[Flaser]

Leave all the other threads alone.

This is your playground for all of the liberals, democrats, labour party members, righters, lefters, socialists, conservatives, communists, yuppies, greens....ect.

(NAZIS or any of their kind are NOT WELCOME though)

HotSnoJ, an0n, FLipside and everyone else I forgot or was tired to look up - you can go on about America here.

This is also the place where I'll give my response:

How can you people be so goddamn shorsighted! Politics is about one thing: POWER.
Everything else is para-duma, coverup or a nice wrapping for realities.

It's about the power you have over your own life, or the power of the wealthy or the power of corporation, the power of oil - of possesing it or controlling it. (Herbert is/was a genius - it's not the one who uses a thing who controls it - it's the one who can destroy it).

Bush and the rest of the parties struggle for power - to do so in democracy they need to make the people vote for them. No matter whatever it takes...

The fact that this was supposed to happen by doing what you want favorable is not guaranteed. Who the devil ever told you  that the guy you elected stands for your ideals? Did anyone during any election speek of his philosopy about life?

Did it occur that you were actually voting for a party - in somecases just to ensure the other one won't make it?

Did it happen to cross your mind, that regardless the presense of weapons in Iraq Hussein's demise would inevitably strenghen the ones who got there first hand? - that the EU needs the oil just as bad.... - that any party will try to smite their own advantage out of the situation by throwing **** on their opposition?

Regardless the truth....regardless the morality.

It's POWER we speak of people, not you daily beer - and the loosers in this match don't always make it to the changing room...

I'm a born communist whose realised the impossibility of the ideal's life and therefore srtives with all his life for a democratic socialist system that would grant all of us: FREEDOM, EQUALITY and LOVE - in the original sense as Jensus meant it. Void of Religios content, a pure acceptance of another's existence.

My problem is that the our so called "democratic" systems are not really about those 3 things.

Not go throw the stones at me....but just think for minute.

...
..
.
What the hell is going on here? Everywhere?

[Ghostavo]

In other words, borg rule?

[Flaser]

...your miserable world if you're a diehard ST fan.

Otherwise - it's the system you're born into and don't even consider realising (actuall all us are in a Matrix - except even the janitors are part of it in our case). If you try to break out - the blaksuits will come for you, unless you're already one of them.

[Bobboau]

/*thinks for minute...*/

/*throws the stones at Flaser*/

[Flaser]

Wish I were that sinless...

[jdjtcagle]

The government rules everything and the WORLD sucks ass,  MONEY, POLOTICS, and MORE MONEY. You can basically feel the EVIL in just the name politics.  
I hate the world and most of all Politics A.K.A the rich people you sit on there ass and talk about the next scheme they are going to do to convice the people to like them.

[Flaser]

The irony of the situation is that while during the true Imperialistic era (17-19 century) the aristocracy (modern or feudal) managed to keep its separation from the plebs, right now the devolutionary tactics of mass control take their toll on them just as well if not even more intensly since they're more exposed to it.

[SadisticSid]

Communism doesn't has never worked, it doesn't work now and it will NEVER work. Human civilization is built on the back of ambition, rewarding successful ambition - i.e. enterprise - and as a result, a desire to become better than we are. Giving people absolute equality is essentially a free ticket to be bone idle all their lives and expect to survive. What a disgusting (and thankfully, an impossible) concept communism is.

[Flaser]

I perfectly agree with the first part of your statement - it's UNLIVEABLE.

Still I'm a born and raised leftern/socialist person.

As for the later part - that's not how it should be. The CCCP/SSSR had nothing to do with what real communism was meant to be.

During history only 1 country ever had a communism true to its spirit: Israel during the kibutz era - but it failed as well.

The thing can work for a couple of people - but you can't run a country like that - well not until there's no work to be done. The problem is that it seems like good and honest work is alien to the natural way people live - unless you actually grade people by it.

Well that's not the best way to put it - since people do like to do things on their own - even work. Take this community for example. But when its an obligation without any whatsoever honor in it people will immediately get lazzy and slack. Unfortunatelly many people still posess that mentality here.

[Bobboau]

[Flaser]

O..O
.\_/

[Drew]

this is a stupid idea. almost as stupid as the person who started it.

[Flaser]

Welll...it is stuupid to begin with....but YEES., go on barfing at Bush or Europeans in the thread about Rampage or whatever you want....

...Or keep all of our politising(ly problematic) members in once place when they went the steam and keep the rest of the place clean.

[Lynx]

And once again, evil leftist worldviews reel their ugly heads into the Hard Light public forums. Protect the children!

[Drew]

Originally posted by Flaser
...Or keep all of our politising(ly problematic) members in once place when they went the steam and keep the rest of the place clean.

but thats censorship. Im american i can voice my opinions wherver and whenver i want

[Flaser]

Excuse me, but what the  f*** will that comment achieve?
I always accept constructive criticism or a civil opinion like SadisticSid posted his own.

I created this thread to clean the rest of the threads. You can use it for whatever flaming you want to, but that wasn't the initial intention.

Read the title: POLITICS.

Discuss here.

My own first post was a general slap for everyone - stop speaking or morality issues or the philosophy of the thing. No that's a f0bared way to put it - don't confuse the two.

Politics is about people and their powerbase - their actions and their interaction with events.

Don't bring morality into the picture - it can obscure it more often than not, and won't give a better understanding of the situation.

This is my personal opinion and shouldn't stop anyone from analysing the actual morality of any event, it's only my preference to separate it from a purely political analysis.

"EDIT"

That went for Lynx.

Drew - not necessarily. No one is going to force you to post in this thread.

However...this is a society - and you're free to do whatever you want - as long as you don't limit anyone else in their freedom.

So if you start debating politics in whatever thread you happen to come across regardless the topic - it may not fit with everyone else or it could ruin the thread people  had about an entierly different subject.

I'm not going to force you to anythign - I merly ask you to debate politics here, a thead that's devoted to the subject.

Hell, a whole sub-forum could be devoted to the subject since one or two thread always pop up in the Hard Light section every few weeks.

If I want to be categoric than this thread should be:

What was started in the Rampage - No Longer With Us thread.

PS.: Please, don't give me this: "I'm an American" sing-song.
I could go on a rant - I'm Hungarian, part of 1000 year old nation, we stopped the Turks hence saved Europe. Even during 986 all of Europe feared or arrows! ...but I don't. It's not something that makes you any more of the person who you really are. You can be proud of you ancestors, the way your nation/country is but that won't change who you're at all or what you have a right to do. BTW Every sane society works by the principle I quoted above.

"EDIT"

[Drew]

anway, in blatant defiance to your thread

http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php/topic,22277.0.html

[Rictor]

Once we get into politics, you quickly get into history, sociology, theology, psychology and philosophy. And I for one don't think we can to justice to the entire subject of humanities in a single thread,

I also like you you think that anyone with an interest in politics likes it as a hobby or someting. Therefore its appropriate to make a thread for all the "politics fanboys". This is not like making an anime thread or a basketball thread, its a bit more than that. Politics touches on almost every facet of human life.

In conclusion, it would be pointless and stupid to limit discussion of such a broad and important topic to a single thread. I much prefer the way we've been doing it until now, that is discussing politics and anything else we damn well please wherever it is apporpriate. You can only learn and grow (damn that sounds stupid) from inteligent debate, and though I admit that we are not perfect, we're far more civilized than most other message boards when in comes to so controversial a matter.

[Flaser]

You're fighting dirty and ignore rethorics.

You've taken an icident out of context - and what the hell does Europe have to do with us the HLP?

I never spoke of use Europens/Hungarians vs. You/Americans? Where did that mentality come from?

BTW

"The European Ombudsman has already come to his defence, issuing a harsh criticism of OLAF's campaign to silence him.

Mr Tillack, who describes himself as a "pro-European federalist", has been OLAF's most vocal critic, accusing it of covering up abuses within the EU system."

- that's from the text you linked to.

[Drew]

Originally posted by Flaser
I never spoke of use Europens/Hungerians vs. You/Americans? Where did that mentality come from?

gezz dont you get it? you want to confine political discussion to one thread, and i just made another thread outside it.

Rictors got it right. admins please lock this.