[NGTM-1R]

If you're saying that's a reasonable assumption then it follows that you're claiming the Moloch, Sathanas, Ravana and every other new class in FS2 is under 32 years old since we didn't see them in the 1st Great War.

Why not? The GTVA certainly put a lot of new classes into service.

But more to the point, this speculative blah blah blah pie-in-the-sky fleet is, well, speculative, and must bow to the existance of those ships that actually made it into ships.tbl for this sort of discussion. If FS2 hadn't existed, it would be perfectly reasonable to say the FS1 Shivan fleet comprised the majority of Shivan ship types in existance.

So no. I don't have to be making that claim. I can embrace the totality of what we know as having always existed, only we didn't know it all before. But I've still got .tbl files vs. your maybe-there's-more. Which trumps?

[Flipside]

We already know Volition were talking about planet-sized vessels, I'm assuming Shivan unless the '3rd' was to be set several thousand years in the future, so it's already certain that there is more than is in ships.tbl, I don't see even the Shivans being able to construct a ship that big outside of a considerable amount of time. Since we are talking hypothetical here, what if that was what they had in mind for Shivan 'worlds'?

Personally, I don't see the Moloch or Sathanas (particuarly the Moloch) being 'new' designs, the Mara and the Ravanna, however, I could almost accept it, they are almost a direct reply to the Terran vessels of FS1, the Orion and the Apollo/Ulysses etc, but built to Shivan standards. The sheer quantity of the Sathanas suggests to me that it is a workhorse of the Shivan fleet, which is a scary thought.

But then then it does not explain why a ship nearly 8000 years older has shields.It also means that the Demon Class vessel must also be extremely old.

[AlphaOne]

Here is a question we can all agree that the shivans have superior numbers to the GTVA at least in terms of Jugg class. they have ...well they have 80 or so the GTVA had 1 . Now while i do find the arguement that the jugg's might me theyr most expensive endeavour and/or theyr main battlefleet. I do not believe they have such a huge numerical advantage when it comes to destroyers and the works.

Cruisers yes by all means especialy the Lilith which ios more then capable of tearing appart a corvette and even a destroyer with the right circumstances.

However what is really more interesting is were those jugg's equiped with the same weapons as the lucifer or were the beam cannons already there? this question comes to mind when looking at the timescale of the shivans. Also are the later Demon class destroyer refits like the Orion or are they simply newer constructed ones?

Beacause of various game things we can asume that the Demon is at least as old as the Lucifer . At least that is what i believe. I could be wrong .

If this is the case and lets asume the Demon's we see are in fact refits then where the hell was it refitted . since it would mean that the shivans have at least some sort of base of shypyards near GTVA space. Perhaps 10 or 15 jumps away.

The jugg's might of been equped with beam cannons from the start but i also believe that the beam cannons tech was available to the shivans prior to the FS1 era. They just never got around to refitting the FS1 Lucifer fleet or there was no need for it. since the lucifer has those fricking powerfull fluxcannons which i believe do more dammage then even the BFRed.

[Admiral_Stones]

The Lucifer had shields because they were still effective. My theory is though that the beam cannons are too powerful to be stopped by shields, which is also supported by the fact that AAAf, AAAh, S-AAA and such anti-fighter beams trepass fighter and bomber shields. Why waster enery on it then?

[Kie99]

The Lucifer cannons are nowhere near as powerful as the BFRed.

[Snail]

Some retard said that Shivan Super Lasers are more powerful than any beam on veteran comments. I am disgusted.

[Admiral_Stones]

I was also shocked by this blatantly idiotic comment. Burn him, I say!

[Snail]

It was Mars! *gasp* The canon enforcer has made a grave mistake!


But then again, our failure to notice it for almost 2 years is embarrassing as well...

[Admiral_Stones]

I noticed it the first look I ever took at the SSL entry.

[TrashMan]

Shivan Flux Cannon is the weakest of all heavier beams..it takes..what? 8 hits to destroy a damaged Orion ..pfft.

[FreeSpaceFreak]

The damage per shot doesn't matter that much. The sustained DPSec is way more important. Yes, it may take 8 shots to destroy an Orion, but the reloading time is - 10 seconds? The BGreen, for example, destroys an Orion in 4 hits, but it needs to recharge for nearly half a minute between shots. So the SFC mows through its enemies much quicker.

The LRed does less damage per shot than the BGreen, but it recharges much faster. Its S.DPSec is nearly twice that of a BGreen. That's its greatest strength. The MjolnirBeam does even less damage per shot, but it recharges even faster. And we all know what that one can do.

[NGTM-1R]

Some retard said that Shivan Super Lasers are more powerful than any beam on veteran comments. I am disgusted.

The Jihad has struck.

Your comments are eliminated.

[Snail]

I was expecting someone to do that.