[Mefustae]

I like where this thread started, and where it is going. It reminds me a lot of why I don't read this board anymore.

Little known fact: The United States also invented breast, lung and prostate cancer. The US also put the AIDS into Africa to kill off all the Colored people. The fact that the gay community caught it as well was only icing on the cake.

Yes, because commenting on the policies of the United States is wrong. Wrong, wrong, wrong. Damn us for committing this heinous sin! Damn us for having a ****ing opinion! Damn us all... well, except those of us like yourself who are obviously above it all.

[Knight Templar]

Basically.


Because, you know, the United States created Global Warming to defeat the Communists in the Cold War and to try to keep the European economy down. That's why nobody else in the world pollutes or contributes to any world wide CO2 / Toxin problems. Especially not the UK, China, France, Germany, or Russia.

But you have opinions, and ideas, and shivan jokes. So you already knew that.

[Mefustae]

Because, you know, the United States created Global Warming to defeat the Communists in the Cold War and to try to keep the European economy down. That's why nobody else in the world pollutes or contributes to any world wide CO2 / Toxin problems. Especially not the UK, China, France, Germany, or Russia.

This may be a silly question, but why exactly would you be expecting to see a protracted discussion of the global warming-related policies of China, France, Germany, Russia or the UK in a thread titled "US Governments' attitude towards global warming"?

Not that i'm implying any of us should have an opinion about the US Government, because that'd be stupid and wrong. I'm just wondering is all.

[karajorma]

Go read this: here.  Then come back and talk about it.. will be interesting.  Just keep it nice, will ya?  XD  Ya, riiiiiight...  Hmm... people are actually being civilized here.  /me likes.  But did anyone read the link?  XD 

I don't think anyone with half a brain is really claiming that we'd all drown or that Earth would turn into Waterworld so I really don't know who he thinks he's arguing with.

[Hellstryker]

No, but it could turn into venus given enough time x.x

[karajorma]

Possible but I doubt we could actually do that much damage before Earth successfully wiped us out and managed to restore the balance.

[Janos]

Basically.


Because, you know, the United States created Global Warming to defeat the Communists in the Cold War and to try to keep the European economy down. That's why nobody else in the world pollutes or contributes to any world wide CO2 / Toxin problems. Especially not the UK, China, France, Germany, or Russia.

But you have opinions, and ideas, and shivan jokes. So you already knew that.

You know what?

People were debating, and if you are not interested in this then stay out of the thread. We are not here to serve you and whatever your preferences were and we are most definitely not interested if you think all global warming threads suck dick. On one other forum what you are doing would be called thread****ting, and it is.

You come in here, obviously do not read the thread and then post a strawman or two. High quality posting indeed.

[Mefustae]

You know what?

People were debating, and if you are not interested in this then stay out of the thread. We are not here to serve you and whatever your preferences were and we are most definitely not interested if you think all global warming threads suck dick. On one other forum what you are doing would be called thread****ting, and it is.

You come in here, obviously do not read the thread and then post a strawman or two. High quality posting indeed.

I was just going to stick with the passive-aggressive route, but okay then. What he said!

[TrashMan]

Ohh, I thought you were talking about Kara and I debating idiots. My bad.

You saying anyone disagreeing with you or Kara is an idiot?

Pray tell me, what happens if you and Kara disagree on something? Which one is the idiot then?

[karajorma]

Read back a few pages.

[Hazaanko]

Alright, back to the discussion.

I think it's interesting you say I am a conspiracy theorist for saying pretty much the exact opposite you are.

While I understand what you're saying, the point I was trying to make in the difference between the two is that a conspiracy suggests that it is something they are trying to keep hidden.  I'm not saying there's anything wrong with you being a conspiracy theorist.  I'm saying that on the green side, there is no conspiracy, since they're not (for the most part) trying to keep their sources of money a secret.  Thus no conspiracy.

A LOT less than the big companies.

How many of those cases do they win? Who pays for the procedure? Do they sue for money or to force some action? If for money, check what that money is used for.

Nah, I don't know where you get this from, but there is no consistent increase on all solar planets. The temperature on Mars has risen somewhat, but is has actually fallen on some other planets. That said, given how little we know of those planets and their cycles, any increase/drop of temperature could very well be a part of their cycle, so any "evidence" derived from that is on shaky legs (to put it very mildly).

Big companies, however don't pour all of their money into global warming.  In fact, in every instance I've heard of so far, companies are putting more money into research on how to lower carbon emissions than they are into the actual research of global warming (by an extremely large amount, too).  On the other side, most environmentalist groups (especially the bigger ones) would be putting most or all of their funds into it (as would seem likely).  And again, its not just the green groups.  In fact, I would guess that only a very small percentage of the total funding comes from them.
----
I'm not sure about the environmentalist groups suing thing.  All I know is that they sue A LOT.  I'm going to go ahead and assume based off of the sheer amount of cases they make that they're not entirely unsuccessful in winning them.  You'd think if it wasn't working that they wouldn't do it as much.
----
You make a good point, but the key factor in the 'planet warming' phenomenon is that the planets and moons without an atmosphere are warming on a similar trend, strongly suggesting solar cause.  Still, like you said, it is "on shaky legs" considering there are more factors than just atmosphere which we don't fully understand.  But the general warming is, nonetheless, a hint towards solar activity.
----

Aaaaand back on the topic of the IPCC.  It seems some people missed the link that I so rudely posted a few pages back thereby resurrecting this thread.  Here it is again.  Pretty good evidence against defending it as a "international huge scientific organization" when only 52 of them that supported the consensus were actual scientists.  I'd go further in bashing the IPCC consensus, but hey - I'm lazy and its my birthday. 

http://epw.senate.gov/public/index.cfm?FuseAction=Minority.Blogs&ContentRecord_id=f80a6386-802a-23ad-40c8-3c63dc2d02cb

[TrashMan]

And all the 400 that singed the other document you mentioned were world-renowned, honorable, trustworthy scientists?

[Knight Templar]

Because, you know, the United States created Global Warming to defeat the Communists in the Cold War and to try to keep the European economy down. That's why nobody else in the world pollutes or contributes to any world wide CO2 / Toxin problems. Especially not the UK, China, France, Germany, or Russia.

This may be a silly question, but why exactly would you be expecting to see a protracted discussion of the global warming-related policies of China, France, Germany, Russia or the UK in a thread titled "US Governments' attitude towards global warming"?

Not that i'm implying any of us should have an opinion about the US Government, because that'd be stupid and wrong. I'm just wondering is all.

Oh don't get me wrong. I don't have any beef with your having opinions, no matter how misguided they are. That's your God-given, evolutionarily divined right. Especially if you're American. My real beef is with the general Eurotard level of intelligence around these parts. It's rather prevalent in the first page of the topic. I'm pretty sure Flip was the only one to have anything intelligent to say.

And to Janosman, grats on finding your balls buddy. I don't know what "thread****ting" is, but I'm glad to hear that you don't care that I don't care about what you have to say. I was beginning to think someone was going to let me openly not be interested in this topic in peace, which would have been a travesty.

[Janos]

And to Janosman, grats on finding your balls buddy. I don't know what "thread****ting" is, but I'm glad to hear that you don't care that I don't care about what you have to say. I was beginning to think someone was going to let me openly not be interested in this topic in peace, which would have been a travesty.

I don't care that you don't care, but you are a crappy poster who loudly announces his disinterest and comes into a thread to do it

maybe you could seek attention elsewhere

[Knight Templar]

And to Janosman, grats on finding your balls buddy. I don't know what "thread****ting" is, but I'm glad to hear that you don't care that I don't care about what you have to say. I was beginning to think someone was going to let me openly not be interested in this topic in peace, which would have been a travesty.

I don't care that you don't care, but you are a crappy poster who loudly announces his disinterest and comes into a thread to do it

maybe you could seek attention elsewhere

Crappy poster? Owch. You don't have to make it personal. You're starting to hurt my feelings. I honestly thought someone should know how ridiculous you guys are being. I guess that's what I get for trying to do a public service.

[Janos]

it is the most horrendous of all accusations

[IceFire]

Possible but I doubt we could actually do that much damage before Earth successfully wiped us out and managed to restore the balance.

Thats what I worry about.  The plane will survive us but will we survive the planet?  Or if we do what will society look like.

[jr2]

Why does that concern you?  If you are a natural process, your actions and their consequences are also natural.

[Mefustae]

Why does that concern you?  If you are a natural process, your actions and their consequences are also natural.

What's that supposed to mean?

[Mika]

I'm a little bit late about this, but Christmas is Christmas

As someone who has a foot in both academia and the oil industry, can I just call bull****, please?  You get idiots and geniuses in both camps, to be sure, but it is a helluvalot harder for the idiots to hide in academia.  You are expected to publish peer reviewed articles; lots of them.  If you don't, you will not get tenure.  If your science is shoddy, it will eventually get caught (re: Hwang Woo Suk, cold fusion, etc.)  In industry, there are usually few to no peer-reviewed papers.  Your work will NOT receive public scrutiny.  It frequently won't receive much scrutiny within the company itself.  It is EASY to hide the fact you are incompetent when there is no one in contact with you who could also do your job.

You of course can call it whatever you want. I have a foot in both camps also. The thing about working in the company is that if you screw up, it is not only your job, but many other peoples' jobs that are in the line of fire. In the University, it is pretty much your research and job only.

What you said is probably true for large sized companies where it is possible to hide yourself under the radar. In medium sized or small sized companies this is simply not possible. But I'm not so sure about the infallibility of the scientific method, if you check the Ig-Nobel winners and their topics... Wasn't it sometime ago when several scientists published a bull**** article in a peer-reviewed study? Also, I have heard some rumours about a bull****-article generator generated article that was actually accepted in a symposium or conference?

Mika