[Stunaep]

Originally posted by Nico


3) Well, even if you say so, the Euro is a good thing, the strongest currency nowadays, btw. I just don't get people who are against it.

The only problem is, that even though the Estonian economy is growing faster than the EU average, the hit that a currency reform will take on prices (averaging the sums, the capitalist way, etc.) will take a major toll on the living quality, which is already borderling horrible, especially since the prices will go up anyway, now that we've joined the EU, we just can't afford MORE price rises in 5 years. Believe me, we know, we just went through a currency reform 13 years ago.

The general consensus here is that EU objectives should be adapted to the country and the times. If we were to follow the directives to the letter, France economical situation would only get worse. The EU deal works fine for an economicaly sane country. Which is not the case right now for about all the members of the Union.
All that to say that you can't expect things to get brighter right away, you can't expect, maybe, any good outcome out of this for the time being. It's a long due process that will probably disgust most people, but I do believe it's going the right way, we just have to be patient.

My sentiments exactly, only thing is, that our goverments don't have the balls to adapt the EU normatives. That's the problem with being a small nation, you get used to being pushed around.

PS: UE? Union Éuropean? I should probably hone my french skills.

[Nico]

Originally posted by SadisticSid
Actually France benefits a lot from the EU's common agricultural policy and its subsidies

You're crazy. All your argumentation is shot down by the simple fact that this statement is so very wrong it becomes funny. Ask José Bové about it. If you don't know him, lucky you, tho.
Just as an exemple, EU policy on, say, cheese, is completly killing the exportation business because of lots of stupid limits and requirements. Cattle raisers in France are completly crushed by their eastern colleagues. Crop producers have to face cheaper producers from, again, eastern countries, which are favorized by the UE policies and which comepltly holds France down on that matter. etc etc.

[Jiggyhound]

just one step closer to a unified world goverment if you ask me

think about it. The east will someday form their own superpower too. Then we got problems. And if Russia ever pulls its finger out...

maybe its a new trend in world politics

[Nico]

Originally posted by Stunaep

PS: UE? Union Éuropean? I should probably hone my french skills.

Yeah, Union Européenne. Sorry, didn't pay attention.

[Stunaep]

Originally posted by Nico


You're crazy. All your argumentation is shot down by the simple fact that this statement is so very wrong it becomes funny. Ask José Bové about it. If you don't know him, lucky you, tho.
Just as an exemple, EU policy on, say, cheese, is completly killing the exportation business because of lots of stupid limits and requirements. Cattle raisers in France are completly crushed by their eastern colleagues. Crop producers have to face cheaper producers from, again, eastern countries, which are favorized by the UE policies and which comepltly holds France down on that matter. etc etc.

Yeah, and we get our sugar exportation handed to us on our collective asses. But you gain new markets where to export your goods to, privileged, in comparison to Asian markets, as do we. You may lose now, but in the long run, Europe is the winner.

And Russia loses. Which is good in any way.

[Nico]

New markets? Not quite, let's take Poland, we were already the first foreign contractors there, before even the States. It doesn't change anything to us.
And I don't share your hatred for Russia, I'm kindda saddened by the rampent poverty those people suffer from.

[an0n]

EU != Good for Britain.

It's only good for nations with no political, economic or diplomatic power. It's for ****ty little nations who want to feel important.

If Britain or France or Germany wanted to, they could withdraw from the EU and dictate terms of trade to them, but no, we've all got to pretend we aren't all looking out for our own interests. We've got to play nice and circle-jerk each other because the false happiness detracts attention from the ****ty state of affairs just about every country in the world is in.

[vyper]

I love you an0n.

In a male bonding way.

[an0n]

*coughs gruffly and shakes vyper's hand without looking him in the eye*

Yeah, thanks.

*quickly makes his way out the thread to get some manly beer, play some manly sports and have sex with some manly hookers*

[Stunaep]

Originally posted by Nico
New markets? Not quite, let's take Poland, we were already the first foreign contractors there, before even the States. It doesn't change anything to us.
And I don't share your hatred for Russia, I'm kindda saddened by the rampent poverty those people suffer from.

However, let's take us for example, or the baltic states in general. 80% of the imported electronics have come from Asia, the construction efforts are from either russia or local, etc. Just be there and take it up. Build a citroen factory in estona. or something.

It's only good for nations with no political, economic or diplomatic power. It's for ****ty little nations who want to feel important.

It's not that we want to feel important, it's just we want to live reasonably well, and not be annexed every thirty years or so.

Of course, then there's britain.

[an0n]

Britain has abso-friggin-loutely no need to be allying itself with anyone for any reason.

There's no chance of use every being invaded because of the fierce nationalism, we'd make the Iraqi 'rebels' looks like little kids throwing a tantrum. We're geographically secure (no border runners and such). And if need be we can totally insulate ourselves from the rest of the world. The only problem being Ireland, but no-one gives a **** about Ireland.

Seriously, has anyone ever heard of Ireland actually doing ANYTHING? I've not heard a peep about their diplomacy or economy......ever.

[vyper]

[q]Of course, then there's britain.[/q]

Yeah we started off wanting to get some cheap booze on holiday and what happens? We end up worryin about Poland's neighbours again...

[Flipside]

I must admit to some trepedation about all this, but only because in the UK we have been dosed on horror stories of planes and boats crammed with immigrants heading for our shores. It does appear to be true that emergency measures have been put in place by the government, so I do have some concerns.

However, regardless of that, it is actually good to see Europe gaining the partners, and that growth is inevitable, regardless of my own personal feelings. So I will wait and see on this, being a free press in the UK seems to give you license to use terrorism to sell papers.

[Stunaep]

well, why not be generous for a change? Except of course, because the EU screws you over a dozen times or so, but shouldn't we all get along or something?

You could always migrate to Estonia. Because now you can. We own now officialy the cheapest booze in the EU.

[vyper]

[q]We own now officialy the cheapest booze in the EU[/q]

Whats your border control like?

[Bobboau]

as I understand it, there are no borders between EU nations (slight exaggeration)

[vyper]

Sorry Bob, there are.

[Stunaep]

Yeah, there is border control if you want to go out of estonia, or if you want to go anywhere in the EU and are estonian.

However, if you're a brit and wish to come here.... nothing whatsover.

Also you can buy an unlimited amount of alcohol.

To give you an idea of our cheapness, the average price of a bottle of beer (and good one, mind ya): about £0.30.

That's right. Thirty pence. 1/2 litres a bottle.

[vyper]

So now I know where I'm going on holiday this year, continue the political discussion....

[vyper]

Eyy Stu I just saw Estonia on the news.... ye all look very happy about it.