Author Topic: DeathMatch  (Read 12796 times)

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can you say double post? :P
Fun while it lasted.

Then bitter.

 

Offline Snail

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Sorry, I ate Hades' post again.

 

Offline Hades

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You should stop eating them.Because i always put salt on them for good luck. ;)
[22:29] <sigtau> Hello, #hard-light?  I'm trying to tell a girl she looks really good for someone who doesn't exercise.  How do I word that non-offensively?
[22:29] <RangerKarl|AtWork> "you look like a big tasty muffin"
----
<batwota> wouldn’t that mean that it’s prepared to kiss your ass if you flank it :p
<batwota> wow
<batwota> KILL

 
If a huge tear in subspace brought Serenity (Firefly), Voyager (Star Trek) Babylon 5 (Babylon 5) Lucifer (FS1) and the Death Star (Star Wars) together and they all started fighting, who would win?

The death star takes this, easily.
I hope I don't have to explain why the Serenity is..irrelevent.

The voyager is horribly undergunned, even compared to a small corvette from the Star wars verse, while Babylon 5 as far as I am aware does not have planet destroying capabilities.
The deathstar has enough capabilities, beyond destroying a planet, to deal with any large scale threat.

On the lucifer, ignoring the invulnerability 'tag', and looking in-universe, we can assume it has a shield system that is incredibly powerful by FS2 standards, however, nothing is all powerful(no limits fallacy). I am simply going to assume that the Death stars superlaser, or enough of it's several thousand turbo-lasers can overload the lucifer.

And please, let no one mention star treks horrible 'but lasers can't penetrate our navigational shields' bull****.

 
he he it would be nice to see a DS and lucy face off.....  if the starwars conversion for FS2 ever finishes we might be able to try it   ;7

speaking of the SWC, how the hell are they going to pull off the battle of endor, without BOE syndrome?

 

Offline Polpolion

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Don't forget all the fighters the Lucy has. And the ones the DS has. But those are mostly ties and don't count.

 
Don't forget all the fighters the Lucy has. And the ones the DS has. But those are mostly ties and don't count.

Why not? Tie fighters, esspecially Tie bombers and Tie advance are capable of a not insignificent amount of firepower going just from ANH and ESB. Most FS2-verse starfighters have pathetic firewpower looking at their astroid destruction rates.

 
when it comes to the lucy and the ds, it'll come down to beams, and beams alone. they've both destroyed a planet, corse, one was near vaporized, and the other just become a barren wasteland, so...

 

Offline TrashMan

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In star trek nobody has a phaser bank that's an uber phaser of doom ever that would compare to the output of a lucy beam or a death star laser.

Borg have pretty powerfull ray weapons...Hmmmm...how about the Galaxy Refit from the last TNG episode? It tore trough a Neg'Var with ONE shot from the Phaser Cannon.

EDIT - Luvcy is overrated.. the Lucifer FLEET bombared Vasuda Prime for 13 hours and the planet is intact...less habitable untill the dust settles, but still in tact. The DS pulverizes a planet (regardless how idiotic this sounds) in a minute.

Let's not forget the redicolous size of the DS...it would have a kazillion HP, so even if Lucy had free reign to shot at it it would take forever. (let's not forget that a ISSD chrashed on it and it barely felt that)


Once should compare ships of approximately same size...
« Last Edit: July 14, 2007, 02:21:23 pm by TrashMan »
Nobody dies as a virgin - the life ****s us all!

You're a wrongularity from which no right can escape!

 
In star trek nobody has a phaser bank that's an uber phaser of doom ever that would compare to the output of a lucy beam or a death star laser.

Borg have pretty powerfull ray weapons...Hmmmm...how about the Galaxy Refit from the last TNG episode? It tore trough a Neg'Var with ONE shot from the Phaser Cannon.

Ignoring the one shot wonder weapon of the week in star trek, which never consistent work...
Working off the figures here, the calculations of which are available in the rest of the site, we have that the Enterprise-D has main phasers with 3.6GigaWatts of power.
This seems alot, untill you consider that the Slave-1, an utterly forgettable modified corvette in the star wars universe has main guns capable of sustained fire delivering 64000 GW, or that medium transports from twenty years before the empires peak are capable of hundreds of millions of GW.


This is ignoring the main reason I would not bet against the empire in this matchup, movement speeds. Freespace has pathetically low speeds, which annoyingly are hard to quantify thanks to the annoying as hell FS2 node map, while star trek has really, really slow FTL speeds compared to SW.

 
when it comes to the lucy and the ds, it'll come down to beams, and beams alone. they've both destroyed a planet, corse, one was near vaporized, and the other just become a barren wasteland, so...

um...DS blew alderaan to pieces...
Fun while it lasted.

Then bitter.

 
when it comes to the lucy and the ds, it'll come down to beams, and beams alone. they've both destroyed a planet, corse, one was near vaporized, and the other just become a barren wasteland, so...

um...DS blew alderaan to pieces...

Yes, but thats not vaporized.
Definitions of Vaporized:
Turning a liquid into gas as a result of exposure to high heat.

Alderaan was obliterated and nicely taken apart, but not vaporized.

 

Offline Polpolion

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when it comes to the lucy and the ds, it'll come down to beams, and beams alone. they've both destroyed a planet, corse, one was near vaporized, and the other just become a barren wasteland, so...

Yes but the firing solution of the Super Laer or whatever it's called is zero pretty much. The Lucy's is a lot greater. Not that it matters, because the DS is so freaking huge. Plus the Lucy has subspace. It can jump out of the firing solution of the beam and by the time the DS turns, the drives will be charged again. Plus there is the recharge time for the Super Laser itself.

And ace pace, when I said Ties, I meant the ties that look like a sandwich.  Those things don't even have shields. And anyway, if a couple squadrons of X-wings could foray somewhat through them, then I'm sure a myriad of Shivan craft could obliterate them.

And also, the Lucy wasn't Invulnerable because of the tag, it was invulnerable because of the shield, they just had to use the tag because the game didn't like the lucy with the shields. The only thing that can penetrate the shield without having to bring it down is beams. So the turbolasers and Tie weapons wouldn't do anything.

(let's not forget that a ISSD chrashed on it and it barely felt that)

That was the second DS. It wasn't done, so it's kind of hard to use that for this. And even if we did, the lucy would just shoot at the exposed infrastructure.
« Last Edit: July 14, 2007, 02:44:49 pm by thesizzler »

 

Yes but the firing solution of the Super Laer or whatever it's called is zero pretty much.
The Lucy's is a lot greater.

Uh what?  What are you talking about.
Not that it matters, because the DS is so freaking huge. [/quote]

And it moves fast, it cleared the Yavin gas giant in 15 minutes.

Plus the Lucy has subspace. It can jump out of the firing solution of the beam[/quote]

Says who? The Alderan detonation, from start of visable firing sequance to impact, occured in less then 4 seconds. Are you seriously saying that the Lucifer can detect, start her subspace sequance and escape in that time?

Quote
and by the time the DS turns, the drives will be charged again. Plus there is the recharge time for the Super Laser itself.

If we're talking DS1, sure, DS2 has recharge rates in the minutes.
But the DS1 shouldn't need it's superlaser but rather only a wall of turbo-lasers.

 

Offline TrashMan

  • T-tower Avenger. srsly.
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    • FLAMES OF WAR
In star trek nobody has a phaser bank that's an uber phaser of doom ever that would compare to the output of a lucy beam or a death star laser.

Borg have pretty powerfull ray weapons...Hmmmm...how about the Galaxy Refit from the last TNG episode? It tore trough a Neg'Var with ONE shot from the Phaser Cannon.

Ignoring the one shot wonder weapon of the week in star trek, which never consistent work...
Working off the figures here, the calculations of which are available in the rest of the site, we have that the Enterprise-D has main phasers with 3.6GigaWatts of power.
This seems alot, untill you consider that the Slave-1, an utterly forgettable modified corvette in the star wars universe has main guns capable of sustained fire delivering 64000 GW, or that medium transports from twenty years before the empires peak are capable of hundreds of millions of GW.


This is ignoring the main reason I would not bet against the empire in this matchup, movement speeds. Freespace has pathetically low speeds, which annoyingly are hard to quantify thanks to the annoying as hell FS2 node map, while star trek has really, really slow FTL speeds compared to SW.

You do realise they were just throwing numbers around for SW starships? Besides, those numbers are not from movies but some collectors manuals, books or something that was realeased to make money later.
Hell, I can invenat a Sci-fi series and later print manuals that saz the weapons on the ships generate 99999999 bajjilion TW or power per shot, but that  is the realm of fairy tales.

If Slave 1 could indeed deliver 64000 GW, it could glass a planet on its own...
It's the equalent of giving a mercenary today a portable nuclear missile launcher...thus..REDICOLOUSLY STUPID.
Nobody dies as a virgin - the life ****s us all!

You're a wrongularity from which no right can escape!

 

Offline Hades

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Also with the Fs ships, They go Meters Per Second.
[22:29] <sigtau> Hello, #hard-light?  I'm trying to tell a girl she looks really good for someone who doesn't exercise.  How do I word that non-offensively?
[22:29] <RangerKarl|AtWork> "you look like a big tasty muffin"
----
<batwota> wouldn’t that mean that it’s prepared to kiss your ass if you flank it :p
<batwota> wow
<batwota> KILL

 

Offline Nuclear1

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If a huge tear in subspace brought Serenity (Firefly), Voyager (Star Trek) Babylon 5 (Babylon 5) Lucifer (FS1) and the Death Star (Star Wars) together and they all started fighting, who would win?
None of them.

Why?  

Because they're entirely different universes, in entirely systems of measurement, different scales, different weapons, different species, different physics.  You can't compare the Lucifer to the Enterprise or the Death Star because they aren't in the same universe at all.  

Sorry, but we've seen about a thousand threads on these "LET'S BATTLE UNIVERSES!!!!!11" or "STAR TREK VS. FREESPACE"  topic that it's just getting old and irritating.

EDIT: Or, if you won't listen to me, please listen to JAD:
Quote
This is what The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy has to say about FreeSpace...

NOTHING!

They're from completely different universes, get it? So no arguments about how the Colossus could waste the Heart of Gold!
« Last Edit: July 14, 2007, 02:52:36 pm by nuclear1 »
Spoon - I stand in awe by your flawless fredding. Truely, never before have I witnessed such magnificant display of beamz.
Axem -  I don't know what I'll do with my life now. Maybe I'll become a Nun, or take up Macrame. But where ever I go... I will remember you!
Axem - Sorry to post again when I said I was leaving for good, but something was nagging me. I don't want to say it in a way that shames the campaign but I think we can all agree it is actually.. incomplete. It is missing... Voice Acting.
Quanto - I for one would love to lend my beautiful singing voice into this wholesome project.
Nuclear1 - I want a duet.
AndrewofDoom - Make it a trio!

 

Offline Snail

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Also with the Fs ships, They go Meters Per Second.

Still, it makes them much, much slower than SW ships.

 

You do realise they were just throwing numbers around for SW starships?

Wrong, the turbolaser numbers in that page are taken from the ICS, but here is a good quantitive analyse of the astroids scene from ESB giving us a sense of the scale involved in a ship that CAN vapourize astroids.
Quote
Besides, those numbers are not from movies but some collectors manuals, books or something that was realeased to make money later.

Except that these books are considered canon and are therfor relevent to the discussion. The numbers in the first page I linked to, regarding the acclemator, are taken from the Episode 2 ICS, written by Dr. Saxton(author of the Star wars technical commentries). While the second are extrapolations of astroid destruction in the chase scene of episode 2.

Quote
Hell, I can invenat a Sci-fi series and later print manuals that saz the weapons on the ships generate 99999999 bajjilion TW or power per shot, but that  is the realm of fairy tales.

And if I was discussing your verse, I'd have to take those numbers into account, unless they are contradicted by your discription of the weapons in any other text. In this case, the movies are the highest canon, and using the ESB astroid vapour scene, we get quantative numbers.

Quote
If Slave 1 could indeed deliver 64000 GW, it could glass a planet on its own...
It's the equalent of giving a mercenary today a portable nuclear missile launcher...thus..REDICOLOUSLY STUPID.

Uh no, again quoting from SD.net.
Quote
The absolute minimum energy requirement for destroying an Earth-like planet is roughly 5E16 megatons. This is 500 million times the K-T extinction asteroid impact (and hundreds of millions of times the firepower of an individual ISD or Shadow planet-killer).

The information on how to derive the force needed to destroy a planet is here, to quote the relevent parts.

Quote

The accomplishment of the complete disruption of an Earth-like planet sets a lower limit to the destructive capability of the Death Stars' prime weapon. The gravitational binding energy of a planetary body is the minimum amount of energy required to eject all of its material with sufficient force that it will not fall back together. (It is also the total energy which would be released as heat if the entire substance of the planet were gathered together from free space.) For an object of a given mass the gravitational binding energy is increased when a greater fraction of the mass is concentrated near the centre. The density of a planet tends to increase with depth from the surface, because the weight of overlying material causes pressure to increase with depth, and heavier materials tend to sink towards the core when a planet forms.

Alderaan is probably a typical habitable planet, with much the same dimensions and composition as our Earth. An approximation for its gravitational binding energy can be obtained according to the density structure profiles of the Earth or Venus. An approximate figure for the binding energy of Alderaan, assuming Earthlike composition and mass of 5.9 x 1024 kg, is:
U = 2.4 x 1032 joules.

It should be noted that this is simply the minimum energy required to destroy a terrestrial planet. The Death Star's maximum capability is much greater.

For the full math on how this number was arrived to, slightly differant results due to differant estimations, but roughly same scale.


By the way, thank you hades, these comparisons are mostly meaningless, as each verse has it's own power scales, which fit the story, comparison is technically possible(using simple physics) but also irrelevent. But it's a fun hobby.

 
If a huge tear in subspace brought Serenity (Firefly), Voyager (Star Trek) Babylon 5 (Babylon 5) Lucifer (FS1) and the Death Star (Star Wars) together and they all started fighting, who would win?
None of them.

Why? 

Because they're entirely different universes, in entirely systems of measurement, different scales, different weapons, different species, different physics.  You can't compare the Lucifer to the Enterprise or the Death Star because they aren't in the same universe at all. 

Sorry, but we've seen about a thousand threads on these "LET'S BATTLE UNIVERSES!!!!!11" or "STAR TREK VS. FREESPACE"  topic that it's just getting old and irritating.

Ya, i'm bored of these nerd fests anyways...
Fun while it lasted.

Then bitter.