[Kosh]

http://www.defensenews.com/story.php?F=2121111&C=america

[Prophet]

Quess what? I saw this coming.

Bush has overextended US recources. And has ruined the countrys credibility. I predict a lot more stepping on US toes. And the shoes will get heavier. But just wait when Finns grab the sledgehammer and rock the world!

[NGTM-1R]

I've known of this for a fairly long time. It's technically an act of war, in fact...

[Wanderer]

Using spy satellites continously to observe and monitor a sovereign country isnt exactly fair either... As said in the report..

If you keep looking over the fence at you neighbor’s back yard, you’re going to get poked in the eye, so it’s not surprising that China might be worried about U.S. forces stationed on their doorstep. They don’t like it and are figuring out how to poke us in the eye.

[Prophet]

Afterall, it's not like Bush has a god-given right to play peeping tom on other countries. Though he might think so.

[aldo_14]

I've known of this for a fairly long time. It's technically an act of war, in fact...

Surely it's as much an act of war to be spying on a countries activities and infringing territory with military spy-plane overflights?  Frankly, repressive ****s as they may be, China have as much right to blind US satellites as the US has to use spy satellites against China.

[Colonol Dekker]

But the combination of China’s efforts and advances in Russian satellite jamming capabilities illustrate vulnerabilities to the U.S. space network are at the core of U.S. Air Force plans to develop new space architectures and highly classified systems, according to sources.

Coalition Basilisk stealth fighters anyone?


Its only a high powered laser blinding optical tech, Nothing really major, We've already hit the moon with a laser dot, But it does intrigue to know that the Future coalition are stepping up the tech war pace.........

[Unknown Target]

Ooo, aa...pretty lights

[Sarafan]

Coalition Basilisk stealth fighters anyone?

 

[Janos]

I've known of this for a fairly long time. It's technically an act of war, in fact...

It's not an act of war, because if it were everyone would seriously be at war all the time against pretty much everyone. Espionage is propably the oldest form of diplomacy and a fact in politics.

Espionage can also prevent wars, Cold War is pretty good example. If you know what your enemy is actually doing, you don't have to overreact and cause problems.

[TrashMan]

Coalition Basilisk stealth fighters anyone?

 

Kommader Kulov, they are on to us!!!!!

[NGTM-1R]

I've known of this for a fairly long time. It's technically an act of war, in fact...

Surely it's as much an act of war to be spying on a countries activities and infringing territory with military spy-plane overflights?  Frankly, repressive ****s as they may be, China have as much right to blind US satellites as the US has to use spy satellites against China.

Bull****. Space is free for the use of all. If you can't get there that's just too damn bad. The parallel in international law would be the sea; the sea is free for the use of all, and if somebody's sitting in international waters watching you there's not a damn thing you can legally do.

Start trying to damage their ship and it's an act of war. The same applies here.

[IceFire]

I've known of this for a fairly long time. It's technically an act of war, in fact...

Surely it's as much an act of war to be spying on a countries activities and infringing territory with military spy-plane overflights?  Frankly, repressive ****s as they may be, China have as much right to blind US satellites as the US has to use spy satellites against China.

Bull****. Space is free for the use of all. If you can't get there that's just too damn bad. The parallel in international law would be the sea; the sea is free for the use of all, and if somebody's sitting in international waters watching you there's not a damn thing you can legally do.

Start trying to damage their ship and it's an act of war. The same applies here.

During the Cold War a U-2 spyplane was shot down (at least once) by Russian SAM's.  That was far more significant than this.  No war.  More recently the Chinese had captured a P-3 (I think that was it) reconnaisance craft with crew.  No war.  It could be construed as an act of war during a period of high tension and hostilities...but I think this is more of "the usual" in the cloak and dagger world of espionage.

[NGTM-1R]

The U-2 was a Russian pretext for war, not a US one, and just for being there. Airspace is different from orbital height. Destroying the EP-3E on the tarmac after it landed with a TLAM-C strike was seriously considered, particularly since it was after all a staged incident by the Chinese.

However, you're making a rather childish distinction between casus belli and actually starting a war that betrays your lack of understanding of international politics. Things happen all the time that are technically acts of war and could provoke one if the wronged party feels the desire. That doesn't mean wars happen all the time. But they could. Under international law it would be totally justifible.

[Kosh]

since it was after all a staged incident by the Chinese

Source?

[aldo_14]

I've known of this for a fairly long time. It's technically an act of war, in fact...

Surely it's as much an act of war to be spying on a countries activities and infringing territory with military spy-plane overflights?  Frankly, repressive ****s as they may be, China have as much right to blind US satellites as the US has to use spy satellites against China.

Bull****. Space is free for the use of all. If you can't get there that's just too damn bad. The parallel in international law would be the sea; the sea is free for the use of all, and if somebody's sitting in international waters watching you there's not a damn thing you can legally do.

Start trying to damage their ship and it's an act of war. The same applies here.

It's not damaging it, though; it's no more an act of war than jamming use of radar within your territory.  Launch an air-orbit cruise missile and it's a different matter, but using a blinding laser is really no different from using a big mirror in your territory to flash and blind watching ships in international waters - it's really optical camo of the same nature as plonking a big blanket over stuff, there is no 'weapon' deployed beyond manipulation observable light. 

And it's pretty certain that the US will use or have been using such technology of their own against other nations satellites.

[NGTM-1R]

Source?

Did you even pay the slightest attention to the actual news coverage?

Let's put it this way: considering how they normally operate China would probably have billed the family of the pilot who mid-aired the Orion for the cost of his plane had it been accidental. They got the equivalent of $20,000 instead. Draw your own conclusions. Must have made an interesting pre-mission briefing, though. "Sorry, you've been selected to do your duty and die for the State."

It's not damaging it, though; it's no more an act of war than jamming use of radar within your territory.  Launch an air-orbit cruise missile and it's a different matter, but using a blinding laser is really no different from using a big mirror in your territory to flash and blind watching ships in international waters - it's really optical camo of the same nature as plonking a big blanket over stuff, there is no 'weapon' deployed beyond manipulation observable light. 

And it's pretty certain that the US will use or have been using such technology of their own against other nations satellites.

That's not the intention or indeed the reality of what this thing is intended to do; it is meant to permanently damage the CCD cameras. That's not the same thing as jamming. Jamming is a temporary condition. That the Chinese haven't got it down yet can be put down to their incompetence or robust US equipment.

Go order up a set of photos of Groom Lake from SPOT. See if you get laser-flashed. I'm almost positive that if the US ever had the equipment it got nixed with the moriatorium on ASAT testing back in the '80s.

[Mefustae]

That's not the intention or indeed the reality of what this thing is intended to do; it is meant to permanently damage the CCD cameras. That's not the same thing as jamming. Jamming is a temporary condition. That the Chinese haven't got it down yet can be put down to their incompetence or robust US equipment.

I was under the impression China was using lasers to merely blind the satellites temporarily, as it would take a considerably more powerful laser to permanently blind the satellite's optics. Granted, they've got the message across that they are developing the capability to blind US SpySats, but when you can buy anti-satellite missiles from the Russians, it's not that big an issue.

[aldo_14]

AFAIK SPOT is not owned by a hostile foreign power.  furthermore, I'm pretty sure the USAF / NASA keeps tab on commercial satellite overflights should they need to hide stuff from them.  Additionally, a casual peruse of the SPOT website seems to indicate daily-feeds rather than realtime.  Also, again, the light source is within Chinese territory; in terms of casus belli there's no weapon being technically fired at anything, the US sattelite is merely viewing a light source which happens to be blinding and possibly overloading.  It's a bit like the nuclear flash from an atomic bomb test being an act of war if it blinds foreign power observers in international water.

Also worth noting the Us test fired a MIRACL anti-satellite laser in 1997, which pissed of the Russians big-time (http://www.ucsusa.org/global_security/space_weapons/a-history-of-asat-programs.html#current).  The US Starfire Optical Range also (?) fires lasers at satellites - purportedly as a tracking method (see bottom; http://www.defensetech.org/archives/002794.html) - apparently satellite-laser-defense research goes on there.

And with the US publicly wishing to assert space (military) superiority and have 'strike-at-second' capability across the globe, can anyone blame China for wanting to blind US spy sats?

[Flaser]

ngtm1r, since when are the seas or space for that matter FREE when it's your goddamn ships and later on spacecraft (unmannded and manned) that have dominance there?

You can argue all you want for the freedom of such a domain, the fact will remain that you posses an definite advantage over anyone else, and percieve any attempts to level the field - or simply assure your continued survival in face of a changing Amercian policy - as acts of hostility, whereas you're the hostile one in the first place.

The same arguement could have been made by the British when they were sailing the African or Asian coasts....and the results were anything but pretty.

So, kindly take your neo-colonial notions of world dominance, and shove it where it rests comfortably in the grave next to the rest of the haunting ghosts of the past.