06:18:52 pm
That is quite doable and thus, I have added to my to-do list.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on October 16, 2017, 06:54:06 pm
I dont like making these kind of posts, and it pains me to keep making them, but yeah, a release this year is definitely not happening.
There's just so much stuff to work on. Because making a quality game takes quality time. (Time I could probably better spend making a game I could actually make money off of, instead of modding for free for a dead game on a dead forum)

Have a whole minute of gameplay footage to ease the possible pain my incompetence may have caused you.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on October 16, 2017, 07:35:33 pm
Aw yiss it's Misu! And a new character for the Guardian Angel.

The Kaze seems like it'll be even more fun to fly now.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LoneFan on October 17, 2017, 06:04:36 am
Wow, so much speed and maneuverability. It seems like the game is progressing away from Star Wars styles physics (which is wrong but fun to fly nonetheless) and toward truer inertial physics, which is trickier but worth the effort.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Enioch on October 17, 2017, 06:17:14 am
Because making a quality game takes quality time.

(https://s1.postimg.org/2rwf1xgc5r/3f0d1390594448c019beefafe7db0182.jpg)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on October 17, 2017, 07:55:31 am
Wow, so much speed and maneuverability. It seems like the game is progressing away from Star Wars styles physics (which is wrong but fun to fly nonetheless) and toward truer inertial physics, which is trickier but worth the effort.
Parts of those were under glide mode, but given it's the Kaze I believe it's already pretty drifty under tight turns.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on October 17, 2017, 06:06:41 pm
Wow, so much speed and maneuverability. It seems like the game is progressing away from Star Wars styles physics (which is wrong but fun to fly nonetheless) and toward truer inertial physics, which is trickier but worth the effort.
Parts of those were under glide mode, but given it's the Kaze I believe it's already pretty drifty under tight turns.
Yeah that's just glide, the Ray 3 could have done similar movement. There's not any real push toward truer inertial physics. Though you can get pretty close to it, in a ship that allows for movement on all axis and has glide. (Like the Cyrvan fighters for example)

<pic>
If I had a desktop near my toilet, I'm sure I'd produce my best work there.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on October 19, 2017, 12:07:44 pm
Oh no, not the Alligator again! It took me forever to clear that mission in old WoD! :D
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on October 19, 2017, 12:50:37 pm
*Aligator
It's a completely different animal, I swear
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on October 19, 2017, 01:01:33 pm
Why only one L?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on October 19, 2017, 01:16:59 pm
Because I mispelled the name in old WoD, got made fun of, and for some time, I didn't understood what it was, that people found so odd about 'Aligator'. Now it's a bit of a dumb injoke, and I'm making fun of myself, many years later.

Now it's canon WoD lore that an Aligator is a different animal than an Alligator.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on October 19, 2017, 01:21:08 pm
Heh. :)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Droid803 on October 19, 2017, 10:44:11 pm
Does it have to e an animal?

Aligator, one who "Aligates" (presumably)
Aligate(d), non-ligate(d)
ligated, to ligate (past tense)
ligate, verb (surgery) to tie up or otherwise close off (an artery or vessel)
Not closed of arteries or vessels = bleeding

Aligator - one who leaves people bleeding? :nervous:
Yeah okay, that's some word hoops to jump through to get to that definition but hey, is pretty cool~
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: niffiwan on October 20, 2017, 07:06:30 pm
:lol:

Love the video Spoon  :yes:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on October 24, 2017, 09:26:50 am
Going from the screenshot in the support board, is the idea to make Cordi ships bleed?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: -Norbert- on October 24, 2017, 10:05:35 am
Bleeding Cordi ships? Where do I have to sign!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on October 24, 2017, 12:06:39 pm
Alas, no. Not that it wouldn't be cool, but it's not possible to define impact effects based on the type of species that it hits.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: manwiththemachinegun on November 02, 2017, 03:38:16 pm
You're really hitting that Macross level of firepower across the board.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LoneFan on November 04, 2017, 10:11:09 pm
You're really hitting that Macross level of firepower across the board.
That would be wonderful and challenging standard to follow. :)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: manwiththemachinegun on November 08, 2017, 12:13:21 pm
The standard by which dakka is judged by. ;)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog update
Post by: Spoon on November 09, 2017, 02:33:54 pm
Hoping I can reach and live up to that standard!


Let's do a transparant development update. I mean, this is what you wonderful backers have pledged tens of thousands of moneydollars for after all, jpg's of ships and the most transparant development in the history of the gaming industry.

A gazillion months after the release of episode 1 later, where are things at currently?

Assets wise, things are looking pretty good, with two models in queue to be textured. And the remodelling of the Hertak capitalships still pending. Once all of these have been added, there's little work left on this front for any future episodes. Almost all of the aliens have had their ship models updated in some form, providing a decent amount of variation to shoot at. 

(https://i.imgur.com/9DQKnvW.png)

Player flyable ships are plenty as well, with 10 unique terran ships plus 6 variants. And 4 unique CSA ships. (Not all of them pictured here)
(https://i.imgur.com/Y29bFRt.png)
Which should help keep the game varied and fresh over the episodes. As you unlock more options to wreak carnage with!

For characters, it's a bit more work left, with four characters that I still have to start on for episode 2, and several characters that still need some degree of work in Emofuri (headani's and VN portraits). Then after this upcoming releases, there's still a few more characters I plan on adding, so there's still some long term effort to be put into this. (A better artist would probably get this done in less than two weeks, but alas, its just me. )

Currently it's already over 240 apng's for 16 characters, coming in at 1.78GB. By my conservative estimate, this number will easily end up reaching 300.

WoD's soundscape has also been much improved, now fully utilizing all of the nice new sound code that has been added recently. Now sounds won't be excessively culled anymore, and sound effects that would repeat a lot, like shield impacts, are now a lot more varied.

As for the actual meat of the game, Missions.
Progress on these have actually only started kind of recently, several of the missions of episode 1 have been reworked/replaced in some form or another. Making the campaign a bit more straight up, 'fly&gun' and a bit less 'gimmicky'. Which I believe is generally more what people want&expect from a campaign (Not to mention that those kind of missions are also significantly easier to make). In addition to reworks, there have also been two extra missions added to episode 1.
Axem has been working on redoing the mission to ambush the Contravention, the mission has become a bit more straightforward and much more cinematic, and ends in a cool final showdown with Ophelia. Really happy with how it has turned out.

(https://i.imgur.com/JCfqJjj.png)
As shown here, Axem has also put some effort into replacing a lot of the big asteroids previously used in WoD. (and considering how many missions seem to take place in the proximity of Asteroids, thats a good thing indeed.)

Episode 2 is roughly 30%ish there in just raw missions. Now 30% may seem like it's not really coming along quickly, but it's not the missions I'm personally concerned about. Missions are relatively quick to create (unless you construct absurdly amazingly complex missions like seen in JAD). It's the visual novel segments that I'm more worried about, there hasn't been that much progress made on them yet, outside of converting the episode 1 ones to the new file version format (which is kind of dumb busy work, but has to be done). There's still a lot of words still to be written. Which then have to be checked&edited by someone.
In addition to that, the backgrounds for the VN parts also still need to be done. Work work.

So when's a release realistically to be expected? As is common in gamedevelopment, its often hard to gauge how long things will take. (Amirite Croberts?) Especially since my motivation to work on things kind of ebs and flows. Some months progress is rapidly made, others... well, not so much.
April maybe? Who knows.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: FrikgFeek on November 09, 2017, 02:50:24 pm
Episode 1 was originally released in April too, so if you manage to release it on the 4th of April it would be a straight 3 years, nice and round.

Also

"Nukes Left : 1" Oh my...
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on November 10, 2017, 08:57:19 am
It's always exciting to see new stuff pertaining to WoD. The ships are turning out great too, there's even a CRF Caliburn.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LoneFan on November 11, 2017, 03:24:28 am
Given all the factions and that in universe each faction has a fleet composition, by faction, how is the games capital ship count looking.
 :doubt:
And how many ships can custom WOD support?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on November 11, 2017, 12:07:45 pm
Given all the factions and that in universe each faction has a fleet composition, by faction, how is the games capital ship count looking.
On average each faction has 2 or 3 capitalships, terrans a few more. Roughly 25ish capships total, give or take
And how many ships can custom WOD support?
Same as regular builds: http://wiki.hard-light.net/index.php/Engine_limitations

Episode 1 was originally released in April too, so if you manage to release it on the 4th of April it would be a straight 3 years, nice and round.

Also

"Nukes Left : 1" Oh my...
Yeah, thats what I was thinking too.

Man... it's been three years already? (I'm suprised anyone is still left)

It's always exciting to see new stuff pertaining to WoD. The ships are turning out great too, there's even a CRF Caliburn.
The CRF have named their Caliburn variant the Excalibur. Can't have enough sacred swords.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on November 11, 2017, 07:10:58 pm
Man... it's been three years already? (I'm suprised anyone is still left)
Boi I ain't simply walking away from WoD.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LoneFan on November 14, 2017, 07:13:40 am
And how many ships can custom WOD support?
Same as regular builds: http://wiki.hard-light.net/index.php/Engine_limitations

That's 500 entries! Just wow, I remember way back being frustrated with a 150ish ship limit. Now there is plenty of room to grow. Just damn, way to go open source team.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LaineyBugsDaddy on November 15, 2017, 12:33:06 pm
That is why we no longer have Inferno builds. They just aren't necessary anymore.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: AdmiralRalwood on November 15, 2017, 04:54:30 pm
That is why we no longer have Inferno builds. They just aren't necessary anymore.
Yes and no; it's not so much that there weren't Inferno builds anymore as there weren't non-Inferno builds anymore; Inferno builds became the new standard (and then the ship limit was doubled from that new standard of 250 to 500 for 3.7.4).
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LaineyBugsDaddy on November 16, 2017, 03:33:38 am
Let me rephrase that. This is why we no longer have separate Inferno builds. Because they all are now.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: manwiththemachinegun on November 21, 2017, 09:42:40 am
Damn it Spoon, my hype levels are now at unsustainable levels. :P
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Bryan See on December 07, 2017, 01:01:22 pm
Given all the factions and that in universe each faction has a fleet composition, by faction, how is the games capital ship count looking.
On average each faction has 2 or 3 capitalships, terrans a few more. Roughly 25ish capships total, give or take
And how many ships can custom WOD support?
Same as regular builds: http://wiki.hard-light.net/index.php/Engine_limitations

Episode 1 was originally released in April too, so if you manage to release it on the 4th of April it would be a straight 3 years, nice and round.

Also

"Nukes Left : 1" Oh my...
Yeah, thats what I was thinking too.

Man... it's been three years already? (I'm suprised anyone is still left)

It's always exciting to see new stuff pertaining to WoD. The ships are turning out great too, there's even a CRF Caliburn.
The CRF have named their Caliburn variant the Excalibur. Can't have enough sacred swords.
Not just those were expressed above. The FSO engine build runs on a same single instance - with the window title name "FreeSpace 2".

The window title name "FreeSpace 2" could be a FS2 mod name or a TC name, which in this case here, "Wings of Dawn" (the first HLP original TC game, the second one is being "Shattered Stars", now restarted development).
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: AdmiralRalwood on December 08, 2017, 09:13:44 pm
Not just those were expressed above. The FSO engine build runs on a same single instance - with the window title name "FreeSpace 2".

The window title name "FreeSpace 2" could be a FS2 mod name or a TC name
What does that have to do with literally anything you quoted? But FYI, yes, a mod table option for setting the window title has been added (http://wiki.hard-light.net/index.php/Game_settings.tbl#.24Window_title:).
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on December 09, 2017, 12:30:39 pm
What does that have to do with literally anything you quoted? But FYI, yes, a mod table option for setting the window title has been added (http://wiki.hard-light.net/index.php/Game_settings.tbl#.24Window_title:).
Oh that's actually neat. The game_settings.tbl just keeps on expanding with nifty new little things.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Bryan See on December 11, 2017, 12:45:48 pm
And what of Knossos? I don't see Wings of Dawn there.

Plus on the HLP projects page, I only see Diaspora. What about this? Could this be described as the "first original TC, anime-themed"?

What does that have to do with literally anything you quoted? But FYI, yes, a mod table option for setting the window title has been added (http://wiki.hard-light.net/index.php/Game_settings.tbl#.24Window_title:).
I mean we could have multiple instances of FSO. One is using FreeSpace 2, while the other runs something else.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: AdmiralRalwood on December 11, 2017, 10:47:37 pm
I mean we could have multiple instances of FSO. One is using FreeSpace 2, while the other runs something else.
I have literally no idea what you're trying to say or what relevance it has to this thread.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on March 01, 2018, 10:27:42 am
And thus we march into march. oh poop, its almost my bday again, can someone stop time? I'm getting too old. And its time for yet another update on development. It's not going to be a long post, but a post it will be.

Development has been steady, some days progress is faster than on others, depending on motivation and willpower, but generally, something is done at least daily. The rough majority of reworking on episode 1 has been completed, though all of the polishing remains to be done. Episode two is coming along pretty well too, with 50% of the missions being done and some 20% of them being works in progress. There's still a lot of visual novel words to be written though. I'm not much of an accomplished writer, I feel good enough if I can get ~700 words on digital paper on a day. Additionally, the friend I rely on for doing editing of my words is currently busy with other work, so there may be some delays there.

I don't really know what else to write here, any questions anyone would like to ask instead? Now is your once in a lifetime chance to get possible answers from such an internet celebrity such as myself!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Nightmare on March 01, 2018, 10:43:33 am
So, chances for a soon release is dropping rather, right? Awww...
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: JSRNerdo on March 01, 2018, 10:58:14 am
And thus we march into march. oh poop, its almost my bday again, can someone stop time? I'm getting too old.

What are you talking about? You're a 13 year old magical girl!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Enioch on March 01, 2018, 01:08:13 pm
So, chances for a soon release is dropping rather, right? Awww...

On the other hand, chances for a Spoon release are right as planned.

[/****post]
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on March 01, 2018, 01:09:49 pm
On the last major post you mentioned four characters in progress for Episode 2. Were they existing characters from the original release or completely new for the remake?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LoneFan on March 01, 2018, 09:33:44 pm
On the last major post you mentioned four characters in progress for Episode 2. Were they existing characters from the original release or completely new for the remake?
and will captain Rance and his naughty crew make another cameo.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on March 02, 2018, 01:01:49 am
What are you talking about? You're a 13 year old magical girl!
True, true. I worry about nothing!

So, chances for a soon release is dropping rather, right? Awww...

On the other hand, chances for a Spoon release are right as planned.

[/****post]
(https://i.imgur.com/CUTtqdC.jpg)

On the last major post you mentioned four characters in progress for Episode 2. Were they existing characters from the original release or completely new for the remake?
Both. Though considering a lot of the characters from oldwod didn't actually have a face or much of a personality, its only really the name that they share at this point.
And that number has gone down to just two characters, both of which are new characters. Once they're complete, WoD's cast will be some 19 characters (including minor roles).

and will captain Rance and his naughty crew make another cameo.
Unforunately, we were not able to negotiate a new contract with Sir Rance ):
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Nightmare on March 02, 2018, 01:22:43 am
Longer waiting time means expecting higher quality of course :D
Not that I'd seriously doubt that I would be dissapointed just to clarify
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on March 04, 2018, 02:35:25 pm
I forget the name of it, but will we see the card game again?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: yomi on March 04, 2018, 07:19:43 pm
Will we see Mizusu and Crystal next episode? :D
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on March 05, 2018, 05:10:04 am
I forget the name of it, but will we see the card game again?
Not outside of the one scene in episode 1

Will we see Mizusu and Crystal next episode? :D
Yes!

Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Enioch on March 05, 2018, 06:14:18 am
I forget the name of it, but will we see the card game again?
Not outside of the one scene in episode 1

Clearly, it is time to introduce Dawn no Tsubasa: the Tabletop RPG as a follow-up.

Cyrvans rolling d20s. What could go wrong?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on March 05, 2018, 06:33:44 am
I forget the name of it, but will we see the card game again?
Not outside of the one scene in episode 1

Clearly, it is time to introduce Dawn no Tsubasa: the Tabletop RPG as a follow-up.

Cyrvans rolling d20s. What could go wrong?
I'm sure there's a meaning behind that second line, but I don't know what it is. However, plenty went wrong for the Cyrvans in my forum game when I was rolling dice for them, even though their fleet was JACKED they barely got to do anything.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: QuakeIV on March 10, 2018, 02:09:06 pm
Hey dude, you should upload to Knossos.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on March 10, 2018, 04:05:01 pm
Does Knossos handle standalone mods?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: wookieejedi on March 10, 2018, 04:29:40 pm
Does Knossos handle standalone mods?

By standalone do you mean one's that use custom SCP builds? It can handle just about anything, TC's, extensive mod dependencies, no dependencies, etc.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on March 10, 2018, 06:40:36 pm
Hey dude, you should upload to Knossos.
Yes (https://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php?topic=94068.msg1858029#msg1858029)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: manwiththemachinegun on March 12, 2018, 12:58:59 pm
And thus we march into march. oh poop, its almost my bday again, can someone stop time? I'm getting too old. And its time for yet another update on development. It's not going to be a long post, but a post it will be.

Development has been steady, some days progress is faster than on others, depending on motivation and willpower, but generally, something is done at least daily. The rough majority of reworking on episode 1 has been completed, though all of the polishing remains to be done. Episode two is coming along pretty well too, with 50% of the missions being done and some 20% of them being works in progress. There's still a lot of visual novel words to be written though. I'm not much of an accomplished writer, I feel good enough if I can get ~700 words on digital paper on a day. Additionally, the friend I rely on for doing editing of my words is currently busy with other work, so there may be some delays there.

I don't really know what else to write here, any questions anyone would like to ask instead? Now is your once in a lifetime chance to get possible answers from such an internet celebrity such as myself!

I have done some freelance book editing for S&S in the past (Dust and Shadow: an Account of the Ripper Killings, and Gods of Gotham). If you need someone to make sure the words on a page sound like the words of a hue-mone, and not just a splurge of red in a Word doc, PM me a page of writing and I'll send it back.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on March 12, 2018, 01:57:39 pm
I might take you up on that offer, will depend a bit on cirumstances.
Thanks in any case  :)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: manwiththemachinegun on March 12, 2018, 08:55:37 pm
Well I'm sure helpless at FREDD-ing, so us mortals have to help when we can. :P
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on March 22, 2018, 07:52:19 pm
(https://i.imgur.com/vYfRqOD.gif)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Nightmare on March 22, 2018, 08:07:40 pm
 :lol:

The joy when all ships are placed...
than spending hours on a single event...
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: QuakeIV on March 22, 2018, 08:08:54 pm
Im semi decent at fredding, would you be willing to send me a simple made up task for me to do to show you that i could be useful?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: JSRNerdo on March 22, 2018, 08:09:15 pm
:lol:

The joy when all ships are placed...
than spending hours on a single event...

Welcome to my life.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Nightmare on March 22, 2018, 08:32:26 pm
Im semi decent at fredding, would you be willing to send me a simple made up task for me to do to show you that i could be useful?

Wat kind of question is that
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on March 23, 2018, 01:46:33 pm
Im semi decent at fredding, would you be willing to send me a simple made up task for me to do to show you that i could be useful?
I appreciate the offer to help, but when it comes to Fred things I'm not currently looking for additional help. Delegating missions and such to others is tricky (to me) for a bunch of reasons. Plus the majority of episode 2's missions are done at this point and the ones that still need making, are missions I'd really have to do myself regardless.

(What I'll need soonish™ are playtesters though, and I do think that having FRED experience helps with that)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: QuakeIV on March 23, 2018, 08:12:29 pm
I'd be down for that.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: manwiththemachinegun on March 26, 2018, 07:10:00 pm
(https://i.imgur.com/vYfRqOD.gif)

Well, at least you can consider yourself fortunate to not be in the boat the poor guy developing Yandare Simulator is. :lol: Practically worked himself to death.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on March 26, 2018, 07:27:59 pm
I always find yanderedev's vids interesting, not because I am in particular interested in the game, but because his vids are just very relatable game development things. He has the additional pressure of having build an absurdly large audience though.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Asteroth on April 15, 2018, 07:47:22 pm
The major difference of course being that you're actually competent in your field and have successfully seen multiple large-scale projects to completion and are capable of working together with other people. I have plenty of confidence that the next chapter of WoD will be released, and I have 0 confidence that yandere sim will ever see the light of something even remotely functional. I mean, have you seen the screenshots of the code he's written?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on April 16, 2018, 08:39:06 am
The major difference of course being that you're actually competent in your field and have successfully seen multiple large-scale projects to completion and are capable of working together with other people. I have plenty of confidence that the next chapter of WoD will be released, and I have 0 confidence that yandere sim will ever see the light of something even remotely functional. I mean, have you seen the screenshots of the code he's written?
(https://i.somethingawful.com/forumsystem/emoticons/emot-allears.gif)


(I'm not a coder myself, I wouldn't know what is bad or good code)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Nightmare on April 16, 2018, 08:46:38 am
Well then tell Yanderedev that there's a forum called HLP, that hosts an engine that's better than anything he could archieve (even if it'd VN wise), with people that know how to get things done.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on May 14, 2018, 10:30:34 am
I don't consider myself much of an actual writer, I don't usually write as a hobby thing, or even do all that much reading either. When I read a piece written in a style I like, I can't even really put into words what I actually like about it. I'm just an amateur really.
Which is probably why I both underestimated the time it would take to write the visual novel parts of WoD, as well as overestimate my 'writing endurance'. Sure if I could write 2000 words per day, every day. The majority of VN files would have been done a week or two ago. But in reality it was more around 900 words on day, when I'm in the mood to write. In addition, the episode 2 vn segments ended up being much larger in comparison to episode 1, because of all the new characters being introduced.

Regardless of facing reality like this, I did end up writing a lot of words these past weeks. And am in the progress of wrapping up the second to last file today, with just one remaining for episode 2. A major milestone, because in the months before starting on this, I had been dreading this seemingly massive pile of 'things to do and write'. And just getting even started on it could feel oddly depressing.
Now that is not to say that I'm actually close to being done on this. All of these files are still without their syntax, variables and the fred missions they have to be put in. (Not to mention all of the testing required afterwards (https://fi.somethingawful.com/images/smilies/negativeman-55f.png)) but hey it's progress.

Game development is hard.

In other news.
Let me shows you two new weapons that have been added to the game. These two blackmarket weapons can be bought in episode 1 (and only in episode 1), so be sure to look out for them when you go shopping at the blue haven colony.

The Ezchalon (https://www.dropbox.com/s/jxhq3lyihoes2c3/Fs2_open_Wings_of_Dawn-EX13-SSE%202018-05-14%2016-54-10-10.webm?dl=0) Scattershot (https://www.dropbox.com/s/sd9tvoo392v67q9/Fs2_open_Wings_of_Dawn-EX13-SSE%202018-05-14%2016-54-29-66.webm?dl=0), a powerful close range medium shotgun, that can fire a burst of 4 shells in quick succession before it has to swap drums. It's not the most reliable weapons, and sometimes a faulty shell may be exploding prematurely, flinging its submunitions in all directions.

And the Mazer (https://www.dropbox.com/s/2l49pwx1lzo7fhr/Fs2_open_Wings_of_Dawn-EX13-SSE%202018-05-14%2016-55-08-66.webm?dl=0), a energy weapon that draws upon surrounding ether to increase its power. Making the weapon exceedingly damaging at long ranges, but performs poorly at close ranges. This weapon will overheat with continuous use, aversely impacting its accuracy.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: FrikgFeek on May 14, 2018, 11:31:29 pm
While these weapons definitely seem cool(especially The mazer, a long range energy weapon is just what you need against Nordera) I'm more intrigued by the fact you're actually purchasing them. Have you actually hacked in some sort of money system based on kills/objectives(this might make higher enemy counts on insane actually beneficial) or do you simply get a set allowance from Tempest to blow on weapons and stat upgrades?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on May 15, 2018, 05:33:31 am
In a way I'm reminded of the Helix Cannon from Descent when I see the pattern the Mazer makes. It's a pretty effect and the mechanics of the weapons themselves will be fun to try as well.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on May 15, 2018, 07:32:34 am
While these weapons definitely seem cool(especially The mazer, a long range energy weapon is just what you need against Nordera) I'm more intrigued by the fact you're actually purchasing them. Have you actually hacked in some sort of money system based on kills/objectives(this might make higher enemy counts on insane actually beneficial) or do you simply get a set allowance from Tempest to blow on weapons and stat upgrades?
Tempest gives you an allowance to go buy the Dragonfly upgrade package, which is the primary objective of the mission, but you can earn more money by doing a few mini-games, like doing a time attack race through the colony, or doing a fetch quest etc.

In a way I'm reminded of the Helix Cannon from Descent when I see the pattern the Mazer makes. It's a pretty effect and the mechanics of the weapons themselves will be fun to try as well.
It uses the helix particle spread, so it has that part of the helix in common at least.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Nightmare on May 15, 2018, 08:37:50 am
While these weapons definitely seem cool(especially The mazer, a long range energy weapon is just what you need against Nordera) I'm more intrigued by the fact you're actually purchasing them. Have you actually hacked in some sort of money system based on kills/objectives(this might make higher enemy counts on insane actually beneficial) or do you simply get a set allowance from Tempest to blow on weapons and stat upgrades?
Tempest gives you an allowance to go buy the Dragonfly upgrade package, which is the primary objective of the mission, but you can earn more money by doing a few mini-games, like doing a time attack race through the colony, or doing a fetch quest etc.

In a way I'm reminded of the Helix Cannon from Descent when I see the pattern the Mazer makes. It's a pretty effect and the mechanics of the weapons themselves will be fun to try as well.
It uses the helix particle spread, so it has that part of the helix in common at least.

Wow, that's so awesome what you're doing here :eek2:

I remember that my biggest "YES!" moment I ever had while playing FS was seeing (and flying through) the space habitat in the Ep1 release, and I can't wait to see what you (and the other team members of course) made for this. :)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: FrikgFeek on May 15, 2018, 11:40:33 am
Though I wonder what introducing more specialised(and seemingly more powerful) weapons will do to the poor balance of the game. Ep1 was already pretty damn easy, if these weapons are good you might go into Ubisoft-easy territory.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on May 15, 2018, 03:21:45 pm
Wow, that's so awesome what you're doing here :eek2:

I remember that my biggest "YES!" moment I ever had while playing FS was seeing (and flying through) the space habitat in the Ep1 release, and I can't wait to see what you (and the other team members of course) made for this. :)
The time attack race through the colony is especially cool, since Axem has set up all these boosters, that will propel you at highspeeds through the small gaps between the buildings.

Though I wonder what introducing more specialised(and seemingly more powerful) weapons will do to the poor balance of the game. Ep1 was already pretty damn easy, if these weapons are good you might go into Ubisoft-easy territory.
I wasn't really aware that the balance was poor. Episode 1 is very much a introductory chapter and isn't designed to be particularly difficult. You're also looking through a very veteran and skilled lens. I'm personally, as a designer, much more concerned about the average player getting through the game and having a fun, not frustrating time.
That being said, episode 2 has a few optional highly challenging bonus objectives that will hopefully sate your hunger somewhat.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Nightmare on May 15, 2018, 04:28:29 pm
That sounds good :)

But there's no Cyrvan StarMecha, or?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: FrikgFeek on May 15, 2018, 06:11:52 pm
"Poor balance" wasn't meant to imply that the balance is poor(for 95% of players) it was meant to express my sympathy with the balance(as in: that poor sod, that poor thing) and the increasingly difficult act of balancing as complexity increases.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Axem on May 15, 2018, 07:06:31 pm
I can confirm now that WoD has poor FREDding.

(according to that definition)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: JSRNerdo on May 15, 2018, 07:17:04 pm
I can confirm now that WoD has poor FREDding.

(according to that definition)

Don't we all?

... tries not to think about what to do for my future missions
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Flak on May 20, 2018, 08:13:09 am
The original Wings of Dawn is Zero Wing/1942 hard anyway, so for new players I supposed it was adjusted. 
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: FrikgFeek on May 20, 2018, 08:53:42 am
Eh, I feel more like it was generally managable aside from the last mission which is just stupid hard and how insane the Fur'angle were if you weren't packing HEDRs. Death by constant screenshake is not fun.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on May 25, 2018, 06:55:48 pm
Hidden Text: Show
(https://i.imgur.com/tDvChTC.jpg)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Axem on May 25, 2018, 07:59:36 pm
Reported for explicit content.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LoneFan on May 26, 2018, 07:42:23 am
Reported for explicit content.
Meh, a 6 out of 10.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: JSRNerdo on May 26, 2018, 07:43:41 am
This person's tounge appears to be melting, would someone please call a doctor?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Enioch on May 26, 2018, 06:29:29 pm
Ffs, Spoon, what have you been doing to that poor girl?

I mean, if it's safe, sane and consensual then it's fine by me, but I don't see why you would ever think that indulging your exhibitionist tendencies on this board was anything close to OK or appropriate.

We can see her stroking your naked handle, ffs.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Nightmare on May 26, 2018, 06:47:04 pm
In think Spoon just cuddled the girl to a near-comatose state.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on May 26, 2018, 08:00:31 pm
O-Oh no, how embarrassing! That I would accidently post a picture of my very private collection instead of a development pictures.
Please pretend you never saw anything!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on May 26, 2018, 08:17:59 pm
Now we know the real reason why there hasn't been a release yet. There have been distractions... :P
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Nightmare on May 26, 2018, 11:34:59 pm
Now we know the real reason why there hasn't been a release yet. There have been distractions... :P

Well Spoon can make his own distractions :D
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on May 27, 2018, 11:58:45 am
Now we know the real reason why there hasn't been a release yet. There have been distractions... :P

Well Spoon can make his own distractions :D
I'm livin' the dream.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on June 09, 2018, 05:49:26 pm
Since he was brought up before:
Large parts of this vid are very relatable to me.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Bryan See on June 09, 2018, 07:52:41 pm
 Me too.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LoneFan on June 15, 2018, 04:36:04 am
This puts things into perspective.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on July 08, 2018, 01:54:04 am

A couple of development milestones have been reached since the last actual dev update post. The first being that all of the episode 1 updating has been completed, with the campaign file being fully playable from start to finish. A few missions have been added, a few have been completely reworked and overall I'd say it's just a better experience now. Work on updating episode 1 and making episode 2 have been happening simultaneously all this time, so it was good for my mental state to finally being to check that one off the list.

Another one, which took a bit longer than initially calculated, were the visual novel backgrounds for episode 2. The backgrounds for episode 1 Axem made in Space Engineers, which didn't take too long to setup. For the interior of the Guardian Angel, he wanted to try his hand at Unreal engine 4. This was a bit of a learning experience for him, so it took some time. But I think it came out pretty great. And with some transparancy, lets us do things like at the 2:49 mark in the above video.

(https://i.imgur.com/rrw7rZE.jpg)
One of the locations in the Unreal Editor

Axem also did some amazing work on asteroid textures, improving basically all of the existing asteroids in some way, and adding a few more for specific purposes. As seen at the 3:24 mark, he replaced the original 'Scar asteroid' (from beyond the red line) and eventually got so fed up with making the inside of that asteroid not look like arse, that he just outright replaced the whole interior. Which was much needed, because it was very easy to get lost inside the interior, which could make the mission a bit frustrating. But now everyone can just focus on finding them precious ores.

(https://i.imgur.com/on2Eb9B.png)
(https://i.imgur.com/DxryyYA.png)
Escaping the clutches of FRED's awful briefing editor, we're moving onto JAD style briefings now.

Dahblount also did some neat programming. Adding a 'failure rate' feature, allowing weapons to have a defined random chance to substitute out for another weapon. Which I use for the Ezchalon scattershot (the shotgun type weapon that was shown last post) to have some shells misfire and explode in your own face. The perils of using blackmarket weapons.
And on the subject of weapons, notice how in the first clip there's an ammo switching feature for the Bakaka weapon. Use the right ammo type against the right targets for the best damage. Another nifty script by the lua wizard Axem.

You can take part in a time attack race to earn some extra money to buy these weapons (https://www.dropbox.com/s/e7zzaokwdpj5qh2/Fs2_open_Wings_of_Dawn-EX14-SSE%202018-07-07%2017-05-16-15.webm?dl=0)

Episode 2 at this point only has two missions left that need to be made (assuming I don't change my mind on that randomly), while the rest are 'complete' but will still need that sweet sweet polishing. The visual novel parts are the biggest amount of work left, which is just a time consuming process with no real shortcuts. In addition to writing, there's the spellchecking/editing, adding the syntax and testing it over and over to make sure it works. Work Work.
I'm sure I'm forgetting a bunch of other things that have already been done in recent times, but eventually everything just kind of starts to blur together, and after working on WoD for so long I start to forget what is new and has been around for a while. (Also I'm typing this post at 03:00). In short, things are still steadily progressing, despite things occasionally taking a bit longer than initially expected.

I hope you will all look forward to the eventual end result.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: niffiwan on July 08, 2018, 02:07:48 am
Quote
I hope you will all look forward to the eventual end result.

Oh yes! All my yes, this is looking fantastic :nod: :yes:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Nightmare on July 08, 2018, 02:46:55 am
Escaping the clutches of FRED's awful briefing editor, we're moving onto JAD style briefings now.
Somebody should change the UI for the briefing room, so that retail FS2 can be liberated as well from this slavery :warp:

Quote
I hope you will all look forward to the eventual end result.
Yes, your highness! Any WoD effort will be appreciated and celebrated!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LoneFan on July 08, 2018, 10:03:21 am
This is amazing. I'm getting pumped up now.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on July 08, 2018, 10:30:42 am
I'm actually in tears. Those videos are superb and I already like Zeri. My lust for combat personified.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: 0rph3u5 on July 12, 2018, 07:08:52 pm
I hope you will all look forward to the eventual end result.

I do ...

ps. drop me a line if you want to make the stream I talked about happen for Episode 2 ....
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: manwiththemachinegun on July 25, 2018, 04:43:19 pm
I saw the gameplay video posted a few weeks ago and have been merrily spreading it around the internet hangouts I visit. So yep, still hyped.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on August 08, 2018, 10:41:25 pm
Weapon crafting, a feature long planned and recently implemented into the game. Remember that brief bit of gameplay showing some mining from the last video? Well, any of the none critical ore that you get from that mission can be used to create some modified versions of existing weapons. And you might be able to obtain more resources at various points in the campaign. Needless to say, these crafted weapons will carry over to the next episode. (Thanks to 'eternal' variables).


Axem's visual novel script is really amazingly versatile.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: 0rph3u5 on August 08, 2018, 11:02:32 pm
Not a exactly a feature that gets me excited but cool to see it happen nonetheless ...
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Nightmare on August 09, 2018, 01:35:30 am
While I always appreciate anything that happens here (as well as new features), I think I'll switch to not-sure-if-want mode for this one. Loads and loads of weapons always confused me at some point, and generally prefer weapons with proper gameplay roles.

If it's already going to that direction, than why not directly deliver only a bunch of basic weapons that do this or that, and leave it to the player to configure E-use/ammunition/ROF/Damage themselves? Maybe it could be done via scripting, lots of tabled weapons or a mix of both...

Also, story-wise I'm wondering whether they modify their weapons aboard the GA due to use of raw materials (hence no spare parts or prefactored addons). I thought it was supposed to be a warship, not a factory (unless you call Episode 2 "Exile" ;) ).
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on August 09, 2018, 10:31:49 am
The nice thing about the system is it looks like some mods will result in the same weapon with some sort of improvement as well as others changing the dynamic of the weapon itself. That doesn't even acknowledge that time is being taken to also show us how it changes.

The fact you can even do this is mind-boggling. You'd get some bizarre reactions next time someone asks what you're doing and you answer with "Mining asteroids for materials to turn some plasma cannons into shotguns in a FreeSpace mod."
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on August 09, 2018, 11:44:00 am
Clearly Spoon wants to beat Star Citizen in all aspects. Even feature creep. :p
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Nightmare on August 09, 2018, 01:01:00 pm
Clearly Spoon wants to beat Star Citizen in all aspects. Even feature creep. :p
Star Citizen is good!
Wings of Dawn is better!

Beating SC can be done by simply releasing something complete though, so it is a simple target...
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on August 09, 2018, 03:41:33 pm
I saw the gameplay video posted a few weeks ago and have been merrily spreading it around the internet hangouts I visit. So yep, still hyped.
Spreading the WoD word is really helpful, because I am socially inept and don't do any kind of social media. So I'm not much good promoting my own game.

Not a exactly a feature that gets me excited but cool to see it happen nonetheless ...
How so? Does it conjure up images of triple A open world games that obligatorily include some form of crafting in all of their titles?

While I always appreciate anything that happens here (as well as new features), I think I'll switch to not-sure-if-want mode for this one. Loads and loads of weapons always confused me at some point, and generally prefer weapons with proper gameplay roles.
Well the crafting part is entirely optional. So you definitely don't have to use it if you don't want to.
The overabundance of weapons to choose from is actually kind of a concern to me. I've been doing a lot of pondering how to best dripfeed them to the player without overwhelming them with choice.

If it's already going to that direction, than why not directly deliver only a bunch of basic weapons that do this or that, and leave it to the player to configure E-use/ammunition/ROF/Damage themselves? Maybe it could be done via scripting, lots of tabled weapons or a mix of both...
While a neat idea, it's basically unworkable. I've thought about something like that initially, but the sheer amount of extra work that would require would be insane. Not to mention, that WoD is already currently at 249 weapon entries out of the engine max limit of 300.

Also, story-wise I'm wondering whether they modify their weapons aboard the GA due to use of raw materials (hence no spare parts or prefactored addons). I thought it was supposed to be a warship, not a factory (unless you call Episode 2 "Exile" ;) ).
Even historically, warships have had some limited refinery facilities onboard them. (Graf spee for example, suffered battle damage to her facilities, which crippled her for any future long voyages. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_cruiser_Admiral_Graf_Spee#Battle_of_the_River_Plate)) It's not that big of a stretch for a futuristic large assault carrier to have the means to process ore and to be able to produce some spare parts itself.

The nice thing about the system is it looks like some mods will result in the same weapon with some sort of improvement as well as others changing the dynamic of the weapon itself. That doesn't even acknowledge that time is being taken to also show us how it changes.

The fact you can even do this is mind-boggling. You'd get some bizarre reactions next time someone asks what you're doing and you answer with "Mining asteroids for materials to turn some plasma cannons into shotguns in a FreeSpace mod."
(https://i.somethingawful.com/forumsystem/emoticons/emot-allears.gif) Your posts are good and encouraging.

Clearly Spoon wants to beat Star Citizen in all aspects. Even feature creep. :p
Star Citizen is good!
Wings of Dawn is better!

Beating SC can be done by simply releasing something complete though, so it is a simple target...
Well, it's not technically feature creep if it was planned to be included from the start. I've always kind of wanted something like this in my game.
(https://i.imgur.com/rtJPZMu.gif)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: ngld on August 09, 2018, 07:16:35 pm
If it's already going to that direction, than why not directly deliver only a bunch of basic weapons that do this or that, and leave it to the player to configure E-use/ammunition/ROF/Damage themselves? Maybe it could be done via scripting, lots of tabled weapons or a mix of both...
While a neat idea, it's basically unworkable. I've thought about something like that initially, but the sheer amount of extra work that would require would be insane. Not to mention, that WoD is already currently at 249 weapon entries out of the engine max limit of 300.

I remember some coders talking about extending the scripting API to allow scripts to modify weapons without adding new table entries. You'd be able to modify the weapon properties directly from Lua (if I understood correctly). Not sure if that helps you but if you're interested, I could look into whether it was implemented and how it works.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: FrikgFeek on August 09, 2018, 09:15:26 pm
I think weapon crafting is a really cool feature for WoD, because of how it encourages a wide variety of weapons with its armour types and hull/shield balance. So providing power increases via upgrades rather than just continuously dumping new weapons onto the player eases the burden of knowledge. There are some neat little tricks you can do with certain weapons and you don't have to keep learning those if you're not constantly using new ones. Things like loading up a Ray 3 with 2 VX08s against Nordera and then switching banks right after you fire, just like you would with bombs. Except you don't have to deal with lockon times so you'll essentially get double the firerate of a single VX08. You can also do this with VK03N and VX08 when shooting at hulls, just sneaking in a few VK03 shots between your plasma bursts to optimize DPS.

And the upgrades seem to increase a weapon's strengths or add new quirks rather than covering up weaknesses so you'll still want a varied setup.

A small nitpick about that video though, the "Rate of Fire" stat seems to be $Fire wait. RoF usually refers to the number of shots per unit of time rather than the time between 2 shots. So the VK03Ns Rate of Fire would be 2.5/s or 150 RPM rather than "0.4". Though that really is just a small nitpick.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on August 10, 2018, 12:20:20 pm
I remember some coders talking about extending the scripting API to allow scripts to modify weapons without adding new table entries. You'd be able to modify the weapon properties directly from Lua (if I understood correctly). Not sure if that helps you but if you're interested, I could look into whether it was implemented and how it works.
Definitely interested. Something like that could have a wide range of uses.

I think weapon crafting is a really cool feature for WoD, because of how it encourages a wide variety of weapons with its armour types and hull/shield balance. So providing power increases via upgrades rather than just continuously dumping new weapons onto the player eases the burden of knowledge. There are some neat little tricks you can do with certain weapons and you don't have to keep learning those if you're not constantly using new ones. Things like loading up a Ray 3 with 2 VX08s against Nordera and then switching banks right after you fire, just like you would with bombs. Except you don't have to deal with lockon times so you'll essentially get double the firerate of a single VX08. You can also do this with VK03N and VX08 when shooting at hulls, just sneaking in a few VK03 shots between your plasma bursts to optimize DPS.

And the upgrades seem to increase a weapon's strengths or add new quirks rather than covering up weaknesses so you'll still want a varied setup.
:yes:
A small nitpick about that video though, the "Rate of Fire" stat seems to be $Fire wait. RoF usually refers to the number of shots per unit of time rather than the time between 2 shots. So the VK03Ns Rate of Fire would be 2.5/s or 150 RPM rather than "0.4". Though that really is just a small nitpick.
Valid nitpick. Not something I'm going to bother changing at this point, but you're right.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: 0rph3u5 on August 11, 2018, 10:57:24 am
Not a exactly a feature that gets me excited but cool to see it happen nonetheless ...
How so? Does it conjure up images of triple A open world games that obligatorily include some form of crafting in all of their titles?

For one, I am an old RPG-hound who has learned all too well, that every shiney newly crafted/bought item is only as shiney and new as the next one that comes along, so I would be hoarding ressources until a point of no return anyway...

That being said, item crafting (in the narrow sense) has featured in some of the my most recent top games (Breath of the Wild; Horizon: Zero Dawn; Monster Hunter World) and my view on it is always informed by how well it is implimented - One of the one hand, HZD infurated me by not tracking normal animals despite them being a source of valuable crafting ressources. On the other MHW offered the option to save a "shopping list" so I didn't have obsessively track my next object for acquisition. BoW thankfully restricted it's crafting to consumables (meaning you where you good as long as you had plently of Bananas).
In the same vein, I will hold my verdict once I see it implimented in Wings of Dawn.


Now putting the player role aside, there are some design problems I see, which give me pause to do something similar:

Firstly, there is the impact that ressource gathering and crafting have on a player's psychology: How you are going to adress the issue that any players (excluding completionists) might feel compelled to invest an disproportiante ammount of time in gathering and crafting on the off-chance that any of crafted items might turn out to be the key to a difficult mission down the line.

Secondly, there is something you have already adressed, which is the "overabundance of options rendering the choice meaningless".

Thirdly, there is of course the ever present spectre of any optional activity in a video game ruining the pacing of the main story...
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: manwiththemachinegun on August 12, 2018, 09:08:20 pm
I think the things I'm most excited for other than the new missions is the greater attention to characters and cinematic elements viewed "outside" of the cockpit. The bridge battle cutscene for example. Anything to immerse the player in that they are a pilot living on a ship with comrades and friends as part of a larger galaxy, rather than a cockpit which flies around and makes things explode. :P

And no, I'm not talking about sacrificing good gameplay, but there's a reason people remember Metal Gear and Resident Evil so fondly, people get invested in the cast.

The fact that Freespace was successful without these elements was due to its great sense of tension. You didn't need the plot to tell you you were outnumbered and outgunned, you could feel it while playing the missions.

But anything to enhance those story telling elements gets a big thumbs up from me.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on September 21, 2018, 06:43:19 pm
I never numbered any of these posts, let's give one the arbitrary number of 99.
Welcome to blog post #99 where we give you all the amazing insights on what we do with your thousands of backer dollars/euros/yen/rupees/zeni/credits that you've poured into this project to make all your dreams a reality. I can't believe we keep getting away with this. Let's just never release anything and keep raking in the money.

Let's start off with some genuine ~feature creep~
As Axem was working on an amazing Nordera model, he decided to finally ditch Wings as a 3d modelling program and step into the world of Blender. And in order to get to know the program a bit better, he decided to make a simpler Nordera ship as practice. Without consulting me, can you believe the nerve of this guy? Unbelievable.
Thankfully, it came out cool and neat. Because Axem is awesome like that.

The Nordera raider is fast, it's furious, it burns a lot of fossil fuel and it's terrible for the environment.
(https://i.imgur.com/jtw3lKo.png)
Its primary role is to serve as a light attack craft with it's forward mounted fixed cannon and as an anti-fighter platform with it's various point defense turrets.

Banana for scale
(https://i.imgur.com/3gULsYu.png)

Since Axem made the Raider with various destroyed subsystem states, it suddenly started bothering me how every other large multipart turret in the game just vanishes when destroyed. So I went and feature creeped a bit myself and made destroyed turret models for the majority of capital ships: https://www.dropbox.com/s/j8eiotyqm6haxz7/Fs2_open_Wings_of_Dawn-EX15-SSE%202018-09-21%2016-35-05-79.webm?dl=0

And since we're on the subject of turrets. I mentioned that Axem is working on another Nordera model. Which I'm not going to spoil. I'll just show you this small part of it:
(https://i.imgur.com/KuoqQxr.png)
Ten barrels? (https://fi.somethingawful.com/safs/smilies/0/a/eyepop.001.gif) Who designed that even? Or perhaps a better question, why hasn't anyone designed this before?


But let's leave the feature creep and absurd turrets behind and let's instead look at the current status of the missions of episode 1 and 2:

Missions
Tutorial - A bit improved, done.
E1M1 - Remade, done.
E1M2 - Remade, done.
E1M3 - Mostly unchanged, done.
E1M4 - Remade, done.
E1M5 - Remade, done.
E1M6 - Remade, done.
E1M7 - Mostly unchanged, done.
E1X1 (The optional distress call mission) - Mostly unchanged, done.
E1M8 - Mostly unchanged, done.
E1M9 - New, done.
E2M10 - New, done.
E2M11 - New, done.
E2M12 - New, done.
E2M14 - New, done.
E2M15 - New, done.
E2M16 - New, done.
E2M17 - New, done.
E2M18 - New, done.
E2M19 - New, done.
E2M20 - New, done.
E2M21 - New, done.
E2M22 - New, done.
E2M23 - New, done.
E2M24 - Not started yet.
E2M25 - Not started yet.

Looks suprisingly green.
Disclaimer, though, they are 'done', but not playtested yet by anyone other than me and occasionally Axem. And the entirety of episode 2 is not even in a campaign file yet. But still, isn't that a nice list?

The Visual Novel segments are a bit harder to list, some are done except for editing, some require some art or a cutscene to be made etc. And I can't really name from the top of my head what the status of each file is without going through them in depth. And there's a lot of words to go through. My amazing buddy, mpgrey, is still helping me out with editing. I can't even promise him fame and exposure yet he still takes the time to correct all of my bad writing.

VN
VN1-12 - Done, some editing/spell checking may still be required.
VN13-23 - In various states of completion. Majority of work has been done.
VN24 - Not started yet.


Art
All characters are done. (https://i.imgur.com/fAvODN5.gif) There's still some tweaking here and there and some expressions that still need to be made, but the vast majority of character headani's and vn portraits are done for episode 1 and 2. There's still a few story related drawings that have to be made and most importantly, a lot of anime titties that have to be drawn for the 'R18 patch'. Since I figure I'll release WoD as a relatively 'family friendly' game, and have people opt in on all the filth fine culture through an optional patch.
There will be smug Cyrvans in episode 2, isn't that lovely?
(https://i.imgur.com/OcZseZj.png)


Weapons and ships
I kind of wish I had kept some kind of actual change log history on all the various weapon tweaks I've done between episode 1's release and now. But since I haven't, I'll just try and mention the noticable things I can remember for the weapons that you, the players, have actually potentially used in episode 1.

CHI-MPC1v Proton - This used to be a cycle weapon and nobody really seemed to like it much. Because it was cycle firing, it's push effect didn't really shine, and it seemed a bit weak in the damage department.
The weapon has received various buffs and tweaks, changing it to burst fire and generally improving its allround performance. It's a very solid energy weapon now, that can properly knock an enemy off course.

Type-74 Cannon - This weapon actually did twice the damage it was suppose to. Since it has a explosive radius, which meant that the game applied the damage of the weapon twice. First for the shot hitting itself, then again for anything inside the blast radius. This has been adjusted (nerfed) so it won't be one shotting targets it's not supposed to. It's still a powerful weapon, though. I personally love putting this weapon alongside the CHI-MPC1v Proton in the Ray MkIII. Since you can keep switching between each weapon and significantly increase your damage output that way.

VX-08 Plasma - This Nordera buster has gotten a bit faster in its projectile speed and its shield damage has been increased a small amount. Otherwise mostly the same.

VK-03N - Has mostly remained unchanged.

Missiles have overall been much improved and feel a lot more solid and fun to use. A lot of their previous performance woes have been due to the majority of them being 'swarm' missiles. Turns out that making a missile a swarmer, apparantly alters quite a bit of its characteristics. Target tracking becomes significantly worse, especially when you fire the missiles off bore. Changing all of the swarmers to be 'corkscrews' instead, instantly made a world of difference.

The DHSM-3c Dart is a lovely dogfighting missile now, that is supremely useful for finishing off a target that is going evasive while you're on its tail. The SMHS-15 Wildfire has become a bit more potent in its damage, and now fires a volley of 5 instead of 6. Which means it won't cause weird ammo counts and a half baked last volley. Speaking of volley's, the VFAS-16 Volley has been reworked, for it felt supremely unrewarding to use. It now has double the ammo count, though its range went from 1800 to 800. It's turn time went from 1.1 to 0.5, making it extremely nimble. Instead of firing a standard salvo of 4, it will now lock on each seeker individually, so the longer you let it lock on, the more energy missiles you can unleash on your enemy. (This wasn't possible before, because the A.I. couldn't fire any missile with multilock attributes. Thanks DahBlount for changing that)


Of course, ships have been endlessly tweaked with too. The Dragonfly-EX has gotten a significant boost to its afterburner, letting it reach a speed up to 170 (vs the 160 of the MkIII) and it accelerates significantly faster than before. But since you, the players, didn't get an opportunity to fly anything other than a MkIII and the Dragonfly EX in episode 1, there's not much sense listing a bunch of changes that won't mean anything to you.

Model asset wise, the vast majority has been covered. Axem is working on the last critical model for episode 2. And after that there's two more alien capital ships on the to-do list, which are technically not critical for episode 2's release.

Anyway, that's all for this dev blog post.
Until next time!

Edit:
Actually that's not all. I forgot to mention Sound. Which is again an aspect that has been massively improved since Episode 1. Since there's a whole bunch of new sound code features that lets the overall soundscape be a lot more diverse. Taking the Nordera as example again; they used to have just a single cannon sound effect that was used over most weapon variants. But with the new sound code, that cannon sfx now has 4 seperate variants that play randomly when fired and also differ in pitch and volume each time. 
And this new feature has been applied to a large amount of sounds, like shield impacts and laser hull impacts and the majority of weapon fire.
Not to mention that with the old sound code, most sound slots were hardcoded to be played only a very limited amount at the same time. Which often led to sounds stuttering or being cut off when a new one overwrote it. None of that anymore!

Okay that's all for real now.
Until the next next time.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on September 21, 2018, 08:07:04 pm
Getting home from work and seeing a new WoD post, I don't think there's a better way to start the weekend.

And yes, I believe smug Cyrvans is indeed lovely.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: FrikgFeek on September 21, 2018, 09:23:46 pm
Whooo, that's a big update. It's great to see wod coming along so nicely, and those ships look sexy. And that's one mean turret.

The weapon changes look interesting, I've always loved the dart for its ability to just spam more missiles without even really trying. You can be doing all kinds of manoeuvres and still fire the thing. Though it always felt bad to see like 20 of them chasing one countermeasure. The Chi change looks great, might actually want to use it now.
The volley change looks a bit... strange, though obviously I've never tried it so I have no idea how it feels in-game. But you'd think that with the 1000m range on the LDRP1 you'd just spam those instead once you close in.

For the missions you've listed 8 + 1 optional + tutorial but Ep1 only had 6 + 1 optional + tutorial. I'm not sure if new ones got added or if some of those refer to the semi-cutscene dream missions? Would help to know the mission names, atm I'm not sure which missions you're referring to. I also remember M3 - counter the contravention got remade, mentioned in a previous update but you've listed it as "mostly unchanged", so I'm guessing the numbers are out of sync with Ep1 release.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: niffiwan on September 21, 2018, 09:54:30 pm
Woohoo; thanks for the update! :) 

And turrets with lots of guns is good and totally not absurd :D

(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/f1/MkVIIIpompomsHMSRodney1940.jpg)
(ok so that's a weak 8 rather than an awesome 10)

Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on September 21, 2018, 10:17:06 pm
So I guess this should come out maybe late 2020, early 2021, and Episode 3 around 2030 with episodes 1 and 2 completely redesigned and a slew of new features. :p

Anyway, glad to see you're happy and continuing to make progress, and yes, the green does indeed look nice. We had a very similar list to that on the Frontlines internal board with the red, yellow and green format, so I know how that feels watching it change until it's all green. :)

That is a very smug looking Cyrvan indeed. I remember Cyrvans naturally grow anime coloured hair, but can they grow hair in more than one colour naturally?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Axem on September 21, 2018, 10:34:18 pm
Without consulting me, can you believe the nerve of this guy? Unbelievable.

You should fire this guy imo. Doesn't sound like a team player.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Nightmare on September 21, 2018, 11:27:46 pm
Thank you for the long update! :)

I'd probably would have to spam the thread now with pages of :yes: , but I hope :yes: :yes: :yes: :yes: :yes: will be acepted as sufficient payment. :D
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on September 22, 2018, 12:47:44 pm
Getting home from work and seeing a new WoD post, I don't think there's a better way to start the weekend.

And yes, I believe smug Cyrvans is indeed lovely.
I'll have to make a mental note to make sure to release WoD on a weekend.

Whooo, that's a big update. It's great to see wod coming along so nicely, and those ships look sexy. And that's one mean turret.

The weapon changes look interesting, I've always loved the dart for its ability to just spam more missiles without even really trying. You can be doing all kinds of manoeuvres and still fire the thing. Though it always felt bad to see like 20 of them chasing one countermeasure. The Chi change looks great, might actually want to use it now.
The volley change looks a bit... strange, though obviously I've never tried it so I have no idea how it feels in-game. But you'd think that with the 1000m range on the LDRP1 you'd just spam those instead once you close in.
Spamming magic missiles is of course always an excellent option :p
The Volley does perform very well against both Cordi and Nordera in its current incarnation, since it deals a high amount of hull damage with energy damage. And with its super fast turn rate, it can easily knock those pesky Cordi fighters down, which is not nearly as easy to do with dumbfires. But ultimately it might just depend on what feels best to your particular flying style.

For the missions you've listed 8 + 1 optional + tutorial but Ep1 only had 6 + 1 optional + tutorial. I'm not sure if new ones got added or if some of those refer to the semi-cutscene dream missions? Would help to know the mission names, atm I'm not sure which missions you're referring to. I also remember M3 - counter the contravention got remade, mentioned in a previous update but you've listed it as "mostly unchanged", so I'm guessing the numbers are out of sync with Ep1 release.
They are indeed out of sync, a few new missions got added between, and I didn't count/list any of the dream segments. What used to be mission 2 is now mission 3, while mission 3 (counter the contra) is now mission 5. There's also a few occasions where VN files are part of a mission, or there's bit of gameplay inside a visual novel segment, which then isn't counted as an actual mission. I've got it all neatly organized in my little designer diagram, but it might get a bit confusion when trying to explain it to others (Axem probably has to try his hardest to make sense of it).
But the short of it is; there's more content now.

Woohoo; thanks for the update! :) 

And turrets with lots of guns is good and totally not absurd :D

(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/f1/MkVIIIpompomsHMSRodney1940.jpg)
(ok so that's a weak 8 rather than an awesome 10)
That doesn't count, that's not even in a turret! That's just a bunch of oversized machine guns stacked together!  :hopping:

But I agree, its good and not absurd  :D

So I guess this should come out maybe late 2020, early 2021, and Episode 3 around 2030 with episodes 1 and 2 completely redesigned and a slew of new features. :p

Anyway, glad to see you're happy and continuing to make progress, and yes, the green does indeed look nice. We had a very similar list to that on the Frontlines internal board with the red, yellow and green format, so I know how that feels watching it change until it's all green. :)
I was thinking a post like this would inspire some amount of confidence that release wouldn't be late 2020 but somehow it managed to do the opposite? (https://i.imgur.com/IhkHHbU.png)

That is a very smug looking Cyrvan indeed. I remember Cyrvans naturally grow anime coloured hair, but can they grow hair in more than one colour naturally?
They can indeed.

You should fire this guy imo. Doesn't sound like a team player.
Agreed imo.

Thank you for the long update! :)

I'd probably would have to spam the thread now with pages of :yes: , but I hope :yes: :yes: :yes: :yes: :yes: will be acepted as sufficient payment. :D
Acceptable.
Though, I prefer anime titties as payment.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on September 22, 2018, 07:00:31 pm
Well, if she's being too smug then, I'll let her know her hair reminds me of a dog with different coloured fur. That should wipe the smile from her face. While I actually like her hair a lot, it was genuinely the first thing that came to mind.

Late 2020 would be my at the latest estimate.

If you've got missiles that can easily blow the cordi out of the sky, I'm sure I'll be making liberal use of them.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Lorric on September 25, 2018, 01:10:15 am
Are there any Hierarchy headanis? And if yes, any Zy?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on September 25, 2018, 03:39:53 pm
There are none
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: manwiththemachinegun on October 02, 2018, 10:20:06 pm
Sounds like it's that old Dawn taste, new Dawn sparkle!

Seriously, the game looks great and the attention to detail is stellar. I'm looking forward to this almost as much as Ace Combat 7.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog - Playtesters
Post by: Spoon on November 12, 2018, 01:40:20 pm
What I'll need soonish™ are playtesters, though.
Soon...
No wait... Now.

So with both Axem and me having played through the campaign from start to (almost) finish (just the episode 2 finale left to FRED), I figure its about time to get some fresh eyes to look at the game.

Testers will have to:
Be able to use git. This is where you'll download the game and any updates from. If you already know how to use git, great! If you don't, then don't worry, we'll help you set it up.
Use discord. This is our main form of communication, you'll get an invite link from me when you apply.
Play through the campaign once, report any bugs and give general feedback. It may seems kind of silly to emphasise this, but past experiences with beta testers have learned that far too often people apply for beta testing and then just... don't. So please don't apply if you're going to be short on time and cannot be relied upon.

Interested? Shoot me a PM on the forum.


 
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: 0rph3u5 on November 12, 2018, 03:08:18 pm
So tempting ...

If you are still looking in January, drop me a line.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on November 13, 2018, 09:36:23 am
short on time 
fug

Well, still awesome to hear you're reaching that stage.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on November 13, 2018, 11:40:56 am
Thanks to the people who applied. I think we have enough testers for now!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: manwiththemachinegun on November 19, 2018, 04:46:01 pm
Having had a very small taste of the story, I'm perfectly happy letting the gameplay being a surprise. :P
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LoneFan on December 09, 2018, 01:11:18 am
I just lurk right her. I can't wait for some more news.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on December 09, 2018, 05:07:39 pm
Can confirm that Axem is making an awesome finale to episode 2
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Nightmare on December 09, 2018, 06:05:36 pm
Sw33t! :)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LoneFan on December 10, 2018, 06:52:26 am
I know this is going to mind blowing.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: manwiththemachinegun on December 19, 2018, 08:36:51 pm
Quick, everyone, have we plumbed the depths of Gundam 00's soundtrack? :P
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on December 20, 2018, 05:44:46 pm
(https://i.imgur.com/fAvODN5.gif)
All the missions are done. (https://drive.google.com/file/d/19E9lgNOHfsIWx-Wn1Hh795KWxSaOfW_9/view)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Axem on December 20, 2018, 07:47:43 pm
Everybody party!!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Nightmare on December 20, 2018, 07:54:52 pm
Everybody party!!

Yaayyy!

But release is next year, right? Because comparing "most intense space shooter this year" 2018 would include a certain mod with mega-BoE. :shaking:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: niffiwan on December 21, 2018, 03:19:15 am
whoooooooooooooooooooooo!  :yes:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: X3N0-Life-Form on December 22, 2018, 02:42:59 am
Congrats !
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on December 22, 2018, 08:04:48 am
Hype drive at maximum! :D
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LoneFan on December 22, 2018, 04:56:07 pm
 This is going to be good.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Piemanlives on December 23, 2018, 12:41:38 pm
I love you Spoon.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: manwiththemachinegun on December 23, 2018, 12:44:14 pm
Highway to the danger zone! Time to start hyping WoD on other forum sites that I visit. 12/29 release date!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on December 23, 2018, 01:06:30 pm
Once more, with feeling. Or should say, with release date.

This is going to be good.
I sure hope so!

I love you Spoon.
Love you too. <3



Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: manwiththemachinegun on December 23, 2018, 01:29:28 pm
Thank God, our national shortage of beams and missile spam will soon be over!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Axem on December 23, 2018, 02:55:53 pm
Thank God, our national shortage of beams and missile spam will soon be over!

Remember this post everyone. It's going to be very relevant after you play the last few missions.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: manwiththemachinegun on December 23, 2018, 03:07:00 pm
Coming from a guy who once made a super robot out of Shivan destroyers, this isn't making the waiting any easier. :P
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on December 23, 2018, 03:45:11 pm
Three days to play the hell out of this after seeing Above & Beyond. Perfect timing!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: 0rph3u5 on December 23, 2018, 06:39:38 pm
*cut for time*

Thanks for the present, Spoon.

Shoulder, heal faster!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: theperfectdrugsk on December 23, 2018, 08:23:42 pm
Oooooooooooooooo

I am pumped.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: CKid on December 24, 2018, 08:34:29 am
Very excited. The 29th can't come soon enough. Quick question, what are the download options? stand-alone, Knossos or both?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on December 24, 2018, 09:19:03 am
Planned download options are going to be Knossos, Mediafire, Mega and Moddb
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Nightmare on December 24, 2018, 10:56:27 am
**** why is Christmas so late this year
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: manwiththemachinegun on December 27, 2018, 06:59:10 pm
We need to get the hype train going around here!

(https://i.imgur.com/zFsr4jk.png)

#Sorrynotsorry
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Nightmare on December 27, 2018, 07:16:20 pm
 Why do you have to remind me constantly that it is still not out. :(
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on December 27, 2018, 08:13:00 pm
*Image*
(https://fi.somethingawful.com/images/smilies/discoursechef.png)


Since it's not saturday yet, lemme just share a selection of the silly git commit messages that we've had over the years:

Quote from: Git commit messages
Axem: Written on Axem's Tombstone: Are the cutscenes done yet?

Spoon: Had to shorten the name on these because of more good coding practices. Now it's just milk without the shake

Axem: ETERNALS BANISHED FOR ETERNITY

Axem: look over there! thats definitely not a file i forgot to commit again!

Spoon: The shaaaare holdderrrrssss muuusssttt beeee appeasssseed

Axem: AXEMMMM STOP COMMITTING BAD SCRIPTS!!!

Axem: Wrote myself a note for the future. Do not open until 2029.

Spoon: I don't have a dirty mind, I have a sexy imagination.

Axem: what would win, axem or a 312 dds boi

Axem: noooooooooooo

Spoon: Everyone should depart the gauntlet on defeat. It's rude to stick around and shoot the player.

Axem: What does Axem do when a sexp gives him trouble? JUST MAKE A NEW SCRIPT!!!

Axem: axem commits files that fix things 10 years too late

Spoon: Maybe the wildfire could be a little bit more wild.

Axem: Gearbox here I come

Axem: I don't even want to talk about how stupid finding this bug was. Let's just fix it and never talk about it again. (sending messages from self no longer causes asserts in debug)

Spoon: Distress! Distress!

Axem: All your base can be configured

Axem: I'd like to dedicate this commit to Pepsiman, who inspired me to do good and abandon the evil CocaCora ways

Spoon: Cheeky breeki

Spoon: failure rate is faulty :V

Axem:  4 + 3 = 43

Spoon: We dig dig dig dig dig dig dig in our mine the whole day through
To dig dig dig dig dig dig dig is what we really like to do
It ain't no trick to get rich quick
If you dig dig dig with a shovel or a pick
In a mine! In a mine! In a mine! In a mine!
Where a million diamonds shine!
We dig dig dig dig dig dig dig from early morn till night
We dig dig dig dig dig dig dig up everything in sight
We dig up diamonds by the score
A thousand rubies, sometimes more
But we don't know what we dig 'em for
We dig dig dig a-dig dig
Heigh-ho, Heigh-ho
Heigh-ho, Heigh-ho
Heigh-ho

Axem: I actually just changed 3 lines but git things I did a lot more. I'll be sure to bill Spoon as git reports instead of the truth...

Axem: Wait a minute... this sounds like Rock and/or Roll

Spoon: AS SOLDIERS OF THE EMPIRE, YOU SHOULD BE EXPECTED TO DO YOUR DUTIES, YOU MAGGOTS!

Axem: That'll be 5000 axembux for emergency surgery on a mission

Spoon: if your happy and you know it raise your ears

Axem: Axem can't count, full story on the M o'clock news

Spoon: I didn't finish writing the last commit message, but now I forgot what I was going to add to it. Something something here's a wip mission.

Axem: I hope one day to finish minigames and live among the stars

Spoon: Looks like missions are back on the menu boys!

Axem: Do you like, my carrrr

Axem: We apologize for the Shinkansen being 5 microseconds late.

Spoon: EFF BE GONE, APNG IS THE FUTURE.

Axem: Upgrading a debug print to a GAME HALTING ERROR!!!!!!!!!!!

Axem: Months in the making, Axem's mission finally makes its internal debut!!!!

Spoon: And the Buoy goes pew pew pew pew pew

Spoon: Aaargh, get them right on the first try please spoon please you're killing yourself

Axem: gj axem for finding this very complicated and complex thingamajig problem

Spoon: More space elves, more space fighters, more, mooore

Axem: "We’re already one week in - another 2 weeks puts us at 3 total which is ideal. Any more and things would begin to get stale."

Spoon: Give me the O, the P, the H, the E, the L, the I and the A! Whats that spell? Ophileia!?

Spoon: We updatan missuns un' massiles be tuned agaains

Axem: Updated VN config file for Spoon's mental health

Spoon: Hi future me, citizencon in 30 minutes.

Spoon: Now they are fixed, for realiez (I hope, I mean, I checked really well. I just hope I didn't over look something again, that would be very unfortunate and mildly upsetting.) also trimmed all of the long turret names so they wont overflow their hud gauge as much!

Axem: Prof Oak: Axem! This isn't the time to use that!

Spoon: And furthermore, starcitizen is good.

Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on December 28, 2018, 04:07:52 am
 :lol:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: X3N0-Life-Form on December 28, 2018, 10:07:53 am
Ahhh, commit histories, good times :)

Quote
Axem:  4 + 3 = 43
It is particularly sad that I find that one relatable...
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on December 28, 2018, 04:30:19 pm
Well, it's all wrapped up in that awful old and outdated .vp format that won't allow for files larger than 2gb each, and then packaged up some more in a .rar
For a total of a whooping 5.6gb (8.4gb unpacked). WoD has turned into an absolute unit.

Just a matter of uploading and don't a few final checks. I'm absolutely pooped.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on December 28, 2018, 05:16:29 pm
(https://i.imgur.com/U1PQs0R.png)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: procdrone on December 28, 2018, 06:47:37 pm
Its absolutely outrageous I didn't take a week off work to play this. So ashamed of myself. Forgive me Spoon.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: manwiththemachinegun on December 28, 2018, 07:02:35 pm
Well, it's all wrapped up in that awful old and outdated .vp format that won't allow for files larger than 2gb each, and then packaged up some more in a .rar
For a total of a whooping 5.6gb (8.4gb unpacked). WoD has turned into an absolute unit.

Just a matter of uploading and don't a few final checks. I'm absolutely pooped.

It runs with its own unique launcher same as Episode 1 right?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Nightmare on December 28, 2018, 07:07:33 pm
For a total of a whooping 5.6gb (8.4gb unpacked). WoD has turned into an absolute unit.

If you upload this to MediaFire you might run into some issues with files larger than a GB, atleast I did (hope you don't, elseway you have to split them).
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on December 28, 2018, 07:18:24 pm


Its absolutely outrageous I didn't take a week off work to play this. So ashamed of myself. Forgive me Spoon.
Forgiven.

It runs with its own unique launcher same as Episode 1 right?
Well the 5.5g launcher is not really unique (kind of old actually). But yeah that's still the launcher that will be provided with the download, but you can use wxlauncher too if you like. Thought, I would highly recommend using Knossos instead!

If you upload this to MediaFire you might run into some issues with files larger than a GB, atleast I did (hope you don't, elseway you have to split them).
Indeed. Mediafire's download will come in three seperate packages. So google drive and mega will be better mirrors, but again, Knossos is best.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Nightmare on December 28, 2018, 07:20:10 pm
What about SectorGame? (just in case you need an addontional one)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: 0rph3u5 on December 28, 2018, 10:03:31 pm
So I have regained use of my right shoulder in time.  :yes:

... and I am about to tear those two muscles again, ain't I?  ;)

/hyperbole mode
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: IidoTheMageFox on December 29, 2018, 12:23:31 am
It's almost time! :D (This is Iido from Moddb btw)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LoneFan on December 29, 2018, 03:02:28 am
Wow, forums blowing up.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: IidoTheMageFox on December 29, 2018, 05:22:19 am
Where's the download link? The game's page says episode 2 is out, but the links are all for episode 1 still.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on December 29, 2018, 05:52:05 am
What about SectorGame? (just in case you need an addontional one)
between knossos/moddb/mediafire/mega/drive I think we're set on mirrors (:

So I have regained use of my right shoulder in time.  :yes:

... and I am about to tear those two muscles again, ain't I?  ;)

/hyperbole mode
I sure hope not! Don't over do it.

It's almost time! :D (This is Iido from Moddb btw)
Heya, welcome! I recognized the avatar. 

Wow, forums blowing up.
Bakuretsu?

Where's the download link? The game's page says episode 2 is out, but the links are all for episode 1 still.
Hold your horses. We just updated the website with dummy links. Release will be in a couple of hours!

Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: IidoTheMageFox on December 29, 2018, 05:55:25 am
Alright! ^^ Wasn't trying to rush ya, I just wasn't sure if I was missing something or not haha.

I'll download it later after I wake up!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Nightmare on December 29, 2018, 06:02:34 am
why do a couple hours feel like months
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on December 29, 2018, 11:26:28 am
Uploading to knossos is taking a bit longer than expected.
(https://i.imgur.com/KL5zmoY.png)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Commander Zane on December 29, 2018, 01:21:43 pm
Worth it! I'm gonna be raving out all night so I can wait another day!
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on December 29, 2018, 03:16:49 pm
So Knossos has been... not great so far. After uploading the large Hud package, the upload timed out and Axem had to reupload it again. Which took most of the day. Then when we finally thought it was going to be ready and available, turned out that the ~3.5Gb package was too large for Knossos, which breaks the ETA calculation which then causes the download to fail. So now ngld is in the progress of downloading and reuploading the HUD but broken up in smaller packages.

It's been a slightly frustrating day of mostly waiting. Not fantastic.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: manwiththemachinegun on December 29, 2018, 04:36:13 pm
(http://i.imgur.com/vxRAwo8.gif)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: procdrone on December 29, 2018, 04:38:37 pm
ITS OUT

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on December 29, 2018, 04:50:45 pm
Well, there it is.
After a very very exhausting day, there's finally a release. Here's hoping everyone will have a trouble&bug free fun WoD experience.

(I may or may not have accidently 'announced' the release topic by email to like 1% of the regular members (or more), oops, that was my bad.)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: procdrone on December 29, 2018, 04:55:39 pm
Thank you Spoon.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: LoneFan on December 29, 2018, 05:49:12 pm
For awhile there, I thought I was the problem.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: 0rph3u5 on December 29, 2018, 07:08:37 pm
It's so nice I downloaded it twice.*

*Got issues with my Joystick - so I had to switch from a manual install to Knossos.

ps. "Fünf" is correctly transcribed to "Fuenf" from german into english. All umlauts disassemble into a "+e".  ;)
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on February 05, 2019, 06:44:04 pm
(https://i.imgur.com/8qnv9vB.jpg)
Come on FRED, how is someone suppose to make a gauntlet if you're going to complain about placing a few ships?
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: FrikgFeek on February 05, 2019, 06:47:28 pm
Quote
Nordera Marauder 296

Spoon no

Stop dis

I have a family
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Spoon on February 05, 2019, 06:48:41 pm
No you don't.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Nightmare on February 05, 2019, 06:55:41 pm
Come on FRED, how is someone suppose to make a gauntlet if you're going to complain about placing a few ships?

ship-create SEXP?

No you don't.

:wakka:
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Jellyfish on February 05, 2019, 10:36:49 pm
I thought the SCP versions of FRED increased the limit of ships you could have.
Title: Re: A WoD dev blog
Post by: Nightmare on February 06, 2019, 06:02:42 am
Not enough for WoD. :D