[Flipside]

I never wrote that I want war with NK, someone just wrote that they could be the aggressor.
Although Kim could use a little spanking for all the starving people in North Korea.


Also- China's army ain't really that much bigger than the US's armed forces. And I'll bet someone else's life that the US are far more technologically advanced, enough to even out the odds. Also- South Korea has a big military with good equiptment.

That's active troops, China has a reserve that is something like 1/4 Billion men. Poorly trained, mostly guerilla warfare, and not as well armed as the US, but still overwhelming unless you are prepared to go Nuclear, and I doubt anyone wants that.

America is not as far ahead technically as they'd like people to believe with regards to China. China may not have quite the digital advantage, but they have perfectly serviceable and effective weapons, and a hell of a lot of them. Remember, China was the first country to, at least officially, take out a satellite in orbit from the ground.

America is ahead still, but without using Nukes, China can put vast numbers of troops with small arms and Portable Anti-Air and Armour Piercing weapons in the field. At the very least, if they were assisting a guerilla war in another country, they could certainly make life pretty unpleasant for the occupiers. They have used exactly this technique before.

[BengalTiger]

Today you win conventional battles in the air, and untill China has radars that detect airplanes more stealth than the 20+ year old F-117, the US have the upper hand.
Also the Americans have quite a fleet of armed UAV's, don't know about China (other than the fact they most probably have the tech needed to produce rather advanced UAV's).
There is also a question of how other countries (EU, India) would react if the world found out that Chinese 'volunteers' are assisting North Korea in the war against the US and SK.

And regarding the satellite killing- these weapons are much older than one might expect: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-satellite_weapon

[MP-Ryan]

I never wrote that I want war with NK, someone just wrote that they could be the aggressor.
Although Kim could use a little spanking for all the starving people in North Korea.


Also- China's army ain't really that much bigger than the US's armed forces. And I'll bet someone else's life that the US are far more technologically advanced, enough to even out the odds. Also- South Korea has a big military with good equiptment.

Let me correct that for you:  China's standing army isn't much bigger than the US's.  However, the Chinese can field massive numbers of B and C reserve units.  Poorly trained, not well equipped, but they're bodies with weapons.  The US military is over-extended as it is.  And if it hasn't become completely obvious in the last 50 years, large-scale combat waged by technological means is becoming less and less popular.  Insurgent and guerilla-style warfare is sustainable by a very small group for a very long time against the best militaries in the world (just ask the SAS about Burma sometime).  In fact, it was the numbers and not the technology that landed Korea in the mess it's in today.  UN forces had the North pushed back almost into China - and then the Chinese and North Korea's came flooding over the river in numbers so large that the UN forces were forced to beat it back to the parallel and try to come to a deal, which resulted in a 50+ year cease-fire.

The air war doesn't gain ground.  Planes don't control territory.  NATO learned that the hard way in Kosovo.

Furthermore, the fact that poorly trained insurgents using old weaponry and improvised homemade explosives could drive the entire armed forces of the Soviet Union out of Afghanistan and are wagely a very deadly campaign against the coalition forces currently in Afghanistan and Iraq should be ample evidence that in modern warfare technology gives you very little in the way of an edge.

Conventional wisdom dictates that an attacking/occupying force must out-number the defenders by a ratio of 3:1 to claim victory if they are in all other ways matched.  Conventional wisdom doesn't consider the staggering numbers required to stamp out an insurgency.

[Flipside]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_War

America was technically the most advanced force in that confrontation as well, my own feeling is that, if it was tried again today, the result would be pretty much identical, if not worse.

[Blue Lion]

Well in conventional warfare the front line is a line- you know where the enemy is, and who's friendly. You can be much more trigger happy, use much deadlier weapons and worry less about roadside bombs or shooting civilians.
That means the 60+k US soldiers would do much more damage to N K, than the 150k do to terrorists in Iraq.
I also admit that such an open war could cost millions per day, but less manpower is needed when you have a thin line to hold than when you need to police a whole county.

You obviously don't know anything about North Korea's conventional weapons and manpower then.

[General Battuta]

Yeah.

And the immense destruction caused by even a 'conventional' war would devastate the civilian population. War always has done most of its damage to civilians -- actual clashes between armed forces on opposing sides make up the minority of any struggle's effects

[Uchuujinsan]

On a side note, war is a very complex thing. In most cases there is something you didnt even think off that will have a huge influence on the war, like climate, storms, morale, overall economy, stability of government, new strategies or newly developed technologies.

Compared to WW2, the last really big war, todays standing armies are very small on every side.
But thats not that important, especially with countries of the size of the USA or China, seperated by an ocean.
A surprise attack will take out many (remote) defenses, but it needs a lot of time to invade the land of each nation itself, enough time to properly prepare.

So, no real need to worry about a real war :>

[Blue Lion]

It's not us I'm worried about them attacking.

[Mars]

China isn't going to invade us...

They're going to help dig the grave for our economy.

[Snail]

China doesn't need war, really.

[Darklord42]

 (this is more directed at the arguments a couple of pages ago)

I believe this onion video says it all.
(Edit: I tried linking to the one on the onion site but it would move to the wrong video)

Its funny, but it portrays a serious problem in the American political system.  I don't care hows Obama's name sounds like Iraq Hussein Ossama or McCain is 70 or other such BS that is thrown at me, and neither should you.  Really scrutinize what you hear from the news and what people tell you because this election is really important.  This country, quite frankly, is in a dire situation around the globe and at home.  Our economy is in recession,  It's difficult to get a job, the national Debt is 9 Trillion+ !,  Social Security is a joke because our government cant tell the difference between and FICA tax and an Income.  Our energy policy is completely defunct for the crises (Oil and Global Warming)  we now face,  College tuition has risen way past inflation,  mortgage rates are through the roof and speaking as a young person, this country has never been in a worse state for someone just starting out. People work more then ever and yet are barely getting by as credit debts are disastrous.   Generally, our quality of life is down the tubes. Never mind the fact that our creditability around the globe is non existent.  And its a fact, thanks to our international policy,  terrorism is worse now then it ever was after 9/11.

That is the world we live in.  Really, seriously think about who you vote into office (And don't stand on the sidelines!) Because, by god, they are the ones who will take this burden, and despite their rhetoric, will somehow make it better or make it worse.

[Uchuujinsan]

China was just an example, someone iirc said before that splitting the troops to many countries like Irak, Afghanistan, South Korea etc.. will make it easy to be attacked (and overwhelmed). I wanted to answer that you dont really have to worry about that, but maybe I just misunderstood.

[Blue Lion]

I think you meant me, and I didn't mean so much as the US being attacked, but when we DO need to send troops to a real conflict (not one we trumped up) we won't have the manpower.

[Uchuujinsan]

Ah ok, i really misunderstood :>

[InfernoGod]

Also- China's army ain't really that much bigger than the US's armed forces. And I'll bet someone else's life that the US are far more technologically advanced, enough to even out the odds. Also- South Korea has a big military with good equiptment.

Because, you know, all of our technological advancements really helped the USA win in Vietnam.
Oh... wait... we lost?

[Mars]

In a war with China technology might actually help.

[MP-Ryan]

In a war with China technology might actually help.

Only if war were confined to naval and aerial units.

[Mars]

It goes beyond that though. Body armor comes to mind, tank armor, longer range artillery, more reliable weapons (I wish), it goes on and on.

Body armor has even helped the US in the Iraq conflict, imagine what our casualties would be without it.

[Spicious]

Body armor has even helped the US in the Iraq conflict, imagine what our casualties would be without it.

Fixed.

[Mars]

I fully agree, all I'm saying is that body armor alone is a huge advantage over a conventional force.

Of course the Chinese are very close to the US in technology, and their weapons are potentially better (they have higher KE)