Author Topic: TRUSPACE: I need some help.  (Read 1784 times)

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Offline EAD_Agamemnon

  • 28
  • Fuzzy Wuzzy wasn't very Fuzzy Was He?
TRUSPACE: I need some help.
I've !FINALLY! figured out how to actually make a model using TS (v3.2 in my case since I cant afford to buy any other versions). I've built myself a basic ship, but I am still trying to figure out where to go from there. I've already slapped on some textures, and can use MODVIEW or PCS to get engines or guns on the thing, but while looking at other models made by others to get an idea of what I need to do, I'm unsure.

In TruSpace Extensions, I've run into a wall much like I did when I originally got TS last year (only very recently I tried TS again and figured out the basics of making a model). Any and all hints will be appreciated...
"Never start a fight, but always finish it."  - Captain John Sheridan
-------
In Diffucult Ground; Press On
In Encircled Ground; Devise Strategems
In Death Ground; FIGHT!

Sun Tzu on The Art of War circa 400 B.C.

 

Offline karajorma

  • King Louie - Jungle VIP
  • Administrator
  • 214
    • Karajorma's Freespace FAQ
Re: TRUSPACE: I need some help.
I'm not quite certain I see what your problem is. If you can get a ship in game all you need do now is practice and improve your skills. :)
Karajorma's Freespace FAQ. It's almost like asking me yourself.

[ Diaspora ] - [ Seeds Of Rebellion ] - [ Mind Games ]

 

Offline EAD_Agamemnon

  • 28
  • Fuzzy Wuzzy wasn't very Fuzzy Was He?
Re: TRUSPACE: I need some help.
As of this response I think I got the heirarchy thing in place (this is where I was having trouble...but I looked at the table for the Fenris cruiser and that helped)...the various submodels actually show up now in MODVIEW. I think I have things in order now, I even modified the Hippocrates table file to fit with my NewShip.pof.

One thing I'd like to do...probably more than my wanting to make a kick *** looking ship....is actually figure out how FRED works.
"Never start a fight, but always finish it."  - Captain John Sheridan
-------
In Diffucult Ground; Press On
In Encircled Ground; Devise Strategems
In Death Ground; FIGHT!

Sun Tzu on The Art of War circa 400 B.C.

 

Offline EAD_Agamemnon

  • 28
  • Fuzzy Wuzzy wasn't very Fuzzy Was He?
Re: TRUSPACE: I need some help.
DOUBLE POST

WOOHOO! IT WORKED! Mind you I got a few errors regarding the subsystems or some such. I slapped the ship into place of the Myrmidon so I got to actually fly this oddball I made. Only has 4 spire-like turrets at this time....I've gotten to enjoy flying cruisers even IF I can only be the helmsman. The ship I made !resembles! the type of ships you see the Narns attacking Ragesh 3 with...vaguely though. Now that I actually have an idea of what to do....I got 1 idea I'm going to try starting on...wont be anything flashy...but...

I need to get a screeny of my ship...only need to figure out the best way to get one so I can show my 1st piece of work...
"Never start a fight, but always finish it."  - Captain John Sheridan
-------
In Diffucult Ground; Press On
In Encircled Ground; Devise Strategems
In Death Ground; FIGHT!

Sun Tzu on The Art of War circa 400 B.C.

 

Offline Getter Robo G

  • 211
  • Elite Super Robot Pilot
Re: TRUSPACE: I need some help.
your printscreen button, take a shot and places it in main FS2 directory... Open that pic and save it as a 800x600(or smaller) pic and thn get a image file hosting site: like Imageshack or photobucket...

Upload the pic there and copy link to lit, then place link in your forum postings...

"Don't think of it as being out-numbered, think of it as having a WIDE target selection!"

"I am the one and ONLY Star Dragon..."
Proof for the noobs:  Member Search

[I'm Just an idea guy, NOT: a modeler, texturer, or coder... Word of advice, "Watch out for the ducks!"]

Robotech II - Continuing...
FS2 Trek - Snails move faster than me...
Star Blazers: Journey to Iscandar...
FS GUNDAM - The Myth lives on... :)

 

Offline EAD_Agamemnon

  • 28
  • Fuzzy Wuzzy wasn't very Fuzzy Was He?
Re: TRUSPACE: I need some help.
Okay. Will do.



I've run into another problem though. I can get the ships to appear in-game, but as soon as one dies....FS2 crashes. When loading I get a number of errors regarding subsystems. A copy of the ship table and the errors is as follows, and I apologize that it might take up a good bit of space.

Ship Table Entry:

$Name:                          GTHFr Heavy Escort
$Short name:               Heavy Escort Gunship
$Species:                       Terran
+Tech Description:
XSTR("This is my second ship. There are none like it. But this one is mine. This vessel is the same as NewShip but with the

addition of four more twin turrets.", 3046)
$end_multi_text
$POF file:                      NewShip2.pof
$Detail distance:            (0,0,0,0)
$Show damage:               YES
$Density:                       1
$Damp:                          0.2
$Rotdamp:                       1.0
$Max Velocity:               0.0, 0.0, 30.0
$Rotation time:               40.0, 40.0, 40.0
$Rear Velocity:               0.0
$Forward accel:               10.0
$Forward decel:               5.0
$Slide accel:               0.0
$Slide decel:               0.0
$Expl inner rad:            200.0
$Expl outer rad:            1000.0
$Expl damage:               200.0
$Expl blast:               3500.0
$Expl Propagates:            YES            ;; If set to Yes, then when the ship dies,

the explosion propagates through it.
$Shockwave Speed:            100.0         ;; speed shockwave expands at, 0 means no shockwave
$Default PBanks:            ()
$Default SBanks:            ()
$SBank Capacity:            ()
$Shields:                       10000
$Power Output:               10.0
$Max Oclk Speed:            55.0
$Max Weapon Eng:            100.0
$Hitpoints:                     10000
$Flags:                         ( "cruiser" "in tech database")
$AI Class:                      Captain
$Afterburner:               NO
$Countermeasures:            0
$Scan time:                     2000
$EngineSnd:                  191                   ;; Engine sound of ship
$Closeup_pos:               0.0, 0.0, -500
$Closeup_zoom:               .55
$Shield_icon:   GenericShield
$Score:                     100
$Subsystem:                     turret01, 5.0, 1.0
   $Default PBanks:         ( "Terran Huge Turret" )
$Subsystem:                     turret02, 5.0, 1.0
   $Default PBanks:         ( "Terran Huge Turret" )
$Subsystem:                     turret03, 5.0, 1.0
   $Default PBanks:         ( "Terran Huge Turret" )
$Subsystem:                     turret04, 5.0, 1.0
   $Default PBanks:         ( "Terran Huge Turret" )
$Subsystem:         turret05, 10.0, 1.0
   $Default PBanks:         ( "Terran Turret" "Terran Turret" )
$Subsystem:         turret06, 10.0, 1.0
   $Default PBanks:         ( "Terran Turret" "Terran Turret" )
$Subsystem:         turret07, 10.0, 1.0
   $Default PBanks:         ( "Terran Turret" "Terran Turret" )
$Subsystem:         turret08, 10.0, 1.0
   $Default PBanks:         ( "Terran Turret" "Terran Turret" )
$Subsystem:                     sensors,                         4, 0
$Subsystem:                     communications,  4, 0.0
$Subsystem:                     navigation,              4, 0.0
$Subsystem:                     weapons1,                         4, 0.0
$Subsystem:         weapons2,
$Subsystem:                     engine,                 30, 0.0
   $Engine Wash:   Default300
;-------------------

Errors upon starting FS2:

Error: ships.tbl(1013):
Error: Expecting float, found [$Subsystem:                     ].

File:parse/parselo.cpp
Line: 551
[This filename points to the location of a file on the computer that built this executable]

Call stack:
------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------------------------------------------

Error: ships.tbl(1013):
Error: Expecting float, found [engine,                 30, 0.0].

File:parse/parselo.cpp
Line: 551
[This filename points to the location of a file on the computer that built this executable]

Call stack:
------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------------------------------------------


Error: ships.tbl(1014):
Error: Required token = [#End], [$Subsystem:] or [$Name], found [30, 0.0].

File:parse/parselo.cpp
Line: 551
[This filename points to the location of a file on the computer that built this executable]

Call stack:
------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------------------------------------------

Error: ships.tbl(1014):
Error: Required token = [#End], [$Subsystem:] or [$Name], found [$Engine Wash:   Default300].

File:parse/parselo.cpp
Line: 551
[This filename points to the location of a file on the computer that built this executable]

Call stack:
------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------------------------------------------

Error: ships.tbl(2012):
Error: Expecting float, found [$Subsystem:                     ].

File:parse/parselo.cpp
Line: 551
[This filename points to the location of a file on the computer that built this executable]

Call stack:
------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------------------------------------------

Error: ships.tbl(2013):
Error: Expecting float, found [engine,                 30, 0.0].

File:parse/parselo.cpp
Line: 551
[This filename points to the location of a file on the computer that built this executable]

Call stack:
------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------------------------------------------

Error: ships.tbl(2014):
Error: Required token = [#End], [$Subsystem:] or [$Name], found [30, 0.0].

File:parse/parselo.cpp
Line: 551
[This filename points to the location of a file on the computer that built this executable]

Call stack:
------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------------------------------------------

Error: ships.tbl(2015):
Error: Required token = [#End], [$Subsystem:] or [$Name], found [$Engine Wash:   Default300].

File:parse/parselo.cpp
Line: 551
[This filename points to the location of a file on the computer that built this executable]

Call stack:
------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------------------------------------------


Now I'm in an area beyond my knowledge.

P.S. Any idea why after awhile in TS...the Eye move (UP, DOWN, SIDE TO SIDE), Eye ZOOM (IN & OUT)...and the one that lets your circle object...wont work after a certain point? I had this come up last night and the only way I was immediately able to figure out how to fix it was to reinstall. ATM only the Eye Rotate fails to work...though it was working just fine earlier today.
« Last Edit: August 26, 2006, 08:57:57 pm by EAD_Agamemnon »
"Never start a fight, but always finish it."  - Captain John Sheridan
-------
In Diffucult Ground; Press On
In Encircled Ground; Devise Strategems
In Death Ground; FIGHT!

Sun Tzu on The Art of War circa 400 B.C.

 

Offline bizzybody

  • 29
  • Space Viking
    • Fandemonium 2008!
Re: TRUSPACE: I need some help.
trueSpace 3.2 is a decent program, but has its share of problems and bugs. :P It's the first release with the cubical UV mapping option and the final release before the 4.x series. 3.2 was also the first version to make really good use of the tSX plugin API. I don't remember which of the 4.x series was the first to have the Lightworks rendering engine, which was the same renderer available as a *plugin* for lightwave that cost more than trueSpace. It was like getting Lightworks for free. :) (I suspect licensing issues on Lightworks is why Caligari hasn't released any newer version for free.)

One bug is that sometimes when moving points or edges or faces, they'll just zip way off into nowhere, making a big spike and worse, that bug also clears the undo buffer.

Another issue is accuracy when moving more than one vertex with the mouse. Create a cube and select on vertical face. Switch to Left or Right view so the selected face is edge-on to you. On the panel for point/edge/face manipulation, click the button with the double ended arrow, then on the main toobar, click the Y button to bind movement to that axis only. Now hold the left button and move the mouse left and right to move the face. Note how the points start drifting out of place.

A better way to move the face is to rightclick the arrow cursor button and manually enter the new dimension there. You can get perfect accuracy with trueSpace 3.2, but you have to manually enter the numbers or have a high resolution mouse and move vertices while watching the numbers count up and down.

If you do any erasing of vertices to do advanced shaping, keep a cube hanging around. Why? As a test to see if the mesh has become non-solid. Select your object, then click the boolean subtract button then  click that cube. If you can't do it, your object has become non-solid and there's not a hell of a lot tS 3.2 can do with non-solid meshes. (It wasn't until 6.5 or 6.6 that Caligari FINALLY figured out a way to add faces to fill holes to convert non-solid meshes to solid ones.)

To avoid trouble and loss of work, treat trueSpace 3.2 like you would a computer game. SAVE right after every operation you do that worked right and SAVE right _before_ doing something that may go really wrong and can't be undone.
"They were really only teeny little A-bombs, honest!" Dr. Charles Dart

 

Offline EAD_Agamemnon

  • 28
  • Fuzzy Wuzzy wasn't very Fuzzy Was He?
Re: TRUSPACE: I need some help.
At the moment, the only headaches TS is giving me is that the Eye Move, Rotate, and Zoom are periodically failng to function on me, as it is at this very moment as of this post....had to reinstall again to overcome the problem...any idea why this problem is?

Regarding bizzy's reply, thanks for those pointers, but they dont seem to answer why my ships when they are destroyed cause FS to crash and my table entries are causing errors.
"Never start a fight, but always finish it."  - Captain John Sheridan
-------
In Diffucult Ground; Press On
In Encircled Ground; Devise Strategems
In Death Ground; FIGHT!

Sun Tzu on The Art of War circa 400 B.C.

 

Offline Wanderer

  • Wiki Warrior
  • 211
  • Mostly harmless
Re: TRUSPACE: I need some help.
$Subsystem:                     navigation,              4, 0.0
$Subsystem:                     weapons1,                         4, 0.0
$Subsystem:         weapons2,
$Subsystem:                     engine,                 30, 0.0
   $Engine Wash:   Default300
;-------------------

That line seems to be missing something, like 4, 0.0.... and remember to test the model by loading it with debug builds (fred-d is quite good for this).

And i tend use 'Walk through World' option with TS, works very nicely.
Do not meddle in the affairs of coders for they are soggy and hard to light

 

Offline bizzybody

  • 29
  • Space Viking
    • Fandemonium 2008!
Re: TRUSPACE: I need some help.
At the moment, the only headaches TS is giving me is that the Eye Move, Rotate, and Zoom are periodically failng to function on me, as it is at this very moment as of this post....had to reinstall again to overcome the problem...any idea why this problem is?

Things to check. Is the Grid Mode on? (Grid button slightly greyer than other buttons.) Are the XYZ buttons at the far right NOT 'pushed in'? When they're 'out' they lock the X, Y, and Z, axes respectively. Those buttons are also context sensitive. If you have Z locked for Eye Rotate then click the Object Rotate button, the axis locks switch to how you had them the last time you selected Object Rotate.

Once you get used to how that works, it's very useful!
"They were really only teeny little A-bombs, honest!" Dr. Charles Dart

 

Offline EAD_Agamemnon

  • 28
  • Fuzzy Wuzzy wasn't very Fuzzy Was He?
Re: TRUSPACE: I need some help.
Okay, I'll try what is suggested.....

This modeling thing is actually....kinda fun....I not done anything else for the past 3 days now EXCEPT this... :)
"Never start a fight, but always finish it."  - Captain John Sheridan
-------
In Diffucult Ground; Press On
In Encircled Ground; Devise Strategems
In Death Ground; FIGHT!

Sun Tzu on The Art of War circa 400 B.C.

 

Offline Getter Robo G

  • 211
  • Elite Super Robot Pilot
Re: TRUSPACE: I need some help.
I was told long ago that ships that die/crash are bad geometry (is this true?)...

  I have quite a few of those myself piled up...


Oh, on another note... If your ship is capable of rearming (tabel wise) like a cap ship model using a fighter table or has expendable ordinance make sure you DISABLE support ships in FRED.

Nothing like testing out a ship/mission and in the middle of it someone calls in support and causes a crash! (your ship has no dockpoint yet and that causes a fatal error)...
"Don't think of it as being out-numbered, think of it as having a WIDE target selection!"

"I am the one and ONLY Star Dragon..."
Proof for the noobs:  Member Search

[I'm Just an idea guy, NOT: a modeler, texturer, or coder... Word of advice, "Watch out for the ducks!"]

Robotech II - Continuing...
FS2 Trek - Snails move faster than me...
Star Blazers: Journey to Iscandar...
FS GUNDAM - The Myth lives on... :)

  

Offline EAD_Agamemnon

  • 28
  • Fuzzy Wuzzy wasn't very Fuzzy Was He?
Re: TRUSPACE: I need some help.
When I fly the cap ships, it substitute all the information from POF file name  to the last subsystem...havent gotten any errors that way yet. At once point I had most Terran fighters replaced with cruiser-sized ships just slapped in from various mods...only bad thing is that it appears theres a certain limit to turrets in the scene....having say 8-12 fighters on your side and about the same on the other....nothing wants to shoot....

Anywho...got my 2nd ship model 'somewhat' completed. I turned a version that didnt have its heirarchy set yet into a POF to see how it would look (surface mode only since I have yet to slap any textures on it)....it didnt load.

An Error Occured!

Error #6027:
Too many bounding boxes.
Should be <=4886184

Hmm...I triangulated the model...it actually lowered things after I did that than the non-triangulated one it seems. The thing while in TS....has 4410 verticies, 5762 faces...and takes 45-55 seconds for PCS to load when I select the model with COB to POF...and has crashed PCS at least once as a result it seems. It isn't a BIG model eitehr...about twice the size of a fenris/leviathan, and fairly simple in shape...though the engine nozzels (cylinders that taper at one end) are each about 100 vertices and 100 faces each....

Did I go overboard on the model?
"Never start a fight, but always finish it."  - Captain John Sheridan
-------
In Diffucult Ground; Press On
In Encircled Ground; Devise Strategems
In Death Ground; FIGHT!

Sun Tzu on The Art of War circa 400 B.C.