[pyro-manic]

If Blair kowtows again I'm going to personally kick him in the bollocks...

EDIT: And UT, all he has to do is to scream "traitors!!!!111one" and bash the flag a bit, and congress will roll over very quickly (after all, it's already happened at least once). Given that there's a Republican majority anyway, I think it's perfectly possible....

[ShadowWolf_IH]

You know what i love...i love the way we base all of our opinions on what intel is avaliable to us.  I think that in the end, there is more going  on than we know of.  I think that the people who make these decisions are much more informed than we are.  Either way, I am sick of the let's ***** about the united states threads.  How many do we need before you feel that your point is across?  yes you hate america.  good for you.  if you don't hate it, why is it that all i ever see is *****ing about it as if it were an exwife?

I don't mind a thread asking for thoughts on a subject, but everytime there is one it degenerates into a "let's ***** about america" thread.  

Your collective opinion about america is noted.  Maybe we should make an entire Politard forum so that you people can go in and *****.  You made your opinions known within 6 months of your arrival.  Do we need to keep hearing it?

The fact is, you people ***** about america out of spite and jealousy.  Do i agree with of what happens, no i don't, but don't even think about lumping me in as a mindless drone.  I am just friggin sick of all the *****ing.  

If you want to say something constructive and add thoughts then go for it....but everytime i see one of these threads degenerate into yet another ***** about america thread then i feel personally attacked.  Yeah I am an american.  yeah I fought for this country, and yeah i have a purple heart for being wounded in combat.  

Some of the thoughts here are valid, and thought out, to you people i apologize for this, but for the let's ***** crowd....get informed, and get a life.  

in conclusion, if you have taken offense at this post, perhaps it is because you probably think i am talking to you.  Maybe there is a reason you think that.

[Gank]

Shut up ya bollox, its a thread about the US's actions, if you cant stand to seem them criticised, **** off to freerepublic or somewhere.

http://www.newyorker.com/fact/content/?050124fa_fact

[an0n]

There is absolutely no ****ing way the US is mounting a viable military strike on Iran.

For starters, I truly do think the French and Germans would rally the EU to block all EU trade with the US.

Secondly, the only thing stopping the US from being over-run and cut to ****ing ribbons in Iraq is the British troops backing them up. Without them, they'd be vastly outnumbered.

Thirdly, Britain won't be fighting any more wars in the next 20 years (barring incidents of mass-genocide). Blair's credibility was destroyed by the war in Iraq and it'll probably cost him the next election. The majority of Britain didn't want to go to war with Iraq. A significant percentage of the population despise Bush.

And most importantly - neither the US nor the UK has any troops left to fight Iran, and no-one else is going to help the US out. All 'our' troops are engaged in operations in Afghanistan and Iraq.

[an0n]

The fact is, you people ***** about america out of spite and jealousy.

Bwuahahahahaha..... Good one.

Compared to the US, the UK is a ****ing paradise.

[Gank]

They're talking about airstrikes anon not invasions. As for france and germany blockading it, unlikely, EU trade with US > EU trade with Iran.

And I think you're kinda overplaying British troops role in Iraq, seeing how the spot they're in is the quietest in the country.

[pyro-manic]

ShadowWolf: I don't know if you're directing it at me or not, but: I don't bash your gvt. (note: not the people) for the hell of it. The fact is, your country is being run by greedy bastards. Mine's going the same way. I'm not about to sit around while everything goes to ****. Are you?

Back on-topic: Yes, many countries have special forces operating all over the world (mine being one of them, also France and the US), and it's a fact of life. Everybody's always up to something, and that's not going to change any time soon. Putting Yank special forces into Iran is really not a good idea though, and calling them "military operations" is an even more stupid.

[Tiara]

Originally posted by Gank
They're talking about airstrikes anon not invasions. As for france and germany blockading it, unlikely, EU trade with US > EU trade with Iran.

The EU doesn't need the US economically speaking. While the EU does take a hit when they block the US, they can easily sustain themselves.

Though i think this is kind of doomsday thinking here.

[Unknown Target]

Originally posted by an0n

Secondly, the only thing stopping the US from being over-run and cut to ****ing ribbons in Iraq is the British troops backing them up. Without them, they'd be vastly outnumbered.
 

The UK has, what, at most 2,000 troops in the region. The US has 30,000. That's not what's stopping them.


And anyway, I seriously doubt that congress would be dumb enough to do this. On top of that, do you really think the American people would just ignore another war? I doubt that as well.

And on the topic of America-bashing. Yes, we have our flaws. But name a country that is as powerful as ours, as big as ours, and still has as many freedoms as we do. Sure, they're being cut back, but we still have most of them. People who bash America are usually hypocrits, saying "Oh, America doesn't do this, America doesn't help with that." Guess what? We don't because as soon as we poke our heads into a foreign affair, half the free world screams "IMPERIALIST! IMPERIALIST!"
Now, I'm not including Iraq in that statement, that was a wrong and unjust war that I do not support nor agree with. But the simple fact of the matter is, everyone expects America to do something, and if they don't, they get bashed, if they do, they get bashed. So what're we to do?

NOTE: Once again, I do not support Iraq or any future wars that the US may enter.

[aldo_14]

Originally posted by ShadowWolf_IH
You know what i love...i love the way we base all of our opinions on what intel is avaliable to us.  I think that in the end, there is more going  on than we know of.  I think that the people who make these decisions are much more informed than we are.  Either way, I am sick of the let's ***** about the united states threads.  How many do we need before you feel that your point is across?  yes you hate america.  good for you.  if you don't hate it, why is it that all i ever see is *****ing about it as if it were an exwife?

I don't mind a thread asking for thoughts on a subject, but everytime there is one it degenerates into a "let's ***** about america" thread.  

Your collective opinion about america is noted.  Maybe we should make an entire Politard forum so that you people can go in and *****.  You made your opinions known within 6 months of your arrival.  Do we need to keep hearing it?

The fact is, you people ***** about america out of spite and jealousy.  Do i agree with of what happens, no i don't, but don't even think about lumping me in as a mindless drone.  I am just friggin sick of all the *****ing.  

If you want to say something constructive and add thoughts then go for it....but everytime i see one of these threads degenerate into yet another ***** about america thread then i feel personally attacked.  Yeah I am an american.  yeah I fought for this country, and yeah i have a purple heart for being wounded in combat.  

Some of the thoughts here are valid, and thought out, to you people i apologize for this, but for the let's ***** crowd....get informed, and get a life.  

in conclusion, if you have taken offense at this post, perhaps it is because you probably think i am talking to you.  Maybe there is a reason you think that.

I ***** when I see your government making mistakes that even I could have predicted, which act to destabilise the entire world.  I don't have anything against Americans, or you country, or even your army.  My concern is that when your leaders get it wrong, or simply when they act out of their own self interest, it affects all of us.  And given that the shape of international politics is so heavily dependent on the US government, I think we should feel free to moan about it - because at the end of the day it's the only power we have.   If the UK government had that influence, and was doing as much damage, I'd expect the same in response.

But...this thread isn't about Iraq or whatnot.  This is about a) whether US troops are operating in Iran and b) could it be a precursor to yet another war.

And arguably c) how incredibly ****ing stupid and divisive would that war be?

[Rictor]

Calm down people, or there's lockage ahead (and this is a legit topic which ought to be discussed).

Shadowolf: I think you're forgetting who is the victim and who is the agreesor. No one is jealous of America (or rather I'm not, and I don't imagine that many of the people here are either). What we are talking about it a nation that consistantly violates the territorial integrity of sovereign nations in naked acts of agression. I have every right to be pissed at such a nation, and so does everyone else.

[Gank]

Guess what? We don't because as soon as we poke our heads into a foreign affair, half the free world screams "IMPERIALIST! IMPERIALIST!"

incase you were too young to notice, this sort of thing only became widespread after you put Bush in charge, before that you got away with tons of ****, Nicaragua, Panama, Grenada etc

Tiara, maybe doesnt need, but they're not going to take that sort of a hit to support the ayatollahs.

[Tiara]

Originally posted by Gank

Tiara, maybe doesnt need, but they're not going to take that sort of a hit to support the ayatollahs.

They won't support them rather then protecting the rest of the world. If nobody stops the US from giving them a get out of jail free-card every time they decide to do something like this, things will get exponentially worse.

[Rictor]

Politicians aren't that principled. And the EU isn't in any danger (assuming that they are idealogically much different than the US to begin with, which is quite an assumption).

[aldo_14]

Originally posted by Unknown Target


The UK has, what, at most 2,000 troops in the region. The US has 30,000. That's not what's stopping them.
 

I'm not sure what you mean by region; over all Iraq the US has something like 100,000-130,000(?) and the Uk has about 12,000 ( http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/ops/iraq_orbat_coalition.htm ).  I know that UK troops were important in their move to Camp Dogwood during the besieging of Fallujah, and also that the Uk provided a large number of tanks for the war itself.

But it would be unrealistic to say the UK was the difference between failure and, er, slightly less failure in Iraq.  Especially as the UK sensibly bagged the more peaceful areas.

[Zarax]

The situation will calm down within 10 years.
As soon as another superpower will emerge (china, EU, maybe russia later) the US will have to act more carefully if not reasonably...

[Corsair]

It will come. It is merely biding its time...

[Gank]

Originally posted by Tiara
They won't support them rather then protecting the rest of the world. If nobody stops the US from giving them a get out of jail free-card every time they decide to do something like this, things will get exponentially worse.

Thats what they should do. Not what they will.

[pyro-manic]

@ corsair

UT: The problem is, America tends to intervene in places where intervention isn't wanted, by invading/bombing the **** out of a country, killing lots of people, and generally making a rather nasty mess of it.

Zarax: Ideally it shouldn't take that long - American people should sort it out for themselves, when they realise how badly they're getting screwed....

Sapphire: Shouldn't be happening? Something that you think shouldn't be happening. If Iran is indeed developing MCWs and/or nuclear weapns, then it's in response to the percieved threat from aggressive Western states. Wonder who they could be....?

[Rictor]

Originally posted by Zarax
The situation will calm down within 10 years.
As soon as another superpower will emerge (china, EU, maybe russia later) the US will have to act more carefully if not reasonably...

How so? Each superpower will only opress and conquer within their own sphere of influence. Even now, the superpowers (EU, US and China) realize that its better to support each other than to figh each other. Becuase the central agression of the State is not against foreigner nations, but against their own citizens. They conquer foreign countries in order to bring those citizens "into the fold", so that the mass of people under their control is increased.

US keeps quiet about Chechnya, Russia keep criticism over Iraq to a minimum. China gets to go in with their little police state, the US needs them too much to make a fuss. Ditto the Saudis and Egypt. The EU talks but does nothing cause they're pretty much a marginally less agressive, European version of the US. They don't care for some Iraqis half a world away, they care about their own economies and power, which is dependent on the US.

"They prop each other up, like 3 sheaves of wheat"
(or something like that, describing the 3 superstates in 1984)

I'm hoping that this won't become the case, but its a possibility.