[Shadow Gunman]

To honest I am  creating a BOEish mission in FRED for a game I am having with my two brothers. Problem is I have met the max number of wings I can create in FRED which is around 25 I believe. Is there any possible way to go beyond the maximum wing limit in FRED?

Thanks in advace!

Edit: Also don't know if anybody cares or not but I have not went beyond the limit for maximum number of ships I can have at one time to host a net game which is 130 I think ( I have 95 right now).

[Mobius]

There's a wing limit that really pisses people off. The problems also come when I remove a wing and get a wings count error...

Try to change your concept...see, for example, if you can increase the number of waves of one wing and give new orders during the mission to replace another wing.

By the way, welcome to the HLPBB!!!

[Clawandfang]

Isn't...25...enough....?

[colecampbell666]

What type of PC do you plan to run that on. That's 150 fighters.

[Mobius]

Depends...

Anyway all those wings are too much for FS...missions aren't supposed to have so many wings. As I said before, try reducing their number and "merge" two or more wings into one

[Droid803]

25 *4 = 100 fighters.
That's already as many ships as you can place in FRED.

Unless you're using really small wings (3 fighters or less), this problem shouldn't come up at all...just make bigger wings and more waves.

[colecampbell666]

25 *4 = 100 fighters.
That's already as many ships as you can place in FRED.

Unless you're using really small wings (3 fighters or less), this problem shouldn't come up at all...just make bigger wings and more waves.

You can have wings of up to 6.

[Droid803]

Yes, which means, you should probably run out of ships before you run out of wings...

[FUBAR-BDHR]

3.6.10 currently supports more ships.  Something like 400???  Has the wing limit been increased in it as well?  I know that it's kind of crazy but your're talking to the master of trying crazy s$@^.  While 25 wings may seem like a lot if you are doing some kind of crazy TvT rember that is only 12 1/2 wings per side.  Oh and he did say it was a BOE mission.  Not that I am defending that many wings but who knows maybe there is a good reason.  I had one once upon a time.  Could have used 150 ships and 142 wings consisting of 1 fighter each.  That ended real quick when I realized there was a limit to ships, wings, and alt-ship names.  That mission went on to become both my and later Cet's BDHR mission.

[Shadow Gunman]

Feel like I better explain myself better for why I wanted to create more fighter wings beyound the maximum limit. Bascially I don't want a tug-o-war battle, I want a constant steady flow battle. To explain this a bit better I want 4 or less fighters per wing with a wing theshold of 1 each (cannot do this with a 6 wing limit so that my problem.) By doing this, when the last fighter is still standing in that wing, a new wing will arrive to replace that wing. Thus, when that last fighter in that wing is finally destroyed, the new wing will be in the fight already. By doing this I will be keeping a constant battle flow from both sides.

I don't want a tug-o-war battle (where there is no wing theshold on either side) where side A eventually overwhelms side B then side A waits for enemy forces to arrive, then Side B forces arrive and then overwhelms Side A, then again side B will wait for enemy reinforcements and side A forces arrive and overwhelms Side B and so on.

Again thanks for the help so far guys!

BTW i am using 3.6.10 Fred Editor

Also, some of my wings are taken up by capital ships in my game so they keep coming in at set intervals. That is another reason why I am interested in going beyond the maximum wing limit.

[FUBAR-BDHR]

OK then there is a way around it.  You better grab a 12 pack for this one it's probably not going to make sense otherwise.  Don't think in terms of waves and wings but more along the lines of what you want in battle at what time.  You can control the arrival of subsequent waves of wings by using events.  Lets say you have 2 wings of 6 fighters each.  Set them to 99 waves or whatever.  You can have wing 2 arrive when the first wing is say at 1 fighter left but not have it arrive if there are more than that.  I think its something like num-ships-in-wing sexp. 
Basically you can have all the wings arrivals base on repeating events using arguments like that.  This way you can always ensure a certain range of fighters in game.  It will take some doing but it can be done.  Just don't try to change the wings orders midway through arrivals doing that. 

<disclaimer> not responsible for hair loss or alcohol poisoning incurred from trying to figure it out <end disclaimer>

[Shadow Gunman]

OK then there is a way around it.  You better grab a 12 pack for this one it's probably not going to make sense otherwise.  Don't think in terms of waves and wings but more along the lines of what you want in battle at what time.  You can control the arrival of subsequent waves of wings by using events.  Lets say you have 2 wings of 6 fighters each.  Set them to 99 waves or whatever.  You can have wing 2 arrive when the first wing is say at 1 fighter left but not have it arrive if there are more than that.  I think its something like num-ships-in-wing sexp. 
Basically you can have all the wings arrivals base on repeating events using arguments like that.  This way you can always ensure a certain range of fighters in game.  It will take some doing but it can be done.  Just don't try to change the wings orders midway through arrivals doing that. 

<disclaimer> not responsible for hair loss or alcohol poisoning incurred from trying to figure it out <end disclaimer>

I think I get what your saying. Lets say we have wing A and wing B with 6 fighters in each wing. When wing A is down to lets say 2 fighters, the sexps trigger a respawn of a wing of wing B fighters. Also, if wing B is down to two fighters, the sexp trigger will respawn a wing of wing A fighters. Did i get this right?

If so, man I got work to do to figure out how to get this working because well Im not good with sexps lol. Done some before but some pretty basic ones. ( and probably forgot how to do the basic ones too since its been awile since fredding).

[Backslash]

Too much noise about nothing.  The wing limit was bumped to 75 a month or two ago   The trick is finding a recent enough build of FRED... sorry, I'm too tired to go look tonight.

Shadow Gunman's mission design sounds awesome and I look forward to seeing it.  Wing Commander Saga has been attempting a few missions like this, and that's why the limit got bumped. FUBAR's workaround is very clever, but as he said potentially confusing, and no longer as necessary

[Shadow Gunman]

Okay I give up. I can't get the sexp's to work properly (i think i got it to work once but when I decieded to fiddle with it i screwed it up). Can someone please post a stable build where I can go beyond the 25 wing limit?

Again thanks in advance!

[Admiral Edivad]

Did anybody already suggest the create-ship sexp?

[Mobius]

It would be difficult to handle the created ships...

[Galemp]

I'm going to go out on a limb here and state the obvious...

...you are using waves, right??