[Christoph_Berg]

I asked about this topic back in 2002, but there was no big response.

To bring this topic back to mind, I would like to ask if it is possible to make translation of campaigns easier, by merging the two tables tbstrings.tbl and strings.tbl in one.

This could be useable for the FreeSpace Port, because there was a German version of FreeSpace 1, but just copying from the German mission files to the Port mission files would create two versions of the same file, which would mean there would be two incompatible versions of the port.

Here is the link to the old discussion.

[Inquisitor]

Basically, we need someoen to do the work

[Christoph_Berg]

I'd like to help, but I don't really much C/C++. That's the problem.

[Setekh]

Hey, Christoph. This is indeed a great endeavour, but difficult to implement. If you could hook up with someone who has coding expertise and lend your language skills to them and vice versa, this could get done.

[Christoph_Berg]

Yep. But how should I get the coders?

[taylor]

I'll help you out.  I've already got a lot to do but we can get started on this at least.

As far as merging strings.tbl and tstrings.tbl though that's probably not a good idea.  The two files are for different things and I doubt it would help any to merge them.  Doing this would also break original tables unless we code around that to support old and new but that could get pretty tricky.

It may be good to just create a new table (ie, mstrings.tbl) that would contain translated strings for mods and single missions.  This would hopefully make it easier for mod makers to distribute and update translations and we wouldn't have to play around so much with the existing limits.  Fred could possibly be modified to automatically generate (English at least) mstrings.tbl during editing.  Then the translators can come in and translate the strings into the desired language.

[Inquisitor]

taylor: I trust you to design something that scales and behaves itself, so, if you are volunteering, go for it

And after Sunday, I vote we get your linux stuff in properly into CVS

[taylor]

Originally posted by Inquisitor
taylor: I trust you to design something that scales and behaves itself, so, if you are volunteering, go for it

Here's hoping.  Actually I have thought about this already since the idea has been brought up several times before.  Most of my beta testers for icculus.org stuff (especially FS1) were German so we had talked about better language support in '02 while FS1 was in beta.  This is where the language auto-selection came from as well so that we didn't have to keep two different language builds around.

And after Sunday, I vote we get your linux stuff in properly into CVS

Sounds good to me.  I've still got things to get working as well as I want them to but the code cleanup is done and there is nothing really holding it up but the 3.6 release.  Streaming and 3D positional audio are the only things that don't work 100% yet but they can be completed down the road.  Beyond that, everything that works on Windows should now work on Linux.

[Christoph_Berg]

I'll help you out. I've already got a lot to do but we can get started on this at least.

That's good to hear, taylor. I like your idea with a new table. This would have the advantage that mods wouldn't interfere with each other, when they start using the XSTRs.

I remember that there were some strings hardcoded in the FS2 code. A long time ago I had a look at this code. It would be good if we could also put these strings in the desired table. The strings are mostly for briefing icons if I remember correctly.

[taylor]

Originally posted by Christoph_Berg
I remember that there were some strings hardcoded in the FS2 code. A long time ago I had a look at this code. It would be good if we could also put these strings in the desired table. The strings are mostly for briefing icons if I remember correctly.

I'll have to look at the briefing icon thing again but I know they are translated in game because of the way all of that is set up.  I'll go over that code again and try to figure out an easier way to do it.  The HUD targetbox has the same problem.  Just start making a list of everything that's hardcoded or incorrect and we'll start working through it.

[Christoph_Berg]

Okay, will make a list about everything I found in the code.

[Christoph_Berg]

Okay. I've found it. All hardcodec strings reside in the localize.cpp file. We have four functions: One for weapon names,  one for Briefing icons, one for ship names and the last one is for the targetbox.

It seems that the weapon and ship names are not in the localization tables.

[Hayabusa]

I must say there are many NON - English  versions of Freespace 2and  that`s the problem. Some of them seem not to work properly with Open Source...

[Christoph_Berg]

Some of them seem not to work properly with Open Source...

Well. The German version of FreeSpace works good. Even the umlauts are displayed properly. But I think there was a post about added support for the German umlauts.

To support every language the string handeling must changed to support unicode.

[Lightspeed]

FS2 has only been released in very few languages. AFAIK only in english, polish and german.

[kasperl]

French, IIRC.


But why can't we just make sure it is available in other languages? We would need to get some voice acting done, and it might be hard, but just getting the strings translated might be easier. It opens up a whole new market, you know.......

[Lightspeed]

Anyone should be able to read / use / and play an english version. And it doesn't hurt to have english text, but for example french voice acting.

[taylor]

I'm working out the details for the new table for strings now.  I've worked on it a little today and only have a few more details to work out regarding mods and then I can start coding.

Polish language support was added to the icculus.org version and could be ported over without too much difficulty.  I haven't seen a completely working French version but then I don't live in France so what do I know.

There is more to this than just strings though.  We'll have to modify the font files, while still supporting the old ones, to support any additional characters, and support right-to-left text if the language requires it.  We will also need to start using more XSTR()'s in tables (ships, weapons for the names) so that the translations don't have to be hardcoded.  Fred will have to be modified to preserve current translations and give the mission designer the option of choosing what language they are writing messages in as well as generating a new table for new strings.  The main table of translations will have to be setup and maintained.  We also need to create a tool that would make it easy for translators to add translations without having to use Fred to do it.  There is also the question of unicode translation for strings in a completely cross platform way that doesn't require a ton changes to the game.

[kasperl]

Ok, it would be hard, I gather. On the other hand, if, one day, post 4.0 or something, we get fully working multi language support it is a great selling feature.

Nothing to worry about very soon, as far as I care, though.

[Hayabusa]

Well... I`ll check 3.6 and see if it works with my Freespace 2 and if it`s correct... well there might appear quite many people willing to  use 3.6