Author Topic: Airplane discussion  (Read 13858 times)

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Offline Admiral Nelson

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They started a day early this year. I can't say its easy to get decent pics in the rain.  Props have a certain appeal that jets somehow don't match....








« Last Edit: October 04, 2006, 07:40:52 pm by Admiral Nelson »
If a man consults whether he is to fight, when he has the power in his own hands, it is certain that his opinion is against fighting.

 

Offline Unknown Target

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The problem with the Tomcat was that it required a lot (and I mean a lot) of maintenance and spare parts from what I hear, and back in 1992 or something, Dick Cheney ordered all factories/equipment producing those to be shut down in preperation for the Tomcat retirement.
Quite simply, I think the Tomcat just got too expensive to operate for a mission that really didn't exist anymore - aerial intercept/superiority. The Super Bug can drop bombs better than the Bombcat ever could/can, and it can dogfight/intercept at least half as well. The Navy doesn't need aircraft to fight the Russians anymore, it needs aircraft to fight insurgencies.

EDIT: Nelson, great pics btw :)

 

Offline NGTM-1R

  • I reject your reality and substitute my own
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F/A-18E Super Hornet is essentially new aircraft, it's superficially similar and name was given to get funding from Congress though  :confused: It has over two times the combat range of C/D and carries a lot more weapons and fuel. It has longer combat range than Tomcat! Hornet's slower, though, but full burn uses fuel.

The F/A-18C's range with a standard combat load of external stores, assuming it has to fly back to where it launched from, is about 275 nautical miles. The F/A-18D's varies depending on the type of mission; most missile-based stores like SEAD,  ASuW, or standard CAP loadouts give 370nm round-trip range, close-support loadouts heavy on the bombs drop it to 250nm. The F/A-18E's stretched fuselage for expanded fuel storage and improved engines give it slightly better radius, which also varies heavily based on stores it's loaded with but hovers around 400nm (which is less than twice of the C/D). The F/A-18F's combat radius is about 370nm.

For comparison, the ranges of the Tomcat the F/A-18E is replacing: Standard intercept loadout for an F-14B gives it a round-trip range of about 475nm; escort loadout gives changes it to be about 525nm. The F-14D's range with standard interception loadout is 525nm; the range with an escort loadout is 700nm. As you can see, the F/A-18E doesn't reach as far as the F-14.

The A-6E's ranges, for comparison to F/A-18F that replaced it: Bomb-based loads give it 600nm round-trip range, missile-based like SEAD and ASuW or precision weapons tend to be about 700nm.

Much as we don't like to admit it, the Backfires are still out there. China is reportedly interested in buying some; so are India and Iran. It's also known that Egypt, Iran, Libya, and China have purchased Badgers (and have the missiles to arm them), which would have been the secondary targets of the Tomcat. In some cases the Hornet's range isn't even far enough to intercept a Badger before it launches missiles. Whatever the decisions regarding the Tomcat, whatever the reasons for retiring it, was taken out of service before the threat it was designed to defeat was.
« Last Edit: October 04, 2006, 08:11:14 pm by ngtm1r »
"Load sabot. Target Zaku, direct front!"

A Feddie Story

 

Offline Janos

  • A *really* weird sheep
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F/A-18E Super Hornet is essentially new aircraft, it's superficially similar and name was given to get funding from Congress though  :confused: It has over two times the combat range of C/D and carries a lot more weapons and fuel. It has longer combat range than Tomcat! Hornet's slower, though, but full burn uses fuel.

The F/A-18C's range with a standard combat load of external stores, assuming it has to fly back to where it launched from, is about 275 nautical miles. The F/A-18D's varies depending on the type of mission; most missile-based stores like SEAD,  ASuW, or standard CAP loadouts give 370nm round-trip range, close-support loadouts heavy on the bombs drop it to 250nm. The F/A-18E's stretched fuselage for expanded fuel storage and improved engines give it slightly better radius, which also varies heavily based on stores it's loaded with but hovers around 400nm (which is less than twice of the C/D). The F/A-18F's combat radius is about 370nm.

For comparison, the ranges of the Tomcat the F/A-18E is replacing: Standard intercept loadout for an F-14B gives it a round-trip range of about 475nm; escort loadout gives changes it to be about 525nm. The F-14D's range with standard interception loadout is 525nm; the range with an escort loadout is 700nm. As you can see, the F/A-18E doesn't reach as far as the F-14.

The A-6E's ranges, for comparison to F/A-18F that replaced it: Bomb-based loads give it 600nm round-trip range, missile-based like SEAD and ASuW or precision weapons tend to be about 700nm.

Much as we don't like to admit it, the Backfires are still out there. China is reportedly interested in buying some; so are India and Iran. It's also known that Egypt, Iran, Libya, and China have purchased Badgers (and have the missiles to arm them), which would have been the secondary targets of the Tomcat. In some cases the Hornet's range isn't even far enough to intercept a Badger before it launches missiles. Whatever the decisions regarding the Tomcat, whatever the reasons for retiring it, was taken out of service before the threat it was designed to defeat was.

Our sources are different and yours are propably better, I only used wiki. But of course Tomcat was far from the only platform designed to counter that very specific attack - they have Aegis systems for that and actually the entire CVBG concept is based on protecting the valuable carrier from missile and torpedo attacks.

You need a lot of missiles to get through those defences. And no, SUNBURN! does not constitute as answer and if someone asks something about it then I'll get angry and copy-paste the patent naval officer's reply.

lol wtf

 

Offline Admiral Nelson

  • Resurrecter of Campaigns
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  • The GTA expects that every man will do his duty.
If a man consults whether he is to fight, when he has the power in his own hands, it is certain that his opinion is against fighting.

  

Offline Dysko

 :jaw:
Do you know when will be next Blue Angels' tour in Europe?  :D
My aviation photography website: GolfVictorSpotting.it