[Zuljin]

Didn't see this one up here already and it's been a few days since it happened too.
Seems this one passed most of  the media by while they weren't looking too closely.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/5134328.stm

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2006/10/18/military_commissions_a_go/

[Kosh]

Does this apply to civilian trials or just Gitmo-like people?

[Unknown Target]

Gitmo-like people AFAIK.

[Flipside]

Is he having a 'Who is the most crazy-insane despot' race with North Korea or something?

[Ashrak]

gitmo like people?


so he goes walking on the street... i DONT LIKE YOU, YOUR  TERRORIST BOOM torture yay

[aldo_14]

gitmo like people?


so he goes walking on the street... i DONT LIKE YOU, YOUR  TERRORIST BOOM torture yay

In effect, yeah.

Effectively it means the military can arrest anyone for suspected terrorism and detain them without any recourse to the civil legal system.  The military can then give them a military trial which is laughably (if it weren't so tragic) one sided, and finally execute them.  Plus the military reserves the right to detain these people even if they are aquitted by that tribunal - indefinately.

It is one of the most dangerous pieces of legislation I have ever seen;  by legislating some tissue paper laws on interrogation (when the real torture will be by export/rendition to Saudi Arabia, Yemen, Pakistan, etc or so-called black sites in places like Diego Garcia), the US government has created a basis for enforcing a police state where they can just 'vanish' people in the night with the simple accusation of terrorist sedition.

[Ashrak]

somehoe reminds me of the Clark Regime from B5 hmm


Heil Hitl..... Bush!

[Mefustae]

Oh, don't be so melodramatic. The current administration may suck, but they're not going to start vanishing people, no matter how eville you think they may be. The problem here is that the establishment of this act opens the door to future leaders who would use it to create a Police-state.

[aldo_14]

Oh, don't be so melodramatic. The current administration may suck, but they're not going to start vanishing people, no matter how eville you think they may be. The problem here is that the establishment of this act opens the door to future leaders who would use it to create a Police-state.

Didn't I just say make that very point?

[Mefustae]

No.

[aldo_14]

No.

Yes I did.

"the US government has created a basis for enforcing a police state where they can just 'vanish' people in the night with the simple accusation of terrorist sedition"

[Mefustae]

Granted, but you were still a tad unclear on the fact I highlighted, evidenced by Ashrak's 'colourful' post directly following yours.

You made a point that the US has created the basis for a Police-state. I pointed out that that does not mean the current administration/Bush will turn the US into a Police-state.

[aldo_14]

Granted, but you were still a tad unclear on the fact I highlighted, evidenced by Ashrak's 'colourful' post directly following yours.

You made a point that the US has created the basis for a Police-state. I pointed out that that does not mean the current administration/Bush will turn the US into a Police-state.

but they can if they want, now

[Mefustae]

They sure can.

...Wait, that's nothing to smile about! Oh my God, we're doomed!!

[aldo_14]

They sure can.

...Wait, that's nothing to smile about! Oh my God, we're doomed!!

Frowning is islamofacistic commieterrorism intended to disrupt the pleasurable benevolence of the Glorious Leader George W Bush, comrade!  Remember, unhappy is sedition and double-plus ungood!

[Mefustae]

And here I was thinking that Cults of Personality had gone out of style.

[aldo_14]

And here I was thinking that Cults of Personality had gone out of style.

Well, I have to admit to being disappointed with my recent recruitment rates.......

[Mefustae]

And now for something completely different.

As an aside, I just stumbled across an excellent quote that really sums up what I feel has been happening in the US lately.

“Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country.”

[aldo_14]

And now for something completely different.

As an aside, I just stumbled across an excellent quote that really sums up what I feel has been happening in the US lately.

“Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country.”

aah, yes.  Goering?

And not to forget Orwell;

The essential act of war is destruction, not necessarily of human lives, but of the products of human labour. War is a way of shattering to pieces, or pouring into the stratosphere, or sinking in the depths of the sea, materials which might otherwise be used to make the masses too comfortable, and hence, in the long run, too intelligent. Even when weapons of war are not actually destroyed, their manufacture is still a convenient way of expending labour power without producing anything that can be consumed. A Floating Fortress, for example, has locked up in it the labour that would build several hundred cargo-ships. Ultimately it is scrapped as obsolete, never having brought any material benefit to anybody, and with further enormous labours another Floating Fortress is built. In principle the war effort is always so planned as to eat up any surplus that might exist after meeting the bare needs of the population. In practice the needs of the population are always underestimated, with the result that there is a chronic shortage of half the necessities of life; but this is looked on as an advantage. It is deliberate policy to keep even the favoured groups somewhere near the brink of hardship, because a general state of scarcity increases the importance of small privileges and thus magnifies the distinction between one group and another. By the standards of the early twentieth century, even a member of the Inner Party lives an austere, laborious kind of life. Nevertheless, the few luxuries that he does enjoy his large, well-appointed flat, the better texture of his clothes, the better quality of his food and drink and tobacco, his two or three servants, his private motor-car or helicopter -- set him in a different world from a member of the Outer Party, and the members of the Outer Party have a similar advantage in comparison with the submerged masses whom we call 'the proles'. The social atmosphere is that of a besieged city, where the possession of a lump of horseflesh makes the difference between wealth and poverty. And at the same time the consciousness of being at war, and therefore in danger, makes the handing-over of all power to a small caste seem the natural, unavoidable condition of survival.

[Mefustae]

Got it in one. Conincidentally, I got the Goering quote from the 1984 wiki page.