[Zacam]

So, I noticed that aside from Training-1.fs2, none of the other training missions have a special condition check for firing on the instructor causing a warp out debriefing. So, I went through to correct that oversight and came a cross a perplexing problem in the file mentioned in the title.

The following is taken directly from the original.

Code: [Select]

$Formula: ( when
   ( is-event-true-delay "Well Done" 3 )
   ( training-msg "Confirm That" )
)
+Name: Confirm That
+Repeat Count: 1
+Interval: 1
+Chained: 2

$Formula: ( when
   ( targeted "GTT Argo 01" )
   ( training-msg "Now Have Epsilon" )
)
+Name: Now Have Epsilon
+Repeat Count: 1
+Interval: 1
+Chained: 4

$Formula: ( when
   ( is-destroyed-delay 0 "GTT Argo 01" )
   ( do-nothing )
)
+Name: Directive (Now Have Epsilon)
+Repeat Count: 1
+Interval: 1
+Chained: 0
+Objective:  XSTR("Order Epsilon to Destroy Target", 2317)
+Objective key:  XSTR("Press [$C$], [2], [1], [1]", 2318)

$Formula: ( when
   ( is-event-true-delay
      "Now Have Epsilon"
      8
   )
   ( training-msg "Select [2]" )
)
+Name: Select [2]
+Repeat Count: 1
+Interval: 1
+Chained: 0

$Formula: ( when
   ( true )
   ( training-msg "Now Press The" )
)
+Name: Now Press The
+Repeat Count: 1
+Interval: 1
+Chained: 12

$Formula: ( when
   ( is-destroyed-delay 0 "GTT Argo 01" )
   ( training-msg "Well Done, Pilot!" )
)
+Name: Well Done, Pilot!
+Repeat Count: 1
+Interval: 1

Now, what happens is that it displays the Objective properly, along with the key sequence. BUT it doesn't play all the audio. It plays "Confirm That" followed by "Now Have Epsilon", completley skips "Select [2]", ONLY plays "Now Press The" once the GTT Argo 01 is destroyed and misses the "Well Done, Pilot!". I can GET it to play all of the audio cue's, but every attempt I've tried that successfully get's all trainin-msg's to play, result in the Objective displaying as already fullfilled. How can I get it to do both? (Display Objective and switch to fullfilled once the Argo is gone as well as play all training-msg cues)

And yes, I realize that this is a complete nit-pick on a retail mission. However, inconsistant behaviour annoy's me (even consistant inconsistant behaviour) and this not operating in the spirit that it SHOULD really get's on my nerves. There was a similar issue in Training-3.fs2 where you're prompted to select the Tempest missiles. And the audio cue feedback would proceed EVEN IF you never changed your secondary weapons. (It also outfitted you with a Promethius-R which you're not qualified for at the time.) So while these may be inconsiquential in the grander scheme of things, since no one else is targeting them I decided to do so. Besides, it's giving me experience with how mission and campaign files work and experience in FRED (even though I haven't actually fired it up yet save to have it check the files when I'm done.)

[karajorma]

Are you looking at this mission in FRED or just notepad? Cause I find it easier to spot errors like this in FRED where you can see the chaining etc visually.

At a quick glance I can't see anything actually wrong with the mission. Chaining the "Select [2]" event to the one above it is pointless but shouldn't actually harm the mission any. The message does have a bit of a long wait before apprearing though (8 seconds from the time Now Have Epsilon comes true though. Have you tried waiting that long to see if the event does eventually trigger?

While I'm at it I don't consider having the Prometheus an inconsistancy. How else are you supposed to qualify for a new weapon other than training on it in simulator missions?

[Zacam]

If you qualify for the Prometheus in Training-1 through Training-3, then why isn't that mentioned in the basic loadout brief for Training-1? And then why is it not available until SM1-03, the mission just before your transfer (And the loading of TSM-104)?

And not all weapons are qualified for in simulator missions, just as a part of the campaign flow (otherwise there would be a lot more TSM's to play through!)

I haven't launched FRED, I'm using a notepad like program and the FS exe (Retail and SCP). And changing the timing from 8 to 0 (or any acceptable value in between) does nothing. It's "theoretically" chained just fine, but it doesn't perform as intended. I'll see what FRED has to say about it.

[karajorma]

I'm not saying that you'd have to fly the simulator to qualify for every weapon in the game but to me it makes perfect sense that you could be granted a weapon in the simulator that you aren't authorised to use in real missions yet.

Because this is your first combat assignment, you'll be authorized to carry the standard armaments: the Subach HL-7, the Tempest dumb-fire, and the Rockeye heat-seeking missile. These weapons are covered in the training modules and in the tech room database. As you gain experience in combat, you will be authorized to use more advanced weaponry.

It's pretty obvious that Loukakis is refering to real life not simulator here. Being given the Prom doesn't contradict what he says one iota as far as I'm concerned. Military pilots are always qualified to use stuff in simulator before they are given it in RL.

[Zacam]

K, makes sense. I still think it's an oversight that it appears there, but that in and of itself is not the issue.

FRED doesn't show anything wrong with the file at all. Yet by the apperance of the missions intentions, those audio cues are supposed to play and they don't. I can get them to play, but then it flags the "Objective" as already completed. I need to figure out how to get it to retain the "Objective" until it IS completed AND play the audio cues. I've tried mashing about the various sexp's to find something that will work, but I can only seem to accomplish one or the other. And yes, I have the Wiki open for FRED and I've read the Retail SEXP Reference (have that open on yet another tab as we speak.)

I did note in FRED that they're not all chained like most other missions. Not sure if that's relevant, I'll try chaining them in FRED and testing that output after a brief nap and my 2-hour obligatory contract on-site call.

[Wobble73]

Funnily enough I was playing these training missions last night, I also noticed that some of the objectives/directives were satisfied when I did nothing, i.e. selecting the tempests (I was actually distracted by Big Brother for a second, don't ask, the wife watches it, and I heard the objective satisfied noise??)

[Zacam]

Yup. I figure since I don't know enough coding to help out on the EXE aside from testing and since DaBrain hasn't released any Alpha's/Beta's for upcoming new VP's, I'd pass the time doing mission corrections. (since nameplates for ships will likely be in the new vp's, they might as well be corrected.)

I'm also ensuring consistancy with the $f and $h tags in mission briefs, spell checking and other little things that probably are not all that important as I previously mentioned, but the wonder of the stuff that the SCP provides beyond the original EXE kind of comes to a stumble when you're distracted from the immersion by little things.

I'm good at little things.

Also, side note on the Prometheus-R. Even though it shows up in SM1-03, you don't receive a "Now Qualified" until TSM-104. So it shouldn't even be available in SM1-03 either.

[karajorma]

I hope you're starting with Admiral Nelson's missions from mv_models.vp rather than the standard FS2 ones though.

[Zacam]

Heh. I am indeed, but thank you for asking on that. It would be an easy mistake to make.

Quick opinion poll thing: When correcting the $f and $h tags in the mission briefing, should I also add them to the Command Briefings, or leave them as they are? (I don't recall ever seeing any flavor colors in the Command Briefs (but I could be wrong) and the Command Briefs _will_ accept them.)

[Zacam]

Mea Culpa.

The code snippet from the first post isn't entirely accurate, apparently. I forgot that I had already modified the file to test the "Fire on Instructor" check to exit the TSM. Apparently this:

$Formula: ( when ( true ) ( do-nothing ) )
+Name: Event name
+Repeat Count: 1
+Interval: 1

was supposed to be immediately after "+Name: Directive (now have epsilon)" and for some reason it wasn't. With it in place and no changes made, it proceedes as it should. Double checking and re-examining how this happened, but for now, this particular issue is now resolved.

Things Learned:
Always double check source and modified files before declaring an issue.
Using "+Name: Event Name" formula's after a directive is important to preserve continuity when the next event is not the conclusion event. (This threw me, because of the Objectives events DON'T have this in them, but they're also not "multi-event" Objectives.)
Don't try doing things like this (or post about them) during a time when one should be sleeping prior to work. Sleep first, post later.

[karajorma]

That's good advice It's why the second I detect a problem in a mission or mod I always try to reproduce it using retail data before anything else. I've lost track of the number of "code bugs" that turned out to be someone doing something wrong in FRED.