[jdjtcagle]

Here it goes, since the Capital Punishment thread I threatened to create a thread on doctrinal issues that I have with today's Christianity so here it is...

First off, I’m not here to hurt anyone’s feelings or take away from their experience with God. As I write this I put aside my biases and approach you guys as someone who just wants some answers. 

I haven’t always been a Christian and when I became one I sought to find the truth of the bible.  What I found in my studies brings me to some questions I have about mainstream Christianity that I do not agree with.  I can’t seem to find justification to why some Christians believe the way that they do and I’m most of the time looked upon as a hell driven prophet when I ask questions to find an honest answer.

There are a few (that I know of) free thinkers on this forum that are Christians as-well.

So in this spirit of finding truth let me continue.

Me and GOatmaster have been PM’ing each other about a particular scripture that I have challenged him on.  Although the actual discussion has not yet begun I found it appropriate to share this with everyone on the forum.  The scripture I challenged him on is Romans chapter 10.

He doesn't believe that baptism is essential for salvation and that this scripture is the basis for salvation.

8 But what does it say? “The word is near you, in your mouth and in your heart”(that is, the word of faith which we preach): 9 that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved. 10 For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. 11 For the Scripture says, “Whoever believes on Him will not be put to shame.” 12 For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek, for the same Lord over all is rich to all who call upon Him. 13 For “whoever calls on the name of the LORD shall be saved.”

This particular scripture is interpreted by mainstream Christianity to be the foundational scripture of salvation.  That salvation comes automatically if one mentally asserts that Jesus rose from the dead and verbally confesses that He is Lord. However, this interpretation contradicts the truth that saving faith includes appropriation and obedience.  That baptism and the experience known as the Holy Spirit is not important and I believe otherwise.

2 Timothy 2:15
15 Be diligent to present yourself approved to God, a worker who does not need to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

The New Testament consists of four divisions: (1) Gospels (Matthew, Mark, Luke, John), (2) Church History (Acts), (3) Epistles (Romans to Jude), and (4) Prophecy (Revelation). The Gospels are historical accounts of the life, teachings, ministry, death, resurrection, and ascension of Jesus Christ. None of them describes the establishing of a church; they describe the One who would establish the church upon His person, teaching, and work. The Book of Acts is a narrative history of the New Testament church, describing its beginning in Jerusalem and its spread to all Judea, Samaria, and the Gentile world. The Epistles are letters of instruction and admonition written to born-again believers to help them in Christian living. While the Epistles do contain references to the initial conversion experience, they assume the readers have already been born of water and the Spirit. The Book of Revelation is also addressed to established churches and believers, revealing God's plan for the future.
Acts is the only book in the Bible to contain historical accounts of people who received the new birth experience in the New Testament church, including all accounts of Christian water baptism and Spirit baptism. Because of the nature and purpose of the book, it contains most of the direct evidence relative to the question, "How can I be saved?" The Book of Acts is the pattern and norm for the New Testament church, not the exception. If Acts is not the norm, then the Bible gives no example of what the church should be like. The five accounts of the Spirit baptism in Acts are not exhaustive, but representative of the way in which God poured out His Spirit across the entire spectrum of humanity.

Hebrews 6:1 - basics of early Christian doctrines
1 Therefore, leaving the discussion of the elementary principles of Christ, let us go on to perfection, not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works and of faith toward God, 2 of the doctrine of baptisms, of laying on of hands, of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment. 3 And this we will do if God permits.

What did the apostles preach? What can we gather from the only New Testament examples of salvation?

The book of Acts.

Examples of Salvation...

37 Now when they heard this, they were cut to the heart, and said to Peter and the rest of the apostles, “Men and brethren, what shall we do?”
38 Then Peter said to them, “Repent, and let every one of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. 39 For the promise is to you and to your children, and to all who are afar off, as many as the Lord our God will call.” (Acts 2:37-38).

When the Jews heard the message of Peter in Acts chapter 2 they asked an important question… Men and brethren, what shall we do?
To answer such a question, Peter had authority based on Jesus’ word. That the New Testament Church would be built by what Peter was about to say in verse 38-39

Matthew 16:13-19
13 When Jesus came into the region of Caesarea Philippi, He asked His disciples, saying, “Who do men say that I, the Son of Man, am?”
14 So they said, “Some say John the Baptist, some Elijah, and others Jeremiah or one of the prophets.”
15 He said to them, “But who do you say that I am?”
16 Simon Peter answered and said, “You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.”
17 Jesus answered and said to him, “Blessed are you, Simon Bar-Jonah, for flesh and blood has not revealed this to you, but My Father who is in heaven. 18 And I also say to you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build My church, and the gates of Hades shall not prevail against it. 19 And I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven, and whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven.”

Acts 8

9 But there was a certain man called Simon, who previously practiced sorcery in the city and astonished the people of Samaria, claiming that he was someone great, 10 to whom they all gave heed, from the least to the greatest, saying, “This man is the great power of God.” 11 And they heeded him because he had astonished them with his sorceries for a long time. 12 But when they believed Philip as he preached the things concerning the kingdom of God and the name of Jesus Christ, both men and women were baptized. 13 Then Simon himself also believed; and when he was baptized he continued with Philip, and was amazed, seeing the miracles and signs which were done.   
14 Now when the apostles who were at Jerusalem heard that Samaria had received the word of God, they sent Peter and John to them, 15 who, when they had come down, prayed for them that they might receive the Holy Spirit. 16 For as yet He had fallen upon none of them. They had only been baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. 17 Then they laid hands on them, and they received the Holy Spirit.
18 And when Simon saw that through the laying on of the apostles’ hands the Holy Spirit was given, he offered them money, 19 saying, “Give me this power also, that anyone on whom I lay hands may receive the Holy Spirit.”
20 But Peter said to him, “Your money perish with you, because you thought that the gift of God could be purchased with money! 21 You have neither part nor portion in this matter, for your heart is not right in the sight of God. 22 Repent therefore of this your wickedness, and pray God if perhaps the thought of your heart may be forgiven you. 23 For I see that you are poisoned by bitterness and bound by iniquity.”
24 Then Simon answered and said, “Pray to the Lord for me, that none of the things which you have spoken may come upon me.”
25 So when they had testified and preached the word of the Lord, they returned to Jerusalem, preaching the gospel in many villages of the Samaritans.

The experience of the Samaritans demonstrates that one can believe to a certain extent and even be baptized in water and yet not receive the Spirit. There is no salvation without the Spirit (Romans 8:9), the Samaritans needed the baptism of the Spirit to complete their salvation, as the case of Simon the Magician exemplifies.

Paul's conversion...

God arrested Saul of Tarsus (Paul) by a light from heaven, but we find no indication that Paul was saved at this moment. Rather, the Lord told him, "Arise, and go into the city, and it shall be told thee what thou must do" (Acts 9:6). God sent Paul to Ananias in order for Paul to receive his sight and "be filled with the Holy Ghost" (Acts 9:17). When Ananias laid hands on Paul and prayed for him, Paul immediately received his sight, arose, and was baptized (Acts 9:18).

Acts 11:1-18

 1 Now the apostles and brethren who were in Judea heard that the Gentiles had also received the word of God. 2 And when Peter came up to Jerusalem, those of the circumcision contended with him, 3 saying, “You went in to uncircumcised men and ate with them!”
4 But Peter explained it to them in order from the beginning, saying: 5 “I was in the city of Joppa praying; and in a trance I saw a vision, an object descending like a great sheet, let down from heaven by four corners; and it came to me. 6 When I observed it intently and considered, I saw four-footed animals of the earth, wild beasts, creeping things, and birds of the air. 7 And I heard a voice saying to me, ‘Rise, Peter; kill and eat.’ 8 But I said, ‘Not so, Lord! For nothing common or unclean has at any time entered my mouth.’ 9 But the voice answered me again from heaven, ‘What God has cleansed you must not call common.’ 10 Now this was done three times, and all were drawn up again into heaven. 11 At that very moment, three men stood before the house where I was, having been sent to me from Caesarea. 12 Then the Spirit told me to go with them, doubting nothing. Moreover these six brethren accompanied me, and we entered the man’s house. 13 And he told us how he had seen an angel standing in his house, who said to him, ‘Send men to Joppa, and call for Simon whose surname is Peter, 14 who will tell you words by which you and all your household will be saved.’ 15 And as I began to speak, the Holy Spirit fell upon them, as upon us at the beginning. 16 Then I remembered the word of the Lord, how He said, ‘John indeed baptized with water, but you shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit.’ 17 If therefore God gave them the same gift as He gave us when we believed on the Lord Jesus Christ, who was I that I could withstand God?”
18 When they heard these things they became silent; and they glorified God, saying, “Then God has also granted to the Gentiles repentance to life.”

Cornelius was devout, feared God, gave much alms, prayed to God often, and even had an angelic visitation. Despite all of these qualities and honorable activities, he was not saved. The angel told him to send for Peter, "who shall tell thee words, whereby thou and all thy house shall be saved" (Acts 11:14). Probably he had repented but had not received the Holy Spirit and so was not saved.

He was not a Jew, either by birth or conversion, but a Gentile. Upon God's direct command, Peter went to Caesarea and preached to Cornelius, his kinsmen, and his friends. While Peter was preaching, his Gentile listeners all received the Holy Ghost and began to speak in tongues (Acts 10:44-46). Peter identified this sign as the baptism of the Spirit - the same gift that the Jews received on the Day of Pentecost (Acts 11:15-17). This is a very significant account, because it marks the first time that Gentiles were baptized with the Spirit.

The last experience of salvation described in detail is Paul at Ephesus.
When Paul met about twelve disciples of John the Baptist in the city of Ephesus, he asked, "Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed?" (Acts 19:2). They answered, "We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost" (Acts 19:2).

Possibly these disciples had never heard John preach about the Spirit baptism, or more likely, they did not know the time had actually come to receive the promised experience. They were probably saying, "We have not heard whether the Holy Ghost is given yet," (See John 7:39, which literally says "The Holy Ghost was not yet" but which the KJV translates as "The Holy Ghost was not yet given.") At any rate, Paul next asked these men, "Then what baptism did you receive?" (Acts 19:3, NIV).

When he found that they had received only John's baptism, he rebaptized them in the name of Jesus. Then he prayed for them and laid hands on them, upon which they received the Holy Ghost, spoke in tongues, and prophesied (Acts 19:6).

It is enlightening to see Paul's approach to these "believers." He was not content until he asked two very important questions: (1) Have you received the Holy Ghost? and (2) How were you baptized? He taught them and worked with them until they were baptized in the name of Jesus and received the Holy Ghost with the sign of tongues.

Acts 16:30:25-3

" 25 But at midnight Paul and Silas were praying and singing hymns to God, and the prisoners were listening to them. 26 Suddenly there was a great earthquake, so that the foundations of the prison were shaken; and immediately all the doors were opened and everyone’s chains were loosed. 27 And the keeper of the prison, awaking from sleep and seeing the prison doors open, supposing the prisoners had fled, drew his sword and was about to kill himself. 28 But Paul called with a loud voice, saying, “Do yourself no harm, for we are all here.”
29 Then he called for a light, ran in, and fell down trembling before Paul and Silas. 30 And he brought them out and said, “Sirs, what must I do to be saved?”
31 So they said, “Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will be saved, you and your household.” 32 Then they spoke the word of the Lord to him and to all who were in his house. 33 And he took them the same hour of the night and washed their stripes. And immediately he and all his family were baptized. 34 Now when he had brought them into his house, he set food before them; and he rejoiced, having believed in God with all his household." .
Here the prisoner asks Paul directly what he must do to be saved.  Paul responded saying to believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you ‘will’ (not ‘are’) saved. Then after being baptized they rejoiced for believing in God with all his household. 

Here the prisoner asks Paul directly what he must do to be saved.  Paul responded saying to believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you ‘will’ (not ‘are’) saved. Then after being baptized they rejoiced for believing in God with all his household. 

Titus 3:5
 5 not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to His mercy He saved us, through the washing of regeneration and renewing of the Holy Spirit,

"He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved" (Mark 16:16).

Please do not troll - This is not a topic talking about the validity of God or the bible - but mainly the teachings thereof.

I have attempted, in a very long post to describe the experience of the New Testament church and to show that it doesn't just take faith (a mental assertion), but obedience to the biblical teaching of salvation.  Water baptism and the infilling of the Holy Spirit.  Please forgive the length but I have barely laid down the basis of scriptural evidence on this.

So I guess my questions are... GOatmaster... whoever
What about the book of Acts?  What do these scriptures mean to you?  Doesn't the bible teach that baptism in Jesus name is essential? What about the Holy Spirit? 

Please provide scriptures

[Kosh]

Unfortunately, the bible is a collection of stories that was compiled by a committee who edited them to suit their interests/beliefs. There are bound to be contradictions.

[Nuke]

666 everybody needs to go to hell. 667 too bad its a social-political construct.
668 nobody gets a get out of jail free card!

-the gospel according to nuke, the great blasphemer

[jdjtcagle]

@ Kosh, I'm not at par with a contradiction at all...  It's not a contradiction - misinterpretation yes - but not a contradiction.

When Romans 10:13 says, "Whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved," it means more than merely an oral invocation of the name Jesus. Otherwise, faith itself would not be necessary. Saving faith is more than oral confession of Christ, for that act alone is not enough. Obviously Romans 10:13 describes the sincere heart's cry of someone who believes on Jesus. Oral confession is a step in that direction, but living faith and obedience are required to validate this confession.

21 “Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ 23 And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’

The main point of Romans 10:13 is not to give a formula for salvation but to teach that salvation is for all. The emphasis is on whosoever. Paul quoted this verse to support his statement that "there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him" (Romans 10:12). The quotation originally appears in Joel 2:32, which follows Joel's prophecy concerning the latter-day outpouring of the Spirit upon all flesh (Joel 2:28-29) and the latter-day judgment of God (verses 30-31). Joel 2:32 explains that all who call upon YHWH will be delivered from this judgment.

Peter applied this prophecy to the outpouring of the Spirit at Pentecost (Acts 2:21). Furthermore, Ananias commanded Paul (the writer of Romans) to call on the name of the Lord at water baptism (Acts 22:16). 

No contradiction but again this is not a discussion on whether or not the bible is true so lets not stray

[Kosh]

Kosh, I'm not at par with a contradiction at all...  It's not a contradiction - misinterpretation yes - but not a contradiction.

Maybe that isn't a condradiction, but that doesn't mean the bible doesn't have them.

[Mustang19]

You may have more luck in a legitimate religious forum, jdj... Hard Light is not the best place for discussions on scripture when even threads vaguely related to religion somehow end up completely occupied with the athiesm/theism debate.

[perihelion]

jdjtcagle, Acts 2:38 is my standard reply to Christians that suggest that baptism is optional.  You already quoted it, but I figured I'd throw my .02$ in.  I see no way to read that verse and interpret it any way other than baptism being a requirement.  If you go into the actual Greek, it is even more emphatic.  "Repent and be baptized, every one of you, for the remission of sins."  The "for" in that sentence, from the Greek is more along the lines "for the purpose of obtaining."  So, without both the "repent" and the "be baptized" bit, the "remission of sins" bit wouldn't happen.

I'm neither a Greek nor Biblical scholar, but I have seen this verse dissected in gruesome detail in both English and Greek multiple times.  There are other examples in the Bible of baptism being required, but none are quite as unequivocal as Acts 2:38.

[jdjtcagle]

Correct perihelion the greek word "for" is "eis".

The grammar actually requires that Peter is saying be baptized "for" the remission of sins. The use of the preposition "eis" demands this meaning. Concerning this specific verse, BAGD, the most authoritative Greek lexicon in English says, "to denote purpose / in order to, to . . . for forgiveness of sins, so that sins might be forgiven Mt 26:28; cf. Mk 1:4; Lk 3:3; Ac 2:38."

There are many scriptures that prove baptism is pivotal in the salvation proccess...

1 Peter 3:21
21 There is also an antitype which now saves us—baptism (not the removal of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God), through the resurrection of Jesus Christ,

In context to this epistle Peter describes Old Testament shadows of the New Covenant.
In this scripture he describes that baptism is not a "ceremonial" bath, but an answer to good conscience toward God.

[Rictor]

Where's Liberator when you need him.

[jdjtcagle]

I'm sorry to bump but I would like to give GOatmaster time to post, I'm sure he's busy and has limited time and to be fair I gave a really long post.

[WeatherOp]

You may have more luck in a legitimate religious forum, jdj... Hard Light is not the best place for discussions on scripture when even threads vaguely related to religion somehow end up completely occupied with the athiesm/theism debate.

Are you suggesting HLP is even a good place for normal discussion? 

[captain-custard]

the scriptures have no relevance within modern faith they are no more than "spin "doctors at work, this work of collaborative fiction has been twisted and turned , edited and reedited to suit the ruling class of the day...........

if you believe in a higher entity great , believe with your heart do not seek proof in an adulterated text..........



ooops the return of the random.......

[jdjtcagle]

You may have more luck in a legitimate religious forum, jdj... Hard Light is not the best place for discussions on scripture when even threads vaguely related to religion somehow end up completely occupied with the athiesm/theism debate.

Are you suggesting HLP is even a good place for normal discussion? 

You don't think I've tried "legitimate" forums?  They aren't real friendly and never really give me a straight answer, honestly I've given up people.  Realized that many people just follow religion because it's tradition.  Like I said, I respect Christians like GOatmaster that has studied the scriptures and seems to have a rational position on God and the bible.

@andicirk - This is not the discussion unfortunately, I can respect you have a view on the validity of the scripture but I'll will wait until a answer on the subject at hand.  Unless, that is the only reason that seems to come up when explaining the view of salvation - then we can take a step in that direction.

[Nuclear1]

Honestly, the whole act of baptism is one of the greatest issues in Christianity today. The whole concept of salvation through Christ is the lack of acts on the part of the believer--not by works, as one of the epistles says. The believer isn't  asked to go sacrifice animals at the local church, make yearly pilgrimages, or perform any ceremonies. Baptism, confirmation, and all other rituals currently in mainstream Christianity are all for memorial or traditional sake.

Christ asks for believers to "do this in remembrance of me." He doesn't order them to do it or risk losing salvation. Throughout his whole life Christ was opposed to set traditions demanding when and where believers should worship. As long as two or three people were gathered in worship, then he was going to be there.

Honestly, the act of having water poured on your head means nothing more than honoring tradition. Probably the best proof baptism isn't necessary is the thief on the cross next to Christ. He was never baptized, but was still promised salvation for accepting Christ on the cross as his savior. If he could be promised salvation without any acts other than profession and acknowledgment of faith, then what's to say any other believer should have to do any more?

The whole idea of baptism and confirmation IMO was born when the church was young and facing prosecution. The rites were more than likely a way for the Christian community to know who was genuinely with them and who was an agent of the Roman government. Nowhere in the Gospels does Christ mention baptizing with water; that's purely from Acts and beyond. In fact, John said Christ would baptize with fire, not with water.

Just my opinion.

[Mustang19]

You don't think I've tried "legitimate" forums?  They aren't real friendly and never really give me a straight answer, honestly I've given up people.  Realized that many people just follow religion because it's tradition.  Like I said, I respect Christians like GOatmaster that has studied the scriptures and seems to have a rational position on God and the bible.

Hm, I guess so. As diverse as the Internet is supposed to be, all of the debates tend to turn out the same way...

Just my opinion.

That's actually a pretty common opinion. Remember that the "Christianity" we know today was not created by Christ. There are hundreds of conflicting accounts of Jesus' life, stories about his brothers and sisters and his early childhood. In general, his behavior somewhat less saintly if these alternate accounts are given credence (eg breaking one of his sibling's legs once), even though he is credited with performing miracles in virtually all of them.

Roman christianity (Catholicism) was created by the Nicean Council a few hundred years after Christ's death; some believe that the Romans converted to paganism to attract Greek recruits to defend against the barbarians. The Council took all of the conflicting accounts out of the picture and ended up with an idealist version, the divinely concieved, holy, miracle-performing Jesus we all know today.

Here's a little Geocities site that I found after a few seconds of searching. Look up "Nicean Council" if you want more, although you're probably already familiar with that. Scroll down to near the end and it starts talking about the various Jesus stories.

http://www.geocities.com/metacrock2000/Jesus_pages/versions.htm

[TrashMan]

That's actually a pretty common opinion. Remember that the "Christianity" we know today was not created by Christ. There are hundreds of conflicting accounts of Jesus' life, stories about his brothers and sisters and his early childhood. In general, his behavior somewhat less saintly if these alternate accounts are given credence (eg breaking one of his sibling's legs once), even though he is credited with performing miracles in virtually all of them.

The only questions is - "what do you believe?"

Give me any subject, any subject at all, I can find you texts, books and quotes and oppinions that conflict totally about anything.
Some way to filter out has to be employed if one wants to find the truth.

No different then than it was now. You can question the methods or the ones doing the filtering, but the fact remains that there is no other way to do it. You'll always be able to suspect and question things - people write a lot of lies.
Global warming? Keneddy asasination? Moon landing? Paris Hilton? You can have thousands of the worlds greatest scientists and expert unite and agree on a single version of what happened/is happening - but you'll still have all those books/quotes of others that will always nibble at it and refuse to acknowledge the truth.

So having some texts that say something else or don't match the bible's texts means nothing really.

[Mustang19]

The point is, the generally accepted version of Christ's life is only one of several versions, and the Catholic church came up with several rituals, such as baptism, that Christ never endorsed (or God for that matter, but he doesn't seem to talk to us much anymore).

[TrashMan]

F'course there are multiple versions.. There are multiple verisons of everything. But only one is the truth.

[jdjtcagle]

Alright guys I have no time to give a good solid post.  I may or may not be back later today but I just want to clear up some points
@ nuclear1 - I will respond to your post later.

Roman christianity (Catholicism) was created by the Nicean Council a few hundred years after Christ's death; some believe that the Romans converted to paganism to attract Greek recruits to defend against the barbarians. The Council took all of the conflicting accounts out of the picture and ended up with an idealist version, the divinely concieved, holy, miracle-performing Jesus we all know today.

Your correct that the Nicean Council did create modern catholicism and did introduce many ceremonies although you are not correct that they invented baptism.  They did change the formula of baptism, from "in Jesus name" to "in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit" with the invention of the Trinity (or at least a primitive form of it).  Which historical records validate this as-well.  Also there are some scriptures that are in question because they do not match up with some of the earliest text. That are thought to be changed by the Catholic church because of the new "Trinity" and they are... Mathew 28:19 and 1 John 5:7.  These scriptures pose no threat to me and I don't mind them in there, so whether they are supposed to be there or not, the truth of the bible is upheld. 

Historians and biblical encyclopedias all agree that it was the name of Jesus that was invoked in baptism for the first 100 years of the newly founded Church.  Some (such as Eusibius of Caesarea) contend that Matthew 28:19 originally did not contain the triune formula at all, but rather stated, "Go ye and make disciples of all the nations in my name."  While all extant manuscripts contain the triune formula, many early church records seem to indicate that the text was changed within the first 100 years to reflect the emerging doctrine of the Trinity. 

What came to be accepted as the canon of Scripture was not really an announcement by church councils either. What had been officially accepted as the contents of the New Testament canon was not much of a development over what the church had held on an unofficial level for centuries. There were a few books that had been disputed as to whether or not they were truly the inspired word of God, most of the books in the present canon had been accepted by the church at large by the end of the first-century. In fact, it took so long for any formal canon to develop because the church saw little need for such a pronouncement because there was such widespread agreement on the issue.

Several factors led the church towards making an official NT canon of Scripture. First, was the persecution by Emperor Decius, who killed Christians that would not turn their sacred writings over to the authorities to be burned. At such a point it becomes very important to determine once and for all which books you are willing to die for and which you are not!

Secondly, heretics arose, such as Marcion, who denied the inspiration of many books contained in the traditionally accepted, yet informal canon. The church reacted because the church had a long-time unofficial acceptance of the authority of those books. When one challenged this general acceptance the church saw the need to officially decide and set forth which books contained God's words and which ones were merely man's words. The very fact that the church reacted to Marcion demonstrates the traditional and widespread acceptance of the books in today's canon. The church reacted so violently to Marcion because he was rejecting the books they had traditionally believed to be God's inspired words. This demonstrates the existence of a very early, informal cannon, not an arbitrary decision made hundreds of years after the writings to which many would have found objectionable.

The point is, the generally accepted version of Christ's life is only one of several versions, and the Catholic church came up with several rituals, such as baptism, that Christ never endorsed (or God for that matter, but he doesn't seem to talk to us much anymore).

I already covered the first part of this but in response to Christ never endorsed it let me explain.  A claim that says that Christ didn't, shows a lack of understanding of what baptism is.

Christ commanded baptism.

Matthew 28:19 Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit

 

Now this is Jesus telling us to go out and baptize all nations.  I already showed that the last part probably used to read "in Jesus name" like the other gospels but you get the picture.

Luke 24:47 and that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in His name  to all nations, beginning at Jerusalem. 48 And you are witnesses of these things. 49 Behold, I send the Promise of My Father upon you; but tarry in the city of Jerusalem until you are endued with power from on high.

Repentance and remission of sins is the same exact thing that peter preached to the Jews, by saying Repent and be baptized for the remission of sins.  Most believe that Luke is also the writer of Acts because the beginnings suggest that Luke is doing a part 1 and part 2 to the person he is writing to.

Mark 16:15 Go into all the world and preach the gospel to every creature. 16 He who believes and is baptized will be saved; but he who does not believe will be condemned. 17 And these signs will follow those who believe: In My name they will cast out demons; they will speak with new tongues

Paul taught that baptism was a burial with Christ (Romans 6:3-4; Colossians 2:12). The old man is buried at baptism. The old man is the unregenerate lifestyle, the record of past sins, and the dominion of sin. After baptism, we never have to face the record of our past sins again.

Baptism into Christ

Paul also taught that we are baptized into Christ: "For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ" (Galatians 3:27). We understand this to mean the one baptism of water and Spirit that places us into the body of Christ. Water baptism is necessary to identify us with Christ and to place us in His spiritual family.

Spiritual Circumcision

Paul compared baptism to circumcision in the Old Testament: "In whom (Christ) also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ: Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead. And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses" (Colossians 2:11-13).

This verse refers to water and Spirit baptism, which includes both burial of the old man and the resurrection of the new man in Christ. Water baptism is a spiritual circumcision that separates from sins, cuts away the control of the sinful nature, and results in forgiveness of sins. The Spirit baptism completes the circumcision process by imparting new spiritual life.

Old Testament circumcision was the means by which a male Jew became part of the Jewish religion and heir to God's promises to Abraham. God told Abraham, "This is my covenant, which ye shall keep, between me and you arid thy seed after thee; Every man child among you shall be circumcised… And the uncircumcised man child… shall be cut off from his people; he hath broken my covenant" (Genesis 17:10,14). Circumcision alone was valueless without a corresponding faith in God and obedience to His Word (Romans 2:25; 4:12). But God demanded that the Jews practice literal circumcision (Exodus 4:24-26; Joshua 5:2-9). An uncircumcised man could not participate in the Passover supper (Exodus 12:43-44). Likewise, at Christian baptism God cuts away a person old sins and joins him to God's people. Without circumcision an Israelite male was not part of God's people; he was subject to the penalty of death and could not participate in God's salvation plan.